http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3238661/the-prometheus-sequel-has-its-writer/ (http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3238661/the-prometheus-sequel-has-its-writer/)
There you have it.
Phase II of Development Hell begins.
I dunno, I've seen a lot of movies go into development Hell, and what I've so far from Prometheus doesn't fit the bill. :P
How do you figure that?
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 17, 2013, 11:48:38 PM
How do you figure that?
Despite not having a greenlight, it's still generating a ton of interest from Fox. Which wouldn't be extraordinary if the first one didn't make $400 million worldwide and 3 times it's budget. Still being a slight financial disappointment, it just looks like Fox is trying to be more cautious. There's no production conflicts or cast fallouts. Now that a writer has been hired, it just works to be additional fuel for the project.
Unlike my
Meg film, which has hired several writers, producers, directors, etc. But everything keeps failing because there's no successful contemporaries to justify it's budget. And it hasn't received any verbal commitment from a movie studio, which I believe Fox has given Prometheus 2 or whatever it's called several times.
This also has had its original writer jump ship, rumors now circulating that Scott won't be returning to direct, no greenlight, and their new hired screenwriter has only one yet-to-be-released credit to his name and will probably just be the first of many writers in a revolving door. :P
Wow, I don't even remember making this thread! <_<
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 12:12:47 AM
This also has had its original writer jump ship, rumors now circulating that Scott won't be returning to direct, no greenlight, and their new hired screenwriter has only one yet-to-be-released credit to his name and will probably just be the first of many writers in a revolving door. :P
It is undoubtedly having it's developmental difficulties at this point, a few of which are reminiscent of a developmental hell birth, I'm just saying I'm less worried because of the positive feedback currently coming back from Fox and the financial success of the first one.
And Lindelof leaving doesn't bother me a bit :P
Quote from: Aspie on Jun 18, 2013, 12:30:55 AM
Wow, I don't even remember making this thread! <_<
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 12:12:47 AM
This also has had its original writer jump ship, rumors now circulating that Scott won't be returning to direct, no greenlight, and their new hired screenwriter has only one yet-to-be-released credit to his name and will probably just be the first of many writers in a revolving door. :P
It is undoubtedly having it's developmental difficulties at this point, a few of which are reminiscent of a developmental hell birth, I'm just saying I'm less worried because of the positive feedback currently coming back from Fox and the financial success of the first one.
And Lindelof leaving doesn't bother me a bit :P
It bothers me because it feels like his whole plan to hijack the Alien Prequel and turn it into his grand Prometheus trilogy and answer all of the questions he raised in the first film in the sequel but no he just didn't care.
Quote from: cloverfan98 on Jun 18, 2013, 12:45:00 AM
It bothers me because it feels like his whole plan to hijack the Alien Prequel and turn it into his grand Prometheus trilogy and answer all of the questions he raised in the first film in the sequel but no he just didn't care.
what
Quote from: Space Sweeper on Jun 18, 2013, 01:33:53 AM
Quote from: cloverfan98 on Jun 18, 2013, 12:45:00 AM
It bothers me because it feels like his whole plan to hijack the Alien Prequel and turn it into his grand Prometheus trilogy and answer all of the questions he raised in the first film in the sequel but no he just didn't care.
what
QuoteHas Anyone Really Been Far Even as Decided to Use Even Go Want to do Look More Like?
Quote from: Aspie on Jun 18, 2013, 12:30:55 AM
Wow, I don't even remember making this thread! <_<
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 12:12:47 AM
This also has had its original writer jump ship, rumors now circulating that Scott won't be returning to direct, no greenlight, and their new hired screenwriter has only one yet-to-be-released credit to his name and will probably just be the first of many writers in a revolving door. :P
It is undoubtedly having it's developmental difficulties at this point, a few of which are reminiscent of a developmental hell birth, I'm just saying I'm less worried because of the positive feedback currently coming back from Fox and the financial success of the first one.
And Lindelof leaving doesn't bother me a bit :P
You don't remember? What shenanigans have you been up to, Aspie?
Other than that I agree with you. Lindelof not returning isn't a bad thing, and we can't quite call Development Hell on the film at this point. If we get to the end of the year and nothing has progressed,
then we can definitely claim it to be in Development Hell.
It's only in development hell if they're actively trying to get shit done and it's not getting done. No one really knows how actively this is being pursued at present. Riddles has always got a dozen balls in the air anyway.
Quote from: Aspie on Jun 18, 2013, 12:02:00 AM
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 17, 2013, 11:48:38 PM
How do you figure that?
Despite not having a greenlight, it's still generating a ton of interest from Fox. Which wouldn't be extraordinary if the first one didn't make $400 million worldwide and 3 times it's budget. Still being a slight financial disappointment, it just looks like Fox is trying to be more cautious. There's no production conflicts or cast fallouts. Now that a writer has been hired, it just works to be additional fuel for the project.
Unlike my Meg film, which has hired several writers, producers, directors, etc. But everything keeps failing because there's no successful contemporaries to justify it's budget. And it hasn't received any verbal commitment from a movie studio, which I believe Fox has given Prometheus 2 or whatever it's called several times.
Should be called "Paradise" in my opinion.
If it's to be a trilogy call it Purgatory.
Man, let's not drag Dante through this mud while we're at it.
Interesting that they're going with a guy who, until Transcendence comes out next year, hasn't been attached to a single movie.
More Ridley manipulating the writers? Probably. But there's always the chance that Palgen could be a cool up-and-coming writer with an interesting vision for a sequel. I'll remain cautiously optimistic for the time being.
Quote from: SiL on Jun 18, 2013, 02:23:20 AM
Man, let's not drag Dante through this mud while we're at it.
Alighieri started it!!
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Jun 18, 2013, 02:25:37 AM
Interesting that they're going with a guy who, until Transcendence comes out next year, hasn't been attached to a single movie.
More Ridley manipulating the writers? Probably. But there's always the chance that Palgen could be a cool up-and-coming writer with an interesting vision for a sequel. I'll remain cautiously optimistic for the time being.
Had Jon Spaight had anything actually released when he was attached to Prometheus? (Genuine question, I'm not sure)
According to IMDB, The Darkest Hour was released in 2011.
To echo something that Space Sweeper said in the Blade Runner 2 thread a few weeks back, it seems like Ridley likes to go for guys that he can get a decent amount of control over in order to get his vision on screen. Sometimes that works, but I think Prometheus suffered from it (and from Ridley's 'butts in seats' mentality on the cutting-room floor).
Quote from: SM on Jun 18, 2013, 02:14:58 AM
If it's to be a trilogy call it Purgatory.
I like that. Prometheus, Paradise, and when they find out it's not much of a paradise, Purgatory.
Fools... Everyone knows he's sitting at home, waiting for the call. Then Fox will hire some new up-and-comer to pen and direct it, rename the project '
Deacons' and repackage it into a completely different genre (romantic comedy, obviously). Ridley will feel miffed he wasn't begged to return, wait thirty more years to return and supervise a new prequel-which-isn't-a-prequel-but-really-is
from beyond the grave.
Spoiler
It'll cameo a cloned John Hurt as a character named Chaz Hunter.
Quote from: SiL on Jun 18, 2013, 02:23:20 AM
Man, let's not drag Dante through this mud while we're at it.
I want to hug you.
Who do i have the feeling that the sequel will move further away from its sci fi elements and instead become some religious fantasy movie.....in space
That does seem likely. I like space fantasy though. And as long as it stays in the realm of fiction, weird religious stuff tends to be a pretty ripping yarn.
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn.pjmedia.com%2Ftatler%2Ffiles%2F2012%2F10%2Fi_m_ok_with_this__n1296497202304__super.png&hash=8d2d28dba115efd6db8723e64726c576d3006ab3)
are u aware guys that most of the sequels are much worse than the first movie? :P
And? Many aren't.
Quote from: szkoki on Jun 18, 2013, 09:42:51 AM
are u aware guys that most of the sequels are much worse than the first movie? :P
Terminator 2
Aliens
American Pie 2
Die Hard, Die Hard with a vengeance,
Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey
Ghostbusters 2
TDK, TDKR
Superman 2
Spiderman 2
Beverley Hills Cop 2
to name a couple of great ones
the guy whos doing Trancendence?
im ok with this
I would be a little gutted if Scott doesn't return but it wouldn't be an end of the world scenario. Comingsoon.net/ The Wrap report negotiations with Scott are currently underway. I imagine it has a lot to do with Scott's availability due to a currently packed schedule (both Exodus and Blade Runner seem pretty ready to go).
I imagine this writer's work will be rewritten by a more well known name at some point down the line. And we all know how that turned out the first time.
This film needs a more reliable director than Ridley Scott. He just gets lucky with whether each release turns out good/bad and his best film (Blade Runner) only became so after a simple yet major edit to the soundtrack a decade after it was first released.
Scott will always be deeply knotted in his struggle with art and commerce. It seems as though commerce tends to influence the art too heavily each time though. His assembly line approach to making movies in the last years of his life mean that he will never top his earliest works. He then keeps the suits at Fox happy by letting them influence his decisions so that he can have a sustainable outlet for these assembly line pictures.
He should just quit and do his painting full time.
I suspected he was over the hill before Prometheus came out (I hoped he wasn't), but the film was solid proof that he's lost it.
I wonder which part of "I want to go to where they came from" Scott didn't understand.
Batten down the hatches. Shit this way comes.
Quote from: ChrisPachi on Jun 18, 2013, 02:03:53 PM
I wonder which part of "I want to go to where they came from" Scott didn't understand.
Batten down the hatches. Shit this way comes.
I remain defiantly optimistic.
Spoiler
Then again, I liked the first one.
Quote from: [CANCERBLACK] on Jun 18, 2013, 03:16:38 PM
Quote from: ChrisPachi on Jun 18, 2013, 02:03:53 PM
I wonder which part of "I want to go to where they came from" Scott didn't understand.
Batten down the hatches. Shit this way comes.
I remain defiantly optimistic.
Spoiler
Then again, I liked the first one.
I loved the first one :P
Prometheus is a fascinating mess that has a whole lot to love, and quite a bit that just leaves you sitting there scratching your head and wondering "why?". It laid an intriguing foundation that, depending on what they do with a sequel, can make for a very interesting followup.
Quote from: Aspie on Jun 18, 2013, 04:42:42 PM
Quote from: [CANCERBLACK] on Jun 18, 2013, 03:16:38 PM
Quote from: ChrisPachi on Jun 18, 2013, 02:03:53 PM
I wonder which part of "I want to go to where they came from" Scott didn't understand.
Batten down the hatches. Shit this way comes.
I remain defiantly optimistic.
Spoiler
Then again, I liked the first one.
I loved the first one :P
Spoiler
Me too. 8) :-*
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Jun 18, 2013, 04:45:22 PM
Prometheus is a fascinating mess that has a whole lot to love, and quite a bit that just leaves you sitting there scratching your head and wondering "why?". It laid an intriguing foundation that, depending on what they do with a sequel, can make for a very interesting followup.
Listen to this man, he knows what he's talking about.
Quote from: [CANCERBLACK] on Jun 18, 2013, 04:50:24 PM
Quote from: Aspie on Jun 18, 2013, 04:42:42 PM
Quote from: [CANCERBLACK] on Jun 18, 2013, 03:16:38 PM
Quote from: ChrisPachi on Jun 18, 2013, 02:03:53 PM
I wonder which part of "I want to go to where they came from" Scott didn't understand.
Batten down the hatches. Shit this way comes.
I remain defiantly optimistic.
Spoiler
Then again, I liked the first one.
I loved the first one :P
Spoiler
Me too. 8) :-*
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Jun 18, 2013, 04:45:22 PM
Prometheus is a fascinating mess that has a whole lot to love, and quite a bit that just leaves you sitting there scratching your head and wondering "why?". It laid an intriguing foundation that, depending on what they do with a sequel, can make for a very interesting followup.
Listen to this man, he knows what he's talking about.
lolno
He sure seems to in regards to Prometheus, and I have yet to see any evidence to the contrary in general.
:-\
-_- nvm lol
Quote from: [CANCERBLACK] on Jun 18, 2013, 04:52:58 PM
He sure seems to in regards to Prometheus, and I have yet to see any evidence to the contrary in general.
:-\
First rule of AVPGalaxy: If you wish to keep your sanity, pay no attention to Aspie.
Second rule of AVPGalaxy: If you are even in a dangerous encounter with Aspie, post pictures of spiders, trilobites, or isopods.
Third rule of AVPGalaxy: Enjoy :)
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi3.kym-cdn.com%2Fphotos%2Fimages%2Foriginal%2F000%2F556%2F986%2F6c9.gif&hash=7a1ebb2e19ac53d15025cd8be0b14a6e2ede15da)
Like so?
Like so :D
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Jun 18, 2013, 04:45:22 PM
Prometheus is a fascinating mess that has a whole lot to love, and quite a bit that just leaves you sitting there scratching your head and wondering "why?". It laid an intriguing foundation that, depending on what they do with a sequel, can make for a very interesting followup.
I`d say the only salvation for Prometheus (for it to make any sense) is decent sequel that actually answers all those questions. If "Prometheuses" give us as much insight as first one, the series is doomed.
Answering questions won't do shit if the sequel has the same wretched writing, acting and editing.
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 06:49:54 PM
Answering questions won't do shit if the sequel has the same wretched writing, acting and editing.
I didn't have much of a problem with most of the acting, myself. But I agree completely with the writing and, even more so, the editing.
The acting from half the cast is dreadful -- Rafe Spall can't even make up his mind whether to use a stupid southern accent in some scenes or speak normally in others.
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 06:49:54 PM
Answering questions won't do shit if the sequel has the same wretched writing, acting and editing.
Answering questions is writing. With bullshit script there must be bullshit film.
Rafe Spall was bad but Noomi Rapace killed it for me, her character was so unlikeable that I was hoping she would die (Shaw not Rapace)
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 07:06:51 PM
The acting from half the cast is dreadful -- Rafe Spall can't even make up his mind whether to use a stupid southern accent in some scenes or speak normally in others.
There were certainly some problems with the acting, but I felt that the good outweighed the bad. Michael Fassbender was excellent and Noomi Rapace and Idris Elba were also great, in my opinion. Charlize Theron was really good, too (aside from that "father" scene; I much preferred the alternate cut of that one) though she was very underused and kind of one-dimensional throughout.
Quote from: Master on Jun 18, 2013, 07:08:51 PM
Answering questions is writing. With bullshit script there must be bullshit film.
Ya'know, I honestly wouldn't mind if we were left with things even more open ended questions in the sequel. Some answers would be nice, but I think it would be even more interesting if some of this stuff goes beyond the comprehension of humans. Lovecraft style.
Aside from the fact that the Engineers basically are just humans, so that kills any of the Lovecraftian incomprehensibility factor.
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 07:13:53 PM
Aside from the fact that the Engineers basically are just humans, so that kills any of the Lovecraftian incomprehensibility factor.
Yeah, there's that... :-\ But then again, the Engineers aren't necessarily the only thing out there.
"And who made them?"I really did like the concept of Engineers as presented in
Prometheus, playing off of mythology and whatnot. But I would have absolutely loved to have seen the Space Jockey in all of its glory as well. Its too late now to render the Engineer and the Jockey separate entities, but I would definitely be open to seeing the Engineers mutating and experimenting on their own bodies, resulting in beings similar the biomechanical terror fused to the chair in
Alien. The Engineer at the end of
Prometheus was already taking a step in that direction.
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Jun 18, 2013, 07:12:35 PM
Lovecraft style.
Considering the first film
annihilated everything remotely Lovecraftian there was in the series before -- I kind of doubt it.
Could be interesting if his son-in-law gets it, like he was going to with the previous.
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Jun 18, 2013, 07:18:40 PM
Yeah, there's that... :-\ But then again, the Engineers aren't necessarily the only thing out there. "And who made them?"
I much prefer the thought that Engineers were just 'the prototype'. Humans being a more refined, adaptable, genetically diverse final product. There was
still nothing on screen which proved that the entities we saw were who made us (or at least, were responsible for accelerating our mental development).
Engineers as the prototype model kept behind for labour and construction purposes? Could be... Would let them bring in undertones of 'fallen angel' mythology, that way, too.
Alternatively, Engineers were the finished product and we were flawed genetic garbage they decided to give a planet to, rather than mindlessly exterminate. Which would make us more like the Engineers' cousins than 'children'.
And, in keeping with Greek mythology, would make the creators of the Engineers like the Titans and Engineers, themselves, like the Olympus gods. A lot of people forget that the Titans came first and that the gods, their children, came after. Greek mythology is basically a tale of a cosmic military coup. :)
I miss when the Alien franchise hadn't yet devolved into stupid Star Trek space opera.
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Jun 18, 2013, 07:18:40 PM
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 07:13:53 PM
Aside from the fact that the Engineers basically are just humans, so that kills any of the Lovecraftian incomprehensibility factor.
Yeah, there's that... :-\ But then again, the Engineers aren't necessarily the only thing out there. "And who made them?"
I really did like the concept of Engineers as presented in Prometheus, playing off of mythology and whatnot. But I would have absolutely loved to have seen the Space Jockey in all of its glory as well. Its too late now to render the Engineer and the Jockey separate entities, but I would definitely be open to seeing the Engineers mutating and experimenting on their own bodies, resulting in beings similar the biomechanical terror fused to the chair in Alien. The Engineer at the end of Prometheus was already taking a step in that direction.
I think
"And who made them?" is the only thing that can save some Lovecraftian vibes in this franchise. And it better be original space jockey.
Quote from: Master on Jun 18, 2013, 08:17:37 PM
I think "And who made them?" is the only thing that can save some Lovecraftian vibes in this franchise. And it better be original space jockey.
Its too late to make the Jockey and the Engineer separate entities (unless they decide to reboot
Prometheus somewhere down the line). Doesn't mean they can't come up with something new and equally fascinating, though.
I hope that the creatures that we get in the sequel, assuming it even sees the light of day, are more interesting that the ones in
Prometheus. The Hammerpede was a great design, but ultimately proved to be fairly useless. The Trilobite was interesting enough, and I would love to see something like that expanded upon. But I really want to see something new that is not necessarily trying to directly replicate the original
Alien designs.
All I ask is this be taken into consideration with PROMETHEUS 2 or PARADISE:
What saves all the ALIEN films from being unforgivable is that each film is almost operating in an entirely different genre / vrs of sci-fi.
This is what makes (ignoring but still acknowledging the cartoon-ish Adventure film AVP, and the Teen Slasher-mess that was AVP-R) all of the films in the series acceptable in the grand scheme for me. Even if A:R for example is basically a bad movie.
ALIEN - Was a Sci-Fi Horror HAUNTED HOUSE film
ALIENS - Was a Sci-Fi Horror ACTION film
ALIEN3 - Was a Sci-Fi Horror Religious Space DRAMA-NOIR about doom.
ALIEN: R - Was a Sci-Fi Horror Old-School MONSTER movie, like BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN, complete with black humor.
PROMETHEUS - Was Sci-Fi Horror meets GOLDEN AGE Sci-Fi like FORBIDDEN PLANET or DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL
They may have called it 'HARD SCI-FI' but it was really a throwback to GOLDEN AGE SCI-FI.
Anyway, if PARADISE should turn out to be different than ALL IS WELL in the ALIEN universe if you ask me.
If you look at the above pattern, some things are apparent to me.
1. The simpler GENRE-hybrids were the best received (even though I love A3 and like PROMETHEUS enough)
ALIEN - Sci-Fi Horror Haunted House, and ALIENS - Sci-Fi Horror Action.
2. If you look at the breakdown its not hard to understand why the last 3 are harder to swallow.
3. What everyone is concerned about is that they are going forward making the mistake of continuing on to PARADISE in the same genre and vein as the last but the other mistake they have made in the past is in trying to return to what has been done before.
A3 was ruined theatrically by trying to cut out the heart and darkness and make it more of an action film. A:R The only things that work are the original content, it is also hurt buy trying to make it more like ALIENS. Same thing goes for AVP - The Adventure film angle works everything else doesn't. Nowhere is it more apparent to me than watching AVP-R, the way the series is hurt by an attempt to be more like ALIENS. Even PROMETHEUS was in many ways hurt by the NEED to connect it to ALIEN. The birth of the deacon ends up feeling tacked on and the plot is in many ways reminiscent of ALIEN. Again, what works in PROMETHEUS is the original content, not the stuff we've already seen.
4. If they are going to make PARADISE, a good film, they need to liberate the franchise from trying to be LIKE what came before it.
5. They need to find a simple genre-hybrid concept, based on the events in the previous films and let it be what it wants to be, instead of what fans liked before.
For instance, a SCI-FI HORROR FANTASY film, that really focused on the BIOMECHANICS and the bizarre world they inhabit while letting the ALIEN be less of a centerpiece.... Or if they want to focus on the DEACON, and LV-223, make its story something outside of what's come before.
This every-film-is-different factor is what make the Alien series the best SCI-FI franchise out there. Even with its blunders and (no offense to anyone) accepting that AVP isn't canonical - if they finish this off on a high note somehow, this entire series will be vindicated.
.......and.....I'm back. Prometheus 2. Here's hoping it's what was promised in Prometheus.
Ridley Scott is the only person on Earth who is allowed to screw up the series; he pioneered the A L I E N beginning after all!
I would agree that Noomi's character is neither likable or memorable. She weighed the film down with her presence. Vickers had more gravitas and dimension then Shaw. I think I'm still in disbelief at how bad portions of this movie are. I just want to slap Scott upside the head. His mistakes are so P.T. Anderson, so beneath his experiences.
You are beginning to see the light, Bethesda :-* Welcome back.
Quote from: ThisBethesdaSea on Jun 18, 2013, 10:01:21 PM
I would agree that Noomi's character is neither likable or memorable. She weighed the film down with her presence. Vickers had more gravitas and dimension then Shaw. I think I'm still in disbelief at how bad portions of this movie are. I just want to slap Scott upside the head. His mistakes are so P.T. Anderson, so beneath his experiences.
Folks, I have never been capable of sitting through Prometheus twice.
It has the terribly unsubtle quick cut opening scene with the pseudo alien font title card.
Followed by the pointless archaeology scene which leads to double exposition.
Followed by the UGLIEST visuals EVER in a Ridley Scott film - the wretched dream sequence.
Followed by douche bag guy giving his lecture with the shitty looking hollograms.
OH and you mean his mistakes are so Paul WS Anderson. P.T Anderson would make a great sci fi movie I bet.
Quote from: FiorinaFury161 on Jun 18, 2013, 09:56:39 PM
Ridley Scott is the only person on Earth who is allowed to screw up the series; he pioneered the A L I E N beginning after all!
No-one should be 'allowed' to screw it up. What you've just stated is precisely the problem with the public's perception... He, on his own, was
not the one who pioneered it. It was the sum total of a
lot of different visionaries. Sometimes, he hired people and didn't even bother to look over their contributions much, if at all. Chris Foss would be very much a case in point.
But it was Scott's boner for a terrible idea that set this square wheel in motion.
Welcome back Bethesda! :)
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 07:06:51 PM
The acting from half the cast is dreadful -- Rafe Spall can't even make up his mind whether to use a stupid southern accent in some scenes or speak normally in others.
It's been explained.
http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=44475.msg1418601#msg1418601 (http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=44475.msg1418601#msg1418601)
If Prometheus 2 doesn't have some Alien like thing eating people's faces it will be as terrible as the first one.
QuoteSometimes, he hired people and didn't even bother to look over their contributions much, if at all. Chris Foss would be very much a case in point.
Not everyone gets their stuff on screen. Esepcially when Cobb's stuff was superior.
And sometimes when you do get your stuff on screen, no one knows who you are and cream their pants over the other guy. Hello, Roger Dicken.
Even the Prometheus facebook page has anounced the news about the writer. I know it doesn't mean much, but it's something.
Another thing that a Prometheus sequel needs is to be scary. Prometheus failed horribly in this department for me.
Prometheus 2 script will eventually end up where it belongs - in the dumpster.
I can't wait for Fox to announce the news they are rebooting ALIEN. :laugh:
I hope they'll intertwine several subplots as well as go back in the past, show Weyland's motivations, his relationship with David and maybe reveal something about the company.
Quote from: ThisBethesdaSea on Jun 18, 2013, 10:01:21 PM
I would agree that Noomi's character is neither likable or memorable. She weighed the film down with her presence. Vickers had more gravitas and dimension then Shaw. I think I'm still in disbelief at how bad portions of this movie are. I just want to slap Scott upside the head. His mistakes are so P.T. Anderson, so beneath his experiences.
not P.T. Anderson, it's Paul WS Anderson. Paul Thomas Anderson would never make a sci-fi movie.
Quote from: SM on Jun 19, 2013, 12:59:41 AM
Not everyone gets their stuff on screen. Esepcially when Cobb's stuff was superior.
And sometimes when you do get your stuff on screen, no one knows who you are and cream their pants over the other guy. Hello, Roger Dicken.
Quote from: 'Hardware - The Definitive SF Works Of Chris Foss'
In the Autumn of 1976 Chris was invited to work on 'Alien' (1979) as the movie's visual design consultant, Dan O'Bannon - who also co-wrote the story and wrote the screenplay - wanted to use the same team from 'Dune'. The studio was in downtown Los Angeles, on the Fox lot. Chris stayed with friends in a "fantastic" house on Mulholland Drive and the studio gave him a choice of exotic cars to drive. "I'd wake up to brilliant Californian sunshine and drive down to the studio. I was working with a lovely chap called Ron Cobb and we got on really well," he recalls. Because they were non-union the production had to keep them hidden, so they worked in everything from a washroom to an un-air conditioned shed over the carpenter's studio. However, Chris and Ron were having so much fun it didn't seem to matter. Their only contact with the production team was through O'Bannon, who was very supportive.
After several months of intensive work the director finally came to view their artwork. After looking around the room at the sea of concept drawings, Chris remembers he simply commented, "'Yeah, room full of spaceships' and walked out again." The only direction Chris and Cobb had was from O'Bannon, who had a very clear idea of what he wanted, "but he was getting countermanded as the 'Alien' production got bigger and bigger. Every day his car was getting more and more dents in it and we took that as a metaphor for the battering he was getting from the production.
From that, it seems...
1: RS wasn't just disengaged on a personal level, but on the very
rare moment he went to see the concept artists (of the stuff which was going to be taking up a lot more screen time than the creature), he was disrespectful of their craft, too. Especially in light of their poor working conditions.
2: RS gave no creative feedback, whatsoever. Whatever the reasons for that, it's bad form for a working relationship.
3: O'Bannon was the one making an effort to try and co-ordinate the creative side of things. If not for what he was doing, the production might have turned out very different.
4: Cobb received the same treatment as Foss. It wasn't about whose work was ultimately chosen.
Doesn't mean RS is a 'bad person', but it does demonstrate how strangely disengaged he was with some very important aspects of the project. This is what I meant when I wrote that he shouldn't be considered the be all and end all of '
Alien'. A tremendously important factor, yes. But just one factor of several, nonetheless.
Riddles wasn't interested in science fiction, and Danny O'B was credited as 'Visual Design Consultant'. The above sounds about right.
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 18, 2013, 11:22:25 AM
Quote from: szkoki on Jun 18, 2013, 09:42:51 AM
are u aware guys that most of the sequels are much worse than the first movie? :P
Terminator 2 agreed
Aliens - DIFFERENT GENRE
American Pie 2 really? all of them is the same
Die Hard, Die Hard with a vengeance, rather watch the 3rd :P
Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey agreed
Ghostbusters 2 no
TDK, TDKR agreed but forget that B 3rd movie
Superman 2 really? all of them is the same
Spiderman 2 really? all of them is the same
Beverley Hills Cop 2 really? all of them is the same
to name a couple of great ones
matter of taste diude mainly, but most of the sequels are just ripp offs to make money and most of the time with a completely differents cast, director and staff totally not understanding the whole concept for example Cube
Just hope some randome guy will dare to make better script for Promi than Sphait and Linde
Yeah should have specified it was just my list of what I perceive to be great sequels, hopefully they can redeem themselves somewhere with the second script. The script needs someone ballsy who will stick to their own ideas and not give in to FOX's demands, I'd personally love to see a fully controlled Fincher script!
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 19, 2013, 05:31:03 AM
Quote from: ThisBethesdaSea on Jun 18, 2013, 10:01:21 PM
I would agree that Noomi's character is neither likable or memorable. She weighed the film down with her presence. Vickers had more gravitas and dimension then Shaw. I think I'm still in disbelief at how bad portions of this movie are. I just want to slap Scott upside the head. His mistakes are so P.T. Anderson, so beneath his experiences.
not P.T. Anderson, it's Paul WS Anderson. Paul Thomas Anderson would never make a sci-fi movie.
I wouldn't rule out PTA doing a sci fi considering how his last two movies seem to have a Kubrick influence. The opening of There Will Be Blood is essentially The Dawn Of Man sequence from 2001.
Quote from: Cvalda on Jun 18, 2013, 07:06:51 PM
The acting from half the cast is dreadful -- Rafe Spall can't even make up his mind whether to use a stupid southern accent in some scenes or speak normally in others.
I can't really remember any scenes where he spoke with a middle class British accent??? Although saying that I do always wonder why they don't just employ American actors to play Americans or change the character to 'British' to simply make it easier for the actors involved. It's not like Millburn or Janek needed to be American... I'm just glad that they didn't make Ian Holm or John Hurt speak with US accents...
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jun 18, 2013, 10:25:36 PM
Quote from: FiorinaFury161 on Jun 18, 2013, 09:56:39 PM
Ridley Scott is the only person on Earth who is allowed to screw up the series; he pioneered the A L I E N beginning after all!
No-one should be 'allowed' to screw it up. What you've just stated is precisely the problem with the public's perception... He, on his own, was not the one who pioneered it. It was the sum total of a lot of different visionaries. Sometimes, he hired people and didn't even bother to look over their contributions much, if at all. Chris Foss would be very much a case in point.
The problem with this quote is that film making is a business and any film that almost triples its cost in revenue, is just not a screw-up. Also, and Im not trying to start some flame war, but most people liked it enough... Personally, I just felt it was hurt by involving the Alien at all. I wish they would have saved them for the sequel because once they ad that monster element people are shaking their fingers if it doesn't become what Alien was, and Prometheus was interested in telling a different kind of story. If and when it stuck to those aspects, I think it suceeded. But fans wanted it to be an ALIEN film and so the Producers forced the hand to stir in certain things which led to a soup being created that was fine but didn't work as a stand-alone film.
Quote from: CainsSon on Jun 19, 2013, 04:39:05 PM
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jun 18, 2013, 10:25:36 PM
Quote from: FiorinaFury161 on Jun 18, 2013, 09:56:39 PM
Ridley Scott is the only person on Earth who is allowed to screw up the series; he pioneered the A L I E N beginning after all!
No-one should be 'allowed' to screw it up. What you've just stated is precisely the problem with the public's perception... He, on his own, was not the one who pioneered it. It was the sum total of a lot of different visionaries. Sometimes, he hired people and didn't even bother to look over their contributions much, if at all. Chris Foss would be very much a case in point.
The problem with this quote is that film making is a business and any film that almost triples its cost in revenue, is just not a screw-up. Also, and Im not trying to start some flame war, but most people liked it enough... Personally, I just felt it was hurt by involving the Alien at all. I wish they would have saved them for the sequel because once they ad that monster element people are shaking their fingers if it doesn't become what Alien was, and Prometheus was interested in telling a different kind of story. If and when it stuck to those aspects, I think it suceeded. But fans wanted it to be an ALIEN film and so the Producers forced the hand to stir in certain things which led to a soup being created that was fine but didn't work as a stand-alone film.
I agree... I think it could be deemed a 'screw up' in terms of it attempting to be as original, as ground breaking or as scary as Alien. However, when viewed in context, and objectively, I personally think it's a pretty good sci-fi film (although I'd admit not in the same league as Alien). It also made sheds of money...
Prometheus2 - good luck with that.
The show must go on I guess. Could be ground breaking deep-space sci-fi, in the right hands.
Hoping for a bio-mechanical-psychological thriller 'Forbidden Planet' on steroids this time, a more coherent script and bigger Space Jockies - sorry - Engineers, of course. :laugh:
Quote from: Powerloader on Jun 19, 2013, 05:11:42 AM
I can't wait for Fox to announce the news they are rebooting ALIEN. :laugh:
"You secure that shit, Hudson!" :D
I personally can't wait for them to get movin' on Prometheus 2. For all its narrative flaws, the original is still an enjoyable sensory experience, and I find myself watching it a lot. I'll always appreciate sci-fi/horror films with real craftsmanship that are able to avoid having cameras going down peoples' throats, and such...
Quote from: Mr. Clemens on Jun 19, 2013, 11:37:39 PM
Quote from: Powerloader on Jun 19, 2013, 05:11:42 AM
I can't wait for Fox to announce the news they are rebooting ALIEN. :laugh:
"You secure that shit, Hudson!" :D
I personally can't wait for them to get movin' on Prometheus 2. For all its narrative flaws, the original is still an enjoyable sensory experience, and I find myself watching it a lot. I'll always appreciate sci-fi/horror films with real craftsmanship that are able to avoid having cameras going down peoples' throats, and such...
^^THIS^^ ..and definitely NO to any Alien reboot!!
Prometheus already was pretty much a reboot, albeit an in-continuity one.
As I recall, the murmurs were that this was going to be a remake of 'Alien'. Then it got changed to a direct prequel, then changed (again) to what ended up being 'Prometheus.
And, after having just rewatched 'District 9' for the first time in ages, there was something awfully familiar about seeing an alien race of insectoid-looking creatures who had something to do with an urn-like container with black fluid in it, which caused a human being to begin painfully mutating...
Interestingly, the stuff on there was being used as a fuel, not a weapon, even though it had extremely similar properties to what was shown on 'Prometheus'. That it caused genetic mutations was clarified as being incidental.
Good to see the theory I've been favouring for a while has ended up on the big screen somehow. :laugh:
The similarities were very obvious, though. In retrospect, I'm surprised that more hasn't been made of it. Cross 'Alien Versus Predator' with 'District 9' and you basically get the story of 'Prometheus'.
QuoteIn retrospect, I'm surprised that more hasn't been made of it.
People were too busy screaming "X-FILES RIP OFFF!!!!!!1!!" like body snatchers...
I stopped watching that show after the first or second series. Couldn't get into that debate, unfortunately.
Quote from: SM on Jun 20, 2013, 03:27:46 AM
QuoteIn retrospect, I'm surprised that more hasn't been made of it.
People were too busy screaming "X-FILES RIP OFFF!!!!!!1!!" like body snatchers...
'like body snatchers'
I nearly spilled my morning beverage, man.
I hope they'll apply more serious approach to science, fill in the gaps Prometheus left and for example someone will bring an Engineer from for an analysis and we'll learn something more about properties of black goo, how it affects cells, etc. I'm very confident this part will require creating a corporate story arch possibly involving something more than Weyland Corp. I want the movie to tackle the issue of religion vs science more seriously. That'd require more flashbacks into Weyland's past and Elizabeth's youth. No more silly jumps from caves to spaceships with shitty explanations and no depth. More like a lot more narrative vignettes coldly edited to end abruptly and adding layers to the story in various points of time. I can perfectly picture them in my mind.
I think they could really juxtapose Weyland's inability to conceive and the creation of David with Elizabeth's infertility. The former leads to the need of opposing human limits with science, "defying gods", wanting to transcend that; the latter is about exploring everything through the prism of faith and finding answers in it. Overall, this is too important of an angle to ignore it, to not develop it and character flashbacks are the only way to retcon it and give the audience more reasons to care about Elizabeth and her quest.
Weyland conceived Vickers.
Besides, the concept of a protagonist with a talking head is cool as hell and could really inject something new and unique into Alien-related universe, some likeable quirkiness which might be a natural progression from what we've seen of David's character in Prometheus (he was totally different than Ash, Bishop or Call). Of course centering the whole film around it would maybe be too far-fetched so I'd assume he'd get his head back in place at some points. Flashbacks or verbal recollections from the past might also make a perfect sense since David might have questions for Elizabeth and vice versa and since it's just them they'd have a lot of time to talk.
Quote from: SM on Jun 20, 2013, 06:05:41 AM
Weyland conceived Vickers.
You ruined my perfectly symmetrical story-arch :( But still, something along those lines would make perfect sense. He didn't have what he wanted even if he could conceive. Elizabeth on the other hand no matter how hard she tried, she couldn't conceive (tentacled monster aside). Whim vs physical inability.
I'm a f**king literature nerd, I get my way around such things :D
I found the religion-versus-science stuff thoroughly... Disinteresting. We don't need a movie to revolve around it. Nor do we need samples of the black ooze to be brought back to our solar system to be examined. Just make sure that the ship/colony, where the story is set, has a decent laboratory.
Not that even this would be necessary. We don't need to see the black ooze ever again. It was a mercurial plot device which didn't really go anywhere. Zombie cavemen don't do much for me, entertainment-wise.
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 20, 2013, 06:09:13 AM
Besides, the concept of a protagonist with a talking head is cool as hell
Eh... I've seen it elsewhere ('
AI', '
Lexx', '
Empire Strikes Back', etcetera) and I don't see it adding anything fascinating.
Unless it's David Byrne.
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jun 20, 2013, 09:24:50 PM
I found the religion-versus-science stuff thoroughly... Disinteresting.
Pure Lindelof.
The guy sure as hell knows how to sell a movie, but he sure doesn't know how to write a good one.
Quote from: maledoro on Jun 20, 2013, 09:33:55 PM
Unless it's David Byrne.
:applause: :D
"You might ask yourself, 'why is this man's suit so big?'
And you may think to yourself, 'couldn't it be taken in a little'?" ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNcnudXLN2g#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNcnudXLN2g#ws)
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jun 20, 2013, 09:24:50 PM
I found the religion-versus-science stuff thoroughly... Disinteresting. We don't need a movie to revolve around it. Nor do we need samples of the black ooze to be brought back to our solar system to be examined. Just make sure that the ship/colony, where the story is set, has a decent laboratory.
Not that even this would be necessary. We don't need to see the black ooze ever again. It was a mercurial plot device which didn't really go anywhere. Zombie cavemen don't do much for me, entertainment-wise.
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 20, 2013, 06:09:13 AM
Besides, the concept of a protagonist with a talking head is cool as hell
Eh... I've seen it elsewhere ('AI', 'Lexx', 'Empire Strikes Back', etcetera) and I don't see it adding anything fascinating.
And I've seen it in Bring me the Head of Alfredo Garcia, a movie that would your fvckin head off. But the head wasn't alive.
Quote from: SM on Jun 20, 2013, 11:18:55 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNcnudXLN2g#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNcnudXLN2g#ws)
Perfect pun, "you're just a talking head" and then there was a Talking Heads poster shown hanging on the wall :D
And what I meant in religion vs science thread is that the plot needs some friction, something to capitalize on Elizabeth's characteristics, many things were touched in Prometheus, just not explored. The movie MUST contain friction, David contained a lot of elements that caused frictions but there wasn't enough of that in characters around him. The franchise needs some underlying characteristics to add to its continuity or else it will become less and less meaningful with every subsequent iteration. The character of Weyland wasn't fully developed and it was a huge missed opportunity, the only way to fix it is to do it the way I suggested. The clash of religion and science was never meant by me to be a focal point and something presented in a straightforward way, but rather something blurred yet tangible, like morality in William Friedkin's movies (i.e. there are no clear-cut heroes and no clear-cut villains).
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 21, 2013, 04:04:40 AMAnd what I meant in religion vs science thread is that the plot needs some friction
Prometheus pretty much put an end to any religion vs. science debate: Theists are dead wrong; Scientists just need more samples.
I gave up with the "well who created them?" Line, it represents completely the whole arrogant, religious argument. My God has been disproven, but wait who created the people who created us.... surely it must be God?! He's so mysterious and beardy!
Get off my movie screen
Yay for unimaginative and narrow audiences...
I didn't see anything in Prometheus advocating the wisdom of belief/faith. Quite the opposite.
Quote from: Gash on Jun 22, 2013, 12:06:55 AM
I didn't see anything in Prometheus advocating the wisdom of belief/faith. Quite the opposite.
Makes it hard to care about Shaw's character though. Her "I believe because it's what I chose" is so cringy.
Quote from: tmjhur on Jun 22, 2013, 12:16:15 AM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 22, 2013, 12:06:55 AM
I didn't see anything in Prometheus advocating the wisdom of belief/faith. Quite the opposite.
Makes it hard to care about Shaw's character though. Her "I believe because it's what I chose" is so cringy.
Shaw completely encapsulated that notion, that's why I hated her character for the majority of the movie, she met her maker, which pretty much disproved her faith and yet still hung on to that "God still might exist because..." attitude.
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 12:20:28 AM
Quote from: tmjhur on Jun 22, 2013, 12:16:15 AM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 22, 2013, 12:06:55 AM
I didn't see anything in Prometheus advocating the wisdom of belief/faith. Quite the opposite.
Makes it hard to care about Shaw's character though. Her "I believe because it's what I chose" is so cringy.
Shaw completely encapsulated that notion, that's why I hated her character for the majority of the movie, she met her maker, which pretty much disproved her faith and yet still hung on to that "God still might exist because..." attitude.
Isn't that how most people behave though? Adversity can often lead to strengthening religious beliefs.
I'm hoping this will get made, but I can't count on it yet. Fox has been known to put their sequels on hold before like with Predators 2 for example.
Quote from: Hellspawn28 on Jun 22, 2013, 07:56:23 AM
I'm hoping this will get made, but I can't count it yet. Fox has been known to put their sequels on hold before like with Predators 2 for example.
Predators was bad though... Did it have a single redeeming feature? ;)
Quote from: Darth Vile on Jun 22, 2013, 07:59:46 AM
Quote from: Hellspawn28 on Jun 22, 2013, 07:56:23 AM
I'm hoping this will get made, but I can't count it yet. Fox has been known to put their sequels on hold before like with Predators 2 for example.
Predators was bad though... Did it have a single redeeming feature? ;)
Did Prometheus? ;)
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 08:25:47 AMDid Prometheus? ;)
Debatable. But it certainly made a lot of moolah, which of course is Job #1.
Quote from: Mr. Clemens on Jun 22, 2013, 03:24:18 PM
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 08:25:47 AMDid Prometheus? ;)
Debatable. But it certainly made a lot of moolah, which of course is Job #1.
Is that a direct quote from Michael Bay? :laugh:
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 08:25:47 AM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Jun 22, 2013, 07:59:46 AM
Quote from: Hellspawn28 on Jun 22, 2013, 07:56:23 AM
I'm hoping this will get made, but I can't count it yet. Fox has been known to put their sequels on hold before like with Predators 2 for example.
Predators was bad though... Did it have a single redeeming feature? ;)
Did Prometheus? ;)
Yes - many. Predators had nothing... Saying that, I'm in a minority here as I don't believe there has ever been a good Predator movie.
Quote from: Darth Vile on Jun 22, 2013, 08:36:51 PMSaying that, I'm in a minority here as I don't believe there has ever been a good Predator movie.
What the hell is this "Predator" thing you guys keep talking about?
;)
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 12:20:28 AMShaw completely encapsulated that notion, that's why I hated her character for the majority of the movie, she met her maker, which pretty much disproved her faith and yet still hung on to that "God still might exist because..." attitude.
Shaw needs to believe that her creator, no matter what form it takes, is good and just. That's why she is heading off the find more of them at the end of the film. Her faith is tied to their motives, not their existence.
Quote from: ChrisPachi on Jun 23, 2013, 01:42:17 PM
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 12:20:28 AMShaw completely encapsulated that notion, that's why I hated her character for the majority of the movie, she met her maker, which pretty much disproved her faith and yet still hung on to that "God still might exist because..." attitude.
Shaw needs to believe that her creator, no matter what form it takes, is good and just. That's why she is heading off the find more of them at the end of the film. Her faith is tied to their motives, not their existence.
Keep in mind her response to Chumly Hollowhead's comment about our creators not being gods; she immediately asked what or who made the Engineers using the rhetorical God of the Gaps (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_of_the_gaps) argument. It's also a shame that she has either rejected or never considered the Epicurean Paradox (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicurus#Pleasure_as_absence_of_suffering).
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 08:25:47 AM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Jun 22, 2013, 07:59:46 AM
Quote from: Hellspawn28 on Jun 22, 2013, 07:56:23 AM
I'm hoping this will get made, but I can't count it yet. Fox has been known to put their sequels on hold before like with Predators 2 for example.
Predators was bad though... Did it have a single redeeming feature? ;)
Did Prometheus? ;)
Redeeming? No. Didn't need any.
Quote from: maledoro on Jun 23, 2013, 02:41:40 PMIt's also a shame that she has either rejected or never considered the Epicurean Paradox.
There is no paradox if you can ask god itself.
...or Chumly.
Quote from: ChrisPachi on Jun 27, 2013, 02:25:36 PM
Quote from: maledoro on Jun 23, 2013, 02:41:40 PMIt's also a shame that she has either rejected or never considered the Epicurean Paradox.
There is no paradox if you can ask god itself.
And since God hasn't come forth with an answer after all these years, the paradox remains.
Not sure how I feel about this. If Prometheus 2 never happens perhaps I can forget about the first one in time.
I really hated all the year of our lord bullshit at the end of P1. In my mind there is certainly no freaking God in the Alien universe and I can't help but feel that a weak writer will try and write a popular script pandering to the predominately religious masses and go in that direction, which I think is the exact opposite of what the Alien universe is about.
Thinking along these lines actually just makes me hate on Prometheus, why the hell couldn't the engineers be monstrous aliens as depicted so excellently in Alien rather than humans in suits, I could almost believe in a God if we were one of a myriad of crazy creations over the vast expanse of space, I'm surprised the "engineers" didn't have pointy ears. Talk about lack of imagination.
Frankly I'm not surprised they are struggling to find a writer, how the hell is the story going to continue? Shaw is going to land on their planet, walk about with David's head chatting to engineers? Perhaps the Decon stowed away so we can get some Alien on Alien killing action, because you know, that always works.
I really want something to look forward to in the Alien universe, but Prometheus 2 doesn't feel like it.
Rant over.
Quote from: Gash on Jun 23, 2013, 03:52:01 PM
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jun 22, 2013, 08:25:47 AM
Quote from: Darth Vile on Jun 22, 2013, 07:59:46 AM
Quote from: Hellspawn28 on Jun 22, 2013, 07:56:23 AM
I'm hoping this will get made, but I can't count it yet. Fox has been known to put their sequels on hold before like with Predators 2 for example.
Predators was bad though... Did it have a single redeeming feature? ;)
Did Prometheus? ;)
Redeeming? No. Didn't need any.
Prometheus didn't need any redeeming features? So people are cool with lazy writing, no character development and a rushed final third, not to mention a lame fan service at the end with the Deacon?
Quote from: Novak 1334 on Jul 09, 2013, 03:52:39 PMPrometheus didn't need any redeeming features? So people are cool with lazy writing, no character development and a rushed final third, not to mention a lame fan service at the end with the Deacon?
Scarily, there are people who worship Ridley Scott. I've seen this on a Prometheus forum (one of the admins goes as far as demonizing David Giler, as if he were the "Anti-Scott") and in reading the 4+ star ratings for
Prometheus on Amazon (where some claim that
Prometheus is like
2001 as it is now a misunderstood masterpiece, but future historians will champion it).
What I'm looking forward to most are the next batch of interviews where Ridley Scott goes off on some more spontaneously rambling tangents.
Quote from: Xenomorphine on Jul 09, 2013, 11:32:00 PM
What I'm looking forward to most are the next batch of interviews where Ridley Scott goes off on some more spontaneously rambling tangents.
Ive said this before and I will say it again. Not to be a jerk but just to be sure this stays fresh in people's minds.
Anyone who says another ALIEN film after PROMETHEUS will not happen is sorely, sorely mistaken.
The ONLY question is what that film will be and if you don't WANT it to be PARADISE, well you can pretty much be assured that the next ALIEN film will be a REBOOT/REMAKE of ALIEN that follows in sequence after PROMETHEUS.
That's how PROMETHEUS set things up, and THAT IS WHAT FOX LOVED ABOUT LINDELOF'S DRAFT.
If you don't root for PARADISE, then you will be delivered an ALIEN reboot.
Do you want that to happen?
After ALIEN 3 - which was a clear ending, we still got A:R.
After A:R effectively ruined the franchise, we ended up with AVP.
After AVP turned a smart adult-themed series into a PG-13 cartoon and everyone hated it, we STILL got AVP-R.
NOBODY LIKED AVP-R. It is one of the most widely despised films in recent memory. It didn't even do well at the BOX OFFICE and yet....
...WE STILL GOT PROMETHEUS!
Even though the next logical step, at that time was a remake/reboot of ALIEN...
Do the math here.
PARADISE or REBOOT. That's whats on the table.
No. All that's really on the table at this point is Prometheus 2.
Quote from: SM on Jul 10, 2013, 04:38:56 AM
No. All that's really on the table at this point is Prometheus 2.
Correct PROMETHEUS 2 - which will either be PARADISE / PROMETHEUS 2, or PROMETHEUS 2 The ALIEN REBOOT.
To clarify: Ask yourself if it seems logical enough to start PROMETHEUS 2 with some kind of unwitting Weyland Corp ship of Terraformers, sent from an off-world out-post to Terraform LV223... What follows is a reboot of ALIEN that leads into a reboot of ALIENS. Change character names / add new characters....There. Now its both a sequel to PROMETHEUS AND ALSO a REBOOT OF THE ALIEN series. See how easy that is?
If PARADISE doesn't happen, this will happen. FOX is already taking a risk even considering doing something different when they can just move forward with an ALIEN reboot from here.
If you think some other ALIEN film won't be coming,... You just don't get the film industry. After the success of PROMETHEUS, another film will come one way or the other. Its also worth noting that an ALIEN REBOOT as a PROMETHEUS follow-up, will likely cost them much LESS money than Ridley Scott's PARADISE or whoever directs.
I suppose you could ALSO consider the likelihood that PROMETHEUS 2 will be some combination of both things, that FOX believes will keep fans happy by featuring the alien and possibly also taking place on PARADISE...
Im not completely against that idea, but I'd rather see a more original story follow Prometheus.
PROMETHEUS set-up, what could easily be an ALIEN reboot-PROMETHEUS sequel hybrid. If you think that's not true, you are not seeing the full hand that the PROMETHEUS plot dealt the studio.
It allowed the studio to either A) Make a further original film that continues in the same vein as PROMETHEUS - and becomes PARADISE or B) If PROMETHEUS failed, it provided a larger framework for an ALIEN-REBOOT series, starting with what is essentially and ALIEN reboot.
I think they could have done an Alien reboot without making a prequel... but I understand what you're saying. To be honest, I'm not sure there is much money in an Alien reboot... it's a much more expensive movie to make than a Halloween or Texas Chainsaw Massacre (which can be done very cheaply), and I'm not sure the market is there to make that money back. Prometheus worked, financially, because it was a prequel and because Scott was coming back to the franchise. I'm not sure they could get that audience again unless they made a very, very good movie.
QuoteIm not completely against that idea, but I'd rather see a more original story follow Prometheus.
And since Riddles pretty much agrees with this and has said any Prometheus sequels will likely move further away from Alien, it renders most of your post kinda void.
Reboots are for superheroes and tv shows, not cinematic classics. I honestly can't stop laughing at the idea of some young director coming along and casting seven 'hot' young thespians in a remake/reboot of Alien.
The 3rd and 4th Jaws movies sucked. Does Jaws need a reboot?
If that's your idea of entertainment, let me suggest the Monster Truck show...
Quote from: SM on Jul 10, 2013, 12:01:33 PM
QuoteIm not completely against that idea, but I'd rather see a more original story follow Prometheus.
And since Riddles pretty much agrees with this and has said any Prometheus sequels will likely move further away from Alien, it renders most of your post kinda void.
Rite man, but I stated this warning to those who trash PROMETHEUS. Riddles, as you say, is on the same page, but FOX is not yet. They listened to fans reactions and have a choice to make: What is more bankable, a PROMETHEUS 2 that moves further away from ALIEN or one they can market with the ALIEN on board in a real way.
The point is: I WANT PARADISE, not an ALIEN REBOOT. And anyone who doesn't want an ALIEN REBOOT should be EXCITED that PARADISE MAY HAPPEN so we don't get a version of PROMETHEUS 2 that behaves as a reboot.
As for those who said an ALIEN REBOOT isn't marketable, that's just silly. Its certainly cheaper to make than PARADISE and they also have the distinct option to say its a PROMETHEUS SEQUEL and not be lying, when really its an ALIEN REBOOT.
Unfortunately, this remains a bankable, cheaper alternative to PARADISE, so lets keep our fingers crossed that JACK PAGLEN comes up with something exciting for the studio to warm up to. I wish this REBOOT potential for PROMETHEUS 2 wasn't the case, but sadly its like a carrot dangling in front of the producer's faces.
Why take a really expensive risk when you can take the less expensive ace in the hole?
Yeah but looking at the numbers, Prometheus was $230m ahead in box office receipts of the nearest flick with an Alien in it.
And it's third in terms of inflation adjusted box office behind Alien and Aliens which have 33 and 26 years respectively worth of headstart. And it's Alien and Aliens it's behind.
Despite the apparent rage from some quarters, Prometheus reviewed better among critics and punters than Alien3 and Resurrection and way better than the AvPs. At this point you'd be angling for more Prometheus than Alien.
I'm so excited for Prometheus 2. :D
Quote from: Mr. Clemens on Jul 10, 2013, 11:45:05 PM
Reboots are for superheroes and tv shows, not cinematic classics. I honestly can't stop laughing at the idea of some young director coming along and casting seven 'hot' young thespians in a remake/reboot of Alien.
The 3rd and 4th Jaws movies sucked. Does Jaws need a reboot?
If that's your idea of entertainment, let me suggest the Monster Truck show...
Yep, this 100% for me, there's no need for a reboot. Love it or hate it, there's enough scope for Prometheus 2 to be its own thing, even if it did have an alien in it. Prometheus' shorter than average Jockey was proof enough for me you can take something you did before, and still turn it into something else without harming what's already in place. I myself expected too much of the prequel thing at first, but once you open your eyes to it, Prometheus can go anywhere it wants, all I want to see is a story that's told in a better way.
Quote from: CainsSon on Jul 10, 2013, 04:20:21 AM
If you don't root for PARADISE, then you will be delivered an ALIEN reboot.
That's apparently what '
Prometheus' was going to
be before Fox got wind of the bad reaction.
Not that I'd necessarily be
averse to a remake of '
Alien', but I can't think of anyone I'd trust to do it right. Plus, it would be just as unnecessary as '
Prometheus', itself, was.
Quote from: CainsSon on Jul 11, 2013, 06:44:02 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 10, 2013, 12:01:33 PM
QuoteIm not completely against that idea, but I'd rather see a more original story follow Prometheus.
And since Riddles pretty much agrees with this and has said any Prometheus sequels will likely move further away from Alien, it renders most of your post kinda void.
Rite man, but I stated this warning to those who trash PROMETHEUS. Riddles, as you say, is on the same page, but FOX is not yet. They listened to fans reactions and have a choice to make: What is more bankable, a PROMETHEUS 2 that moves further away from ALIEN or one they can market with the ALIEN on board in a real way.
The point is: I WANT PARADISE, not an ALIEN REBOOT. And anyone who doesn't want an ALIEN REBOOT should be EXCITED that PARADISE MAY HAPPEN so we don't get a version of PROMETHEUS 2 that behaves as a reboot.
As for those who said an ALIEN REBOOT isn't marketable, that's just silly. Its certainly cheaper to make than PARADISE and they also have the distinct option to say its a PROMETHEUS SEQUEL and not be lying, when really its an ALIEN REBOOT.
Unfortunately, this remains a bankable, cheaper alternative to PARADISE, so lets keep our fingers crossed that JACK PAGLEN comes up with something exciting for the studio to warm up to. I wish this REBOOT potential for PROMETHEUS 2 wasn't the case, but sadly its like a carrot dangling in front of the producer's faces.
Why take a really expensive risk when you can take the less expensive ace in the hole?
I think an Alien movie is 'marketable', I just don't think it would be profitable for the studio. Time will tell, but I'd hazzard a guess that Prometheus 2 will be closer to the themes of Prometheus than it will Alien.
Quote from: CainsSon on Jul 11, 2013, 06:44:02 AMAnd anyone who doesn't want an ALIEN REBOOT should be EXCITED that PARADISE MAY HAPPEN so we don't get a version of PROMETHEUS 2 that behaves as a reboot.
I've seen the latest Alien reboot and it was shit, so forgive me if I am not excited about a potential sequel in the vain hope that my lack of excitement somehow results in another Alien reboot.
Quote from: SM on Jul 11, 2013, 06:56:23 AM
Yeah but looking at the numbers, Prometheus was $230m ahead in box office receipts of the nearest flick with an Alien in it.
And it's third in terms of inflation adjusted box office behind Alien and Aliens which have 33 and 26 years respectively worth of headstart. And it's Alien and Aliens it's behind.
Despite the apparent rage from some quarters, Prometheus reviewed better among critics and punters than Alien3 and Resurrection and way better than the AvPs. At this point you'd be angling for more Prometheus than Alien.
I hope you're right. I really do.
My two cents. I don't know about a reboot but I think that Prometheus will move closerto the Alien franchise than further away. It's just a hunch, but I think most people watch Prometheus expecting some tie in with the Alien series, and that one of the main disappointments of the film was that there wasn't enough of that tie in the movie.
Possibly, but no one can say they weren't suitably warned.
Rebooting the first alien film would bring some serious consequences, and most serious of all them imo (apart from the more than probable failure as a movie) would be the total loss of the magic and malevolence shrouding the first iconic creature, the one and only true alien in the series, which actually was Kane reborn as the perfect organism, and of course, a lot more than that.
If the alien series would ever have to face a reboot, It should be only to free the creature from more than 20 years of Cameron-itis and his damned influence over the entire franchise once and for all. Still, If this movie was ever to be done, It should not be a reboot of the first film by any means, and of course the creature to be used in the film could also be different to Giger's alien..., but please, at least be biomechanical, human-like and perverse like the first one, and with the very much missed regeneration skills that the original alien also had (one of the good things about Prometheus was that, but applied to the hammerpede this time).
QuoteRebooting the first alien film would bring some serious consequences, and most serious of all them imo (apart from the more than probable failure as a movie) would be the total loss of the magic and malevolence shrouding the first iconic creature, the one and only true alien in the series, which actually was Kane reborn as the perfect organism, and of course, a lot more than that.
Please. Nothing will ever change the original film. It's still a classic despite what anyone thinks of any of the sequels.
Quoteand with the very much missed regeneration skills that the original alien also had (one of the good things about Prometheus was that, but applied to the hammerpede this time).
Regeneration which was never really highlighted beyond the quick healing facehugger, so therefore not actually missed at all.
I feel like Cameron's influence has extended more to the EU and the various comics, novels, and games which is a good fit for the kind of Alien story. I don't feel that any of the films have tried to follow up on Cameron's influence with the exception of AVPR and that was ripping everything off not just Aliens. I'm really disappointed with Prometheus so I can't say I'm sitting on the edge of my seat waiting for a sequel, but if they did one I'm not sure I want to see Shaw and David visit Paradise or whatever. I'd be ok with a stand alone film where more people come across the remnants of the Engineer's work which would allow for maybe some kind of explanation of what was happening on the first one.
What happened to lindelof?
I was holding my breath for answers to be questions.
Quote from: RobThom on Aug 13, 2013, 06:45:07 AM
What happened to lindelof?
I was holding my breath for answers to be questions.
Who knows? Man I loved Lost and I still love it and yes I loved the ending but between Prometheus and STID my opinion if him is lowering fast. Even though I liked STID and like SOME elements of Prometheus.
Quote from: RobThom on Aug 13, 2013, 06:45:07 AMWhat happened to lindelof?
He had other stuff to do, like wash his hair. Love him or loath him, the man knows a balls-up when he sees it, and his contract had an out.
Although I will be most properbly be target for termination after that :) IMO Prometheus 2 / Paradise should end up being the missing link for EVERYTHING. I think it sure will do the connection between Prometheus and the first Alien movie, but personally I wish they also would link it somehow to the, I agree not the best but still nice entertaining, AvP movies. My dream sequence would still be, the Lost Preds ( the small gang from Pred2 ) being responsible for the original jockey wreckage.
Quote from: Real Scooby on Oct 06, 2013, 07:04:55 AMIMO Prometheus 2 / Paradise should end up being the missing link for EVERYTHING. I think it sure will do the connection between Prometheus and the first Alien movie
Sadly, Ridley Scott and Co. do not share your "O". Scott said that if there were more
Prometheus films, they would take on a life of their own and move away from the
Alien films.
Quote from: Real Scooby on Oct 06, 2013, 07:04:55 AMbut personally I wish they also would link it somehow to the, I agree not the best but still nice entertaining, AvP movies. My dream sequence would still be, the Lost Preds ( the small gang from Pred2 ) being responsible for the original jockey wreckage.
Pretty much everyone involved with the
Alien films distance themselves from the
AVP movies. Even Paul W.S. Anderson had taken an about face and claimed his movie was set in a different universe from the
Alien films. (Which I suspect he had done when he was called out on the many ways his movie didn't fit in with the
Alien films.)