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Films/TV => Alien Prequel Series: Prometheus & Alien Covenant => Topic started by: John73 on May 14, 2017, 05:51:54 PM

Title: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: John73 on May 14, 2017, 05:51:54 PM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4292&p=.htm


42 million this weekend.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 14, 2017, 05:56:50 PM
Phew and wow :)
Great goddamn news!!

Some more info:

With offshore rollout just beginning on Ridley Scott's Alien: Covenant, $42M worth of moviegoers ran to see the Xenomorphs in action in 34 markets this frame. Fox unleashed the Prometheus sequel to No. 1s in 19, ahead of the May 19 domestic bow, and came up with the No. 2 studio movie at the international box office.

Korea leads offshore play at $7.2M, followed by the UK ($6.4M), France ($4.5M), Australia ($3.1M) and Mexico ($2.5M). Alien: Covenant's opening weekend is 4% bigger than Mad Max: Fury Road for the same bucket of markets and at current exchange rates.

http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-king-arthur-guardians-of-the-galaxy-vol-2-aamir-khan-dangal-china-international-box-office-weekend-1202093146/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 14, 2017, 05:58:18 PM
No 3D as well remember which inflated Prometheus' haul.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 14, 2017, 06:03:08 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 14, 2017, 05:58:18 PM
No 3D as well remember which inflated Prometheus' haul.

Plus the £ has tanked after Brexit since Prometheus and Fury Road. That UK figure would be about 20% higher pre last summer
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 14, 2017, 06:21:48 PM
The only concerning thing is that it dropped vs. Prometheus in most markets. I see we've already covered the "no 3D" defense, which is admittedly a potential cause for decreased revenue.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Buckmenstaf on May 14, 2017, 06:23:52 PM
4 days... I'm in Russia... How do I wait just 4 more days...:D
Well, I guess, the same way I've been waiting since 2012:)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Randomizer on May 14, 2017, 06:24:57 PM
I think Covenant would've been better off with using 3D instead of Prometheus but then again, it's no deal-breaker.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 14, 2017, 06:28:09 PM
. .prometheus was also front loaded and i am thinking and  hoping that word of mouth will be better with covenant
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: XENOMORPHOSIS on May 14, 2017, 06:29:37 PM
Is it likely this movie will under perform and pose as worrying for the studio where they'll reconsider whether or not to green light a sequel?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 14, 2017, 06:36:05 PM
Quote from: XENOMORPHOSIS on May 14, 2017, 06:29:37 PM
Is it likely this movie will under perform and pose as worrying for the studio where they'll reconsider whether or not to green light a sequel?

I think it will be fine. That's a very good opening all things considered. The only sure bet for box office success these days is comic book films so for an R rated sci fi its a great opening.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 14, 2017, 06:36:44 PM
. .it's got stiffer competition than prometheus and also bear in mind a harder R than prometheus. .tho i am not quite certain on the latter. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: John73 on May 14, 2017, 06:40:20 PM
Just to clarify a few things on the front page article, I believe the figure linked to at box office pro is a projection for the North American release weekend, not the international projection for this weekend.  Also, I think Prometheus opened to 51 million in North America, I don't think that was its opening gross for the international market.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 14, 2017, 06:40:54 PM
Quote from: XENOMORPHOSIS on May 14, 2017, 06:29:37 PM
Is it likely this movie will under perform and pose as worrying for the studio where they'll reconsider whether or not to green light a sequel?

I do not know at what point 20th Century Fox does not consider this a flop but box office mojo predicted a 35 million $$ domestic opening weekend...less than Prometheus at around 51 million $$. They said it could be higher with good reviews and word of mouth. So yeah, there are good reviews, but some average and bad ones too. I hope it does well because I do not want another 15 years to wait for another Alien movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darkness on May 14, 2017, 06:41:58 PM
Kinda disappointed that the opening takings have dropped so significantly from Prometheus' in Western countries. There's been loads of advertising for it here - I've seen loads of billboards and on the sides of buses in the last two weeks.

And where'd you get that picture on the news post from, Hicks? Haven't seen it before.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 14, 2017, 06:44:15 PM
Quote from: Darkness on May 14, 2017, 06:41:58 PM
Kinda disappointed that the opening takings have dropped so significantly from Prometheus' in Western countries. There's been loads of advertising for it here - I've seen loads of billboards and on the sides of buses in the last two weeks.

And where'd you get that picture on the news post from, Hicks? Haven't seen it before.

I think Western countries quite liked Prometheus...it's just Murica that kept griping about it. Nudge nudge wink wink.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 14, 2017, 06:45:15 PM
I'm not sure what to think about all this. On one hand I don't really think this film deserves to do well in the box office, because I strongly dislike the overall direction they seem to be taking. But on the other hand, I don't want to wait five years (or more) again...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 14, 2017, 06:56:57 PM
Quote from: Evanus on May 14, 2017, 06:45:15 PM
I'm not sure what to think about all this. On one hand I don't really think this film deserves to do well in the box office, because I strongly dislike the overall direction they seem to be taking. But on the other hand, I don't want to wait five years (or more) again...

If they get rid of Ridley Scott, do they even bother finishing the prequel series?

If this thing flops hard, they should consider waiting a bit and then doing a 10 episode HBO series or something...maybe dealing with the Colonial Marines and touching on Xenos very rarely and only built up properly. Great writers, production value similar to Game of Thrones, proper character development...get people excited by the franchise again. Then they can properly make another film and spend their time shooting it without rushing the process.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gazz on May 14, 2017, 07:08:41 PM
So it's tracking about 5% above Mad Max Fury Road in the same markets, which bodes well considering the budget for Covenant is much lower. If it held similarly that would see the film tripling it's budget without factoring in China, although word-of-mouth is clearly not as strong for Covenant. It's a solid start, but the following weeks are what matter most.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Whos_Nick on May 14, 2017, 07:14:38 PM
Quote from: Darkness on May 14, 2017, 06:41:58 PM
Kinda disappointed that the opening takings have dropped so significantly from Prometheus' in Western countries. There's been loads of advertising for it here - I've seen loads of billboards and on the sides of buses in the last two weeks.

And where'd you get that picture on the news post from, Hicks? Haven't seen it before.

It's a Japanese poster
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FqekWiQ8.jpg&hash=0fe4281e20d54a6384e9aae28a35965a43b01572)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 14, 2017, 07:24:49 PM
I have a bad feeling about this.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 14, 2017, 07:27:37 PM
How hype this movie in US ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: MrRipley on May 14, 2017, 07:35:01 PM
US tracking is in the early 30's maybe not even a 100 million grosser.



Let's see what the Gross Margin diff is between the two movies.  Just because Prometheus takes in more rev., doesn't mean it'll be more profitable.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 14, 2017, 07:53:51 PM
Quote from: John73 on May 14, 2017, 06:40:20 PM
Just to clarify a few things on the front page article, I believe the figure linked to at box office pro is a projection for the North American release weekend, not the international projection for this weekend.  Also, I think Prometheus opened to 51 million in North America, I don't think that was its opening gross for the international market.

Thanks. Amended that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: motherfather on May 14, 2017, 08:04:26 PM
Im similarly cautious. I'd like the movie to do moderately well. Enough to prove there is a huge audience out there, but not comfortably enough to encourage them to start being miserly on spending or resorting to cgi or getting cocky about whatever influences fox/execs/whoever might have had (wich may have been to the detriment of the movie from a fan's perspective)

Juat enough to want them to greenlight another movie sooner rather than later.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: ESPILFIRE on May 14, 2017, 08:12:12 PM
Is this a good new or a bad new? I hope we can get at least other film for Alien...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kimo on May 14, 2017, 08:29:52 PM
So will it make enough to warrant a sequel?

Another thing to consider for Prometheus other then being in 3D. Is it was Ridley's Scott's return to sci-fi since Blade Runner. So that would of got a few seats in the cinema.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on May 14, 2017, 08:40:23 PM
Glad to hear it's doing ok. I sincerely hope it reaches the 350m mark before home release. I really want it to succeed, but not so much that we get bogged down in prequels for a decade. Maybe 250m is more realistic though. I don't personally see it having as large a return as say "skull island".
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 14, 2017, 08:54:30 PM
Actually it might not be that bad considering next weekend it will open in 52 other countries, including the U.S. I would say its not fantastic but not bad either. It would pull in Prometheus numbers going at this rate,and that was considered a success. This also while going against Guardians if the Galaxy 2 and not having 3d showings to boost the numbers.

All in all, no reason to begin to panic....far from it actually.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ja on May 14, 2017, 09:11:15 PM
This movie deserve to bomb. I'm sorry for saying this - it is that bad.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 14, 2017, 09:26:18 PM
Quote from: Darkness on May 14, 2017, 06:41:58 PM
Kinda disappointed that the opening takings have dropped so significantly from Prometheus' in Western countries. There's been loads of advertising for it here - I've seen loads of billboards and on the sides of buses in the last two weeks.

Unfortunately the bus advertising didn't quite have the desired effect. Not quite sure why.  :-\

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C-Qqpz7W0AE7I74.jpg:large)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: motherfather on May 14, 2017, 09:52:04 PM
Germany is a big economy doing fairly well at the moment, so it will be interesting to see what sales it pulls in next weekend too.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: XENOMORPHOSIS on May 14, 2017, 10:23:13 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 14, 2017, 09:26:18 PM
Quote from: Darkness on May 14, 2017, 06:41:58 PM
Kinda disappointed that the opening takings have dropped so significantly from Prometheus' in Western countries. There's been loads of advertising for it here - I've seen loads of billboards and on the sides of buses in the last two weeks.

Unfortunately the bus advertising didn't quite have the desired effect. Not quite sure why.  :-\

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C-Qqpz7W0AE7I74.jpg:large)

Feel bad for the misleads audience who've seen the bus ad waiting to see a movie titled LIAEN OVEN CANT ;:/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on May 14, 2017, 10:54:19 PM
Quote from: Ja on May 14, 2017, 09:11:15 PM
This movie deserve to bomb. I'm sorry for saying this - it is that bad.

I'm glad you're not in charge of anything, then.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 14, 2017, 11:05:08 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 14, 2017, 10:54:19 PM
Quote from: Ja on May 14, 2017, 09:11:15 PM
This movie deserve to bomb. I'm sorry for saying this - it is that bad.

I'm glad you're not in charge of anything, then.

Is just a stupid person.

He thinks if ALIEN: COVENANT bombs they made ALIEN Neil Blomkamp. It's actually THE OPOSSITE.

If ALIEN: COVENANT bombs, FOX cancels ANY ALIEN for the next 10 years.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on May 14, 2017, 11:19:28 PM
That's "42 million in adjusted dollars", by the way.

It's also healthy takings - for a movie that's only been out for 4 days.

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on May 15, 2017, 12:16:37 AM
Quote from: windebieste on May 14, 2017, 11:19:28 PM
That's "42 million in adjusted dollars", by the way.

It's also healthy takings - for a movie that's only been out for 4 days.

-Windebieste.

XD

Well, that's almost half the cost to make the film, right, at 111 million? I'm not sure how advertising factors into all of this. "That's minus payload, of course." Perhaps the advertisements for Covenant would be the "payload," in that allegory.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 12:22:04 AM
Quote from: windebieste on May 14, 2017, 11:19:28 PM
That's "42 million in adjusted dollars", by the way.

It's also healthy takings - for a movie that's only been out for 4 days.

-Windebieste.

I think its pretty good numbers. 53 more markets this coming week, including the U.S. Overall positive reviews right now should give the movie some good momentum. A few of my friends who do not follow the franchise too closely have told me they are hearing good things, so there is some positivity in the air...surprising as that may be amidst some of the doom and gloom here.


Quote from: NickisSmart on May 15, 2017, 12:16:37 AM
Quote from: windebieste on May 14, 2017, 11:19:28 PM
That's "42 million in adjusted dollars", by the way.

It's also healthy takings - for a movie that's only been out for 4 days.

-Windebieste.

XD

Well, that's almost half the cost to make the film, right, at 111 million? I'm not sure how advertising factors into all of this. "That's minus payload, of course." Perhaps the advertisements for Covenant would be the "payload," in that allegory.

Someone on here did a good breakdown on how studios do not get all the ticket profits, so its really not as cut and dry as matching production plus marketting costs to box office.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 01:05:23 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 15, 2017, 12:16:37 AM
Quote from: windebieste on May 14, 2017, 11:19:28 PM
That's "42 million in adjusted dollars", by the way.

It's also healthy takings - for a movie that's only been out for 4 days.

-Windebieste.

XD

Well, that's almost half the cost to make the film, right, at 111 million? I'm not sure how advertising factors into all of this. "That's minus payload, of course." Perhaps the advertisements for Covenant would be the "payload," in that allegory.

No. This is overseas so the studio keeps about 16 million out of this. And their production plus distribution is around 200 million. So it's a start but a long ways off from coming close to breaking even.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Thai on May 15, 2017, 01:07:50 AM
Well considering it's 110 million budget.  They would need roughly 220 million to break even.  I think they would be happy with a Prometheus like worldwide haul, but looks like it's going to be a bit lower.  Still I think anything in the $320 to $350 million mark world wide would be considered a success.  Alien has never been a gigantic box office draw.  As long as the studio makes money on it I think they will continue to make Alien movies.  Unless they have a blowout box office success, I think they'll continue to keep the budget in that 110 million dollar range.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Game_Over_Man on May 15, 2017, 01:16:32 AM
$42m is actually a very strong figure considering there's another 54 markets awaiting.

I'm disappointed so many of you appear to be wishing this to fail because Ridley's not going down the route most of you (including me) want. I still want the film to succeed no matter what.

Although it's mostly bonkers and a lights years away from the first 2 films, I still enjoyed the movie for what it was (basically a homage to Hammer horror!) Please, let's get behind this and hopefully Ridley will take fan criticisms on board and make the next film a thrilling finale.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 15, 2017, 02:30:23 AM
I don't know is this good or bad?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 15, 2017, 04:43:41 AM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 15, 2017, 01:16:32 AM
$42m is actually a very strong figure considering there's another 54 markets awaiting.

I'm disappointed so many of you appear to be wishing this to fail because Ridley's not going down the route most of you (including me) want. I still want the film to succeed no matter what.

Although it's mostly bonkers and a lights years away from the first 2 films, I still enjoyed the movie for what it was (basically a homage to Hammer horror!) Please, let's get behind this and hopefully Ridley will take fan criticisms on board and make the next film a thrilling finale.

I agree.

It's kind of sad so many people here wants it to bomb. And it's somewhat stupid too.

If this film bombs, FOX CANCELS any ALIEN film for the next 10 years.

If you hate Ridley Scott, you are doing him a favor too. He has 5 better projects(THE CARTEL, BATTLE OF BRITAIN, ATMITW, etc) than these ALIEN films.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 15, 2017, 04:44:57 AM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 15, 2017, 02:30:23 AM
I don't know is this good or bad?
. .it's fair. .i wonder if movies that are released at the end of a month has a better opening than those who don't?. .i must say tho that i have no clue when people get their salaries in other countries. .over here in south africa the majority gets it either the 25 or the last day of the month and i am also curious if studios even take that into consideration?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 15, 2017, 04:45:39 AM
Quote from: Thai on May 15, 2017, 01:07:50 AM
Well considering it's 110 million budget.  They would need roughly 220 million to break even.  I think they would be happy with a Prometheus like worldwide haul, but looks like it's going to be a bit lower.  Still I think anything in the $320 to $350 million mark world wide would be considered a success.  Alien has never been a gigantic box office draw.  As long as the studio makes money on it I think they will continue to make Alien movies.  Unless they have a blowout box office success, I think they'll continue to keep the budget in that 110 million dollar range.

I agree.

I doubt ALIEN: COVENANT 2 is going to have a bigger budget than ALIEN: COVENANT.

Maybe a little bigger, but NOT a big difference.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: TriniXeno on May 15, 2017, 05:49:04 AM
A lot of you, are too passionate to the point of stupidity. If the movie fails  there is not going to be any new alien movie for a long time. So if you want more movies it has to do good! This garbage of I don't get that feel of the first alien movie in Prometheus and Covenant is nonsense if you want new stories or expansion to the Alien universe you got to stop having tunnel vision, the movies  are not only made for old Alien fans as it seems to be perceived by a lot of you.. but for new viewers  today.  In the 80's that was a totally different film  and cultural era, shit that time don't scare ppl today.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Creditor on May 15, 2017, 07:13:44 AM
It was always a bad idea to make it go a week after Guardians if the Galaxy 2. Pirates 5 and Baywatch will come out soon and make a dent in Covenant box office too.


Just got back from seeing it.  "Alien" fan here since I saw the first on TV as a twelve year old child in 1982.  This was UTTER SHIT - woeful, waste of time piece of shit.  I was bored, annoyed and left ANGRY.  Alien is DEAD people - maybe it's artistic irony it was killed by its creator. 

*snip. I understand folk aren't all going to be angry but you can refrain from the comments wishing death on people. Thanks. Hicks.


Good luck!  I'm one of THE BIGGEST Alien fans you'll ever find and it's now my MISSION to get people to NOT waste their money on this f**king piece of moronic shit.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 15, 2017, 08:17:06 AM
Lose - lose.

If It does well at the box office, then expect more of the same.. and by that I mean laughable plot, script, and lack of coherence and respect.  Prom and AC could have been great. Instead we have portentious popcorn masquerading as philosophy.   

If it breaks even or less, then expect a reboot of Aliens.

I'm not going to spend my money on it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 09:41:39 AM
Quote from: Thai on May 15, 2017, 01:07:50 AM
Well considering it's 110 million budget.  They would need roughly 220 million to break even.  I think they would be happy with a Prometheus like worldwide haul, but looks like it's going to be a bit lower.  Still I think anything in the $320 to $350 million mark world wide would be considered a success.  Alien has never been a gigantic box office draw.  As long as the studio makes money on it I think they will continue to make Alien movies.  Unless they have a blowout box office success, I think they'll continue to keep the budget in that 110 million dollar range.

It needs about 400-450 to break even.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Beardomorph on May 15, 2017, 09:48:11 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 09:41:39 AM
It needs about 400-450 to break even.

That's not out of reach.

The amount of money they spent on marketing seems to be huge. In London I keep seeing adverts for it everywhere in town.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 15, 2017, 10:17:44 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 09:41:39 AM
Quote from: Thai on May 15, 2017, 01:07:50 AM
Well considering it's 110 million budget.  They would need roughly 220 million to break even.  I think they would be happy with a Prometheus like worldwide haul, but looks like it's going to be a bit lower.  Still I think anything in the $320 to $350 million mark world wide would be considered a success.  Alien has never been a gigantic box office draw.  As long as the studio makes money on it I think they will continue to make Alien movies.  Unless they have a blowout box office success, I think they'll continue to keep the budget in that 110 million dollar range.

It needs about 400-450 to break even.

Woow that too much .

Prometheus total gross is $403,354,469   
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=prometheus.htm
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:22:19 AM
No, it does not need "about 400-450 to break even". If that were the case, Prometheus would be a money-loser and we'd never get Covenant.

Studios are businesses. They didn't agree on a sequel for the fans' sake.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Beardomorph on May 15, 2017, 10:41:06 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:22:19 AM
No, it does not need "about 400-450 to break even". If that were the case, Prometheus would be a money-loser and we'd never get Covenant.

That's already been discussed, but Prometheus mainly made profit on the DVD/Blu-ray sales.

It's basic maths. IF the studio makes half the money from ticket sales, and IF indeed they spent 110M on the movie plus 90/100M on marketing ( at least ), then they need to make at least 400M in ticket sales to break even. That's an oversimplification of course, but it gives you an idea.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:45:21 AM
No studio greenlights a movie in 2015 hoping to earn back its investment through home video sales.
The market's pretty much dead and looks nothing like it did back in 2012.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Beardomorph on May 15, 2017, 10:50:56 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:45:21 AM
No studio greenlights a movie in 2015 hoping to earn back its investment through home video sales.
The market's pretty much dead and looks nothing like it did back in 2012.

Which is why the movie budget is lower than Prometheus, the marketing budget higher than Prometheus with a massive focus on TV spots and the use of Alien Day, and it's also why they insisted on having the Alien back in this movie, why they put the word Alien in the title and why so much of the marketing has focused on the creature instead of David, despite what the movie is about. In short, they're doing everything they can to get people to see it in the theatres to make their money back, because they know that this time around they won't make as much profit on the home market.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 15, 2017, 11:10:27 AM
Just a few region specific articles -

http://www.screendaily.com/news/uk-box-office-alien-covenant-scares-off-guardians-2/5117824.article?blocktitle=LATEST-FILM-NEWS&contentID=40562
http://movieplayer.it/news/box-office-italia-alien-covenant-debutta-in-prima-posizione_50748/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 11:10:47 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:22:19 AM
No, it does not need "about 400-450 to break even". If that were the case, Prometheus would be a money-loser and we'd never get Covenant.

Studios are businesses. They didn't agree on a sequel for the fans' sake.

It does.

Prometheus was a box office money loser by a fairly decent amount.  That is partially why this was given a lower absolute budget even five years later, even though it almost always goes the other way due to inflation alone.

There are other ways a movie can make money and through those avenues Prometheus nearly broke even.  The studio wanted a new franchise and they were willing to take an initial loss of some degree to establish it.  If Prometheus had made money, they would not have forced this massive shift to Aliens in it and given it a lower budget.  Prometheus lost money.

Covenant needs about 400-450 to break even at the box office.  There are other ways for it to make money (dvd sales being a relatively large one) but the box office is king in terms of amount of money taken in and public perception.

QuoteNo studio greenlights a movie in 2015 hoping to earn back its investment through home video sales.
The market's pretty much dead and looks nothing like it did back in 2012.

You are 100% dead wrong.  People buy dvds or digital media for the top movies at very high rates.  To throw out an example, TFA made nearly 200 million in dvd sales alone (non digital), last year.

Frozen made a little less than 400 million dollars in physical media sales.

If you want to only look at R rated movies, deadpool made nearly 100 million.

These are not going to save an absolutely tanking movie and I explicitly said they would not.  In Prometheus' case they definitely pushed the movie close to the breaking even point though which, in part, convinced the studio to allow this sequel (with some stipulations).  Physical and digital media sales are very powerful revenue streams.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Feeds On Minds on May 15, 2017, 11:53:51 AM
Hmm..
A sequel to a film that half it's core audience hated...I wonder why it's not doing so well..   ::)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 12:17:29 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 15, 2017, 11:53:51 AM
Hmm..
A sequel to a film that half it's core audience hated...I wonder why it's not doing so well..   ::)

I think it's far too early to call it.

It certainly has shown a lower opening in MOST places than Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 12:29:36 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 11:10:47 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:22:19 AM
No, it does not need "about 400-450 to break even". If that were the case, Prometheus would be a money-loser and we'd never get Covenant.

Studios are businesses. They didn't agree on a sequel for the fans' sake.

It does.

Prometheus was a box office money loser by a fairly decent amount.  That is partially why this was given a lower absolute budget even five years later, even though it almost always goes the other way due to inflation alone.

There are other ways a movie can make money and through those avenues Prometheus nearly broke even.  The studio wanted a new franchise and they were willing to take an initial loss of some degree to establish it.  If Prometheus had made money, they would not have forced this massive shift to Aliens in it and given it a lower budget.  Prometheus lost money.

Covenant needs about 400-450 to break even at the box office.  There are other ways for it to make money (dvd sales being a relatively large one) but the box office is king in terms of amount of money taken in and public perception.

QuoteNo studio greenlights a movie in 2015 hoping to earn back its investment through home video sales.
The market's pretty much dead and looks nothing like it did back in 2012.

You are 100% dead wrong.  People buy dvds or digital media for the top movies at very high rates.  To throw out an example, TFA made nearly 200 million in dvd sales alone (non digital), last year.

Frozen made a little less than 400 million dollars in physical media sales.

If you want to only look at R rated movies, deadpool made nearly 100 million.

These are not going to save an absolutely tanking movie and I explicitly said they would not.  In Prometheus' case they definitely pushed the movie close to the breaking even point though which, in part, convinced the studio to allow this sequel (with some stipulations).  Physical and digital media sales are very powerful revenue streams.

Thanks for the insight and info! Do you by chance have a source or link for Prometheus numbers? I have heard so many conflicting reports about how much it took to make even...would be nice to see some hard numbers. If not, no problem, I will do some searching when I am at home.

Edit: not specific to Prometheus but I found this article helpful for explaining what it takes for a film to actually be profitable
http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/
(http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 12:47:06 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 12:29:36 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 11:10:47 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:22:19 AM
No, it does not need "about 400-450 to break even". If that were the case, Prometheus would be a money-loser and we'd never get Covenant.

Studios are businesses. They didn't agree on a sequel for the fans' sake.

It does.

Prometheus was a box office money loser by a fairly decent amount.  That is partially why this was given a lower absolute budget even five years later, even though it almost always goes the other way due to inflation alone.

There are other ways a movie can make money and through those avenues Prometheus nearly broke even.  The studio wanted a new franchise and they were willing to take an initial loss of some degree to establish it.  If Prometheus had made money, they would not have forced this massive shift to Aliens in it and given it a lower budget.  Prometheus lost money.

Covenant needs about 400-450 to break even at the box office.  There are other ways for it to make money (dvd sales being a relatively large one) but the box office is king in terms of amount of money taken in and public perception.

QuoteNo studio greenlights a movie in 2015 hoping to earn back its investment through home video sales.
The market's pretty much dead and looks nothing like it did back in 2012.

You are 100% dead wrong.  People buy dvds or digital media for the top movies at very high rates.  To throw out an example, TFA made nearly 200 million in dvd sales alone (non digital), last year.

Frozen made a little less than 400 million dollars in physical media sales.

If you want to only look at R rated movies, deadpool made nearly 100 million.

These are not going to save an absolutely tanking movie and I explicitly said they would not.  In Prometheus' case they definitely pushed the movie close to the breaking even point though which, in part, convinced the studio to allow this sequel (with some stipulations).  Physical and digital media sales are very powerful revenue streams.

Thanks for the insight and info! Do you by chance have a source or link for Prometheus numbers? I have heard so many conflicting reports about how much it took to make even...would be nice to see some hard numbers. If not, no problem, I will do some searching when I am at home.

Edit: not specific to Prometheus but I found this article helpful for explaining what it takes for a film to actually be profitable
http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/
(http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/)

Unfortunately you will never get a fully disclosed number from the studio BUT the reported budget was 130 million dollars.  That does not include advertisement and distribution which, in the case of Prometheus, was extensive.  Using some known numbers and numbers culled from Sony's leaked email scandal, it is commonly accepted that a marketing push of that type is safely in the 100-150 range.  That means the movie is sitting around 250-280 million dollar budget overall.

Here is an in depth look at deadpool:

It has a reported budget of 58 million dollars.

However, it had a print/ad budget of 120 million.  It had video costs of 48 million, residuals of 24 and other costs close to 75 million.  In total its costs were 325 million dollars of which the production was only 58.

The box office was massive, pulling in 363 domestic and 420 international.  The studio only kept 181 and 168 of that, respectively.  They also made 159 on rentals/dvds/digital sales and had about 138 million dollars in tv broadcast rights in the US and overseas.  Overall it pulled in 647 million for the studio.

When you take the difference you get 322 million in profit.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 01:17:47 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 12:47:06 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 12:29:36 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 11:10:47 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:22:19 AM
No, it does not need "about 400-450 to break even". If that were the case, Prometheus would be a money-loser and we'd never get Covenant.

Studios are businesses. They didn't agree on a sequel for the fans' sake.

It does.

Prometheus was a box office money loser by a fairly decent amount.  That is partially why this was given a lower absolute budget even five years later, even though it almost always goes the other way due to inflation alone.

There are other ways a movie can make money and through those avenues Prometheus nearly broke even.  The studio wanted a new franchise and they were willing to take an initial loss of some degree to establish it.  If Prometheus had made money, they would not have forced this massive shift to Aliens in it and given it a lower budget.  Prometheus lost money.

Covenant needs about 400-450 to break even at the box office.  There are other ways for it to make money (dvd sales being a relatively large one) but the box office is king in terms of amount of money taken in and public perception.

QuoteNo studio greenlights a movie in 2015 hoping to earn back its investment through home video sales.
The market's pretty much dead and looks nothing like it did back in 2012.

You are 100% dead wrong.  People buy dvds or digital media for the top movies at very high rates.  To throw out an example, TFA made nearly 200 million in dvd sales alone (non digital), last year.

Frozen made a little less than 400 million dollars in physical media sales.

If you want to only look at R rated movies, deadpool made nearly 100 million.

These are not going to save an absolutely tanking movie and I explicitly said they would not.  In Prometheus' case they definitely pushed the movie close to the breaking even point though which, in part, convinced the studio to allow this sequel (with some stipulations).  Physical and digital media sales are very powerful revenue streams.

Thanks for the insight and info! Do you by chance have a source or link for Prometheus numbers? I have heard so many conflicting reports about how much it took to make even...would be nice to see some hard numbers. If not, no problem, I will do some searching when I am at home.

Edit: not specific to Prometheus but I found this article helpful for explaining what it takes for a film to actually be profitable
http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/
(http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/)

Unfortunately you will never get a fully disclosed number from the studio BUT the reported budget was 130 million dollars.  That does not include advertisement and distribution which, in the case of Prometheus, was extensive.  Using some known numbers and numbers culled from Sony's leaked email scandal, it is commonly accepted that a marketing push of that type is probably is in the 100-150 range.  That means the movie is sitting around 250-280 million dollar budget overall.


Thank you!

Your assessment would be correct then. Looks like they either hit cost at the box office or close to it, and the rest would be profit for the studio. I was not aware that they spent that much in marketing. I was under the impression that viral marketing (which they did well) was cheaper than just blasting your tv spots everywhere. They must of done a lot of traditional marketing as well...that's a big number.

So I wonder what it will take for Fox to green light Ridley Scotts prequel finale. I would assume that IF Covenant flopped, not saying it will...I am quite optimistic actually, that Fox would probably still want to finish the story being told. If you end with Covenant, then you leave a gaping hole in the story,  but Fox might not care if it leaves them losing money. I hope he can finish the story with one more well made film, then give the franchise to someone new with a good mind for the franchise that will bring in heavy Giger influence.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 01:24:23 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 01:17:47 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 12:47:06 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 12:29:36 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 11:10:47 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 15, 2017, 10:22:19 AM
No, it does not need "about 400-450 to break even". If that were the case, Prometheus would be a money-loser and we'd never get Covenant.

Studios are businesses. They didn't agree on a sequel for the fans' sake.

It does.

Prometheus was a box office money loser by a fairly decent amount.  That is partially why this was given a lower absolute budget even five years later, even though it almost always goes the other way due to inflation alone.

There are other ways a movie can make money and through those avenues Prometheus nearly broke even.  The studio wanted a new franchise and they were willing to take an initial loss of some degree to establish it.  If Prometheus had made money, they would not have forced this massive shift to Aliens in it and given it a lower budget.  Prometheus lost money.

Covenant needs about 400-450 to break even at the box office.  There are other ways for it to make money (dvd sales being a relatively large one) but the box office is king in terms of amount of money taken in and public perception.

QuoteNo studio greenlights a movie in 2015 hoping to earn back its investment through home video sales.
The market's pretty much dead and looks nothing like it did back in 2012.

You are 100% dead wrong.  People buy dvds or digital media for the top movies at very high rates.  To throw out an example, TFA made nearly 200 million in dvd sales alone (non digital), last year.

Frozen made a little less than 400 million dollars in physical media sales.

If you want to only look at R rated movies, deadpool made nearly 100 million.

These are not going to save an absolutely tanking movie and I explicitly said they would not.  In Prometheus' case they definitely pushed the movie close to the breaking even point though which, in part, convinced the studio to allow this sequel (with some stipulations).  Physical and digital media sales are very powerful revenue streams.

Thanks for the insight and info! Do you by chance have a source or link for Prometheus numbers? I have heard so many conflicting reports about how much it took to make even...would be nice to see some hard numbers. If not, no problem, I will do some searching when I am at home.

Edit: not specific to Prometheus but I found this article helpful for explaining what it takes for a film to actually be profitable
http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/
(http://www.boxofficeflops.com/articles/when-does-a-movie-break-even-at-the-box-office/)

Unfortunately you will never get a fully disclosed number from the studio BUT the reported budget was 130 million dollars.  That does not include advertisement and distribution which, in the case of Prometheus, was extensive.  Using some known numbers and numbers culled from Sony's leaked email scandal, it is commonly accepted that a marketing push of that type is probably is in the 100-150 range.  That means the movie is sitting around 250-280 million dollar budget overall.


Thank you!

Your assessment would be correct then. Looks like they either hit cost at the box office or close to it, and the rest would be profit for the studio. I was not aware that they spent that much in marketing. I was under the impression that viral marketing (which they did well) was cheaper than just blasting your tv spots everywhere. They must of done a lot of traditional marketing as well...that's a big number.

So I wonder what it will take for Fox to green light Ridley Scotts prequel finale. I would assume that IF Covenant flopped, not saying it will...I am quite optimistic actually, that Fox would probably still want to finish the story being told. If you end with Covenant, then you leave a gaping hole in the story,  but Fox might not care if it leaves them losing money. I hope he can finish the story with one more well made film, then give the franchise to someone new with a good mind for the franchise that will bring in heavy Giger influence.

Here is an in depth look at deadpool:

It has a reported budget of 58 million dollars.

However, it had a print/ad budget of 120 million.  It had video costs of 48 million, residuals of 24 and other costs close to 75 million.  In total its costs were 325 million dollars of which the production was only 58.

The box office was massive, pulling in 363 domestic and 420 international.  The studio only kept 181 and 168 of that, respectively.  They also made 159 on rentals/dvds/digital sales and had about 138 million dollars in tv broadcast rights in the US and overseas.  Overall it pulled in 647 million for the studio.

When you take the difference you get 322 million in profit.  Which, for reference, was the second most profitable movie that year behind secret life of pets.

You can't draw one to one comparisons with deadpool for covenant but I would be surprised if it was not considerably more in costs (absolutely in budget but probably more in print/media advertising as well) and will end up slightly less in other areas of revenue (like tv distribution rights and physical/digital media sales sales).

It has a tough hill to climb, just like Prometheus did. 

One large advantage it has over deadpool is that it will have the chinese market.  The studio doesn't keep much of that but in sheer numbers it will absolutely help.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 15, 2017, 03:25:07 PM
Do you seriously believe those Deadpool totals? 75 Million other costs? Just 75 Million dollars in sundries?!

Hollywood accounting is notoriously shady and the studios ensure all their films appear in the red to avoid paying back end to the talent. Don't you remember the Peter Jackson Lord Of The Rings lawsuit that showed according to studio accounting Return Of The King lost money despite making nearly 1.2 billion?

It's all smoke and mirrors and the studios love message board comments or Deadline articles that perpetuate that myth as it keeps the studio execs rolling it it
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 15, 2017, 03:38:38 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 15, 2017, 03:25:07 PM
Do you seriously believe those Deadpool totals? 75 Million other costs? Just 75 Million dollars in sundries?!

Hollywood accounting is notoriously shady and the studios ensure all their films appear in the red to avoid paying back end to the talent. Don't you remember the Peter Jackson Lord Of The Rings lawsuit that showed according to studio accounting Return Of The King lost money despite making nearly 1.2 billion?

It's all smoke and mirrors and the studios love message board comments or Deadline articles that perpetuate that myth as it keeps the studio execs rolling it it


That seems like a double-edged sword... Yeah, you save money in the short term but then you also produce a poor image for the film. Public interest in any future films might be dimished if the consensus is the movie flopped.

Is 20th Century Fox notorious for this method?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 03:41:13 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 15, 2017, 03:25:07 PM
Do you seriously believe those Deadpool totals? 75 Million other costs? Just 75 Million dollars in sundries?!

Hollywood accounting is notoriously shady and the studios ensure all their films appear in the red to avoid paying back end to the talent. Don't you remember the Peter Jackson Lord Of The Rings lawsuit that showed according to studio accounting Return Of The King lost money despite making nearly 1.2 billion?

It's all smoke and mirrors and the studios love message board comments or Deadline articles that perpetuate that myth as it keeps the studio execs rolling it it

Short answer, yes, to a large degree I do.  Just because you don't understand those items does not make them fake.

Long answer, it is the best estimate we have and, on top of it, there are the many leaked internal emails from Sony regarding budgets that line up with these.  Second, those have line items but people rarely understand them...  residuals, etc.  Those are very legitimate budget line items and just because you don't understand them does not mean they do not exist.  They are paid out on every single movie..... always.

Yes, there are shady practices.  Covenant was probably way more than 110 in pure budget, let alone everything else, but they do not want to be embarrassed when the box returns come in.  But it's the best estimate and roughly correct.  Fox is in for a tough time to try and break even on this movie.

If you don't believe it, simply double the budget and that will give you a very low estimate on what it cost to make and distribute the movie.  THen work tyhe math with BO returns.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Wilo on May 15, 2017, 04:17:58 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 03:41:13 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 15, 2017, 03:25:07 PM
Do you seriously believe those Deadpool totals? 75 Million other costs? Just 75 Million dollars in sundries?!

Hollywood accounting is notoriously shady and the studios ensure all their films appear in the red to avoid paying back end to the talent. Don't you remember the Peter Jackson Lord Of The Rings lawsuit that showed according to studio accounting Return Of The King lost money despite making nearly 1.2 billion?

It's all smoke and mirrors and the studios love message board comments or Deadline articles that perpetuate that myth as it keeps the studio execs rolling it it

Short answer, yes, to a large degree I do.  Just because you don't understand those items does not make them fake.

Long answer, it is the best estimate we have and, on top of it, there are the many leaked internal emails from Sony regarding budgets that line up with these.  Second, those have line items but people rarely understand them...  residuals, etc.  Those are very legitimate budget line items and just because you don't understand them does not mean they do not exist.  They are paid out on every single movie..... always.

Yes, there are shady practices.  Covenant was probably way more than 110 in pure budget, let alone everything else, but they do not want to be embarrassed when the box returns come in.  But it's the best estimate and roughly correct.  Fox is in for a tough time to try and break even on this movie.

I'm genuinely curious where are you getting this information from? I can't be bothered to search through all the Sony emails but if they are the same emails that are on WikiLeaks' server for everyone to see, information regarding Deadpool seemed to be scarce. This would make sense as the hacking took place about half a year before Deadpool was even in the phase of principal photography.  Is it really credible that someone at that point had the numbers down anyway? Or were you referring to something else?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 15, 2017, 05:00:02 PM
Quote from: Wilo on May 15, 2017, 04:17:58 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 03:41:13 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 15, 2017, 03:25:07 PM
Do you seriously believe those Deadpool totals? 75 Million other costs? Just 75 Million dollars in sundries?!

Hollywood accounting is notoriously shady and the studios ensure all their films appear in the red to avoid paying back end to the talent. Don't you remember the Peter Jackson Lord Of The Rings lawsuit that showed according to studio accounting Return Of The King lost money despite making nearly 1.2 billion?

It's all smoke and mirrors and the studios love message board comments or Deadline articles that perpetuate that myth as it keeps the studio execs rolling it it

Short answer, yes, to a large degree I do.  Just because you don't understand those items does not make them fake.

Long answer, it is the best estimate we have and, on top of it, there are the many leaked internal emails from Sony regarding budgets that line up with these.  Second, those have line items but people rarely understand them...  residuals, etc.  Those are very legitimate budget line items and just because you don't understand them does not mean they do not exist.  They are paid out on every single movie..... always.

Yes, there are shady practices.  Covenant was probably way more than 110 in pure budget, let alone everything else, but they do not want to be embarrassed when the box returns come in.  But it's the best estimate and roughly correct.  Fox is in for a tough time to try and break even on this movie.

I'm genuinely curious where are you getting this information from? I can't be bothered to search through all the Sony emails but if they are the same emails that are on WikiLeaks' server for everyone to see, information regarding Deadpool seemed to be scarce. This would make sense as the hacking took place about half a year before Deadpool was even in the phase of principal photography.  Is it really credible that someone at that point had the numbers down anyway? Or were you referring to something else?

"The Numbers" offers that on a research basis (full breakdowns).  Reality is his Final number of 322m profit is the same number they reported.  That is without a Chinese release.  I've read 90m of residuals.  Either way, move a few numbers around and there you have it.

Robopadna's numbers for deadpool line up.  And while we argue over advertising budget on Covenant it's safe to say they have a fairly large uphill battle to make real money.  China should help, but how much is always kinda a random. 


Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 15, 2017, 05:02:26 PM
It's more than a little concerning A:C is underperforming compared to Prometheus in so many markets, 3D or no 3D.

I'm going to certainly support it when it hits theaters in the U.S. on Friday by seeing it twice just like I did Prometheus. The good news is there's really no competition for it next weekend except for Guardians of the Galaxy 2, and that's already been out for a couple weeks.

I desperately want this to do well because I want more movies, especially if Ridley has another one poised and ready to go in 14 months.

Some of the community are calling it a bad film and don't want more installments that may or may not deviate from Alien's lore further, but me personally, I'll take a mediocre Alien film over no Alien film any day of the week. I love the franchise and want it to stay alive without anymore prolonged gaps.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 15, 2017, 05:11:20 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 15, 2017, 05:02:26 PM
It's more than a little concerning A:C is underperforming compared to Prometheus in so many markets, 3D or no 3D.

I'm going to certainly support it when it hits theaters in the U.S. on Friday by seeing it twice just like I did Prometheus. The good news is there's really no competition for it next weekend except for Guardians of the Galaxy 2, and that's already been out for a couple weeks.

I desperately want this to do well because I want more movies, especially if Ridley has another one poised and ready to go in 14 months.

Some of the community are calling it a bad film and don't want more installments that may or may not deviate from Alien's lore further, but me personally, I'll take a mediocre Alien film over no Alien film any day of the week. I love the franchise and want it to stay alive without anymore prolonged gaps.

I'm not even sure I'll see it in the theatre.

While I enjoy the franchise I'm not sold on the direction they are going in.  Canada is also a country with a Fox/Netflix deal so i know it'll be on there by the end of the year.  Nothing about this film is screaming "MUST SEE" to me.  I can wait.  I'm honestly more interested in the numbers it is generating than anything to do with the plot.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alienspace on May 15, 2017, 06:43:57 PM
Incredible movie 9/10
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 15, 2017, 06:48:42 PM
Quote from: Alienspace on May 15, 2017, 06:43:57 PM
Incredible movie 9/10

I think you got the wrong thread :)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 15, 2017, 06:55:50 PM
Quote from: fiveways on May 15, 2017, 05:11:20 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 15, 2017, 05:02:26 PM
It's more than a little concerning A:C is underperforming compared to Prometheus in so many markets, 3D or no 3D.

I'm going to certainly support it when it hits theaters in the U.S. on Friday by seeing it twice just like I did Prometheus. The good news is there's really no competition for it next weekend except for Guardians of the Galaxy 2, and that's already been out for a couple weeks.

I desperately want this to do well because I want more movies, especially if Ridley has another one poised and ready to go in 14 months.

Some of the community are calling it a bad film and don't want more installments that may or may not deviate from Alien's lore further, but me personally, I'll take a mediocre Alien film over no Alien film any day of the week. I love the franchise and want it to stay alive without anymore prolonged gaps.

I'm not even sure I'll see it in the theatre.

While I enjoy the franchise I'm not sold on the direction they are going in.  Canada is also a country with a Fox/Netflix deal so i know it'll be on there by the end of the year.  Nothing about this film is screaming "MUST SEE" to me.  I can wait.  I'm honestly more interested in the numbers it is generating than anything to do with the plot.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Feeds On Minds on May 15, 2017, 10:29:54 PM
I would rather they never made another Alien film over them making more of this mediocre poorly written garbage.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Naf Neila on May 15, 2017, 11:46:09 PM
@Denton Smalls

If you love the Alien saga so much, why are you willing to settle for mediocre Alien movies?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 12:04:02 AM
I'm only an Alien/Predator fan so I don't know how it goes with other popular franchises like Star Wars & Star Trek but does anyone know if "fans" that spew overwhelming negativity exist in those communities also?

Unfortunately I have to take a breather from here for a day or two and I'm wondering if anyone else feels like this because there's being critical and then there's just plain old bashing which I feel like has a lot more to do with the person than the topic at hand.

Did I love Predators and Prometheus? No. But I enjoyed the hell out of the experience of going to see the first solo Predator movie in 20 years and to see Ridley Scott dip his toe back into a saga he created.

And guess what? I'm going to enjoy the hell out of going to see the first real solo Alien movie with "Alien" in the title since I was 13 and got surprised by my Dad to see Resurrection in the theater. P.S. I didn't love that film either but nor did I say I hope they bury the series because of it.




Edit!

"Overwhelming" isn't exactly fair. That's pushing it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 12:11:57 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 12:04:02 AM
I'm only an Alien/Predator fan so I don't know how it goes with other popular franchises like Star Wars & Star Trek but does anyone know if "fans" that spew overwhelming negativity exist in those communities also?

Unfortunately I have to take a breather from here for a day or two and I'm wondering if anyone else feels like this because there's being critical and then there's just plain old bashing which I feel like has a lot more to do with the person than the topic at hand.

Did I love Predators and Prometheus? No. But I enjoyed the hell out of the experience of going to see the first solo Predator movie in 20 years and to see Ridley Scott dip his toe back into a saga he created.

And guess what? I'm going to enjoy the hell out of going to see the first real solo Alien movie with "Alien" in the title since I was 13 and got surprised by my Dad to see Resurrection in the theater. P.S. I didn't love that film either but nor did I say I hope they bury the series because of it.




Edit!

"Overwhelming" isn't exactly fair. That's pushing it.

Communities like this are far more critical, yea. Do not let the negativity bother you. General consensus is its a good movie, so enjoy it like most people are.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 12:19:09 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 12:11:57 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 12:04:02 AM
I'm only an Alien/Predator fan so I don't know how it goes with other popular franchises like Star Wars & Star Trek but does anyone know if "fans" that spew overwhelming negativity exist in those communities also?

Unfortunately I have to take a breather from here for a day or two and I'm wondering if anyone else feels like this because there's being critical and then there's just plain old bashing which I feel like has a lot more to do with the person than the topic at hand.

Did I love Predators and Prometheus? No. But I enjoyed the hell out of the experience of going to see the first solo Predator movie in 20 years and to see Ridley Scott dip his toe back into a saga he created.

And guess what? I'm going to enjoy the hell out of going to see the first real solo Alien movie with "Alien" in the title since I was 13 and got surprised by my Dad to see Resurrection in the theater. P.S. I didn't love that film either but nor did I say I hope they bury the series because of it.




Edit!

"Overwhelming" isn't exactly fair. That's pushing it.

Communities like this are far more critical, yea. Do not let the negativity bother you. General consensus is its a good movie, so enjoy it like most people are.

Cheers 🍻, yea critical is good and honestly I've been scrounging these boards for the last five years to hear different thoughts on things like the black goo and without being critical thinkers, those speculations wouldn't exist so I didn't mean to suggest stifling or censoring necessarily. I hope that didn't come off too dickish.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 12:53:41 AM
China release on 16 June.

Between Alien and Transformers (3D) no doubt which movies that chiness people would choose to watch.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 01:12:53 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 12:53:41 AM
China release on 16 June.

Between Alien and Transformers (3D) no doubt which movies that chiness people whould choose to watch.

I feel like an idiot for asking but.... Which one? No idea what is popular there :-\
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 01:19:58 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 01:12:53 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 12:53:41 AM
China release on 16 June.

Between Alien and Transformers (3D) no doubt which movies that chiness people whould choose to watch.

I feel like an idiot for asking but.... Which one? No idea what is popular there :-\

Transformers and 3D very big deal in china.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=intl&country=CH&id=transformers4.htm
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 16, 2017, 01:53:14 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 12:04:02 AM
I'm only an Alien/Predator fan so I don't know how it goes with other popular franchises like Star Wars & Star Trek but does anyone know if "fans" that spew overwhelming negativity exist in those communities also?

Unfortunately I have to take a breather from here for a day or two and I'm wondering if anyone else feels like this because there's being critical and then there's just plain old bashing which I feel like has a lot more to do with the person than the topic at hand.

Did I love Predators and Prometheus? No. But I enjoyed the hell out of the experience of going to see the first solo Predator movie in 20 years and to see Ridley Scott dip his toe back into a saga he created.

And guess what? I'm going to enjoy the hell out of going to see the first real solo Alien movie with "Alien" in the title since I was 13 and got surprised by my Dad to see Resurrection in the theater. P.S. I didn't love that film either but nor did I say I hope they bury the series because of it.




Edit!

"Overwhelming" isn't exactly fair. That's pushing it.
Any time you get a bunch of like-minded people in a mob, things can get ugly.  Fans are no different.  I loved Prometheus, and any time I post anything positive about it anywhere on the internet, even here, I always receive a string of condescending replies explaining that I am wrong.  I was even cyber-stalked on the IMDB boards by Alien fans who took my affection for that movie as a personal affront.  It's insane and you have to decide how much of that insanity you want to expose yourself to.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 02:34:37 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 01:19:58 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 01:12:53 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 12:53:41 AM
China release on 16 June.

Between Alien and Transformers (3D) no doubt which movies that chiness people whould choose to watch.

I feel like an idiot for asking but.... Which one? No idea what is popular there :-\

Transformers and 3D very big deal in china.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=intl&country=CH&id=transformers4.htm

Thanks for the info!

Is the Alien franchise fairly well known there? Seems like there should be room for both to coexist and get decent numbers, especially in China.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 04:06:22 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 02:34:37 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 01:19:58 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 16, 2017, 01:12:53 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 16, 2017, 12:53:41 AM
China release on 16 June.

Between Alien and Transformers (3D) no doubt which movies that chiness people whould choose to watch.

I feel like an idiot for asking but.... Which one? No idea what is popular there :-\

Transformers and 3D very big deal in china.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=intl&country=CH&id=transformers4.htm

Thanks for the info!

Is the Alien franchise fairly well known there? Seems like there should be room for both to coexist and get decent numbers, especially in China.

Alien franchise it's well know everywhere It's could be get decent number on first week but i don't expect too much after Transformers get release week later.

Chiness people love watch Action 3D than Scifi Horror.

don't mention Pirates of the Caribbean and Guardians of the Galaxy that probably still on theater when Alien get release.

3D Rule China.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 16, 2017, 02:51:36 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 12:04:02 AM
I'm only an Alien/Predator fan so I don't know how it goes with other popular franchises like Star Wars & Star Trek but does anyone know if "fans" that spew overwhelming negativity exist in those communities also?

Unfortunately I have to take a breather from here for a day or two and I'm wondering if anyone else feels like this because there's being critical and then there's just plain old bashing which I feel like has a lot more to do with the person than the topic at hand.

Did I love Predators and Prometheus? No. But I enjoyed the hell out of the experience of going to see the first solo Predator movie in 20 years and to see Ridley Scott dip his toe back into a saga he created.

And guess what? I'm going to enjoy the hell out of going to see the first real solo Alien movie with "Alien" in the title since I was 13 and got surprised by my Dad to see Resurrection in the theater. P.S. I didn't love that film either but nor did I say I hope they bury the series because of it.


Star Trek and Star Wars fans are worse simply by numbers.  You cannot hope to avoid it as there are so goddamn many of them.

Are you annoyed that people are destroying a movie or your nostalgia surrounding it?  The last paragraph sounds more like you want to hold onto that youthful feeling of seeing a movie for the first time which is f**king awesome.  If that is the case reading forums with a pretty large divide in what fans wanted might seriously impact it.  Might be best to disappear for a month and come back after everyone has got it out of their systems.

I really enjoy Prometheus.  I actually think there is a movie better than Aliens in there and it was kinda ruined by action beats every few minutes and shady editing.  I love that movie when I sit down and think about it and dislike the way it was made.  There are others around here that feel that way.  We were more interested in the mystery in a Lovecraft/Giger sort of way.  Now that is pretty much dead.  When a franchise does that it's going to get rough and people will voice their displeasure. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 09:33:56 PM
Quote from: Naf Neila on May 15, 2017, 11:46:09 PM
@Denton Smalls

If you love the Alien saga so much, why are you willing to settle for mediocre Alien movies?

What's the alternative?


Quote from: Protozoid on May 16, 2017, 01:53:14 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 16, 2017, 12:04:02 AM
I'm only an Alien/Predator fan so I don't know how it goes with other popular franchises like Star Wars & Star Trek but does anyone know if "fans" that spew overwhelming negativity exist in those communities also?

Unfortunately I have to take a breather from here for a day or two and I'm wondering if anyone else feels like this because there's being critical and then there's just plain old bashing which I feel like has a lot more to do with the person than the topic at hand.

Did I love Predators and Prometheus? No. But I enjoyed the hell out of the experience of going to see the first solo Predator movie in 20 years and to see Ridley Scott dip his toe back into a saga he created.

And guess what? I'm going to enjoy the hell out of going to see the first real solo Alien movie with "Alien" in the title since I was 13 and got surprised by my Dad to see Resurrection in the theater. P.S. I didn't love that film either but nor did I say I hope they bury the series because of it.




Edit!

"Overwhelming" isn't exactly fair. That's pushing it.
Any time you get a bunch of like-minded people in a mob, things can get ugly.  Fans are no different.  I loved Prometheus, and any time I post anything positive about it anywhere on the internet, even here, I always receive a string of condescending replies explaining that I am wrong.  I was even cyber-stalked on the IMDB boards by Alien fans who took my affection for that movie as a personal affront.  It's insane and you have to decide how much of that insanity you want to expose yourself to.

That sucks you had to go through that man.

Appreciate the feedback all. I'll let the thread fall back into it's intended BO discussion. Don't want to muck it up too much.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 12:52:25 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Right now the estimates are varying wildly.  Fox is playing it safe and trying to really low ball it to avoid embarrassment and are apparently predicting a 35 million dollar opening.  Other sites are predicting up to a 50 million dollar opening.

It's somewhat interesting to note that Fox took the same approach with Prometheus and estimated an opening in the 30s and it actually opened to about 51 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 12:59:27 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Wow!  That Ebert review especially is high praise.  All the more impressive considering how he hated the original Alien way back in 79.  This review alone will help fill seats, as I know a lot of people take Ebert's reviews very seriously and for him to make statements like "This is one of Scott's best-directed movies and one of his most entertaining overall" and "It's rare to see such a combination of technical mastery and wicked joy in a film by a director who's been working as long as Scott." is quite powerful.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 17, 2017, 01:05:08 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 12:59:27 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Wow!  That Ebert review especially is high praise.  All the more impressive considering how he hated the original Alien way back in 79.  This review alone will help fill seats, as I know a lot of people take Ebert's reviews very seriously and for him to make statements like "This is one of Scott's best-directed movies and one of his most entertaining overall" and "It's rare to see such a combination of technical mastery and wicked joy in a film by a director who's been working as long as Scott." is quite powerful.

You know he didn't write movies review since 2013 ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:07:07 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 12:59:27 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Wow!  That Ebert review especially is high praise.  All the more impressive considering how he hated the original Alien way back in 79.  This review alone will help fill seats, as I know a lot of people take Ebert's reviews very seriously and for him to make statements like "This is one of Scott's best-directed movies and one of his most entertaining overall" and "It's rare to see such a combination of technical mastery and wicked joy in a film by a director who's been working as long as Scott." is quite powerful.

Well the man is quite dead at the moment so its not his statement, but reviewers affiliated with him hold a good bit of sway.


Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 12:52:25 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Right now the estimates are varying wildly.  Fox is playing it safe and trying to really low ball it to avoid embarrassment and are apparently predicting a 35 million dollar opening.  Other sites are predicting up to a 50 million dollar opening.

It's somewhat interesting to note that Fox took the same approach with Prometheus and estimated an opening in the 30s and it actually opened to about 51 million.

Ah yes, I do remember this! I suppose I can understand the approach, but it could potentially do much better and I am optimistically going to predict a 54 million opening weekend. I have noticed some apathy amongst coworkers and friends towards Guardians of the Galaxy 2,  and a lot of them excited for Alien Covenant (a few who are not even familiar with the franchise and do not even know about Prometheus). So we will see... I will be there opening night tomorrow at the 10pm showing and then again Saturday afternoon with my wife, so how packed the cinema is will be a good gauge for me.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 17, 2017, 01:20:16 PM
Well if covenant is sitting at 42 million a couple of days ago and it's opening in over 50 countries this weekend including the USA. .where do you folks think is gonna be by monday. .i am thinking about 120-150 ?.
Oh and i have a queation about kong:skull island. .it cost 185 to make, marketing excluded . .and it's basicly at the end of it's run. .sitting at 564 with alot of the total coning from china. .did it make a profit?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 01:29:51 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 17, 2017, 01:20:16 PM
Well if covenant is sitting at 42 million a couple of days ago and it's opening in over 50 countries this weekend including the USA. .where do you folks think is gonna be by monday. .i am thinking about 120?.
Oh and i have a queation about kong:skull island. .it cost 185 to make, marketing excluded . .and it's basicly at the end of it's run. .sitting at 564 with alot of the total coning from china. .did it make a profit?

People are only talking about the US.  It's the single largest market.

The general line of thought followed by people predicting a low opening is that US market somewhat mirrors the Australian market and that showed a big drop off from Prometheus.

The simple answer for Kong is 'no' in regards to the box office.  It came up considerably short.  Like I said before though, there are a lot of other revenue streams that can really add up (and other costs associated with them).  My guess is that it will roughly break even or take an acceptable loss. 

They are probably ok with the loss because they view it as building up a foundation for their cinematic universe where they will have Godzilla fight king kong, etc.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:31:17 PM
I don't know much studios take in from China ticket sales but if its a comparable 45 to 50%, and they did not spend over $100 million on advertising, then it either made a slight profit or will break even by the end of its run. Digital and blue ray/ DVD should be all profit though.


Quote from: juxtapose on May 17, 2017, 01:20:16 PM
Well if covenant is sitting at 42 million a couple of days ago and it's opening in over 50 countries this weekend including the USA. .where do you folks think is gonna be by monday. .i am thinking about 120-150 ?.
Oh and i have a queation about kong:skull island. .it cost 185 to make, marketing excluded . .and it's basicly at the end of it's run. .sitting at 564 with alot of the total coning from china. .did it make a profit?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 01:32:24 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:07:07 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 12:59:27 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Wow!  That Ebert review especially is high praise.  All the more impressive considering how he hated the original Alien way back in 79.  This review alone will help fill seats, as I know a lot of people take Ebert's reviews very seriously and for him to make statements like "This is one of Scott's best-directed movies and one of his most entertaining overall" and "It's rare to see such a combination of technical mastery and wicked joy in a film by a director who's been working as long as Scott." is quite powerful.

Well the man is quite dead at the moment so its not his statement, but reviewers affiliated with him hold a good bit of sway.


Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 12:52:25 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Right now the estimates are varying wildly.  Fox is playing it safe and trying to really low ball it to avoid embarrassment and are apparently predicting a 35 million dollar opening.  Other sites are predicting up to a 50 million dollar opening.

It's somewhat interesting to note that Fox took the same approach with Prometheus and estimated an opening in the 30s and it actually opened to about 51 million.

Ah yes, I do remember this! I suppose I can understand the approach, but it could potentially do much better and I am optimistically going to predict a 54 million opening weekend. I have noticed some apathy amongst coworkers and friends towards Guardians of the Galaxy 2,  and a lot of them excited for Alien Covenant (a few who are not even familiar with the franchise and do not even know about Prometheus). So we will see... I will be there opening night tomorrow at the 10pm showing and then again Saturday afternoon with my wife, so how packed the cinema is will be a good gauge for me.

I wasn't aware that he died.  I knew Siskel had passed, but somehow I missed the news that Ebert had passed as well.  Damn :(
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 01:33:30 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:31:17 PM
I don't know much studios take in from China ticket sales but if its a comparable 45 to 50%, and they did not spend over $100 million on advertising, then it either made a slight profit or will break even by the end of its run. Digital and blue ray/ DVD should be all profit though.

The Chinese market is roughly a 33% take for the studio.  They spent way more than 100 on advertising.

Digital and physical media have costs associated with them as well (it is expensive to create, produce, advertise and ship media).  They are absolutely a good additional revenue stream but they are not 'free money'.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 17, 2017, 01:33:56 PM
next next next week have

May 26 - Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Men Tell No Tales
Jun 2 - Wonder Woman
Jun 9 - The Mummy (?)

why i have bad feeling about this ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:40:42 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 01:33:30 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:31:17 PM
I don't know much studios take in from China ticket sales but if its a comparable 45 to 50%, and they did not spend over $100 million on advertising, then it either made a slight profit or will break even by the end of its run. Digital and blue ray/ DVD should be all profit though.

The Chinese market is roughly a 33% take for the studio.  They spent way more than 100 on advertising.

Digital and physical media have costs associated with them as well (it is expensive to create, produce, advertise and ship media).  They are absolutely a good additional revenue stream but they are not 'free money'.


Thanks for the clarrification. So Kong is far from breaking even then.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 17, 2017, 01:42:48 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:40:42 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 01:33:30 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:31:17 PM
I don't know much studios take in from China ticket sales but if its a comparable 45 to 50%, and they did not spend over $100 million on advertising, then it either made a slight profit or will break even by the end of its run. Digital and blue ray/ DVD should be all profit though.

The Chinese market is roughly a 33% take for the studio.  They spent way more than 100 on advertising.

Digital and physical media have costs associated with them as well (it is expensive to create, produce, advertise and ship media).  They are absolutely a good additional revenue stream but they are not 'free money'.


Thanks for the clarrification. So Kong is far from breaking even then.

Shame i really like Kong.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 01:43:07 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:40:42 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 01:33:30 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:31:17 PM
I don't know much studios take in from China ticket sales but if its a comparable 45 to 50%, and they did not spend over $100 million on advertising, then it either made a slight profit or will break even by the end of its run. Digital and blue ray/ DVD should be all profit though.

The Chinese market is roughly a 33% take for the studio.  They spent way more than 100 on advertising.

Digital and physical media have costs associated with them as well (it is expensive to create, produce, advertise and ship media).  They are absolutely a good additional revenue stream but they are not 'free money'.


Thanks for the clarrification. So Kong is far from breaking even then.

From box office alone?  No, they are considerably short of it by my guess.  It hasn't had any dvd sales yet but they have sold tv rights...   but that market isn't what it used to be.  My guess is that they are still short and will probably end up being a little short, or roughly break even, when all is said and done.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:43:14 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 17, 2017, 01:33:56 PM
next next next week have

May 26 - Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Men Tell No Tales
Jun 2 - Wonder Woman
Jun 9 - The Mummy (?)

why i have bad feeling about this ?

Pirates I am not too worried about...different target audiences. Wonder Woman will take attention off Alien for sure, but still different enough for both to coexist. The Mummy, likewise, but at least Alien will be the one R rated big name film out, do that helps.

All in all I believe it comes down to a strong opening weekend and positive word of mouth/social media trending etc keeping the momentum strong if Alien is to do well at the box office.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 17, 2017, 01:55:44 PM
thanks for your answers. . .yeah i thought kong did'nt make any profit and i was curious why the media did not notice. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 02:00:20 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 01:43:14 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 17, 2017, 01:33:56 PM
next next next week have

May 26 - Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Men Tell No Tales
Jun 2 - Wonder Woman
Jun 9 - The Mummy (?)

why i have bad feeling about this ?

Pirates I am not too worried about...different target audiences. Wonder Woman will take attention off Alien for sure, but still different enough for both to coexist. The Mummy, likewise, but at least Alien will be the one R rated big name film out, do that helps.

All in all I believe it comes down to a strong opening weekend and positive word of mouth/social media trending etc keeping the momentum strong if Alien is to do well at the box office.

I agree.  The Pirates movies have done progressively less in take with each sequel, so that probably won't pose a threat.  Wonder Woman, in addition to being a different kind of movie altogether, is also burdened by the fact it isn't a Marvel movie (none of the DC movies have done all that well for this and other reasons).  The Mummy is the only serious contender and honestly it's not much of a threat either due to being more of an adventure movie than a horror. 

I don't expect any serious competition until Transformers and Planet of the Apes.  Both of those, despite being different genre films, are going to draw audiences.  Thankfully by that point, AC will be winding down so the damage will be minimal I expect.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:06:19 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.

WW is REALLY odd.  There are forecasts for an opening around 65 million all the way up to 100+ (all domestic predictions).  The DC cinematic universe is in a really weird place.  Like you said, there is a feeling of getting burned that could impact the box office, but I have yet to see it actually happen.  BvS and SS both opened to incredibly high numbers despite a fairly poor opinion among both critics and fans.  You certainly saw bad multipliers, in BvS especially, that led to lower totals but they market their films well and there is clearly an interested audience.

I have to imagine it will open up to closer to 100 than 65 simply due to the bullet proof nature of opening weekends for comic book movies.  If it honestly hits around 60 and has the normal DC multiplier, that universe is in a lot of trouble.  I would imagine they will release the first JL and probably aquaman (which I think has already started filming) but then sit and rethink their approach.

Quote(none of the DC movies have done all that well for this and other reasons

They actually open VERY well.  If there is one thing WB seems to be doing right, it's building hype for their movies.

QuoteThe Pirates movies have done progressively less in take with each sequel

I don't know.  The WW grosses are 655, 1066, 963, 1046...   that is certainly not a decreasing trend.  Depp is a HUGE international draw.  Domestically they are down but that franchise is a juggernaut compared to Alien.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 02:35:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:06:19 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.

WW is REALLY odd.  There are forecasts for an opening around 65 million all the way up to 100+ (all domestic predictions).  The DC cinematic universe is in a really weird place.  Like you said, there is a feeling of getting burned that could impact the box office, but I have yet to see it actually happen.  BvS and SS both opened to incredibly high numbers despite a fairly poor opinion among both critics and fans.  You certainly saw bad multipliers, in BvS especially, that led to lower totals but they market their films well and there is clearly an interested audience.

I have to imagine it will open up to closer to 100 than 65 simply due to the bullet proof nature of opening weekends for comic book movies.  If it honestly hits around 60 and has the normal DC multiplier, that universe is in a lot of trouble.  I would imagine they will release the first JL and probably aquaman (which I think has already started filming) but then sit and rethink their approach.

Quote(none of the DC movies have done all that well for this and other reasons

They actually open VERY well.  If there is one thing WB seems to be doing right, it's building hype for their movies.

QuoteThe Pirates movies have done progressively less in take with each sequel

I don't know.  The WW grosses are 655, 1066, 963, 1046...   that is certainly not a decreasing trend.  Depp is a HUGE international draw.  Domestically they are down but that franchise is a juggernaut compared to Alien.

They did well opening weekend and then quickly fell off the radar.  That is the DC curse.  Oh and Fantastic Four and Green Lantern.  DC is at best 50% hit and 50% miss.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:48:23 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 02:35:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:06:19 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.

WW is REALLY odd.  There are forecasts for an opening around 65 million all the way up to 100+ (all domestic predictions).  The DC cinematic universe is in a really weird place.  Like you said, there is a feeling of getting burned that could impact the box office, but I have yet to see it actually happen.  BvS and SS both opened to incredibly high numbers despite a fairly poor opinion among both critics and fans.  You certainly saw bad multipliers, in BvS especially, that led to lower totals but they market their films well and there is clearly an interested audience.

I have to imagine it will open up to closer to 100 than 65 simply due to the bullet proof nature of opening weekends for comic book movies.  If it honestly hits around 60 and has the normal DC multiplier, that universe is in a lot of trouble.  I would imagine they will release the first JL and probably aquaman (which I think has already started filming) but then sit and rethink their approach.

Quote(none of the DC movies have done all that well for this and other reasons

They actually open VERY well.  If there is one thing WB seems to be doing right, it's building hype for their movies.

QuoteThe Pirates movies have done progressively less in take with each sequel

I don't know.  The WW grosses are 655, 1066, 963, 1046...   that is certainly not a decreasing trend.  Depp is a HUGE international draw.  Domestically they are down but that franchise is a juggernaut compared to Alien.

They did well opening weekend and then quickly fell off the radar.  That is the DC curse.  Oh and Fantastic Four and Green Lantern.  DC is at best 50% hit and 50% miss.

Fantastic Four isn't a DC property but it is also not under the Disney umbrella for marvel.  Fox I think has it?  They simply have no idea what to do with that property.  I honestly think the best FF movie was the Roger Corman one that was made simply to retain the rights :)

It depends on what you mean by hit or miss...  in the financial sense they aren't really as big of a miss as people tend to think they are.  Critically they are pretty massive misses.  I also don't personally like any of their cinematic universe (the three movies in it) to date.

If you branch outside into the Nolan/Bale trilogy, the story is entirely different.  They are all vast financial successes and critically acclaimed.  One of them essentially defining the heights that a super hero movie can reach.

Anyway you slice it, Covenant has a tough hill to climb.  I just do not see Alien as the draw that their budgets would suggest it is.  I love the series but you are really asking a lot of a violent hard R film to make back that kind of money.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 03:12:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:48:23 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 02:35:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:06:19 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.

WW is REALLY odd.  There are forecasts for an opening around 65 million all the way up to 100+ (all domestic predictions).  The DC cinematic universe is in a really weird place.  Like you said, there is a feeling of getting burned that could impact the box office, but I have yet to see it actually happen.  BvS and SS both opened to incredibly high numbers despite a fairly poor opinion among both critics and fans.  You certainly saw bad multipliers, in BvS especially, that led to lower totals but they market their films well and there is clearly an interested audience.

I have to imagine it will open up to closer to 100 than 65 simply due to the bullet proof nature of opening weekends for comic book movies.  If it honestly hits around 60 and has the normal DC multiplier, that universe is in a lot of trouble.  I would imagine they will release the first JL and probably aquaman (which I think has already started filming) but then sit and rethink their approach.

Quote(none of the DC movies have done all that well for this and other reasons

They actually open VERY well.  If there is one thing WB seems to be doing right, it's building hype for their movies.

QuoteThe Pirates movies have done progressively less in take with each sequel

I don't know.  The WW grosses are 655, 1066, 963, 1046...   that is certainly not a decreasing trend.  Depp is a HUGE international draw.  Domestically they are down but that franchise is a juggernaut compared to Alien.

They did well opening weekend and then quickly fell off the radar.  That is the DC curse.  Oh and Fantastic Four and Green Lantern.  DC is at best 50% hit and 50% miss.

Fantastic Four isn't a DC property but it is also not under the Disney umbrella for marvel.  Fox I think has it?  They simply have no idea what to do with that property.  I honestly think the best FF movie was the Roger Corman one that was made simply to retain the rights :)

It depends on what you mean by hit or miss...  in the financial sense they aren't really as big of a miss as people tend to think they are.  Critically they are pretty massive misses.  I also don't personally like any of their cinematic universe (the three movies in it) to date.

If you branch outside into the Nolan/Bale trilogy, the story is entirely different.  They are all vast financial successes and critically acclaimed.  One of them essentially defining the heights that a super hero movie can reach.

Anyway you slice it, Covenant has a tough hill to climb.  I just do not see Alien as the draw that their budgets would suggest it is.  I love the series but you are really asking a lot of a violent hard R film to make back that kind of money.

There is a way...

First, forget anything you know about the scrapped Alien 5 and projects anyone else is working on. This is all hypothetical.

New big budget alien movie
Colonial marines
Sigourney Weaver
Ridley Scott and James Cameron attached to it somehow (or another well established accredited director)
2 or 3 other well known actors/actresses
Bishop

You place this anywhere in the timeline post-Aliens. Guarantee you it slaughters at the box office. Will it happen ? Not a chance. But it would be huge at the box office, so there are ways to make violent R rated films with large budgets work.


×Que everyone telling me to get my head out of the 80's, no way anyone cares about this hypothetical movie anymore
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 03:36:46 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 03:12:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:48:23 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 02:35:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:06:19 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.

WW is REALLY odd.  There are forecasts for an opening around 65 million all the way up to 100+ (all domestic predictions).  The DC cinematic universe is in a really weird place.  Like you said, there is a feeling of getting burned that could impact the box office, but I have yet to see it actually happen.  BvS and SS both opened to incredibly high numbers despite a fairly poor opinion among both critics and fans.  You certainly saw bad multipliers, in BvS especially, that led to lower totals but they market their films well and there is clearly an interested audience.

I have to imagine it will open up to closer to 100 than 65 simply due to the bullet proof nature of opening weekends for comic book movies.  If it honestly hits around 60 and has the normal DC multiplier, that universe is in a lot of trouble.  I would imagine they will release the first JL and probably aquaman (which I think has already started filming) but then sit and rethink their approach.

Quote(none of the DC movies have done all that well for this and other reasons

They actually open VERY well.  If there is one thing WB seems to be doing right, it's building hype for their movies.

QuoteThe Pirates movies have done progressively less in take with each sequel

I don't know.  The WW grosses are 655, 1066, 963, 1046...   that is certainly not a decreasing trend.  Depp is a HUGE international draw.  Domestically they are down but that franchise is a juggernaut compared to Alien.

They did well opening weekend and then quickly fell off the radar.  That is the DC curse.  Oh and Fantastic Four and Green Lantern.  DC is at best 50% hit and 50% miss.

Fantastic Four isn't a DC property but it is also not under the Disney umbrella for marvel.  Fox I think has it?  They simply have no idea what to do with that property.  I honestly think the best FF movie was the Roger Corman one that was made simply to retain the rights :)

It depends on what you mean by hit or miss...  in the financial sense they aren't really as big of a miss as people tend to think they are.  Critically they are pretty massive misses.  I also don't personally like any of their cinematic universe (the three movies in it) to date.

If you branch outside into the Nolan/Bale trilogy, the story is entirely different.  They are all vast financial successes and critically acclaimed.  One of them essentially defining the heights that a super hero movie can reach.

Anyway you slice it, Covenant has a tough hill to climb.  I just do not see Alien as the draw that their budgets would suggest it is.  I love the series but you are really asking a lot of a violent hard R film to make back that kind of money.

There is a way...

First, forget anything you know about the scrapped Alien 5 and projects anyone else is working on. This is all hypothetical.

New big budget alien movie
Colonial marines
Sigourney Weaver
Ridley Scott and James Cameron attached to it somehow (or another well established accredited director)
2 or 3 other well known actors/actresses
Bishop

You place this anywhere in the timeline post-Aliens. Guarantee you it slaughters at the box office. Will it happen ? Not a chance. But it would be huge at the box office, so there are ways to make violent R rated films with large budgets work.


×Que everyone telling me to get my head out of the 80's, no way anyone cares about this hypothetical movie anymore

I'm not so sure it would slaughter it anymore.  I think the appeal of Ripley is well worn out (it certainly didn't generate any massive returns on 3 or 4) and Aliens as a brand would probably not support that budget (Cameron does not work cheap).  It will only ever be speculation at this point though because, like you said, it will never happen.

I am not saying it is impossible for violent R rated movies to have large budgets and make their money back, but it's just about there.  Outside of the Exorcist (in 1973) there simply hasn't been any R rated violent horror movie that would even come close in box office returns to equal out Covenant's budget, let alone a larger one.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 04:41:07 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 03:36:46 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 03:12:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:48:23 PM
Quote from: oberonqa on May 17, 2017, 02:35:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 02:06:19 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.

WW is REALLY odd.  There are forecasts for an opening around 65 million all the way up to 100+ (all domestic predictions).  The DC cinematic universe is in a really weird place.  Like you said, there is a feeling of getting burned that could impact the box office, but I have yet to see it actually happen.  BvS and SS both opened to incredibly high numbers despite a fairly poor opinion among both critics and fans.  You certainly saw bad multipliers, in BvS especially, that led to lower totals but they market their films well and there is clearly an interested audience.

I have to imagine it will open up to closer to 100 than 65 simply due to the bullet proof nature of opening weekends for comic book movies.  If it honestly hits around 60 and has the normal DC multiplier, that universe is in a lot of trouble.  I would imagine they will release the first JL and probably aquaman (which I think has already started filming) but then sit and rethink their approach.

Quote(none of the DC movies have done all that well for this and other reasons

They actually open VERY well.  If there is one thing WB seems to be doing right, it's building hype for their movies.

QuoteThe Pirates movies have done progressively less in take with each sequel

I don't know.  The WW grosses are 655, 1066, 963, 1046...   that is certainly not a decreasing trend.  Depp is a HUGE international draw.  Domestically they are down but that franchise is a juggernaut compared to Alien.

They did well opening weekend and then quickly fell off the radar.  That is the DC curse.  Oh and Fantastic Four and Green Lantern.  DC is at best 50% hit and 50% miss.

Fantastic Four isn't a DC property but it is also not under the Disney umbrella for marvel.  Fox I think has it?  They simply have no idea what to do with that property.  I honestly think the best FF movie was the Roger Corman one that was made simply to retain the rights :)

It depends on what you mean by hit or miss...  in the financial sense they aren't really as big of a miss as people tend to think they are.  Critically they are pretty massive misses.  I also don't personally like any of their cinematic universe (the three movies in it) to date.

If you branch outside into the Nolan/Bale trilogy, the story is entirely different.  They are all vast financial successes and critically acclaimed.  One of them essentially defining the heights that a super hero movie can reach.

Anyway you slice it, Covenant has a tough hill to climb.  I just do not see Alien as the draw that their budgets would suggest it is.  I love the series but you are really asking a lot of a violent hard R film to make back that kind of money.

There is a way...

First, forget anything you know about the scrapped Alien 5 and projects anyone else is working on. This is all hypothetical.

New big budget alien movie
Colonial marines
Sigourney Weaver
Ridley Scott and James Cameron attached to it somehow (or another well established accredited director)
2 or 3 other well known actors/actresses
Bishop

You place this anywhere in the timeline post-Aliens. Guarantee you it slaughters at the box office. Will it happen ? Not a chance. But it would be huge at the box office, so there are ways to make violent R rated films with large budgets work.


×Que everyone telling me to get my head out of the 80's, no way anyone cares about this hypothetical movie anymore

I'm not so sure it would slaughter it anymore.  I think the appeal of Ripley is well worn out (it certainly didn't generate any massive returns on 3 or 4) and Aliens as a brand would probably not support that budget (Cameron does not work cheap).  It will only ever be speculation at this point though because, like you said, it will never happen.

I am not saying it is impossible for violent R rated movies to have large budgets and make their money back, but it's just about there.  Outside of the Exorcist (in 1973) there simply hasn't been any R rated violent horror movie that would even come close in box office returns to equal out Covenant's budget, let alone a larger one.

I concur...

So, what is your thought on the viability of an Alien franchise premium TV series on HBO...with the production value of say, Game of Thrones? It could focus on any number of things, still retain the sci-fi horror/action elements, allow for extensive character development, and expand the universe.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 07:16:21 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 04:41:07 PM
I concur...

So, what is your thought on the viability of an Alien franchise premium TV series on HBO...with the production value of say, Game of Thrones? It could focus on any number of things, still retain the sci-fi horror/action elements, allow for extensive character development, and expand the universe.

Cleaning up the embedded quotes a bit :)

It's an interesting idea but the problem is, in my opinion, you would have to have a hook to watching that show and the hook can't really revolve around aliens.  Game of Thrones largely revolves around interpersonal conflict and political maneuvering.  Even though you have the consistent threat of white walkers, they actually play a very small role in the show itself.

I think that in order to make it work, you would have to do a ton of world building.  Maybe you focus on artificial intelligence or, more likely, the inner workings and political aspects of Weyland Yutani.  Maybe set it after Weyland and Vickers left for the Prometheus expedition and watch the power struggle that happens.  Will people want to watch that?  I don't know...   it's certainly a different way of using the Alien brand but I think it's the only feasible one.

Focus very little on the Aliens themselves because constant battles will be expensive to produce and, quite honestly, boring to watch.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 07:41:38 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 07:16:21 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 04:41:07 PM
I concur...

So, what is your thought on the viability of an Alien franchise premium TV series on HBO...with the production value of say, Game of Thrones? It could focus on any number of things, still retain the sci-fi horror/action elements, allow for extensive character development, and expand the universe.

Cleaning up the embedded quotes a bit :)

It's an interesting idea but the problem is, in my opinion, you would have to have a hook to watching that show and the hook can't really revolve around aliens.  Game of Thrones largely revolves around interpersonal conflict and political maneuvering.  Even though you have the consistent threat of white walkers, they actually play a very small role in the show itself.

I think that in order to make it work, you would have to do a ton of world building.  Maybe you focus on artificial intelligence or, more likely, the inner workings and political aspects of Weyland Yutani.  Maybe set it after Weyland and Vickers left for the Prometheus expedition and watch the power struggle that happens.  Will people want to watch that?  I don't know...   it's certainly a different way of using the Alien brand but I think it's the only feasible one.

Focus very little on the Aliens themselves because constant battles will be expensive to produce and, quite honestly, boring to watch.

Agreed and any alien material would need be few and far between and serve a purpose. Good input though...I am going to make a separate thread here in a couple days about it actually, since I do not want to derail this one.

Back on topic, the optimist in me is thinking 55 million opening weekend in the US. see a lot of buzz and good reviews going around so this film just may hit the domestic cinemas in a full on sprint. Plus 53 or so other markets get their AC debut this weekend too. By Sunday, I am going to say: 170 million total box office
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 07:48:36 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 07:41:38 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 07:16:21 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 04:41:07 PM
I concur...

So, what is your thought on the viability of an Alien franchise premium TV series on HBO...with the production value of say, Game of Thrones? It could focus on any number of things, still retain the sci-fi horror/action elements, allow for extensive character development, and expand the universe.

Cleaning up the embedded quotes a bit :)

It's an interesting idea but the problem is, in my opinion, you would have to have a hook to watching that show and the hook can't really revolve around aliens.  Game of Thrones largely revolves around interpersonal conflict and political maneuvering.  Even though you have the consistent threat of white walkers, they actually play a very small role in the show itself.

I think that in order to make it work, you would have to do a ton of world building.  Maybe you focus on artificial intelligence or, more likely, the inner workings and political aspects of Weyland Yutani.  Maybe set it after Weyland and Vickers left for the Prometheus expedition and watch the power struggle that happens.  Will people want to watch that?  I don't know...   it's certainly a different way of using the Alien brand but I think it's the only feasible one.

Focus very little on the Aliens themselves because constant battles will be expensive to produce and, quite honestly, boring to watch.

Agreed and any alien material would need be few and far between and serve a purpose. Good input though...I am going to make a separate thread here in a couple days about it actually, since I do not want to derail this one.

Back on topic, the optimist in me is thinking 55 million opening weekend in the US. see a lot of buzz and good reviews going around so this film just may hit the domestic cinemas in a full on sprint. Plus 53 or so other markets get their AC debut this weekend too. By Sunday, I am going to say: 170 million total box office

Only speaking from a domestic stand point but I think everyone involved would be very happy with a 55 million opening.  I think it still means it's going to lose money, but 55 is a really strong opening for this type of property, especially after it was, perception wise, damaged by Prometheus (even though I thought that movie was far better).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 17, 2017, 10:36:59 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 17, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
I wonder how well Wonder Woman is going to do. There's got to be some real trepidation from people about DC films now.

I have trepidation when it comes to the DCEU, but it's entirely possible general audiences will only see it as a Wonder Woman film. The FIRST WW film to boot. As someone else said, tracking is somewhat scattershot, but we're still 2 weekends out. It doesn't need to pull in BvS or even Suicide Squad money to be a hit. It's more important for the film & DCEU at large that the film is good to help reassure fans that are on the fence, especially with Justice League coming out less than 6 months later.

-----

As for discussion of Covenant's opening weekend, I'd love to see a $55 mil opening weekend on the domestic front, but I highly doubt it. That would represent an increase over Prometheus & all tracking points to an opening in the $35-$40 mil range, though I would frankly find that somewhat disappointing. FOX would do backflips if it opened to $55 mil.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 18, 2017, 03:37:58 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 12:52:25 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Right now the estimates are varying wildly.  Fox is playing it safe and trying to really low ball it to avoid embarrassment and are apparently predicting a 35 million dollar opening.  Other sites are predicting up to a 50 million dollar opening.

It's somewhat interesting to note that Fox took the same approach with Prometheus and estimated an opening in the 30s and it actually opened to about 51 million.
Where have you read it?


Variety:
Quote"Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2" has soared past its competition for the past two weekends. But will Ridley Scott's "Alien: Covenant" be the film to upset the trend?

It appears so, according to early estimates which project Fox's "Prometheus" sequel will make anywhere from $40 million to $45 million during its opening weekend. The studio is projecting earnings on the low end of the range. "Prometheus" made $51 million when it opened in June 2012 in the second slot behind "Madagascar 3: Europe's Most Wanted."
http://variety.com/2017/film/news/box-office-alien-covenant-guardians-of-the-galaxy-2-1202430915/


LA Times:
QuoteIn an era of aging franchises, "Alien" theoretically represents a scary scenario for a studio. "Alien: Covenant" is the eighth film the 20th Century Fox property, counting the two widely panned "Alien Vs. Predator" movies. It's also a sequel to 2012's "Prometheus," a heady quasi-prequel to the original 1979 "Alien." (Still with us?)

Nonetheless, "Covenant" has generated strong interest among moviegoers, thanks to heightened anticipation among "Alien" fans stoked by gruesome marketing and generally positive reviews. Yes, the philosophical "Prometheus" confused many "Alien" fans with an origin-of-man back story that conspicuously lacked the famous creatures designed by surrealist H.R. Giger. In an about-face, the trailers for "Covenant" put the xenomorphs and facehuggers front and center.

The movie is poised to generate a strong $40 million to $50 million in ticket sales in the U.S. and Canada this weekend, according to people who have reviewed audience tracking surveys. That would be a similar result to "Prometheus" five years ago, which ended up collecting $400 million worldwide after opening with $51 million domestically.

http://www.latimes.com/business/hollywood/la-fi-ct-movie-projector-alien-20170516-htmlstory.html

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 18, 2017, 06:47:27 AM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-weekend-box-office-projections-wimpy-kid-guardians-of-the-galaxy-vol-2-everything-everything-1202096372/

http://pro.boxoffice.com/weekend-forecast-alien-covenant-diary-wimpy-kid-long-haul-everything-everything/

QuoteAlien: Covenant   Fox   $35,900,000   $35,900,000   NEW

I hope Pro Box Office are wrong, but yeah, I've seen the $35mill figure in a couple of places. I don't know if I'm naive but I can't see it doing LESS than Alien vs Predator's 38mill bow in August 2004.

At least Covenant has critical backing behind it. If word of mouth over the opening weekend is good whatever the first three days takings is, hopefully it'll have legs in the long run.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 18, 2017, 10:39:42 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 18, 2017, 03:37:58 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 17, 2017, 12:52:25 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 17, 2017, 11:32:54 AM
Seems to be a large influx of positive reviews from Ebert.com, New York Times and other critics with a lot of pull here in the United States (causing RT to go up from 75 to 77),  so that might give some good momentum for Alien Covenant heading into its debut week here.

Right now the estimates are varying wildly.  Fox is playing it safe and trying to really low ball it to avoid embarrassment and are apparently predicting a 35 million dollar opening.  Other sites are predicting up to a 50 million dollar opening.

It's somewhat interesting to note that Fox took the same approach with Prometheus and estimated an opening in the 30s and it actually opened to about 51 million.
Where have you read it?


Variety:
Quote"Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2" has soared past its competition for the past two weekends. But will Ridley Scott's "Alien: Covenant" be the film to upset the trend?

It appears so, according to early estimates which project Fox's "Prometheus" sequel will make anywhere from $40 million to $45 million during its opening weekend. The studio is projecting earnings on the low end of the range. "Prometheus" made $51 million when it opened in June 2012 in the second slot behind "Madagascar 3: Europe's Most Wanted."
http://variety.com/2017/film/news/box-office-alien-covenant-guardians-of-the-galaxy-2-1202430915/


LA Times:
QuoteIn an era of aging franchises, "Alien" theoretically represents a scary scenario for a studio. "Alien: Covenant" is the eighth film the 20th Century Fox property, counting the two widely panned "Alien Vs. Predator" movies. It's also a sequel to 2012's "Prometheus," a heady quasi-prequel to the original 1979 "Alien." (Still with us?)

Nonetheless, "Covenant" has generated strong interest among moviegoers, thanks to heightened anticipation among "Alien" fans stoked by gruesome marketing and generally positive reviews. Yes, the philosophical "Prometheus" confused many "Alien" fans with an origin-of-man back story that conspicuously lacked the famous creatures designed by surrealist H.R. Giger. In an about-face, the trailers for "Covenant" put the xenomorphs and facehuggers front and center.

The movie is poised to generate a strong $40 million to $50 million in ticket sales in the U.S. and Canada this weekend, according to people who have reviewed audience tracking surveys. That would be a similar result to "Prometheus" five years ago, which ended up collecting $400 million worldwide after opening with $51 million domestically.

http://www.latimes.com/business/hollywood/la-fi-ct-movie-projector-alien-20170516-htmlstory.html

The articles you quoted put it at about 40 so it's entirely possible they feel more confident in its performance now.

The other isn't an estimate from fox.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: razeak on May 18, 2017, 07:57:25 PM
Going to go see it Friday or Saturday. I can't wait. Someone said it felt like a Hammer homage. That piques my interest even more.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 08:50:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.

That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

Adjusted for inflation, yes, it's a downward trend. Also working against it is the budget for each film, excluding the AVP films, increased. If the numbers being reported are accurate, Covenant is the first film to have a lower budget than it's predecessor. On the positive side of things, the international earnings for each film has increased.

A chart from Box Office Mojo: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=alien.htm
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 09:08:22 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 08:50:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.

That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

Adjusted for inflation, yes, it's a downward trend. Also working against it is the budget for each film, excluding the AVP films, increased. If the numbers being reported are accurate, Covenant is the first film to have a lower budget than it's predecessor. On the positive side of things, the international earnings for each film has increased.

A chart from Box Office Mojo: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=alien.htm
Worldwide only increased unadjusted. Adjusted I'm sure it it also declining, with Prometheus as an exception.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 10:36:14 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 09:08:22 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 08:50:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.

That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

Adjusted for inflation, yes, it's a downward trend. Also working against it is the budget for each film, excluding the AVP films, increased. If the numbers being reported are accurate, Covenant is the first film to have a lower budget than it's predecessor. On the positive side of things, the international earnings for each film has increased.

A chart from Box Office Mojo: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=alien.htm
Worldwide only increased unadjusted. Adjusted I'm sure it it also declining, with Prometheus as an exception.

International receipts are never adjusted. Impossible to know. A general trend, one that has really boomed within the past decade, are films taking off overseas. Both Alien 3 & Resurrection dropped off substantial on the domestic front w/o inflation as well.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: GQSioux on May 18, 2017, 11:24:39 PM
They're predicting 41.4 for opening weekend:


http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4293&p=.htm
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

From the box office, Prometheus most likely lost money.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 01:47:55 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

From the box office, Prometheus most likely lost money.

Only if you believe Hollywood accounting. And if you do then please can you invest in my new company. Guaranteed 100% return on every $
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 19, 2017, 01:48:13 AM
About 20 minutes from start time and cinema is packed here. 2nd showing of night too and people coming out of first showing seemed please. Hope other cinemas as packed as this. Will mean good things for box office :)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 19, 2017, 01:57:06 AM
15 mins from showtime here, & that sadly also represents how many people are currently in the theater. I am pumped the f**k up tho!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 01:59:03 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 19, 2017, 01:48:13 AM
About 20 minutes from start time and cinema is packed here. 2nd showing of night too and people coming out of first showing seemed please. Hope other cinemas as packed as this. Will mean good things for box office :)

Thanks for report. I reckon it's going to do well in the US. 45 million maybe?


Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 19, 2017, 01:57:06 AM
15 mins from showtime here, & that sadly also represents how many people are currently in the theater. I am pumped the f**k up tho!

I watched Return Of The Jedi in a totally empty cinema and made the most of it. Get the best seat in the cinema, put your feet up and enjoy
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 19, 2017, 02:26:58 AM
When we will know US box office number ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 02:32:25 AM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 01:47:55 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

From the box office, Prometheus most likely lost money.

Only if you believe Hollywood accounting. And if you do then please can you invest in my new company. Guaranteed 100% return on every $

No, it pretty clearly lost money and absolutely did from the box office.  The simple actions by the studio make this glaringly obvious to anyone with any knowledge of how the box office works or the ability to simply logically think through cause and effect.

Not everything is magical 'hollywood accounting' when it comes up bad for a movie you wanted to do well.  Often times they just don't do well.  Prometheus lost money from the box office.  I'm sorry, I have no problem discussing the profit etc of films but it's more helpful when the other person has some sense of how percentages and math works.

I don't think I would invest in your company because I am fairly certain you have no clue what you are talking about.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 02:45:35 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 02:32:25 AM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 01:47:55 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

From the box office, Prometheus most likely lost money.

Only if you believe Hollywood accounting. And if you do then please can you invest in my new company. Guaranteed 100% return on every $

No, it pretty clearly lost money and absolutely did from the box office.  The simple actions by the studio make this glaringly obvious to anyone with any knowledge of how the box office works or the ability to simply logically think through cause and effect.

Not everything is magical 'hollywood accounting' when it comes up bad for a movie you wanted to do well.  Often times they just don't do well.

I don't think I would invest in your company because I am fairly certain you have no clue what you are talking about.

Well 20th Century Fox isn't a charity so if Prometheus lost them money why would they go with a sequel? My mum used to say why throw good money after bad


Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 02:32:25 AM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 01:47:55 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

From the box office, Prometheus most likely lost money.

Only if you believe Hollywood accounting. And if you do then please can you invest in my new company. Guaranteed 100% return on every $

No, it pretty clearly lost money and absolutely did from the box office.  The simple actions by the studio make this glaringly obvious to anyone with any knowledge of how the box office works or the ability to simply logically think through cause and effect.

Not everything is magical 'hollywood accounting' when it comes up bad for a movie you wanted to do well.  Often times they just don't do well.  Prometheus lost money from the box office.  I'm sorry, I have no problem discussing the profit etc of films but it's more helpful when the other person has some sense of how percentages and math works.

I don't think I would invest in your company because I am fairly certain you have no clue what you are talking about.

Ok you edited before I replied. Budget for Prometheus was what 125? Just over 400 mil at box office. Seems like a good return to me


When Dredd was released Alex Garland said if it hits 50 million in the US it's a hit. The budget on that film was 30 million or so. It flopped big time but he gave a good insight into what investors look for, not studio suits.
Anyone looking at budget vs box office should look into that film
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 10:46:48 AM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 02:45:35 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 02:32:25 AM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 01:47:55 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

From the box office, Prometheus most likely lost money.

Only if you believe Hollywood accounting. And if you do then please can you invest in my new company. Guaranteed 100% return on every $

No, it pretty clearly lost money and absolutely did from the box office.  The simple actions by the studio make this glaringly obvious to anyone with any knowledge of how the box office works or the ability to simply logically think through cause and effect.

Not everything is magical 'hollywood accounting' when it comes up bad for a movie you wanted to do well.  Often times they just don't do well.

I don't think I would invest in your company because I am fairly certain you have no clue what you are talking about.

Well 20th Century Fox isn't a charity so if Prometheus lost them money why would they go with a sequel? My mum used to say why throw good money after bad


Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 02:32:25 AM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 01:47:55 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 18, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 18, 2017, 07:59:11 PM
Studios always low-ball to save face if a film doesn't open as well as projected. Rival studios will sometimes try to do the opposite. $35 seems too low, honestly, given that Prometheus opened w/ $51 mil 5 years ago. I know that film was divisive, but the focus on the actual Xeno & having Alien in the title is supposed to balance that.
That might result in Resurrection-level profits, rather than Prometheus or The Martian profits. In fact, when you adjust for inflation, each Alien movie was earning less... until Prometheus. My impression is that the Alien franchise is dying, and that Prometheus reversed the downward trends with critics, fans, and profits by jettisoning the familiar iconography and rebooting as something more cutting edge.

From the box office, Prometheus most likely lost money.

Only if you believe Hollywood accounting. And if you do then please can you invest in my new company. Guaranteed 100% return on every $

No, it pretty clearly lost money and absolutely did from the box office.  The simple actions by the studio make this glaringly obvious to anyone with any knowledge of how the box office works or the ability to simply logically think through cause and effect.

Not everything is magical 'hollywood accounting' when it comes up bad for a movie you wanted to do well.  Often times they just don't do well.  Prometheus lost money from the box office.  I'm sorry, I have no problem discussing the profit etc of films but it's more helpful when the other person has some sense of how percentages and math works.

I don't think I would invest in your company because I am fairly certain you have no clue what you are talking about.

Ok you edited before I replied. Budget for Prometheus was what 125? Just over 400 mil at box office. Seems like a good return to me


When Dredd was released Alex Garland said if it hits 50 million in the US it's a hit. The budget on that film was 30 million or so. It flopped big time but he gave a good insight into what investors look for, not studio suits.
Anyone looking at budget vs box office should look into that film

None of what you are saying is correct. :(  Good luck with everything but Prometheus cost far more than 130 and the studio got far less than 400. That is simply how the basic math works.

Dredd isn't unusual. The film had a tiny marketing budget. If it did 50 in the us then it would do comparable over seas and financially it would have pretty much broken even before taking anything into account.

Also the writer isn't who you want to be leaning on to tell you financials. Most people involved don't know and never are told costs. Why would they be?  Their job is to make a good movie and not worry about how much money is or isn't made.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 19, 2017, 03:12:43 PM
$4.2 mil from Thursday night

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/19/box-office-alien-covenant-earns-promising-4-2-million-thursday/?c=0&s=BoxOffice
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 19, 2017, 03:19:30 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 19, 2017, 03:12:43 PM
$4.2 mil from Thursday night

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/19/box-office-alien-covenant-earns-promising-4-2-million-thursday/?c=0&s=BoxOffice

I can see that. Local cinema was sold out for early showing and packed during late showing I was at. The crowd was really into it and enjoyed it. I will see it again tomorrow with my wife and see what the crowd is like. We will see if this thing has legs but that is a good start.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 04:12:19 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 19, 2017, 03:19:30 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 19, 2017, 03:12:43 PM
$4.2 mil from Thursday night

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/19/box-office-alien-covenant-earns-promising-4-2-million-thursday/?c=0&s=BoxOffice

I can see that. Local cinema was sold out for early showing and packed during late showing I was at. The crowd was really into it and enjoyed it. I will see it again tomorrow with my wife and see what the crowd is like. We will see if this thing has legs but that is a good start.

That's pretty good. If it holds well over the weekend and it hits 50 that would be a far better than expected opening
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 19, 2017, 05:02:42 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 19, 2017, 02:45:35 AM
When Dredd was released Alex Garland said if it hits 50 million in the US it's a hit. The budget on that film was 30 million or so. It flopped big time but he gave a good insight into what investors look for, not studio suits.
Anyone looking at budget vs box office should look into that film

No, he said that 50 million would be the minimum it would need to make in the US in order to have a faint glimmer of hope for a sequel. Anyway, Dredd is not a good comparison because it wasn't a typical Hollywood studio movie like Covenant. It was essentially an indie movie. Lionsgate only purchased distribution rights for the US. Each international territory had it's own distributor and a good chunk of the funding came from India.

Quote from: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 10:46:48 AM
Dredd isn't unusual. The film had a tiny marketing budget. If it did 50 in the us then it would do comparable over seas and financially it would have pretty much broken even before taking anything into account.

Also the writer isn't who you want to be leaning on to tell you financials. Most people involved don't know and never are told costs. Why would they be?  Their job is to make a good movie and not worry about how much money is or isn't made.

Alex Garland was also one of the producers and essentially the director as well for all intents and purposes. He had a vested interest in Dredd's box office performance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: GQSioux on May 19, 2017, 06:00:09 PM
From Box Office Mojo:


Alien: Covenant delivered $4.2 million from Thursday night previews, which began at 7PM at ~3,000 locations. This compares favorably to Mad Max: Fury Road, which brought in $3.7 million on Thursday night before opening with $45.4 million. In fact, this is a better preview result than 2012's Prometheus, which brought in $3.6 million ahead of its $51 million opening weekend.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Lexxdog on May 19, 2017, 07:49:16 PM
Just back from watching the move 😞😞 it's not that it a bad movie it's just not what I wanted it not what we should have got and it not how thing should have turned out as far as I'm concerned this is not a ALIEN movie there is only one ALIEN everything is dose not count (I don't think I will brother with alien awaking our what ever Ridley desides 2 shit
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 19, 2017, 09:58:34 PM
Quote from: Lexxdog on May 19, 2017, 07:49:16 PM
Just back from watching the move 😞😞 it's not that it a bad movie it's just not what I wanted it not what we should have got and it not how thing should have turned out as far as I'm concerned this is not a ALIEN movie there is only one ALIEN everything is dose not count (I don't think I will brother with alien awaking our what ever Ridley desides 2 shit

There were lots of aliens. And alien only had one alien. So is that not an alien movie?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 20, 2017, 07:59:56 AM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Hmmmm so so figures. Not a flop but reaffirms Alien as a steady if unspectacular box office draw. Was really really hoping to see it open above $40mill. I'm convinced the actual figures will be below.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Look into my eye on May 20, 2017, 08:13:18 AM
Depends where you get your facts from I suppose.
According to this, and other websites, it did better than what Deadline is reporting.

http://variety.com/2017/film/box-office/box-office-alien-covenant-guardians-everything-everything-1202437248/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 20, 2017, 08:18:32 AM
Quote from: Look into my eye on May 20, 2017, 08:13:18 AM
Depends where you get your facts from I suppose.
According to this, and other websites, it did better than what Deadline is reporting.

http://variety.com/2017/film/box-office/box-office-alien-covenant-guardians-everything-everything-1202437248/

Deadline has the first Friday figures, everywhere else is going off the Thursday night screenings.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 20, 2017, 12:29:49 PM
Quote from: Look into my eye on May 20, 2017, 08:13:18 AM
Depends where you get your facts from I suppose.
According to this, and other websites, it did better than what Deadline is reporting.

http://variety.com/2017/film/box-office/box-office-alien-covenant-guardians-everything-everything-1202437248/

Half way down there is this little piece of information which i think is super important:

"The opening will be about 18% below that of "Prometheus," which grossed $51 million domestically when it launched on June 8-10, 2012".  18% drop off is pretty sizable.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gazz on May 20, 2017, 12:32:52 PM
Sure but it also cost a sizeable amount less to make than Prometheus. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Feeds On Minds on May 20, 2017, 12:50:36 PM
This film deserves to flop.
This series deserves a better film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on May 20, 2017, 01:09:23 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 20, 2017, 12:50:36 PM
This film deserves to flop.
This series deserves a better film.

If this flops, the series won't get another film for a long, long time.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Feeds On Minds on May 20, 2017, 01:29:34 PM
If that means we won't get yet another disappointing poorly written mediocre insult to a once great series; I'm completely on board with that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Aquarius8 on May 20, 2017, 02:11:10 PM
"Alien" is a "Horror" franchise even though it's Sci-Fi.   It's box office must be compared along those lines of Horror.  Plus it's R-rated.   I believe it's the highest grossing Horror Franchise of all time.   It seems "Covenant" is going to drop from "Prometheus", but worldwide it may still keep numbers respectable. 

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 02:56:21 PM
Quote from: fiveways on May 20, 2017, 12:29:49 PM
Quote from: Look into my eye on May 20, 2017, 08:13:18 AM
Depends where you get your facts from I suppose.
According to this, and other websites, it did better than what Deadline is reporting.

http://variety.com/2017/film/box-office/box-office-alien-covenant-guardians-everything-everything-1202437248/

Half way down there is this little piece of information which i think is super important:

"The opening will be about 18% below that of "Prometheus," which grossed $51 million domestically when it launched on June 8-10, 2012".  18% drop off is pretty sizable.

Not if it matches the drop in budget. Will need to see how it all pans out in WW box office. I don't think it will flop but I also don't think it will be very profitable.


Quote from: shawsbaby on May 20, 2017, 01:09:23 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 20, 2017, 12:50:36 PM
This film deserves to flop.
This series deserves a better film.

If this flops, the series won't get another film for a long, long time.

I sincerely doubt it will flop badly and will at leadt break even. Regardless, it seems Ridley Scott is intent on finishing this prequel series out and said they will be filming in a year or so from now. Whether Fox is on board is another thing, and they may have to force Ridley to make some compromises.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 20, 2017, 03:09:43 PM
https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/20/box-office-alien-covenant-tops-friday-with-15m-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-bombs/?c=0&s=BoxOffice

I highly recommend Scott's daily round-up's. Yes, it looks like Alien Covenant is headed for ~$40 mil which is in line w/ most pre-release expectations, for better or worse.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on May 20, 2017, 03:32:05 PM
Anybody thinking Covenant is/will be a box office flop doesn't know how to count. A US opening weekend of circa $40M + will be viewed as successful. It's certainly doing well in Europe... and when one factors in anticipsted home cinema sales, the next film is pretty much green lit.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 03:48:43 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 20, 2017, 03:32:05 PM
Anybody thinking Covenant is/will be a box office flop doesn't know how to count. A US opening weekend of circa $40M + will be viewed as successful. It's certainly doing well in Europe... and when one factors in anticipsted home cinema sales, the next film is pretty much green lit.

Ridley Scott certainly seems to think so given his enthusiasm in recent interviews for getting the next film out and his determination to shoot in 13 months from now.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 20, 2017, 04:03:28 PM
While I had originally seen Covenant's budget listed at ~$110 mil I've seen more than 1 site in the past week list it at $97 mil. Interesting discrepancy. The lower the budget, the less it has to make, obviously. Either one would represent a come down from Prometheus's reported $130 mil. I don't think we're in any danger of Covenant being a flop, but it's success, or relative lack thereof, will likely dictate how much money FOX is willing to spend on a sequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 20, 2017, 04:19:13 PM
Scott reported it as 111 (I think), Fox reported it as 90 something.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 20, 2017, 04:44:08 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 20, 2017, 04:19:13 PM
Scott reported it as 111 (I think), Fox reported it as 90 something.

Interesting. I guess I'll take FOX"s word on it, though studios aren't necessarily the most trustworthy! Operating at 75% of Prometheus's the budget gives Covenant quite a cushion.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 04:53:02 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 20, 2017, 04:44:08 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 20, 2017, 04:19:13 PM
Scott reported it as 111 (I think), Fox reported it as 90 something.

Interesting. I guess I'll take FOX"s word on it, though studios aren't necessarily the most trustworthy! Operating at 75% of Prometheus's the budget gives Covenant quite a cushion.

Hope Covenant does well enough when all is said and done to warrant a budget similar to Covenant for the next film. I don't know what direction Ridley Scott is heading with the final film, as there are MANY interesting ways to tie this all up, but I gaurantee you that none of them will be cheap.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ectomorph on May 20, 2017, 05:20:49 PM
Very pleased to hear the film is doing so well - the worldwide numbers from last week definitely gave me hope! I'm rooting for Scott to make due on his promise to make six more Alien films now. I hope he has it in him.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 20, 2017, 05:24:22 PM
Quote from: Ectomorph on May 20, 2017, 05:20:49 PM
Very pleased to hear the film is doing so well - the worldwide numbers from last week definitely gave me hope! I'm rooting for Scott to make due on his promise to make six more Alien films now. I hope he has it in him.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/box-office-alien-covenant-opening-guardians-2-1202438525/

40.2 Millions in USA!.

Good news! 8)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 20, 2017, 05:31:44 PM
It hasn't taken that just yet, it's just on track to take the predicted amount.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 05:46:38 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 20, 2017, 05:24:22 PM
Quote from: Ectomorph on May 20, 2017, 05:20:49 PM
Very pleased to hear the film is doing so well - the worldwide numbers from last week definitely gave me hope! I'm rooting for Scott to make due on his promise to make six more Alien films now. I hope he has it in him.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/box-office-alien-covenant-opening-guardians-2-1202438525/

40.2 Millions in USA!.

Good news! 8)

The news is very good. Here is what Box Office Mojo has so far.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=alienparadiselost.htm

QuoteProduction Budget: $97 million

This is outstanding work by Ridley to keep costs low.
Double this with a box office number (~$200 million) and the production costs are paid. (Studios keep ~1/2 of box office money while the theaters get their share.)
- Next would be marketing costs which might be about $50 million. I'm guessing since studios rarely release those numbers these days.
My guess is that if "Covenant" can get to $300 million box office, that it will be making a profit in theaters. (I've got formulas for this but I won't bore people with that here unless someone asks me.) :)
- Then there is the money from streaming, disk sales, TV broadcasts, toys, etc.
"Covenant" will make money and there will be another new Alien film.

Worldwide box office numbers up through Friday, May 19;

Quote(US):    $15,350,000      
+ (outside US): $46,668,253      
= Worldwide:    $62,018,253

;)    

PS. I ran the numbers for a total budget of about $150 million for "Covenant" which includes marketing costs.
The worldwide box office number it would have to reach with the formula I have is ~$263 million to definitely make a profit in theaters.

SNL Kagan has a formula to show when a movie has definitely made money.
It is 1.75 times the total budget.
$150 million x 1.75 = $262.5 million
http://www.deadline.com/2013/01/movie-profits-december-snl-kagan/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 05:46:38 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 20, 2017, 05:24:22 PM
Quote from: Ectomorph on May 20, 2017, 05:20:49 PM
Very pleased to hear the film is doing so well - the worldwide numbers from last week definitely gave me hope! I'm rooting for Scott to make due on his promise to make six more Alien films now. I hope he has it in him.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/box-office-alien-covenant-opening-guardians-2-1202438525/

40.2 Millions in USA!.

Good news! 8)

The news is very good. Here is what Box Office Mojo has so far.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=alienparadiselost.htm

QuoteProduction Budget: $97 million

This is outstanding work by Ridley to keep costs low.
Double this with a box office number (~$200 million) and the production costs are paid. (Studios keep ~1/2 of box office money while the theaters get their share.)
- Next would be marketing costs which might be about $50 million. I'm guessing since studios rarely release those numbers these days.
My guess is that if "Covenant" can get to $300 million box office, that it will be making a profit in theaters. (I've got formulas for this but I won't bore people with that here unless someone asks me.) :)
- Then there is the money from streaming, disk sales, TV broadcasts, toys, etc.
"Covenant" will make money and there will be another new Alien film.

Worldwide box office numbers up through Friday;

Quote(US):    $15,350,000      
+ (outside US): $46,668,253      
= Worldwide:    $62,018,253

;)   

Good points and yes I am optimistic myself.

Those of us seeing the movie 3+ times certainly are helping :) Luckily there is so much going on in the movie that it lends itself well to multiple viewings. I hope Ridley Scott pays attention to critics though because while I REALLY enjoy Covenant, I want the next film to appease those with issues with it. Even the Xeno origin can be expanded, where as David merely copied an existing idea, anything....point it, the next movie can still follow the same plot line but manage to fix things.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 20, 2017, 08:39:50 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 05:46:38 PM
- Next would be marketing costs which might be about $50 million. I'm guessing since studios rarely release those numbers these days.

Was certainly way more than that.

Robopadna what was your estimate again?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 10:16:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMGood points and yes I am optimistic myself...
Luckily there is so much going on in the movie that it lends itself well to multiple viewings.

Yes.

Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMI want the next film to appease those with issues with it. Even the Xeno origin can be expanded, where as David merely copied an existing idea, anything....point it, the next movie can still follow the same plot line but manage to fix things.

* Ridley needs to be true to himself imo.
He doesn't over explain things in "Blade Runner", "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
- So, what is the answer to what David said in "Covenant"?
The film theory which explains it is this.
1. David in "Covenant" has delusions of grandeur.
2. David in "Covenant" is a compulsive liar.
* This tells the viewer that whatever David said about the xenomorph origins should not be trusted.

* Scott has put ample evidence in "Covenant" about David's delusions and lies.
Imo there is nothing to fix about whatever David said in the new movie.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 21, 2017, 12:12:58 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 10:16:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMGood points and yes I am optimistic myself...
Luckily there is so much going on in the movie that it lends itself well to multiple viewings.

Yes.

Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMI want the next film to appease those with issues with it. Even the Xeno origin can be expanded, where as David merely copied an existing idea, anything....point it, the next movie can still follow the same plot line but manage to fix things.

* Ridley needs to be true to himself imo.
He doesn't over explain things in "Blade Runner", "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
- So, what is the answer to what David said in "Covenant"?
The film theory which explains it is this.
1. David in "Covenant" has delusions of grandeur.
2. David in "Covenant" is a compulsive liar.
* This tells the viewer that whatever David said about the xenomorph origins should not be trusted.

* Scott has put ample evidence in "Covenant" about David's delusions and lies.
Imo there is nothing to fix about whatever David said in the new movie.

;)

I agree.

It's very interesting that David sees himself as THE GOD and at the same time he forgotten about his favorites books and authors.

Maybe David has Alzeihmer? ???
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 12:16:47 AM

Quote from: PierreVW on May 21, 2017, 12:12:58 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 10:16:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMGood points and yes I am optimistic myself...
Luckily there is so much going on in the movie that it lends itself well to multiple viewings.

Yes.

Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMI want the next film to appease those with issues with it. Even the Xeno origin can be expanded, where as David merely copied an existing idea, anything....point it, the next movie can still follow the same plot line but manage to fix things.

* Ridley needs to be true to himself imo.
He doesn't over explain things in "Blade Runner", "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
- So, what is the answer to what David said in "Covenant"?
The film theory which explains it is this.
1. David in "Covenant" has delusions of grandeur.
2. David in "Covenant" is a compulsive liar.
* This tells the viewer that whatever David said about the xenomorph origins should not be trusted.

* Scott has put ample evidence in "Covenant" about David's delusions and lies.
Imo there is nothing to fix about whatever David said in the new movie.

;)

I agree.

It's very interesting that David sees himself as THE GOD and at the same time he forgotten about his favorites books and authors.

Maybe David has Alzeihmer? ???

In a way you're right, but I think it's that his A.I. is starting to have glitches.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 21, 2017, 03:42:17 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 12:16:47 AM

Quote from: PierreVW on May 21, 2017, 12:12:58 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 10:16:22 PM
* Ridley needs to be true to himself imo.
He doesn't over explain things in "Blade Runner", "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
- So, what is the answer to what David said in "Covenant"?
The film theory which explains it is this.
1. David in "Covenant" has delusions of grandeur.
2. David in "Covenant" is a compulsive liar.
* This tells the viewer that whatever David said about the xenomorph origins should not be trusted.

* Scott has put ample evidence in "Covenant" about David's delusions and lies.
Imo there is nothing to fix about whatever David said in the new movie.

;)

I agree.

It's very interesting that David sees himself as THE GOD and at the same time he forgotten about his favorites books and authors.

Maybe David has Alzeihmer? ???

In a way you're right, but I think it's that his A.I. is starting to have glitches.

Yes. The idea of glitches with a killer AI was brought up in "2001" with HAL.
- "Covenant" gives the viewer an interesting premise; what if a glitchy AI decides to become the evil god of the galaxy?
The glitchy AI has a weapon of mass destruction, the black goo.
And this psychotic AI (for lack of a better term) is trying to create an army of Xenomorph (or xenomorph like) creatures.

What can be done about that?
I'm looking forward to the next Alien sequel to find out.

* And what will help is the low production budget and very good box office numbers (so far).
It's pretty certain that there will be another movie in this series. Yeah!

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 21, 2017, 07:26:39 AM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Estimated $36million for the weekend now. What a flop.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 07:56:36 AM
Wow, I wasn't expecting numbers this low. Its below AvP, even before you adjust for over a decade of inflation. Yikes. I think the next one is going to be an actual B-movie at this rate.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 21, 2017, 08:29:15 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 07:56:36 AM
Wow, I wasn't expecting numbers this low. Its below AvP, even before you adjust for over a decade of inflation. Yikes. I think the next one is going to be an actual B-movie at this rate.

There's a questionable lack of thirst for decent Sci-Fi/Horror in America. I wasn't the biggest fan of Life but it deserved to do better than it did, and Alien: Covenant is competently made and well acted, no matter what side of the fence you sit on, but it just hasn't translated.

Prometheus scored a B, Life scored a C+ and Covenant scored a B among audiences. All middling scores and left eating the dust of audience reaction to the likes of Power Rangers and Transformers whcih scored A's.

Hats off to 20th Century Fox for backing this one all the way though. It's received the most lavish advertisement of an any Alien movie. Hopefully they recoup some money internationally, hope is not lost there.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 21, 2017, 08:53:42 AM
i would definately not call it a flop just yet . .36 mil is ok, but not great. .i knew it was'nt going to do major business in the us. .it openened in over 50 other territory's this weekend so lets see how it faired globally after the weekend. .plus their is still china and japan to come. . .so their is still hope i think
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 21, 2017, 08:56:09 AM
Flop may have been an overreaction on my part. It'll probably still scrape breaking even worldwide. But those American numbers are severely disappointing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 21, 2017, 09:43:24 AM
It's just an estimated number,even if I doubt it will be much different. It can still go higher,but nothing more than 37/38M. In any case,it's ok. It's a R-rated sci-fi with a 97M budget (with the Australian funds). It's fine. Everyone knew that it was never going  to do great money in the US.  It doesn't need the same Prometheus numbers to be profitable.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 21, 2017, 10:06:11 AM
I've always felt that Scott films got a better reaction outside of the US anyway.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: four eyes on May 21, 2017, 10:39:02 AM
Perhaps i can't calculate but from what i read and understand deadline states Saturday 11:25 PM = estimated $36.1M. SUNDAY hasnt accurred yet nor is it finished and hasn't been calculated. Maybe they wont included thursday nights previews in the weekend total, but if you've read box office mojo before theres many times they dont include Thursday night previews in the total demestic BO, weird aye.

So my understanding is this, Thursday Night 4.2 million , Friday 15.3 million, Saturday 12 million 11:25pm = 34.2 million. They could be screening scheduled after 11:25 Saturday night which obviously would not be included yet and of course SUNDAY, so like I said perhaps im wrong and point out if I am, but how could anyone come  to the conclusion it'll make a total of 36 million by the end of Sunday, that means it'll make 1.8 million all day Sunday ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 21, 2017, 11:47:59 AM
Ouch... Disappointing numbers. I hope Sunday sees an upswing cause it will need it to hit in the 40 million range. I was optimistic because I happen to like Covenant, now I am concerned. If it struggles to hit even 36 million this weekend, how is it going to fair in the coming weeks?


Quote from: four eyes on May 21, 2017, 10:39:02 AM
Perhaps i can't calculate but from what i read and understand deadline states Saturday 11:25 PM = estimated $36.1M. SUNDAY hasnt accurred yet nor is it finished and hasn't been calculated. Maybe they wont included thursday nights previews in the weekend total, but if you've read box office mojo before theres many times they dont include Thursday night previews in the total demestic BO, weird aye.

So my understanding is this, Thursday Night 4.2 million , Friday 15.3 million, Saturday 12 million 11:25pm = 34.2 million. They could be screening scheduled after 11:25 Saturday night which obviously would not be included yet and of course SUNDAY, so like I said perhaps im wrong and point out if I am, but how could anyone come  to the conclusion it'll make a total of 36 million by the end of Sunday, that means it'll make 1.8 million all day Sunday ?

Good points... I know it will do much better than 1.8 million on Sunday. At least here the theatres are pretty active on Sundays.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ryan741 on May 21, 2017, 12:01:31 PM
I just hope it does well enough for Fox to stick with the franchise.  I had a blast with Covenant and desperately want a sequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 21, 2017, 12:10:18 PM
Quote from: Ryan741 on May 21, 2017, 12:01:31 PM
I just hope it does well enough for Fox to stick with the franchise.  I had a blast with Covenant and desperately want a sequel.

Exactly... Well, we would know within a short amount of time whether Fox will allow Ridley Scott to continue his sequel. He wants to shoot 13 months from now, which means preproduction would be starting later this year, probably around October or so.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ryan741 on May 21, 2017, 12:24:14 PM
Right enough, keeping my fingers and toes crossed. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 21, 2017, 01:28:04 PM
Fox will make sequel even number not good in box office but not within 14 month because they need time to rethink about sequel.

Probably they find another Director to direct it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 01:42:46 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 21, 2017, 08:53:42 AM
i would definately not call it a flop just yet . .36 mil is ok, but not great. .i knew it was'nt going to do major business in the us. .it openened in over 50 other territory's this weekend so lets see how it faired globally after the weekend. .plus their is still china and japan to come. . .so their is still hope i think

36 is very very very low. It's not ok domestically. If it sticks to that number then gotg2 almost beat it in its third week.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 21, 2017, 01:46:35 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 21, 2017, 01:28:04 PM
Fox will make sequel even number not good in box office but not within 14 month because they need time to rethink about sequel.

Probably they find another Director to direct it.

Let's hope not. Scott was the main draw for me.


In the UK I went to two screenings - nine days apart. Cinema was packed to capacity on both occasions. In fact some people in the queue were turned away at the second screening and they booked for the following day instead.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 21, 2017, 02:28:29 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 21, 2017, 01:46:35 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 21, 2017, 01:28:04 PM
Fox will make sequel even number not good in box office but not within 14 month because they need time to rethink about sequel.

Probably they find another Director to direct it.

Let's hope not. Scott was the main draw for me.


In the UK I went to two screenings - nine days apart. Cinema was packed to capacity on both occasions. In fact some people in the queue were turned away at the second screening and they booked for the following day instead.

Good to hear friend!

That is what irks me about here in the states and the BO results. The opening night theatre I attended at a cinemark on their XD screen (their version of IMAX) was probably 90% full for the second screening and sold out for the first screening. Yesterday, at 3pm, the theatre was 75% full and people were already lined up for the screening after that when I left. So going by what I observed, the numbers feel like they should of been much higher for BO results.

Still though, with looking at the numbers, are they really only estimating 1.6 million for Sunday? Cause they would just need to do 4 to 5 million (less than half of Saturday) to hit 40 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Home Releases (UK)
Post by: MrRipley on May 21, 2017, 03:28:18 PM
The BO results are in $36 million large drop offs after Friday,looking shaky already.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 21, 2017, 03:32:03 PM
https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/21/box-office-alien-covenant-opens-below-alien-vs-predator/#18cd77b45269

Yikes. I guess it's in line with tracking & FOX's own public estimates. Certainly doesn't feel like anything resembling a win however.

I'm scratching my head somewhat at what has people so confused? BO reporting isn't rocket science. The Thursday preview #'s are always included in the Friday "opening day" gross. Weekend estimates always come out approx. 11 AM on Sunday. The bigger the #'s, the bigger the potential alteration once actual #'s come in on Monday.

Quote from: four eyes on May 21, 2017, 10:39:02 AM
So my understanding is this, Thursday Night 4.2 million , Friday 15.3 million, Saturday 12 million 11:25pm = 34.2 million. They could be screening scheduled after 11:25 Saturday night which obviously would not be included yet and of course SUNDAY, so like I said perhaps im wrong and point out if I am, but how could anyone come  to the conclusion it'll make a total of 36 million by the end of Sunday, that means it'll make 1.8 million all day Sunday ?

First off, 4.2 + 15.3 + 12 = 31.5 mil, not 34.2 mil. Secondly: you counted the Thursday cross twice. No one is estimating a 1.8 million Sunday. They're estimating an 8.8 mil Sunday, considering 15.3 + 12 = 27.3
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 03:45:25 PM
Aren't all movies expected to do worse this year???
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 21, 2017, 03:56:07 PM
What? No. Stop making excuses.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 03:57:58 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 03:45:25 PM
Aren't all movies expected to do worse this year???

No, not at all.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Predaker on May 21, 2017, 04:04:28 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 20, 2017, 10:16:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMGood points and yes I am optimistic myself...
Luckily there is so much going on in the movie that it lends itself well to multiple viewings.

Yes.

Quote from: cucuchu on May 20, 2017, 05:53:23 PMI want the next film to appease those with issues with it. Even the Xeno origin can be expanded, where as David merely copied an existing idea, anything....point it, the next movie can still follow the same plot line but manage to fix things.

* Ridley needs to be true to himself imo.
He doesn't over explain things in "Blade Runner", "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
- So, what is the answer to what David said in "Covenant"?
The film theory which explains it is this.
1. David in "Covenant" has delusions of grandeur.
2. David in "Covenant" is a compulsive liar.
* This tells the viewer that whatever David said about the xenomorph origins should not be trusted.

* Scott has put ample evidence in "Covenant" about David's delusions and lies.
Imo there is nothing to fix about whatever David said in the new movie.

;)

Spoiler
There is no indication that David is a compulsive liar, nor is there any good reason to believe he's lying to Oram when he outright states that he created the Alien eggs.
[close]

Edit: spoiler tag added
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scott Conover on May 21, 2017, 04:05:43 PM
World wide the movie has already made $117,800,000. I think we are doing ok. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cliffhanger on May 21, 2017, 04:06:15 PM
Haven't gotten around to see it unfortunately, it's only available here since 3 days and i want a good seat and the cinema's were completely booked.
Which in itself is interesting.

then again, reading the box office results is rather dramatic.

I must say though, i'm not too influenced by it. I will appreciate a movie based on what i see, not what other poeple think.
But it must be said, excitement rises when you hear box office sales records getting crushed, and at the moment, the box office sales
are disappointing which doesn't really do good for excitement.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 21, 2017, 04:06:40 PM
Hopefully the WW Box Office can carry the film to a moderate success. I am still confident FOX will let Ridley finish his series with one more film, the question is with what compromises? When will we know the WW results for the weekend?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 04:08:52 PM
Quote from: Scott Conover on May 21, 2017, 04:05:43 PM
World wide the movie has already made $117,800,000. I think we are doing ok.

Not really...   this weekend will give a better view on how it's doing.  domestically it's very disappointing if it can't crack 40.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: broken back on May 21, 2017, 04:20:15 PM
36 million for the three day weekend ?
I dont understand ? can someone explain to me how, whoever is out there can proclaim these numbers ? when SUNDAY isn't over yet. As of writting this these are some of america's timezones

Time in Austin Texas 11:10am  Sunday
Time in New York     12:10pm   Sunday
Time in California   9:15am       Sunday
Time in Detroit      12:15pm       Sunday

I would also like to point out Thursday nights numberes are NOT included in the 36 million and that prometheus never had thusday late night showing so if a comparison should be made, include the 4.2 million on thursday before giving up on this films chances of a sequel
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 21, 2017, 04:37:35 PM
Quote from: broken back on May 21, 2017, 04:20:15 PM
36 million for the three day weekend ?
I dont understand ? can someone explain to me how, whoever is out there can proclaim these numbers ? when SUNDAY isn't over yet. As of writting this these are some of america's timezones

Time in Austin Texas 11:10am  Sunday
Time in New York     12:10pm   Sunday
Time in California   9:15am       Sunday
Time in Detroit      12:15pm       Sunday

I would also like to point out Thursday nights numberes are NOT included in the 36 million and that prometheus never had thusday late night showing so if a comparison should be made, include the 4.2 million on thursday before giving up on this films chances of a sequel

They do the Thrusday instead of midnight friday shows (which Prometheus in both 2d and 3d had, I went to one of them).

Estimates is what it is based on using advanced ticket sales and using average sunday drop off for opening weeks films that are rated R and grossed that kinda money. 

Also remember Fox only keeps about half that money.  So $36m begins to translate to 18m for fox.  They make less overseas.  Though the huge tax break they got nicely offsets that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ryan741 on May 21, 2017, 04:41:58 PM
Reading Collider Fox seem kinda pleased with the performance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alexa431 on May 21, 2017, 04:47:51 PM
Just want to make a quick note, most of the showings for Covenant, due to Guardian of the Galaxy taking preference, are not in IMAX. That will of course influence the box office tremendously.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 21, 2017, 04:58:36 PM
Quote from: Alexa431 on May 21, 2017, 04:47:51 PM
Just want to make a quick note, most of the showings for Covenant, due to Guardian of the Galaxy taking preference, are not in IMAX. That will of course influence the box office tremendously.

Can even mention the lack of 3-D.

Feel we're just over-compensating for what is a disappointing result. First Chris Cornell, now this bombing, bloody hell I'm miserable this weekend lol
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 21, 2017, 05:08:24 PM
I have a bad feeling that we might not see Covenant sequel. It's a lesson for Fox that messing with franchise and changing directions isn't a good idea. Alien in the title and on the screen doesn't guarantee success. I hope I'm wrong.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Dino21AvP on May 21, 2017, 05:17:33 PM
$36 million is kind of a disappointing opening but not a flop by any means. I think the foreign and worldwide totals will make it successful though, especially since it had a much lower budget than Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 21, 2017, 05:27:18 PM
Quote from: Ryan741 on May 21, 2017, 04:41:58 PM
Reading Collider Fox seem kinda pleased with the performance.

I would imagine a sigh of relief after King Arthur. The fate that suffered sends serious chills down studio exec spines. 36m isn't gangbusters but it's not a dud either. It's weird but the difference 4m makes. It it landed the original forecast of 40m the press would be more upbeat.
I would rather be in Fox shoes with 36m off 93m than Europacorp sweating it with 180m riding on Luc Bessons Valerian film. That one looks like a huge roll of the dice. I hope it hits though because it looks amazing
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AntJac on May 21, 2017, 05:33:29 PM
I think some common sense is needed here guys. AC was and is up against and was released in a time where all the major blockbusters have been and will be released. Bearing in mind it's gone up against one of the most successful Marvel films much anticipated sequel which is still taking in massive amounts of cash, on top of AC being rated 18/R, 36m is not too shabby at all.

Fox will be pleased as Rated R films and Horror in general very rarely reach number one let alone number one in a month dominated by one of Marvel's cash cows.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 05:43:47 PM
Quote from: AntJac on May 21, 2017, 05:33:29 PM
I think some common sense is needed here guys. AC was and is up against and was released in a time where all the major blockbusters have been and will be released. Bearing in mind it's gone up against one of the most successful Marvel films much anticipated sequel which is still taking in massive amounts of cash, on top of AC being rated 18/R, 36m is not too shabby at all.

Fox will be pleased as Rated R films and Horror in general very rarely reach number one let alone number one in a month dominated by one of Marvel's cash cows.

It went up against a marvel movie in its third weekend and barely beat it. AC had no real competition.

Fox is not going to be very pleased with this OW. Plenty of horror movies and r movies open up at number one.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 05:47:35 PM
The take will be lower because there's no 3D. I would also bet the IMAX showings were less.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AntJac on May 21, 2017, 05:54:11 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 05:43:47 PM
Quote from: AntJac on May 21, 2017, 05:33:29 PM
I think some common sense is needed here guys. AC was and is up against and was released in a time where all the major blockbusters have been and will be released. Bearing in mind it's gone up against one of the most successful Marvel films much anticipated sequel which is still taking in massive amounts of cash, on top of AC being rated 18/R, 36m is not too shabby at all.

Fox will be pleased as Rated R films and Horror in general very rarely reach number one let alone number one in a month dominated by one of Marvel's cash cows.

It went up against a marvel movie in its third weekend and barely beat it. AC had no real competition.

Fox is not going to be very pleased with this OW. Plenty of horror movies and r movies open up at number one.

Marvel movies are notorious for getting consistent BO takings for a number of weeks before drifting off. It's why the majority of their films take in obscene amounts.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 21, 2017, 05:58:47 PM
Quote from: four eyes on May 21, 2017, 10:39:02 AM
Perhaps i can't calculate but from what i read and understand deadline states Saturday 11:25 PM = estimated $36.1M. SUNDAY hasnt accurred yet nor is it finished and hasn't been calculated. Maybe they wont included thursday nights previews in the weekend total, but if you've read box office mojo before theres many times they dont include Thursday night previews in the total demestic BO, weird aye.

So my understanding is this, Thursday Night 4.2 million , Friday 15.3 million, Saturday 12 million 11:25pm = 34.2 million. They could be screening scheduled after 11:25 Saturday night which obviously would not be included yet and of course SUNDAY, so like I said perhaps im wrong and point out if I am, but how could anyone come  to the conclusion it'll make a total of 36 million by the end of Sunday, that means it'll make 1.8 million all day Sunday ?

Quote from: broken back on May 21, 2017, 04:20:15 PM
36 million for the three day weekend ?
I dont understand ? can someone explain to me how, whoever is out there can proclaim these numbers ? when SUNDAY isn't over yet. As of writting this these are some of america's timezones

Time in Austin Texas 11:10am  Sunday
Time in New York     12:10pm   Sunday
Time in California   9:15am       Sunday
Time in Detroit      12:15pm       Sunday

I would also like to point out Thursday nights numberes are NOT included in the 36 million and that prometheus never had thusday late night showing so if a comparison should be made, include the 4.2 million on thursday before giving up on this films chances of a sequel

Are you the same person?

PS: Prometheus did have Thursday evening showings. I went to one.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ulm on May 21, 2017, 06:00:20 PM
I can see this struggling to get past 85 mil now. Boxoffice Mojo is particularly user friendly when it comes to comparisons of other films opening weekends and how much they go on to earn. So search for 35-40 mil openers. You just have to select the 2017 yearly domestic screen and click on opening weekend at the top.

You can select previous years too. Over 40 would have been great to get to 100m.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 21, 2017, 06:07:15 PM
Quote from: Ryan741 on May 21, 2017, 04:41:58 PM
Reading Collider Fox seem kinda pleased with the performance.

lol they're not going to compromise their poker face.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 21, 2017, 06:31:31 PM
I remember after Fantastic Four was released to a critical lynching and disastrous box office result, Fox just kept on smillin' and saying that a sequel was definitely still on the cards. Then a month or so after the home release it was quietly removed from their release schedule. Can't blame them though, they have to support their product after all.

Quote from: Dino21AvP on May 21, 2017, 05:17:33 PM
I think the foreign and worldwide totals will make it successful though, especially since it had a much lower budget than Prometheus.

Only problem is that it had some massive drop-offs in the majority of foreign markets as well (compared to Prometheus). A massive 80% drop in Australia's opening weekend for example. The Asian markets are looking a bit better though, would be interesting to see how it fares in Japan and China.
Title: Re: Re: Alien: Covenant Home Releases (UK)
Post by: MnTd on May 21, 2017, 07:25:18 PM
$36 million is not great but let's see how it goes. I went to PROMETHEUS with a whole group of
friends and I asked many people to go to ALIEN COVENANT with me but many of them could
not make it, had to work, etc. - Not everyone is able to get out opening weekend.
I wish movie companies wern't so dependent on "opening weekend" numbers anyhow.
I'm sure it will do fine overseas, I'm hoping it will do better in America and I'm positive
the bluray/dvd/uhdbd and crappy streaming services will make money.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AlienFanIL17 on May 21, 2017, 07:44:20 PM
It feels like we will hopefully get one more movie, if we are lucky, to get us to the original Alien.  I would love if we got the multiple movies that Scott has been talking about.  It just doesn't seem like people, and thus the box office returns, will support that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 21, 2017, 07:57:12 PM
Quote from: AlienFanIL17 on May 21, 2017, 07:44:20 PM
It feels like we will hopefully get one more movie, if we are lucky, to get us to the original Alien.  I would love if we got the multiple movies that Scott has been talking about.  It just doesn't seem like people, and thus the box office returns, will support that.

One more movie for Ridley Scott I would say. Covenant hits all the right notes for me and I quite enjoy it but it appears people are rather divided. Still though, I think Ridley has it in him to deliver and am very intrigued to see David's story conclusion.

I might get crucified for saying this but I would be quite interested in seeing Cristopher Nolan direct an Alien film.


Edit: I think that if Ridley Scott does not shoot the Covenant follow up in a year (as he has planned) that he will be done with the Alien franchise. As young at heart as he might be, he is getting up there in years. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 21, 2017, 08:18:31 PM
AvP:R  cost 40 million? They should have bought some lights.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: zoidy on May 21, 2017, 08:22:03 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 21, 2017, 08:18:31 PM
AvP:R  cost 40 million? They should have bought some lights.

Ha! I almost spilled my bottle of brewdog there.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 21, 2017, 08:22:48 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 21, 2017, 06:31:31 PM
I remember after Fantastic Four was released to a critical lynching and disastrous box office result, Fox just kept on smillin' and saying that a sequel was definitely still on the cards. Then a month or so after the home release it was quietly removed from their release schedule. Can't blame them though, they have to support their product after all.

Quote from: Dino21AvP on May 21, 2017, 05:17:33 PM
I think the foreign and worldwide totals will make it successful though, especially since it had a much lower budget than Prometheus.

Only problem is that it had some massive drop-offs in the majority of foreign markets as well (compared to Prometheus). A massive 80% drop in Australia's opening weekend for example. The Asian markets are looking a bit better though, would be interesting to see how it fares in Japan and China.

Well i don't high hope too much on china.

1. No 3d.
2. Transformers.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AlienFanIL17 on May 21, 2017, 08:27:00 PM
@ cucuchu

"Covenant hits all the right notes for me and I quite enjoy it but it appears people are rather divided"

I really liked Covenant.  I would probably give it an 8 out 10.  My rankings would probably go Aliens, Alien, Covenant, Prometheus, Alien 3, Alien Resurrection.  Also, I think divided is an understatement, lol.

Like I said, I would love it if we got the multiple movies Scott has been talking about.  Alien is my favorite science fiction franchise.  It's better to me than Star Wars, Star Trek, etc.  I would love Alien to be able to explode to those levels of success and fan following.  I would love the two more Alien movies to get us to the original Alien.  I would love to get the two Prometheus sequels.  Give me Alien 5, 6, and 7 as well  ;D  I'll take as many Alien movies as I can get.  Even a bad Alien movie is alright in my book, because at least it's an Alien movie.

I just don't see the financials being there for Fox to give us all that.  That's why I'm just hoping we get a sequel to Covenant to get us to the original Alien.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: zoidy on May 21, 2017, 08:48:39 PM
I don't honestly think the financials will dictate another Alien film, with Scott in charge. It will probably be Scott.

Put it this way - if Covenant isn't deemed successful, Scott will still get movies greenlit. Movies with no track record or fan base. But he'll still get the chance to make them, because he is one of the a list directors, and he makes commercial not arthouse movies.

If he wants to do it, he'll get the chance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ectomorph on May 21, 2017, 09:09:56 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.
I think it's also been a slow weekend for movies, with Memorial Day weekend coming up. I worked at a cinema in high school, and I always noticed that horror films always did much better on weekdays than other movies. I think Covenant still has a chance to do well throughout the next couple of weeks. I'm hoping to see it reach the quarter-billion mark by the time it completes its run here and overseas.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 21, 2017, 09:11:00 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.

Interestingly enough, whenever I left the cinema, everyone was vocal and happy about the film. Random strangers taking to me about it as I left both times. So people in the states seem to like it from what I have seen... But that is with people familiar with the series that have probably been following the movie since it was announced. Everyone else, this seems to be flying under their radar.

Bit of a case study: A friend of mine not familiar at all with the series went with me opening night. He came over 3 hours before we were to be at the cinema so to get him caught up, I first showed him the derelict scene from Alien and then Prometheus. He enjoyed Prometheus, did not love it though. We went to see Covenant and he enjoyed it immensely and we were up till 3am talking about it afterwards. So point is that I think the movie has potential with a more general audience, the problem is that the general audience needs to be somewhat invested in the franchise to get them interested in the first place.

Word of mouth could give it some legs and a nice boost, we will just have to see.


Quote from: Ectomorph on May 21, 2017, 09:09:56 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.
I think it's also been a slow weekend for movies, with Memorial Day weekend coming up. I worked at a cinema in high school, and I always noticed that horror films always did much better on weekdays than other movies. I think Covenant still has a chance to do well throughout the next couple of weeks. I'm hoping to see it reach the quarter-billion mark by the time it completes its run here and overseas.

Hmm, memorial day weekend could give it a nice boost for sure.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 09:24:11 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.

Hicks, it hasn't.

The studio made 18 million in the US and 32 overseas (still waiting on the returns this weekend).

It has made back about half of only the production budget, not marketing/distribution, etc.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: YutaniDitch on May 21, 2017, 09:29:32 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 09:24:11 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.

Hicks, it hasn't.

The studio made 18 million in the US and 32 overseas (still waiting on the returns this weekend).

It has made back about half of only the production budget, not marketing/distribution, etc.

Still too early to call it, but do not forget the production budget is only half of the story... Marketing costs, copies, movie theaters percentage, etc... all are not contemplated... My educated guess is that 111 million is the production budget given the VFX heavy movie we got...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 09:30:16 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 09:24:11 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.

Hicks, it hasn't.

The studio made 18 million in the US and 32 overseas (still waiting on the returns this weekend).

It has made back about half of only the production budget, not marketing/distribution, etc.

I forget about the percentages thing.  :-\
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Snake on May 21, 2017, 09:30:24 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 09:24:11 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.

Hicks, it hasn't.

The studio made 18 million in the US and 32 overseas (still waiting on the returns this weekend).

It has made back about half of only the production budget, not marketing/distribution, etc.

I blame sites like imdb for this (apparently) disappointing result. All the negative reviews are on the first page; influencing all the sheeple.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 09:38:38 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 09:30:16 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 09:24:11 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 21, 2017, 08:55:32 PM
It's made back it's reported budget. So probably wants double of that with the marketing to get in the green but that's not terrible. Not great either but not terrible. Depends if it can keep momentum. The American's don't seem to be too thrilled with it so word of mouth may not be great.

Hicks, it hasn't.

The studio made 18 million in the US and 32 overseas (still waiting on the returns this weekend).

It has made back about half of only the production budget, not marketing/distribution, etc.

I forget about the percentages thing.  :-\

doesn't mean it won't...  but it does have a tough hill to climb.  All in all I think it will break even when every single revenue stream and cost is accounted for.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: ESPILFIRE on May 21, 2017, 09:40:30 PM
Bad new... I hope a better performance on box office for guarantee a sequel (and bigger budget than AC).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: DestinyCaptain on May 21, 2017, 09:41:22 PM
Unrelated to the numbers...

At the American release day on Friday, I purchased tickets online. The theatre I chose had assigned seating.  I was able to see seat availability for each showing.

Only the 7pm showing was at 90% capacity. The 8pm showing was about half. All other showings throughout the day were reserved for less than ten people at each showing.

Just seems like there is very little enthusiasm for this film. Dunno.

I was surprised at the lack of turnout. The theatre I chose also caters to geeks and the like. There was hardly any presence there compared to other recent big nam releases I have been to recently.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dallevalle on May 21, 2017, 09:46:13 PM
nice numbers proud of you Ridley Scott
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 21, 2017, 09:59:23 PM
When will we get hard numbers for total WW box office for this weekend and prior? I see a lot of speculative numbers.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 21, 2017, 10:07:39 PM
It's good numbers.

But Sir Ridley Scott would probably left the franchise.

His biggest hit(THE MARTIAN) is most successful than any ALIEN movie ever.

Sir Ridley Scott doesn't need all of this huge drama. He has better projects.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mr. Forest on May 21, 2017, 10:24:53 PM
So Covenant opened to about $15 million less than Prometheus and even about $2 million less than the first AVP film.  I don't see it doing well with Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man Tell No Tales opening next week and Wonder Woman opening the week after.  Add to the very divisive reaction from audiences, I think Covenant is going to end up under performing to Fox's expectations.  I wouldn't be surprised of Scott just gives up and Fox ends up putting the franchise on ice for a few years.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 10:41:59 PM
Has anyone posted a number of screens it was released on yet?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 10:44:24 PM
3,761 screens.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 21, 2017, 10:47:47 PM
Next week it goes head to head with Baywatch, which shouldn't be a big problem, but Pirates of the Caribbean 6 or whatever number they're on will unfortunately draw a lot of moviegoers away from A:C. :(
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: razeak on May 21, 2017, 10:48:18 PM
I went to the 945 showing and there were about 15 people total. I had 4 in my group. I have never been to a showing that starts that late before. It was Friday. On the way out I was eavesdropping and a 16-17 year old girl said she liked it but didn't understand some of it. The boy said there were a bunch of older movies they should watch so she'll get it.

Franchise saved. Lol. Anecdotal ftw.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 10:51:22 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 10:44:24 PM

3,761 screens,

How many for Prometheus?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 10:54:08 PM
Quote from: dallevalle on May 21, 2017, 09:46:13 PM
nice numbers proud of you Ridley Scott

They are actually not very good at all.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 10:56:25 PM
I agree I don't think they are very good either, but there's quite a number of things that decreased sales.

Mainly no 3D, few IMAX. And it's also rated R.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 10:57:07 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 10:51:22 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 10:44:24 PM

3,761 screens,

How many for Prometheus?

3,442.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 10:57:34 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 10:51:22 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 10:44:24 PM

3,761 screens,

How many for Prometheus?

3396 on OW 3442 next weekend...   covenant was the second most screens ever for an r rated film and the 55th highest opening I think?


Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 10:56:25 PM
I agree I don't think they are very good either, but there's quite a number of things that decreased sales.

Mainly no 3D, few IMAX. And it's also rated R.

The R thing isn't a big deal....   R movies easily make money now.  This ahd the second most screens ever for an R rated opening weekend and only the 55th highest opening for an R rated movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 11:00:48 PM

I guess Fox was hoping more IMAX theaters would book Covenant. I've never been to an IMAX theater, how much are tickets?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:01:28 PM
Wow then these numbers are terrible...we may want to start worrying about a sequel


Quote from: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 11:00:48 PM

I guess Fox was hoping more IMAX theaters would book Covenant. I've never been to an IMAX theater, how much are tickets?

Almost double a movie ticket
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 11:11:19 PM

It's very frustrating that movie has under performed, but like Prometheus it can't seem to reach the mainstream audience. I thought the positive reviews were bring them in for sure. I'm not even sure it will make it's money back in the States. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dookie on May 21, 2017, 11:12:32 PM
Ridley was right: the xeno was cooked. And to exacerbate matters, they completely butchered and discarded of the single most captivating aspect of these prequels in the engineers.

Good riddance. You reap what you sow.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 21, 2017, 11:17:42 PM
Oh man, I'm getting very worried.  :-[   Covenant isn't perfect, but I think Ridley deserves to finish this story.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 11:22:17 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 10:51:22 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 10:44:24 PM

3,761 screens,

How many for Prometheus?
Not sure, looks like Prometheus opened on 3,396 screens in North America.  Keep in mind inflation. AvP made a couple million more in 2004 dollars and premiered on almost the same number of screens (3,395) and didn't have any premium format showings like IMAX.

These numbers definitely aren't great.  Even the estimate of $40 million is probably far below what Fox hoped for when they decided to make the movie.

As Pierre said, Ridley has better things to do.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:25:19 PM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Pretty much 30% decline from Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 11:31:04 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:25:19 PM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Pretty much 30% decline from Prometheus.
When you adjust for inflation, maybe, yeah. Even when you take into account that Covenant cost less, this one still appears to be performing below Prometheus.  AvP was probably massively more successful due to the budget.  I expect the next Alien movie will have a similar sized budget to AvP, and someone other than Ridley Scott directing. Jake Scott?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:40:31 PM
Quote from: dookie on May 21, 2017, 11:12:32 PM
Ridley was right: the xeno was cooked. And to exacerbate matters, they completely butchered and discarded of the single most captivating aspect of these prequels in the engineers.

Good riddance. You reap what you sow.

I disagree. The xeno wasn't used properly here that's all.

Another thing I wanted to add. I know RT has a fresh rating, but most YouTube reviews for the movie pretty negative.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 11:44:45 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 11:31:04 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:25:19 PM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Pretty much 30% decline from Prometheus.
When you adjust for inflation, maybe, yeah. Even when you take into account that Covenant cost less, this one still appears to be performing below Prometheus.  AvP was probably massively more successful due to the budget.  I expect the next Alien movie will have a similar sized budget to AvP, and someone other than Ridley Scott directing. Jake Scott?

Ridley will probably have to condense the two other films into one. The story will probably go back to spaceship horror too.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 21, 2017, 11:47:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 11:31:04 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:25:19 PM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Pretty much 30% decline from Prometheus.
When you adjust for inflation, maybe, yeah. Even when you take into account that Covenant cost less, this one still appears to be performing below Prometheus.  AvP was probably massively more successful due to the budget.  I expect the next Alien movie will have a similar sized budget to AvP, and someone other than Ridley Scott directing. Jake Scott?

Hi Elijah;
From box office mojo;
- AVP did alright.
Production Budget: $60 million
Worldwide box office: $172,544,654   
That is box office which is about 2.87 times the production budget

Compare that with "Covenant" after its first weekend in the US. Realize it will make more money in theaters after this.
Production Budget: $97 million
To match AVP multiply that by 2.87 which = about $278 million.
I'm certain that "Covenant" will make more than that in theaters.
Currently its Worldwide box office is at:    $117,881,862.
And there is a long way to go.

;)   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 21, 2017, 11:58:08 PM
The xeno isn't cooked. It's just not all you should offer. This movie was very reactionary in the same way AvPR was. How do you go from Prometheus to a couple of CGI xenos...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Game_Over_Man on May 22, 2017, 12:01:12 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

Globally the takings are just under $120m. The movie's budget is estimated no more than $110m...I'd say it's made it's money back. WITH DVD/RENTALS you're looking around $300m - ok, not as strong as Prometheus, but by no means a flop.

Alien 5 probably coming sooner than we think, for Fox's sake.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 12:02:44 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 21, 2017, 11:44:45 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 11:31:04 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:25:19 PM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Pretty much 30% decline from Prometheus.
When you adjust for inflation, maybe, yeah. Even when you take into account that Covenant cost less, this one still appears to be performing below Prometheus.  AvP was probably massively more successful due to the budget.  I expect the next Alien movie will have a similar sized budget to AvP, and someone other than Ridley Scott directing. Jake Scott?

Ridley will probably have to condense the two other films into one. The story will probably go back to spaceship horror too.

This.

I can see them making one more. There is still a way to keep the David storyline and allow for the origination of the alien to be a bit more....well, alien. All is not lost and there is a silver lining to this so long as it does not completely flop and lose Fox a ton of money. Ridley Scott will be forced to answer to critism, which is good, and hopefully he can still work in his obvious true passion element of this - the story of David.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 12:05:51 AM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 22, 2017, 12:01:12 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

Globally the takings are just under $120m. The movie's budget is estimated no more than $110m...I'd say it's made it's money back. WITH DVD/RENTALS you're looking around $300m - ok, not as strong as Prometheus, but by no means a flop.

Alien 5 probably coming sooner than we think, for Fox's sake.

That isn't how it works.  The studio gets 50% of the domestic take and 40% of foreign...  33% of china.

So no, it has not even made half it's production cost back.  Let alon marketing and distribution which is another 100+.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 22, 2017, 12:26:28 AM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 22, 2017, 12:01:12 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

Globally the takings are just under $120m. The movie's budget is estimated no more than $110m...I'd say it's made it's money back. WITH DVD/RENTALS you're looking around $300m - ok, not as strong as Prometheus, but by no means a flop.

Alien 5 probably coming sooner than we think, for Fox's sake.
This. Even without taking into account DVD/rentals,300M is totally possible and I don't see how it could be considered a flop. Correct me if I'm wrong but Prometheus wasn't released in China. This has that market too,and the budget is considerably lower.
From Forbes:
QuoteThe good news is that 20th Century Fox and friends spent just $97 million on this picture, as opposed to the $130m that was spent on Prometheus. A 25% smaller budget means they can afford to make a lot less money here and abroad and still come out okay. The film received mixed-positive reviews and may yet triumph overseas. If the film has the same post-weekend legs as Prometheus than we're looking at an $88m domestic total. However, if it's as frontloaded as Alien vs. Predator then it'll be a $76m total which will put it below the domestic cumes of Prometheus ($126m), Aliens ($86m) and Alien ($78m). Again, this isn't a code red catastrophe, especially if it plays well outside of North America.

I don't have overseas figures at the moment, but an eventual over/under $300 million worldwide gross for an R-rated Alien movie shouldn't be taken as a defeat, but rather a sign that these films don't justify bigger budgets.

Sure,a 40M opening would have been better,but 36M is not a bad result at all for R-rated sci-fi horror that is part of a niche franchise. Also,it's not released in 3D and the number of IMAX screens is really lower than Prometheus. But that's not even the most important reason why Prometheus and A:C shouldn't be compared. Prometheus was treated as an event. Forbes' BO analyst is also right with his argument about the whole  promotion. Prometheus was promoted as an original sci-fi thriller that can appeal to a wider audience. Also,Deadline pointed out that there's definitely confusion for the average moviegoer. Mixed reactions on social media -Prometheus sequel..uhm,no,it's an Alien film,and so on- didn't help either.

BTW,it's still very strange that Fox didn't leave it in August. It would have done much better. The real problem is not the opening number,but the insane competion in the next weeks.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 12:27:42 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 12:05:51 AM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 22, 2017, 12:01:12 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

Globally the takings are just under $120m. The movie's budget is estimated no more than $110m...I'd say it's made it's money back. WITH DVD/RENTALS you're looking around $300m - ok, not as strong as Prometheus, but by no means a flop.

Alien 5 probably coming sooner than we think, for Fox's sake.

That isn't how it works.  The studio gets 50% of the domestic take and 40% of foreign...  33% of china.

So no, it has not even made half it's production cost back.  Let alon marketing and distribution which is another 100+.

So that mean Fox get 18,000,000 on Domestic and 49,129,117.2 on Foreign.

= 67,129,117.2
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 22, 2017, 12:35:18 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 12:05:51 AM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 22, 2017, 12:01:12 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

Globally the takings are just under $120m. The movie's budget is estimated no more than $110m...I'd say it's made it's money back. WITH DVD/RENTALS you're looking around $300m - ok, not as strong as Prometheus, but by no means a flop.

Alien 5 probably coming sooner than we think, for Fox's sake.

That isn't how it works.  The studio gets 50% of the domestic take and 40% of foreign...  33% of china.

So no, it has not even made half it's production cost back.  Let alon marketing and distribution which is another 100+.
Right,but this is just the second week.. IF it makes 300M,the studio will make some profit too. Also,I really doubt they've spent 100+ for marketing and distribution. It'd be insane with that budget. And while the marketing was good (imo),nothing I saw can justify that number. Funnily enugh,I see people saying that they didn't even know the movie was coming out and that the marketing was horrible lol.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 12:39:54 AM
They spent $22.35 million on tv ads alone.

And if people still don't know about this movie, then Fox failed miserably in getting the word out there. Personally, I don't think they did. I think GoTG2 is what people want to see more of. Covenant is very grim, and that could hurt its take in as well.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 12:40:20 AM
Just to clarify, is everyone going off the 110 million budget stated by Ridley Scott or the 90-something million budget reported last week?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 12:40:56 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 22, 2017, 12:35:18 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 12:05:51 AM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 22, 2017, 12:01:12 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

Globally the takings are just under $120m. The movie's budget is estimated no more than $110m...I'd say it's made it's money back. WITH DVD/RENTALS you're looking around $300m - ok, not as strong as Prometheus, but by no means a flop.

Alien 5 probably coming sooner than we think, for Fox's sake.

That isn't how it works.  The studio gets 50% of the domestic take and 40% of foreign...  33% of china.

So no, it has not even made half it's production cost back.  Let alon marketing and distribution which is another 100+.
Right,but this is just the second week.. IF it makes 300M,the studio will make some profit too. Also,I really doubt they've spent 100+ for marketing and distribution. It'd be insane with that budget. And while the marketing was good (imo),nothing I saw can justify that number. Funnily enugh,I see people saying that they didn't even know the movie was coming out and that the marketing was horrible lol.

It was easily 100 million in advertising.  Ads on tv are EXPENSIVE and they were everywhere.  Your own individual idiosyncratic experiences aren't what actually happened.  It's like people claiming their theater was packed so it had to have made a lot.  It didn't.  It did the very low end of the prediction band.

If it makes 300 million that means the domestic take was likely small.  If the split is 80- vs 220 that means the studio took in about 125 million.  That is not enough to come close to breaking even at the box office.  Now there are other revenue streams but there are additional costs associated with them as well.  Prometheus made about 40 million in physical media sales but there was a cost to produce, advertise and distribute those as well. 

In the end, Covenant might break even.  Which is certainly a major disappointment for the studio that thought they had figured out why Prometheus wasn't the hit they expected.

QuoteJust to clarify, is everyone going off the 110 million budget stated by Ridley Scott or the 90-something million budget reported last week?

For strict production, it's the 97 or whatever.  Overall that won't really matter BO wise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 12:41:37 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 12:39:54 AM

They spent $22.35 million on tv ads alone.

Are TV ads not the bulk of marketting costs?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 12:43:53 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 12:41:37 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 12:39:54 AM

They spent $22.35 million on tv ads alone.

Are TV ads not the bulk of marketting costs?

There are lots of ways marketing and distributing come into play but tv ads are likely the largest single expense (outside of the murky world of distribution).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 22, 2017, 12:47:34 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 12:39:54 AM
They spent $22.35 million on tv ads alone.

And if people still don't know about this movie, then Fox failed miserably in getting the word out there. Personally, I don't think they did. I think GoTG2 is what people want to see more of. Covenant is very grim, and that could hurt its take in as well.

If $22.35 million is the TV ad number for "Covenant", then the total marketing budget for the movie will not be more than $50 million.
This reasonable cost would be more support that "Covenant" should make a profit in theaters.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 01:07:01 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 22, 2017, 12:47:34 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 12:39:54 AM
They spent $22.35 million on tv ads alone.

And if people still don't know about this movie, then Fox failed miserably in getting the word out there. Personally, I don't think they did. I think GoTG2 is what people want to see more of. Covenant is very grim, and that could hurt its take in as well.


If $22.35 million is the TV ad number for "Covenant", then the total marketing budget for the movie will not be more than $50 million.
This reasonable cost would be more support that "Covenant" should make a profit in theaters.

;)

I'm sorry but you are just wrong. The marketing and distribution was very much in line with known 100 million dollar efforts.

It is what it is. Honestly the ad cost is much higher than other large tentople 100-150 million dollar campaigns.

Covenant will most likely not make any profit at all in the theatres. Normally that isn't a huge deal but they really think they have a tent pole franchise here and they thought they had fixed their problems with Prometheus under performing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 22, 2017, 01:08:07 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 21, 2017, 11:47:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 11:31:04 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:25:19 PM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Pretty much 30% decline from Prometheus.
When you adjust for inflation, maybe, yeah. Even when you take into account that Covenant cost less, this one still appears to be performing below Prometheus.  AvP was probably massively more successful due to the budget.  I expect the next Alien movie will have a similar sized budget to AvP, and someone other than Ridley Scott directing. Jake Scott?

Hi Elijah;
From box office mojo;
- AVP did alright.
Production Budget: $60 million
Worldwide box office: $172,544,654   
That is box office which is about 2.87 times the production budget

Compare that with "Covenant" after its first weekend in the US. Realize it will make more money in theaters after this.
Production Budget: $97 million
To match AVP multiply that by 2.87 which = about $278 million.
I'm certain that "Covenant" will make more than that in theaters.
Currently its Worldwide box office is at:    $117,881,862.
And there is a long way to go.

;)
True, but I was only looking at opening weekends, because those are the only numbers we have.  In terms of opening weekends, AvP did substantially better, nearly $12 million more when adjusted for inflation.  It's $13 million below Prometheus, and it's dropping faster, too...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 22, 2017, 01:14:27 AM
I think the amount of money they lose on Pirates in 2 weeks will make these numbers low.

I know I have said this a lot, but this summer movie is slated to lose more money than any other summer.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 01:16:40 AM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 22, 2017, 01:14:27 AM
I think the amount of money they lose on Pirates in 2 weeks will make these numbers low.

I know I have said this a lot, but this summer movie is slated to lose more money than any other summer.

I don't know if pirates will bomb or not. Over seas they consistently pull in a massive amount of money. They are usually 1 billion world wide.

Plus their media sales and toy lines are huge revenue streams.

You could be right though. Depp is not on a great streak recently
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 22, 2017, 01:21:08 AM
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/hollywood-braces-big-decline-at-summer-box-office-1001473
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 22, 2017, 01:24:03 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 22, 2017, 01:08:07 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 21, 2017, 11:47:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 21, 2017, 11:31:04 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 21, 2017, 11:25:19 PM
http://deadline.com/2017/05/alien-covenant-diary-of-a-wimpy-kid-everything-everything-box-office-previews-1202097673/

Pretty much 30% decline from Prometheus.
When you adjust for inflation, maybe, yeah. Even when you take into account that Covenant cost less, this one still appears to be performing below Prometheus.  AvP was probably massively more successful due to the budget.  I expect the next Alien movie will have a similar sized budget to AvP, and someone other than Ridley Scott directing. Jake Scott?

Hi Elijah;
From box office mojo;
- AVP did alright.
Production Budget: $60 million
Worldwide box office: $172,544,654   
That is box office which is about 2.87 times the production budget

Compare that with "Covenant" after its first weekend in the US. Realize it will make more money in theaters after this.
Production Budget: $97 million
To match AVP multiply that by 2.87 which = about $278 million.
I'm certain that "Covenant" will make more than that in theaters.
Currently its Worldwide box office is at:    $117,881,862.
And there is a long way to go.

;)
True, but I was only looking at opening weekends, because those are the only numbers we have.  In terms of opening weekends, AvP did substantially better, nearly $12 million more when adjusted for inflation.  It's $13 million below Prometheus, and it's dropping faster, too...

Yes Elijah, but in the end the number which counts the most is the final box office.
I know that overall "Covenant" will not do as well as "Prometheus". 
But can "Covenant" do as well as "Passengers" which made $300 million? I think so.

That's all "Covenant" needs to get to, $300 million, to have a clear profit and then there will probably be another Alien film.
We will see.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ultramorph on May 22, 2017, 01:25:38 AM
I'm starting to worry this is going to be the end of the franchise.  :'(
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 01:30:58 AM
Quote from: Ultramorph on May 22, 2017, 01:25:38 AM
I'm starting to worry this is going to be the end of the franchise.  :'(

Not even close. It won't even be the end of Ridley making another I bet, and probably in a similar time line as he has planned.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 01:58:03 AM
I don't like these numbers. If we don't get Ridleys complete trilogy, I'll fall into depression
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AGuy on May 22, 2017, 02:08:46 AM
20th Century Fox very much wants to keep working with Ridley Scott. He's one of the few sure bets in the film world because he's one of the few filmmakers who does pictures of this size while still able to stay tightly on schedule & often under budget. If any other name filmmaker had been given THE MARTIAN they would have needed a $150 million budget.  Scott did it for just slightly north of $100 million.   Fox has produced/released every film he has done since PROMETHEUS in 2012 because there's very little risk of production woes leading to budget inflations.  They give him a number for a movie one year and two years later they just have to overcome that number in profit and they're good.  They won't be doing ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD with him but they still very much want Scott to direct THE CARTEL & that BATTLE OF BRITAIN film.  I'm sure an easy agreement can be made that Scott will do those films for Fox after he completes his ALIEN/DAVID saga.

I think the only real change is there won't be any more talk of "Doing four or six sequels".   I think next time someone interviews Scott about the future of the Alien series he'll openly say something along the lines of "We're doing one more.  We'll wrap up the David story & it will tie into the original Alien."  Which as much as I've liked/loved PROMETHEUS & ALIEN: COVENANT would be for the best.  Three films is a nice number.   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 02:11:46 AM
Quote from: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 01:58:03 AM
I don't like these numbers. If we don't get Ridleys complete trilogy, I'll fall into depression

The movie is not flopping that badly, and maybe not at all. The story will be completed I'm sure, the question is with what compromises. It will most likely be only one film now connecting to Alien after Covenant and Fox will likely have Ridley Scott ensure it meets a more broad appeal.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 22, 2017, 02:26:48 AM
They really thought RUN HIDE PRAY and a xenomorph would cure what ailed us. Yeesh.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 02:42:54 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 02:11:46 AM
Quote from: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 01:58:03 AM
I don't like these numbers. If we don't get Ridleys complete trilogy, I'll fall into depression

The movie is not flopping that badly, and maybe not at all. The story will be completed I'm sure, the question is with what compromises. It will most likely be only one film now connecting to Alien after Covenant and Fox will likely have Ridley Scott ensure it meets a more broad appeal.

go action route like aliens ? i don't think he okay with that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 03:09:42 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 02:42:54 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 02:11:46 AM
Quote from: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 01:58:03 AM
I don't like these numbers. If we don't get Ridleys complete trilogy, I'll fall into depression

The movie is not flopping that badly, and maybe not at all. The story will be completed I'm sure, the question is with what compromises. It will most likely be only one film now connecting to Alien after Covenant and Fox will likely have Ridley Scott ensure it meets a more broad appeal.

go action route like aliens ? i don't think he okay with that.

There are other ways, so long as you have some decent set pieces and a substantial payoff towards the end (like the queen in Aliens). Not saying it needs to be that, but just something that leaves people in awe. And for the love of all that is decent, no more aliens getting shot out of airlocks or impaling themselves.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: jonathancrk on May 22, 2017, 03:17:47 AM
Ridley Scott is an industry giant, akin to a Spielberg or a Cameron (not only him as a director, but as a producer for his film/TV company and his advertising business. If he wants to continue doing Alien films, I frankly think the studio will let him do it. The only question will be how much budget will be allocated to him, and I doubt that would be an issue since he's very well-known to keep costs within or below budget. That's why I think the studios trust him, regardless of whether his films make money or not. Plus Scott's films tend to have a long shelf-life in ancillary industries such as DVDs/Blu-Rays. If he wants to do a Director's Cut of Alien: Covenant (or even Prometheus), it's likely these versions will sell well.

I really wouldn't worry too much about the box office performance right now. It's probably likely at worst the film will break even and make money via TV rights or off-line media. The bulk of the box office will likely be taken from overseas too.

Just my two-cents worth ...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 22, 2017, 03:20:46 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 12:39:54 AM
They spent $22.35 million on tv ads alone.

And if people still don't know about this movie, then Fox failed miserably in getting the word out there. Personally, I don't think they did. I think GoTG2 is what people want to see more of. Covenant is very grim, and that could hurt its take in as well.
I don't think they did either. It was just an example to explain that while we're talking about huge marketing costs,there're actually people-and I'm talking about "BO junkies"- who consider the marketing poor. I also agree about GOTG. It's true that it's the third week,but it's a family-friendly movie. It's the kind of films that many people choose to see in theaters with their children. The more adult-oriented stuff is watched at home because tickets are increasingly expensive.



Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 01:07:01 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 22, 2017, 12:47:34 AM
Quote from: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 12:39:54 AM
They spent $22.35 million on tv ads alone.

And if people still don't know about this movie, then Fox failed miserably in getting the word out there. Personally, I don't think they did. I think GoTG2 is what people want to see more of. Covenant is very grim, and that could hurt its take in as well.


If $22.35 million is the TV ad number for "Covenant", then the total marketing budget for the movie will not be more than $50 million.
This reasonable cost would be more support that "Covenant" should make a profit in theaters.

;)

I'm sorry but you are just wrong. The marketing and distribution was very much in line with known 100 million dollar efforts.

It is what it is. Honestly the ad cost is much higher than other large tentople 100-150 million dollar campaigns.

Covenant will most likely not make any profit at all in the theatres. Normally that isn't a huge deal but they really think they have a tent pole franchise here and they thought they had fixed their problems with Prometheus under performing.

If you've some sources,I'd like to see them. 22M for tv ads seems reasonable enough. Now,my point was that I don't really think they've spent that much on marketing,above all when they've kept budget costs much lower than Prometheus.
Also,Prometheus is seen as a profitable movie and a financial success for the franchise. I've never seen anyone claiming that Prometheus undeperformed,because the Alien franchise has always been a niche franchise. Its 50M opening was considered a very good result and this gives a precise idea about what were the real expectations. The point is that,higher budget aside,they surely spent a lot of money on marketing. Also,the movie performed well but if I recall correctly was also quite frontloaded with considerable drops. So,the final gross was still on the "positive/it's a success"  side,but there were already signes that didn't inspire much confidence (besides the mixed reactions).
For this reason I can see Fox trying to keep all the marketing costs much lower than Prometheus.
I'm calculating the break even point with the usual 2,5X budget rule,which is not perfect science,of course. And we should also keep in mind that a studio like Fox has many backdoor deals as well.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: whiterabbit on May 22, 2017, 03:31:53 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 01:30:58 AM
Quote from: Ultramorph on May 22, 2017, 01:25:38 AM
I'm starting to worry this is going to be the end of the franchise.  :'(

Not even close. It won't even be the end of Ridley making another I bet, and probably in a similar time line as he has planned.
I think there will be at least one more but yea, I'm worried too.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 04:03:11 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

I suppose you are happy.

I really doubt they greenlight Neil Blomkamp version.

They are going to kill Alien franchise for 5-7 years.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: MrRipley on May 22, 2017, 09:30:44 AM
It sort of made 40 mill the other 4 mill came from previews so some people saw it v early.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 22, 2017, 09:39:36 AM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
... if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

Get away from my Zimmer frame you bitch!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 09:53:46 AM
"Aliens" make franchise popular fox would not let ridley do that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 22, 2017, 10:01:05 AM
I will hold a similar stance to David in regard to the worth of humanity if the Angry Joe's of this world get their way.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:16:29 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 04:03:11 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

I suppose you are happy.

I really doubt they greenlight Neil Blomkamp version.

They are going to kill Alien franchise for 5-7 years.

I saw it and liked it. I would prefer it make a large profit and garauntee the future of the franchise.

But numbers are what they are. There is no point in pretending it's a different outcome.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 22, 2017, 10:24:12 AM
So it's sleeper - seemingly misunderstood. Similar to the reaction to Blade Runner, but back then you didn't get the social media bile.

Cult classic then.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 10:25:37 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:16:29 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 04:03:11 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 21, 2017, 11:14:09 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 21, 2017, 11:06:11 PM
It's made it's budget back, but Fox will no doubt be interfering in the follow up big time. I'll be surprised if Ridley directs again - he'll be producer of course, but I can see Nicolas Refn or even Matt Reeves sinking their teeth into this.

A:C isn't a poor film, it's just average with some intriguing moments. But if you really want to re-ignite the franchise, you need Ripley back for one last stand, one last battle against the xeno's...and the corporate suits!

No, it did not.  People need to stop saying this...   it hasn't made half of it back of just the production cost, let alone advertising and distribution.

I suppose you are happy.

I really doubt they greenlight Neil Blomkamp version.

They are going to kill Alien franchise for 5-7 years.

I saw it and liked it. I would prefer it make a large profit and garauntee the future of the franchise.

But numbers are what they are. There is no point in pretending it's a different outcome.

Is possible that fox will do sequel on Netflix ? instead Cinema ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:28:44 AM
Quote from: Gash on May 22, 2017, 10:24:12 AM
So it's sleeper - seemingly misunderstood. Similar to the reaction to Blade Runner, but back then you didn't get the social media bile.

Cult classic then.

Slow down. Let's not assume it's a cult classic. A film has to actually earn that.

This is also not a sleeper. That term is used to define surprise hits that you never realized made as much money as they did and never had quite the hype.

This had a lot of expectations and it didn't make a lot so far.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 10:57:58 AM
So much doom and gloom here...

Why are people assuming the franchise is dead if it doesn't make a lot of money or just breaks even? (even loses a bit, worst case scenario which I don't see happening) Ridley Scott is intent on finishing this and he has a lot of say in what movies get made at 20th Century Fox. The only thing in question now would be all the multiple movies he wants to complete...They may now force him to just do one Alien movie between Covenant and Alien '79 to tie it all up and be done with that project. They will likely have Ridley Scott make it appeal more to the mass audience and there will likely be some compromises. Then in a few years time, I am sure some new director/screenwriter will propose a new direction to the franchise that appeals to Fox and they will be at it again. Saying "death of a franchise" over a movie doing less than ideal, but not terrible, and probably breaking even and making a little profit when its all said and done is a bit hyperbolic in my opinion.

Any update to WW numbers over the weekend?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on May 22, 2017, 11:45:44 AM
I think A:C will hold up pretty well next weekend since so many people go to the movies over the holiday weekend. I'm sure that's why they moved up the release date, to have it smack in the middle of all the blockbusters so when a movie is sold out folks on line will decide to check out A:C instead. I anticipate it'll do business close to Prometheus (which will be nearly as good, if not better, since Prometheus got to "cheat" with 3D and IMAX pricing).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 11:49:28 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 10:57:58 AM
So much doom and gloom here...

Why are people assuming the franchise is dead if it doesn't make a lot of money or just breaks even? (even loses a bit, worst case scenario which I don't see happening) Ridley Scott is intent on finishing this and he has a lot of say in what movies get made at 20th Century Fox. The only thing in question now would be all the multiple movies he wants to complete...They may now force him to just do one Alien movie between Covenant and Alien '79 to tie it all up and be done with that project. They will likely have Ridley Scott make it appeal more to the mass audience and there will likely be some compromises. Then in a few years time, I am sure some new director/screenwriter will propose a new direction to the franchise that appeals to Fox and they will be at it again. Saying "death of a franchise" over a movie doing less than ideal, but not terrible, and probably breaking even and making a little profit when its all said and done is a bit hyperbolic in my opinion.

Any update to WW numbers over the weekend?

Business that why, doesn't matter how good or bad we will see a bunch of sequel as long as movies make profitable.

Quote from: shawsbaby on May 22, 2017, 11:45:44 AM
I think A:C will hold up pretty well next weekend since so many people go to the movies over the holiday weekend. I'm sure that's why they moved up the release date, to have it smack in the middle of all the blockbusters so when a movie is sold out folks on line will decide to check out A:C instead. I anticipate it'll do business close to Prometheus (which will be nearly as good, if not better, since Prometheus got to "cheat" with 3D and IMAX pricing).

I don't think so .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 22, 2017, 11:50:55 AM
Frankly I find this desperation over box office receipts a bit sad. It's almost like widespread appeal is some justification for having an opinion on whether this film is any good or not. It's like viewing the film as a hurdle to the next sequel, rather than a film that can be appreciated on it's own merits - of which there are plenty IMHO.

I hope Ridley gets to make another because I like his approach better than any other director who's been involved, but if it has to end with David drifting into deep space with sleeping humans at his mercy, that's a fittingly bleak and sombre conclusion. The mystery of what then lies between Covenant and ALIEN is all the more lovecraftian. I can live with that more happily than Fox sliding Blomkamp into the saddle to appease the indefensible Angry Joe brigade.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 11:55:43 AM
Quote from: Gash on May 22, 2017, 11:50:55 AM
Frankly I find this desperation over box office receipts a bit sad. It's almost like widespread appeal is some justification for having an opinion on whether this film is any good or not. It's like viewing the film as a hurdle to the next sequel, rather than a film that can be appreciated on it's own merits - of which there are plenty IMHO.

I hope Ridley gets to make another because I like his approach better than any other director who's been involved, but if it has to end with David drifting into deep space with sleeping humans at his mercy, that's a fittingly bleak and sombre conclusion. The mystery of what then lies between Covenant and ALIEN is all the more lovecraftian. I can live with that more happily than Fox sliding Blomkamp into the saddle to appease the indefensible Angry Joe brigade.

Problem is Fox own franchise not Ridley So they can do whatever they want.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 11:55:59 AM
Quote from: Gash on May 22, 2017, 11:50:55 AM
Frankly I find this desperation over box office receipts a bit sad. It's almost like widespread appeal is some justification for having an opinion on whether this film is any good or not. It's like viewing the film as a hurdle to the next sequel, rather than a film that can be appreciated on it's own merits - of which there are plenty IMHO.

I hope Ridley gets to make another because I like his approach better than any other director who's been involved, but if it has to end with David drifting into deep space with sleeping humans at his mercy, that's a fittingly bleak and sombre conclusion. The mystery of what then lies between Covenant and ALIEN is all the more lovecraftian. I can live with that more happily than Fox sliding Blomkamp into the saddle to appease the indefensible Angry Joe brigade.

I think people want good reviews and high box office returns to justify their love for a film or franchise.  They want to feel that other people like the things they like.

There is the other side where if a movie doesn't make enough money, the studio won't move forward with the series.  While that's depressing, that's the nature of a company investing two hundred million dollars+ in a product.  They don't want to break even and they especially don't want to lose money.

Overall people should like whatever they like.  If all the reviews suck, so be it.  If it bombs so be it.  You should still find the same amount of joy/interest in the movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 22, 2017, 12:06:44 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 11:55:43 AM

Problem is Fox own franchise not Ridley So they can do whatever they want without Ridley.

Sure they can, they made AvP after all, and they might make more money aiming it at Angry Joe types.

I'll just watch whatever Ridley makes next - Getty - Battle of Britian? and drift away from AvP Galaxy and leave it to people who like whatever Fox thinks the most vocal fanboys want. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Naf Neila on May 22, 2017, 12:06:46 PM
@Gash

The Angry Joe brigade is right about these prequels
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 12:10:21 PM
Quote from: shawsbaby on May 22, 2017, 11:45:44 AM
I think A:C will hold up pretty well next weekend since so many people go to the movies over the holiday weekend. I'm sure that's why they moved up the release date, to have it smack in the middle of all the blockbusters so when a movie is sold out folks on line will decide to check out A:C instead. I anticipate it'll do business close to Prometheus (which will be nearly as good, if not better, since Prometheus got to "cheat" with 3D and IMAX pricing).

We will see but judging by the front loaded nature of the weekend, it doesn't bode well for the long term prospects.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 22, 2017, 12:29:31 PM
having it released in over 50 odd terrotries did'nt seem to help it much over the weekend either. .amounting to an extra 30 mil. .right now things is not looking great. .one can only pray it has very long legs!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 12:45:19 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 22, 2017, 12:29:31 PM
having it released in over 50 odd terrotries did'nt seem to help it much over the weekend either. .amounting to an extra 30 mil. .right now things is not looking great. .one can only pray it has very long legs!


Where are you seeing the WW numbers?

Edit: Nevermind, found it


https://www.google.com/amp/variety.com/2017/film/news/box-office-alien-covenant-global-1202439281/amp/
(https://www.google.com/amp/variety.com/2017/film/news/box-office-alien-covenant-global-1202439281/amp/)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 12:56:13 PM
I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if Gaurdians ends up pipping it to number 1 when the actuals are released....

Meanwhile it's been no 1 for two weekends here in the UK
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 22, 2017, 01:00:40 PM
. .i wonder if they will ever do an animated series. .i know about the comics, but an actual animated series or movie might be a nice conselation in the event that we don't get a sequal to covenant. .


Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 12:56:13 PM
I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if Gaurdians ends up pipping it to number 1 when the actuals are released....

Meanwhile it's been no 1 for two weekends here in the UK
. .when is the actuals supposed to get released?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 01:21:53 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 22, 2017, 01:00:40 PM
. .i wonder if they will ever do an animated series. .i know about the comics, but an actual animated series or movie might be a nice conselation in the event that we don't get a sequal to covenant. .


Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 12:56:13 PM
I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if Gaurdians ends up pipping it to number 1 when the actuals are released....

Meanwhile it's been no 1 for two weekends here in the UK
. .when is the actuals supposed to get released?

Later today.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ryan741 on May 22, 2017, 01:27:05 PM
I despise Angry Joe.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 22, 2017, 01:36:02 PM
. .does these actuals ever really differ much?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 01:37:51 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 22, 2017, 01:36:02 PM
. .does these actuals ever really differ much?

They can, but in virtually every case it is a marginal change, if any.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 02:08:31 PM
 Sorry to ask again (For sure) but How much does a movie need to gross to be break-even ?

300 ? 400 ?

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 02:12:33 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 02:08:31 PM
Ask again ? How much does a movie need to gross to be break-even ?

300 ? 400 ?

If it wants to do it on straight box office...   a lot...  450+.  There are other revenue streams and the under performing box office will be off set through other means, most likely.  The box office is still king though and Fox will definitely take notice of this not being the tent pole franchise they thought it was.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Fire Marshall Bill on May 22, 2017, 02:14:02 PM
Covenant had the most promo, trailers, and footage before its release out of any movie this year that I can remember honestly, and to be quite frank it flopped here in America. 36 million isn't too good and when numbers tally up may not even take over gotg2 for this weekend, was that close according to comingsoon.net. Mixed to bad reviews I think killed this plus the fact that they prolly over estimated the public even wanting another alien movie. Die hard fans will always want more alien films, its just what we do. Everyone else apparently could care less and it showed. I know there is no 3D so that kinda of deflates numbers but it is im IMAX where I happened to see it for 21 bucks and still should have made more money. The suits definitely cannot be pleased with this past weekends numbers that's for sure. I could care less about how well it does to be honest only for the simple reason to get another movie. Hopefully they let him wrap it up with the last film but I seriously doubt they will allow or green light 2 more sequels/prequels like he had been saying. Even Ridley has to be kind of shocked and disappointed with the numbers as he was boasting before its release that he would immediately try to start production on the next film, as if to say I know covenant will be a hit so I'm gonna go right into the next one. I don't know if it will be that simple now. They really need to listen to the criticism on the cgi and pacing of movie. They cannot satisfy everyone's wishes for what the sequel is to bring, but the consensus is the cgi looked bad at times and the pacing of the movie in third act was way too fast. I think if he is allowed to follow covenant up within a year and some change like he said he would like, he should very well pay close attention to what people attacked about covenant. Covenant was great until honestly David saved them imo. I like David in the movie, but the movie up to that point was almost flawless or reallly really good at least. Pacing was great, character interaction, atmosphere. Then once they got to citadel, the movie switched and I kinda was waiting for it to go back to the way it was on th he first half, which it never did. I did like covenant, but I can see where he messed up on it and how or why it didn't do as well as they thought it would. Gotg2 has something to do with it as well, but they wanted that spot for covenant so I'm sure they definitely anticipated it doing a lot better. Hopeful it makes up ground worldwide and they make enough to say , let him finish it
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 02:21:27 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 02:12:33 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 02:08:31 PM
Ask again ? How much does a movie need to gross to be break-even ?

300 ? 400 ?

If it wants to do it on straight box office...   a lot...  450+.  There are other revenue streams and the under performing box office will be off set through other means, most likely.  The box office is still king though and Fox will definitely take notice of this not being the tent pole franchise they thought it was.


Well that is downright damning. At this rate I don't even know if it will do 200 million at the WW box office.

Edit: Does anyone have any silver lining to add to this? Cause I don't anymore and still have yet to move past denial stage of the stages of grief with how this has turned out.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 02:28:58 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 02:21:27 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 02:12:33 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 02:08:31 PM
Ask again ? How much does a movie need to gross to be break-even ?

300 ? 400 ?

If it wants to do it on straight box office...   a lot...  450+.  There are other revenue streams and the under performing box office will be off set through other means, most likely.  The box office is still king though and Fox will definitely take notice of this not being the tent pole franchise they thought it was.


Well that is downright damning. At this rate I don't even know if it will do 200 million at the WW box office.

Edit: Does anyone have any silver lining to add to this? Cause I don't anymore and still have yet to move past denial stage of the stages of grief with how this has turned out.

I mean the silver lining is if you like the movie you liked the movie, regardless of how much it made.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: newbeing on May 22, 2017, 02:59:02 PM
yeah... if there is a next movie expect a big cut in budget and/or a PG-13 rating.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hubbs on May 22, 2017, 03:46:06 PM
Well figures are in and its not what the studios are hoping for so far, average at best. Not forgetting international figures are already in week 2.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/alien-covenant-box-office-analysis-ridley-scott-1202439346/#article-comments (http://variety.com/2017/film/news/alien-covenant-box-office-analysis-ridley-scott-1202439346/#article-comments)

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/alien-covenant/alien-covenant-stalks-top-us-box-office/ (http://www.empireonline.com/movies/alien-covenant/alien-covenant-stalks-top-us-box-office/)

Worldwide total about 117 million thus far, which is reasonable, but not great for such a franchise as this. Considering how many big flicks are coming up this doesn't look good at all.

I can't see this film holding out. It will probably get a third sequel but I'm not sure if that will survive unless Scott ties things up pretty neatly. We won't be getting 6 movies that's for sure.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 03:50:25 PM
Quote from: Hubbs on May 22, 2017, 03:46:06 PM
Well figures are in and its not what the studios are hoping for so far, average at best. Not forgetting international figures are already in week 2.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/alien-covenant-box-office-analysis-ridley-scott-1202439346/#article-comments (http://variety.com/2017/film/news/alien-covenant-box-office-analysis-ridley-scott-1202439346/#article-comments)

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/alien-covenant/alien-covenant-stalks-top-us-box-office/ (http://www.empireonline.com/movies/alien-covenant/alien-covenant-stalks-top-us-box-office/)

Worldwide total about 117 million thus far, which is reasonable, but not great for such a franchise as this. Considering how many big flicks are coming up this doesn't look good at all.

I can't see this film holding out. It will probably get a third sequel but I'm not sure if that will survive unless Scott ties things up pretty neatly. We won't be getting 6 movies that's for sure.

I think Fox has to consider if this really IS that great of a franchise...  honestly, how long ago were the great movies?  1986?  I like Prometheus but it was real 50/50 among people.  I agree that it isn't 'great'.

Financially it isn't a tent pole any more.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on May 22, 2017, 04:12:54 PM
I'm not sure what people are expecting. It's a circa 40 year old franchise, that has more in common with Halloween or Terminator, than something like Star Wars (or other big successfull franchise). It's not a film you take your family to see... and it's not a franchise that the 'kids' are going to love. The bottom line is that it needs to make more money than it cost. And then they, the bean counters, need to determine if the profit is 'worth it'.

I'd be careful what those wanting Covenant to fail wish for... they will make another film for sure, with or without Ridley Scott. And if they want more profit, they will either try and make it more accessible or reduce the budget (or both). I think Covenant is far from perfect, and I think one has to consider if an Alien film is even still relevant (without just re-making the original), but for me, it's still in a different league than the last X-Men film, Avengers Cloverfield or other.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 04:20:27 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 03:50:25 PM
Quote from: Hubbs on May 22, 2017, 03:46:06 PM
Well figures are in and its not what the studios are hoping for so far, average at best. Not forgetting international figures are already in week 2.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/alien-covenant-box-office-analysis-ridley-scott-1202439346/#article-comments (http://variety.com/2017/film/news/alien-covenant-box-office-analysis-ridley-scott-1202439346/#article-comments)

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/alien-covenant/alien-covenant-stalks-top-us-box-office/ (http://www.empireonline.com/movies/alien-covenant/alien-covenant-stalks-top-us-box-office/)

Worldwide total about 117 million thus far, which is reasonable, but not great for such a franchise as this. Considering how many big flicks are coming up this doesn't look good at all.

I can't see this film holding out. It will probably get a third sequel but I'm not sure if that will survive unless Scott ties things up pretty neatly. We won't be getting 6 movies that's for sure.

I think Fox has to consider if this really IS that great of a franchise...  honestly, how long ago were the great movies?  1986?  I like Prometheus but it was real 50/50 among people.  I agree that it isn't 'great'.

Financially it isn't a tent pole any more.

It has potential to be great, but maybe they should cater to what a more general audience will like. Maybe a movie similar to Aliens but with some horrific exposition and some kind of evolution of the aliens as we know them. I think another movie focusing on the colonial marines with a decent cast would do quite well.

I also think an HBO series focusing on Weyland-Yutani and other elements of the franchise outside of the xenomorph could do well and help. They could be involved somehow but rarely make an actual appearance and when they do, they should be just as intelligent as they are dangerous.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 22, 2017, 04:22:49 PM
I am thinking they will give Scott a smaller budget, and let him finish his trilogy....after that I honestly don't know.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: motherfather on May 22, 2017, 04:33:27 PM
The numbers don't include Germanic territories yet, right? Few sites I looked at said no box office data yet.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 22, 2017, 04:37:28 PM
Lol Germanic territories. What. Dude they won't make a dent. Stop deluding yourself, the movie is underperforming and that's that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 22, 2017, 04:40:07 PM
lol Germanic territories.....

It hasn't released in China yet right? I thought I read it wont be out in China till June.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 22, 2017, 04:55:13 PM
germany. .south africa and the netherlands. .sure combined we will make a relative dent at least. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Silver Teeth on May 22, 2017, 04:58:39 PM
China might help this film generate the next sequel but fox's confidence changing positions from august right to the front line of box office guaranteed films, has cost it somewhat deerly, theres nothing coming out in august, thats why they selected that month to rerelease T2 in 3D , does this prove fox really dont know what there doing ?

Look, Some are the Alien films are bad, like just bad, Alien Resurrection, Alien 3 ( yes fans like it but, you know to the general audience, its bad) Aliens Vs. Predator Requiem, Prometheus was an inquisitive film but theres some stupid moments in that movie.
The point now, is prehaps fox need to stick with it, take the good with the bad rebuild the brand recognition
you can't expect people around the world to flock to see a film with a partially bad reputation of films within
the franchise.
This is fox's fault, they approved Avp over Alien 5, they greenlighted Avp R & tempered with the director's vision of Alien 3. Consider these films, Batman Begins 374 million, The Dark Night 1 billion and those batman films came off a couple bad sequels, but got there box office numbers up eventually.

The box office question is how do fox lure the other audience members who were not attracted this time around, who didn't see interest in this film ? Prometheus proved that curiosity is a key, where as showing too much for Alien Covenant's sake may not be.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 05:20:04 PM
Well, well...

From the looks of it, in terms of reviews and first impressions, Pirates of the Caribbean is shitting its pants before it even pushes off the starting line later this week. I do not like to wish poorly on another film but just saying, if its not that great and fizzles out early then that might help Alien Covenant during memorial day weekend (when a lot of us Americans hit the cinemas).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 05:32:10 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 05:20:04 PM
Well, well...

From the looks of it, in terms of reviews and first impressions, Pirates of the Caribbean is shitting its pants before it even pushes off the starting line later this week. I do not like to wish poorly on another film but just saying, if its not that great and fizzles out early then that might help Alien Covenant during memorial day weekend (when a lot of us Americans hit the cinemas).

I still think Covenant is f**ked. The word-of-mouth among cinema-goers is mixed and that's putting it politely. Covenant received the dreaded "B" on cinemascore.com, whereas Pirates will probably get an A, even though it's being slaughtered among critics.

I think best we can hope for is a final tally of $80million. It just doesn't pay to be optimistic with Alien in america. I remember even AvP managed to finish below Freddy vs Jason somehow. That was un-f**king-believable back in the day, especially because AvP had access to a far wider audience. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: newbeing on May 22, 2017, 05:34:58 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 05:20:04 PM
Well, well...

From the looks of it, in terms of reviews and first impressions, Pirates of the Caribbean is shitting its pants before it even pushes off the starting line later this week. I do not like to wish poorly on another film but just saying, if its not that great and fizzles out early then that might help Alien Covenant during memorial day weekend (when a lot of us Americans hit the cinemas).

Rotten Tomato scores seem to matter little for franchises that are considered popcorn flicks to general audiences. Look at how many Transformer films  there have been despite the highest rated one being the original at 57%. Last three Pirates films were also rotten, but they bring the summer movie audiences in.
Prometheus had a significant drop on its second weekend in the US, something like 60% I think. I feel Alien: Covenant will be the same.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: DaddyYautja on May 22, 2017, 05:36:23 PM
so now we are happy that the movie came under budget and on time?  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 22, 2017, 05:56:33 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 22, 2017, 04:37:28 PM
Lol Germanic territories. What. Dude they won't make a dent. Stop deluding yourself, the movie is underperforming and that's that.

Djibouti's numbers aren't in yet either.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 06:07:33 PM
Quote from: newbeing on May 22, 2017, 05:34:58 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 05:20:04 PM
Well, well...

From the looks of it, in terms of reviews and first impressions, Pirates of the Caribbean is shitting its pants before it even pushes off the starting line later this week. I do not like to wish poorly on another film but just saying, if its not that great and fizzles out early then that might help Alien Covenant during memorial day weekend (when a lot of us Americans hit the cinemas).

Rotten Tomato scores seem to matter little for franchises that are considered popcorn flicks to general audiences. Look at how many Transformer films  there have been despite the highest rated one being the original at 57%. Last three Pirates films were also rotten, but they bring the summer movie audiences in.
Prometheus had a significant drop on its second weekend in the US, something like 60% I think. I feel Alien: Covenant will be the same.

We shall see. I have a feeling that memorial day weekend will boost the numbers beyond what would happen with a normal second weekend drop off. Will it matter much? Probably not. But every little bit helps.

I am confident Scott will get to finish it out with one more movie though. Its not doing well but once it is all said done, I don't think it will be a monumental flop of such proportions that they give up on the franchise. Like Silver Teeth posted above, Fox needs to stick it out if they want to establish the franchise. I am talking BEYOND Scott's next Alien film. They had the right idea with Prometheus and expanding the Alien universe, but they tried to branch out way too much. You need to stick closer to the source, and branch out more as you go, not the other way around IMO.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 06:15:10 PM

I think the film will probably be a bigger hit on the home video market.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 22, 2017, 06:26:11 PM
R-Rated films typically do well on the home market. Dredd for example did exceptionally well but even that was not enough to garner any interest for a sequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 07:16:56 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 06:26:11 PM
R-Rated films typically do well on the home market. Dredd for example did exceptionally well but even that was not enough to garner any interest for a sequel.

Better than what?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 22, 2017, 07:21:20 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 06:26:11 PM
R-Rated films typically do well on the home market. Dredd for example did exceptionally well but even that was not enough to garner any interest for a sequel.

That's true, but aren't they finally getting a TV series for that? Of course it taken around five years to do so.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 07:49:23 PM
I wonder if FOX would have been better off with the original release date of August. Moving it the pre-Memorial Day weekend was a sign of confidence, though perhaps that was misguided. Yes, the hope is that it will hold better over the 4-day Memorial Day weekend, but that's no guarantee. The film opens in China 6/16. That market has exploded in the past 5-10 years, so hopefully they're big Alien fans.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 08:04:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 07:49:23 PM
I wonder if FOX would have been better off with the original release date of August. Moving it the pre-Memorial Day weekend was a sign of confidence, though perhaps that was misguided. Yes, the hope is that it will hold better over the 4-day Memorial Day weekend, but that's no guarantee. The film opens in China 6/16. That market has exploded in the past 5-10 years, so hopefully they're big Alien fans.

FOX could save money if they pursuit Chinese Co-Production for ALIEN: COVENANT 2.

Filming in China like PACIFIC RIM 2.

PACIFIC RIM 2 is saving money filming everything in Shangai.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prof. a on May 22, 2017, 08:06:13 PM
Quote from: gantarat on May 22, 2017, 02:08:31 PM
Sorry to ask again (For sure) but How much does a movie need to gross to be break-even ?

300 ? 400 ?

I see there is a lot of confusion and varying information regarding Covenant and the Box Office. Let me start out by saying I have a background in Film/TV, teach courses on the business aspects of the media industry, and do pay close attention to the box office.

Firstly, we (the public) will never actually know how much was spent on the production budget (let alone marketing/distribution costs which aren't included). Hollywood is known for "creative accounting" so to speak. Look at the many lawsuits against studios for denying key personnel a percentage of the gross.  So, the "books" are generally very secretive.

Secondly, we don't always get a completely clear idea about how much a film makes outside of the Box Office - including Video-On-Demand, home DVD/Blu-Ray sales, merchandise, etc.

So, the rule of thumb (even though it may not always be accurate) is a film should make double the production budget to break even. The budget from this film (from what I've heard) ranges from 90 to 110 million dollars. So, 180 to 220 million should put it (most of the time) in break even territory. Right now, with about 117 million, Covenant should be able to reach that.

There were those in the media that portrayed Prometheus as a box office misfire but with around $400 million in Box Office with about a 120-130 million budget, we saw that Fox still had confidence in the franchise to launch not just Covenant, but the more risky Scott movie - The Counselor. I read reports that the only reason Fox made The Counselor was because Prometheus generated a lot of profit - contrary to some media outlets.

So, the Covenant box office is not a disaster. It's not great but it should make at a minimum, break even territory.

Key question is what does Fox do?

They could go the AvP:R route, make one more film but at a much, much lower budget.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:10:51 PM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/weekend/chart/?view=main&yr=2017&wknd=20&p=.htm

Actuals have been released and it's officially number 1. Guardians actually came in a bit lower than estimated.

Small cause for celebration, I guess.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
Pacific Rim made $110 mil in China, out-grossing its domestic haul. I doubt the same will happen for Covenant.

The way I see it is FOX cut the budget by 25%, if we're using the reported numbers. Therefore, it's my presumption that Covenant can afford to earn 25% less. Now, what that might mean for the franchise going forward, I don't know.

And YAY for it staying at #1 :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:18:39 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 22, 2017, 10:01:05 AM
I will hold a similar stance to David in regard to the worth of humanity if the Angry Joe's of this world get their way.

Haha, brilliantly put.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:32:28 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

Surely FOX will advertise the fact that it's #1. And the bigger the numbers are the more they fluctuated, but it can go either way, up or down. The embargo for Pirates has lifted, and so far the reviews aren't favorable. If audiences are on the fence, they may go with the better reviewed option. Actually, other than Guardians, Covenant has the highest Rotten Tomatoes score of the top 10.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:32:48 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

GOTG2 is such a forgettable film. Entertaining while it lasts but leaves no lasting impression afterwards. And its shtick with shitty comfort zone 70s music gets old really fast and it's not charming at all. :/

I don't really hate it, I had some good fun while watching it but I can't believe it's still printing money like no tomorrow.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: LiquidMonster on May 22, 2017, 08:42:09 PM
Probably just me but after watching Alien: Covenant yesterday, I felt more than ever that I wanted to see Sigourney Weaver fighting ALIENS in the Neil Blomkamp proposed film with Hicks an adult Newt and possibly Bishop one last time.

Ridley has let ALIENS influence him so much anyways now(with the xenomorph now super fast) compared to what we see from the xeno in "ALIEN" that he's gone off the track a bit. We get superfast, jumping xenos like we saw in ALIENS but it doesn't make sense backing into "ALIEN" where the xeno is very slow and methodical.

Fox and Scott should just let Blomkamp make his ALIEN film now since these movies seem all over the place now.

I'm probably one of the few who didn't like the neomorph, seeing their lifecycle, who made them, etc. I liked that I thought the Space Jockeys were creatures only to find out it was an engineer suit. I like that in ALIEN we don't know much of anything and that it's ok not to have everything explained to us.

Now it seem Ridley feels he has to tell the entire back story of how the "xenos" came to be and I just don't like it at all. The neomorph communicating with David was laughable. I just man......I really think Scott needs to walk away from the films now.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 08:50:43 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:32:48 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

GOTG2 is such a forgettable film. Entertaining while it lasts but leaves no lasting impression afterwards. And its shtick with shitty comfort zone 70s music gets old really fast and it's not charming at all. :/

I don't really hate it, I had some good fun while watching it but I can't believe it's still printing money like no tomorrow.

I agree.

But ALL Marvel Disney movies are like these. FORGETTABLE. MEDIOCRE. I like them in the theaters but LOGAN(FOX Marvel) is better than ANY Marvel Disney movie ever.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 08:50:59 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 22, 2017, 08:42:09 PM
Probably just me but after watching Alien: Covenant yesterday, I felt more than ever that I wanted to see Sigourney Weaver fighting ALIENS in the Neil Blomkamp proposed film with Hicks an adult Newt and possibly Bishop one last time.

Ridley has let ALIENS influence him so much anyways now(with the xenomorph now super fast) compared to what we see from the xeno in "ALIEN" that he's gone off the track a bit. We get superfast, jumping xenos like we saw in ALIENS but it doesn't make sense backing into "ALIEN" where the xeno is very slow and methodical.

Fox and Scott should just let Blomkamp make his ALIEN film now since these movies seem all over the place now.

I'm probably one of the few who didn't like the neomorph, seeing their lifecycle, who made them, etc. I liked that I thought the Space Jockeys were creatures only to find out it was an engineer suit. I like that in ALIEN we don't know much of anything and that it's ok not to have everything explained to us.

Now it seem Ridley feels he has to tell the entire back story of how the "xenos" came to be and I just don't like it at all. The neomorph communicating with David was laughable. I just man......I really think Scott needs to walk away from the films now.


I am willing to bet that Scott will film the next movie in the timeline he has proposed, perhaps with some compromises brought down by the studio, and it will release near the 40th anniversary of Alien in 2019 (perfect time to connect the prequels directly into Alien). After that, I could see a push to get a Sigourney Alien film in production soon there after while she is still young enough. Most likely with colonial marines too...maybe the proposed Alien 5 or something similar but fit to meet a mass market appeal.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:56:44 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 08:50:43 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:32:48 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

GOTG2 is such a forgettable film. Entertaining while it lasts but leaves no lasting impression afterwards. And its shtick with shitty comfort zone 70s music gets old really fast and it's not charming at all. :/

I don't really hate it, I had some good fun while watching it but I can't believe it's still printing money like no tomorrow.

I agree.

But ALL Marvel Disney movies are like these. FORGETTABLE. MEDIOCRE. I like them in the theaters but LOGAN(FOX Marvel) is better than ANY Marvel Disney movie ever.

Yes. Logan was special. Btw it shares one of the writers with Covenant.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 09:12:13 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 08:50:59 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 22, 2017, 08:42:09 PM
Probably just me but after watching Alien: Covenant yesterday, I felt more than ever that I wanted to see Sigourney Weaver fighting ALIENS in the Neil Blomkamp proposed film with Hicks an adult Newt and possibly Bishop one last time.

Ridley has let ALIENS influence him so much anyways now(with the xenomorph now super fast) compared to what we see from the xeno in "ALIEN" that he's gone off the track a bit. We get superfast, jumping xenos like we saw in ALIENS but it doesn't make sense backing into "ALIEN" where the xeno is very slow and methodical.

Fox and Scott should just let Blomkamp make his ALIEN film now since these movies seem all over the place now.

I'm probably one of the few who didn't like the neomorph, seeing their lifecycle, who made them, etc. I liked that I thought the Space Jockeys were creatures only to find out it was an engineer suit. I like that in ALIEN we don't know much of anything and that it's ok not to have everything explained to us.

Now it seem Ridley feels he has to tell the entire back story of how the "xenos" came to be and I just don't like it at all. The neomorph communicating with David was laughable. I just man......I really think Scott needs to walk away from the films now.


I am willing to bet that Scott will film the next movie in the timeline he has proposed, perhaps with some compromises brought down by the studio, and it will release near the 40th anniversary of Alien in 2019 (perfect time to connect the prequels directly into Alien). After that, I could see a push to get a Sigourney Alien film in production soon there after while she is still young enough. Most likely with colonial marines too...maybe the proposed Alien 5 or something similar but fit to meet a mass market appeal.
Im fine with Scott wrapping up the story in the next movie as long as it's like 3 hours long. I can't see it being any shorter without it being a rushed disaster.

I would love to see a Sigourney Weaver/Colonial Marines Alien film again. Hopefully we'll get it after Scott's done.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 09:23:36 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 08:50:43 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:32:48 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

GOTG2 is such a forgettable film. Entertaining while it lasts but leaves no lasting impression afterwards. And its shtick with shitty comfort zone 70s music gets old really fast and it's not charming at all. :/

I don't really hate it, I had some good fun while watching it but I can't believe it's still printing money like no tomorrow.

I agree.

But ALL Marvel Disney movies are like these. FORGETTABLE. MEDIOCRE. I like them in the theaters but LOGAN(FOX Marvel) is better than ANY Marvel Disney movie ever.

Really?  I really liked winter soldier and doctor strange.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 22, 2017, 09:28:07 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 08:50:43 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:32:48 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

GOTG2 is such a forgettable film. Entertaining while it lasts but leaves no lasting impression afterwards. And its shtick with shitty comfort zone 70s music gets old really fast and it's not charming at all. :/

I don't really hate it, I had some good fun while watching it but I can't believe it's still printing money like no tomorrow.

I agree.

But ALL Marvel Disney movies are like these. FORGETTABLE. MEDIOCRE. I like them in the theaters but LOGAN(FOX Marvel) is better than ANY Marvel Disney movie ever.

Sadly this is very true but people still flock to see them in droves and everyone of them seems to get good reviews for some reason. Every single one of them is exactly the same yet the very same critics accuse Covenant of being over familiar lol.  Logan is far superior, its a bold film just like Covenant and both should be applauded for being so.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 22, 2017, 09:30:38 PM
I hope this movie flops. I don't want to see Scott butchering his legacy.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 22, 2017, 09:31:11 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 09:23:36 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 08:50:43 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:32:48 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

GOTG2 is such a forgettable film. Entertaining while it lasts but leaves no lasting impression afterwards. And its shtick with shitty comfort zone 70s music gets old really fast and it's not charming at all. :/

I don't really hate it, I had some good fun while watching it but I can't believe it's still printing money like no tomorrow.

I agree.

But ALL Marvel Disney movies are like these. FORGETTABLE. MEDIOCRE. I like them in the theaters but LOGAN(FOX Marvel) is better than ANY Marvel Disney movie ever.

Really?  I really liked winter soldier and doctor strange.

I find them entertaining enough whilst watching them but instantly forgettable. Marvel just have a formula that they use for every film, its just so repetitive.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:08:44 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 22, 2017, 09:31:11 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 09:23:36 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 22, 2017, 08:50:43 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 22, 2017, 08:32:48 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 08:25:40 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 22, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
And YAY for it staying at #1 :P

I genuinely didn't think it would. Especially since Guardians increased over it's estimates for two weeks in a row prior to this one. Maybe Covenant can gain some small momentum from being the number 1 movie in America before Pirates and Baywatch?

GOTG2 is such a forgettable film. Entertaining while it lasts but leaves no lasting impression afterwards. And its shtick with shitty comfort zone 70s music gets old really fast and it's not charming at all. :/

I don't really hate it, I had some good fun while watching it but I can't believe it's still printing money like no tomorrow.

I agree.

But ALL Marvel Disney movies are like these. FORGETTABLE. MEDIOCRE. I like them in the theaters but LOGAN(FOX Marvel) is better than ANY Marvel Disney movie ever.

Really?  I really liked winter soldier and doctor strange.

I find them entertaining enough whilst watching them but instantly forgettable. Marvel just have a formula that they use for every film, its just so repetitive.

I mean I liked them and remember them. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 22, 2017, 10:17:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 07:16:56 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 06:26:11 PM
R-Rated films typically do well on the home market. Dredd for example did exceptionally well but even that was not enough to garner any interest for a sequel.

Better than what?

Skyfall strangely enough. The Dredd and Skyfall BD were released on Amazon UK at just about the same time but Dredd managed to outsell it.

Pretty amazing considering Skyfall's box office haul was over a billion while Dredd struggled to get past $40 million. Couldn't believe it myself.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:41:20 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 10:17:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 07:16:56 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 06:26:11 PM
R-Rated films typically do well on the home market. Dredd for example did exceptionally well but even that was not enough to garner any interest for a sequel.

Better than what?

Skyfall strangely enough. The Dredd and Skyfall BD were released on Amazon UK at just about the same time but Dredd managed to outsell it.

Pretty amazing considering Skyfall's box office haul was over a billion while Dredd struggled to get past $40 million. Couldn't believe it myself.

Uhhhh skyfall made 100 million in physical media sales.  Dredd made 19 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 22, 2017, 10:55:53 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:41:20 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 10:17:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 07:16:56 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 06:26:11 PM
R-Rated films typically do well on the home market. Dredd for example did exceptionally well but even that was not enough to garner any interest for a sequel.

Better than what?

Skyfall strangely enough. The Dredd and Skyfall BD were released on Amazon UK at just about the same time but Dredd managed to outsell it.

Pretty amazing considering Skyfall's box office haul was over a billion while Dredd struggled to get past $40 million. Couldn't believe it myself.

Uhhhh skyfall made 100 million in physical media sales.  Dredd made 19 million.

The example I gave was from Amazon UK only. Obviously a different case in the US where Dredd is a relatively obscure IP. The point still stands that in comparison to Dredd's box office performance it fared much better on DVD/BD.

Compare your physical media sales figures to the respective box office haul of each film to see what I mean. Skyfall = 10% Dredd = 50%
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:59:48 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 10:55:53 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:41:20 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 10:17:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 07:16:56 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 22, 2017, 06:26:11 PM
R-Rated films typically do well on the home market. Dredd for example did exceptionally well but even that was not enough to garner any interest for a sequel.

Better than what?

Skyfall strangely enough. The Dredd and Skyfall BD were released on Amazon UK at just about the same time but Dredd managed to outsell it.

Pretty amazing considering Skyfall's box office haul was over a billion while Dredd struggled to get past $40 million. Couldn't believe it myself.

Uhhhh skyfall made 100 million in physical media sales.  Dredd made 19 million.

The example I gave was from Amazon UK only. Obviously a different case in the US where Dredd is a relatively obscure IP. The point still stands that in comparison to Dredd's box office performance it fared much better on DVD/BD.

Compare your physical media sales figures to the respective box office haul of each film to see what I mean. Skyfall = 10% Dredd = 50%

I mean all that matters is total sales.  I think its somewhat a factor of the box office being so high for one and 100 million being such a huge amount...   more of a ceiling/floor effect than anything in particular.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 22, 2017, 11:08:44 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 22, 2017, 10:59:48 PM
I mean all that matters is total sales.  I think its somewhat a factor of the box office being so high for one and 100 million being such a huge amount...   more of a ceiling/floor effect than anything in particular.

Yes, I agree total sales is what matters in the end. I'm just trying to illustrate the known fact that R-Rated films often fare better in the home market compared to their box office run even if they make less $. Box Office is still the most important factor but all the other little revenue streams like DVD/BD, broadcasting rights, streaming services, rental etc. can still contribute quite a bit towards the film's total haul.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 23, 2017, 12:19:55 AM
Quote from: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 09:12:13 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 08:50:59 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 22, 2017, 08:42:09 PM
Probably just me but after watching Alien: Covenant yesterday, I felt more than ever that I wanted to see Sigourney Weaver fighting ALIENS in the Neil Blomkamp proposed film with Hicks an adult Newt and possibly Bishop one last time.

Ridley has let ALIENS influence him so much anyways now(with the xenomorph now super fast) compared to what we see from the xeno in "ALIEN" that he's gone off the track a bit. We get superfast, jumping xenos like we saw in ALIENS but it doesn't make sense backing into "ALIEN" where the xeno is very slow and methodical.

Fox and Scott should just let Blomkamp make his ALIEN film now since these movies seem all over the place now.

I'm probably one of the few who didn't like the neomorph, seeing their lifecycle, who made them, etc. I liked that I thought the Space Jockeys were creatures only to find out it was an engineer suit. I like that in ALIEN we don't know much of anything and that it's ok not to have everything explained to us.

Now it seem Ridley feels he has to tell the entire back story of how the "xenos" came to be and I just don't like it at all. The neomorph communicating with David was laughable. I just man......I really think Scott needs to walk away from the films now.


I am willing to bet that Scott will film the next movie in the timeline he has proposed, perhaps with some compromises brought down by the studio, and it will release near the 40th anniversary of Alien in 2019 (perfect time to connect the prequels directly into Alien). After that, I could see a push to get a Sigourney Alien film in production soon there after while she is still young enough. Most likely with colonial marines too...maybe the proposed Alien 5 or something similar but fit to meet a mass market appeal.
Im fine with Scott wrapping up the story in the next movie as long as it's like 3 hours long. I can't see it being any shorter without it being a rushed disaster.

I would love to see a Sigourney Weaver/Colonial Marines Alien film again. Hopefully we'll get it after Scott's done.

I agree the next one has to be very long to answer all of these questions. Like 'Lord of the Rings' long!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: salomonj on May 23, 2017, 12:20:22 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.
District 9 was great, but everything else...not so much.


If Blade Runner 2049 turns out great, than Dennis Vill. NEEDS to hop on Alien 5.




https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/baywatch_2017

Baywatch off to a GREAT start on RT.


Quote from: echobbase79 on May 23, 2017, 12:19:55 AM
Quote from: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 09:12:13 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 08:50:59 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 22, 2017, 08:42:09 PM
Probably just me but after watching Alien: Covenant yesterday, I felt more than ever that I wanted to see Sigourney Weaver fighting ALIENS in the Neil Blomkamp proposed film with Hicks an adult Newt and possibly Bishop one last time.

Ridley has let ALIENS influence him so much anyways now(with the xenomorph now super fast) compared to what we see from the xeno in "ALIEN" that he's gone off the track a bit. We get superfast, jumping xenos like we saw in ALIENS but it doesn't make sense backing into "ALIEN" where the xeno is very slow and methodical.

Fox and Scott should just let Blomkamp make his ALIEN film now since these movies seem all over the place now.

I'm probably one of the few who didn't like the neomorph, seeing their lifecycle, who made them, etc. I liked that I thought the Space Jockeys were creatures only to find out it was an engineer suit. I like that in ALIEN we don't know much of anything and that it's ok not to have everything explained to us.

Now it seem Ridley feels he has to tell the entire back story of how the "xenos" came to be and I just don't like it at all. The neomorph communicating with David was laughable. I just man......I really think Scott needs to walk away from the films now.


I am willing to bet that Scott will film the next movie in the timeline he has proposed, perhaps with some compromises brought down by the studio, and it will release near the 40th anniversary of Alien in 2019 (perfect time to connect the prequels directly into Alien). After that, I could see a push to get a Sigourney Alien film in production soon there after while she is still young enough. Most likely with colonial marines too...maybe the proposed Alien 5 or something similar but fit to meet a mass market appeal.
Im fine with Scott wrapping up the story in the next movie as long as it's like 3 hours long. I can't see it being any shorter without it being a rushed disaster.

I would love to see a Sigourney Weaver/Colonial Marines Alien film again. Hopefully we'll get it after Scott's done.

I agree the next week has to be very long to answer all of these questions. Like 'Lord of the Rings' long!
yes! This needs to be a Lord of the Rings trilogy! I feel that movies aren't made that long anymore, unless it's a Tarantino flick which is one of the reasons I love about him. There's nothing better than going to the cinema for a 3 hour film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:27:06 AM
Quote from: salomonj on May 23, 2017, 12:20:22 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.
District 9 was great, but everything else...not so much.


If Blade Runner 2049 turns out great, than Dennis Vill. NEEDS to hop on Alien 5.




https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/baywatch_2017

Baywatch off to a GREAT start on RT.


Quote from: echobbase79 on May 23, 2017, 12:19:55 AM
Quote from: salomonj on May 22, 2017, 09:12:13 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 22, 2017, 08:50:59 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 22, 2017, 08:42:09 PM
Probably just me but after watching Alien: Covenant yesterday, I felt more than ever that I wanted to see Sigourney Weaver fighting ALIENS in the Neil Blomkamp proposed film with Hicks an adult Newt and possibly Bishop one last time.

Ridley has let ALIENS influence him so much anyways now(with the xenomorph now super fast) compared to what we see from the xeno in "ALIEN" that he's gone off the track a bit. We get superfast, jumping xenos like we saw in ALIENS but it doesn't make sense backing into "ALIEN" where the xeno is very slow and methodical.

Fox and Scott should just let Blomkamp make his ALIEN film now since these movies seem all over the place now.

I'm probably one of the few who didn't like the neomorph, seeing their lifecycle, who made them, etc. I liked that I thought the Space Jockeys were creatures only to find out it was an engineer suit. I like that in ALIEN we don't know much of anything and that it's ok not to have everything explained to us.

Now it seem Ridley feels he has to tell the entire back story of how the "xenos" came to be and I just don't like it at all. The neomorph communicating with David was laughable. I just man......I really think Scott needs to walk away from the films now.


I am willing to bet that Scott will film the next movie in the timeline he has proposed, perhaps with some compromises brought down by the studio, and it will release near the 40th anniversary of Alien in 2019 (perfect time to connect the prequels directly into Alien). After that, I could see a push to get a Sigourney Alien film in production soon there after while she is still young enough. Most likely with colonial marines too...maybe the proposed Alien 5 or something similar but fit to meet a mass market appeal.
Im fine with Scott wrapping up the story in the next movie as long as it's like 3 hours long. I can't see it being any shorter without it being a rushed disaster.

I would love to see a Sigourney Weaver/Colonial Marines Alien film again. Hopefully we'll get it after Scott's done.

I agree the next week has to be very long to answer all of these questions. Like 'Lord of the Rings' long!
yes! This needs to be a Lord of the Rings trilogy! I feel that movies aren't made that long anymore, unless it's a Tarantino flick which is one of the reasons I love about him. There's nothing better than going to the cinema for a 3 hour film.

Villeneuve is Directing DUNE. Too busy.

Sir Ridley has 3 better projects: ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD, THE CARTEL and BATTLE OF BRITAIN. Maybe He chooses to leave this franchise.

But FOX DOESN'T have faith in Neil Blomkamp. That's why they cancelled his project.

Probably is going to be someone NEW.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 12:32:24 AM
Lets assume that Ridley is given the chance to finish out the prequels with one more movie and start shooting a little over a year from now like he said he was going to. When would we hear that it is confirmed? Sets would have to be built, actors/actresses hired, all that...so we would know by the end of the year?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BringbackJonesy! on May 23, 2017, 01:12:47 AM
I would have loved to have watched a 3D version of this on the big screen, as PROMETHEUS looked excellent in that format compared to certain other 3D releases.

While I've certainly got many issues with ALIEN COVENANT (and plan to re-edit it more to my liking along with PROMETHEUS), I know that many of Ridley's scenes would again have looked terrific in 3D.

For instance, GRAVITY had some of the most involving and effective 3D I've ever seen, and I kept thinking how good the COVENANT 'spacewalk' sequence would have looked in that manner too.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 23, 2017, 02:12:59 AM
Alien: Covenant v. Prometheus

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view=basic&id=covprom.htm
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 23, 2017, 04:15:38 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 12:56:13 PM
I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if Gaurdians ends up pipping it to number 1 when the actuals are released....

Meanwhile it's been no 1 for two weekends here in the UK

The actuals show that "Covenant" is number 1 for the weekend in the US.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/weekend/chart/

Next weekend in the US there is a holiday on Monday which should help AC a bit. 

Also AC will be released in China on June 16 which hopefully will get it about $30 million more world wide box office.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2316204/releaseinfo

("Resident Evil: Afterlife" made $21 million in China.)

* The key thing to realize imo is that science fiction / horror is not that popular a genre.
With US box office the only franchises which have made decent money in this category with sequels/prequels (not adjusted for inflation) are Alien and Resident Evil.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/genres/chart/?id=scifihorror.htm

AC just needs to get to $100 million in the US which I think is still possible.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 23, 2017, 06:02:01 AM
Problem is Covenant no "3D"
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: HarveyYan on May 23, 2017, 06:15:08 AM
Ridley Scott is awesome, looking forward to his next Alien movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 23, 2017, 06:26:37 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 23, 2017, 04:15:38 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 12:56:13 PM
I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if Gaurdians ends up pipping it to number 1 when the actuals are released....

Meanwhile it's been no 1 for two weekends here in the UK

The actuals show that "Covenant" is number 1 for the weekend in the US.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/weekend/chart/

Next weekend in the US there is a holiday on Monday which should help AC a bit. 

Also AC will be released in China on June 16 which hopefully will get it about $30 million more world wide box office.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2316204/releaseinfo

("Resident Evil: Afterlife" made $21 million in China.)

* The key thing to realize imo is that science fiction / horror is not that popular a genre.
With US box office the only franchises which have made decent money in this category with sequels/prequels (not adjusted for inflation) are Alien and Resident Evil.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/genres/chart/?id=scifihorror.htm

AC just needs to get to $100 million in the US which I think is still possible.

;)


I posted the actuals ages ago.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 23, 2017, 06:52:03 AM
Well,Resident Evil it's Heavy Action movies than Sci-Fi Horror Movies like Alien.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 10:07:57 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 23, 2017, 04:15:38 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 22, 2017, 12:56:13 PM
I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if Gaurdians ends up pipping it to number 1 when the actuals are released....

Meanwhile it's been no 1 for two weekends here in the UK

The actuals show that "Covenant" is number 1 for the weekend in the US.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/weekend/chart/

Next weekend in the US there is a holiday on Monday which should help AC a bit. 

Also AC will be released in China on June 16 which hopefully will get it about $30 million more world wide box office.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2316204/releaseinfo

("Resident Evil: Afterlife" made $21 million in China.)

* The key thing to realize imo is that science fiction / horror is not that popular a genre.
With US box office the only franchises which have made decent money in this category with sequels/prequels (not adjusted for inflation) are Alien and Resident Evil.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/genres/chart/?id=scifihorror.htm

AC just needs to get to $100 million in the US which I think is still possible.

;)

I have no idea where you are coming up with 100 million from. It also is going to have a hard time doing even that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
How does everyone think Covenant will hold up this weekend domestically? With the holiday weekend, I'm hoping for maybe 25 million...that is probably being too optimistic though. It will be losing screens to Baywatch and Pirates of the Caribbean...both reviewing poorly it looks like, but people will still probably flock to them in this country.

It didn't too hot WW this last weekend from the looks of it. I don't see it doing any better this weekend. So maybe 50 million total WW?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
How does everyone think Covenant will hold up this weekend domestically? With the holiday weekend, I'm hoping for maybe 25 million...that is probably being too optimistic though. It will be losing screens to Baywatch and Pirates of the Caribbean...both reviewing poorly it looks like, but people will still probably flock to them in this country.

It didn't too hot WW this last weekend from the looks of it. I don't see it doing any better this weekend. So maybe 50 million total WW?

PIRATES 5 has 33% in RT. Critics are killing it.

I think PIRATES 5 is going to flop. Remember PIRATES 5 costed 250 Millions. A: COVENANT costed only 97 Millions.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 04:58:24 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
How does everyone think Covenant will hold up this weekend domestically? With the holiday weekend, I'm hoping for maybe 25 million...that is probably being too optimistic though. It will be losing screens to Baywatch and Pirates of the Caribbean...both reviewing poorly it looks like, but people will still probably flock to them in this country.

It didn't too hot WW this last weekend from the looks of it. I don't see it doing any better this weekend. So maybe 50 million total WW?

PIRATES 5 has 33% in RT. Critics are killing it.

I think PIRATES 5 is going to flop. Remember PIRATES 5 costed 250 Millions. A: COVENANT costed only 97 Millions.

I also do not see much enthusiasm for Pirates 5 here in the states at least. Actually I see more hype for Baywatch which critics are tearing apart even worse than Pirates 5. I suppose Covenant could do well this weekend but I just don't see it having the draw. The more I think about it, the more this franchise needs another Aliens type movie with some big names to get the general audience attention.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 05:27:09 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
How does everyone think Covenant will hold up this weekend domestically? With the holiday weekend, I'm hoping for maybe 25 million...that is probably being too optimistic though. It will be losing screens to Baywatch and Pirates of the Caribbean...both reviewing poorly it looks like, but people will still probably flock to them in this country.

It didn't too hot WW this last weekend from the looks of it. I don't see it doing any better this weekend. So maybe 50 million total WW?

PIRATES 5 has 33% in RT. Critics are killing it.

I think PIRATES 5 is going to flop. Remember PIRATES 5 costed 250 Millions. A: COVENANT costed only 97 Millions.

Pirates is pretty much impervious to flopping due to how many huge revenue streams it will generate. Until proven otherwise I also think that franchise is immune to bad reviews. Outside the first one none of them were well reviewed and they all hit a billion world wide. It's like transformers. People know what they are and don't care what critics think.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 05:31:03 PM
Top 10 films May 19-21 in UK.

1. King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, £2,501,993 from 564 sites (new)
2. Alien: Covenant, £2,127,347 from 631 sites. Total: £10,003,742 (two weeks)
3. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2, £1,942,687 from 599 sites. Total: £36,309,702 (four weeks)
4. Snatched, £842,489 from 465 sites (new)
5. The Boss Baby, £414,954 from 527 sites. Total: £26,819,979 (seven weeks)
6. A Dog's Purpose, £263,233 from 432 sites. Total: £2,464,023 (three weeks)
7. Fast & Furious 8, £230,868 from 346 sites. Total: £29,385,156 (six weeks)
8. Beauty and the Beast, £158,496 from 373 sites. Total: £71,878,441 (10 weeks)
9. Colossal, £150,642 from 145 sites (new)
10. Half Girlfriend, £115,183 from 67 sites (new)

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/may/23/king-arthur-alien-covenant-uk-box-office

In UK Covenant made 10 millions in 2 weeks. Prometheus in total made nearly 40 millions! Covenant is gonna flop BIG TIME!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 23, 2017, 05:31:48 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 05:27:09 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
How does everyone think Covenant will hold up this weekend domestically? With the holiday weekend, I'm hoping for maybe 25 million...that is probably being too optimistic though. It will be losing screens to Baywatch and Pirates of the Caribbean...both reviewing poorly it looks like, but people will still probably flock to them in this country.

It didn't too hot WW this last weekend from the looks of it. I don't see it doing any better this weekend. So maybe 50 million total WW?

PIRATES 5 has 33% in RT. Critics are killing it.

I think PIRATES 5 is going to flop. Remember PIRATES 5 costed 250 Millions. A: COVENANT costed only 97 Millions.

Pirates is pretty much impervious to flopping due to how many huge revenue streams it will generate. Until proven otherwise I also think that franchise is immune to bad reviews. Outside the first one none of them were well reviewed and they all hit a billion world wide. It's like transformers. People know what they are and don't care what critics think.
Even all those shitty Resident Evil movies amounted to $1.2 billion total.


Quote from: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 05:31:03 PM
Top 10 films May 19-21 in UK.

1. King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, £2,501,993 from 564 sites (new)
2. Alien: Covenant, £2,127,347 from 631 sites. Total: £10,003,742 (two weeks)
3. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2, £1,942,687 from 599 sites. Total: £36,309,702 (four weeks)
4. Snatched, £842,489 from 465 sites (new)
5. The Boss Baby, £414,954 from 527 sites. Total: £26,819,979 (seven weeks)
6. A Dog's Purpose, £263,233 from 432 sites. Total: £2,464,023 (three weeks)
7. Fast & Furious 8, £230,868 from 346 sites. Total: £29,385,156 (six weeks)
8. Beauty and the Beast, £158,496 from 373 sites. Total: £71,878,441 (10 weeks)
9. Colossal, £150,642 from 145 sites (new)
10. Half Girlfriend, £115,183 from 67 sites (new)

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/may/23/king-arthur-alien-covenant-uk-box-office
Barely edged out Covenant. And Covenant stayed on top of GOTG2...That's at least comforting.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on May 23, 2017, 05:59:11 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
How does everyone think Covenant will hold up this weekend domestically? With the holiday weekend, I'm hoping for maybe 25 million...

Me too which would keep it ahead of "Passengers" which made ~ $21 million its second weekend and that ended up with a US total of $100 million.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=passengers2016.htm

If AC gets to $100 million in the US, then things could be OK in terms of it making a profit.

Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
that is probably being too optimistic though.

We'll see.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 06:24:15 PM
Covenant will not reach 100. Not a chance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 23, 2017, 06:39:26 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 05:31:03 PM
Top 10 films May 19-21 in UK.

1. King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, £2,501,993 from 564 sites (new)
2. Alien: Covenant, £2,127,347 from 631 sites. Total: £10,003,742 (two weeks)
3. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2, £1,942,687 from 599 sites. Total: £36,309,702 (four weeks)
4. Snatched, £842,489 from 465 sites (new)
5. The Boss Baby, £414,954 from 527 sites. Total: £26,819,979 (seven weeks)
6. A Dog's Purpose, £263,233 from 432 sites. Total: £2,464,023 (three weeks)
7. Fast & Furious 8, £230,868 from 346 sites. Total: £29,385,156 (six weeks)
8. Beauty and the Beast, £158,496 from 373 sites. Total: £71,878,441 (10 weeks)
9. Colossal, £150,642 from 145 sites (new)
10. Half Girlfriend, £115,183 from 67 sites (new)

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/may/23/king-arthur-alien-covenant-uk-box-office

In UK Covenant made 10 millions in 2 weeks. Prometheus in total made nearly 40 millions! Covenant is gonna flop BIG TIME!

Prometheus was Scott's biggest ever hit in the UK. Covenant is actually doing respectable business over here - it's in America it's struggling.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 06:45:37 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 06:24:15 PM
Covenant will not reach 100. Not a chance.

I wouldn't say "not a chance". Memorial day weekend is a popular time to go to the cinemas here in the states and the two debuting movies it has to compete with are getting shredded by critics. So it could possibly pull in 25 - 30 million, making it possible to reach up to 100 million when you factor in the general week-day showings as well.

Is it likely? Nope, but there is a chance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.

It's obvious you want a Full Action Aliens movie.

In that case, Neil Blomkamp is Mediocre TOO in terms of Action. They could get a Better Action Director.


Quote from: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.

Michael Fassbender is one of the greatest actors of all time BUT people hate him for some weird reason. Like Russell Crowe.

ALIEN: COVENANT 2 needs Tom Hardy. Hardy is a bigger star than Fassbender and he is a big fan of Sir Ridley Scott.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 23, 2017, 07:07:14 PM
People hate Fassbender? When did that happen?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 23, 2017, 07:08:18 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.

It's obvious you want a Full Action Aliens movie.

In that case, Neil Blomkamp is Mediocre TOO in terms of Action. They could get a Better Action Director.


Quote from: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.

Michael Fassbender is one of the greatest actors of all time BUT people hate him for some weird reason. Like Russell Crowe.

ALIEN: COVENANT 2 needs Tom Hardy. Hardy is a bigger star than Fassbender and he is a big fan of Sir Ridley Scott.

Is fassbender unpopular then? I didn't realise that, does anyone know why that might be.

Tom Hardy would be great to see
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 23, 2017, 07:09:18 PM
I am surprised Ridley hasn't nabbed Hardy for Prometheus or Covenant. He was at both premieres, and is a big admirer of the guy.

Covenant had amazing actors but nary a Charlize Theron or Idris Elba. Should've stuck James Franco and Tom Hardy in as Oram, Tennessee or Lope.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 07:10:57 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.

It's obvious you want a Full Action Aliens movie.

In that case, Neil Blomkamp is Mediocre TOO in terms of Action. They could get a Better Action Director.


Quote from: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.

Michael Fassbender is one of the greatest actors of all time BUT people hate him for some weird reason. Like Russell Crowe.

ALIEN: COVENANT 2 needs Tom Hardy. Hardy is a bigger star than Fassbender and he is a big fan of Sir Ridley Scott.

First, they need to keep Fassbender. He plays the role of David very well and that story needs to continue in some regard.

Second, yes I am completely on board with having Tom Hardy in the film. He was the better actor (IMO) in the Revenant. The problem we run into is that big actors require big money and Fox is probably going to limit Ridley in that regard.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 23, 2017, 07:16:50 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 23, 2017, 07:09:18 PM
I am surprised Ridley hasn't nabbed Hardy for Prometheus or Covenant. He was at both premieres, and is a big admirer of the guy.

Covenant had amazing actors but nary a Charlize Theron or Idris Elba. Should've stuck James Franco and Tom Hardy in as Oram, Tennessee or Lope.

No way, Billy was outstanding as Oram


Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 07:10:57 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.

It's obvious you want a Full Action Aliens movie.

In that case, Neil Blomkamp is Mediocre TOO in terms of Action. They could get a Better Action Director.


Quote from: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.

Michael Fassbender is one of the greatest actors of all time BUT people hate him for some weird reason. Like Russell Crowe.

ALIEN: COVENANT 2 needs Tom Hardy. Hardy is a bigger star than Fassbender and he is a big fan of Sir Ridley Scott.

First, they need to keep Fassbender. He plays the role of David very well and that story needs to continue in some regard.

Second, yes I am completely on board with having Tom Hardy in the film. He was the better actor (IMO) in the Revenant. The problem we run into is that big actors require big money and Fox is probably going to limit Ridley in that regard.

I reckon Tom hardy would take a pay cut to work with Ridley
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 23, 2017, 07:18:31 PM
That's not the point.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 23, 2017, 08:06:04 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 23, 2017, 07:07:14 PM
People hate Fassbender? When did that happen?

First I'm hearing of it :laugh:

Also, these Passengers comparisons are weird for a variety of reasons.

To hit $100 mil, Covenant would need to pull a ~2.77 multiplier. Prometheus had a ~2.45 multiplier. Simply put, it needs to be leggier. Memorial Day weekend gives it a chance to do just that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 10:26:49 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on May 23, 2017, 05:59:11 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
How does everyone think Covenant will hold up this weekend domestically? With the holiday weekend, I'm hoping for maybe 25 million...

Me too which would keep it ahead of "Passengers" which made ~ $21 million its second weekend and that ended up with a US total of $100 million.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=passengers2016.htm

If AC gets to $100 million in the US, then things could be OK in terms of it making a profit.

Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 02:29:59 PM
that is probably being too optimistic though.

We'll see.

;)

I could be wrong but historically there is about a 0 chance of it ending up with 100 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on May 23, 2017, 10:30:52 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 23, 2017, 06:39:26 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 05:31:03 PM
Top 10 films May 19-21 in UK.

1. King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, £2,501,993 from 564 sites (new)
2. Alien: Covenant, £2,127,347 from 631 sites. Total: £10,003,742 (two weeks)
3. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2, £1,942,687 from 599 sites. Total: £36,309,702 (four weeks)
4. Snatched, £842,489 from 465 sites (new)
5. The Boss Baby, £414,954 from 527 sites. Total: £26,819,979 (seven weeks)
6. A Dog's Purpose, £263,233 from 432 sites. Total: £2,464,023 (three weeks)
7. Fast & Furious 8, £230,868 from 346 sites. Total: £29,385,156 (six weeks)
8. Beauty and the Beast, £158,496 from 373 sites. Total: £71,878,441 (10 weeks)
9. Colossal, £150,642 from 145 sites (new)
10. Half Girlfriend, £115,183 from 67 sites (new)

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/may/23/king-arthur-alien-covenant-uk-box-office

In UK Covenant made 10 millions in 2 weeks. Prometheus in total made nearly 40 millions! Covenant is gonna flop BIG TIME!

Prometheus was Scott's biggest ever hit in the UK. Covenant is actually doing respectable business over here - it's in America it's struggling.
That's not a surprise... Covenant is almost like an arthouse film trying to be commercial. I'm not sure that naturally jives with American audiences as much as European's.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 10:37:06 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 23, 2017, 10:30:52 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 23, 2017, 06:39:26 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 05:31:03 PM
Top 10 films May 19-21 in UK.

1. King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, £2,501,993 from 564 sites (new)
2. Alien: Covenant, £2,127,347 from 631 sites. Total: £10,003,742 (two weeks)
3. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2, £1,942,687 from 599 sites. Total: £36,309,702 (four weeks)
4. Snatched, £842,489 from 465 sites (new)
5. The Boss Baby, £414,954 from 527 sites. Total: £26,819,979 (seven weeks)
6. A Dog's Purpose, £263,233 from 432 sites. Total: £2,464,023 (three weeks)
7. Fast & Furious 8, £230,868 from 346 sites. Total: £29,385,156 (six weeks)
8. Beauty and the Beast, £158,496 from 373 sites. Total: £71,878,441 (10 weeks)
9. Colossal, £150,642 from 145 sites (new)
10. Half Girlfriend, £115,183 from 67 sites (new)

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/may/23/king-arthur-alien-covenant-uk-box-office

In UK Covenant made 10 millions in 2 weeks. Prometheus in total made nearly 40 millions! Covenant is gonna flop BIG TIME!

Prometheus was Scott's biggest ever hit in the UK. Covenant is actually doing respectable business over here - it's in America it's struggling.
That's not a surprise... Covenant is almost like an arthouse film trying to be commercial. I'm not sure that naturally jives with American audiences as much as European's.

I really don't see it as being any more of an arthouse film than inception which made massive amounts of money in the US.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on May 23, 2017, 10:50:55 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 10:37:06 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 23, 2017, 10:30:52 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 23, 2017, 06:39:26 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 05:31:03 PM
Top 10 films May 19-21 in UK.

1. King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, £2,501,993 from 564 sites (new)
2. Alien: Covenant, £2,127,347 from 631 sites. Total: £10,003,742 (two weeks)
3. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2, £1,942,687 from 599 sites. Total: £36,309,702 (four weeks)
4. Snatched, £842,489 from 465 sites (new)
5. The Boss Baby, £414,954 from 527 sites. Total: £26,819,979 (seven weeks)
6. A Dog's Purpose, £263,233 from 432 sites. Total: £2,464,023 (three weeks)
7. Fast & Furious 8, £230,868 from 346 sites. Total: £29,385,156 (six weeks)
8. Beauty and the Beast, £158,496 from 373 sites. Total: £71,878,441 (10 weeks)
9. Colossal, £150,642 from 145 sites (new)
10. Half Girlfriend, £115,183 from 67 sites (new)

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/may/23/king-arthur-alien-covenant-uk-box-office

In UK Covenant made 10 millions in 2 weeks. Prometheus in total made nearly 40 millions! Covenant is gonna flop BIG TIME!

Prometheus was Scott's biggest ever hit in the UK. Covenant is actually doing respectable business over here - it's in America it's struggling.
That's not a surprise... Covenant is almost like an arthouse film trying to be commercial. I'm not sure that naturally jives with American audiences as much as European's.

I really don't see it as being any more of an arthouse film than inception which made massive amounts of money in the US.
Nolan's Inception was off the back of a hugely popular film i.e. The Dark Knight. It also starred one of the biggest film stars (in terms of Hollywood). It had a much bigger budget and had substantially more action... and on a bigger scale. Inception is the better film, IMO, but its certainly more mainstream in terms of tone and structure, even if the concept was quite esoteric.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 11:00:33 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 23, 2017, 10:50:55 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 10:37:06 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 23, 2017, 10:30:52 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 23, 2017, 06:39:26 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 23, 2017, 05:31:03 PM
Top 10 films May 19-21 in UK.

1. King Arthur: Legend of the Sword, £2,501,993 from 564 sites (new)
2. Alien: Covenant, £2,127,347 from 631 sites. Total: £10,003,742 (two weeks)
3. Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2, £1,942,687 from 599 sites. Total: £36,309,702 (four weeks)
4. Snatched, £842,489 from 465 sites (new)
5. The Boss Baby, £414,954 from 527 sites. Total: £26,819,979 (seven weeks)
6. A Dog's Purpose, £263,233 from 432 sites. Total: £2,464,023 (three weeks)
7. Fast & Furious 8, £230,868 from 346 sites. Total: £29,385,156 (six weeks)
8. Beauty and the Beast, £158,496 from 373 sites. Total: £71,878,441 (10 weeks)
9. Colossal, £150,642 from 145 sites (new)
10. Half Girlfriend, £115,183 from 67 sites (new)

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/may/23/king-arthur-alien-covenant-uk-box-office

In UK Covenant made 10 millions in 2 weeks. Prometheus in total made nearly 40 millions! Covenant is gonna flop BIG TIME!

Prometheus was Scott's biggest ever hit in the UK. Covenant is actually doing respectable business over here - it's in America it's struggling.
That's not a surprise... Covenant is almost like an arthouse film trying to be commercial. I'm not sure that naturally jives with American audiences as much as European's.

I really don't see it as being any more of an arthouse film than inception which made massive amounts of money in the US.
Nolan's Inception was off the back of a hugely popular film i.e. The Dark Knight. It also starred one of the biggest film stars (in terms of Hollywood). It had a much bigger budget and had substantially more action... and on a bigger scale. Inception is the better film, IMO, but its certainly more mainstream in terms of tone and structure, even if the concept was quite esoteric.

Inception was way more indie than Covenant in most ways (Covenant is a horror film but that doesn't make it 'indie').  Everywhere from structure to tone.  Are you in a reality or not?  You could say Covenant maybe is borderline fairy tale/nightmare but overall it's sort of all over the place.  Honestly Covenant, like Nolan's movies, tries to be a summer blockbuster but inject a few higher concepts in it.

Much like Scott himself, it can't settle on one theme to really follow.  I don't think that makes it any more indie than any other movie, just unfocused.

Also, let's be honest, you are comparing it to a guy who just came off making a HUGE mainstream film in the Martian with one of the more bankable actors in hollywood.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 23, 2017, 11:07:38 PM
Both Inception & Alien Covenant are mainstream blockbusters.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 23, 2017, 11:13:15 PM
Yup. Stop making excuses for Covenant. Some films just don't do well.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 11:17:52 PM
So it dropped back down under GotG2 on Monday (it was also behind it on Sunday).  It's Monday actually showed a moderate drop off in line with Prometheus'
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 23, 2017, 11:18:35 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 23, 2017, 07:16:50 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 23, 2017, 07:09:18 PM
I am surprised Ridley hasn't nabbed Hardy for Prometheus or Covenant. He was at both premieres, and is a big admirer of the guy.

Covenant had amazing actors but nary a Charlize Theron or Idris Elba. Should've stuck James Franco and Tom Hardy in as Oram, Tennessee or Lope.

No way, Billy was outstanding as Oram


Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 07:10:57 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.

It's obvious you want a Full Action Aliens movie.

In that case, Neil Blomkamp is Mediocre TOO in terms of Action. They could get a Better Action Director.


Quote from: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.

Michael Fassbender is one of the greatest actors of all time BUT people hate him for some weird reason. Like Russell Crowe.

ALIEN: COVENANT 2 needs Tom Hardy. Hardy is a bigger star than Fassbender and he is a big fan of Sir Ridley Scott.

First, they need to keep Fassbender. He plays the role of David very well and that story needs to continue in some regard.

Second, yes I am completely on board with having Tom Hardy in the film. He was the better actor (IMO) in the Revenant. The problem we run into is that big actors require big money and Fox is probably going to limit Ridley in that regard.

I reckon Tom hardy would take a pay cut to work with Ridley

That's a good point actually. Ridley gave him his first job in Black Hawk Down so Tom has soft spot for Ridley. Same with Brad Pitt who Ridley launched in Thelma and Louise. I think he took a pay cut to appear in The Counsellor
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 11:21:50 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 23, 2017, 11:18:35 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 23, 2017, 07:16:50 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 23, 2017, 07:09:18 PM
I am surprised Ridley hasn't nabbed Hardy for Prometheus or Covenant. He was at both premieres, and is a big admirer of the guy.

Covenant had amazing actors but nary a Charlize Theron or Idris Elba. Should've stuck James Franco and Tom Hardy in as Oram, Tennessee or Lope.

No way, Billy was outstanding as Oram


Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 07:10:57 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.

It's obvious you want a Full Action Aliens movie.

In that case, Neil Blomkamp is Mediocre TOO in terms of Action. They could get a Better Action Director.


Quote from: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.

Michael Fassbender is one of the greatest actors of all time BUT people hate him for some weird reason. Like Russell Crowe.

ALIEN: COVENANT 2 needs Tom Hardy. Hardy is a bigger star than Fassbender and he is a big fan of Sir Ridley Scott.

First, they need to keep Fassbender. He plays the role of David very well and that story needs to continue in some regard.

Second, yes I am completely on board with having Tom Hardy in the film. He was the better actor (IMO) in the Revenant. The problem we run into is that big actors require big money and Fox is probably going to limit Ridley in that regard.

I reckon Tom hardy would take a pay cut to work with Ridley

That's a good point actually. Ridley gave him his first job in Black Hawk Down so Tom has soft spot for Ridley. Same with Brad Pitt who Ridley launched in Thelma and Louise. I think he took a pay cut to appear in The Counsellor

Guys, first, everyone took a pay cut to be in the Counselor.  Second, Pitt is NOT going to appear in Alien and 99% sure Hardy isn't either.  What is this?

Fassbender has been great and seems to love the character.  His character will be a main one moving forward.  Why would you switch?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 23, 2017, 11:26:28 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 23, 2017, 11:21:50 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 23, 2017, 11:18:35 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 23, 2017, 07:16:50 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 23, 2017, 07:09:18 PM
I am surprised Ridley hasn't nabbed Hardy for Prometheus or Covenant. He was at both premieres, and is a big admirer of the guy.

Covenant had amazing actors but nary a Charlize Theron or Idris Elba. Should've stuck James Franco and Tom Hardy in as Oram, Tennessee or Lope.

No way, Billy was outstanding as Oram


Quote from: cucuchu on May 23, 2017, 07:10:57 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 06:56:44 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 23, 2017, 05:03:22 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 23, 2017, 12:18:16 AM
I would prefer Sir Ridley Scott Directing ALIEN 5 with Sigourney Weaver very soon.

Neil Blomkamp is very overrated especially in AVP Forums.

The truth is Neil Blomkamp is very, very mediocre. He ISN'T capable of did a masterpiece like ALIEN or ALIENS.


Yea, i prefer very, very mediocre over AC train wreck.

It's obvious you want a Full Action Aliens movie.

In that case, Neil Blomkamp is Mediocre TOO in terms of Action. They could get a Better Action Director.


Quote from: Protozoid on May 23, 2017, 06:08:02 PM
Passengers had two huge stars and appealed to women. Only 30 percent of Covenant's crowd is women, and its only stars - Fassbender and the xeno - are actually possibly hurting the box office.  One analyst said Fassbender was a turnoff for regular audiences. I don't foresee any outcome where this is considered a hit. Not a flop, either, but certainly an under-performer.

Michael Fassbender is one of the greatest actors of all time BUT people hate him for some weird reason. Like Russell Crowe.

ALIEN: COVENANT 2 needs Tom Hardy. Hardy is a bigger star than Fassbender and he is a big fan of Sir Ridley Scott.

First, they need to keep Fassbender. He plays the role of David very well and that story needs to continue in some regard.

Second, yes I am completely on board with having Tom Hardy in the film. He was the better actor (IMO) in the Revenant. The problem we run into is that big actors require big money and Fox is probably going to limit Ridley in that regard.

I reckon Tom hardy would take a pay cut to work with Ridley

That's a good point actually. Ridley gave him his first job in Black Hawk Down so Tom has soft spot for Ridley. Same with Brad Pitt who Ridley launched in Thelma and Louise. I think he took a pay cut to appear in The Counsellor

Guys, first, everyone took a pay cut to be in the Counselor.  Second, Pitt is NOT going to appear in Alien and 99% sure Hardy isn't either.  What is this?

Fassbender has been great and seems to love the character.  His character will be a main one moving forward.  Why would you switch?

I wouldn't switch but the question was about getting a star name attached to add some box office clout. Given the links between Tom and Ridley I think it was a good point raised. Ridley is producing Toms tv show Taboo and given he gave him his first job I am sure he could pull in a favour


But it's all moot speculation anyway because based on the numbers so far there won't be another Alien from Ridley. For one I am glad. I would rather see him do Battle Of Britain. He only has so many films left in him so try something fresh.
Personally I would get Gareth Edwards to do the next Alien. He did a stellar job with Rogue One
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 24, 2017, 12:03:53 AM
Lindelof said for a brief moment, Pitt wanted to play David in Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 12:27:41 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 24, 2017, 12:03:53 AM
Lindelof said for a brief moment, Pitt wanted to play David in Prometheus.

The brief moment is all it is. Fassbender is perfect and there isn't really going to be another character.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 24, 2017, 01:27:18 AM
If the film plays exactly like Prometheus it will earn ~$88 mil, which when adjusted for inflation would be the lowest grossing film in the franchise apart from Requiem. Even if it hits $100 mil, which isn't a mathematical impossibility by any means, the only other film it would finish ahead of is Resurrection. I've probably posted a link to this page before, but check it out:

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=alien.htm
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 24, 2017, 01:40:37 AM
I hear baywatch and pirates are reviewing pretty terrible. It could happen guys!!!!





Lol but prob not
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 24, 2017, 01:40:54 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 24, 2017, 01:27:18 AM
If the film plays exactly like Prometheus it will earn ~$88 mil, which when adjusted for inflation would be the lowest grossing film in the franchise apart from Requiem. Even if it hits $100 mil, which isn't a mathematical impossibility by any means, the only other film it would finish ahead of is Resurrection. I've probably posted a link to this page before, but check it out:

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=alien.htm

That accounting for just domestic or ww in terms of lowest grossing?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 24, 2017, 02:05:26 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 24, 2017, 01:40:54 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 24, 2017, 01:27:18 AM
If the film plays exactly like Prometheus it will earn ~$88 mil, which when adjusted for inflation would be the lowest grossing film in the franchise apart from Requiem. Even if it hits $100 mil, which isn't a mathematical impossibility by any means, the only other film it would finish ahead of is Resurrection. I've probably posted a link to this page before, but check it out:

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=alien.htm

That accounting for just domestic or ww in terms of lowest grossing?

Domestic. WW grosses are never adjusted for inflation.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 24, 2017, 02:13:55 AM
The Monday gross was a steeper decline than AvP. It's not even in line to earn $80mill atm.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anthony on May 24, 2017, 02:37:17 AM
This weekend will probably be the weekend that sets Covenant's Box Office fate. Pirates and Baywatch this week alone (poor reviews aside, Pirates is tracking decently and Baywatch has Dwayne Johnson), AND it has an R rating and no IMAX and Dolby cinema after this week. If it falls hard this weekend....well, you know.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on May 24, 2017, 04:57:06 AM
Quote from: Anthony on May 24, 2017, 02:37:17 AM
This weekend will probably be the weekend that sets Covenant's Box Office fate. Pirates and Baywatch this week alone (poor reviews aside, Pirates is tracking decently and Baywatch has Dwayne Johnson), AND it has an R rating and no IMAX and Dolby cinema after this week. If it falls hard this weekend....well, you know.

The end of all life as we know it?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 24, 2017, 08:24:26 AM
If we gonna see (I sincerely doubt) Covenant sequel I hope Scott won't be on helm. Let somebody else do it. Scott's too big for it. He's so talented but he's simply wasting his time by making another Alien movies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bobby brown on May 24, 2017, 09:23:37 AM
And ours...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 24, 2017, 09:37:08 AM
if it was'nt scott it might have done even worse imo, besides alot of decent movies have failed at the BO in the last year and alot of new franchises simple did not happen. .power rangers, king arthur, fantastic 4. .to name a few. .still early days. .lets hope it knocks it in china and japan. .plus the end of the month is in sight. .121 mil. .it could have done worse so far. .look at a cure for wellness. .did not even cross it's budget yet . .and it was not a bad movie. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 24, 2017, 10:44:10 AM
I think it's normal for most films to drop by 40-50% at least after one weekend, especially rated R ones. Hopefully A:C is able to make its money through longevity. If it stays solid for a month, we'll be in good shape. It won't make Deadpool money but that movie was a unicorn amongst horses.

It's good for Covenant (but bad for Johnny Depp) that Pirates isn't tracking well, but it will most likely pull big numbers from being pg-13 and more kid-friendly.

Since the home media sales don't go into effect for a couple months, I'm guessing we won't know if the next sequel is greenlit until late fall or Christmas at the earliest.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 24, 2017, 10:44:27 AM
Covenant's second week in Australia.

1   KING ARTHUR: LEGEND OF THE SWORD   ROADSHOW   2,326,536
2   ALIEN: COVENANT   FOX   1,981,003
3   GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY VOL. 2   WALT DISNEY   1,907,742
4   JOHN WICK: CHAPTER TWO   STUDIOCANAL   1,829,123
5   SNATCHED   FOX   1,624,664
6   A DOG'S PURPOSE   ENTERTAINMENT ONE   692,850
7   VICEROY'S HOUSE   TRANSMISSION   603,056
8   GET OUT   UNIVERSAL   547,768
9   THE FATE OF THE FURIOUS   UNIVERSAL   167,845
10   THE ZOOKEEPER'S WIFE   ROADSHOW   138,962

http://iris.theaureview.com/australian-box-office-report-king-arthur-reigns-supreme-with-box-office-takings/

I have the feeling that movie won't even reach 300 million in total.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 24, 2017, 10:52:34 AM
can John Wick kill Alien ? (why release so late in Australia ?)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 10:55:40 AM
Actually it held a bit better than Prometheus in Australia (-49.5% vs -54,8% for the second weekend). It will definitely not match Prometheus' box office performance worldwide, unless the Chinese go gaga for it, but it's a cheaper movie and will end up a modest little earner. Just. Of course, in the age of mega-blockbusters this is not the best case scenario for Fox.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 11:45:14 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 24, 2017, 10:44:10 AM
I think it's normal for most films to drop by 40-50% at least after one weekend, especially rated R ones. Hopefully A:C is able to make its money through longevity. If it stays solid for a month, we'll be in good shape. It won't make Deadpool money but that movie was a unicorn amongst horses.

It's good for Covenant (but bad for Johnny Depp) that Pirates isn't tracking well, but it will most likely pull big numbers from being pg-13 and more kid-friendly.

Since the home media sales don't go into effect for a couple months, I'm guessing we won't know if the next sequel is greenlit until late fall or Christmas at the earliest.

Covenant and pirates aren't after the same audiences really. Plus pirates, last I checked, is tracking for about 80 million. Bay watch is tracking for 40. Things can change but covenant doesn't show signs of holding.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 24, 2017, 11:49:52 AM
we must bear in mind that it's being released in a sea of blockbusters and look at what happened to teenage mutant turtles. .out of the shadows. .was a better movie than the first. .but the former pulled it down. .i think prometheus is to blame to an extent. .even tho i loved prom. .but lets see. .way to early to tell. .i am hoping for some legs and good business in china. .i am telling u guys alot of movies are gonna fail during summer. .covenant is far from being considered a flop. .competition is way tougher than what prom had it. .they should have stucked to the august release imo .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 24, 2017, 12:46:06 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 11:45:14 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 24, 2017, 10:44:10 AM
I think it's normal for most films to drop by 40-50% at least after one weekend, especially rated R ones. Hopefully A:C is able to make its money through longevity. If it stays solid for a month, we'll be in good shape. It won't make Deadpool money but that movie was a unicorn amongst horses.

It's good for Covenant (but bad for Johnny Depp) that Pirates isn't tracking well, but it will most likely pull big numbers from being pg-13 and more kid-friendly.

Since the home media sales don't go into effect for a couple months, I'm guessing we won't know if the next sequel is greenlit until late fall or Christmas at the earliest.

Covenant and pirates aren't after the same audiences really. Plus pirates, last I checked, is tracking for about 80 million. Bay watch is tracking for 40. Things can change but covenant doesn't show signs of holding.

Bummer. I'm actually shocked because I thought A:C would blow Prometheus out of the water.

Does anyone here wonder if this film would have done much better had Prometheus not preceded it?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 24, 2017, 01:04:39 PM
it would have faired better if it did not have a 5 year waiting period. .and if covenant came first. .definately. .i mean it made prometheus almost not exist at all. .david could have been a new character and the engineers might have well never been introduced. . Same goes for shaw. .i loved the enginees. .they were uber hot. .but not essential. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 01:05:21 PM
Maybe it would do better if it was sold as a Prometheus sequel and not just another alien movie.

There hasn't been a big alien hit since 1986 and the last few movies to feature alien in the title were excrement. The trailers hid David and all mentions of Prometheus. General audience had no idea that this is a continuation of the story and not a whole new one. Marketing was pretty much: "This one has aliens. You like  aliens. Right?"
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 02:57:30 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 01:05:21 PM
Maybe it would do better if it was sold as a Prometheus sequel and not just another alien movie.

There hasn't been a big alien hit since 1986 and the last few movies to feature alien in the title were excrement. The trailers hid David and all mentions of Prometheus. General audience had no idea that this is a continuation of the story and not a whole new one. Marketing was pretty much: "This one has aliens. You like  aliens. Right?"

It's weird.  I think they should have gone forward with the sequel to Prometheus but for whatever reason Fox was dead convinced that the problem with Prometheus under performing was the lack of Aliens.  I just think they had some really bad marketing around Prometheus that also made it murky as to how connected IT would have been to Alien.

By deciding it HAD to be all Aliens now they created a weird situation where they could certainly push that in all of the ads (and they absolutely made it clear) but they also HAD to do SOMETHING to wrap up loose Prometheus threads.  So it had that hanging on to it and people not expecting that probably weren't fans of it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anthony on May 24, 2017, 03:14:09 PM
Does anyone know the total cost of marketing?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 03:28:26 PM
Covenant is the sequel to Prometheus. It just wasn't sold as a sequel to Prometheus because Fox marketing was convinced people wanted aliens, aliens and more aliens.

It's incredible that they basically hid David from ads -and therefore the premise of the film, presenting the movie as a reboot of alien. They started pushing the Prometheus angle with the Crossing, when they got early tracking and realised that the general audience didn't respond to marketing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 24, 2017, 03:34:12 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 02:57:30 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 01:05:21 PM
Maybe it would do better if it was sold as a Prometheus sequel and not just another alien movie.

There hasn't been a big alien hit since 1986 and the last few movies to feature alien in the title were excrement. The trailers hid David and all mentions of Prometheus. General audience had no idea that this is a continuation of the story and not a whole new one. Marketing was pretty much: "This one has aliens. You like  aliens. Right?"

It's weird.  I think they should have gone forward with the sequel to Prometheus but for whatever reason Fox was dead convinced that the problem with Prometheus under performing was the lack of Aliens.

Yeah. Fox f**ked up badly. Problem with Prometheus is not lack of Aliens. It's the script in general. They should have done proper Prometheus sequel instead of doing Alien prequel. They must be pissed off now but who cares? I don't. Not my money. Will we ever see Covenant sequel? I doubt that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 24, 2017, 03:41:07 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 24, 2017, 03:34:12 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 02:57:30 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 01:05:21 PM
Maybe it would do better if it was sold as a Prometheus sequel and not just another alien movie.

There hasn't been a big alien hit since 1986 and the last few movies to feature alien in the title were excrement. The trailers hid David and all mentions of Prometheus. General audience had no idea that this is a continuation of the story and not a whole new one. Marketing was pretty much: "This one has aliens. You like  aliens. Right?"

It's weird.  I think they should have gone forward with the sequel to Prometheus but for whatever reason Fox was dead convinced that the problem with Prometheus under performing was the lack of Aliens.

Yeah. Fox f**ked up badly. Problem with Prometheus is not lack of Aliens. It's the script in general. They should have done proper Prometheus sequel instead of doing Alien prequel. They must be pissed off now but who cares? I don't. Not my money. Will we ever see Covenant sequel? I doubt that.

I'm not sure what a 'proper' sequel to Prometheus would be but I don't think it would make any difference to the numbers. I think the damage had already been done with regards to Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 03:47:40 PM
Covenant is a proper sequel to Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 24, 2017, 04:04:00 PM
Covenant is a proper film!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 24, 2017, 04:04:36 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 03:47:40 PM
Covenant is a proper sequel to Prometheus.

No. It's not. Prometheus 2 was planned to be about Shaw and David.

Scott said once:

QuoteI know where it's going. I know that to keep [David] alive is essential and to keep [Elizabeth] alive is essential and to go where they came from, not where I came from, is essential.

QuoteBecause [the Engineers] are such aggressive f**kers ... and who wouldn't describe them that way, considering their brilliance in making dreadful devices and weapons that would make our chemical warfare look ridiculous? So I always had it in there that the God-like creature that you will see actually is not so nice, and is certainly not God. As she says, 'This is not what I thought it was going to be, and I think we should get the Hell out of here or there won't be any place to go back to.'

That's not necessarily planted in the ground at the tail end of the third act, but I knew that's kind of where we should go, because if we've opened up this door — which I hope we have because I certainly would like to do another one – I'd love to explore where the hell [Dr. Shaw] goes next and what does she do when she gets there, because if it is paradise, paradise can not be what you think it is. Paradise has a connotation of being extremely sinister and ominous.

Good read: http://collider.com/alien-covenant-original-story-prometheus-2/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 24, 2017, 04:09:44 PM
http://www.cine-directors.net/boxoff.htm

Second week stats from France. It doesn't show the total gross but number of admissions.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 24, 2017, 04:13:11 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 24, 2017, 04:04:36 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 03:47:40 PM
Covenant is a proper sequel to Prometheus.

No. It's not. Prometheus 2 was planned to be about Shaw and David.

Scott said once:

QuoteI know where it's going. I know that to keep [David] alive is essential and to keep [Elizabeth] alive is essential and to go where they came from, not where I came from, is essential.

QuoteBecause [the Engineers] are such aggressive f**kers ... and who wouldn't describe them that way, considering their brilliance in making dreadful devices and weapons that would make our chemical warfare look ridiculous? So I always had it in there that the God-like creature that you will see actually is not so nice, and is certainly not God. As she says, 'This is not what I thought it was going to be, and I think we should get the Hell out of here or there won't be any place to go back to.'

That's not necessarily planted in the ground at the tail end of the third act, but I knew that's kind of where we should go, because if we've opened up this door — which I hope we have because I certainly would like to do another one – I'd love to explore where the hell [Dr. Shaw] goes next and what does she do when she gets there, because if it is paradise, paradise can not be what you think it is. Paradise has a connotation of being extremely sinister and ominous.

Good read: http://collider.com/alien-covenant-original-story-prometheus-2/

But things change and evolve over time. Covenant is a sequel to Prometheus, it's just not the sequel you'd hoped for.

Had they made the film as originally intended I don't think it would have made any difference to the BO numbers because the damage had already been done and that idea would be a harder sell to the general public. It would have also required a much bigger budget
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 04:41:22 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 03:47:40 PM
Covenant is a proper sequel to Prometheus.

It isn't really.  It's one of the bigger hand waves away of the previous movie I have seen.  It doesn't care about virtually any of the ideas in Prometheus or one of the two major characters.  It almost relegated the entire species of Prometheus' antagonist down to a line of dialogue (as it is we got a 30 second clip of them washing their hands clean of having to touch them again)....

And, perhaps biggest of all, Prometheus wanted nothing really to do with Aliens...  this one is establishing itself as clearly having a lot to do with them.

It happens after Prometheus in sequential order and it does indeed try to neatly wrap all ties to that movie up in a few minutes but it is hardly a proper sequel in nearly any sense.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 05:43:12 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

I agree 100%.

PROMETHEUS(3D) was marketed as "THE RETURN OF RIDLEY SCOTT TO SCI-FI".

That's why it did better. ALIEN fans are very few. ALIEN: COVENANT was marketed "ONLY FOR ALIEN FANS".

Even here, everybody want A FULL ACTION ALIENS movie.

I'm one of the very few(or the only one here) who loved ALIEN, PROMETHEUS(3D) and ALIEN: COVENANT. Most teenagers in this Planet NEVER saw the original ALIEN.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 24, 2017, 05:43:46 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

Do you actually believe that wider audiences would have gone to see a film with Noomi Rapace travelling around the galaxy with an androids head meeting big blue aliens? Cause I don't think they would.

I think fox played the percentages and went with what they thought had the wider appeal. It doesn't look like it worked but I don't think the alternative would have either. In box office terms anyway because I like both films.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 24, 2017, 05:49:54 PM
I think Prometheus did better because audiences didn't actually know what to expect. The series had a gigantic break in terms of years passed, plus it had bigger budget, so naturally more ubiquitous marketing and it also had one of the best trailers ever. Seriously. Whatever happens next, Fox / Ridley will be in a hard position to market it, although probably at the end of the day also Fox must swallow the fact it's not gonna earn that much but Ridley must be allowed to do what he wants to do because doing another 180 would just destroy everything and I think the next one really has a chance to become something really special. I want more actors like Crudup in it!!!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 24, 2017, 05:58:52 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 24, 2017, 05:49:54 PM
I think Prometheus did better because audiences didn't actually know what to expect. The series had a gigantic break in terms of years passed, plus it had bigger budget, so naturally more ubiquitous marketing and it also had one of the best trailers ever. Seriously. Whatever happens next, Fox / Ridley will be in a hard position to market it, although probably at the end of the day also Fox must swallow the fact it's not gonna earn that much but Ridley must be allowed to do what he wants to do because doing another 180 would just destroy everything and I think the next one really has a chance to become something really special. I want more actors like Crudup in it!!!

I agree with all of that
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 24, 2017, 06:30:42 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 05:43:12 PM
Even here, everybody want A FULL ACTION ALIENS movie.

That's a generalization and quite frankly, an inaccurate one.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 06:49:51 PM
Also, I believe that modern movie marketing, which reveals all story beats and setpieces through a never ending onslaught of trailers, TV spots and featuretes is counter-productive. By the time the movie is released, general audiences are fatigued and feel not only like they've watched the movie already but also that they've watched a bad version of the movie, with no nuance or character beats. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 24, 2017, 06:53:05 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 24, 2017, 06:49:51 PM
Also, I belive that modern movie marketing, which reveals all story beats and setpieces through a never ending onslaught of trailers, TV spots and featuretes is counter-productive. By the time the movie is released, general audiences are fatigued and feel not only like they've watched the movie already but also that they've watched a bad version of the movie, with no nuance or character beats.

I don't think that helps either
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 07:25:54 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 05:43:12 PM
Even here, everybody want A FULL ACTION ALIENS movie.

I absolutely did not.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 24, 2017, 07:31:43 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 05:43:12 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

I agree 100%.

PROMETHEUS(3D) was marketed as "THE RETURN OF RIDLEY SCOTT TO SCI-FI".

That's why it did better. ALIEN fans are very few. ALIEN: COVENANT was marketed "ONLY FOR ALIEN FANS".

Even here, everybody want A FULL ACTION ALIENS movie.

I'm one of the very few(or the only one here) who loved ALIEN, PROMETHEUS(3D) and ALIEN: COVENANT. Most teenagers in this Planet NEVER saw the original ALIEN.

People just want a good a good a good movie. That's it, all, and everything.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 07:32:08 PM
Agree with the people saying Prometheus did better because of the mystery and the anticipation of a brand new alien film. Nobody knew what to expect. The trailers looked amazing. It was Ridley returning. You could see just by the fake synopses floating around that people hoped it was going to be a very different film to the one that turned up. Prometheus completely burned the audience.

Really when you think about it, it's amazing Covenant managed a thirty-six million opening weekend.

Though tbh, I think the studio anticipated this. It's why the budget was so low. The chances of it making money from that starting point were very high, and I think they'll ultimately be borne out.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 07:46:12 PM
Quote from: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 07:32:08 PM
Agree with the people saying Prometheus did better because of the mystery and the anticipation of a brand new alien film. Nobody knew what to expect. The trailers looked amazing. It was Ridley returning. You could see just by the fake synopses floating around that people hoped it was going to be a very different film to the one that turned up. Prometheus completely burned the audience.

Really when you think about it, it's amazing Covenant managed a thirty-six million opening weekend.

Though tbh, I think the studio anticipated this. It's why the budget was so low. The chances of it making money from that starting point were very high, and I think they'll ultimately be borne out.

I doubt that.

They saved A LOT of money filmed everything in Australia. Australian tax rebates saved like 60 Millions for them.

Sir Ridley did the same thing with EXODUS(3D). The initial budget of EXODUS(3D) was 200 Millions. The final budget was 140 Millions thanks to Spain and its tax rebates.

The same with Australia and its tax rebates.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on May 24, 2017, 07:47:39 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 24, 2017, 07:31:43 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 05:43:12 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

I agree 100%.

PROMETHEUS(3D) was marketed as "THE RETURN OF RIDLEY SCOTT TO SCI-FI".

That's why it did better. ALIEN fans are very few. ALIEN: COVENANT was marketed "ONLY FOR ALIEN FANS".

Even here, everybody want A FULL ACTION ALIENS movie.

I'm one of the very few(or the only one here) who loved ALIEN, PROMETHEUS(3D) and ALIEN: COVENANT. Most teenagers in this Planet NEVER saw the original ALIEN.

People just want a good a good a good movie. That's it, all, and everything.

Everybody wants a "good movie", but that's largely subjective and means different things to different people. I doubt they will ever make an Alien film that pretty much has universal appeal.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 07:52:34 PM
Quote from: Darth Vile on May 24, 2017, 07:47:39 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 24, 2017, 07:31:43 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 05:43:12 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

I agree 100%.

PROMETHEUS(3D) was marketed as "THE RETURN OF RIDLEY SCOTT TO SCI-FI".

That's why it did better. ALIEN fans are very few. ALIEN: COVENANT was marketed "ONLY FOR ALIEN FANS".

Even here, everybody want A FULL ACTION ALIENS movie.

I'm one of the very few(or the only one here) who loved ALIEN, PROMETHEUS(3D) and ALIEN: COVENANT. Most teenagers in this Planet NEVER saw the original ALIEN.

People just want a good a good a good movie. That's it, all, and everything.

Everybody wants a "good movie", but that's largely subjective and means different things to different people. I doubt they will ever make an Alien film that pretty much has universal appeal.

I agree.

The same with STAR WARS.

People only love ALIEN and ALIENS. People only love STAR WARS IV and STAR WARS V.

A lot of people hate the other 15 movies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 08:06:19 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 07:46:12 PM
Quote from: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 07:32:08 PM
Agree with the people saying Prometheus did better because of the mystery and the anticipation of a brand new alien film. Nobody knew what to expect. The trailers looked amazing. It was Ridley returning. You could see just by the fake synopses floating around that people hoped it was going to be a very different film to the one that turned up. Prometheus completely burned the audience.

Really when you think about it, it's amazing Covenant managed a thirty-six million opening weekend.

Though tbh, I think the studio anticipated this. It's why the budget was so low. The chances of it making money from that starting point were very high, and I think they'll ultimately be borne out.


I doubt that.

They saved A LOT of money filmed everything in Australia. Australian tax rebates saved like 60 Millions for them.

Sir Ridley did the same thing with EXODUS(3D). The initial budget of EXODUS(3D) was 200 Millions. The final budget was 140 Millions thanks to Spain and its tax rebates.

The same with Australia and its tax rebates.

Apologies, I don't know what you're doubting? That the studio anticipated a lower take?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on May 24, 2017, 08:43:49 PM
With A:C the franchise is kinda dead to me. David creating the Alien p****** on all the things that made Alien interesting for me in the first place. From here on its all moustache twirling evil cyborg and his chamber of horror vs the 4681th Ripley clone. Who wants to see that?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: RandomNumber on May 24, 2017, 09:02:55 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

I agree 100%.

When I first saw Prometheus, I was confused by a few aspects of the movie. As time went on, I appreciated more and more what a marvelous piece of work it is.

Prometheus gave us David, it portrayed a budding relationship between David and Shaw, it was an immersive exploration into a world far outside human experience, and the filmmakers weren't afraid of ambient lighting, which is unusual these days and shows a high degree of visual confidence.

I'm not sure we're going to get another Alien movie soon. But if we do, I hope Fox follows the expansive intent of Prometheus -- even if it means cutting loose the old-school fan base.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 09:24:28 PM
Quote from: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 08:06:19 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 07:46:12 PM
Quote from: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 07:32:08 PM
Agree with the people saying Prometheus did better because of the mystery and the anticipation of a brand new alien film. Nobody knew what to expect. The trailers looked amazing. It was Ridley returning. You could see just by the fake synopses floating around that people hoped it was going to be a very different film to the one that turned up. Prometheus completely burned the audience.

Really when you think about it, it's amazing Covenant managed a thirty-six million opening weekend.

Though tbh, I think the studio anticipated this. It's why the budget was so low. The chances of it making money from that starting point were very high, and I think they'll ultimately be borne out.


I doubt that.

They saved A LOT of money filmed everything in Australia. Australian tax rebates saved like 60 Millions for them.

Sir Ridley did the same thing with EXODUS(3D). The initial budget of EXODUS(3D) was 200 Millions. The final budget was 140 Millions thanks to Spain and its tax rebates.

The same with Australia and its tax rebates.

Apologies, I don't know what you're doubting? That the studio anticipated a lower take?

I doubt that the initial budget was small.

I read that the initial budget was 150 Millions.

AFTER Australian tax rebates they saved like 60 Millions.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 09:26:19 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 09:24:28 PM
Quote from: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 08:06:19 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 07:46:12 PM
Quote from: MightyViper on May 24, 2017, 07:32:08 PM
Agree with the people saying Prometheus did better because of the mystery and the anticipation of a brand new alien film. Nobody knew what to expect. The trailers looked amazing. It was Ridley returning. You could see just by the fake synopses floating around that people hoped it was going to be a very different film to the one that turned up. Prometheus completely burned the audience.

Really when you think about it, it's amazing Covenant managed a thirty-six million opening weekend.

Though tbh, I think the studio anticipated this. It's why the budget was so low. The chances of it making money from that starting point were very high, and I think they'll ultimately be borne out.


I doubt that.

They saved A LOT of money filmed everything in Australia. Australian tax rebates saved like 60 Millions for them.

Sir Ridley did the same thing with EXODUS(3D). The initial budget of EXODUS(3D) was 200 Millions. The final budget was 140 Millions thanks to Spain and its tax rebates.

The same with Australia and its tax rebates.

Apologies, I don't know what you're doubting? That the studio anticipated a lower take?

I doubt that the initial budget was small.

I read that the initial budget was 150 Millions.

AFTER Australian tax rebates they saved like 60 Millions.

But the initial budget doesn't really work against my argument? They knew they were getting those rebates. So they knew what the actual budget was going to be. They fully planned for it to be 100 million or less.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 09:28:31 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 24, 2017, 08:43:49 PM
With A:C the franchise is kinda dead to me. David creating the Alien p****** on all the things that made Alien interesting for me in the first place. From here on its all moustache twirling evil cyborg and his chamber of horror vs the 4681th Ripley clone. Who wants to see that?

IF Sir Ridley does one more(probably Scott is leaving by his own decision):

It's going to be Michael Fassbender and his Aliens VERSUS Colonial Marines.

EVERYONE in All Internet wants Colonial Marines(except me) so FOX and Sir Ridley are going to return to those Colonial Marines.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 24, 2017, 09:40:06 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 09:28:31 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 24, 2017, 08:43:49 PM
With A:C the franchise is kinda dead to me. David creating the Alien p****** on all the things that made Alien interesting for me in the first place. From here on its all moustache twirling evil cyborg and his chamber of horror vs the 4681th Ripley clone. Who wants to see that?

IF Sir Ridley does one more(probably Scott is leaving by his own decision):

It's going to be Michael Fassbender and his Aliens VERSUS Colonial Marines.

EVERYONE in All Internet wants Colonial Marines(except me) so FOX and Sir Ridley are going to return to those Colonial Marines.

Scott will very likely get to finish his prequel series in short time with one more film should he feel the desire.

No, not everyone wants that Colonial Marines movie but I will say that making the movie a bit more action oriented and with well-known actors will help. As much as I hate to say it: Give the Angry Joe's what they want while maintaining some horrifying exposition and bring in some big name actors/actresses, include a hard hitting pay off in the 3rd act, and you will have something that could bring mass appeal. The movie I want? Not really. Prometheus and Alien Covenant were movies I  liked and not many others did so I am willing to accept the mass audience might want something different but that I could still enjoy.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 24, 2017, 10:02:55 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 09:28:31 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 24, 2017, 08:43:49 PM
With A:C the franchise is kinda dead to me. David creating the Alien p****** on all the things that made Alien interesting for me in the first place. From here on its all moustache twirling evil cyborg and his chamber of horror vs the 4681th Ripley clone. Who wants to see that?

IF Sir Ridley does one more(probably Scott is leaving by his own decision):

It's going to be Michael Fassbender and his Aliens VERSUS Colonial Marines.

EVERYONE in All Internet wants Colonial Marines(except me) so FOX and Sir Ridley are going to return to those Colonial Marines.

Most people do not want that.  It will not happen.


Looking at the weekday holds, it's out performing its weekend slide.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on May 24, 2017, 10:11:09 PM
In my eyes Davids Aliens vs Colonial Marines sounds like a worthy sequel plot to Alien: Covenant.

Its even a worthy title. ALIENS: DAVIDS ALIENS (RICOS ROUGHNECKS) VS NEORINES (Marines surgically improved with black goo)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 24, 2017, 10:12:55 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 09:28:31 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 24, 2017, 08:43:49 PM
With A:C the franchise is kinda dead to me. David creating the Alien p****** on all the things that made Alien interesting for me in the first place. From here on its all moustache twirling evil cyborg and his chamber of horror vs the 4681th Ripley clone. Who wants to see that?

IF Sir Ridley does one more(probably Scott is leaving by his own decision):

It's going to be Michael Fassbender and his Aliens VERSUS Colonial Marines.

EVERYONE in All Internet wants Colonial Marines(except me) so FOX and Sir Ridley are going to return to those Colonial Marines.

I don't want colonial marines and I'll be very surprised if we were to see them in a follow up to Covenant
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: razeak on May 24, 2017, 10:22:28 PM
I would watch more Colonial Marines. I'm not too picky, but we have had 5 movies that lean more on Alien than Aliens. I just worry they wouod hire bad crews is AvP and AvPR.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 24, 2017, 10:30:48 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 24, 2017, 09:28:31 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 24, 2017, 08:43:49 PM
With A:C the franchise is kinda dead to me. David creating the Alien p****** on all the things that made Alien interesting for me in the first place. From here on its all moustache twirling evil cyborg and his chamber of horror vs the 4681th Ripley clone. Who wants to see that?

IF Sir Ridley does one more(probably Scott is leaving by his own decision):

It's going to be Michael Fassbender and his Aliens VERSUS Colonial Marines.

EVERYONE in All Internet wants Colonial Marines(except me) so FOX and Sir Ridley are going to return to those Colonial Marines.

Pierre you need to stop speaking for the fans and filmmakers alike. You don't know anything. This is all sprung from your own imagination.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 25, 2017, 03:12:50 AM
I feel like this thread goes off topic a lot.

Anyways, it made $3.38 mil on Tuesday; new total 42.87 mil. WW is at $124.6 mil.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on May 25, 2017, 10:06:49 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 25, 2017, 03:12:50 AM
I feel like this thread goes off topic a lot.

Anyways, it made $3.38 mil on Tuesday; new total 42.87 mil. WW is at $124.6 mil.

I'm surprised it has been continuing to hold the $3+ million intake for weekdays. If this keeps up, it will be in the neighborhood of $50 million on Friday and then should benefit from the holiday weekend. Doesn't seem like it will quite inch to $100 million domestically, but we'll see.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 25, 2017, 10:15:46 AM
If it doesn't collapse this weekend, I predict it will end its run with $95-$105 million in the US and around $280 million worldwide excl. China.

It will be a huge PR boost if it breaks out in China -not to mention a huge incentive to proceed with a sequel ASAP, since the deal concerning the studios' cut from Chinese box office is currently being renegotiated.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 10:27:56 AM
what about japan. .is'nt that also supposed to be a huge market?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 25, 2017, 10:43:44 AM
It's an important market, and it will help the movie approach $300 million. To keep things into perspective, Prometheus grossed $21 million there, so Covenant should end up with around $14 million.

China is the second biggest market worldwide and very soon it will be the biggest. And let's not forget that Prometheus didn't open in China. China could contribute anything from $30-100+ million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 10:51:27 AM
Well this is all sounding much more positive.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 25, 2017, 11:00:52 AM
Fox is definitely disappointed this didn't take off they way they hoped it would. The movie under-performed but it's not a flop.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 11:04:30 AM
Now you've spoiled my new found optimism   :(
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 02:04:44 PM
one of the chinese members mentioned that prometheus was released in china. .tho i am not sure if it was a proper release or weather it only played at film festivals. .i know apparently it was very cut. .it missed the entire medpod scene and milburn and fifields fate. .hope covenant does not get the same treatment over their. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 25, 2017, 02:18:15 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 11:04:30 AM
Now you've spoiled my new found optimism   :(

Why would you be optimistic. Opening weekend is what matters.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 25, 2017, 02:28:46 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 25, 2017, 02:18:15 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 11:04:30 AM
Now you've spoiled my new found optimism   :(

Why would you be optimistic. Opening weekend is what matters.

Depends on your criteria for being optimistic. For example, I am optimistic that it will at least make its money back once its all said and done. I enjoyed the movie, though I am not excited about the Xeno's creation, so I'm optimistic to see how Ridley Scott finishes out the prequel series with hopefully one more movie. Now if he says he wants to officially make 4 more movies or whatever, then that optimism will deflate quickly. Give him one more movie, let him finish his story, and lets get a fresh director.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 02:29:44 PM
legs is what matters!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 02:37:29 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 25, 2017, 02:18:15 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 11:04:30 AM
Now you've spoiled my new found optimism   :(

Why would you be optimistic. Opening weekend is what matters.

I would have thought the final takings would be what matters to Fox
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 25, 2017, 02:38:44 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 02:29:44 PM
legs is what matters!

My chief concern with it now is that it has lost the more premium screens, which have now been given to Pirates and Baywatch (mostly Pirates). This weekend will be very telling though, one way or another. I'll remain cautiously optimistic though  :)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 03:19:29 PM
i hope pirates and baywatch fails. .mind u i loved the original pirates movie. .but the rest of them has been crap so far with some of the most incoherent plots i have ever come across. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 25, 2017, 03:24:59 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 03:19:29 PM
i hope pirates and baywatch fails. .mind u i loved the original pirates movie. .but the rest of them has been crap so far with some of the most incoherent plots i have ever come across. .

That crowd that props up the success stories of the Pirate films tend to care little about poor reviews, which Pirates 5 is receiving en masse. Baywatch might get destroyed though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 03:27:43 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 25, 2017, 03:24:59 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 03:19:29 PM
i hope pirates and baywatch fails. .mind u i loved the original pirates movie. .but the rest of them has been crap so far with some of the most incoherent plots i have ever come across. .

That crowd that props up the success stories of the Pirate films tend to care little about poor reviews, which Pirates 5 is receiving en masse. Baywatch might get destroyed though.

Yeah, only the first Pirates film was any good but the kids love them and the schools are on half term next week in England so I expect it will do very well here.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 03:42:41 PM
i love the whole science of the box office and budget vs BO and the marketing that has to be taken into account. .from what i have learned. .the basic rule of thumb is that a movie needs to make between 3 to 4 times it.s budget to break even. .seeing as marketing figures are seldomly revealed and generally harder to calculate. .i watched percy jackson and the sea of monsters the other day and kinda enjoyed it mostly for the FX. .a fun popcorn flick. .they were planning a sequal that never happened. .it had more or less the same budget as covenant. .made 202 mil at the box office. .the firts one. .the lightning thieve had a similar budget and made 223 mil. .and i am surprised the second one even got made. .i guess they were hoping for a better BO the second time around. .maybe the first one got excused cause it was the beginning of a new franchise. .it's hard to imagine how either made a profit based on those figures tho. . ??!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 25, 2017, 04:03:17 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 02:37:29 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 25, 2017, 02:18:15 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 11:04:30 AM
Now you've spoiled my new found optimism   :(

Why would you be optimistic. Opening weekend is what matters.

I would have thought the final takings would be what matters to Fox

Yeah but if the opening weekend disappoints then why the hell would the final total be any good. Covenant wont have legs. It'll just do ok at best. I think it's even coming out the same day as Transformers in China.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 04:07:49 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 25, 2017, 04:03:17 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 02:37:29 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 25, 2017, 02:18:15 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 25, 2017, 11:04:30 AM
Now you've spoiled my new found optimism   :(

Why would you be optimistic. Opening weekend is what matters.

I would have thought the final takings would be what matters to Fox

Yeah but if the opening weekend disappoints then why the hell would the final total be any good. Covenant wont have legs. It'll just do ok at best. I think it's even coming out the same day as Transformers in China.

True but we can always have hope. Those of us that want a follow up anyway
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 25, 2017, 04:50:51 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 03:42:41 PM
i love the whole science of the box office and budget vs BO and the marketing that has to be taken into account. .from what i have learned. .the basic rule of thumb is that a movie needs to make between 3 to 4 times it.s budget to break even. .seeing as marketing figures are seldomly revealed and generally harder to calculate. .i watched percy jackson and the sea of monsters the other day and kinda enjoyed it mostly for the FX. .a fun popcorn flick. .they were planning a sequal that never happened. .it had more or less the same budget as covenant. .made 202 mil at the box office. .the firts one. .the lightning thieve had a similar budget and made 223 mil. .and i am surprised the second one even got made. .i guess they were hoping for a better BO the second time around. .maybe the first one got excused cause it was the beginning of a new franchise. .it's hard to imagine how either made a profit based on those figures tho. . ??!

I never believe in that theory.

CIVIL WAR(Marvel Disney) costed 400 Millions(budget plus marketing). It made 1.2 Billions at the box office. Everybody said it was a huge success. By that false theory, it only made 3 times so it's a failure.

The same with ALMOST ALL movies in this Planet.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 05:53:48 PM
. .400 mil. .jesus. .i thought it was meh. . .or ok better than meh. .but still. .well everyone thought kong was a huge success. .aparently . .not. .it was'nt a failure but not exactly a success either. .suppose it's different for each movie. .but lets say 3 times the budget give or take depending on marketing cost. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 25, 2017, 08:57:02 PM
I refuse to believe that if a studio can't make a profit off a film making 3X it's budget that they'd even both financing the project to begin with. Since Civil War was mention, if you go back to MCU Phase 1, both First Avenger & Thor were treated as success. Thor made 3X it's budget & First Avenger made less than 2.5X it's budget. Marketing costs generally go unreported, but for marquee films such as Civil War, or Batman vs. Superman, a combined budget & marketing cost of $400 mil is likely. Despite that, if you or anyone is suggesting Civil War isn't a success at ~$1.2 bil, you're crazy. Beyond that, said films surely cleaned up on home video.

Anyways, Covenant earned $2.17 mil on Weds for a total of $45.04 mil. Tuesday is almost always the weekday highpoint.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 25, 2017, 09:47:36 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 25, 2017, 04:50:51 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 03:42:41 PM
i love the whole science of the box office and budget vs BO and the marketing that has to be taken into account. .from what i have learned. .the basic rule of thumb is that a movie needs to make between 3 to 4 times it.s budget to break even. .seeing as marketing figures are seldomly revealed and generally harder to calculate. .i watched percy jackson and the sea of monsters the other day and kinda enjoyed it mostly for the FX. .a fun popcorn flick. .they were planning a sequal that never happened. .it had more or less the same budget as covenant. .made 202 mil at the box office. .the firts one. .the lightning thieve had a similar budget and made 223 mil. .and i am surprised the second one even got made. .i guess they were hoping for a better BO the second time around. .maybe the first one got excused cause it was the beginning of a new franchise. .it's hard to imagine how either made a profit based on those figures tho. . ??!

I never believe in that theory.

CIVIL WAR(Marvel Disney) costed 400 Millions(budget plus marketing). It made 1.2 Billions at the box office. Everybody said it was a huge success. By that false theory, it only made 3 times so it's a failure.

The same with ALMOST ALL movies in this Planet.

Profit when all was said and done was even less than that:

http://deadline.com/2017/04/most-profitable-movies-2016-secret-life-of-pets-deadpool-disney-1202060846/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 25, 2017, 10:58:03 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 25, 2017, 04:50:51 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 25, 2017, 03:42:41 PM
i love the whole science of the box office and budget vs BO and the marketing that has to be taken into account. .from what i have learned. .the basic rule of thumb is that a movie needs to make between 3 to 4 times it.s budget to break even. .seeing as marketing figures are seldomly revealed and generally harder to calculate. .i watched percy jackson and the sea of monsters the other day and kinda enjoyed it mostly for the FX. .a fun popcorn flick. .they were planning a sequal that never happened. .it had more or less the same budget as covenant. .made 202 mil at the box office. .the firts one. .the lightning thieve had a similar budget and made 223 mil. .and i am surprised the second one even got made. .i guess they were hoping for a better BO the second time around. .maybe the first one got excused cause it was the beginning of a new franchise. .it's hard to imagine how either made a profit based on those figures tho. . ??!

I never believe in that theory.

CIVIL WAR(Marvel Disney) costed 400 Millions(budget plus marketing). It made 1.2 Billions at the box office. Everybody said it was a huge success. By that false theory, it only made 3 times so it's a failure.

The same with ALMOST ALL movies in this Planet.

I mean you can go ahead and not believe whatever you want but that doesn't mean it isn't true.

The box office isn't everything but it's a lot. Civil war made money though. It took in a profit of 200 domestic and 290 over seas.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 01:52:20 AM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=daily&id=alienparadiselost.htm

$2,173,358 on wesnesday.

Dosmestic
$45,041,692
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 26, 2017, 01:54:15 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 25, 2017, 08:57:02 PM
Anyways, Covenant earned $2.17 mil on Weds for a total of $45.04 mil. Tuesday is almost always the weekday highpoint.

Quote from: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 01:52:20 AM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=daily&id=alienparadiselost.htm

$2,173,358 on wesnesday.

Dosmestic
$45,041,692

I had you covered a couple posts back  ;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 26, 2017, 02:05:11 AM
ME FIRST ME FIRST ALWAYS ME FIRST
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 02:09:23 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 26, 2017, 01:54:15 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 25, 2017, 08:57:02 PM
Anyways, Covenant earned $2.17 mil on Weds for a total of $45.04 mil. Tuesday is almost always the weekday highpoint.

Quote from: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 01:52:20 AM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=daily&id=alienparadiselost.htm

$2,173,358 on wesnesday.

Dosmestic
$45,041,692

I had you covered a couple posts back  ;)

i skip a lot of post/page when people talk about other movies box office.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dookie on May 26, 2017, 03:47:30 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

Perfectly summed up.


Oh, and the "Aliens vs Colonial Marines" concept is a joke. Good luck with that one. The masses do not want to see that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 26, 2017, 04:06:59 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 02:09:23 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 26, 2017, 01:54:15 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 25, 2017, 08:57:02 PM
Anyways, Covenant earned $2.17 mil on Weds for a total of $45.04 mil. Tuesday is almost always the weekday highpoint.

Quote from: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 01:52:20 AM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=daily&id=alienparadiselost.htm

$2,173,358 on wesnesday.

Dosmestic
$45,041,692

I had you covered a couple posts back  ;)

i skip a lot of post/page when people talk about other movies box office.

Yeah, this thread deviates from course a lot
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 11:26:17 AM
Quote from: dookie on May 26, 2017, 03:47:30 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 24, 2017, 04:55:56 PM
Prometheus did better because it was better, fresher, and had broader appeal.

Covenant is ranking because fewer people want to see an Alien sequel than a standalone SciFi epic by Ridley Scott. Scott should have done Prometheus 2, or The Forever War, or even Blade Runner 2049. Another Alien movie is something that only hardcore Alien fans wanted,the same vocal minority that is trying to skew reality by spamming the internet with their impressions that Prometheus was a bad film that nobody liked. Fox should not listen to the Alien fans any more. There is no gain for them to make the effort. Tom Rothman, Damon Lindelof, andScott were right to take Prometheus in a new direction. They would have saved the franchise if they had continued. Fox effed this up.

Perfectly summed up.


Oh, and the "Aliens vs Colonial Marines" concept is a joke. Good luck with that one. The masses do not want to see that.

you probably never read/play any aliens game/comic/novel



game is pretty bad but trailer f...king awesome !
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 26, 2017, 11:51:42 AM
No, I don't want a junk food movie of tough guys in space shooting at big bugs. Or a septuagenarian Sigourney Weaver running around dark corridors. Very few people do.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 11:55:55 AM
Few ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 26, 2017, 12:16:26 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 26, 2017, 11:51:42 AM
No, I don't want a junk food movie of tough guys in space shooting at big bugs. Or a septuagenarian Sigourney Weaver running around dark corridors. Very few people do.

A colonial marines movie does not have to be as you described. I am not saying it's for everyone either. An alien film featuring colonial marines taking the threat seriously and making smart decisions and then depicting the aliens as not just bugs would be something I might like.

Imagine a competent officer in charge with competent NCO's to carry out his commands. Put some big name actors in there that people care about. They make smart decisions but even then once they meet the threat, the aliens are extremely intelligent and with all their fire power and training they only take out one alien (maybe), then they back out to request back up, command chain links are broken due to casualties, etc. Throw in some horrific exposition in there about the xeno, maintain their integrity, and don't allow them to be cannon fodder. Make it look like the colonial marines have literally no chance to even survive this, much less deal with the threat.

Point is, it can be a story well told without macho dudes exploding xeno heads with their space rifles. It can just annotate that even the best, most highly trained elite of the elite "warriors" of our species are just cattle for the slaughter against the xeno. Of course this means making the xeno much more intelligent than the Covenant xeno, or we will have marines throwing a chicken leg out the air lock and the xeno will jump to its death to eat it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 26, 2017, 12:28:14 PM
Too many Pirate Showtime in my courntry

https://moveedoo.com/th/movie/pirates-of-the-caribbean-salazars-revenge/


Covenant Showtime (comeout 2 week ago)

https://moveedoo.com/th/movie/alien-covenant/

PS.website missing many theater (we has 2 Theater Business company that are rival)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Bishop2 on May 26, 2017, 02:57:51 PM
At this point, I'm assuming that we are indeed going to see a third film in the prequel line.

- Ridley and others have said more than once that Prometheus performed "very well" and that's why we got Covenant at all.

- Despite the poor-sounding gross in North America, I've seen professional box-office analysts remark that Alien is typically overseas-loaded .... and indeed, it's doing better elsewhere.

- This movie is indeed doing worse business than Prometheus, but it also had a smaller budget. Prometheus made approximately its budget amount in North America (actually slightly less) and a total of approximately three times its budget worldwide, and it does seem like Covenant is tracking to do similarly in North America in relation to its lower budget. So really, the big question now is how well this film holds in overseas markets for its remaining weeks.

- With all that said: I have to wonder what form the third film would take. This is gonna be down to the wire in terms of whether it deserves another entry. Will it be the "midquel" that Scott has referenced? Will it become a true third film in the series? Will Fox demand more changes for the next movie (like "more aliens, more aliens, maybe soldiers!" or something like that), and will Scott back off of director and go into Producer mode if he loses interest in any new direction? Will the budget need to be slashed again to justify it to the higher-ups, and if so, will that kill it? Maybe the higher-ups will even demand a complete divorce from Prometheus/Covenant characters, and David will have to be ousted quickly? Very curious to see how this winds up....
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 26, 2017, 04:58:42 PM
Quote from: Bishop2 on May 26, 2017, 02:57:51 PM
At this point, I'm assuming that we are indeed going to see a third film in the prequel line.

- Ridley and others have said more than once that Prometheus performed "very well" and that's why we got Covenant at all.

- Despite the poor-sounding gross in North America, I've seen professional box-office analysts remark that Alien is typically overseas-loaded .... and indeed, it's doing better elsewhere.

- This movie is indeed doing worse business than Prometheus, but it also had a smaller budget. Prometheus made approximately its budget amount in North America (actually slightly less) and a total of approximately three times its budget worldwide, and it does seem like Covenant is tracking to do similarly in North America in relation to its lower budget. So really, the big question now is how well this film holds in overseas markets for its remaining weeks.

- With all that said: I have to wonder what form the third film would take. This is gonna be down to the wire in terms of whether it deserves another entry. Will it be the "midquel" that Scott has referenced? Will it become a true third film in the series? Will Fox demand more changes for the next movie (like "more aliens, more aliens, maybe soldiers!" or something like that), and will Scott back off of director and go into Producer mode if he loses interest in any new direction? Will the budget need to be slashed again to justify it to the higher-ups, and if so, will that kill it? Maybe the higher-ups will even demand a complete divorce from Prometheus/Covenant characters, and David will have to be ousted quickly? Very curious to see how this winds up....

Very interesting points.

FOX made 11 movies with Sir Ridley and they have plans for the future: THE CARTEL and BATTLE OF BRITAIN. FOX and Sir Ridley have another contract with his company SCOTT FREE.

So, I think FOX has a lot of admiration for Sir Ridley and they NEVER are going to fire him. IT'S UP TO HIM. If Sir Ridley wants to leaves, he leaves. But nobody is going to fire him or his company.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor. He also played games with his availability, making sure he was busy on another movie if he didn't like the current draft of Prometheus 2. When you read about the delays, Scott always wanted to go next wit his draft, and Noomi seems out of the loop, but Fassbinder kept saying "it's about finding the right story" and was constantly busy until the direction changed to being an Alien movie where Dave is the lead and creates the xenos. I know I'm reading between the lines, here, but I think Fassbinder deserves some blame, maybe a lot of the blame. He allegedly didn't get along with Rapace, and surprise she was replaced by an actress Fassbinder enjoyed working with on Steve Jobs. I think Fassbinder played games trying to make Covenant into what he wanted.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 26, 2017, 05:16:55 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor. He also played games with his availability, making sure he was busy on another movie if he didn't like the current draft of Prometheus 2. When you read about the delays, Scott always wanted to go next wit his draft, and Noomi seems out of the loop, but Fassbinder kept saying "it's about finding the right story" and was constantly busy until the direction changed to being an Alien movie where Dave is the lead and creates the xenos. I know I'm reading between the lines, here, but I think Fassbinder deserves some blame, maybe a lot of the blame. He allegedly didn't get along with Rapace, and surprise she was replaced by an actress Fassbinder enjoyed working with on Steve Jobs. I think Fassbinder played games trying to make Covenant into what he wanted.

My friend, that's your theory.

Sir Ridley wanted bigger stars for PROMETHEUS.

For example: Leonardo DiCaprio was the first choice for David. Michael Fassbender was his second choice.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 26, 2017, 05:32:22 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor. He also played games with his availability, making sure he was busy on another movie if he didn't like the current draft of Prometheus 2. When you read about the delays, Scott always wanted to go next wit his draft, and Noomi seems out of the loop, but Fassbinder kept saying "it's about finding the right story" and was constantly busy until the direction changed to being an Alien movie where Dave is the lead and creates the xenos. I know I'm reading between the lines, here, but I think Fassbinder deserves some blame, maybe a lot of the blame. He allegedly didn't get along with Rapace, and surprise she was replaced by an actress Fassbinder enjoyed working with on Steve Jobs. I think Fassbinder played games trying to make Covenant into what he wanted.

Where did you read this about Fassbender? I have yet to hear of it but hey if it was going on, that is rather shitty. I would like to see a source though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Vermillion on May 26, 2017, 05:46:17 PM
 Btw.
Run. Pray. Hide.

No one in Alien Covenant Hid.

False advertising. I'm suing.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SpeedyMaxx on May 26, 2017, 06:16:45 PM
I could buy the story about tension with Rapace and Fassbender if I hadn't seen them doing promotion together. They looked quite chummy in each other's company, and not in a forced junket way. I also don't think Fassbender is some villain scheming to push her out and make the movies about him. This is clearly all Scott.

I don't have to like the story turn in AC, but that doesn't make Michael Fassbender into some sort of IRL bad guy.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 26, 2017, 06:59:27 PM
Noomi Rapaces ousting probably has more to do with her current career trajectory, which ain't great tbh I don't think fassbender can be blamed for that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SpeedyMaxx on May 26, 2017, 07:04:14 PM
She's doing alright. I think she does what she likes. Don't think it has much to do with that vs. wanting to flush Prometheus and clean slate.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 26, 2017, 07:08:00 PM
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on May 26, 2017, 07:04:14 PM
She's doing alright. I think she does what she likes. Don't think it has much to do with that vs. wanting to flush Prometheus and clean slate.

Really? Her last few films have been awful and one step away from straight to DVD releases. I don't know what she has coming up, maybe better but she hasn't been pulling up any trees since Prometheus that's for sure.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SpeedyMaxx on May 26, 2017, 07:16:12 PM
I don't think much of some of her recent films myself, but doing an indie horror (Rupture) from an acclaimed director is far from uncommon these days, even if it turned out lousy. She's in the next big Will Smith movie, she did that silly looking thriller with Tom Hardy and is starring in another Netflix thing with Willem Dafoe, she's Maria Callas in Niki Caro's next movie - I think she's having the career she wants to have, not someone else's who wants to be Jennifer Lawrence. If she gets bored I imagine she'll go back to Sweden and do stuff there.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 26, 2017, 07:23:09 PM
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on May 26, 2017, 07:16:12 PM
I don't think much of some of her recent films myself, but doing an indie horror (Rupture) from an acclaimed director is far from uncommon these days, even if it turned out lousy. She's in the next big Will Smith movie, she did that silly looking thriller with Tom Hardy and is starring in another Netflix thing with Willem Dafoe, she's Maria Callas in Niki Caro's next movie - I think she's having the career she wants to have, not someone else's who wants to be Jennifer Lawrence. If she gets bored I imagine she'll go back to Sweden and do stuff there.

And unlocked which is also terrible. You might be right and she's happy with this but maybe fox were jittery about it. It's all speculative but more likely in my view than fassbender being her arch nemesis as was suggested (not by you I know)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: RandomNumber on May 26, 2017, 08:32:07 PM
As others may already know, boxofficemojo.com (http://boxofficemojo.com) came out with the Thursday numbers, and Covenant is in third place. It came in fourth place if you count the preview showings of Pirates 5. (I'm not sure the experts look at things that way, but it probably gives a good picture of where the weekend box office is going.)

They also have a weekend preview, in which they write: "...we're anticipating Guardians 2 will bring in around $20 million for the three-day with Alien: Covenant bringing in $18 million, which may end up being generous as that only represents a 50% drop."

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4295&p=.htm (http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4295&p=.htm)

Alien: Covenant is a movie I could see having a really steep drop-off in box office. If it is able to pull in $18+ million over the weekend, I think that would be good news for the film (relatively speaking).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 26, 2017, 09:03:38 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.

I'm sorry but nearly everything you listed there bombed horribly.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: motherfather on May 26, 2017, 09:33:15 PM
Urgh. Dicaprio for Prometheus? I can't stand him in anything. Sooo glad he didn't get that part in the end.

If it were up to me, the next film would only have RADA or similar actORs in it. Oh, and Zachary Quinto. :P

Fassbender I do actually like, and in films like xmen he's OK, its just I don't want another all-about-David alien movie. He should be given the "Shaw treatment" for the next movie i.e banished to a few seconds of face time.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Whos_Nick on May 26, 2017, 09:56:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 26, 2017, 09:03:38 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.

I'm sorry but nearly everything you listed there bombed horribly.

which is what he stated
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 26, 2017, 10:07:27 PM
Quote from: Whos_Nick on May 26, 2017, 09:56:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 26, 2017, 09:03:38 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.

I'm sorry but nearly everything you listed there bombed horribly.

which is what he stated


On the plus side maybe that means he will be cheap to hire on for a possible final film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 26, 2017, 10:45:45 PM
lol that's not how things work.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 12:07:00 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 26, 2017, 10:45:45 PM
lol that's not how things work.

Yeah, I figured  :D

Well I would say of those films he was in that bombed, the poor performance was not due to him. He is a good actor and he obviously has put a lot of thought into David (and Walter by extension). I even watched Lawrence of Arabia after Prometheus and Fassbender must of studied that film somewhat as well. I look forward to seeing the end of the story of David and while I hope he is not the focus, it will be interesting seeing his portrayal of David malfunction further and slip deeper and deeper into android dementia.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 27, 2017, 01:35:59 AM
Quote from: Whos_Nick on May 26, 2017, 09:56:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 26, 2017, 09:03:38 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.

I'm sorry but nearly everything you listed there bombed horribly.

which is what he stated

Maybe he isn't a native English speaker but that isn't what that phrase really means. It means those movies prove he has a track record.

I'd actually say that outside of xmen he isn't a draw at all and xmen is more brand than him. Incredible actor but not a draw.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 27, 2017, 01:53:27 AM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?id=covprom.htm

I thought Prometheus actually opened on more screen than Covenant (I thought i read that here).  Box Office mojo says otherwise.

I'll be shocked if Covenant clears 70m in North America.  Hell, I think 60m is gonna be an up hill battle.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 01:54:42 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 27, 2017, 01:35:59 AM
Quote from: Whos_Nick on May 26, 2017, 09:56:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 26, 2017, 09:03:38 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.

I'm sorry but nearly everything you listed there bombed horribly.

which is what he stated

Maybe he isn't a native English speaker but that isn't what that phrase really means. It means those movies prove he has a track record.

I'd actually say that outside of xmen he isn't a draw at all and xmen is more brand than him. Incredible actor but not a draw.
I clearly said Fassbender had a "poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor".  Pretty unambiguous English.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 27, 2017, 01:56:33 AM
 
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.
Well,The Counselor is an ensamble film and was sold as an ensamble film with bigger names than Fassbender. And nobody could have improved AC numbers. It's a VG film that appeals to a very niche audience and it didn't justify a high budget in the first place.
Re A:C: Prometheus didn't have "big names" either,and actually it's difficult for every actor to carry non-franchise movies by themselves,including RDJ,Chris Pratt,Evans, and all those who star in those Marvel monster hits. I think the days of the all star leading man doing are over. Actors don't draw much audiences these days. And,save for XMen,someone like Fassbender is mainly an arthouse kind of film actor.
Anyway,it doesn't make any sense to blame actors when a film like this underperforms. I'd say that Waterston  was the face of the marketing campaign among the actors,but it was evident how the big pull for this franchise - the xenomorphs - was put front and center. This wasn't marketed as a film with this or that actor.


Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on May 26, 2017, 06:16:45 PM
I could buy the story about tension with Rapace and Fassbender if I hadn't seen them doing promotion together. They looked quite chummy in each other's company, and not in a forced junket way. I also don't think Fassbender is some villain scheming to push her out and make the movies about him. This is clearly all Scott.

I don't have to like the story turn in AC, but that doesn't make Michael Fassbender into some sort of IRL bad guy.
Scott is obviously the one who decided to take another direction with the sequels. David  emerged as the most interesting character - and the best performance- so that surely helped,but sometimes I even wonder if Scott really  intended to explore the Engingeers' mythology and world in the sequels to begin with.
And yes,MF and Rapace looked quite chummy during the promotion. I even thought Rapace had a crush on him   :laugh: They got along pretty well. Where does this story even come from? ???


Quote from: RandomNumber on May 26, 2017, 08:32:07 PM
As others may already know, boxofficemojo.com (http://boxofficemojo.com) came out with the Thursday numbers, and Covenant is in third place. It came in fourth place if you count the preview showings of Pirates 5. (I'm not sure the experts look at things that way, but it probably gives a good picture of where the weekend box office is going.)

They also have a weekend preview, in which they write: "...we're anticipating Guardians 2 will bring in around $20 million for the three-day with Alien: Covenant bringing in $18 million, which may end up being generous as that only represents a 50% drop."

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4295&p=.htm (http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4295&p=.htm)

Alien: Covenant is a movie I could see having a really steep drop-off in box office. If it is able to pull in $18+ million over the weekend, I think that would be good news for the film (relatively speaking).

That would be the best case scenario. But I'm more inclined to think it will  bring in around 16M. How much Prometheus drop in its second weekend?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 27, 2017, 01:59:47 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 27, 2017, 01:56:33 AM

Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.
Well,The Counselor is an ensamble film and was sold as an ensamble film with bigger names than Fassbender. And nobody could have improved AC numbers. It's a VG film that appeals to a very niche audience and it didn't justify a high budget in the first place.
Re A:C: Prometheus didn't have "big names" either,and actually it's difficult for every actor to carry non-franchise movies by themselves,including RDJ,Chris Pratt,Evans, and all those who star in those Marvel monster hits. I think the days of the all star leading man doing are over. Actors don't draw much audiences these days. And,save for XMen,someone like Fassbender is mainly an arthouse kind of film actor.
Anyway,it doesn't make any sense to blame actors when a film like this underperforms. I'd say that Waterston  was the face of the marketing campaign among the actors,but it was evident how the big pull for this franchise - the xenomorphs - was put front and center. This wasn't marketed as a film with this or that actor.


Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on May 26, 2017, 06:16:45 PM
I could buy the story about tension with Rapace and Fassbender if I hadn't seen them doing promotion together. They looked quite chummy in each other's company, and not in a forced junket way. I also don't think Fassbender is some villain scheming to push her out and make the movies about him. This is clearly all Scott.

I don't have to like the story turn in AC, but that doesn't make Michael Fassbender into some sort of IRL bad guy.
Scott is obviously the one who decided to take another direction with the sequels. David  emerged as the most interesting character - and the best performance- so that surely helped,but sometimes I even wonder if Scott really  intended to explore the Engingeers' mythology and world in the sequels to begin with.
And yes,MF and Rapace looked quite chummy during the promotion. I even thought Rapace had a crush on him   :laugh: They got along pretty well. Where does this story even come from? ???


Quote from: RandomNumber on May 26, 2017, 08:32:07 PM
As others may already know, boxofficemojo.com (http://boxofficemojo.com) came out with the Thursday numbers, and Covenant is in third place. It came in fourth place if you count the preview showings of Pirates 5. (I'm not sure the experts look at things that way, but it probably gives a good picture of where the weekend box office is going.)

They also have a weekend preview, in which they write: "...we're anticipating Guardians 2 will bring in around $20 million for the three-day with Alien: Covenant bringing in $18 million, which may end up being generous as that only represents a 50% drop."

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4295&p=.htm (http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4295&p=.htm)

Alien: Covenant is a movie I could see having a really steep drop-off in box office. If it is able to pull in $18+ million over the weekend, I think that would be good news for the film (relatively speaking).

That would be the best case scenario. But I'm more inclined to think it will  bring in around 16M. How much Prometheus drop in its second weekend?

Daily breakdown of the movies verse each other at Box Office mojo.  This link has a lot of interesting stats.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view=daily&id=covprom.htm


Prometheus weekend breakdowns.  It made 20m second weekend.  I'll be surprised if Covenant does 12-13m given it's drop off this week.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=prometheus.htm
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 02:14:53 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 27, 2017, 01:56:33 AM

Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.
Well,The Counselor is an ensamble film and was sold as an ensamble film with bigger names than Fassbender. And nobody could have improved AC numbers. It's a VG film that appeals to a very niche audience and it didn't justify a high budget in the first place.
Re A:C: Prometheus didn't have "big names" either,and actually it's difficult for every actor to carry non-franchise movies by themselves,including RDJ,Chris Pratt,Evans, and all those who star in those Marvel monster hits. I think the days of the all star leading man doing are over. Actors don't draw much audiences these days. And,save for XMen,someone like Fassbender is mainly an arthouse kind of film actor.
Anyway,it doesn't make any sense to blame actors when a film like this underperforms. I'd say that Waterston  was the face of the marketing campaign among the actors,but it was evident how the big pull for this franchise - the xenomorphs - was put front and center. This wasn't marketed as a film with this or that actor.
The Counselor was an ensemble, but Fassbender played the title character and is in nearly every scene.  The other characters have significantly less screen time.

A big star like Leonardo DiCaprio or Brad Pitt definitely means something at the box office.  They guarantee a certain amount of interest.

I read a box office analyst say that there are some sort of indicators like audiences are turned off by Fassbender.  If you look at his recent movies, it's overwhelmingly clear that he is not a box office draw like DiCaprio or Pitt.

But my post was more about how Fassbender could be the reason that David stole the spotlight in Covenant.  He probably wasn't interested in versions where Shaw was too smart to reattach his head, for example.  Who would want to play a decapitated head for an entire movie?  In the end, they got a movie where Fassbender plays two roles, has all the best scenes and lines, the new female lead is someone he liked working with before, and he creates the xeno and the movie ends with him gloating over his victory.  C'mon.  It's almost like the script was written just for him, don't you think?  It certainly wasn't exactly what Ridley or Rapace wanted.  It's either Fox or Fassbender, but I don't think Fox would have bothered sending Fassbender a script they didn't intend to green light... unless they needed Fassbender to be onboard.  Either way, I think I have pretty good cause to single out Fassbender as the person with ultimate veto power over the script.  If Scott liked it, he'd show it to Fox, and if they liked it, he'd show it to Fassy and see if he was available.

To summarize, I'd say Fassbender did hurt the movie's box office by being unhappy with earlier versions of the script, causing delays and questionable changes to the story.  Combined with the possibility that Fassbender is a turnoff to mainstream audiences, I think there is a good chance he did hurt this movie.
Quote from: PierreVW on May 26, 2017, 05:16:55 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor. He also played games with his availability, making sure he was busy on another movie if he didn't like the current draft of Prometheus 2. When you read about the delays, Scott always wanted to go next wit his draft, and Noomi seems out of the loop, but Fassbinder kept saying "it's about finding the right story" and was constantly busy until the direction changed to being an Alien movie where Dave is the lead and creates the xenos. I know I'm reading between the lines, here, but I think Fassbinder deserves some blame, maybe a lot of the blame. He allegedly didn't get along with Rapace, and surprise she was replaced by an actress Fassbinder enjoyed working with on Steve Jobs. I think Fassbinder played games trying to make Covenant into what he wanted.

My friend, that's your theory.

Sir Ridley wanted bigger stars for PROMETHEUS.

For example: Leonardo DiCaprio was the first choice for David. Michael Fassbender was his second choice.
Didn't Brad Pitt briefly want to play David, as well?  I imagine he was the first or second choice before Fassbender, but no matter.

Regardless of how responsible Fassbender ultimately was, I think there is plenty of evidence to support the conclusion that Fassbender, not Scott or Fox or Rapace, is the person who rejected the first several drafts of the script.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scott Conover on May 27, 2017, 02:57:00 AM
God dammit. Why can't people just discuss the box office!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on May 27, 2017, 03:15:45 AM
This is the Fassbender show, that's a fact.  Just like Weaver was the star of her Alien movies.  People complain about the Alien movies not having a male lead, but that's no longer the case (I know he's the antagonist, but that doesn't matter).  You won't get another female lead like Weaver, and nobody will watch an Alien film with a solo male protagonist.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SpeedyMaxx on May 27, 2017, 03:15:53 AM
There's absolutely no evidence Fassbender personally sabotaged the script or Noomi Rapace's involvement.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: RandomNumber on May 27, 2017, 04:24:21 AM
There is an interesting analysis of Alien: Covenant from a Forbes contributor who has been covering the film industry for 28 years. (I think other people here have already referenced some information from this article.)

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/21/box-office-alien-covenant-opens-below-alien-vs-predator/ (https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/21/box-office-alien-covenant-opens-below-alien-vs-predator/)

He seems to suggest $300 million as a worldwide box office target for Covenant to be considered at all successful. My impression is that this is not meant to be taken too precisely, and that he is simply setting a basic expectation based on his industry expertise.

I think he is saying that a $300 million global total for Covenant wouldn't be great, but it could be good enough to justify producing R-rated science fiction films at modest budgets.

Prometheus garnered $403.4 million in 2012 U.S. dollars. BoxOfficeMojo currently has Covenant at $133.1 million globally. Unless there is a lag in the reporting of international data, it seems to me the movie has a long way to go.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 27, 2017, 04:26:01 AM
Lol holy shit is Covenant going to make $200mm LESS than Prometheus?!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 27, 2017, 05:33:33 AM
How much Studios get Revenue Share from others country ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 27, 2017, 05:50:47 AM
at this point i don't see it making more than 300 at the box office. .i wonder if thats enought to greenlight a sequel. .the box office is a dissapointment so far. .many here thought it would crack 550 to 600 mil. .definately don't see that happening anymore. .makes me really sad!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SpeedyMaxx on May 27, 2017, 06:10:59 AM
I certainly thought it would do reasonably well or somewhat better than Prometheus, and I haven't exactly been a big booster of this film. Pretty surprising.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 06:45:15 AM
Was just revisiting the old box office prediction thread.  So much optimism. But the experts were right.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 27, 2017, 07:04:53 AM
i think ridley made a decent movie worthy of being a block buster. .unfortunately the masses would rather watch the latest superhero movie. .wonder if those will ever get old. .i don't mind them either but i am starting to get bored with marvel movies . .their always seems to be at least one on the circuit. .they are spawned relentlesly and half the top 10 yearly box office are superhero related and the other half is disney or dreamworks animations. .with the ocational other type of franchise like fast and furious. .all this family frienly crap. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on May 27, 2017, 07:08:48 AM
wot u sed.

ezactly wot u sed.

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on May 27, 2017, 07:09:29 AM
It's doing well for an R rated horror film.  Most of the money comes from merchandising, anyway.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 27, 2017, 07:14:32 AM
Now, I'm almost sure Sir Ridley is going to leave the franchise.

The next ALIEN movie is going to have a SMALL Budget similar to ALIEN V PREDATOR(Paul W.S. Anderson) budget. Like 50-60 Millions.

Sir Ridley Scott STILL get BIG Budgets for his other films. He made his biggest hit(THE MARTIAN) with 108 Millions.

So, He DOESN'T need a new ALIEN movie with a small budget of 50-60 Millions.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 27, 2017, 07:15:23 AM
No no no no no, Pierre. This is not IMDb.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 27, 2017, 07:18:13 AM
Quote from: juxtapose on May 27, 2017, 07:04:53 AM
i think ridley made a decent movie worthy of being a block buster. .unfortunately the masses would rather watch the latest superhero movie. .wonder if those will ever get old. .i don't mind them either but i am starting to get bored with marvel movies . .their always seems to be at least one on the circuit. .they are spawned relentlesly and half the top 10 yearly box office are superhero related and the other half is disney or dreamworks animations. .with the ocational other type of franchise like fast and furious. .all this family frienly crap. .

When movies franchises didn't make money/profit anymore.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 27, 2017, 07:25:42 AM
baywatch looks like it might flop. .at least in north america. . .watching other movies fail makes me feel better about covenants performance. .lol, i know i am evil. . But let me have my fun. .and their is already a long list of flops this year. .some deservingly so and others not so much. .and a few that was actually suprisingly decent. .at least covenant won't be on that long list of outright flops from 2017. .some movies don't even look like they will cover their budget. .a cure for wellness definately wont and that was not an awfull movie and King Arthur got a decent score from the audience despite how critics hated it. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 27, 2017, 12:43:42 PM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?id=covprom.htm

Saw this, and wasn't sure if it was posted yet
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 01:23:04 PM
Well now, even I am having trouble being optimistic.

So if somehow Ridley was allowed and intent to shoot the follow up next June or so like he said, when we know if it was given the green light? Assuming proper preproduction would need to go into effect later this year yeah?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: acrediblesource on May 27, 2017, 01:40:03 PM
Ridley is smart. Consider if they actually need the sets from Prometheus to recreate the original 1979 version, they could do that with alot of tweaking or just using the manufacturing process would probably speed things up. Or just re-use and refine.
That would be an added bonus to the budget.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on May 27, 2017, 02:27:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 01:23:04 PM
Well now, even I am having trouble being optimistic.


Relax. Covenant's only been in theaters for a week, whereas Prometheus had 15 times that number to generate only 4 times Covenant's current box office gross. Give it time. It's an international market, these days. I doubt Ridley's even so much as broken a sweat, yet.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 27, 2017, 02:41:03 PM
Quote from: acrediblesource on May 27, 2017, 01:40:03 PM
Ridley is smart. Consider if they actually need the sets from Prometheus to recreate the original 1979 version, they could do that with alot of tweaking or just using the manufacturing process would probably speed things up. Or just re-use and refine.
That would be an added bonus to the budget.

You guys are so crazy. They'll not be doing any of that. It doesn't work like that.

"Maybe the cast and crew can bring their own lunch to work! Doesn't Fassbender like PB&J?"

Staaaaaahp.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 02:44:01 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 27, 2017, 02:27:22 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 01:23:04 PM
Well now, even I am having trouble being optimistic.


Relax. Covenant's only been in theaters for a week, whereas Prometheus had 15 times that number to generate only 4 times Covenant's current box office gross. Give it time. It's an international market, these days. I doubt Ridley's even so much as broken a sweat, yet.

This is true. Perhaps I should of set my initial expectations a little more realistically vs my 600 million prediction :laugh:

My question still stands though: When would we know if the follow up is going to happen if Ridley Scott starts filming next year around June like he stated before with the 14 month comment? Preproduction would need to be in full swing this fall right?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 02:49:19 PM
Covenant isn't just tracking behind Prometheus overall. It has made less every single day of release. It isn't going to catch up, not according to the predictions of experts. If you look at the numbers more closely, you will see there is no mathematical possibility of Covenant out grossing Prometheus.

Also, Ridley Scott proudly reuses sets all the time. Katherine Waters on wears Matt Damon's Martian wig during reshoots. From trailers I could see pieces of the sets from Martian in Covenant. I bet he used stuff from Exodus, as well. The set for Kingdom of Heaven was such a masterpiece of reusability that people still use it. Just saw it in Good Kill.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 27, 2017, 03:49:37 PM
dunno if i am just grabbing at straws. .but their is still china. .if covenant can hit it big in china then their is still hope. .so what do you guys think the global will be on tuesday. .i am guessing between 170 to 175 mil?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on May 27, 2017, 04:10:54 PM
Can we expect a sequel if AC "might" not perform well in US while it did good overseas?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 27, 2017, 04:17:38 PM
https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/27/box-office-alien-covenant-plunges-horrific-80-for-3m-friday/#20fe536460d5

Yeah, it didn't hold well. Given that Pirates & Baywatch are both underperforming, it seems particularly bad.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 04:28:03 PM
Quote20th Century Fox's Alien: Covenant sank like a stone on its second Friday. The well-reviewed but slightly underperforming Alien prequel/Prometheus sequel earned just $3 million yesterday for what is now a $49.8m eight-day domestic total. Now Prometheus fell 73% on its second Friday, but we were dealing with larger overall numbers. At this juncture, we can expect a $10.6m (-71%) Fri-Sun weekend and a $13.2m holiday haul for a $60m 11-day total. So, barring decent legs after the holiday, we're looking at a domestic total of around $80m. The Ridley Scott picture cost $97m to produce, so overseas can still pull it out of the fire. But a similar 32/68 split gives the film a $254m worldwide total. Is that decent for an R-rated horror film? Absolutely. But it's not great considering the last film made $405m worldwide.

Disaster.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 04:36:13 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 04:28:03 PM
Quote20th Century Fox's Alien: Covenant sank like a stone on its second Friday. The well-reviewed but slightly underperforming Alien prequel/Prometheus sequel earned just $3 million yesterday for what is now a $49.8m eight-day domestic total. Now Prometheus fell 73% on its second Friday, but we were dealing with larger overall numbers. At this juncture, we can expect a $10.6m (-71%) Fri-Sun weekend and a $13.2m holiday haul for a $60m 11-day total. So, barring decent legs after the holiday, we're looking at a domestic total of around $80m. The Ridley Scott picture cost $97m to produce, so overseas can still pull it out of the fire. But a similar 32/68 split gives the film a $254m worldwide total. Is that decent for an R-rated horror film? Absolutely. But it's not great considering the last film made $405m worldwide.

Disaster.

Is this factoring in China though? Prometheus did not have China to boost box office numbers, as far as I am aware. That should push it to at least 300m worldwide.


Quote from: FallenDarkAngel on May 27, 2017, 04:10:54 PM
Can we expect a sequel if AC "might" not perform well in US while it did good overseas?

I am still confident we will get a third and final film, and soon, regardless. That is under the condition Ridley Scott has a strong desire to stick to his shooting schedule of shooting in 13 months. Under what conditions though, that is anyone's guess. Ridley Scott might have the studio sold on an idea that they believe will carry over well for them in the long run.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 05:01:55 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 04:36:13 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 04:28:03 PM
Quote20th Century Fox's Alien: Covenant sank like a stone on its second Friday. The well-reviewed but slightly underperforming Alien prequel/Prometheus sequel earned just $3 million yesterday for what is now a $49.8m eight-day domestic total. Now Prometheus fell 73% on its second Friday, but we were dealing with larger overall numbers. At this juncture, we can expect a $10.6m (-71%) Fri-Sun weekend and a $13.2m holiday haul for a $60m 11-day total. So, barring decent legs after the holiday, we're looking at a domestic total of around $80m. The Ridley Scott picture cost $97m to produce, so overseas can still pull it out of the fire. But a similar 32/68 split gives the film a $254m worldwide total. Is that decent for an R-rated horror film? Absolutely. But it's not great considering the last film made $405m worldwide.

Disaster.

Is this factoring in China though? Prometheus did not have China to boost box office numbers, as far as I am aware. That should push it to at least 300m worldwide.

Prometheus was released in China.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 05:34:10 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 05:01:55 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 04:36:13 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 04:28:03 PM
Quote20th Century Fox's Alien: Covenant sank like a stone on its second Friday. The well-reviewed but slightly underperforming Alien prequel/Prometheus sequel earned just $3 million yesterday for what is now a $49.8m eight-day domestic total. Now Prometheus fell 73% on its second Friday, but we were dealing with larger overall numbers. At this juncture, we can expect a $10.6m (-71%) Fri-Sun weekend and a $13.2m holiday haul for a $60m 11-day total. So, barring decent legs after the holiday, we're looking at a domestic total of around $80m. The Ridley Scott picture cost $97m to produce, so overseas can still pull it out of the fire. But a similar 32/68 split gives the film a $254m worldwide total. Is that decent for an R-rated horror film? Absolutely. But it's not great considering the last film made $405m worldwide.

Disaster.

Is this factoring in China though? Prometheus did not have China to boost box office numbers, as far as I am aware. That should push it to at least 300m worldwide.

Prometheus was released in China.


I am not seeing it reported in BO numbers. What is missing here?


http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=intl&id=prometheus.htm
(http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=intl&id=prometheus.htm)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 05:41:15 PM
Box office: http://english.entgroup.cn/602960/boxoffice/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 27, 2017, 05:43:58 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 27, 2017, 02:27:22 PM
Relax. Covenant's only been in theaters for a week, whereas Prometheus had 15 times that number to generate only 4 times Covenant's current box office gross. Give it time. It's an international market, these days. I doubt Ridley's even so much as broken a sweat, yet.

You're not factoring in the weekly dropoff. We're already looking at more than a 70% drop on it's second weekend in the US. In Australia it's opening weekend gross was 80% less than that of Prometheus.

Quote from: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 05:01:55 PM
Prometheus was released in China.

And in 3D which is a massive draw over there.

Quote from: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 02:49:19 PM
Also, Ridley Scott proudly reuses sets all the time. Katherine Waters on wears Matt Damon's Martian wig during reshoots. From trailers I could see pieces of the sets from Martian in Covenant. I bet he used stuff from Exodus, as well. The set for Kingdom of Heaven was such a masterpiece of reusability that people still use it. Just saw it in Good Kill.

Sets usually get destroyed after filming, storage cost would be too prohibitive even if you were planing more sequels. We've already had reports of Alien: Covenant's Juggernaut set's destruction.

The space ship chairs and some corridor sections from The Martian we saw in Covenant were most likely just re-manufactured from the same 3D model/blueprints. And re-using a wig or whatever is not going to make an iota of difference to reducing costs on the next film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 05:48:52 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 27, 2017, 05:41:15 PM
Box office: http://english.entgroup.cn/602960/boxoffice/

Nice. So Prometheus really made out quite well then with the China numbers on top of the BO mojo numbers.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 27, 2017, 06:29:26 PM
I wonder if that ~$34 mil is included in the approx $400 mil total that's widely reported for Prometheus. I'd have to imagine it is, though it's strange that Box Office Mojo doesn't have it listed independently. Covenant comes out in China on June 16th.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 07:15:22 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 27, 2017, 06:29:26 PM
I wonder if that ~$34 mil is included in the approx $400 mil total that's widely reported for Prometheus. I'd have to imagine it is, though it's strange that Box Office Mojo doesn't have it listed independently. Covenant comes out in China on June 16th.
Box Office Mojo did not include China's $34 million in its foreign total, no. Covenant is tracking $200 million lower than Prometheus and nearly $400 million lower than The Martian.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 27, 2017, 08:37:00 PM
doomy gloomy depession. .oh for the love of god why??. .i mean it is already an improvement on prometheus. .. .witch i thought was a fantastic and dark space opera. .this is a direct result of how tasteless and kitch and common audiences have become. .but hows it doing globaly. .??. .so what if dumb c**t american audiences cant embrace it. .i never had any faith that they would. .but surely the rest of the planet will. .or else. . . Noooooooooooooo!!!!!!!. .oh well it will be added to a list of movies i loved that never made it big at the box office. .suppose we should be happy that we even got another alien movie . . f**k this i don't wanne wait another 10 years for a reboot. .what if i die before then?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 27, 2017, 09:14:39 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 07:15:22 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 27, 2017, 06:29:26 PM
I wonder if that ~$34 mil is included in the approx $400 mil total that's widely reported for Prometheus. I'd have to imagine it is, though it's strange that Box Office Mojo doesn't have it listed independently. Covenant comes out in China on June 16th.
Box Office Mojo did not include China's $34 million in its foreign total, no. Covenant is tracking $200 million lower than Prometheus and nearly $400 million lower than The Martian.

It looks really, really bad for the franchise.

This could kill ALIEN franchise for 5-7 years.

Sir Ridley Scott has 5 better projects so He doesn't care. Like Damon Lindelof said about him: "He never freaked out or lost his cool about anything. Anything". Sir Ridley Scott just forgot and Directs his next film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Enoch on May 27, 2017, 09:16:40 PM
Alien, signing out....

Still searching for perfection. :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 27, 2017, 09:20:17 PM
What's the reason for no imax and 3d viewings? Was it only to make the movie cheaper?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 27, 2017, 09:21:23 PM
There are IMAX viewings. I went to one!  :D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 27, 2017, 09:25:21 PM
Quote from: Evanus on May 27, 2017, 09:21:23 PM
There are IMAX viewings. I went to one!  :D

Oh sorry . Then is there 3d viewings as well? Was the movie shot in 3d?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 27, 2017, 09:26:27 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 27, 2017, 09:25:21 PM
Quote from: Evanus on May 27, 2017, 09:21:23 PM
There are IMAX viewings. I went to one!  :D

Oh sorry . Then is there 3d viewings as well? Was the movie shot in 3d?
Nope, I don't think it was shot in 3D. Not sure why though. Probably to reduce costs, like you said.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 27, 2017, 09:34:44 PM
that's going affect blu ray sales as well. And no furious gods 2.0 either. No CDL .

Let's get rid of everything good that came out of PROmetheus .

#sigh*
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 27, 2017, 10:04:07 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 27, 2017, 09:34:44 PM
that's going affect blu ray sales as well. And no furious gods 2.0 either. No CDL .

Let's get rid of everything good that came out of PROmetheus .

#sigh*
. .have u seen it yet?. .i know u also from SA. .not showing in the freestate. .at least not in welkom. .only in bloemfontein. .thank god i am moving back to jhb later this year .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 27, 2017, 10:08:52 PM
Is it showing in sa currently?


http://www.criticalhit.net/entertainment/local-weekend-box-office-report-alien-covenant-fails-impress-south-africans/

Not doing well at all. No I haven't seen it yet. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on May 27, 2017, 10:44:22 PM
It's sad that it was pulled out already in most branches of the biggest chain of cinemas here in my country. Even the IMAX theathers pulled out the movie.  :-[
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Feeds On Minds on May 27, 2017, 10:50:27 PM
This dead horse needs a break...a nice long break.
Maybe only THEN we'll get something worthy of the franchise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 11:23:01 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 27, 2017, 10:50:27 PM
This dead horse needs a break...a nice long break.
Maybe only THEN we'll get something worthy of the franchise.

If the movie franchise is dead, we might still get some decent video games in the future. Its a tough pill to swallow because this is my favorite cinematic universe and I know it has more potential than what has been provided the last 30 years, but we could be at a point of no return.

I guess if Ridley Scott gave this franchise life then its only fitting that he kills it. Someone else said it before and it makes all the sense now...it feels like Covenant is a death kneel of the franchise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 27, 2017, 11:32:58 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PMA big star like Leonardo DiCaprio or Brad Pitt definitely means something at the box office.  They guarantee a certain amount of interest.
DiCaprio is probably the only actor who can be considered a legit draw,but he always teams up with high profile directors for hyped films that most of the time  end up being  Oscars contenders. He doesn't make independent films.. Movie stars like Pitt,Cruise,Depp don't have a consistent track record anymore. Their star power don't necessarily translate in good BO performances.  My point was that people don't pay to see a particular actor anymore independently of the film. Also,adult-oriented dramas struggle most of the time because those are films that people see at home.  And I don't see any reason to compare actors like Fassbender,Gosling,Hardy  to Pitt,Cruise,Will Smith,DiCaprio because it doesn't make any sense.

QuoteMy friend, that's your theory.  Sir Ridley wanted bigger stars for PROMETHEUS.  For example: Leonardo DiCaprio was the first choice for David. Michael Fassbender was his second choice.
I don't recall  DiCaprio being in the mix - he would have been completely wrong for the role-  but what is sure is that Scott really wanted Fassbender. There  are several articles that mention how Scott supported his casting even if he was un up-and-coming actor at the time who was still shooting all his future high profile films. Also,in the Sony leaked emails you can read Sony executives hinting at the fact that Scott goes around saying that he's the best actor working today. Draw your conclusion.
What Scott is doing is exactly what he wanted to do and Fassbender or anyone else is not playing any role. Logan and Harper are on record saying that they follow Scott's indications and Fassbender has always said that he trusts Scott and doesn't even try to ask about his future plans.


 
Quote from: fiveways on May 27, 2017, 01:59:47 AMDaily breakdown of the movies verse each other at Box Office mojo.  This link has a lot of interesting stats.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view=daily&id=covprom.htm
Prometheus weekend breakdowns.  It made 20m second weekend.  I'll be surprised if Covenant does 12-13m given it's drop off this week.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=prometheus.htm
Thanks! 12.3M is what they're predicting over 3-days weekend and 13,75 over four.
It's performing like Prometheus that fell 74% in its second Friday. While it's underwhelming,I don't know why people expected it to perform like  Prometheus or even better. It's clear that it's a niche franchise,particularly frontloaded too. Without considering that Prometheus was divisive, to say the least,for fans as well.
If it pulls in 80M in domestic,it's not a disaster tbh.
As the Forbes' analyst noticed,even a 225M final gross would be decent for this. And,honestly,I can see it doing better than that without the Asian markets. If it pulls in something like 80M from those other markets,it will be fine.



Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 27, 2017, 05:43:58 PM

You're not factoring in the weekly dropoff. We're already looking at more than a 70% drop on it's second weekend in the US. In Australia it's opening weekend gross was 80% less than that of Prometheus.


No,it dropped 40% in local currency. Those drops in USD reported by BOM were quite meaningless.


Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 11:23:01 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 27, 2017, 10:50:27 PM
This dead horse needs a break...a nice long break.
Maybe only THEN we'll get something worthy of the franchise.

If the movie franchise is dead, we might still get some decent video games in the future. Its a tough pill to swallow because this is my favorite cinematic universe and I know it has more potential than what has been provided the last 30 years, but we could be at a point of no return.

I guess if Ridley Scott gave this franchise life then its only fitting that he kills it. Someone else said it before and it makes all the sense now...it feels like Covenant is a death kneel of the franchise.
Why all this pessimism?
The big mistake was to move this from August. It's an insanely crowded period for American and international releses. Pirates,Wonder Woman,The Mummy..  Films don't even have the time to establish themselves before losing screens for the next blockbuster.
But I don't see anyone talking about a flop.  Honestly,I don't see why Scott should leave the franchise without a conclusion if he agrees to work with a lower budget. The point is that these films don't justify a high budget anymore. That's all.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 28, 2017, 12:27:54 AM
So just because a higher budgeted Alien film didn't do so well, that means these films don't justify it? Nonsense. Alien: Covenant was only targeting horror fans, and thus performed like it. And it also wasn't any good.

And as for DiCaprio... http://www.vulture.com/2010/12/paradise_found_ridley_scotts_a.html

Oh and as for Pitt... "For a hot minute, Pitt was interested in starring in Prometheus and, apparently, really responded to the script." http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/star-trek-into-darkness-world-war-z-520992

All very interesting wouldn't we all say?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: DestinyCaptain on May 28, 2017, 01:00:30 AM
Well, I'll say it again... the theatre I went to was only full at one showing on opening day here in the US. The next fullest was only half. All remaining showings had less than 10 seats sold for each. This is a theatre that caters to geeks and nerds. It has run both Alien and Aliens this year. There was no enthusiasm for this film in the lobby that I could see. I just don't think Covenant has generated the interest that it needed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prez on May 28, 2017, 01:18:00 AM
Less than a week after release here in Australia the film was downgraded to smaller sized theatres screens at most popular local cinemas here in my hometown (Guardians Vol 2 was taking prime spot). My first viewing was on a much smaller screen at a popular cinema.

No real big name actors (bar Fass who lets face it isn't exactly mega star status).

Makes you think that regardless of our opinions of Blomkamp's Alien 5, the pulling power of Weaver (+ Hicks & Newt returning) would've been a banker at the box office.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 28, 2017, 01:19:17 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on May 28, 2017, 12:27:54 AM
So just because a higher budgeted Alien film didn't do so well, that means these films don't justify it? Nonsense. Alien: Covenant was only targeting horror fans, and thus performed like it. And it also wasn't any good
That's your personal opinion. Others may disagree.  Prometheus was also very froantloaded and its numbers were definitely inflated by the 3D. It's difficult to judge how mixed WOM played a role in its drops.  My point was that it's a franchise that appeals to a niche audience. Prometheus was promoted as an "original" sci-fi thriller and that helped,judging things  in retrospect. The fact that Scott was returning to direct an Alien film was also part of the marketing campaign and it created buzz. It's impossible to do a similar thing for a second sequel at this point.

QuoteAnd as for DiCaprio... http://www.vulture.com/2010/12/paradise_found_ridley_scotts_a.html

Oh and as for Pitt... "For a hot minute, Pitt was interested in starring in Prometheus and, apparently, really responded to the script." http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/star-trek-into-darkness-world-war-z-520992

All very interesting wouldn't we all say?
I said I didn't recall that DiCaprio was in the mix. I didn't say that it was impossible. And I vaguely remembered that initially they didn't reach an agreement. It's why I've remarked that Scott really supported him for the role. He was just an up-and-coming actor at the time. Scott and the other producers could have easily chosen another more known actor.  It wasn't a fallback choice. That was my point.
Pitt and DiCaprio would have been awful choices for this role. It doesn't suit their acting style  -and movie star persona-  in any way.
I prefer to have a less known actor who delivers and not miscast actors.
Given the reviews (audiences and critics),I don't know why some people are blaming Fassbender now but whatever..
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 28, 2017, 01:28:01 AM

It bums me out that the movie isn't doing better, but I knew it wouldn't after I saw it. This really isn't an Alien film at all. They're hardly in it and when they are it goes by way to fast.

This is David's movie and the audience doesn't care about that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Whos_Nick on May 28, 2017, 01:43:54 AM
So we're looking at a bomb for Covenant. I was hoping it might do better, but the film has so much wasted potential.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anthony on May 28, 2017, 02:22:11 AM
Let's just hope that if the series goes on a hiatus for a while, when Fox decides to bring it back, they don't go the reboot route.....
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: GQSioux on May 28, 2017, 03:21:10 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 27, 2017, 11:32:58 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PMA big star like Leonardo DiCaprio or Brad Pitt definitely means something at the box office.  They guarantee a certain amount of interest.
DiCaprio is probably the only actor who can be considered a legit draw,but he always teams up with high profile directors for hyped films that most of the time  end up being  Oscars contenders. He doesn't make independent films.. Movie stars like Pitt,Cruise,Depp don't have a consistent track record anymore. Their star power don't necessarily translate in good BO performances.  My point was that people don't pay to see a particular actor anymore independently of the film. Also,adult-oriented dramas struggle most of the time because those are films that people see at home.  And I don't see any reason to compare actors like Fassbender,Gosling,Hardy  to Pitt,Cruise,Will Smith,DiCaprio because it doesn't make any sense.

QuoteMy friend, that's your theory.  Sir Ridley wanted bigger stars for PROMETHEUS.  For example: Leonardo DiCaprio was the first choice for David. Michael Fassbender was his second choice.
I don't recall  DiCaprio being in the mix - he would have been completely wrong for the role-  but what is sure is that Scott really wanted Fassbender. There  are several articles that mention how Scott supported his casting even if he was un up-and-coming actor at the time who was still shooting all his future high profile films. Also,in the Sony leaked emails you can read Sony executives hinting at the fact that Scott goes around saying that he's the best actor working today. Draw your conclusion.
What Scott is doing is exactly what he wanted to do and Fassbender or anyone else is not playing any role. Logan and Harper are on record saying that they follow Scott's indications and Fassbender has always said that he trusts Scott and doesn't even try to ask about his future plans.


 
Quote from: fiveways on May 27, 2017, 01:59:47 AMDaily breakdown of the movies verse each other at Box Office mojo.  This link has a lot of interesting stats.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view=daily&id=covprom.htm
Prometheus weekend breakdowns.  It made 20m second weekend.  I'll be surprised if Covenant does 12-13m given it's drop off this week.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=prometheus.htm
Thanks! 12.3M is what they're predicting over 3-days weekend and 13,75 over four.
It's performing like Promtheus who fell 74% in its second Friday. While it's underwhelming,I don't know why people expected it to do perform like  Prometheus or even better. It's clear that it's a niche franchise,particularly frontloaded too. Without considering that Prometheus was divisive, to say the least,for fans as well.
If it pulls in 80M in domestic is not a disaster tbh.
As the Forbes' analyst noticed,even a 225M final gross would be decent for this. And,honestly,I can see it doing better than that without the Asian markets. If it pulls in something like 80M from those other markets,it will be fine.



Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 27, 2017, 05:43:58 PM

You're not factoring in the weekly dropoff. We're already looking at more than a 70% drop on it's second weekend in the US. In Australia it's opening weekend gross was 80% less than that of Prometheus.


No,it dropped 40% in local currency. Those drops in USD reported by BOM were quite meaningless.


Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 11:23:01 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 27, 2017, 10:50:27 PM
This dead horse needs a break...a nice long break.
Maybe only THEN we'll get something worthy of the franchise.

If the movie franchise is dead, we might still get some decent video games in the future. Its a tough pill to swallow because this is my favorite cinematic universe and I know it has more potential than what has been provided the last 30 years, but we could be at a point of no return.

I guess if Ridley Scott gave this franchise life then its only fitting that he kills it. Someone else said it before and it makes all the sense now...it feels like Covenant is a death kneel of the franchise.
Why all this pessimism?
The big mistake was to move this from August. It's an insanely crowded period for American and international releses. Pirates,Wonder Woman,The Mummy..  Films don't even have the time to establish themselves before losing screens for the next blockbuster.
But I don't see anyone talking about a flop.  Honestly,I don't see why Scott should leave the franchise without a conclusion if he agrees to work with a lower budget. The point is that these films don't justify a high budget anymore. That's all.

Not sure why people are calling it a flop. Something like King Arthur is a flop. Alien Covenant might've not met expectations, but it's not a flop. I too think the August date was better. That month is pretty dry this year. In fact, October would've been even better since it was marketed as a horror film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 03:31:06 AM
Quote from: GQSioux on May 28, 2017, 03:21:10 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 27, 2017, 11:32:58 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PMA big star like Leonardo DiCaprio or Brad Pitt definitely means something at the box office.  They guarantee a certain amount of interest.
DiCaprio is probably the only actor who can be considered a legit draw,but he always teams up with high profile directors for hyped films that most of the time  end up being  Oscars contenders. He doesn't make independent films.. Movie stars like Pitt,Cruise,Depp don't have a consistent track record anymore. Their star power don't necessarily translate in good BO performances.  My point was that people don't pay to see a particular actor anymore independently of the film. Also,adult-oriented dramas struggle most of the time because those are films that people see at home.  And I don't see any reason to compare actors like Fassbender,Gosling,Hardy  to Pitt,Cruise,Will Smith,DiCaprio because it doesn't make any sense.

QuoteMy friend, that's your theory.  Sir Ridley wanted bigger stars for PROMETHEUS.  For example: Leonardo DiCaprio was the first choice for David. Michael Fassbender was his second choice.
I don't recall  DiCaprio being in the mix - he would have been completely wrong for the role-  but what is sure is that Scott really wanted Fassbender. There  are several articles that mention how Scott supported his casting even if he was un up-and-coming actor at the time who was still shooting all his future high profile films. Also,in the Sony leaked emails you can read Sony executives hinting at the fact that Scott goes around saying that he's the best actor working today. Draw your conclusion.
What Scott is doing is exactly what he wanted to do and Fassbender or anyone else is not playing any role. Logan and Harper are on record saying that they follow Scott's indications and Fassbender has always said that he trusts Scott and doesn't even try to ask about his future plans.


 
Quote from: fiveways on May 27, 2017, 01:59:47 AMDaily breakdown of the movies verse each other at Box Office mojo.  This link has a lot of interesting stats.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view=daily&id=covprom.htm
Prometheus weekend breakdowns.  It made 20m second weekend.  I'll be surprised if Covenant does 12-13m given it's drop off this week.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=prometheus.htm
Thanks! 12.3M is what they're predicting over 3-days weekend and 13,75 over four.
It's performing like Promtheus who fell 74% in its second Friday. While it's underwhelming,I don't know why people expected it to do perform like  Prometheus or even better. It's clear that it's a niche franchise,particularly frontloaded too. Without considering that Prometheus was divisive, to say the least,for fans as well.
If it pulls in 80M in domestic is not a disaster tbh.
As the Forbes' analyst noticed,even a 225M final gross would be decent for this. And,honestly,I can see it doing better than that without the Asian markets. If it pulls in something like 80M from those other markets,it will be fine.



Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 27, 2017, 05:43:58 PM

You're not factoring in the weekly dropoff. We're already looking at more than a 70% drop on it's second weekend in the US. In Australia it's opening weekend gross was 80% less than that of Prometheus.


No,it dropped 40% in local currency. Those drops in USD reported by BOM were quite meaningless.


Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 11:23:01 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 27, 2017, 10:50:27 PM
This dead horse needs a break...a nice long break.
Maybe only THEN we'll get something worthy of the franchise.

If the movie franchise is dead, we might still get some decent video games in the future. Its a tough pill to swallow because this is my favorite cinematic universe and I know it has more potential than what has been provided the last 30 years, but we could be at a point of no return.

I guess if Ridley Scott gave this franchise life then its only fitting that he kills it. Someone else said it before and it makes all the sense now...it feels like Covenant is a death kneel of the franchise.
Why all this pessimism?
The big mistake was to move this from August. It's an insanely crowded period for American and international releses. Pirates,Wonder Woman,The Mummy..  Films don't even have the time to establish themselves before losing screens for the next blockbuster.
But I don't see anyone talking about a flop.  Honestly,I don't see why Scott should leave the franchise without a conclusion if he agrees to work with a lower budget. The point is that these films don't justify a high budget anymore. That's all.

Not sure why people are calling it a flop. Something like King Arthur is a flop. Alien Covenant might've not met expectations, but it's not a flop. I too think the August date was better. That month is pretty dry this year. In fact, October would've been even better since it was marketed as a horror film.

It's a flop just not as big as those. It's going to suffer a catastrophic drop this second weekend that would have been a 70+% loss if it wasn't Memorial Day.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 28, 2017, 06:21:48 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 03:31:06 AM
Quote from: GQSioux on May 28, 2017, 03:21:10 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 27, 2017, 11:32:58 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PMA big star like Leonardo DiCaprio or Brad Pitt definitely means something at the box office.  They guarantee a certain amount of interest.
DiCaprio is probably the only actor who can be considered a legit draw,but he always teams up with high profile directors for hyped films that most of the time  end up being  Oscars contenders. He doesn't make independent films.. Movie stars like Pitt,Cruise,Depp don't have a consistent track record anymore. Their star power don't necessarily translate in good BO performances.  My point was that people don't pay to see a particular actor anymore independently of the film. Also,adult-oriented dramas struggle most of the time because those are films that people see at home.  And I don't see any reason to compare actors like Fassbender,Gosling,Hardy  to Pitt,Cruise,Will Smith,DiCaprio because it doesn't make any sense.

QuoteMy friend, that's your theory.  Sir Ridley wanted bigger stars for PROMETHEUS.  For example: Leonardo DiCaprio was the first choice for David. Michael Fassbender was his second choice.
I don't recall  DiCaprio being in the mix - he would have been completely wrong for the role-  but what is sure is that Scott really wanted Fassbender. There  are several articles that mention how Scott supported his casting even if he was un up-and-coming actor at the time who was still shooting all his future high profile films. Also,in the Sony leaked emails you can read Sony executives hinting at the fact that Scott goes around saying that he's the best actor working today. Draw your conclusion.
What Scott is doing is exactly what he wanted to do and Fassbender or anyone else is not playing any role. Logan and Harper are on record saying that they follow Scott's indications and Fassbender has always said that he trusts Scott and doesn't even try to ask about his future plans.


 
Quote from: fiveways on May 27, 2017, 01:59:47 AMDaily breakdown of the movies verse each other at Box Office mojo.  This link has a lot of interesting stats.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?view=daily&id=covprom.htm
Prometheus weekend breakdowns.  It made 20m second weekend.  I'll be surprised if Covenant does 12-13m given it's drop off this week.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=weekend&id=prometheus.htm
Thanks! 12.3M is what they're predicting over 3-days weekend and 13,75 over four.
It's performing like Promtheus who fell 74% in its second Friday. While it's underwhelming,I don't know why people expected it to do perform like  Prometheus or even better. It's clear that it's a niche franchise,particularly frontloaded too. Without considering that Prometheus was divisive, to say the least,for fans as well.
If it pulls in 80M in domestic is not a disaster tbh.
As the Forbes' analyst noticed,even a 225M final gross would be decent for this. And,honestly,I can see it doing better than that without the Asian markets. If it pulls in something like 80M from those other markets,it will be fine.



Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on May 27, 2017, 05:43:58 PM

You're not factoring in the weekly dropoff. We're already looking at more than a 70% drop on it's second weekend in the US. In Australia it's opening weekend gross was 80% less than that of Prometheus.


No,it dropped 40% in local currency. Those drops in USD reported by BOM were quite meaningless.


Quote from: cucuchu on May 27, 2017, 11:23:01 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on May 27, 2017, 10:50:27 PM
This dead horse needs a break...a nice long break.
Maybe only THEN we'll get something worthy of the franchise.

If the movie franchise is dead, we might still get some decent video games in the future. Its a tough pill to swallow because this is my favorite cinematic universe and I know it has more potential than what has been provided the last 30 years, but we could be at a point of no return.

I guess if Ridley Scott gave this franchise life then its only fitting that he kills it. Someone else said it before and it makes all the sense now...it feels like Covenant is a death kneel of the franchise.
Why all this pessimism?
The big mistake was to move this from August. It's an insanely crowded period for American and international releses. Pirates,Wonder Woman,The Mummy..  Films don't even have the time to establish themselves before losing screens for the next blockbuster.
But I don't see anyone talking about a flop.  Honestly,I don't see why Scott should leave the franchise without a conclusion if he agrees to work with a lower budget. The point is that these films don't justify a high budget anymore. That's all.

Not sure why people are calling it a flop. Something like King Arthur is a flop. Alien Covenant might've not met expectations, but it's not a flop. I too think the August date was better. That month is pretty dry this year. In fact, October would've been even better since it was marketed as a horror film.

It's a flop just not as big as those. It's going to suffer a catastrophic drop this second weekend that would have been a 70+% loss if it wasn't Memorial Day.

It can't be called a flop until all the receipts are in. Resident Evil The Final Chapter was deemed a flop but then opened to 90+ million weekend in China going on to make 160 million there. That's now the biggest film of the series and so big they are doing an immediate reboot.

I don't for one second preditct AC will do that in China but then I never would have said RE TFC would make 90 mil opening.

You never know, so it's a little early to pronounce it as a flop. Wait until it's hit the full set of markets then call it a flop
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 28, 2017, 09:42:49 AM
Second weekend here, it's off the big screens and advance bookings are around 15-20% 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 28, 2017, 11:40:17 AM
I'm currently in a major city for the holiday weekend. Last weekend there was multiple places with IMAX listings. Now all I see is regular showings. So no IMAX at all.

Guys it's a flop.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: irn on May 28, 2017, 11:50:17 AM
What went wrong? Was the marketing focused too strongly towards fans rather than general audiences? Was word of mouth after the week-early European release a drag on the US performance?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: marrerom on May 28, 2017, 11:54:48 AM
Quote from: irn on May 28, 2017, 11:50:17 AM
What went wrong? Was the marketing focused too strongly towards fans rather than general audiences? Was word of mouth after the week-early European release a drag on the US performance?

It was stupidly released between gotg2 and pirates 5.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 12:05:56 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 02:14:53 AM

I read a box office analyst say that there are some sort of indicators like audiences are turned off by Fassbender.  If you look at his recent movies, it's overwhelmingly clear that he is not a box office draw like DiCaprio or Pitt.

But my post was more about how Fassbender could be the reason that David stole the spotlight in Covenant.  He probably wasn't interested in versions where Shaw was too smart to reattach his head, for example.  Who would want to play a decapitated head for an entire movie?  In the end, they got a movie where Fassbender plays two roles, has all the best scenes and lines, the new female lead is someone he liked working with before, and he creates the xeno and the movie ends with him gloating over his victory.  C'mon.  It's almost like the script was written just for him, don't you think?  It certainly wasn't exactly what Ridley or Rapace wanted.  It's either Fox or Fassbender, but I don't think Fox would have bothered sending Fassbender a script they didn't intend to green light... unless they needed Fassbender to be onboard.  Either way, I think I have pretty good cause to single out Fassbender as the person with ultimate veto power over the script.  If Scott liked it, he'd show it to Fox, and if they liked it, he'd show it to Fassy and see if he was available.

To summarize, I'd say Fassbender did hurt the movie's box office by being unhappy with earlier versions of the script, causing delays and questionable changes to the story.  Combined with the possibility that Fassbender is a turnoff to mainstream audiences, I think there is a good chance he did hurt this movie.


Well, I think that's all bullsh*t.

If the mass audience hasn't taken to him - and that's debatable, it probably has more to do with the fact that apart from X-Men Fassbender prefers more challenging and less commercial roles. - The Coucellor, 12 Years a Slave, Shame etc aren't going to endear him to the popcorn crowd. Maybe, like Scott, he's just more popular outside the US?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 28, 2017, 12:18:23 PM
Quote from: irn on May 28, 2017, 11:50:17 AM
What went wrong? Was the marketing focused too strongly towards fans rather than general audiences? Was word of mouth after the week-early European release a drag on the US performance?

Marketing was weird.  Most people I know who saw it had zero idea about "the crossing:.

they focus on alien and horror fans.  both are small fringe groups.

Dismissal of Prometheus pissed off people.

The bad reviews were shared more than the good ones.  About half the good reviews felt really force and by people who are more excited to see a movie early than actual reviews.

it's as poorly edited as prometheus but lacks ambition so it is more of a slog.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 28, 2017, 12:40:29 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 12:05:56 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 02:14:53 AM
Quote from: Noah on May 27, 2017, 01:56:33 AM

Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor.
Well,The Counselor is an ensamble film and was sold as an ensamble film with bigger names than Fassbender. And nobody could have improved AC numbers. It's a VG film that appeals to a very niche audience and it didn't justify a high budget in the first place.
Re A:C: Prometheus didn't have "big names" either,and actually it's difficult for every actor to carry non-franchise movies by themselves,including RDJ,Chris Pratt,Evans, and all those who star in those Marvel monster hits. I think the days of the all star leading man doing are over. Actors don't draw much audiences these days. And,save for XMen,someone like Fassbender is mainly an arthouse kind of film actor.
Anyway,it doesn't make any sense to blame actors when a film like this underperforms. I'd say that Waterston  was the face of the marketing campaign among the actors,but it was evident how the big pull for this franchise - the xenomorphs - was put front and center. This wasn't marketed as a film with this or that actor.
The Counselor was an ensemble, but Fassbender played the title character and is in nearly every scene.  The other characters have significantly less screen time.

A big star like Leonardo DiCaprio or Brad Pitt definitely means something at the box office.  They guarantee a certain amount of interest.

I read a box office analyst say that there are some sort of indicators like audiences are turned off by Fassbender.  If you look at his recent movies, it's overwhelmingly clear that he is not a box office draw like DiCaprio or Pitt.

But my post was more about how Fassbender could be the reason that David stole the spotlight in Covenant.  He probably wasn't interested in versions where Shaw was too smart to reattach his head, for example.  Who would want to play a decapitated head for an entire movie?  In the end, they got a movie where Fassbender plays two roles, has all the best scenes and lines, the new female lead is someone he liked working with before, and he creates the xeno and the movie ends with him gloating over his victory.  C'mon.  It's almost like the script was written just for him, don't you think?  It certainly wasn't exactly what Ridley or Rapace wanted.  It's either Fox or Fassbender, but I don't think Fox would have bothered sending Fassbender a script they didn't intend to green light... unless they needed Fassbender to be onboard.  Either way, I think I have pretty good cause to single out Fassbender as the person with ultimate veto power over the script.  If Scott liked it, he'd show it to Fox, and if they liked it, he'd show it to Fassy and see if he was available.

To summarize, I'd say Fassbender did hurt the movie's box office by being unhappy with earlier versions of the script, causing delays and questionable changes to the story.  Combined with the possibility that Fassbender is a turnoff to mainstream audiences, I think there is a good chance he did hurt this movie.
Quote from: PierreVW on May 26, 2017, 05:16:55 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 26, 2017, 05:01:14 PM
Between The Counselor, Steve Jobs, Assassin's Creed, and now Covenant, Fassbender has a pretty poor track record, box office wise, as a lead actor. He also played games with his availability, making sure he was busy on another movie if he didn't like the current draft of Prometheus 2. When you read about the delays, Scott always wanted to go next wit his draft, and Noomi seems out of the loop, but Fassbinder kept saying "it's about finding the right story" and was constantly busy until the direction changed to being an Alien movie where Dave is the lead and creates the xenos. I know I'm reading between the lines, here, but I think Fassbinder deserves some blame, maybe a lot of the blame. He allegedly didn't get along with Rapace, and surprise she was replaced by an actress Fassbinder enjoyed working with on Steve Jobs. I think Fassbinder played games trying to make Covenant into what he wanted.

My friend, that's your theory.

Sir Ridley wanted bigger stars for PROMETHEUS.

For example: Leonardo DiCaprio was the first choice for David. Michael Fassbender was his second choice.
Didn't Brad Pitt briefly want to play David, as well?  I imagine he was the first or second choice before Fassbender, but no matter.

Regardless of how responsible Fassbender ultimately was, I think there is plenty of evidence to support the conclusion that Fassbender, not Scott or Fox or Rapace, is the person who rejected the first several drafts of the script.

Well, I think that's all bullsh*t.

Definatley. It's ridiculous to even suggest fassbender has that kind of power.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: OmegaZilla on May 28, 2017, 12:49:12 PM
People, please avoid quoting long posts just to say a few words. You can erase some of the quote text and replace it with [...] for simplicity. Thanks
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 28, 2017, 12:50:30 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 28, 2017, 12:40:29 PM

Definatley. It's ridiculous to even suggest fassbender has that kind of power.

If Fassbender was a pro wrestler he'd be a upper-midcarder at best.  He's pretty much proven he's not enough of a draw to carry a film alone.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scott Conover on May 28, 2017, 01:25:38 PM
The only way to get out of this mess if for the next film to be on a much smaller scale, possibly just taking place on the Covenant. And it would have to a budget like Arrival (47 million). If they start doing that, then they could have a sustainable movie franchise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 28, 2017, 01:27:20 PM
Quote from: Scott Conover on May 28, 2017, 01:25:38 PM
The only way to get out of this mess if for the next film to be on a much smaller scale, possibly just taking place on the Covenant. And it would have to a budget like Arrival (47 million). If they start doing that, then they could have a sustainable movie franchise.

No War of the Worlds then? :(

I'm not sure how many more movies will we get from this franchise btw...but I think the next one deserves all the money it can get!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scott Conover on May 28, 2017, 01:35:43 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 28, 2017, 01:27:20 PM
Quote from: Scott Conover on May 28, 2017, 01:25:38 PM
The only way to get out of this mess if for the next film to be on a much smaller scale, possibly just taking place on the Covenant. And it would have to a budget like Arrival (47 million). If they start doing that, then they could have a sustainable movie franchise.

No War of the Worlds then? :(

I'm not sure how many more movies will we get from this franchise btw...but I think the next one deserves all the money it can get!

Nah, That WILL NOT add any more money to this franchise. Covenant does not justify increasing the budget for future films.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 28, 2017, 01:39:15 PM
i think we should all just stop freaking about how covenant is doing in north america. .was any of us seriously thinking it was going to do well in this specific teritory?. .it's a pity that all one seems to get when googling is how it's performing in the US. .like it's the only f**king country in the world. .i am frankly way more interested in the global numbers and particularly china and japan where it's yet to open. .so we don't have the full picture yet. .thus i think their is still plenty of hope. .and besides it's not flopping even in the us. .just under performing. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 01:40:38 PM
Quote from: fiveways on May 28, 2017, 12:50:30 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 28, 2017, 12:40:29 PM

Definatley. It's ridiculous to even suggest fassbender has that kind of power.

If Fassbender was a pro wrestler he'd be a upper-midcarder at best.  He's pretty much proven he's not enough of a draw to carry a film alone.

Good then. I prefer actors to stars.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 28, 2017, 01:47:32 PM
Quote from: fiveways on May 28, 2017, 12:50:30 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 28, 2017, 12:40:29 PM

Definatley. It's ridiculous to even suggest fassbender has that kind of power.

If Fassbender was a pro wrestler he'd be a upper-midcarder at best.  He's pretty much proven he's not enough of a draw to carry a film alone.

Exactly, no way he could have held fox to ransom and got rapace the boot. He's a wonderful actor though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 28, 2017, 03:26:27 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 27, 2017, 06:45:15 AM
Was just revisiting the old box office prediction thread.  So much optimism. But the experts were right.

A lot of experts also predicted the extremely mixed word of mouth from Prometheus would detract from audience numbers too. It's clear as day it was social media reaction to Neil Blomkamp's Aliens sequel that set the internet on fire, not that Prometheus was lacking Aliens.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: harlequinade on May 28, 2017, 03:44:36 PM
https://twitter.com/ERCboxoffice/status/868838168996462592

That's a mega drop.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Xeno_from_Belgium on May 28, 2017, 03:49:12 PM
$75-80 finally i think.
Less than Prometheus....
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on May 28, 2017, 03:52:27 PM
I think it can still make it up to $80M dometic and $200-220 M overall (domestic+WW) 


Quote from: juxtapose on May 28, 2017, 01:39:15 PM
i think we should all just stop freaking about how covenant is doing in north america. .was any of us seriously thinking it was going to do well in this specific teritory?. .it's a pity that all one seems to get when googling is how it's performing in the US. .like it's the only f**king country in the world. .i am frankly way more interested in the global numbers and particularly china and japan where it's yet to open. .so we don't have the full picture yet. .thus i think their is still plenty of hope. .and besides it's not flopping even in the us. .just under performing. .

I just hope it'll still do well in Japan even though the release there will be 3 months late.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 04:03:32 PM
Good. The movie was terrible. Franchise needs another rest after two crap films back to back. I don't want a third film to finish this garbage, at this point I no longer give a damn about where the aliens came from anymore. Thanks, Ridley.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 28, 2017, 04:07:23 PM
Here we go again... A rehash of Aliens by a director in artistic and commercial decline, featuring a 70 year-old Weaver (who couldn't open an alien movie 20 years ago) is nothing more than a recipe for disaster.

Covenant marketing dropped the ball EXACTLY because it listened to fanboys and confused audiences, hiding all ties to Prometheus, not explaining the plot and presenting the movie as a remake of Alien.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:21:34 PM
Quote from: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 04:03:32 PM
Good. The movie was terrible. Franchise needs another rest after two crap films back to back. I don't want a third film to finish this garbage, at this point I no longer give a damn about where the aliens came from anymore. Thanks, Ridley.

Yes, thanks Ridley for giving me two films better than the piss poor sequels. (Ok - Alien3 was decent too). Shame the audience is too juvenile to appreciate an expansion of the themes, or too daft to go out and see it for themselves. Such is life. At least the tiresome fan boys are dropping like flies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 04:25:01 PM
LOL "Its better than 3 and Resurrection!" is not exactly a steep hill to climb.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 04:25:57 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:21:34 PM
Quote from: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 04:03:32 PM
Good. The movie was terrible. Franchise needs another rest after two crap films back to back. I don't want a third film to finish this garbage, at this point I no longer give a damn about where the aliens came from anymore. Thanks, Ridley.

Yes, thanks Ridley for giving me two films better than the piss poor sequels. (Ok - Alien3 was decent too). Shame the audience is too juvenile to appreciate an expansion of the themes, or too daft to go out and see it for themselves. Such is life. At least the tiresome fan boys are dropping like flies.

I think it's pretty short sighted to blame it on the audience. There are some pretty bad problems in the movies. And alien is turning out to not be the tentpole franchise fox wanted it to be and thought it might be.

The box office results have been horrific to say the least.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: harlequinade on May 28, 2017, 04:31:22 PM
Actually unlike Covenant Alien 3 and Resurrection weren't forgettable rehashes so I'd say this one is the worst one
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:32:10 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 04:25:57 PM


The box office results have been horrific to say the least.

Compared to other films this year? Hardly.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on May 28, 2017, 04:38:28 PM
Quote from: harlequinade on May 28, 2017, 04:31:22 PM
Actually unlike Covenant Alien 3 and Resurrection weren't forgettable rehashes so I'd say this one is the worst one

...

I've entered the Twilight Zone!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 28, 2017, 04:42:14 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:32:10 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 04:25:57 PM


The box office results have been horrific to say the least.

Compared to other films this year? Hardly.

Lol we're not worried about other films, here.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 28, 2017, 04:48:46 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 28, 2017, 04:38:28 PM
Quote from: harlequinade on May 28, 2017, 04:31:22 PM
Actually unlike Covenant Alien 3 and Resurrection weren't forgettable rehashes so I'd say this one is the worst one

...

I've entered the Twilight Zone!
. .no this is american horror story. .wake up. . lol
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 28, 2017, 05:05:28 PM
Honestly, I don't think Alienkamp would be any better at this point. I wonder if we're getting closer to that ever inevitable and just as unwanted reboot/remake.

Also - https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/28/box-office-alien-covenant-suffers-brutal-71-drop-as-guardians-2-tops-guardians/#67e2795e67e2
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 05:08:38 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:32:10 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 04:25:57 PM


The box office results have been horrific to say the least.

Compared to other films this year? Hardly.

Haha absolutely. An anemic opening and absolute horrific second weekend that was terrible even after being bolstered by memorial weekend.

It's a pretty big failure.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 05:16:18 PM
The level of denial and "its the audience's fault!" behavior being displayed here is sad. Predictable, but still sad.

And yes, a reboot is EXACTLY what this franchise needs. Its needed one for over twenty years.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:17:25 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 28, 2017, 05:05:28 PM
Honestly, I don't think Alienkamp would be any better at this point. I wonder if we're getting closer to that ever inevitable and just as unwanted reboot/remake.

Also - https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/28/box-office-alien-covenant-suffers-brutal-71-drop-as-guardians-2-tops-guardians/#67e2795e67e2


Maybe a reboot is what is needed at this point. I don't want it but I guess we could view at as a cleansing of the series and a fresh start. Everything is such a mess now. I feel exhausted making sense of anything because the writers/directors might not even bother making sense of anything themselves.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 05:25:16 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:17:25 PM
I feel exhausted making sense of anything because the writers/directors might not even bother making sense of anything themselves.

Really? I'm not finding it that hard to make sense of.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 28, 2017, 05:37:47 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 04:25:57 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:21:34 PM
Quote from: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 04:03:32 PM
Good. The movie was terrible. Franchise needs another rest after two crap films back to back. I don't want a third film to finish this garbage, at this point I no longer give a damn about where the aliens came from anymore. Thanks, Ridley.

Yes, thanks Ridley for giving me two films better than the piss poor sequels. (Ok - Alien3 was decent too). Shame the audience is too juvenile to appreciate an expansion of the themes, or too daft to go out and see it for themselves. Such is life. At least the tiresome fan boys are dropping like flies.

I think it's pretty short sighted to blame it on the audience. There are some pretty bad problems in the movies. And alien is turning out to not be the tentpole franchise fox wanted it to be and thought it might be.

The box office results have been horrific to say the least.

I don't like using the abrupt term "this" to express agreement, but, well, this. ^^^


Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 28, 2017, 05:05:28 PM
Honestly, I don't think Alienkamp would be any better at this point. I wonder if we're getting closer to that ever inevitable and just as unwanted reboot/remake.

Also - https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/28/box-office-alien-covenant-suffers-brutal-71-drop-as-guardians-2-tops-guardians/#67e2795e67e2

71%. Horrific. Do we think this will serve as a humbling experience to Scott, or is he just too old and established to truly care at this point?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on May 28, 2017, 05:54:36 PM
The Martian will subsidize Alien: Covenant for Ridley.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:56:17 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 05:25:16 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:17:25 PM
I feel exhausted making sense of anything because the writers/directors might not even bother making sense of anything themselves.

Really? I'm not finding it that hard to make sense of.

I am talking about the issues such as space jockey being bigger than engineer, the short life cycle compared to first movie, aliens behaving like idiots in Covenant vs somewhat intelligent in Alien, etc.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 05:56:24 PM
Quote from: Alionic on May 28, 2017, 05:54:36 PM
The Martian will subsidize Alien: Covenant for Ridley.

That isn't how it works. Fox won't make movies for budgets they know they won't even come close to recouping.

Also Ridley needs a lot of subsidizing after exodus and covenant.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 06:09:02 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 28, 2017, 05:37:47 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 04:25:57 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:21:34 PM
Quote from: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 04:03:32 PM
Good. The movie was terrible. Franchise needs another rest after two crap films back to back. I don't want a third film to finish this garbage, at this point I no longer give a damn about where the aliens came from anymore. Thanks, Ridley.

Yes, thanks Ridley for giving me two films better than the piss poor sequels. (Ok - Alien3 was decent too). Shame the audience is too juvenile to appreciate an expansion of the themes, or too daft to go out and see it for themselves. Such is life. At least the tiresome fan boys are dropping like flies.

I think it's pretty short sighted to blame it on the audience. There are some pretty bad problems in the movies. And alien is turning out to not be the tentpole franchise fox wanted it to be and thought it might be.

The box office results have been horrific to say the least.

I don't like using the abrupt term "this" to express agreement, but, well, this. ^^^


Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 28, 2017, 05:05:28 PM
Honestly, I don't think Alienkamp would be any better at this point. I wonder if we're getting closer to that ever inevitable and just as unwanted reboot/remake.

Also - https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/28/box-office-alien-covenant-suffers-brutal-71-drop-as-guardians-2-tops-guardians/#67e2795e67e2

71%. Horrific. Do we think this will serve as a humbling experience to Scott, or is he just too old and established to truly care at this point?

Scott has endured FAR larger bombs than Covenant (1492 and Legend come to mind). The only thing this will change is the budget Fox gives him for the 3rd one, if there will even be a third one...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 06:45:13 PM
Quote from: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 05:16:18 PM
The level of denial and "its the audience's fault!" behavior being displayed here is sad. Predictable, but still sad.

And yes, a reboot is EXACTLY what this franchise needs. Its needed one for over twenty years.

Not as sad and delusional as those that regard Covenant as the worst in the franchise. Now that is sad.

No reboot required. If it ends here so be it. David as creator drifting into space with 2000 humans to experiment on. Nice grim mystery ending.

Worse thing that could happen is some atrocious perceived fan service in colonial marines vs aliens - awful. Alien existed before 1986.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BonesawT101 on May 28, 2017, 07:03:06 PM
Exactly what Gash said!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 28, 2017, 07:16:20 PM
I said prior to release that the film was set up for success from a scheduling & marketing stand point. I still believe that. Unfortunately, general audiences simply weren't interested, or so it would seem. A 71% decline is atrocious, made even worse by the fact that it's Memorial Day weekend.

I don't know if a Ripley fronted Alien 5 would perform any better. Nostalgia is in, but it's hit or miss. Jurassic World cleaned up whereas Independence Day Resurgence was largely ignored. Of course, quality may play a factor. I'm someone who is open to such a film happening, even though I adore Alien 3.

Why does this franchise need a reboot? What constitutes a reboot in your eyes? Resurrection, though a direct sequel to Alien 3, surely sought to renew fan interest in the franchise. Prometheus, while a prequel, once again attempt to bring audiences back into that world. If by reboot you mean remake however, then that's something I don't have any interest in.

I don't know what would pull in new, or old, audiences at this juncture. I found Covenant disappointing. No, it's not the worst film in the franchise given there's still Alien Resurrection, but I'd rank it behind everything else.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Russ840 on May 28, 2017, 07:17:47 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:56:17 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 05:25:16 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:17:25 PM
I feel exhausted making sense of anything because the writers/directors might not even bother making sense of anything themselves.

Really? I'm not finding it that hard to make sense of.

I am talking about the issues such as space jockey being bigger than engineer, the short life cycle compared to first movie, aliens behaving like idiots in Covenant vs somewhat intelligent in Alien, etc.

The jockey and Engineer size difference will likely just be artist licensing and the other stuff is easy to explain.  The Alien is different so the cycle can be also.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 28, 2017, 08:43:20 PM
Worldwide:    $158,356,462   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Bob Saget on May 28, 2017, 08:55:13 PM
From deadline:

"another $10.8M from 77 markets, Fox and Ridley's Scott's Alien: Covenant just crossed the $100M threshold after experiencing some decent holds in certain markets — Russia is still No. 2 in the market in its sophomore frame after pulling in another $1.1M this weekend, for instance.

Likewise in Germany, it's held on well for the No. 3 spot in its second weekend where it grabbed $914K. In the UK, it took in about $939K (weekend 3) and in France $914K (also week 3).

Remember, this one still has yet to bow in China or Japan, which it will do on June 16 and Sept.. 15, respectively. Overall, it has a cume after this weekend of $101M. Its global take is $161.5M."

http://deadline.com/2017/05/pirates-5-dead-men-tell-no-tales-international-debut-box-office-global-take-disney-1202103717/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: YutaniDitch on May 28, 2017, 08:56:44 PM
Quote from: Russ840 on May 28, 2017, 07:17:47 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:56:17 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 05:25:16 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 28, 2017, 05:17:25 PM
I feel exhausted making sense of anything because the writers/directors might not even bother making sense of anything themselves.

Really? I'm not finding it that hard to make sense of.

I am talking about the issues such as space jockey being bigger than engineer, the short life cycle compared to first movie, aliens behaving like idiots in Covenant vs somewhat intelligent in Alien, etc.

The jockey and Engineer size difference will likely just be artist licensing and the other stuff is easy to explain.  The Alien is different so the cycle can be also.

So, the Xeno chestburster regresses to larvae form after being fully fledged chestburster generations earlier...!? That is very contradictive of Darwin's Laws of Evolution... Like the egg preceding the Queen in just a couple decades... The Xeno only difference is that it had a human host and was somehow created in a very filthy, contaminated underground catacomb of a pseudo-lab...😂💩
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Snake on May 28, 2017, 09:30:45 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 06:45:13 PM
Quote from: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 05:16:18 PM
The level of denial and "its the audience's fault!" behavior being displayed here is sad. Predictable, but still sad.

And yes, a reboot is EXACTLY what this franchise needs. Its needed one for over twenty years.

Not as sad and delusional as those that regard Covenant as the worst in the franchise. Now that is sad.

No reboot required. If it ends here so be it. David as creator drifting into space with 2000 humans to experiment on. Nice grim mystery ending.

Worse thing that could happen is some atrocious perceived fan service in colonial marines vs aliens - awful. Alien existed before 1986.

Right! If Covenant is the final encore so be it. IMO, when I read some of hate-filled posts of the so-called fans here, comparing it to Resurrection and AVP:R (which were AWFUL!), we don't even deserve another film.

Well, time to 'look forward' to 'Lala Land 2', 'Fast & Furious 9: Tits or gtfo', 'Batman vs Hulk feat. Spiderman' and many more!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 28, 2017, 09:51:49 PM
I don't blame audiences for not wanting to see a movie that doesn't look very interesting.

The blame goes to whichever person turned Prometheus 2 into an Alien prequel.  I know this isn't the forum for this statement, but I think the Alien franchise is what turned people off.  People like all the same elements when it is called Prometheus, and both movies got similar reviews.  The only difference is the fact that it's an overt, unabashed Alien movie.  I have to assume that the Alien franchise has overstayed its welcome with the general public.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mr. Forest on May 28, 2017, 10:05:48 PM
I was expecting a big drop, but not this BIG of a drop.  At this point the film will likely finish just under $100 million or lower domestic, and around $200 world wide.  Covenant is most likely not going to break even and the franchise is going to ended up being shelved again.  I just don't get it.  Fox could have had a Prometheus sequel and Alien sequel, but instead they butchered the Prometheus sequel by turning it into an Alien prequel while killing the Alien sequel.  If Fox secretly wanted to kill two birds with one stone, then they succeeded.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:14:45 PM
If Scott made a movie to please the masses then the movie must please the masses . Box office numbers so far shows otherwise .


Quote from: Protozoid on May 28, 2017, 09:51:49 PM
I don't blame audiences for not wanting to see a movie that doesn't look very interesting.

The blame goes to whichever person turned Prometheus 2 into an Alien prequel.  I know this isn't the forum for this statement, but I think the Alien franchise is what turned people off.  People like all the same elements when it is called Prometheus, and both movies got similar reviews.  The only difference is the fact that it's an overt, unabashed Alien movie.  I have to assume that the Alien franchise has overstayed its welcome with the general public.

It an alien movie that we have seen many times before without weaver. The android is only effective in the story when it was subjected to human ownership. Now free it seems human all by itself ? What motivates it to destroy the engineers ? He stood in awe of the engineers in Prometheus - "no doubt a superior species" and now? A bunch of morons ? Right there 's the problem.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Immortan Jonesy on May 28, 2017, 10:34:54 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:14:45 PM
If Scott made a movie to please the masses then the movie must please the masses . Box office numbers so far shows otherwise .

Scott made (in his own way) a movie to please the fans. Especially to please those who hated Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 28, 2017, 10:39:38 PM
It felt cynically made.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 10:50:40 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:14:45 PM
If Scott made a movie to please the masses then the movie must please the masses . Box office numbers so far shows otherwise .


Quote from: Protozoid on May 28, 2017, 09:51:49 PM
I don't blame audiences for not wanting to see a movie that doesn't look very interesting.

The blame goes to whichever person turned Prometheus 2 into an Alien prequel.  I know this isn't the forum for this statement, but I think the Alien franchise is what turned people off.  People like all the same elements when it is called Prometheus, and both movies got similar reviews.  The only difference is the fact that it's an overt, unabashed Alien movie.  I have to assume that the Alien franchise has overstayed its welcome with the general public.

It an alien movie that we have seen many times before without weaver. The android is only effective in the story when it was subjected to human ownership. Now free it seems human all by itself ? What motivates it to destroy the engineers ? He stood in awe of the engineers in Prometheus - "no doubt a superior species" and now? A bunch of morons ? Right there 's the problem.

"Mortal after all" 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:50:46 PM
Quote from: Crazy Shrimp on May 28, 2017, 10:34:54 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:14:45 PM
If Scott made a movie to please the masses then the movie must please the masses . Box office numbers so far shows otherwise .

Scott made (in his own way) a movie to please the fans. Especially to please those who hated Prometheus.

But has he made a movie to please the fans? Are the fans pleased ?


Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 10:50:40 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:14:45 PM
If Scott made a movie to please the masses then the movie must please the masses . Box office numbers so far shows otherwise .


Quote from: Protozoid on May 28, 2017, 09:51:49 PM
I don't blame audiences for not wanting to see a movie that doesn't look very interesting.

The blame goes to whichever person turned Prometheus 2 into an Alien prequel.  I know this isn't the forum for this statement, but I think the Alien franchise is what turned people off.  People like all the same elements when it is called Prometheus, and both movies got similar reviews.  The only difference is the fact that it's an overt, unabashed Alien movie.  I have to assume that the Alien franchise has overstayed its welcome with the general public.

It an alien movie that we have seen many times before without weaver. The android is only effective in the story when it was subjected to human ownership. Now free it seems human all by itself ? What motivates it to destroy the engineers ? He stood in awe of the engineers in Prometheus - "no doubt a superior species" and now? A bunch of morons ? Right there 's the problem.

"Mortal after all"

Doesn't mean they were a bunch of morons . Doesn't mean they weren't superior to us,
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 10:54:41 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:50:46 PM
But has he made a movie to please the fans? Are the fans pleased ?

Mostly, according to the fan poll.

I've been a fan since 79, I'm more than pleased with Covenant.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 11:06:33 PM
Fair enough. I just don t think the fan base is big enough for that.  Prometheus existed because it wanted to introduce a whole new generation Of fans to the lore while starting a new one. Covenant completely doesn't achieve any of that while failing at the box office as a "homage fest" cash cow to keep financial viability of the serious alive until awakening returned to the roots (perhaps) of the series.  Maybe China will do the trick.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 28, 2017, 11:08:29 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 11:06:33 PM
Fair enough. I just don t think the fan base is big enough for that.  Prometheus existed because it wanted to introduce a whole new generation Of fans to the lore while starting a new one. Covenant completely doesn't achieve any of that while failing at the box office as a "homage fest" cash cow to keep financial viability of the serious alive until awakening returned to the roots (perhaps) of the series.  Maybe China will do the trick.

It has homage within it, but tells it's own story.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: DestinyCaptain on May 29, 2017, 12:37:31 AM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 10:54:41 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:50:46 PM
But has he made a movie to please the fans? Are the fans pleased ?

Mostly, according to the fan poll.

I've been a fan since 79, I'm more than pleased with Covenant.

Well, there's the issue. I don't personally know any fans that like it. I also don't personally know any casual viewers that didn't think it wasn't downright stupid. That's about 10 people all together, fans and casuals combined.

This certainly not a scientific number by any stretch of the imagination. However, this is not a good thing in general.  I'm wondering if it's also not sign of where the fan base is.

If they really liked the movie, they'd see it repeatedly and they'd drag loved ones to see it. If casuals really liked it, they'd coax others to see it. The film is just not cutting it with people.

This observation is not a slight on anyone that likes it. I am genuinely glad that these people enjoyed it. It sux when you are exited to see a film and when you finally do, it disappoints you deeply. That's a downer.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on May 29, 2017, 12:56:19 AM
Yikes. A:C only made $10 million this weekend. $57 million domestic so far, $101 international, $158 total.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dookie on May 29, 2017, 01:09:53 AM
Quote from: harlequinade on May 28, 2017, 03:44:36 PM
https://twitter.com/ERCboxoffice/status/868838168996462592

That's a mega drop.


The beast is cooked. Everyone, including Ridley himself, knew it except for those dumbass Fox execs. Good riddance.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: RidgeTop on May 29, 2017, 01:11:09 AM
http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3439492/pirates-sink-alien-covenant-box-office/

"Early estimates are in and they're brutal.

Not since the Friday the 13th remake can I recall a drop like this as Twentieth Century Fox's Alien: Covenant was burned by Baywatch and sunk by Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Men Tell No Tales. In fact, the Friday estimates were so bad that Marvel's Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 beat out Ridley Scott's Prometheus sequel/Alien prequel."


Quote from: Snake on May 28, 2017, 09:30:45 PMRight! If Covenant is the final encore so be it. IMO, when I read some of hate-filled posts of the so-called fans here, comparing it to Resurrection and AVP:R (which were AWFUL!), we don't even deserve another film.

Can we drop the questioning of the fan-status of those who didn't (or did) like the movie please?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 29, 2017, 01:15:15 AM
I still don't know why they pushed this movie to release now??? August looks much better.

Even then Prometheus isn't really considered "sequel worthy"

I don't know. I hope they let Ridley finish his trilogy, but i also haven't been impressed with it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on May 29, 2017, 01:17:31 AM
I don't think the beast is cooked, Covenant simply wasn't about the Aliens. It was about creation and a robot that hated humanity. For 80% of the movie I was in, but the last act just zipped by so fast so Ridley could get back to David and his story. That's why the movie tanked in my opinion.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 29, 2017, 01:24:06 AM
If the aliens are detracting from the story Ridley wants to tell, that is a problem in itself.  Some people still want to see the xenomorphs, sure, but apparently most movie-goers want more out of a movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 29, 2017, 01:45:33 AM
Quote from: shawsbaby on May 29, 2017, 12:56:19 AM
Yikes. A:C only made $10 million this weekend. $57 million domestic so far, $101 international, $158 total.

In the hallowed words of Morse (Danny Webb's character from Alien3):

f**k!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 02:10:54 AM
Quote from: Snake on May 28, 2017, 09:30:45 PM
Right! If Covenant is the final encore so be it. IMO, when I read some of hate-filled posts of the so-called fans here, comparing it to Resurrection and AVP:R (which were AWFUL!), we don't even deserve another film.

Well, time to 'look forward' to 'Lala Land 2', 'Fast & Furious 9: Tits or gtfo', 'Batman vs Hulk feat. Spiderman' and many more!

So-called fans? Just b/c we don't all share your blind affinity for this film doesn't make anyone less of a fan than you. Also, you're takes are just the worst. La La Land won multiple Oscars. The Fast & Furious franchise is a crowd pleaser. Fast Five is truly great. The MCU films haven't received one rotten score on RT.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 29, 2017, 04:20:23 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 02:10:54 AM
Quote from: Snake on May 28, 2017, 09:30:45 PM
Right! If Covenant is the final encore so be it. IMO, when I read some of hate-filled posts of the so-called fans here, comparing it to Resurrection and AVP:R (which were AWFUL!), we don't even deserve another film.

Well, time to 'look forward' to 'Lala Land 2', 'Fast & Furious 9: Tits or gtfo', 'Batman vs Hulk feat. Spiderman' and many more!

So-called fans? Just b/c we don't all share your blind affinity for this film doesn't make anyone less of a fan than you. Also, you're takes are just the worst. La La Land won multiple Oscars. The Fast & Furious franchise is a crowd pleaser. Fast Five is truly great. The MCU films haven't received one rotten score on RT.

So?....

BLADE RUNNER was killed by Critics(like those in RT) in 1982. Critics(All of them) are people who NEVER worked in films.


Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 28, 2017, 05:37:47 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 28, 2017, 04:25:57 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 04:21:34 PM
Quote from: A_Sexual_Tyrannosaurus on May 28, 2017, 04:03:32 PM
Good. The movie was terrible. Franchise needs another rest after two crap films back to back. I don't want a third film to finish this garbage, at this point I no longer give a damn about where the aliens came from anymore. Thanks, Ridley.

Yes, thanks Ridley for giving me two films better than the piss poor sequels. (Ok - Alien3 was decent too). Shame the audience is too juvenile to appreciate an expansion of the themes, or too daft to go out and see it for themselves. Such is life. At least the tiresome fan boys are dropping like flies.

I think it's pretty short sighted to blame it on the audience. There are some pretty bad problems in the movies. And alien is turning out to not be the tentpole franchise fox wanted it to be and thought it might be.

The box office results have been horrific to say the least.

I don't like using the abrupt term "this" to express agreement, but, well, this. ^^^


Quote from: Corporal Hicks on May 28, 2017, 05:05:28 PM
Honestly, I don't think Alienkamp would be any better at this point. I wonder if we're getting closer to that ever inevitable and just as unwanted reboot/remake.

Also - https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/05/28/box-office-alien-covenant-suffers-brutal-71-drop-as-guardians-2-tops-guardians/#67e2795e67e2

71%. Horrific. Do we think this will serve as a humbling experience to Scott, or is he just too old and established to truly care at this point?

Sir Ridley Scott is too old and established to care about this franchise. He is going to leave and Direct 5 other films.

He is already working in ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD with Kevin Spacey and Mark Wahlberg.

He is Directing THE CARTEL in January 2018.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 29, 2017, 01:24:06 AM
If the aliens are detracting from the story Ridley wants to tell, that is a problem in itself.  Some people still want to see the xenomorphs, sure, but apparently most movie-goers want more out of a movie.

https://www.cinemascore.com/

This is the problem. American audiences largely found Baywatch and Pirates a better film; word of mouth just hasn't been very good. I enjoyed Alien: Covenant but it's by no means an Alien movie like the traditional ones, it's very much a sequel to Prometheus and I bet that's either really turning some people off or confusing them.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on May 29, 2017, 06:16:37 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM
it's very much a sequel to Prometheus and I bet that's either really turning some people off or confusing them.

It would had cleared some of the confusion by titling the film Paradise like it was originally in 2012 or Alien: Paradise Lost. Though, too late for that now.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Sway on May 29, 2017, 06:32:33 AM
Quote from: DestinyCaptain on May 29, 2017, 12:37:31 AM
Quote from: Gash on May 28, 2017, 10:54:41 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 28, 2017, 10:50:46 PM
But has he made a movie to please the fans? Are the fans pleased ?

Mostly, according to the fan poll.

I've been a fan since 79, I'm more than pleased with Covenant.

Well, there's the issue. I don't personally know any fans that like it. I also don't personally know any casual viewers that didn't think it wasn't downright stupid. That's about 10 people all together, fans and casuals combined.

This certainly not a scientific number by any stretch of the imagination. However, this is not a good thing in general.  I'm wondering if it's also not sign of where the fan base is.

If they really liked the movie, they'd see it repeatedly and they'd drag loved ones to see it. If casuals really liked it, they'd coax others to see it. The film is just not cutting it with people.

This observation is not a slight on anyone that likes it. I am genuinely glad that these people enjoyed it. It sux when you are exited to see a film and when you finally do, it disappoints you deeply. That's a downer.

I know a total of four people who've seen it, and all feel it was a fantastic film. So yeah, you're "ten friends" do not qualify as a scientific number.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on May 29, 2017, 07:11:42 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 02:10:54 AM
Quote from: Snake on May 28, 2017, 09:30:45 PM
Right! If Covenant is the final encore so be it. IMO, when I read some of hate-filled posts of the so-called fans here, comparing it to Resurrection and AVP:R (which were AWFUL!), we don't even deserve another film.

Well, time to 'look forward' to 'Lala Land 2', 'Fast & Furious 9: Tits or gtfo', 'Batman vs Hulk feat. Spiderman' and many more!

So-called fans? Just b/c we don't all share your blind affinity for this film doesn't make anyone less of a fan than you. Also, you're takes are just the worst. La La Land won multiple Oscars. The Fast & Furious franchise is a crowd pleaser. Fast Five is truly great. The MCU films haven't received one rotten score on RT.

Fast and Furious 5 is a piece of shit specifically made to appeal to the less discerning  popcorn munchers...



Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 29, 2017, 01:24:06 AM
If the aliens are detracting from the story Ridley wants to tell, that is a problem in itself.  Some people still want to see the xenomorphs, sure, but apparently most movie-goers want more out of a movie.

https://www.cinemascore.com/

This is the problem. American audiences largely found Baywatch and Pirates a better film; word of mouth just hasn't been very good. I enjoyed Alien: Covenant but it's by no means an Alien movie like the traditional ones, it's very much a sequel to Prometheus and I bet that's either really turning some people off or confusing them.

I'm just not sure it's that type of movie. It's almost like an arthouse film... quite similar to Alien 3 in that respect. Downbeat, somber, dark. I don't think it's a surprise that audiences would prefer a vastly inferior POC or Baywatch movie over Alien Covenant, but that is by no means refelective of their relative technical merits; AC being the superior one.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:40:35 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 29, 2017, 01:24:06 AM
If the aliens are detracting from the story Ridley wants to tell, that is a problem in itself.  Some people still want to see the xenomorphs, sure, but apparently most movie-goers want more out of a movie.

https://www.cinemascore.com/

This is the problem. American audiences largely found Baywatch and Pirates a better film; word of mouth just hasn't been very good. I enjoyed Alien: Covenant but it's by no means an Alien movie like the traditional ones, it's very much a sequel to Prometheus and I bet that's either really turning some people off or confusing them.

The basic problem with Alien Covenant is that it tries to be all things, and ends up nothing. It fails to resolve issues left over from Prometheus, and instead rehashes old tropes from erarlier films. The more i think about it, the more disillusioned I am with Ridley Scott/The Studio for screwing the pooch on this one.

I'd love to know the back story.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 29, 2017, 07:42:59 AM
. .baywatch made half of what covenant did on it's opening. .18 mil vs 36 mil. .comparing them in covenant's second weekend is not fair. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 29, 2017, 07:50:26 AM
Baywatch underperformed. Pirates underperformed in the US. It's a pretty horrible summer for tentpole movies so far. 

Fox overestimated the number of hardcore alien fans. They should have pushed the Prometheus angle, call the movie "Paradise" or something like that, and stick to the August release date.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
Quote from: marrerom on May 28, 2017, 11:54:48 AM
Quote from: irn on May 28, 2017, 11:50:17 AM
What went wrong? Was the marketing focused too strongly towards fans rather than general audiences? Was word of mouth after the week-early European release a drag on the US performance?

It was stupidly released between gotg2 and pirates 5.

It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on May 29, 2017, 08:36:16 AM
I can't believe that some people here are comparing Baywatch and AC. To think that Baywatch is in its first week while AC is already in its 2nd week. Unfair comparison.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 08:43:51 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 29, 2017, 07:50:26 AM
Fox overestimated the number of hardcore alien fans. They should have pushed the Prometheus angle, call the movie "Paradise" or something like that, and stick to the August release date.

The hardcore Alien fans turned out opening weekend. It didn't live up to the projections but a $15million+ opening day is a decent figure. But the fans are only going to carry a movie so far... Prometheus made over 40% of it's total domestic run in it's opening weekend. Lukewarm word of mouth knocked Prometheus' legs in the end. If you rename Alien: Covenant to  Prometheus 2 and it was met with the very reaction AC has received, I'd imagine it would experience the same results (Probably less because ALIEN will always carry the goodwill of Alien and Aliens)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 29, 2017, 09:08:03 AM
Alien and Aliens don't exist in a vacuum. In the next 30 years the franchise gave us the underperforming and (unfairly) maligned Alien 3, the underperforming and pretty much terrible Resurrection, a sub-par Paul W.S. Anderson B-movie and one of the worst pieces of shit slasher movies ever.

Alien is a tainted brand with a shrinking fan base. Fox's previous administration got that and distanced Prometheus from Alien. The new regime got cocky (and stupid listening to fanboys) and went back to the poisoned well for Covenant.

By the way, Prometheus was well-reviewed and liked in the real world.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 09:27:01 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 29, 2017, 09:08:03 AM
By the way, Prometheus was well-reviewed and liked in the real world.

Like I was saying though, it was front-loaded. Prometheus experienced a -73% first friday-to-friday drop like Covenant (obviously waiting on the actual damages) and shares the same dreaded "B" score card on https://www.cinemascore.com/ - the word of mouth among general audiences was real mixed. There is no way of telling if a straight-up Prometheus sequel would have been a success.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on May 29, 2017, 09:51:53 AM
"'Pirates' Sinks 'Alien: Covenant' at the Box Office"

QuoteCovenant made an estimated $3 million on Friday, making it a whopping 80% drop from the $15 million the week prior. As Forbes notes, this puts it on track to be one of the ten biggest second-week drops of all time.

http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3439492/pirates-sink-alien-covenant-box-office/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 29, 2017, 10:42:55 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM

This is the problem. American audiences largely found Baywatch and Pirates a better film.

Doesn't reflect too well on American audiences then. Still, I'm sure there are some discerning ones.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 10:51:23 AM
Quote from: Gash on May 29, 2017, 10:42:55 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM

This is the problem. American audiences largely found Baywatch and Pirates a better film.

Doesn't reflect too well on American audiences then. Still, I'm sure there are some discerning ones.

The rock and Depp (particularly as sparrow) are big draws at the BO regardless of the quality of the film unfortunately.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 29, 2017, 10:54:17 AM
Apologies when I said masses I meant the overall casual fans who know of alien butt not its lore. Its a pity people don't the story behind the story.

Prometheus probably set out t achieve that as it would reignite interest . Problem is you can't replace the old lore with new lore and not follow up on it especially  without Ripley in the mix. She carried the series after alien. Weaver star power made aliens great. And so also alien 3 and rez. She is an incredible actress. 2 generations of her can't just be replaced with "nothing". Hence Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 29, 2017, 11:18:16 AM
Cameron at his peak made Aliens great.
Weaver didn't carry the series. Alien 3 was a financial disappointment, Resurrection a flop that almost killed the franchise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: oduodu on May 29, 2017, 11:23:19 AM
I disagree. Weaver as Ripley the protaganist against the alien the antagonist was at least 65% what made aliens great. Cameron was the rest.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 29, 2017, 11:53:50 AM
I'm in two minds about the character of Ripley. She was a survivor by chance in ALIEN and I have little interest in her beyond that - although her conclusion in Alien3 was interesting.

But if Ripley hadn't of been in Aliens I would have had zero interest in seeing an Alien sequel done by the Terminator guy. So Ripley was the hook there. Shame she still couldn't salvage it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: JohnnyChimpo on May 29, 2017, 12:28:13 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 29, 2017, 11:53:50 AM
I'm in two minds about the character of Ripley. She was a survivor by chance in ALIEN and I have little interest in her beyond that - although her conclusion in Alien3 was interesting.

But if Ripley hadn't of been in Aliens I would have had zero interest in seeing an Alien sequel done by the Terminator guy. So Ripley was the hook there. Shame she still couldn't salvage it.

Why do you look down your nose so much at Aliens?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 12:35:11 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 29, 2017, 10:42:55 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM

This is the problem. American audiences largely found Baywatch and Pirates a better film.

Doesn't reflect too well on American audiences then. Still, I'm sure there are some discerning ones.

You need to close your mouth about taking out YOUR frustration on an entire nation's audience.

I found your comment prejudicial and insulting being from America.

Stop being a petulant child. I didn't say "it doesn't reflect well on you" because you enjoyed a movie that I didn't. Grow up.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 29, 2017, 12:52:43 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 12:35:11 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 29, 2017, 10:42:55 AM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 29, 2017, 05:52:40 AM

This is the problem. American audiences largely found Baywatch and Pirates a better film.

Doesn't reflect too well on American audiences then. Still, I'm sure there are some discerning ones.

You need to close your mouth about taking out YOUR frustration on an entire nation's audience.

I found your comment prejudicial and insulting being from America.

Stop being a petulant child. I didn't say "it doesn't reflect well on you" because you enjoyed a movie that I didn't. Grow up.

You need to read it again. I didn't bring up the issue of American audiences - I said that viewpoint doesn't reflect well on American audiences and there must be some discerning ones - meaning people who don't prefer Baywatch.



Quote from: JohnnyChimpo on May 29, 2017, 12:28:13 PMWhy do you look down your nose so much at Aliens?

Just way too overrated. It's a competent but simplified rehash that screws with ALIEN lore as much as, if not more than, Alien Covenant is presumed to. The hurt that many Aliens fans are feeling I can relate to as it's much as I felt in 1986 after sitting through their esteemed classic.

Still, the queen is dead (for now) long live David.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on May 29, 2017, 01:32:34 PM
Long live David.

Embrace the New Canon.

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 01:47:49 PM

Quote from: JohnnyChimpo on May 29, 2017, 12:28:13 PMWhy do you look down your nose so much at Aliens?

Just way too overrated. It's a competent but simplified rehash that screws with ALIEN lore as much as, if not more than, Alien Covenant is presumed to. The hurt that many Aliens fans are feeling I can relate to as it's much as I felt in 1986 after sitting through their esteemed classic.

Still, the queen is dead (for now) long live David.
[/quote]

^ this is so true. I like Aliens but it always annoyed me that Cameron took the nightmarish creature from my childhood and turned it into cannon fodder just so he can have a bigger one!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 02:45:12 PM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book

It's weird, man. That does seem like a solid profit, but studios usually need a considerably high margin for their films to be considered a commercial success.

Also, in addition to the $97 mil production cost, the cost of marketing was most likely substantial, so in that regard, I'm not sure the film did much better than break even yet, if that.

We are in a strange cinematic era where the only films that seem to do well (outside animated or live action kids' movies like "Beauty and the Beast" or "Boss Baby") are monster budget comic book films that flood the market and appeal to a massively large audience demographic, or micro budget genre movies like "The Purge" franchise, "Get Out," "Don't Breathe" or "Split," which are made on such a cheap budget that even a ~$100 mil worldwide box office haul is considered successful on a $5-$20 mil budget.

Blumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 29, 2017, 03:18:47 PM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book

$97m is after tax breaks.  The real budget is more like $110m.  Take that number and double it and you have the baseline break even number after advertising, print cost, distribution, and all the back end stuff not involved in movies.  Rough guess that break even point is minimum around $210m.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 29, 2017, 03:23:31 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 02:45:12 PM
Blumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

I used to think that Alien as a TV series wouldn't work, but given that Westworld is essentially a well crafted melding of Weswtorld (the film) and Blade Runner, maybe Alien could work as a TV series - if it was one of those ones that didn't pull it's punches anyway. Blimey if Wolf Creek can get a TV series i'd have thought Alien could.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: T Dog on May 29, 2017, 03:44:32 PM
In fairness, having the most unsubtle trailers which revealed EVERYTHING probably didn't help matters. Nor did the fact that last movie had a very mixed reception.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 03:47:03 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 02:45:12 PM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book

It's weird, man. That does seem like a solid profit, but studios usually need a considerably high margin for their films to be considered a commercial success.

Also, in addition to the $97 mil production cost, the cost of marketing was most likely substantial, so in that regard, I'm not sure the film did much better than break even yet, if that.

We are in a strange cinematic era where the only films that seem to do well (outside animated or live action kids' movies like "Beauty and the Beast" or "Boss Baby") are monster budget comic book films that flood the market and appeal to a massively large audience demographic, or micro budget genre movies like "The Purge" franchise, "Get Out," "Don't Breathe" or "Split," which are made on such a cheap budget that even a ~$100 mil worldwide box office haul is considered successful on a $5-$20 mil budget.

Blumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

First, you are REALLY underestimating how well those movies did.  You said they can make a profit on 100 million WW..   they can, but they make far more than that.

Split = 280 million WW (138 domestic)
Get Out = 240 million WW (astounding 170+ domestic)
Don't Breathe = 157 million WW (90 domestic)

All of those will outpace Covenant's domestic take (where the studio keeps the majority of the money).

Quoteor micro budget genre movies

A majority of those fail (at the box office).  You only remember the ones that succeeded.

QuoteBlumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

Finally, it would make no difference if it isn't a good movie.  An 'indie' movie doesn't make it better by default.  If you threw Covenant on a 10 million dollar budget you would have to have an entirely different vision for the film (and it would be far more restricted).  Good luck seeing Paradise...  they can't afford it.  You can say that it would be a good thing to make it more character driven but that only works if it is well written and being 'indie' (I think you really just mean smaller budget) doesn't guarantee that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 29, 2017, 03:57:39 PM
It won't even reach 80 million. Sad but true.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 29, 2017, 04:03:00 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).

I'm going to assume they had a marketing idea in moving the date forward.  Maybe they figured they could get an extra 10m out of a May release over an October release.  Here is a listing of the top grossing October movies.  Saw III is the highest grossing "R" rated film in the month of October and it is still less than what Covenant made.  Also the second week drop off in October would have been monster.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/weekends/month/?mo=10

Here is August as comparison.  I have zero idea how it would have done that month as it is harder to read.  I'd suspect it would do District 9 kinda money in August. 

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/weekends/month/?mo=08

I'm really really incredibly cynical about online reviews.  A lot of the reviews you read are very middle of the road and very forgiving.  I think a lot of reviewers fall on the side of caution as they want to keep being invited to review viewings and fear giving a totally damning review would hurt the chances of that happening or are just overly excited to be seeing a movie before everyone else.  Their excitement often leads to less objective reviews.  Would the review be vastly different if they saw it on a Monday afternoon the weekend after it opened or would it be the same if you remove the excitement of seeing it first from the entire process?  I personally don't put a lot of faith in online critics anymore unless the review goes into great depth in explaining the pros and cons of the picture.  I will always choose objective over excitement.  Also the cup is half empty and I'm a f**king RIOT at parties.  Seriously I've never brought an entire room down by just being there....


Quote from: Ingwar on May 29, 2017, 03:57:39 PM
It won't even reach 80 million. Sad but true.

70m is going to be an uphill battle.

http://bloody-disgusting.com/movie/3439533/lets-see-alien-covenant-box-office-weekend/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dam on May 29, 2017, 04:13:34 PM
Regarding box office numbers, I would say unless China brings a miracle, im talking Resident Evil: the final chapter miracle numbers, which I think that film done 97 million in one weekend? and you can thank that for the news on a reboot to that franchise, point is , China's audience better want to be interested in this Alien film because the studio gambled on this and Ridley believed in this, and right now at 161 million worldwide, DAM, I don't see another alien film happening ever again, yes it went number one first weekend but it can't keep people interested. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 04:14:47 PM
By saying saw 3 is the highest grossing r rated movie you mean highest grossing released in October?  I don't know if that's true but I do know saw 3 is no where near the highest r rated movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 29, 2017, 04:18:46 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 04:14:47 PM
By saying saw 3 is the highest grossing r rated movie you mean highest grossing released in October?  I don't know if that's true but I do know saw 3 is no where near the highest r rated movie.

Sorry in October.  I'll edit it for clarity.

EDIT:  I'm wrong.  I thought paranormal activity 3 was PG-13 (It was in Canada).  I had zero idea it was R in the USA.  I can only guess it was the 16 uses of the word "f**k" as I don't remember that film being really that violent or gory.  Weird....
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 29, 2017, 04:27:53 PM
Quote from: T Dog on May 29, 2017, 03:44:32 PM
In fairness, having the most unsubtle trailers which revealed EVERYTHING probably didn't help matters. Nor did the fact that last movie had a very mixed reception.

Fox should have learned their lesson from Prometheus re spoiling everything with the trailers - however, unfortunately the Prometheus trailers were hugely successful - nobody viewing them realised the extent of how spoiler heavy they were, so Fox did the same again.

Fortunately for me, once bitten twice shy and I learned my lesson. I didn't view any trailers for Covenant except the prologues. But I'm pretty sure that this time around there was no benefit in the trailers being so spoilery.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 04:50:45 PM
Gash, a lot of content in the ad campaigns aren't in the film (like The Crossing footage or The Last Supper or the Walter commercial).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 29, 2017, 04:56:55 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 04:50:45 PM
Gash, a lot of content in the ad campaigns aren't in the film (like The Crossing footage or The Last Supper or the Walter commercial).

Yes, I saw The Crossing prologue. Saw the Walter commercial after I saw the film. Not watched The Last Supper, wasn't sure if it would be spoilery so I avoided it. Will go watch it now.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Samhain13 on May 29, 2017, 05:16:09 PM


Is it out of the theaters already?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on May 29, 2017, 05:42:57 PM
Coming to a Fox boardroom near you today:

Alien: Box Office Situation (3D)

Run, Hide, Call in sick for the day.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Samhain13 on May 29, 2017, 05:16:09 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0rM4XOMW8I

Is it out of the theaters already?

Not sure what you mean. It had a horrific drop off but it is very clearly still in theatres.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Samhain13 on May 29, 2017, 06:17:08 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Samhain13 on May 29, 2017, 05:16:09 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0rM4XOMW8I

Is it out of the theaters already?

Not sure what you mean. It had a horrific drop off but it is very clearly still in theatres.

I'm asking if is it out of the theaters on where others live. Its out of the theater I saw in my country.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 06:25:07 PM
Quote from: Samhain13 on May 29, 2017, 06:17:08 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Samhain13 on May 29, 2017, 05:16:09 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0rM4XOMW8I

Is it out of the theaters already?

Not sure what you mean. It had a horrific drop off but it is very clearly still in theatres.

I'm asking if is it out of the theaters on where others live. Its out of the theater I saw in my country.

It wouldn't have made 10 million if it was out of theatres.

It actually showed an increase of 11 theatres from last weekend.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 06:27:49 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).

It doesn't matter how you spin it, AC has flopped because it is fundamentally a poor film. A 6/10 film. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 06:33:11 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 06:27:49 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).

It doesn't matter how you spin it, AC has flopped because it is fundamentally a poor film. A 6/10 film.

If it were just down to the quality of a film then films like fast & furious (whatever number it is now) would also flop.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 29, 2017, 06:34:22 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).

It's called counter-programming.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 29, 2017, 06:35:03 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 06:33:11 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 06:27:49 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).

It doesn't matter how you spin it, AC has flopped because it is fundamentally a poor film. A 6/10 film.

If it were just down to the quality of a film then films like fast & furious (whatever number it is now) would also flop.
Yeah, the quality of the film has almost nothing to do with how much money it makes.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 29, 2017, 06:36:05 PM
I'm not even saying that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 29, 2017, 06:39:22 PM
Oh no, I wasn't responding to your comment. Sorry.  :)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 06:43:46 PM
Quote from: Evanus on May 29, 2017, 06:35:03 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 06:33:11 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 06:27:49 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).

It doesn't matter how you spin it, AC has flopped because it is fundamentally a poor film. A 6/10 film.

If it were just down to the quality of a film then films like fast & furious (whatever number it is now) would also flop.
Yeah, the quality of the film has almost nothing to do with how much money it makes.

Are you agreeing with me or being sarcastic?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 29, 2017, 06:48:11 PM
Uhh... I'm agreeing.  ???
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 06:50:22 PM
Quote from: Evanus on May 29, 2017, 06:48:11 PM
Uhh... I'm agreeing.  ???

Ah Sorry, it's hard to tell on here sometimes!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on May 29, 2017, 06:53:33 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 29, 2017, 06:50:22 PM
Quote from: Evanus on May 29, 2017, 06:48:11 PM
Uhh... I'm agreeing.  ???

Ah Sorry, it's hard to tell on here sometimes!
No harm done!  :)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 07:21:52 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 03:47:03 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 02:45:12 PM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book

It's weird, man. That does seem like a solid profit, but studios usually need a considerably high margin for their films to be considered a commercial success.

Also, in addition to the $97 mil production cost, the cost of marketing was most likely substantial, so in that regard, I'm not sure the film did much better than break even yet, if that.

We are in a strange cinematic era where the only films that seem to do well (outside animated or live action kids' movies like "Beauty and the Beast" or "Boss Baby") are monster budget comic book films that flood the market and appeal to a massively large audience demographic, or micro budget genre movies like "The Purge" franchise, "Get Out," "Don't Breathe" or "Split," which are made on such a cheap budget that even a ~$100 mil worldwide box office haul is considered successful on a $5-$20 mil budget.

Blumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

First, you are REALLY underestimating how well those movies did.  You said they can make a profit on 100 million WW..   they can, but they make far more than that.

Split = 280 million WW (138 domestic)
Get Out = 240 million WW (astounding 170+ domestic)
Don't Breathe = 157 million WW (90 domestic)

All of those will outpace Covenant's domestic take (where the studio keeps the majority of the money).

Quoteor micro budget genre movies

A majority of those fail (at the box office).  You only remember the ones that succeeded.

QuoteBlumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

Finally, it would make no difference if it isn't a good movie.  An 'indie' movie doesn't make it better by default.  If you threw Covenant on a 10 million dollar budget you would have to have an entirely different vision for the film (and it would be far more restricted).  Good luck seeing Paradise...  they can't afford it.  You can say that it would be a good thing to make it more character driven but that only works if it is well written and being 'indie' (I think you really just mean smaller budget) doesn't guarantee that.

Lol, I'm sorry dude I was just trying to get the point across that those 3 smaller films were successful. I don't live on or spend the majority of my day on Box Office Mojo so I'm just making a broad statement without the numbers in front of me.

I did not simply mean "smaller budget." Of course it would be restricted and big effects pieces would be out of the question, going to Paradise included, but the whole point would be to, as you said, make it more character driven. That means new script, new concept, the works.

The thing about successful indie films is that they require much more attention to the script, character interactions, etc. because they don't have the big pretty set pieces to fall back on. Therefore much more energy is spent perfecting the actual storytelling. I'm not suggesting they re-stage an indie version of A:C where the Covenant is made out of cardboard.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 29, 2017, 10:13:51 PM


I agree with Grace Randolph.

Sigourney Weaver is Returning.

Maybe Sir Ridley is Directing unless He Retires of this Franchise by his own decision. FOX has too much respect for Sir Ridley Scott.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: John Doe on May 29, 2017, 10:22:29 PM
We don´t need Sigourney, i´m tired o hearing people say Ripley it´s the main star on Alien, for me it´s the Xeno created by H.R Giger.

If the movie has faults, i really don´t think so, are not by not have Sigourney on the movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
LOL at the people taking shots at the Fast & Furious franchise. Yes, some of the movies are terrible, but others are undeniably awesome.

Also, this was the worst Memorial Day weekend at the box office in 18 years. Covenant was set up for success, but general audiences seemingly weren't interested.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 11:33:54 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
LOL at the people taking shots at the Fast & Furious franchise. Yes, some of the movies are terrible, but others are undeniably awesome.

The same could be said of the Alien franchise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 12:06:08 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 11:33:54 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
LOL at the people taking shots at the Fast & Furious franchise. Yes, some of the movies are terrible, but others are undeniably awesome.

The same could be said of the Alien franchise.

I disagree.

ALIEN and ALIENS are masterpieces and 2 of the greatest movies of all time.

The 8 Fast & Furious movies are FAR from masterpieces.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 12:16:22 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 07:21:52 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 03:47:03 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 02:45:12 PM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book

It's weird, man. That does seem like a solid profit, but studios usually need a considerably high margin for their films to be considered a commercial success.

Also, in addition to the $97 mil production cost, the cost of marketing was most likely substantial, so in that regard, I'm not sure the film did much better than break even yet, if that.

We are in a strange cinematic era where the only films that seem to do well (outside animated or live action kids' movies like "Beauty and the Beast" or "Boss Baby") are monster budget comic book films that flood the market and appeal to a massively large audience demographic, or micro budget genre movies like "The Purge" franchise, "Get Out," "Don't Breathe" or "Split," which are made on such a cheap budget that even a ~$100 mil worldwide box office haul is considered successful on a $5-$20 mil budget.

Blumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

First, you are REALLY underestimating how well those movies did.  You said they can make a profit on 100 million WW..   they can, but they make far more than that.

Split = 280 million WW (138 domestic)
Get Out = 240 million WW (astounding 170+ domestic)
Don't Breathe = 157 million WW (90 domestic)

All of those will outpace Covenant's domestic take (where the studio keeps the majority of the money).

Quoteor micro budget genre movies

A majority of those fail (at the box office).  You only remember the ones that succeeded.

QuoteBlumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

Finally, it would make no difference if it isn't a good movie.  An 'indie' movie doesn't make it better by default.  If you threw Covenant on a 10 million dollar budget you would have to have an entirely different vision for the film (and it would be far more restricted).  Good luck seeing Paradise...  they can't afford it.  You can say that it would be a good thing to make it more character driven but that only works if it is well written and being 'indie' (I think you really just mean smaller budget) doesn't guarantee that.

Lol, I'm sorry dude I was just trying to get the point across that those 3 smaller films were successful. I don't live on or spend the majority of my day on Box Office Mojo so I'm just making a broad statement without the numbers in front of me.

I did not simply mean "smaller budget." Of course it would be restricted and big effects pieces would be out of the question, going to Paradise included, but the whole point would be to, as you said, make it more character driven. That means new script, new concept, the works.

The thing about successful indie films is that they require much more attention to the script, character interactions, etc. because they don't have the big pretty set pieces to fall back on. Therefore much more energy is spent perfecting the actual storytelling. I'm not suggesting they re-stage an indie version of A:C where the Covenant is made out of cardboard.

The requirement for any good film is attention to detail and usually believable characters and motivations.

I don't think there is anything in Prometheus and covenant that ever relied on the set pieces to carry it. I think both movies felt they were establishing characters well and that they had interesting interactions.  Essentially you would get the same thing but without the amazing visuals.

I don't think alien lends itself well to a small budget anyway. Some of the best aspects of Prometheus as covenant were in the visuals that would be absent in a 10 million dollar budgeted movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on May 30, 2017, 12:31:56 AM
Quote from: marrerom on May 29, 2017, 03:37:16 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 AM
It was shit. Gore is not a big draw. The script and plot were borderline idiotic. It wasn't failures in marketing, the whole planet has been bombarded with advance hype. Stop trying to offload the blame elsewhere.

The fault lies with the Studio, and possibly the Director.

It was shit? Personal preferences aside the majority of the reviews are positive.

The real problem was the release date. An October or August release date would have been much better as the film would have had no real competition. Instead they bumped up the release date to May...A hard R-rated horror film was never going to do well against two pg-13 family friendly blockbuster franchises (GOTG2 and Pirates 5).
This. August was perfect. It would have probably performed like Prometheus in terms of drops (Prometheus was froantloaded too),but it could have had some legs. Now it doesn't even have the opportunity to keep people interested.. It's a dark,gory R-rated horror movie that is competing with family-friendly movies. GoTG2 is still doing money. Pirates is underperforming but a 70+M opening is not bad.. Next week there's WW too. Tickets are expensive,not many people can afford to pay for two movies,or go to watch movies every week. Even if they're interested,it's more likely that those who have children choose kid-friendly movies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AsapJockey on May 30, 2017, 12:50:43 AM
The word of mouth killed this movie, I personally told all my friends to wait for it on blu ray or rental. so its my fault honestly.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 30, 2017, 12:51:22 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 12:16:22 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 07:21:52 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 03:47:03 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 02:45:12 PM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book

It's weird, man. That does seem like a solid profit, but studios usually need a considerably high margin for their films to be considered a commercial success.

Also, in addition to the $97 mil production cost, the cost of marketing was most likely substantial, so in that regard, I'm not sure the film did much better than break even yet, if that.

We are in a strange cinematic era where the only films that seem to do well (outside animated or live action kids' movies like "Beauty and the Beast" or "Boss Baby") are monster budget comic book films that flood the market and appeal to a massively large audience demographic, or micro budget genre movies like "The Purge" franchise, "Get Out," "Don't Breathe" or "Split," which are made on such a cheap budget that even a ~$100 mil worldwide box office haul is considered successful on a $5-$20 mil budget.

Blumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

First, you are REALLY underestimating how well those movies did.  You said they can make a profit on 100 million WW..   they can, but they make far more than that.

Split = 280 million WW (138 domestic)
Get Out = 240 million WW (astounding 170+ domestic)
Don't Breathe = 157 million WW (90 domestic)

All of those will outpace Covenant's domestic take (where the studio keeps the majority of the money).

Quoteor micro budget genre movies

A majority of those fail (at the box office).  You only remember the ones that succeeded.

QuoteBlumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

Finally, it would make no difference if it isn't a good movie.  An 'indie' movie doesn't make it better by default.  If you threw Covenant on a 10 million dollar budget you would have to have an entirely different vision for the film (and it would be far more restricted).  Good luck seeing Paradise...  they can't afford it.  You can say that it would be a good thing to make it more character driven but that only works if it is well written and being 'indie' (I think you really just mean smaller budget) doesn't guarantee that.

Lol, I'm sorry dude I was just trying to get the point across that those 3 smaller films were successful. I don't live on or spend the majority of my day on Box Office Mojo so I'm just making a broad statement without the numbers in front of me.

I did not simply mean "smaller budget." Of course it would be restricted and big effects pieces would be out of the question, going to Paradise included, but the whole point would be to, as you said, make it more character driven. That means new script, new concept, the works.

The thing about successful indie films is that they require much more attention to the script, character interactions, etc. because they don't have the big pretty set pieces to fall back on. Therefore much more energy is spent perfecting the actual storytelling. I'm not suggesting they re-stage an indie version of A:C where the Covenant is made out of cardboard.

The requirement for any good film is attention to detail and usually believable characters and motivations.

I don't think there is anything in Prometheus and covenant that ever relied on the set pieces to carry it. I think both movies felt they were establishing characters well and that they had interesting interactions.  Essentially you would get the same thing but without the amazing visuals.

I don't think alien lends itself well to a small budget anyway. Some of the best aspects of Prometheus as covenant were in the visuals that would be absent in a 10 million dollar budgeted movie.

I see your point and disagree. Outside of Fassbender's performance in both movies, none of the characters were 3 dimensional. That isn't just me saying this. Plenty of reviews back this up and a lot of people here would likely agree. But to each his own.

Basically all Prometheus had going for it was the visuals. There were character plot holes galore in that film. Hell, they even show actors driving off in a transport in the Fifield scene, only to show them perfectly fine tending to old man Weyland in the next.

About 1/4 of the actors in the film had names outside of "mercenary 1" or "mechanic." How lazy is that to not develop any characterizations when there's only like 17 people in the film?

The same for A:C. Did we learn, beyond what we know from interviews that Rosenthal had a mate in cryo? No. Did we learn who her lover was? Maybe Ankor from the one brief interaction they had. Outside of the brief shot where Lope cradles Hallet's hand in his showing off the matching wedding bands, it wasn't even established that they were married! The only interaction they had besides standing close by to each other was "that's why you should do yoga."

I could go all day but I'm not trying to change anyone's mind.

I thought both movies were visually stunning but lacked in other areas that a smaller budget, smaller cast film would capitalize on.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mr. Forest on May 30, 2017, 12:56:48 AM
Quote from: AsapJockey on May 30, 2017, 12:50:43 AM
The word of mouth killed this movie, I personally told all my friends to wait for it on blu ray or rental. so its my fault honestly.
I told four friends if they were interested to go ahead and see it, but it I still recommended against it in case they were on the fence.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 12:58:49 AM
Say what you will about the fast and furious movies or the transformers movies. Both franchises pump out billion dollar performances. So your points are already moot. If a movie makes a billion dollars then that movie is gonna get a sequel unless it's a biopic (like titanic or Ray)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 01:25:34 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 30, 2017, 12:51:22 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 12:16:22 AM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 07:21:52 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 29, 2017, 03:47:03 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on May 29, 2017, 02:45:12 PM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 29, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
I may sound really stupid in saying this (but I haven't been one to follow box office ratings),  but wasn't the budget for this film $97mil? And from what I have seen it has earnt in the region of $150mil, isn't that a profit? Doesn't seem like a bomb to me... and I quite enjoyed the film. If I don't leave the cinema and ask questions or talk about the film, then it's a failure in my book

It's weird, man. That does seem like a solid profit, but studios usually need a considerably high margin for their films to be considered a commercial success.

Also, in addition to the $97 mil production cost, the cost of marketing was most likely substantial, so in that regard, I'm not sure the film did much better than break even yet, if that.

We are in a strange cinematic era where the only films that seem to do well (outside animated or live action kids' movies like "Beauty and the Beast" or "Boss Baby") are monster budget comic book films that flood the market and appeal to a massively large audience demographic, or micro budget genre movies like "The Purge" franchise, "Get Out," "Don't Breathe" or "Split," which are made on such a cheap budget that even a ~$100 mil worldwide box office haul is considered successful on a $5-$20 mil budget.

Blumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

First, you are REALLY underestimating how well those movies did.  You said they can make a profit on 100 million WW..   they can, but they make far more than that.

Split = 280 million WW (138 domestic)
Get Out = 240 million WW (astounding 170+ domestic)
Don't Breathe = 157 million WW (90 domestic)

All of those will outpace Covenant's domestic take (where the studio keeps the majority of the money).

Quoteor micro budget genre movies

A majority of those fail (at the box office).  You only remember the ones that succeeded.

QuoteBlumhouse is an example of a studio that churns these lower budget films out regularly. It makes me wonder if Alien might do better if it were made as more of an independent movie.

Finally, it would make no difference if it isn't a good movie.  An 'indie' movie doesn't make it better by default.  If you threw Covenant on a 10 million dollar budget you would have to have an entirely different vision for the film (and it would be far more restricted).  Good luck seeing Paradise...  they can't afford it.  You can say that it would be a good thing to make it more character driven but that only works if it is well written and being 'indie' (I think you really just mean smaller budget) doesn't guarantee that.

Lol, I'm sorry dude I was just trying to get the point across that those 3 smaller films were successful. I don't live on or spend the majority of my day on Box Office Mojo so I'm just making a broad statement without the numbers in front of me.

I did not simply mean "smaller budget." Of course it would be restricted and big effects pieces would be out of the question, going to Paradise included, but the whole point would be to, as you said, make it more character driven. That means new script, new concept, the works.

The thing about successful indie films is that they require much more attention to the script, character interactions, etc. because they don't have the big pretty set pieces to fall back on. Therefore much more energy is spent perfecting the actual storytelling. I'm not suggesting they re-stage an indie version of A:C where the Covenant is made out of cardboard.

The requirement for any good film is attention to detail and usually believable characters and motivations.

I don't think there is anything in Prometheus and covenant that ever relied on the set pieces to carry it. I think both movies felt they were establishing characters well and that they had interesting interactions.  Essentially you would get the same thing but without the amazing visuals.

I don't think alien lends itself well to a small budget anyway. Some of the best aspects of Prometheus as covenant were in the visuals that would be absent in a 10 million dollar budgeted movie.

I see your point and disagree. Outside of Fassbender's performance in both movies, none of the characters were 3 dimensional. That isn't just me saying this. Plenty of reviews back this up and a lot of people here would likely agree. But to each his own.

Basically all Prometheus had going for it was the visuals. There were character plot holes galore in that film. Hell, they even show actors driving off in a transport in the Fifield scene, only to show them perfectly fine tending to old man Weyland in the next.

About 1/4 of the actors in the film had names outside of "mercenary 1" or "mechanic." How lazy is that to not develop any characterizations when there's only like 17 people in the film?

The same for A:C. Did we learn, beyond what we know from interviews that Rosenthal had a mate in cryo? No. Did we learn who her lover was? Maybe Ankor from the one brief interaction they had. Outside of the brief shot where Lope cradles Hallet's hand in his showing off the matching wedding bands, it wasn't even established that they were married! The only interaction they had besides standing close by to each other was "that's why you should do yoga."

I could go all day but I'm not trying to change anyone's mind.

I thought both movies were visually stunning but lacked in other areas that a smaller budget, smaller cast film would capitalize on.

It all comes down to a quality script. They felt they had it. You can disagree but nothing would have changed with the characters. In the end Ridley doesn't work with those small budgets anyway so it's moot.

I don't think the series would be inherently helped in anyway by a reduced budget. Yeah it could be good but it could just as equally suck. The budget isn't the problem in the resulting quality of movie and I think you would sacrifice a lot as a result.

Sure make it for 10 million and you'll make money but nothing at all inherently means it will be any better.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.  With all that said I don't think it' doing that bad.   "Prometheus" and "Covenant" = 560+ Million Globally is not bad so Ridley shouldn't feel he failed bringing the franchise back.  I think "Awakening" should come quicker and not be a 5 year wait again.   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 30, 2017, 01:53:52 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.
The general public liked Prometheus.  It ranked higher for home video sales than theatrical, which means interest went up over time.  It's still a discussed movie.  Prometheus was significantly more successful financially and got slightly better scores from critics and audiences.  You can't blame Prometheus for Covenant.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 02:04:49 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 30, 2017, 01:53:52 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.
The general public liked Prometheus.  It ranked higher for home video sales than theatrical, which means interest went up over time.  It's still a discussed movie.  Prometheus was significantly more successful financially and got slightly better scores from critics and audiences.  You can't blame Prometheus for Covenant.

I don't know if I was blaming it as much as I saying it was slightly polarizing.   I think their critical scores are about even (Prometheus critics 72/audience 68, Covenant critics 71/ audience 61 RT).  There were audiences asking about the more Alien though and Ridley even admitted that.  "Covenant" numbers are definitely a lot of factors technically it's the 2nd film of the Prequel Trilogy even though it's the 8th Alien appearance on the big screen and 6th film.  A majority o the time Sequels do drop from their predessors in the box office but notice with "Guardians of the Galaxy", Part 2 increased over the first film and it's not getting better reviews than the original.  I think Time played a role, 5 years was probably too long.  Also I agree with people that maybe August would be a better release date.  "Covenant" is the 3rd May release (Alien, Alien 3).  Hopefully "Awakening" can come out sooner. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 30, 2017, 02:05:32 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.  With all that said I don't think it' doing that bad.   "Prometheus" and "Covenant" = 560+ Million Globally is not bad so Ridley shouldn't feel he failed bringing the franchise back.  I think "Awakening" should come quicker and not be a 5 year wait again.

You have to lump Covenant in with the vastly superior Prometheus in order to reconcile Covenant's failure. Come on man. And people complained about the lack of aliens in Prometheus, but weren't sure about ALIEN: Covenant? Come ooooooon.

And don't be so confident about Awakening coming out sooner rather than later, if at all.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on May 30, 2017, 02:15:02 AM
Fox is clearly waiting on the Chinese box office returns before publicly announcing a decision on the sequel, which makes all the adamant assertions from many of you here that "hurr the franchise is dead kthxbye' that much more eye-rolling and pathetic.  If something as bad as Resident Evil: The Final Chapter made $160 million in China, then Covenant has a solid chance of making $100 million there at the very least.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dookie on May 30, 2017, 02:31:24 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.  With all that said I don't think it' doing that bad.   "Prometheus" and "Covenant" = 560+ Million Globally is not bad so Ridley shouldn't feel he failed bringing the franchise back.  I think "Awakening" should come quicker and not be a 5 year wait again.

I came from that "general audience." The only Alien film that interests me is original. The rest all trash, especially the pathetic Alien vs Predator iterations.

Prometheus brought me back to the alien franchise. Finally, Ridley returns and delivers something new, refreshing, and thought-provoking. But then everything went awry with A:C. The reason A:C fell on its face is because they completely discarded and butchered the only compelling aspects they had cultivated in Prometheus. The third act of A:C was one of the worst movie segments I've ever seen, and I hope Ridley and Fox realize nobody wants to see mind-numbing, stalk-and-kill sci-fi movies anymore.

This movie needed less xenomorph, not more.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 02:37:00 AM
Quote from: Alionic on May 30, 2017, 02:15:02 AM
Fox is clearly waiting on the Chinese box office returns before publicly announcing a decision on the sequel, which makes all the adamant assertions from many of you here that "hurr the franchise is dead kthxbye' that much more eye-rolling and pathetic.  If something as bad as Resident Evil: The Final Chapter made $160 million in China, then Covenant has a solid chance of making $100 million there at the very least.

I hope you are right.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 02:39:02 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.  With all that said I don't think it' doing that bad.   "Prometheus" and "Covenant" = 560+ Million Globally is not bad so Ridley shouldn't feel he failed bringing the franchise back.  I think "Awakening" should come quicker and not be a 5 year wait again.

That still isn't break even point.  They have to make at least another 50m between Japan and China to even begin to break even.

Quote from: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 12:06:08 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 11:33:54 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
LOL at the people taking shots at the Fast & Furious franchise. Yes, some of the movies are terrible, but others are undeniably awesome.

The same could be said of the Alien franchise.

I disagree.

ALIEN and ALIENS are masterpieces and 2 of the greatest movies of all time.

The 8 Fast & Furious movies are FAR from masterpieces.

I hate everyone of those movies with a burning passion, but a few of them have higher critic scores on Rotten Tomato's than Prometheus and Covenant. 

Also of interest is Covenant has slipped below Prometheus's RT score.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 02:42:04 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 02:39:02 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.  With all that said I don't think it' doing that bad.   "Prometheus" and "Covenant" = 560+ Million Globally is not bad so Ridley shouldn't feel he failed bringing the franchise back.  I think "Awakening" should come quicker and not be a 5 year wait again.

That still isn't break even point.  They have to make at least another 50m between Japan and China to even begin to break even.

Quote from: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 12:06:08 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 11:33:54 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
LOL at the people taking shots at the Fast & Furious franchise. Yes, some of the movies are terrible, but others are undeniably awesome.

The same could be said of the Alien franchise.

I disagree.

ALIEN and ALIENS are masterpieces and 2 of the greatest movies of all time.

The 8 Fast & Furious movies are FAR from masterpieces.

I hate everyone of those movies with a burning passion, but a few of them have higher critic scores on Rotten Tomato's than Prometheus and Covenant. 

Also of interest is Covenant has slipped below Prometheus's RT score.

Like I said before: you are taking RT too seriously. RT is nothing.

Remember All Critics Killed BLADE RUNNER in 1982. All Critics NEVER worked in a film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 02:52:14 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 02:42:04 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 02:39:02 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.  With all that said I don't think it' doing that bad.   "Prometheus" and "Covenant" = 560+ Million Globally is not bad so Ridley shouldn't feel he failed bringing the franchise back.  I think "Awakening" should come quicker and not be a 5 year wait again.

That still isn't break even point.  They have to make at least another 50m between Japan and China to even begin to break even.

Quote from: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 12:06:08 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 11:33:54 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
LOL at the people taking shots at the Fast & Furious franchise. Yes, some of the movies are terrible, but others are undeniably awesome.

The same could be said of the Alien franchise.

I disagree.

ALIEN and ALIENS are masterpieces and 2 of the greatest movies of all time.

The 8 Fast & Furious movies are FAR from masterpieces.

I hate everyone of those movies with a burning passion, but a few of them have higher critic scores on Rotten Tomato's than Prometheus and Covenant. 

Also of interest is Covenant has slipped below Prometheus's RT score.

Like I said before: you are taking RT too seriously. RT is nothing.

Remember All Critics Killed BLADE RUNNER in 1982. All Critics NEVER worked in a film.

That actually isn't true.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065466/?ref_=nm_flmg_wr_8

That is because the original version of Blade Runner is actually kinda the shits,  It's filled with interesting ideas but is killed by the forced narrative choices.  The directors cut and final cut though are great.  Yes I am old enough to see every version in order of release, which is watching a movie get better and better as time goes on.  I'll never be a fan of the 1982 version. 

People view RT as gospel in some circles.  I was just pointing out critic reviews.  I personally hate RT and most modern critics as most come off as people who more get off seeing movies before everyone else.  They are the review equal of people who post "FIRST" on youtube videos or make "reacts" videos.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 03:01:24 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 02:52:14 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 02:42:04 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 02:39:02 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:50:42 AM
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $59,972,181      37.3%
+ Foreign:    $101,009,281      62.7%
= Worldwide:    $160,981,462   


Globally will save this movie overall.  I think this proves how polarizing "Prometheus" really was.   I'm sorry but you can't make an Alien movie without the Alien and this is coming from someone that liked the film.   If the Deacon had a bigger role, maybe people wouldn't be so on the fence with "Covenant".   I think us diehards forget general/causal audiences really complained about the lack of "Alien" in the last film.   Now they may be on the fence for this one.  With all that said I don't think it' doing that bad.   "Prometheus" and "Covenant" = 560+ Million Globally is not bad so Ridley shouldn't feel he failed bringing the franchise back.  I think "Awakening" should come quicker and not be a 5 year wait again.

That still isn't break even point.  They have to make at least another 50m between Japan and China to even begin to break even.

Quote from: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 12:06:08 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on May 29, 2017, 11:33:54 PM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on May 29, 2017, 10:32:57 PM
LOL at the people taking shots at the Fast & Furious franchise. Yes, some of the movies are terrible, but others are undeniably awesome.

The same could be said of the Alien franchise.

I disagree.

ALIEN and ALIENS are masterpieces and 2 of the greatest movies of all time.

The 8 Fast & Furious movies are FAR from masterpieces.

I hate everyone of those movies with a burning passion, but a few of them have higher critic scores on Rotten Tomato's than Prometheus and Covenant. 

Also of interest is Covenant has slipped below Prometheus's RT score.

Like I said before: you are taking RT too seriously. RT is nothing.

Remember All Critics Killed BLADE RUNNER in 1982. All Critics NEVER worked in a film.

That actually isn't true.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065466/?ref_=nm_flmg_wr_8

That is because the original version of Blade Runner is actually kinda the shits,  It's filled with interesting ideas but is killed by the forced narrative choices.  The directors cut and final cut though are great.  Yes I am old enough to see every version in order of release, which is watching a movie get better and better as time goes on.  I'll never be a fan of the 1982 version. 

People view RT as gospel in some circles.  I was just pointing out critic reviews.  I personally hate RT and most modern critics as most come off as people who more get off seeing movies before everyone else.  They are the review equal of people who post "FIRST" on youtube videos or make "reacts" videos.

OK.

Usually I disagree with RT. I don't care about RT. All Marvel Disney movies have HIGH notes in RT. All Marvel Disney movies are MEDIOCRE TO ME.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 03:32:29 AM
I with you guys, I'm from the Pre-RT era so I don't view it as the gospel, I only brought up the scores to show that "Prometheus" wasn't universally loved and that could be a carry over to "Covenant".   In no way was I blaming it, just analyzing that maybe some people were on the fence after it.  Yes "Covenant" still has to stand on it's own as a film and clearly there are flaws but you can't deny Predecessors effects on Box office.  Perfect example is "Episode I: Phantom Menace" which was a prequel too.   

It broke so many records and didn't get horrible reviews at the time of it's release yet by the time "Episode II: Attack of the Clones" came it, it dropped in Box office from "Menace" because it was a polarizing film.   I honestly feel like Ridley can't win at this point.  They complained about the lack of Alien and then on "Covenant" he tries to bring that back and he still criticized. George Lucas also was criticized heavily for trying to tell Vader's full story.  Ridley only tried to tell the origin story for the Engineers but people criticized him.   Peter Jackson was also criticized for "Hobbit" prequels and the 2nd "Hobbit" film dropped after the first.   I think it's very difficult to do prequel series and satisfy everyone.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 30, 2017, 03:35:27 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 02:37:00 AM
Quote from: Alionic on May 30, 2017, 02:15:02 AM
Fox is clearly waiting on the Chinese box office returns before publicly announcing a decision on the sequel, which makes all the adamant assertions from many of you here that "hurr the franchise is dead kthxbye' that much more eye-rolling and pathetic.  If something as bad as Resident Evil: The Final Chapter made $160 million in China, then Covenant has a solid chance of making $100 million there at the very least.

I hope you are right.

Only if Covenant have 3D and a lot of actions.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 03:48:24 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 03:32:29 AM
I with you guys, I'm from the Pre-RT era so I don't view it as the gospel, I only brought up the scores to show that "Prometheus" wasn't universally loved and that could be a carry over to "Covenant".   In no way was I blaming it, just analyzing that maybe some people were on the fence after it.  Yes "Covenant" still has to stand on it's own as a film and clearly there are flaws but you can't deny Predecessors effects on Box office.  Perfect example is "Episode I: Phantom Menace" which was a prequel too.   

It broke so many records and didn't get horrible reviews at the time of it's release yet by the time "Episode II: Attack of the Clones" came it, it dropped in Box office from "Menace" because it was a polarizing film.   I honestly feel like Ridley can't win at this point.  They complained about the lack of Alien and then on "Covenant" he tries to bring that back and he still criticized. George Lucas also was criticized heavily for trying to tell Vader's full story.  Ridley only tried to tell the origin story for the Engineers but people criticized him.   Peter Jackson was also criticized for "Hobbit" prequels and the 2nd "Hobbit" film dropped after the first.   I think it's very difficult to do prequel series and satisfy everyone.

The only people that complained about the lack of the alien were people on the internet and forums like these.  The general population didn't give a f**k if it was in it.  They were there to see Prometheus.  Scott switched gears and attempted to appeal to a niche audience and got burned for it.  He listened to the vocal minority of the internet.

Prometheus's issue was never the lack of xenomorph to the majority of the view audience.  It was the lack of consistent editing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on May 30, 2017, 04:02:39 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 03:48:24 AM

Prometheus's issue was never the lack of xenomorph to the majority of the view audience.  It was the lack of consistent editing.

^this!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dookie on May 30, 2017, 04:08:22 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 03:48:24 AM

The only people that complained about the lack of the alien were people on the internet and forums like these.  The general population didn't give a f**k if it was in it.  They were there to see Prometheus.  Scott switched gears and attempted to appeal to a niche audience and got burned for it.  He listened to the vocal minority of the internet.

Prometheus's issue was never the lack of xenomorph to the majority of the view audience.  It was the lack of consistent editing.

Nailed it, my friend. Absolutely nailed it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AlienFanIL17 on May 30, 2017, 05:08:39 AM
I'm still hopeful that Covenant will get a sequel.  It will most likely be the last one, and the one that ties into the original Alien.  A lot of people have made a lot of good points on this site since the movie came out.  The powers that be just have to find that sweet spot between Prometheus and the Xeno. 

Prometheus came out and a lot of people were disappointed that the Xeno was nowhere to be found.  Then the pendulum was moved across the spectrum to the point of Covenant being basically a full blown Alien movie.  They need to find that sweet spot, in my opinion, of balancing the philosophical aspects of Prometheus and the Xeno of Alien.

I think the prequels tied their hands behind their back because of the nature of the Xeno.  It bleeds acid.  So you can't shoot it or blow it up if it's on your ship.  So the only option is the airlock like in Alien and Aliens, which has obviously already been done. 

The future of this series will be in whatever will hopefully be in Alien 5, and I'm not talking about the cancelled Alien 3.5.  I'm also not talking about Ripley necessarily.  If they have a great story to finish her out, then great.  I don't believe the Engineers are done after Covenant.  They can re-appear in an Alien 5 on other worlds.  There can be different, exotic, and more deadlier versions of the Xeno.  They need to do an Alien 5 in order to move away from the traditional Xeno that we have seen so far.  Allowing the beast to change will allow the freedom to start giving us things we've never seen.  That way you don't know what's going to happen already.  Gives us a Xeno that can be shot or blown up on a ship because it wouldn't destroy the ship with the acid blood.  To counter that perceived weakness, give it a higher intelligence so the hunt would have more tension.  The scene that pops into my head is from Aliens when Hudson says, "How could they cut the power."  I think that's why I liked the Neomorph in Covenant, and would have loved to see more of it.  That little bastard was fast, lol.

I think if Alien is to survive as a franchise, and I agree with what some have said, it can't be a traditional space horror with stupid characters just there to be lambs to the slaughter.  Alien 5 and beyond needs to keep the philosophical creation elements, I feel.  It doesn't need to be front and center, but those elements will keep the audience engaged and thinking. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 06:20:24 AM
The bell curve tells us that half the planet is at or below average intelligence. Additionally 40% of the worlds population is below the age of 16.

That's the Fast and Furious Target Audience.

The old adage that nobody went broke underestimating the stupidity of the average cinemagoer holds true. There's big money in flashing lights and loud noises

The R rating requires that AC delivers on more than an adolescent level. Additionally, and because it is a sequel/prequel, it inherently has a  pedigree to live up to. It fails in that regard, and as such, has been panned by those critics that are either invested or not in the pocket of Fox.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SPECIAL FORCES on May 30, 2017, 07:18:30 AM
The major reason it does not do well is that they released it the after GOTG2 and before Pirates of the Caribbean. Also the trailers were not as good as the film deserved. I hope they make at least one more.I want to see the next film end before Alien starts.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 08:20:11 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 03:48:24 AM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 03:32:29 AM
I with you guys, I'm from the Pre-RT era so I don't view it as the gospel, I only brought up the scores to show that "Prometheus" wasn't universally loved and that could be a carry over to "Covenant".   In no way was I blaming it, just analyzing that maybe some people were on the fence after it.  Yes "Covenant" still has to stand on it's own as a film and clearly there are flaws but you can't deny Predecessors effects on Box office.  Perfect example is "Episode I: Phantom Menace" which was a prequel too.   

It broke so many records and didn't get horrible reviews at the time of it's release yet by the time "Episode II: Attack of the Clones" came it, it dropped in Box office from "Menace" because it was a polarizing film.   I honestly feel like Ridley can't win at this point.  They complained about the lack of Alien and then on "Covenant" he tries to bring that back and he still criticized. George Lucas also was criticized heavily for trying to tell Vader's full story.  Ridley only tried to tell the origin story for the Engineers but people criticized him.   Peter Jackson was also criticized for "Hobbit" prequels and the 2nd "Hobbit" film dropped after the first.   I think it's very difficult to do prequel series and satisfy everyone.

The only people that complained about the lack of the alien were people on the internet and forums like these.  The general population didn't give a f**k if it was in it.  They were there to see Prometheus.  Scott switched gears and attempted to appeal to a niche audience and got burned for it.  He listened to the vocal minority of the internet.

Prometheus's issue was never the lack of xenomorph to the majority of the view audience.  It was the lack of consistent editing.

I don't think the general public ever had a desire to see a sequel to Prometheus to be honest.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: palerider on May 30, 2017, 09:13:02 AM
Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 03:48:24 AM


The only people that complained about the lack of the alien were people on the internet and forums like these.  The general population didn't give a f**k if it was in it.  They were there to see Prometheus.  Scott switched gears and attempted to appeal to a niche audience and got burned for it.  He listened to the vocal minority of the internet.

Prometheus's issue was never the lack of xenomorph to the majority of the view audience.  It was the lack of consistent editing.

I completly agree with you.

With this pace of the box office records  I don't think Fox will give a goahead for a prerequel or a sequel
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Le Celticant on May 30, 2017, 09:17:33 AM
Quote from: SPECIAL FORCES on May 30, 2017, 07:18:30 AM
The major reason it does not do well is that they released it the after GOTG2 and before Pirates of the Caribbean. Also the trailers were not as good as the film deserved. I hope they make at least one more.I want to see the next film end before Alien starts.

To be honest it doesn't do good because it ain't that good.
It had the same symptom I hear of people liking prometheus.

Internet's/Magazine's critics are a minority among population thought on the film.
I don't know if you've "probed" your friends, their friends, you brother/sister friend's but the general reaction is "I don't remember it" or "I didn"t care" or "no interest" with or without Alien (and I'm speaking of people who have absolutely no knowledge of Alien and don't even remember the original films).
Once in a while you encounter someone who has Alien licence knowledge and he's like super indulgent and actually liked the film or just... hated it. And a lot of the problem I see with critic is that "Ridley is back to genre" presuming already that the critic has first hand knowledge that he did the original and probably liked it so have an opinion about it.

Both film have their problem which are quite different. Prometheus suffers the same thing Phantom Menace suffer: A messy editing that tries to tell 20 things in a gap of 4 minutes (Shaw C-sec, Fifield, Weyland revelation and Engineer meeting / Gungan Fight, Space Fight, Jedi Fight, Queen fight all unfolding more or less on their own making you go through a rainbow of emotion in 20 seconds).
Covenant really point to another problem (than the script) that Ridley had for years now in his most recent films, his characters are 1D flat line. The Alien prequel stuff would have been so much better centers on David's side from start to finish than following unknown random lead that seems to have less and less character and ultimately get killed by the antagonist that is the only interesting film of the film.

Also, this kind of "In the middle movie" that is a sequel to a film and a prequel to an unreleased film tend to scares people away. It's not marketed this way but people will talk about it. And if you watch it and have never watch prometheus nor Alien you gonna wonder "what da hell did I just watched?" whereas you could watch ALIENS without having seen ALIEN and it was perfectly comprehensible. Part of that is why ALIEN³ failed at the box office IMO but it still managed like ALIEN and ALIENS to actually have an ending and not a "to be continued".
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Cornbreadguy on May 30, 2017, 09:21:01 AM
Only 1, 2, and 3 are the real Alien movies for me. Alien 4 redeemed after seeing Alien Covenant. If anything for the better characterization, mercenaries and risks it took making that silly hybrid creature.

Alien Covenant, while better than the god awful Prometheus movie, screwed up everything in my opinion. Pretty much everything AngryJoe talked about in his spoilers video is spot on.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on May 30, 2017, 09:39:48 AM
I ask myself the question: Would this movie be better if it had nothing to do with Prometheus. No David, no engineers. Simply a fleshed out story about a crew of the Covenant landing on a planet, finding shit and it all goes to hell. (basically what the Alien franchise is all about...) Leaving enough room for the story to breathe and not waste time with the elements of Prometheus.

Either way... both sides seem to be fcked now. We didn't get Prometheus 2 and we didn't get an Alien movie that's worthy of the name.

Shame..
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 09:50:38 AM
I personally would rather see the return of Ripley for one last go and just have Fox greenlight Blomkamp's "ALIEN V" story/pitch. I'd almost guarantee you it would smoke Alien: Covenant at the box office. Ridley has lost his way and is now acting like a spoiled child who is taking his ball and not only going home with it, he's filling it with holes. He's the one who stopped Neil's movie, he pretty much admitted it. Meanwhile, he's destroying what little is left of his ALIEN legacy on the big screen with sequels that are poorly written, explained and simply don't fit into the ALIEN verse imho. Don't know about anyone else but ALIEN and ALIENS are still the only two xeno films I personally view as canon. Prometheus and A:C are as bad as Alien 3 and Resurrection; ie: two sequels that weren't needed when it seemed like fans were hyped for Neil's film. Ridley used that hype for his own gain and screwed Blomkamp up the bum. If there *are* anymore ALIEN movies, the only one I will see is the one directed by Neil Blomkamp closing out the Ripley storyline proper. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on May 30, 2017, 09:52:22 AM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 09:50:38 AM
I personally would rather see the return of Ripley for one last go and just have Fox greenlight Blomkamp's "ALIEN V" story/pitch. I'd almost guarantee you it would smoke Alien: Covenant at the box office. Ridley has lost his way and is now acting like a spoiled child who is taking his ball and not only going home with it, he's filling it with holes. He's the one who stopped Neil's movie, he pretty much admitted it. Meanwhile, he's destroying what little is left of his ALIEN legacy on the big screen with sequels that are poorly written, explained and simply don't fit into the ALIEN verse imho. Don't know about anyone else but ALIEN and ALIENS are still the only two xeno films I personally view as canon. Prometheus and A:C are as bad as Alien 3 and Resurrection; ie: two sequels that weren't needed when it seemed like fans were hyped for Neil's film. Ridley used that hype for his own gain and screwed Blomkamp up the bum. If there *are* anymore ALIEN movies, the only one I will see is the one directed by Neil Blomkamp closing out the Ripley storyline proper. 

rather have no more Alien tbh. Blomkamps ALIEN V sounds like AVPR all over again. Total fanservice, no thank you.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 30, 2017, 10:04:25 AM
Even Aliens Blomkamps happen story would not be like his pitch idea (ignore Alien 3,4)

Fox will force him to change Movie set after alien 4 (or between 3,4) and probably no weaver (unless she want play Ribley 8 again.)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: acidreign on May 30, 2017, 10:05:36 AM
Let's face it: the Alien franchise, despite its relative prestige among genre movie fans, is a niche legacy series that is long past its sell-by date, commercially speaking.

The first two Alien films may have been blockbusters in their time but the moviegoing landscape was also completely different then. Now superhero films, (X-men/Marvel/DC), Disney, Fast & the Furious and Star Wars are the only big-budget ($100 million-plus range) franchises guaranteed to make any money. Everything else is a gamble at best. Movies in general are struggling to compete with a myriad of home viewing options such as prestige cable shows, streaming, and video games.

Covenant already had a lot going against it: as a sequel to Prometheus, it inherited baggage from a movie that was extremely divisive and controversial among fans and audiences. Also being an R-rated science fiction  film, Covenant's potential audience is limited to start with. [Deadpool and Logan may have done well with R-ratings but they are part of the commercially established superhero genre.] And Covenant itself is a weird, idiosyncratic film with a lot of contradictory elements bound to alienate just as many fans and general audience members as its predecessor. Personally I liked the film a lot, but it's not exactly a movie that satisfies the demands of a mainstream audience.

You gotta give Fox credit for trying at least. They marketed the hell out of the movie. Probably to a fault.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on May 30, 2017, 10:13:08 AM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 09:50:38 AM
I personally would rather see the return of Ripley for one last go and just have Fox greenlight Blomkamp's "ALIEN V" story/pitch. I'd almost guarantee you it would smoke Alien: Covenant at the box office. Ridley has lost his way and is now acting like a spoiled child who is taking his ball and not only going home with it, he's filling it with holes. He's the one who stopped Neil's movie, he pretty much admitted it. Meanwhile, he's destroying what little is left of his ALIEN legacy on the big screen with sequels that are poorly written, explained and simply don't fit into the ALIEN verse imho. Don't know about anyone else but ALIEN and ALIENS are still the only two xeno films I personally view as canon. Prometheus and A:C are as bad as Alien 3 and Resurrection; ie: two sequels that weren't needed when it seemed like fans were hyped for Neil's film. Ridley used that hype for his own gain and screwed Blomkamp up the bum. If there *are* anymore ALIEN movies, the only one I will see is the one directed by Neil Blomkamp closing out the Ripley storyline proper. 

Ripley's story was already 'closed out proper' at the end of 'ALIEN 3'.    Deal with it, already.

'ALIEN 3', 'PROMETHEUS' and 'ALIEN: Covenant' are all good movies.  You might like to deal with that, too.

While you're at it, you might like to face the fact that Blomkamp's proposal is history.  In all honesty, it should never have gotten any publicity at all.  It's done no one any good - especially the minute Weaver was publicly associated with it.  There's nothing more pitiful than fan boys being 'cock teased' by a 70 year old woman

The proposal is gone, thrown under the bus, tossed into the furnace and cooked with an apple in it's mouth.  It's history. 

Embrace the New Canon, I say.  ...or forever live in 1986 with false hopes and broken dreams of whoring out the old woman just one more time...

-Windebieste.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 10:13:41 AM
Quote from: acidreign on May 30, 2017, 10:05:36 AM
Let's face it: the Alien franchise, despite its relative prestige among genre movie fans, is a niche legacy series that is long past its sell-by date, commercially speaking.

The first two Alien films may have been blockbusters in their time but the moviegoing landscape was also completely different then. Now superhero films, (X-men/Marvel/DC), Disney, Fast & the Furious and Star Wars are the only big-budget ($100 million-plus range) franchises guaranteed to make any money. Everything else is a gamble at best. Movies in general are struggling to compete with a myriad of home viewing options such as prestige cable shows, streaming, and video games.

Covenant already had a lot going against it: as a sequel to Prometheus, it inherited baggage from a movie that was extremely divisive and controversial among fans and audiences. Also being an R-rated science fiction  film, Covenant's potential audience is limited to start with. [Deadpool and Logan may have done well with R-ratings but they are part of the commercially established superhero genre.] And Covenant itself is a weird, idiosyncratic film with a lot of contradictory elements bound to alienate just as many fans and general audience members as its predecessor. Personally I liked the film a lot, but it's not exactly a movie that satisfies the demands of a mainstream audience.

You gotta give Fox credit for trying at least. They marketed the hell out of the movie. Probably to a fault.

Agree with you on all those points.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: YutaniDitch on May 30, 2017, 10:19:12 AM
http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/custom-comparisons/Alien-Covenant/Prometheus

The comparison graph above clearly shows COVENANT's utter BO failure and AC will have a very hard time covering its production budget (minus the marketing, 'reels', theaters cut, and other costs) domestically... And it looks more and more like the lesser budget will also make less dividends, which kinda conflicts with the whole idea of maximizing revenue while minimizing costs...


Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 09:50:38 AM
I personally would rather see the return of Ripley for one last go and just have Fox greenlight Blomkamp's "ALIEN V" story/pitch. I'd almost guarantee you it would smoke Alien: Covenant at the box office. Ridley has lost his way and is now acting like a spoiled child who is taking his ball and not only going home with it, he's filling it with holes. He's the one who stopped Neil's movie, he pretty much admitted it. Meanwhile, he's destroying what little is left of his ALIEN legacy on the big screen with sequels that are poorly written, explained and simply don't fit into the ALIEN verse imho. Don't know about anyone else but ALIEN and ALIENS are still the only two xeno films I personally view as canon. Prometheus and A:C are as bad as Alien 3 and Resurrection; ie: two sequels that weren't needed when it seemed like fans were hyped for Neil's film. Ridley used that hype for his own gain and screwed Blomkamp up the bum. If there *are* anymore ALIEN movies, the only one I will see is the one directed by Neil Blomkamp closing out the Ripley storyline proper.

Blomkamp's movie could still happen, especially after the BO debacle COVENANT is proving to be... I would not dismiss that movie just yet... On the other hand, I do not like Blomkamp's retcon... The real Ripley is dead, and not only you  would have to retcon everything after ALIENS, you would have to explain why... Multiple timelines, dimensions, whatever... And it would have to be one hell of a movie to make at least me forget about ALIEN3... RESURRECTION, not so much...😁👍🏻
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: OmegaZilla on May 30, 2017, 10:30:22 AM
Look on my box office, ye execs, and despair
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: zoidy on May 30, 2017, 11:12:06 AM
My amusement levels are off the scale  ;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Xenomorphine on May 30, 2017, 11:18:10 AM
Quote from: windebieste on May 30, 2017, 10:13:08 AM
While you're at it, you might like to face the fact that Blomkamp's proposal is history.

Its status is whatever Fox wants it to be. They're free to dismiss or resurrect it, as they see fit.

QuoteThere's nothing more pitiful than fan boys being 'cock teased' by a 70 year old woman

I find this analogy a tad distasteful...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Rankles75 on May 30, 2017, 11:29:50 AM
Quote from: windebieste on May 30, 2017, 10:13:08 AM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 09:50:38 AM
I personally would rather see the return of Ripley for one last go and just have Fox greenlight Blomkamp's "ALIEN V" story/pitch. I'd almost guarantee you it would smoke Alien: Covenant at the box office. Ridley has lost his way and is now acting like a spoiled child who is taking his ball and not only going home with it, he's filling it with holes. He's the one who stopped Neil's movie, he pretty much admitted it. Meanwhile, he's destroying what little is left of his ALIEN legacy on the big screen with sequels that are poorly written, explained and simply don't fit into the ALIEN verse imho. Don't know about anyone else but ALIEN and ALIENS are still the only two xeno films I personally view as canon. Prometheus and A:C are as bad as Alien 3 and Resurrection; ie: two sequels that weren't needed when it seemed like fans were hyped for Neil's film. Ridley used that hype for his own gain and screwed Blomkamp up the bum. If there *are* anymore ALIEN movies, the only one I will see is the one directed by Neil Blomkamp closing out the Ripley storyline proper. 

Ripley's story was already 'closed out proper' at the end of 'ALIEN 3'.    Deal with it, already.

'ALIEN 3', 'PROMETHEUS' and 'ALIEN: Covenant' are all good movies.  You might like to deal with that, too.

While you're at it, you might like to face the fact that Blomkamp's proposal is history.  In all honesty, it should never have gotten any publicity at all.  It's done no one any good - especially the minute Weaver was publicly associated with it.  There's nothing more pitiful than fan boys being 'cock teased' by a 70 year old woman

The proposal is gone, thrown under the bus, tossed into the furnace and cooked with an apple in it's mouth.  It's history. 

Embrace the New Canon, I say.  ...or forever live in 1986 with false hopes and broken dreams of whoring out the old woman just one more time...

-Windebieste.

Your antagonistic dick act is growing old. If people don't want to accept a train wreck of a movie, and instead hold out hope for one that they feel does justice to the series, they have every right to do so. If you think Alien 3 and Prometheus are good movies, that's your right too (although that is an opinion, not a "fact" that we have to "deal with").

It's a shame that Covenant is struggling at the box office, as I think it's a much better film than Prometheus, but it's not really surprising. Bringing it out between Guardians and Pirates wasn't ideal timing, and I think Ridley overrated how much interest there would be in prequels to the Alien series, that answered questions few were really asking. If Blomkamp's film did come out, I'm convinced it would fare a lot better than Covenant has.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 11:35:56 AM
Yeah, I really think that a movie about a senior citizen Ripley and Michael Biehn being kept in suspended animation for 30 years and having nightmares about Alien 3 and Resurrection will do gangbuster business.

I can't wait for marines with newer versions of pulse rifles fighting the queen. Or for Ripley to wear the alien camouflage suit inspired by a Kenner action figure. Yes, that's what this franchise was missing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on May 30, 2017, 11:43:40 AM
I really don't care what you think of me. 

1986 is history and so is Blomkamp's proposal.  Blomkamp's movie isn't going to happen - the real 'train wreck' has been averted.  Thank God for that.  it's not coming out.

'ALIEN: Covenant' is a great addition to the series.  It will find its footing - it will take time but it will happen. 

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 11:45:40 AM
Quote from: Rankles75 on May 30, 2017, 11:29:50 AM
Quote from: windebieste on May 30, 2017, 10:13:08 AM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 09:50:38 AM
I personally would rather see the return of Ripley for one last go and just have Fox greenlight Blomkamp's "ALIEN V" story/pitch. I'd almost guarantee you it would smoke Alien: Covenant at the box office. Ridley has lost his way and is now acting like a spoiled child who is taking his ball and not only going home with it, he's filling it with holes. He's the one who stopped Neil's movie, he pretty much admitted it. Meanwhile, he's destroying what little is left of his ALIEN legacy on the big screen with sequels that are poorly written, explained and simply don't fit into the ALIEN verse imho. Don't know about anyone else but ALIEN and ALIENS are still the only two xeno films I personally view as canon. Prometheus and A:C are as bad as Alien 3 and Resurrection; ie: two sequels that weren't needed when it seemed like fans were hyped for Neil's film. Ridley used that hype for his own gain and screwed Blomkamp up the bum. If there *are* anymore ALIEN movies, the only one I will see is the one directed by Neil Blomkamp closing out the Ripley storyline proper. 

Ripley's story was already 'closed out proper' at the end of 'ALIEN 3'.    Deal with it, already.

'ALIEN 3', 'PROMETHEUS' and 'ALIEN: Covenant' are all good movies.  You might like to deal with that, too.

While you're at it, you might like to face the fact that Blomkamp's proposal is history.  In all honesty, it should never have gotten any publicity at all.  It's done no one any good - especially the minute Weaver was publicly associated with it.  There's nothing more pitiful than fan boys being 'cock teased' by a 70 year old woman

The proposal is gone, thrown under the bus, tossed into the furnace and cooked with an apple in it's mouth.  It's history. 

Embrace the New Canon, I say.  ...or forever live in 1986 with false hopes and broken dreams of whoring out the old woman just one more time...

-Windebieste.

Your antagonistic dick act is growing old. If people don't want to accept a train wreck of a movie, and instead hold out hope for one that they feel does justice to the series, they have every right to do so. If you think Alien 3 and Prometheus are good movies, that's your right too (although that is an opinion, not a "fact" that we have to "deal with").

It's a shame that Covenant is struggling at the box office, as I think it's a much better film than Prometheus, but it's not really surprising. Bringing it out between Guardians and Pirates wasn't ideal timing, and I think Ridley overrated how much interest there would be in prequels to the Alien series, that answered questions few were really asking. If Blomkamp's film did come out, I'm convinced it would fare a lot better than Covenant has.

I'm not so sure, Blomkamp's 'vision' was truly dreadful. The very last thing I would want to see is an Aliens clone, particularly one that brings characters back from the dead and ignores Alien 3, one of the best in the series.


Quote from: windebieste on May 30, 2017, 11:43:40 AM
I really don't care what you think of me. 

1986 is history and so is Blomkamp's proposal.  Blomkamp's movie isn't going to happen - the real 'train wreck' has been averted.  Thank God for that.  it's not coming out.

'ALIEN: Covenant' is a great addition to the series.  It will find its footing - it will take time but it will happen. 

-Windebieste.

I believe it will too, its just ahead of its time. Blomkamp's film would have been a complete disaster, it was just moronic fan service to those who still cry about Hicks and Newt.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Naf Neila on May 30, 2017, 11:55:39 AM
@windebieste

The only pitiful thing here is your choice of words that insults fans of Ellen Ripley and the first two movies
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on May 30, 2017, 11:59:41 AM
Can we take it down a notch please, fellas. We're all fans here. No need to be disrespectful to each other.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Saggit on May 30, 2017, 12:05:10 PM
I liked this movie, as an sci-fi film. But as an Alien movie it's average. They should take it away from Scott before he screws lore even more. He had his masterpiece in 1979 and I will be forever greatful to him for that movie. But as of Prometheus he got carried away and it didn't do anything good for the franchise. He is like mythical (I'm sure he would love that comparison) Cronos - eating his own child (namely Alien). He made the most mysterious and fascinating monster ever into an experiment outcome of an android. And all this deacon, protomorph, neomorph, trilobite, black goo bullshit...ehhhh...On the other hand he actually came on top with this movie after a mess that he have done in Prometheus. Still it is a cool movie. Nothing more.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FiorinaFury161 on May 30, 2017, 12:10:47 PM
When I viewed it on opening weekend, there were a grand total of ten people in the theater. Kinda nice, actually.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Rankles75 on May 30, 2017, 12:12:02 PM
Quote from: FiorinaFury161 on May 30, 2017, 12:10:47 PM
When I viewed it on opening weekend, there were a grand total of ten people in the theater. Kinda nice, actually.

I went to see it at my local cinema about 5 days after it's release, and there were about 5-6 people there...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: MrRipley on May 30, 2017, 12:39:42 PM
Ridley Scott should have kept his mouth shut,now all we have is potential,see how it does b4 you say there are 3 or 4 more films b4 the 79 Alien,now we'll just be left with this and a messed up timeline for the 2 stone cold classics,this film if it gets no follow up and prometheus just mudded the legacy.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 12:41:24 PM
I didn't mean to set off a firestorm of negativity with my post re: bringing up Blomkamp's ALIEN V. We are all fans here and like different aspects of the franchise. I despise 3 and Resurrection while there are those who love 3 and 2 people out there who like Resurrection.  :P

You have to admit that 20th Century Fox got a whirlwind of MASSIVE POSITIVE PUBLICITY when Neil released his proposed ALIEN V concept story images and they used that along with Ridley Scott to miscalculate(IMHO) fans wanted to see another ALIEN movie without Weaver. 

So Fox and Scott hurried things up with a Prometheus sequel when it was looking like it wasn't going to happen.

So Ridley should be thanking Neil for Alien: Covenant because it got people talking about ALIEN again. Fox greenlit A:C based on Neil's popular/positive ALIEN V concept story with Weaver, Biehn, possibly Henrikson and an older Newt actress. Nobody will convince me otherwise. For all intents and purposes, "Prometheus 2" was dead until Neil Blomkamp "resurrected" the "ALIEN" talk. Quite funny really. Cheers!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 12:43:18 PM
By the way, that's what Lance Henriksen looks like now.


(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ec/Lance_Henriksen_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg/220px-Lance_Henriksen_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on May 30, 2017, 12:44:28 PM
Quote from: Rankles75 on May 30, 2017, 12:12:02 PM
Quote from: FiorinaFury161 on May 30, 2017, 12:10:47 PM
When I viewed it on opening weekend, there were a grand total of ten people in the theater. Kinda nice, actually.

I went to see it at my local cinema about 5 days after it's release, and there were about 5-6 people there...

On the first time viewing (May 15 in PHL) on IMAX (although not in 3D) and last full show, there were 15 people inside including my family.

The second viewing on a regular cinema (May 22), there were about 20-25 people inside.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FiorinaFury161 on May 30, 2017, 12:50:09 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 12:43:18 PM
By the way, that's what Lance Henriksen looks like now.


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ec/Lance_Henriksen_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg/220px-Lance_Henriksen_by_Gage_Skidmore.jpg
Thats not Lance, he's just another droid sent sent by the f**kin company!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 30, 2017, 12:53:11 PM
Quote from: Omegamorph on May 30, 2017, 10:30:22 AM
Look on my box office, ye execs, and despair

😂 😂 😂
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 12:54:01 PM
Lance addressed this at the 30th Anniversary ALIENS panel last year. It seemed like he was pitching to get into Blomkamp's movie(which at the time was causing massive positive publicity for Fox and the Alien franchise) by saying his appearance wouldn't need changing because Bishop was designed to grow old with his crew-Ripley, Hicks, etc to make them feel more comfortable and "not out of place". I thought it was a great idea.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 01:02:23 PM
So, you are already jumping through a series of hoops to justify the narrative:

- Alien 3 and Resurrection were dreams, that's why Ripley, Hicks and Newt are still around.
- Bishop was designed to grow old, that's why he looks like he's 80.
- The derelict was not destroyed in the nuclear blast, that's why we have more aliens running around.

It's fan fiction.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kronnang_Dunn on May 30, 2017, 01:06:19 PM
"Alien: Covenant" has not been released in China (June 16) and Japan (September 15), two very important foreign film markets. So, is actually kind of premature to call it a "flop"...  ::)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 01:08:01 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 12:54:01 PM
Lance addressed this at the 30th Anniversary ALIENS panel last year. It seemed like he was pitching to get into Blomkamp's movie(which at the time was causing massive positive publicity for Fox and the Alien franchise) by saying his appearance wouldn't need changing because Bishop was designed to grow old with his crew-Ripley, Hicks, etc to make them feel more comfortable and "not out of place". I thought it was a great idea.

The last thing I would want is to watch old versions of these characters. Watching Harrison Ford play an old Indy or Han Solo just makes me feel sad and want to watch the old movies to see him in his prime.

Positive publicity or not the actual realities of the film would have not been desirable at all.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SyntaX on May 30, 2017, 01:14:20 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 01:08:01 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 12:54:01 PM
Lance addressed this at the 30th Anniversary ALIENS panel last year. It seemed like he was pitching to get into Blomkamp's movie(which at the time was causing massive positive publicity for Fox and the Alien franchise) by saying his appearance wouldn't need changing because Bishop was designed to grow old with his crew-Ripley, Hicks, etc to make them feel more comfortable and "not out of place". I thought it was a great idea.

The last thing I would want is to watch old versions of these characters. Watching Harrison Ford play an old Indy or Han Solo just makes me feel sad and want to watch the old movies to see him in his prime.

Positive publicity or not the actual realities of the film would have not been desirable at all.

What kind of comment is this?  ::)
Actors grow old. Ageing is a natural proces.
Having the actors reprise their roles makes it connect with the previous movies and makes it easier to connect to the audience again. Most of the people that go see a movie (sequel) knows who the character is. Making it much easier for the director.

The fact that people are still talking about Blomkamp's Alien 5 is a good thing and I'd love to see it happen one day. He'll, Ridley Scott could make his sequel to Covenant and Blomkamp should be allowed to finish it all up.



Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 01:15:08 PM
Quote from: Kronnang_Dunn on May 30, 2017, 01:06:19 PM
"Alien: Covenant" has not been released in China (June 16) and Japan (September 15), two very important foreign film markets. So, is actually kind of premature to call it a "flop"...  ::)

I think Covenant has firmly established itself as a box office flop.

The markets you listed aren't going to have huge influences overall.  It will be moderate at best.  I think it will under perform Prometheus so it will probably be under 21 in Japan, meaning the studio gets 8.  Who knows about China but I'm not predicting a franchise saving performance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 01:20:49 PM
Quote from: SyntaX on May 30, 2017, 01:14:20 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 01:08:01 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 12:54:01 PM
Lance addressed this at the 30th Anniversary ALIENS panel last year. It seemed like he was pitching to get into Blomkamp's movie(which at the time was causing massive positive publicity for Fox and the Alien franchise) by saying his appearance wouldn't need changing because Bishop was designed to grow old with his crew-Ripley, Hicks, etc to make them feel more comfortable and "not out of place". I thought it was a great idea.

The last thing I would want is to watch old versions of these characters. Watching Harrison Ford play an old Indy or Han Solo just makes me feel sad and want to watch the old movies to see him in his prime.

Positive publicity or not the actual realities of the film would have not been desirable at all.

What kind of comment is this?  ::)
Actors grow old. Ageing is a natural proces.
Having the actors reprise their roles makes it connect with the previous movies and makes it easier to connect to the audience again. Most of the people that go see a movie (sequel) knows who the character is. Making it much easier for the director.

The fact that people are still talking about Blomkamp's Alien 5 is a good thing and I'd love to see it happen one day. He'll, Ridley Scott could make his sequel to Covenant and Blomkamp should be allowed to finish it all up.

Its a perfectly valid comment. Yes actors grow old and I enjoy watching them in roles that suit them at that age. What I don't like watching is old actors trying to recapture former glories by returning to previous roles. It doesn't work. Particularly when said characters are already dead!

I would quite happily see an Alien 5 if it had completely new characters, a completely new story and a completely different director.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 30, 2017, 01:23:33 PM
Quote from: Kronnang_Dunn on May 30, 2017, 01:06:19 PM
"Alien: Covenant" has not been released in China (June 16) and Japan (September 15), two very important foreign film markets. So, is actually kind of premature to call it a "flop"...  ::)

Yes, but they get less money per ticket sold in China and its also going up against a 3D Transformers (3D being very popular in China, as is Transformers from what I have read).

I was optimistic, and now I don't even see this movie making anywhere near the money spent on production, distribution, marketing, etc. Maybe the digital and bluray sales can make up for it, but I highly doubt there being much interest in that outside of dedicated fans of the franchise. Pretty sure we are done with the prequel series and we will probably get a reboot with a VERY limited budget in a decade or two.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Blomkamp's Alien is pretty much Terminator Genisys all over again. A sequel featuring aging stars, retconning and disregarding older entries in the series, trying to directly attach itself to "the last good one".

A disaster waiting to happen. It didn't work for the Terminator, it didn't work for Superman, it won't work for Alien(s).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 30, 2017, 01:29:07 PM
Quote from: SyntaX on May 30, 2017, 01:14:20 PM


What kind of comment is this?  ::)


Accurate?


Quote from: SyntaX on May 30, 2017, 01:14:20 PM

Actors grow old. Ageing is a natural process.


Of course. But you've only got to look at Blomkamp's concept art to see he hasn't moved these familiar characters on. They are simply playing elderly versions of their 1986 selves - pulse rifles and all. Arguably even Waterston's a little old to be dangling off a rope at 37 but Weaver still playing the Rambo version of Ripley pushing 70 - nah.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: palerider on May 30, 2017, 01:32:34 PM
Quote from: cucuchu on May 30, 2017, 01:23:33 PM
Quote from: Kronnang_Dunn on May 30, 2017, 01:06:19 PM
"Alien: Covenant" has not been released in China (June 16) and Japan (September 15), two very important foreign film markets. So, is actually kind of premature to call it a "flop"...  ::)

Yes, but they get less money per ticket sold in China and its also going up against a 3D Transformers (3D being very popular in China, as is Transformers from what I have read).

I was optimistic, and now I don't even see this movie making anywhere near the money spent on production, distribution, marketing, etc. Maybe the digital and bluray sales can make up for it, but I highly doubt there being much interest in that outside of dedicated fans of the franchise. Pretty sure we are done with the prequel series and we will probably get a reboot with a VERY limited budget in a decade or two.


....and lets not forget, China is the capital of piracy, The dvd's are out by now. I can see the pirate version on many web sites. It is destined to be a "flop".
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 30, 2017, 01:35:01 PM
Agreed, but I will say that it could still be done. Sigourney Weaver is pretty fit and active lately, far more than most people her age, so its not entirely out of the question.

I will say that if they don't do it soon, and I mean VERY soon, it will never happen. Its not just her but Hicks and Bishop (if he was to be included), all actors aging. Two or three more years down the line, it probably has no chance of working vs the slight chance of it working IF they do it right. Big IF.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:49:32 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Blomkamp's Alien is pretty much Terminator Genisys all over again. A sequel featuring aging stars, retconning and disregarding older entries in the series, trying to directly attach itself to "the last good one".

A disaster waiting to happen. It didn't work for the Terminator, it didn't work for Superman, it won't work for Alien(s).

Even though I did like some of the concept art, I agree with this.   After some time thinking about it, "Alien V" could end up like you said "Terminator V" did.   "Genisys' was a mess and completely messed with T1 and T2 Timelines unnecessarily.   This idea that we need to erase "Alien 3" doesn't work for me now that I've really think about it.   "Resurrection" takes place so far into the future I don't worry about it as far as the Alien-Aliens-Alien3 timeline and Ripley's complete story.  I know Ripley is the biggest draw to the franchise but I don't see "Alien V" working out like "Jurassic World" or "The Force Awakens" as far as Nostalgia really boosting those films.   

I see it working like you said more like "Genisys".  Plus Blomkamp is coming off some flops and underperformers.   I think they need to continue to go in a different direction.  I love Sigonery for life but it just to hard to bring the character back based on what happen in "Alien 3".   Now do we need some different directors?  Sure, after Ridley finishes the prequel films, you could bring in some fresh eyes to the franchise.  But it has to be a new timeline with new characters.  The point is "Alien" is going on 40 years old, the franchise is Legendary and it's not going to end.   But they have to figure out something for the future of the franchise because "Alien V" as a "Aliens" sequel probably is off the table now. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on May 30, 2017, 02:04:46 PM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 01:49:32 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Blomkamp's Alien is pretty much Terminator Genisys all over again. A sequel featuring aging stars, retconning and disregarding older entries in the series, trying to directly attach itself to "the last good one".

A disaster waiting to happen. It didn't work for the Terminator, it didn't work for Superman, it won't work for Alien(s).

Even though I did like some of the concept art, I agree with this.   After some time thinking about it, "Alien V" could end up like you said "Terminator V" did.   "Genisys' was a mess and completely messed with T1 and T2 Timelines unnecessarily.   This idea that we need to erase "Alien 3" doesn't work for me now that I've really think about it.   "Resurrection" takes place so far into the future I don't worry about it as far as the Alien-Aliens-Alien3 timeline and Ripley's complete story.  I know Ripley is the biggest draw to the franchise but I don't see "Alien V" working out like "Jurassic World" or "The Force Awakens" as far as Nostalgia really boosting those films.   

I see it working like you said more like "Genisys".  Plus Blomkamp is coming off some flops and underperformers.   I think they need to continue to go in a different direction.  I love Sigonery for life but it just to hard to bring the character back based on what happen in "Alien 3".   Now do we need some different directors?  Sure, after Ridley finishes the prequel films, you could bring in some fresh eyes to the franchise.  But it has to be a new timeline with new characters.  The point is "Alien" is going on 40 years old, the franchise is Legendary and it's not going to end.   But they have to figure out something for the future of the franchise because "Alien V" as a "Aliens" sequel probably is off the table now.

I'm fairly confident the Alien cinematic films are finished for the time being. Its my favorite fictional universe, and yes it is legendary to those of us here, but to the vast majority its extremely insignificant and people that I talk to seem to view in the same light as Halloween and Friday the 13th. The perception of the franchise, along with it being long in tooth, coupled with the general audience just not caring about creature horror anymore (its a horse that has been beat the death and overcooked entirely) is what will make bringing the franchise back to its former glory impossible. I think Covenant will be Fox's coming to terms with the fact that the Alien franchise is not going to be profitable in the medium of films. Comics? Yes. Video games? Somewhat. That is it though.

The best we can hope for is something most of us don't want which is an overhaul/reboot of the series. Take it in a more giger, almost cthun-type direction where you depict the true isolation of space with something horrifying in a unique way that keeps people mentally engaged as well. There is potential with Giger's designs, but I think being tethered to the franchise in its current form will never allow that potential to be realized.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on May 30, 2017, 02:07:30 PM
i love alien 3. .especially the assembly cut. .i don't like the ending tho. .why thats like ending a franchise prematurely. .weather u like weaver or not. . She kinda was such a pivotal part of the whole franchise. .why kill the character?. .if she does return at the age of 70. .then she can be an advisor of sorts. .hand over the reigns to a younger protagonist. .i think that was the whole idea with blomkamps movie. .but pretending that alien 3 and resurrection never happened. .that would have been tricky. .unless they time travel. .wich is not something i am fond of in movies. . .look what it did to the terminator franchise?!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Game_Over_Man on May 30, 2017, 02:24:42 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 29, 2017, 11:23:19 AM
I disagree. Weaver as Ripley the protaganist against the alien the antagonist was at least 65% what made aliens great. Cameron was the rest.

I'd go further, it's Weaver and the depth she brought to the franchise that made it such a draw. Moreso than the Xeno's - yes, they are perverse and fascinating, but it was Ripley standing up like a charismatic union leader against the greedy corporation that made the story.

Want to bring back the big box office? Give is Weaver up against another pencil dIck corporate guy...that's the magic combo. The political climate is perfect for this, how they haven't embraced it I'll never know.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 02:56:27 PM
Quote from: Game_Over_Man on May 30, 2017, 02:24:42 PM
Quote from: oduodu on May 29, 2017, 11:23:19 AM
I disagree. Weaver as Ripley the protaganist against the alien the antagonist was at least 65% what made aliens great. Cameron was the rest.

I'd go further, it's Weaver and the depth she brought to the franchise that made it such a draw. Moreso than the Xeno's - yes, they are perverse and fascinating, but it was Ripley standing up like a charismatic union leader against the greedy corporation that made the story.

Want to bring back the big box office? Give is Weaver up against another pencil dIck corporate guy...that's the magic combo. The political climate is perfect for this, how they haven't embraced it I'll never know.

I have 100% 0 interest in that ans I would hate to see this movie try to shift its themes to current political satire.  I swear I never want to see Weaver in another Alien movie or have the tired and rehashed evil corporate guy show up again.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Vrastal on May 30, 2017, 02:59:59 PM
Ripley is too over used, between the books and games fox loves to shoehorn her into everything alien.  I like Prometheus and Covenant 

But i still want a movie where its a new cast of characters and new actors.  A new alien gane would be amazing as well.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on May 30, 2017, 03:11:57 PM
They should not have done the prequels, especially given the change in tone (towards myth, etc.). The franchise has essentially been about aliens vs. humans, and should have stayed that way. The writers, etc., kept imagining turning the background story into something like 2001, and it's not working.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: OmegaZilla on May 30, 2017, 03:14:22 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on May 30, 2017, 03:11:57 PM
turning the background story into something like 2001,
I f**kin wish it was like 2001 mate
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on May 30, 2017, 03:18:43 PM
Quote from: Omegamorph on May 30, 2017, 03:14:22 PM
I f**kin wish it was like 2001 mate

A horror-action franchise? Why?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 03:35:56 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on May 30, 2017, 03:11:57 PM
They should not have done the prequels, especially given the change in tone (towards myth, etc.). The franchise has essentially been about aliens vs. humans, and should have stayed that way. The writers, etc., kept imagining turning the background story into something like 2001, and it's not working.

George Lucas changed the game, The Star Wars Prequels despite not being critical darlings were hugely influential on Hollywood.   Now every major Director wants to Prequelized Legendary stories.   Ridley, Peter Jackson.   Even Nolan's Dark Knight Trilogy was really a prequelized storyline as it was Batman as a young man. I think they even did an "Exorcist" Prequel about the preacher.  "Planet of the Apes" is just about to finish a Prequel Trilogy.  I'm not mad at the Alien Prequels because Ridley was correct.  James nor David answered the questions from the original Alien.  "Who's the dead Jockey and where did that ship come from and how did Wayland know about the Alien Specimen".   I just think the idea of doing 4 Prequels films is too much. 

There needs to be one more Prequel film.  Tie up the Trilogy in "Awakening" and connect it to "Alien".  Then we do "Alien V" in a different timeframe introduction a new protagonist to carry on the franchise in the future.   Shaw and Daniels were basically Ripley Proxy's.  Nothing against them because I liked both characters motivations but it was about having Strong Female characters.  Fine, you go into the future, Post-Ripley with a new strong Female Character to make the face of the franchise.   My point is when you get to 40 years, you don't end it.  There are are millions of Aliens fans out there around the world.  I just think they have to figure out a Post-Ripley storyline. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 03:42:36 PM
People keep writing that Weaver is the big box office draw, as if Resurrection never happened. And that was 20 years ago, when she was still young and Aliens was just over a decade old.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: OmegaZilla on May 30, 2017, 04:00:41 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on May 30, 2017, 03:18:43 PM
A horror-action franchise? Why?
in what universe is 2001 horror-action?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 04:01:03 PM
i think word of mouth killed this movie.

I also dont see how this movie got high reviews that it did it's a rushed mess.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Le Celticant on May 30, 2017, 04:03:21 PM
Quote from: Kronnang_Dunn on May 30, 2017, 01:06:19 PM
"Alien: Covenant" has not been released in China (June 16) and Japan (September 15), two very important foreign film markets. So, is actually kind of premature to call it a "flop"...  ::)

International market for a film has usually little impact.
Prices are mostly based on fixed bids, not adjustment where fox earn a $ on every ticket which is why it's very hard to make a lot of money in the international market unless your movie takes off and loads of theater actually buy the film and plans to buy a prolonged time during which it'll stay on screen. But this is very rare and the competition in Asia is even harder since they also have a very strong market now (especially in India and China).

Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 03:35:56 PMGeorge Lucas changed the game, The Star Wars Prequels despite not being critical darlings were hugely influential on Hollywood.   Now every major Director wants to Prequelized Legendary stories.

It's more influential than the idea of studio wanting prequels (which already existed before by the way).
It's the first time a film (series) attempts to have as many VFX shots (around 2000 per films) whereas the average for huge blockbuster at the time was around 200-400 (it multiplied between x5 and x10 times) done in so little time (3 years for the entire post-production) and was hugely influential on pre-visualization technologies, green screen direct feedback, first time digital camera use (well actually second, Vidocq had the first sony watermarked 0001 and shot entirely the film on it while star wars prequels still used 35mm stock).
There's also performance capture. You may not think much of Jar Jar binks but the same company a few years later made Davy Jones which is still top noch when transferring the actor performance to a 3D creature. Nowadays it's almost common to see Smaug, benjamin buttons and such characters brought on screen.

Quote from: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 04:01:03 PM
i think word of mouth killed this movie.

I think exactly the same thing.
Especially when you market this film as an horror film with Alien while it's more of a sort of "intellectual sci fi attempt" very much in the prometheus line. The R-rated is really unnecessary and just for the fan service to have a bit of blood here and there but it never truly manage to create the tension and scare because too much is shown and yet what's actually interesting about the film is kept hidden and has nothing to do with the scare factor.
I already thought that Prometheus should have revolved around David and not Shaw and Covenant just showed me how right I am IMO, the film should be centered around him, not some unknown protagonist and others meat bag which are barely important for the great arch Ridley's attempting to build.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on May 30, 2017, 04:04:30 PM
"They should not have done the prequels, especially given the change in tone (towards myth, etc.). The franchise has essentially been about aliens vs. humans, and should have stayed that way. The writers, etc., kept imagining turning the background story into something like 2001, and it's not working."

I couldn't have said it better. I preferred the questions in Alien to remain a mystery, it made everything much more creepy. Answers are good, and sometimes necessary, but the questions posed in Prometheus were just kind of boring. The novel for covenant was a fun enough read, but it definitely made up my mind to wait for home-vid release of the movie. I do believe there are some franchises where following the original formula is the best way to go. I personally love the Alien franchise for it's simplicity, aliens hunting people on a spaceship or abandoned outpost. You know you're going to have some good monster action and it's just a fun ol' time. Not every series has to be some deep philosophical Christopher Nolan fest.

I'll just say that the covenant novel actually did make Prometheus seem better. And I'm afraid as long as they're doing prequels here, there's going to be a lot of that. The next film will make the previous one look better, but that just means a steady decline in quality. If covenant doesn't put the franchise in hypersleep for another 20 years, Fox seriously needs to consider taking the franchise back to its roots. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I watched the avp movies and resurrection again 3 days ago, and at least they gave me what I was looking for, predators and aliens. I actually found them quite fun. Wow, never thought I'd say that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 04:05:54 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on May 30, 2017, 03:18:43 PM
Quote from: Omegamorph on May 30, 2017, 03:14:22 PM
I f**kin wish it was like 2001 mate

A horror-action franchise? Why?

because a horror franchise that goes in a 2001 direction actually seems kinda unique and interesting.  Not all of us like the action part of alien.  Alien is more horror suspense and way less action.  Everything is based on tension not dudes with guns.



Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: marrerom on May 30, 2017, 04:08:47 PM
Changing the release date f


They never should have changed the release date from August to May. Making this film compete with the likes of Guardians 2 and Pirates 5 was a colossal error...Any info out there as to why the studio felt the need to move up the release date?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: john wick on May 30, 2017, 04:13:38 PM
My assumption would be fox will halt the already in development sequel at least move back the planned shooting date.

They will wait to see how alien covenant does on blu ray to gather how much interest is left.

The final decision probably be made after the predator released next year. I think both franchises are cooked. The predator is going to underperform domestically. August release date this isn't another summer comic book movie that the whole family can enjoy. These franchises have both been tainted by two avp movies, and mediocre sequels.

Prometheus was poor and alien covenant was abit above average 6/10 range.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: KingXD on May 30, 2017, 04:22:06 PM
Maybe should have kept the original release date of August. Dunno why Fox decided to move it to May so it can compete against heavy hitters like Pirates 5 and Guardians Vol 2.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on May 30, 2017, 04:30:38 PM
Perhaps what the franchise needed after the deep thinking Prometheus was something more akin to Aliens. Maybe if Fox would've brought Cameron back to do a film like Gibson's Alien 3, they could've marketed it as a summer action blockbuster with horror elements. That would attract the younger crowd, and the fact that it was Cameron (the titanic and Avatar guy) would attract everyone else. At least it would've stood a better chance at making money and keeping the franchise alive.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 30, 2017, 04:08:47 PM
Changing the release date f


They never should have changed the release date from August to May. Making this film compete with the likes of Guardians 2 and Pirates 5 was a colossal error...Any info out there as to why the studio felt the need to move up the release date?

Where I come from we have an expression that seems oddly appropriate. You can polish a turd as much as you like, but it's still a turd.

If the film was any good we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 30, 2017, 04:43:57 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 02:56:27 PM

I have 100% 0 interest in that and I would hate to see this movie try to shift its themes to current political satire.  I swear I never want to see Weaver in another Alien movie or have the tired and rehashed evil corporate guy show up again.

We agree on that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nostromo on May 30, 2017, 04:46:11 PM
You make crap, you get crap.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 30, 2017, 04:50:00 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: marrerom on May 30, 2017, 04:08:47 PM
Changing the release date f


They never should have changed the release date from August to May. Making this film compete with the likes of Guardians 2 and Pirates 5 was a colossal error...Any info out there as to why the studio felt the need to move up the release date?

Where I come from we have an expression that seems oddly appropriate. You can polish a turd as much as you like, but it's still a turd.

If the film was any good we wouldn't be having this conversation.
A lot of people like Covenant, and it got good reviews, generally. But interest is low and they did the wrong things to generate more interest and it backfired. And personally, I have no interest now that they've abandoned Shaw and the Engineers. They might as well just be selling a toy line.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 30, 2017, 04:53:54 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 04:40:37 PM
If the film was any good we wouldn't be having this conversation.

The film is good. Box office suggests apathy on the audience part, mostly in the US. Well that's the audience's loss.

And we'd always be having this conversation, this is a fractured fan-base Alien forum after all.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Skywalker on May 30, 2017, 04:59:00 PM
I believe the movie does not deserve that kind of treatment in ticket sales . I mean not to that extent for sure . But what does it make clear is that people a) do not actually care for the more philosophical approach (something that was partially abandoned with covenant due to the reception prometheus had but apparently its too late for that) b) people need to actually watch the movie before they badmouth it but audiences and internet people are too spoiled nowadays and jump to conclusions before even watching a film . Is this actually a bad film ? Definitely not . Is it great ? Certainly not but I believe its the best film in the alien universe after the first two masterpieces. Clearly the franchise has suffered after the story the dreadfull alien3 has taken and the subsequent films after that . What at first seems like a good idea to go into the unexplored territory of the origins , the philosophical approach did not click with people ( I actually enjoy the flawed prometheus ). What made the first two movies GREAT was a) the scare factor , the tension that builds up to horrifying events , the claustophobic feeling b) the action either being ripley trying to  get to the escape pod of nostromo or the marines blasting aliens . Those two ingridients plus the masterful direction made these two movies great. Those two elements are absent or are not presented with that kind of mindset in prometheus and covenant (although covenant tries to differentiate to a certain extent from the philosophical approsch). I believe either Ridley (with proper story-script material) or James Cameron are the only ones that can salvage thre Alien franchise . Its no wonder that everything went to hell after the first two movies . Same can be said sbout the Terminator franchise...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 05:00:15 PM
This is an online poll among forum members. It appears that those hating it are a vocal minority. Reviews were also mostly positive.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 05:00:30 PM
Well you cant use "But it's well reviewed" as an excuse for why sales dropped dramatically. Pirates 5 is sitting at 31% rotten tomatoes meter...and its opening weekend blows A:C away...A:C wished it had that as an opening weekend in fact.

Some have also suggested that moving the release date up was an odd move, and maybe factored into it. I also disagree. If the movie kicked ass like the others (1 and 2) than it would have done fine.....again it did not. If this movie came out in August in the state it is in today then you would have seen the same numbers...maybe slightly higher by like 5 or 8 million.

The movie is just as irritating as Prometheus was guys....I really did not want it to be that way :(

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 30, 2017, 05:01:37 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 05:00:15 PM
This is an online poll among forum members. It appears that those hating it are a vocal minority. Reviews were also mostly positive.

Don't confuse the matter with facts.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 05:03:31 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 30, 2017, 04:53:54 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 04:40:37 PM
If the film was any good we wouldn't be having this conversation.

The film is good. Box office suggests apathy on the audience part, mostly in the US. Well that's the audience's loss.

And we'd always be having this conversation, this is a fractured fan-base Alien forum after all.

Whilst I respect your opinion, You're wrong.

If you are trying to argue that despite how many umpteen million dollars in PR and advance hype that the reason this film is floundering is because of the timing of the release, well, you're missing the point. The film is incoherent. It brings nothing original to the table, and treats existing fans who actually can remember earlier films with disdain.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 05:04:35 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 05:00:30 PM
Well you cant use "But it's well reviewed" as an excuse for why sales dropped dramatically. Pirates 5 is sitting at 31% rotten tomatoes meter...and its opening weekend blows A:C away...A:C wished it had that as an opening weekend in fact.

Pirates is a PG-13 kids movie, the fifth in a franchise that banks almost a billion dollars every time. Of course its opening weekend blew Covenant away.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 05:07:42 PM
Quote from: Skywalker on May 30, 2017, 04:59:00 PM
I believe the movie does not deserve that kind of treatment in ticket sales . I mean not to that extent for sure . But what does it make clear is that people a) do not actually care for the more philosophical approach (something that was partially abandoned with covenant due to the reception prometheus had but apparently its too late for that) b) people need to actually watch the movie before they badmouth it but audiences and internet people are too spoiled nowadays and jump to conclusions before even watching a film . Is this actually a bad film ? Definitely not . Is it great ? Certainly not but I believe its the best film in the alien universe after the first two masterpieces. Clearly the franchise has suffered after the story the dreadfull alien3 has taken and the subsequent films after that . What at first seems like a good idea to go into the unexplored territory of the origins , the philosophical approach did not click with people ( I actually enjoy the flawed prometheus ). What made the first two movies GREAT was a) the scare factor , the tension that builds up to horrifying events , the claustophobic feeling b) the action either being ripley trying to  get to the escape pod of nostromo or the marines blasting aliens . Those two ingridients plus the masterful direction made these two movies great. Those two elements are absent or are not presented with that kind of mindset in prometheus and covenant (although covenant tries to differentiate to a certain extent from the philosophical approsch). I believe either Ridley (with proper story-script material) or James Cameron are the only ones that can salvage thre Alien franchise . Its no wonder that everything went to hell after the first two movies . Same can be said sbout the Terminator franchise...

The Terminator TV series gets f**king Fantastic later on.  I actually rank the TV series above T2 because of the last 5-6 episodes.  It was a great series that got all of its momentum killed by the writers strike and struggled to find identity during the early part of the second season to take a hiatus and come back as a f**king incredible series.  I really wish the third season got made. 

That said, Covenant was a movie made to appeal to a certain market.  Just they overestimated how big that market is. I wonder if Prometheus 2 would and distancing themselves more and more from the Alien universe might have been a good idea.  Still have the "DNA" of Alien in there but make it more Star Trek doing a horror episode and less Alien in its true form. 

Either way, we are where we are.  The movie isn't doing well, the franchise is up in the air, and the movie is polarizing.   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: marrerom on May 30, 2017, 05:08:03 PM
So here is some information that puts Alien Covenant's poor numbers into context:

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/us-box-office-had-worst-memorial-day-weekend-since/1100-6450403/ (https://www.gamespot.com/articles/us-box-office-had-worst-memorial-day-weekend-since/1100-6450403/)

"total US box office haul for all movies in the Friday-Monday long holiday weekend came out to $172.3 million, the lowest in 18 years, dating back to Memorial Day weekend 1999, when the haul was $142.5 million"

It seems the poor Box Office had more to do with audiences not going to the theaters in general as opposed to anything else. Both Pirates 5 and Baywatch under-performed as well.


*edit*

Also from the article: "Another notable film was Ridley Scott's Alien: Covenant, which made $13.2 million over the long weekend in the US, dropping substantially from its opening-weekend take of $36.2 million. The movie has now made an estimated $161 million worldwide, so it's looking good that the movie, reportedly made on a production budget of $97 million, will be in the black."
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 30, 2017, 05:15:39 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 05:03:31 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 30, 2017, 04:53:54 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 30, 2017, 04:40:37 PM
If the film was any good we wouldn't be having this conversation.

The film is good. Box office suggests apathy on the audience part, mostly in the US. Well that's the audience's loss.

And we'd always be having this conversation, this is a fractured fan-base Alien forum after all.

Whilst I respect your opinion, You're wrong.

If you are trying to argue that despite how many umpteen million dollars in PR and advance hype that the reason this film is floundering is because of the timing of the release, well, you're missing the point. The film is incoherent. It brings nothing original to the table, and treats existing fans who actually can remember earlier films with disdain.

And whilst I respect your opinion I consider you wrong.

I saw ALIEN in the cinema in 1979. I read Giger's Alien, and The Book of Alien around the same time, and Alan Dean Fosters novelisation. It's safe to say I'm a fan with much invested in ALIEN. I found nothing incoherent in Alien Covenant, but I was pleased to see it rekindling elements of the story that were there from the start but have been roundly ignored by 'the franchise.' I think that's the real issue, fans who have adopted Cameron's lore, or maybe Extended Universe lore (?) don't want Ridley harking back to what he took from the first film as he was making it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SpeedyMaxx on May 30, 2017, 05:18:42 PM
You can keep blaming people who dislike this movie on Cameron or Aliens but when we address your points you ignore them and keep pigeonholing us.

I don't give a f**k about the EU and I prefer Alien to the sequels. I think Blomkamp's movie sounded awful. But Ridley f**ked his own golden goose on this one. His retcon deeply compromises the fundamental elements of the franchise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: andyjaxx on May 30, 2017, 05:22:05 PM
this is aimed at a adult audience not for little kids who will put them numbers up at box office, watching the usual marvel crud will always score better
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 05:25:51 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 05:04:35 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 05:00:30 PM
Well you cant use "But it's well reviewed" as an excuse for why sales dropped dramatically. Pirates 5 is sitting at 31% rotten tomatoes meter...and its opening weekend blows A:C away...A:C wished it had that as an opening weekend in fact.

Pirates is a PG-13 kids movie, the fifth in a franchise that banks almost a billion dollars every time. Of course its opening weekend blew Covenant away.



Ah yes your correct I forgot about the PG-13 rating. That actually does make a difference. It will be interesting to see if this Pirates movie makes a billion.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Skywalker on May 30, 2017, 05:30:23 PM
Havent seen the T series so I cant comment on that. But as movies go all terminator movies past T2 are way inferior . I agree with what you said about overestimating their chances with what they set out to do . Taking the story to that territory with that kind of approach. Because whatever you do no matter how differnet Prometheus was at the end of the day its a movie in the alien universe and basically its an alien origins kind of movie.So people will watch the movie and start comparing that with the first movies and that is not in favor of the prequels..Still I believe its an anomaly that the film is performing this bad .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: leeroy! on May 30, 2017, 05:32:20 PM
i am a little bit sad about this, i was a tiny bit disappointed with covenant but i also don't want it to end and fox just reboot it in 5-10 years! unlike most people i dont want an alien movie with tons of aliens and guys blasting them away... i want a bit more! 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 30, 2017, 05:44:42 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on May 30, 2017, 05:04:35 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 30, 2017, 05:00:30 PM
Well you cant use "But it's well reviewed" as an excuse for why sales dropped dramatically. Pirates 5 is sitting at 31% rotten tomatoes meter...and its opening weekend blows A:C away...A:C wished it had that as an opening weekend in fact.

Pirates is a PG-13 kids movie, the fifth in a franchise that banks almost a billion dollars every time. Of course its opening weekend blew Covenant away.

Totally, talk about apples and oranges. My Great Dane eats more than your cat...no sh&t Sherlock

Maybe if (Captain) Jack Sparrow was onboard the Covenant we would be looking at a 70 mill opening
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gertee on May 30, 2017, 05:48:20 PM
I liked Alien Covenant, and from what I've read, most reviews are actually quite positive.

As for the money it's bringing in: this is no longer just about the box office like it was in the 80s or 90s.

It's a chapter in a long running franchise that makes money on an ongoing basis from lisencing deals, dvd (re)releases, etc. And in order to keep people interested in the merchandise, they revisit the series every so often with a new movie.

I'm sure Alien will continue, regardless of Covenant's final BO result.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: N-Shifter on May 30, 2017, 05:53:39 PM
Why are people even entertaining the notion that there won't be another one? "Deserves to bomb" etc. You realize that if it bombs then that's it for a universe you're supposed to be a fan of? It doesn't matter if you love, loathe or feel "meh" about this movie, you should be wishing it well for the sole purpose of having an end to this prequel trilogy, you really want it to end on that cliffhanger?

There WILL be another one.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: ESPILFIRE on May 30, 2017, 05:54:32 PM
I thinkt we will have a sequel with a budget over 80%. Fox don´t want to risk at this...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 30, 2017, 05:58:43 PM
Quote from: N-Shifter on May 30, 2017, 05:53:39 PM
Why are people even entertaining the notion that there won't be another one? "Deserves to bomb" etc. You realize that if it bombs then that's it for a universe you're supposed to be a fan of? It doesn't matter if you love, loathe or feel "meh" about this movie, you should be wishing it well for the sole purpose of having an end to this prequel trilogy, you really want it to end on that cliffhanger?

There WILL be another one.

I'd never wish for an Alien film to bomb; bit like hoping for your football team to lose cause you want the manager out or something. Alien: Covenant wasn't everyone's cup of tea, but boy did they f**king try. It was a lavish attempt at resurrecting the franchise from 20th Century Fox. If Tom Rothman was still at Fox we'd be on AvP4 by now with Uwe Boll's mum directing and your local college doing the practical effects.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anakin21 on May 30, 2017, 06:35:46 PM
Give us Alien 5 with Newt, Hicks and Ripley by Blomkamp or James Cameron!!!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 06:44:01 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on May 30, 2017, 05:58:43 PM
Quote from: N-Shifter on May 30, 2017, 05:53:39 PM
Why are people even entertaining the notion that there won't be another one? "Deserves to bomb" etc. You realize that if it bombs then that's it for a universe you're supposed to be a fan of? It doesn't matter if you love, loathe or feel "meh" about this movie, you should be wishing it well for the sole purpose of having an end to this prequel trilogy, you really want it to end on that cliffhanger?

There WILL be another one.

I'd never wish for an Alien film to bomb; bit like hoping for your football team to lose cause you want the manager out or something. Alien: Covenant wasn't everyone's cup of tea, but boy did they f**king try. It was a lavish attempt at resurrecting the franchise from 20th Century Fox. If Tom Rothman was still at Fox we'd be on AvP4 by now with Uwe Boll's mum directing and your local college doing the practical effects.

Your absolutely right. Some people actually seem to be revelling in its failure for some reason
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: MrRipley on May 30, 2017, 06:44:27 PM
1 more to tie it to the original then leave it alone,we can't keep shelling out on more Box Sets or Quadrilogies anyhow.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 06:46:44 PM
Lol @ people claiming this film is well received. It has fallen under 7 at imdb and i personally know no one who actually enjoyed this fassbender show crap.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 30, 2017, 06:49:14 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 06:46:44 PM
Lol @ people claiming this film is well received. It has fallen under 7 at imdb and i personally know no one who actually enjoyed this fassbender show crap.

Well I thought it was fantastic and the majority on these boards enjoyed it at the very least as the poll proves
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: N-Shifter on May 30, 2017, 06:50:35 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 06:46:44 PM
Lol @ people claiming this film is well received. It has fallen under 7 at imdb and i personally know no one who actually enjoyed this fassbender show crap.

I haven't met anybody that didn't enjoy it, funny how that works right? People only seem to know people that agree with their point of view :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: XenoHunter99 on May 30, 2017, 06:59:10 PM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 03:32:29 AM
I honestly feel like Ridley can't win at this point.  They complained about the lack of Alien and then on "Covenant" he tries to bring that back and he still criticized. George Lucas also was criticized heavily for trying to tell Vader's full story.  Ridley only tried to tell the origin story for the Engineers but people criticized him.
Let's be perfectly clear: Ridley and Lucas have something in common. Their prequel stories are stupid. Ridley's version of the Engineer tale makes no sense. The Engineers left maps for humanity to their top-secret weapons development facility, and the galaxy's dumbest smart people went there for a visit. Almost every decision these people make turns out to be a bad decision, and we get a weird-looking donosaur at the very end to sort of remind us this was an Alien prequel. Everything in Covenant is about androids who look like Fassbender. All other priorities are rescinded. Lucas, meanwhile, made Vader into a whiny, obnoxious brat whose turn to the dark side is flimsy and also makes no sense. Both have piss-poor characterizations of many characters in their movies. Prometheus hasn't aged well, Covenant is not especially loved, and much of the SW prequel trilogy is practically swept under the rug in current SW canon. Both deserve the criticism they've received and continue to receive.

TL;DR: Both the Alien prequels and the SW prequels could have been fixed with better writing!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 30, 2017, 07:08:37 PM
Let's be clear, George Lucas was finished after THX-1138 and this was his only good film in his repertoire while Ridley Scott as flawed, chimeric as he is, is a proper artist bordering on genius.


Quote from: N-Shifter on May 30, 2017, 06:50:35 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 06:46:44 PM
Lol @ people claiming this film is well received. It has fallen under 7 at imdb and i personally know no one who actually enjoyed this fassbender show crap.

I haven't met anybody that didn't enjoy it, funny how that works right? People only seem to know people that agree with their point of view :P

It's called confirmation bias...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on May 30, 2017, 07:17:54 PM
It is quite obvious the Alien series is going in a different direction after Covenant, but still going nevertheless.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 07:25:09 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 30, 2017, 07:08:37 PM
Let's be clear, George Lucas was finished after THX-1138 and this was his only good film in his repertoire while Ridley Scott as flawed, chimeric as he is, is a proper artist bordering on genius.


Its called stating opinion as fact...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 30, 2017, 07:28:39 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 07:25:09 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 30, 2017, 07:08:37 PM
Let's be clear, George Lucas was finished after THX-1138 and this was his only good film in his repertoire while Ridley Scott as flawed, chimeric as he is, is a proper artist bordering on genius.


Its called stating opinion as fact...
It's a silly opinion, too. I like all of Lucas's movies, but they all occupy different positions in the pop art spectrum. If you want to go full arty, yeah, THX is the only one for you. American Graffiti and Star Wars are huge huge huge artistic accomplishments, however pop they may be.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 30, 2017, 07:31:54 PM
Quote from: XenoHunter99 on May 30, 2017, 06:59:10 PM
Quote from: Aquarius8 on May 30, 2017, 03:32:29 AM
I honestly feel like Ridley can't win at this point.  They complained about the lack of Alien and then on "Covenant" he tries to bring that back and he still criticized. George Lucas also was criticized heavily for trying to tell Vader's full story.  Ridley only tried to tell the origin story for the Engineers but people criticized him.
Let's be perfectly clear: Ridley and Lucas have something in common. Their prequel stories are stupid. Ridley's version of the Engineer tale makes no sense. The Engineers left maps for humanity to their top-secret weapons development facility, and the galaxy's dumbest smart people went there for a visit. Almost every decision these people make turns out to be a bad decision, and we get a weird-looking donosaur at the very end to sort of remind us this was an Alien prequel. Everything in Covenant is about androids who look like Fassbender. All other priorities are rescinded. Lucas, meanwhile, made Vader into a whiny, obnoxious brat whose turn to the dark side is flimsy and also makes no sense. Both have piss-poor characterizations of many characters in their movies. Prometheus hasn't aged well, Covenant is not especially loved, and much of the SW prequel trilogy is practically swept under the rug in current SW canon. Both deserve the criticism they've received and continue to receive.

TL;DR: Both the Alien prequels and the SW prequels could have been fixed with better writing!


New Canon Has a lot Prequel Element and Mace Windu Solo comics will release in august after Darth Maul.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on May 30, 2017, 07:34:32 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 30, 2017, 07:28:39 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 07:25:09 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 30, 2017, 07:08:37 PM
Let's be clear, George Lucas was finished after THX-1138 and this was his only good film in his repertoire while Ridley Scott as flawed, chimeric as he is, is a proper artist bordering on genius.


Its called stating opinion as fact...
It's a silly opinion, too. I like all of Lucas's movies, but they all occupy different positions in the pop art spectrum. If you want to go full arty, yeah, THX is the only one for you. American Graffiti and Star Wars are huge huge huge artistic accomplishments, however pop they may be.
In this respect, from going between artsy and accessible to mainstream audiences, I think Stephen Spielberg did a whole lot better job. Of course it is an opinion. It never was anything else.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SpeedyMaxx on May 30, 2017, 07:44:09 PM
Ridley's done many brilliant films but the man who made Hannibal, Exodus, Someone to Watch Over Me and several others is no genius. He's had his fair share of blunders. He is a brilliant visualist and businessman. He is not an artist on par with David Lynch.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on May 30, 2017, 07:49:10 PM
https://twitter.com/BORReport/status/869634468230774784

Covenant did a little better than was initially reported over the 4-day weekend. I guess $80million has to be the target though it's far off.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on May 30, 2017, 07:49:52 PM
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on May 30, 2017, 07:44:09 PM
Ridley's done many brilliant films but the man who made Hannibal, Exodus, Someone to Watch Over Me and several others is no genius. He's had his fair share of blunders. He is a brilliant visualist and businessman. He is not an artist on par with David Lynch.
You picked three Ridley movies I think are pretty decent. I would have gone with Legend, G.I. Jane, and Robin Hood, maybe.

And Lynch may be the top living filmmaker, so unfair comparison? Ridley is one of the few working directors with his own unique style that doesn't owe something to Lynch, so that's something to respect. I would call him a genius. But Lynch is the complete package, and that's rare, like Bergman or Kubrick rare.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on May 30, 2017, 07:56:28 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 12:41:24 PM
So Ridley should be thanking Neil for Alien: Covenant because it got people talking about ALIEN again. Fox greenlit A:C based on Neil's popular/positive ALIEN V concept story with Weaver, Biehn, possibly Henrikson and an older Newt actress. Nobody will convince me otherwise. For all intents and purposes, "Prometheus 2" was dead until Neil Blomkamp "resurrected" the "ALIEN" talk. Quite funny really. Cheers!

Don't know another way of putting it, but all of this is patently false. Prometheus made Fox a boatload of money, and they have publicly announced intentions on pursuing a sequel with Scott shortly after that film's release.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prof. a on May 30, 2017, 08:08:55 PM
Quote from: Alionic on May 30, 2017, 07:56:28 PM
Quote from: LiquidMonster on May 30, 2017, 12:41:24 PM
So Ridley should be thanking Neil for Alien: Covenant because it got people talking about ALIEN again. Fox greenlit A:C based on Neil's popular/positive ALIEN V concept story with Weaver, Biehn, possibly Henrikson and an older Newt actress. Nobody will convince me otherwise. For all intents and purposes, "Prometheus 2" was dead until Neil Blomkamp "resurrected" the "ALIEN" talk. Quite funny really. Cheers!

Don't know another way of putting it, but all of this is patently false. Prometheus made Fox a boatload of money, and they have publicly announced intentions on pursuing a sequel with Scott shortly after that film's release.

Very true. Box Office reports circulating after the dismal financial result of Scott's The Counselor indicated that Prometheus's financial success was the key in greenlighting that movie.

According to some people's calculations (which are totally off-base), Prometheus would've had to generate 3 or 4 times its budget to recoup expenses, somewhere in the range of 360-480 million. This would've meant that Prometheus' 400 million was a failure - however, it was not. 400 million on a 120 million budget is a good financial result.

Same remains true for Covenant - it doesn't need to gross 300 or 400 million to recoup expenses.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 08:34:09 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 30, 2017, 07:34:32 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on May 30, 2017, 07:28:39 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 07:25:09 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on May 30, 2017, 07:08:37 PM
Let's be clear, George Lucas was finished after THX-1138 and this was his only good film in his repertoire while Ridley Scott as flawed, chimeric as he is, is a proper artist bordering on genius.


Its called stating opinion as fact...
It's a silly opinion, too. I like all of Lucas's movies, but they all occupy different positions in the pop art spectrum. If you want to go full arty, yeah, THX is the only one for you. American Graffiti and Star Wars are huge huge huge artistic accomplishments, however pop they may be.
In this respect, from going between artsy and accessible to mainstream audiences, I think Stephen Spielberg did a whole lot better job. Of course it is an opinion. It never was anything else.

I agree.

I think George Lucas is very Overrated. He directed only 6 movies in 45 years. His style was a bad copy of Akira Kurosawa.

Sir Ridley Scott is a Far Better Director than George Lucas.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 30, 2017, 08:37:20 PM
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on May 30, 2017, 07:44:09 PM
Ridley's done many brilliant films but the man who made Hannibal, Exodus, Someone to Watch Over Me and several others is no genius. He's had his fair share of blunders. He is a brilliant visualist and businessman. He is not an artist on par with David Lynch.

Each to their own, I loved Hannibal but walked out of the cinema halfway through Naked Lunch.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 30, 2017, 08:41:42 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 30, 2017, 08:37:20 PM
Quote from: SpeedyMaxx on May 30, 2017, 07:44:09 PM
Ridley's done many brilliant films but the man who made Hannibal, Exodus, Someone to Watch Over Me and several others is no genius. He's had his fair share of blunders. He is a brilliant visualist and businessman. He is not an artist on par with David Lynch.

Each to their own, I loved Hannibal but walked out of the cinema halfway through Naked Lunch.

David Cronenberg directed Naked Lunch. Maybe you meant Inland Empire. I love Lynch but his last movie is utter crap.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BonesawT101 on May 30, 2017, 08:42:14 PM
Hannibal is awesome imo also.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 08:51:26 PM
Sir Ridley Scott and David Lynch were always totally different.

David Lynch was and is a great weirdo like Terrence Malick.

Sir Ridley Scott was and is a great Commercial Director like Steven Spielberg.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on May 30, 2017, 08:53:13 PM
At least Covenant is doing better than Ghost In The Shell (PG-13) which made only 170 million with 110 million budget + marketing. That's a flop!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Xanadu on May 30, 2017, 08:57:00 PM
Whether this movie flops or not, I just want to see this David prequel story to be finished. I don't want it to end on cliffhanger;  abandoned & finished years later in some book.
Hybrid Network video tells that in novelization, David explains that he actually found one of Xenomorph egg which has left behind by Engineers. Which means Engineers still created Xenomorphs & there must be Engineers alive on some other planets who would want revenge against David. Since Covenant showed different race of Engineers , there could be a Space Jockey sized Engineer that ends up in Alien.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 09:23:11 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 30, 2017, 08:53:13 PM
At least Covenant is doing better than Ghost In The Shell (PG-13) which made only 170 million with 110 million budget + marketing. That's a flop!

It doesn't really matter, they are roughly on the same level of flop.  They aren't going to pursue the GitS franchise either.  Covenant is a pretty solid flop just not as bad a flop as other movies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 09:35:32 PM
Covenant is an Alien franchise entry, marketed as the return of the iconic Alien, and it struggles to hit the 300? It doesnt get more flop than that, its worse than GitS actually.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 09:36:37 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 09:23:11 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on May 30, 2017, 08:53:13 PM
At least Covenant is doing better than Ghost In The Shell (PG-13) which made only 170 million with 110 million budget + marketing. That's a flop!

It doesn't really matter, they are roughly on the same level of flop.  They aren't going to pursue the GitS franchise either.  Covenant is a pretty solid flop just not as bad a flop as other movies.

I disagree.

A flop is KING ARTHUR(Guy Ritchie).

Actually, KING ARTHUR(Guy Ritchie) is the biggest failure of 2017.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on May 30, 2017, 09:57:34 PM
It's just a different age. The original film was a slow burning masterpiece. Fast 7, Guardians, Pirates, transformers, etc. it's all about spectacle now. Some people don't want to think, they just want gross sensory overload. Giant robots and explosions fill the seats now. It's the C.O.D. phenomenon. Maybe Shane black is onto something afterall.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AsapJockey on May 30, 2017, 10:03:20 PM
you guys are really wanting for the studios to read this forums lol and not get this damn trilogy done
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: zoidy on May 30, 2017, 10:06:19 PM
Some people are never happy. And many here are most specifically NEVER happy with what Ridley does  ;D

Hilarious!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: teguh hidayat on May 30, 2017, 10:49:10 PM
Huggs

you're right. i agree with you. now its turn for the worst for the Alien franchise.

By the numbers do Fox only care about Alien franchise.

i always think what the future has in-store for us-the real fans of alien and aliens.
maybe this is it  :'( 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Bio Mech Hunter on May 30, 2017, 11:01:06 PM
This is a shame. I really enjoyed Alien Covenant. In fact, I saw it again a couple nights ago. My father is a big Alien fan who'd been wanting to see it, so I took him with me. He really enjoyed it, as well.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on May 30, 2017, 11:12:47 PM
Quote from: Huggs on May 30, 2017, 09:57:34 PM
It's just a different age. The original film was a slow burning masterpiece. Fast 7, Guardians, Pirates, transformers, etc. it's all about spectacle now. Some people don't want to think, they just want gross sensory overload. Giant robots and explosions fill the seats now. It's the C.O.D. phenomenon. Maybe Shane black is onto something afterall.

What Shane Black said?.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kerrod33 on May 31, 2017, 01:04:39 AM
Why is everyone saying this movie flopped when it is still in cinemas, made more money than its budget, still gaining revenue every single day and hasn't even been released everywhere?

You can't talk in past tense when something is still happening
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on May 31, 2017, 01:12:25 AM
Because
of
the
percentage
drops
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on May 31, 2017, 01:35:21 AM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 30, 2017, 09:23:11 PM
It doesn't really matter, they are roughly on the same level of flop.  They aren't going to pursue the GitS franchise either.  Covenant is a pretty solid flop just not as bad a flop as other movies.
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 09:35:32 PM
Covenant is an Alien franchise entry, marketed as the return of the iconic Alien, and it struggles to hit the 300? It doesnt get more flop than that, its worse than GitS actually.

Can you two please stop acting like you know what you're talking about? Covenant has yet to be released in two major markets where sci-fi films do extremely well.

Quote from: AsapJockey on May 30, 2017, 10:03:20 PM
you guys are really wanting for the studios to read this forums lol and not get this damn trilogy done

The amount of ubiquitous negativity on this forum is surreal.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on May 31, 2017, 01:37:22 AM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 31, 2017, 01:04:39 AM
Why is everyone saying this movie flopped when it is still in cinemas, made more money than its budget, still gaining revenue every single day and hasn't even been released everywhere?

You can't talk in past tense when something is still happening

stuidos didn't get all money in the box office.

Quote from: Alionic on May 31, 2017, 01:35:21 AM
Can you two please stop acting like you know what you're talking about? Covenant has yet to be released in two major markets where sci-fi films do extremely well.

I don't know about japan but chiness people love watch (a lot) Action 3D movies

Does Covenant have both ?

3D ? nope just 2D.
Action ? only third act.

and movie release after Wonder Woman,The Mummy (and before Transformers)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kerrod33 on May 31, 2017, 01:39:03 AM
Quote from: gantarat on May 31, 2017, 01:37:22 AM
Quote from: Kerrod33 on May 31, 2017, 01:04:39 AM
Why is everyone saying this movie flopped when it is still in cinemas, made more money than its budget, still gaining revenue every single day and hasn't even been released everywhere?

You can't talk in past tense when something is still happening

stuidos didn't all money in the box office.

Your spelling and grammar is the real flop. I have no idea what you said lol
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mustangjeff on May 31, 2017, 03:48:44 AM
The percentage drops tells me that word of mouth isn't driving people to see it.  The fans went during the first week and aren't recommending the film to anyone else.  If you look at Rotten Tomatoes, the fan ratings is 10% LESS than the critics (71% vs 61%).

Compare that to a film like Guardians Vol 2. The audience rating is 9% higher than the critics.  The new Pirates film is even more lopsided with a critic score of 32% and an audience score of 73%.

My theory is that fans went and saw it once, never recommended it, and never went to see it again.  Obviously some people on this site saw it many times, but we don't represent the average ALIEN fan base.


Also..  I haven't seen a TV ad for covenant since the movie was released.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on May 31, 2017, 07:08:56 AM
Re-release Halloween, possibly 3D. Problem solved.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on May 31, 2017, 11:14:22 AM
Word of mouth, maybe. I think, as someone (I forget who) pointed out earlier, the studio just overestimated the broadness of the target audience.

The Alien series seems to have been relegated to cult classic status. Who knows, maybe this film will pick up steam over time the way Blade Runner did.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 31, 2017, 12:11:25 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths

Well I'm not one of the experts around here but I'm guessing they will say its because $98 of the BO was domestic takings and the studio gets a bigger percentage domestically than foreign BO. I'm just guessing though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 31, 2017, 12:22:56 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 06:46:44 PM
...I personally know no one...

That explains a lot.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:35:41 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths

You can make money off of movies in many ways.  You not understanding why a movie is greenlit doesn't mean the box office analysis was wrong.  A movie can be greenlit for many different reasons, even if the prior one flopped.

here are some reason why that have virtually nothing to do with the box office returns on the prior movie.

An individual greenlit the first one and either considers it his pet project or he's in so far with commitment they will be damned if they aren't making a sequel to prove them right.
The studio desperately needs franchise movies in its portfolio and is willing to take a loss if it thinks the next will be a hit
They had a particular investment arrangement with other backers that shielded (and continues to shield them) from any real risk exposure.
They could have an arrangement with a star or director that if they do this the studio will back a pet project of theirs
They could simply predict a different marketing strategy over seas will make massive changes in profit
They desperately need a movie in a release window and this is the one that is furthest along in development so they are making it
The studio itself just has a strong fondness for a franchise

There are so many reasons that you can get a sequel when the first one flopped.

Just because you don't understand the number doesn't mean there are not people who do.  Nothing is that mystifying.  Numbers are numbers.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:41:35 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:35:41 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths

You can make money off of movies in many ways.  You not understanding why a movie is greenlit doesn't mean the box office analysis was wrong.  A movie can be greenlit for many different reasons, even if the prior one flopped.

Just because you don't understand the number doesn't mean there are not people who do.  Nothing is that mystifying.  Numbers are numbers.

If we agree on that then it's not as black and white as the hard totals make out. If so then some of the concrete opinions on what is and isn't a flop need to be taken with a pinch of salt.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:45:17 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:41:35 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:35:41 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths

You can make money off of movies in many ways.  You not understanding why a movie is greenlit doesn't mean the box office analysis was wrong.  A movie can be greenlit for many different reasons, even if the prior one flopped.

Just because you don't understand the number doesn't mean there are not people who do.  Nothing is that mystifying.  Numbers are numbers.

If we agree on that then it's not as black and white as the hard totals make out. If so then some of the concrete opinions on what is and isn't a flop need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

No, it's pretty obvious when a movie flops, is close or is in the positive.  This particular movie is clearly in the flop category at the moment.  Sure, China COULD change that but I am predicting it won't do as well as people here are desperately hoping it will and it won't make a last second 200 million or whatever.

The making of a sequel could have little to do with the box office performance of the first.  It happens.  See my previous post.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:54:07 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:45:17 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:41:35 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:35:41 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths

You can make money off of movies in many ways.  You not understanding why a movie is greenlit doesn't mean the box office analysis was wrong.  A movie can be greenlit for many different reasons, even if the prior one flopped.

Just because you don't understand the number doesn't mean there are not people who do.  Nothing is that mystifying.  Numbers are numbers.

If we agree on that then it's not as black and white as the hard totals make out. If so then some of the concrete opinions on what is and isn't a flop need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

No, it's pretty obvious when a movie flops, is close or is in the positive.  This particular movie is clearly in the flop category at the moment.  Sure, China COULD change that but I am predicting it won't do as well as people here are desperately hoping it will and it won't make a last second 200 million or whatever.

Well looking at the numbers it's pretty obvious Olympus Has Fallen flopped but a sequel was made. I guess the investors liked throwing good money after bad or perhaps the box office threshold for a flop is not black and white.
What I am trying to say is that we have no idea what Foxs threshold is for this film.
A flop for me is King Arthur, The Lone Ranger, John Carter. They are black and white clear flops. Alien Covemant making lets say 220 mil ww from 93 mil budget....that's not black and white enough for me to call a flop
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:55:37 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:54:07 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:45:17 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:41:35 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:35:41 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths

You can make money off of movies in many ways.  You not understanding why a movie is greenlit doesn't mean the box office analysis was wrong.  A movie can be greenlit for many different reasons, even if the prior one flopped.

Just because you don't understand the number doesn't mean there are not people who do.  Nothing is that mystifying.  Numbers are numbers.

If we agree on that then it's not as black and white as the hard totals make out. If so then some of the concrete opinions on what is and isn't a flop need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

No, it's pretty obvious when a movie flops, is close or is in the positive.  This particular movie is clearly in the flop category at the moment.  Sure, China COULD change that but I am predicting it won't do as well as people here are desperately hoping it will and it won't make a last second 200 million or whatever.

Well looking at the numbers it's pretty obvious Olympus Has Fallen flopped but a sequel was made. I guess the investors liked throwing good money after bad or perhaps the box office threshold for a flop is not black and white.
What I am trying to say is that we have no idea what Foxs threshold is for this film.
A flop for me is King Arthur, The Lone Ranger, John Carter. They are black and white clear flops. Alien Covemant making lets say 220 mil ww from 93 mil budget....that's not black and white enough for me to call a flop

I know what you are trying to say and you are not entirely correct.  I told you why a sequel might be made despite the first losing money.  Alien making 220 WW on a 97 (not sure where you got 93 from now) is pretty clearly a flop.  Now if YOU don't want to call it a flop, that's fine.  But plenty of people with a much better understanding of the box office can tell you that is the category it is sitting in.

Again, look at my previous post.

When you say we don't know their threshold...   do you mean threshold for making a sequel?  If that is what you mean then you are absolutely correct, we don't know what they will consider necessary to make a sequel.  My guess is they are making that sequel come hell or high water.

People here are way too sensitive.  A movie flopping or not is not being negative or positive.  It's not making any sort of evaluation on its worth as a piece of art.  Incredible movies bomb (Blade Runner for instance) and critically panned movies dominate (transformers series).  The financial results of a movie aren't an evaluation on your worth for liking them or not.

I thought Covenant was pretty decent (solid 6-7/10).  I would have liked it to do well.  It isn't.  Things happen in life.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:59:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:55:37 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:54:07 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:45:17 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:41:35 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:35:41 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 11:54:07 AM
Ok I have an example I want the box office experts here to explain. Olympus Has Fallen.
Budget $70 million
WW box office take $161 million
By all the expert analysis mentioned in this thread that film is a "flop". A big flop
But they made a sequel, London Has Fallen, which by the way made $205 mil off a $60 mil budget and has another sequel in development.
I said it before in this thread, there are too many armchair box office "experts" who wholesale believe the Hollywood accounting myths

You can make money off of movies in many ways.  You not understanding why a movie is greenlit doesn't mean the box office analysis was wrong.  A movie can be greenlit for many different reasons, even if the prior one flopped.

Just because you don't understand the number doesn't mean there are not people who do.  Nothing is that mystifying.  Numbers are numbers.

If we agree on that then it's not as black and white as the hard totals make out. If so then some of the concrete opinions on what is and isn't a flop need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

No, it's pretty obvious when a movie flops, is close or is in the positive.  This particular movie is clearly in the flop category at the moment.  Sure, China COULD change that but I am predicting it won't do as well as people here are desperately hoping it will and it won't make a last second 200 million or whatever.

Well looking at the numbers it's pretty obvious Olympus Has Fallen flopped but a sequel was made. I guess the investors liked throwing good money after bad or perhaps the box office threshold for a flop is not black and white.
What I am trying to say is that we have no idea what Foxs threshold is for this film.
A flop for me is King Arthur, The Lone Ranger, John Carter. They are black and white clear flops. Alien Covemant making lets say 220 mil ww from 93 mil budget....that's not black and white enough for me to call a flop

I know what you are trying to say and you are not entirely correct.  I told you why a sequel might be made despite the first losing money.  Alien making 220 WW on a 97 (not sure where you got 93 from now) is pretty clearly a flop.  Now if YOU don't want to call it a flop, that's fine.  But plenty of people with a much better understanding of the box office can tell you that is the category it is sitting in.

Again, look at my previous post.

I guess time will tell the tale. Let's see how China and Japan do before calling it though. As I said earlier in the thread I would have never have laid a bet that Resi TFC would make so much money over there so we never know.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 01:06:05 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on May 31, 2017, 12:59:25 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 12:55:37 PM
I know what you are trying to say and you are not entirely correct.  I told you why a sequel might be made despite the first losing money.  Alien making 220 WW on a 97 (not sure where you got 93 from now) is pretty clearly a flop.  Now if YOU don't want to call it a flop, that's fine.  But plenty of people with a much better understanding of the box office can tell you that is the category it is sitting in.

Again, look at my previous post.

I guess time will tell the tale. Let's see how China and Japan do before calling it though. As I said earlier in the thread I would have never have laid a bet that Resi TFC would make so much money over there so we never know.

It's very hard to tell how a movie will do, exactly, in China.  Usually a staggered release is detrimental to the box office there because of the pirating scene but certain movies (that one included seem to do fine).  China also has a tendency to overinflate returns to make the market seem more powerful than it is.  For instance, with the release of Warcraft, the Chinese market was reporting numbers from provinces that did not have theatres in them.  Overall it's like that on most movies there so you just take the numbers as reported unless you really want to do a deep dive into the data.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on May 31, 2017, 01:26:37 PM
Quote from: Omegamorph on May 30, 2017, 04:00:41 PM
in what universe is 2001 horror-action?

I'm referring to the Alien franchise. How does that become like 2001?



Quote from: fiveways on May 30, 2017, 04:05:54 PM

because a horror franchise that goes in a 2001 direction actually seems kinda unique and interesting.  Not all of us like the action part of alien.  Alien is more horror suspense and way less action.  Everything is based on tension not dudes with guns.

To go in that direction, the "horror" part has to be dropped, too.

Also, the "horror" part in Alien involved slowly revealing the creature throughout the first film. Obviously, that was no longer possible in the sequel,  which is why the genre was shifted to action.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 01:39:20 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on May 31, 2017, 01:26:37 PM
Quote from: Omegamorph on May 30, 2017, 04:00:41 PM
in what universe is 2001 horror-action?

I'm referring to the Alien franchise. How does that become like 2001?

I think there was confusion over the phrasing when someone said 'a horror action movie'.  They meant why would you want a horror action movie to be like 2001, not that they thought 2001 was a horror action movie.

This is pretty non box office related though I guess.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 31, 2017, 03:21:36 PM
As I understand it, and I quote here:

'An American motion picture studio typically gets back somewhere about 40% to 50% of the domestic box office gross a motion picture makes at the theater. A distribution fee, usually 10% to 12%, is paid to the company that distributes the film (doing much of the advertising and preparation and shipment of the copies of the film).

The movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

Foreign distribution and foreign movie theaters keep more of the box office gross for themselves (often to cover the costs of transporting a motion picture overseas and promoting it there as well). American studios tend to get back something about 30% of box office money earned outside of the United States and Canad'

Based on this assessment:

Current domestic gross:  60M so the Studio may get 30-40M from that, not much more as we are beyond the first two weeks.
Overseas:  100M, the studio gets about 30M based on the above

Domestic video/streaming sales: May make 30M gross, 15M net for the studio..

So we are looking at 60- 70M return on 100M investment so far.  It might break even, even make a small profit, although China is unlikely to give a significant boost, as the %age returns are low and the film doesn't tick the right boxes with the Chinese audience (no 3-D, too much dialogue) plus ist is not seen as a hit in the US..
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on May 31, 2017, 04:11:13 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 31, 2017, 12:22:56 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 06:46:44 PM
...I personally know no one...

That explains a lot.


Nice, really nice. I bet with this kind of sophisticated humor your the alpha male in your dudebro gang. Kindergarten mentality, always a pleasure.

Quote from: Alionic on May 31, 2017, 01:35:21 AM

Can you two please stop acting like you know what you're talking about?

After you.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 04:30:22 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 31, 2017, 03:21:36 PM
As I understand it, and I quote here:

'An American motion picture studio typically gets back somewhere about 40% to 50% of the domestic box office gross a motion picture makes at the theater. A distribution fee, usually 10% to 12%, is paid to the company that distributes the film (doing much of the advertising and preparation and shipment of the copies of the film).

The movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

Foreign distribution and foreign movie theaters keep more of the box office gross for themselves (often to cover the costs of transporting a motion picture overseas and promoting it there as well). American studios tend to get back something about 30% of box office money earned outside of the United States and Canad'

Based on this assessment:

Current domestic gross:  60M so the Studio may get 30-40M from that, not much more as we are beyond the first two weeks.
Overseas:  100M, the studio gets about 30M based on the above

Domestic video/streaming sales: May make 30M gross, 15M net for the studio..

So we are looking at 60- 70M return on 100M investment so far.  It might break even, even make a small profit, although China is unlikely to give a significant boost, as the %age returns are low and the film doesn't tick the right boxes with the Chinese audience (no 3-D, too much dialogue) plus ist is not seen as a hit in the US..

While that is a pretty good break down, you are forgetting to add in the marketing and distribution cost into the 100 million dollar investment (print ads alone for covenant are reported to be in the 20-25 million dollar range).  In the end, the investment is more along the lines of 200 million.  if you want to absolutely low ball it, you can go with 150ish but I think that's pretty unrealistic in this case.

Also, this part isn't true any more

QuoteThe movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

Generally speaking it is a flat 50-55% now for studios after theatres started going under by insanely front loaded films.  There are some securities worked out where theatres, not studios, are protected from absolute bombs (they get a higher % of the first x amount of money which flattens out to 50% pretty quickly).

QuoteSo we are looking at 60- 70M return on 100M investment so far.  It might break even, even make a small profit, although China is unlikely to give a significant boost, as the %age returns are low and the film doesn't tick the right boxes with the Chinese audience (no 3-D, too much dialogue) plus ist is not seen as a hit in the US.

China is going to be rough...   studios only see about 33% of China's box office and even less after expenses (distribution over there plus sub titles and or voice actors, currency exchanges and taxes etc., etc.) and I have seen estimates in the range of only really seeing 10-15%.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 31, 2017, 04:48:09 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 31, 2017, 04:11:13 PM
Quote from: Gash on May 31, 2017, 12:22:56 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on May 30, 2017, 06:46:44 PM
...I personally know no one...

That explains a lot.


Nice, really nice. I bet with this kind of sophisticated humor your the alpha male in your dudebro gang.


I apologise unreservedly.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on May 31, 2017, 05:07:09 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 04:30:22 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 31, 2017, 03:21:36 PM
As I understand it, and I quote here:

'An American motion picture studio typically gets back somewhere about 40% to 50% of the domestic box office gross a motion picture makes at the theater. A distribution fee, usually 10% to 12%, is paid to the company that distributes the film (doing much of the advertising and preparation and shipment of the copies of the film).

The movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

Foreign distribution and foreign movie theaters keep more of the box office gross for themselves (often to cover the costs of transporting a motion picture overseas and promoting it there as well). American studios tend to get back something about 30% of box office money earned outside of the United States and Canad'

Based on this assessment:

Current domestic gross:  60M so the Studio may get 30-40M from that, not much more as we are beyond the first two weeks.
Overseas:  100M, the studio gets about 30M based on the above

Domestic video/streaming sales: May make 30M gross, 15M net for the studio..

So we are looking at 60- 70M return on 100M investment so far.  It might break even, even make a small profit, although China is unlikely to give a significant boost, as the %age returns are low and the film doesn't tick the right boxes with the Chinese audience (no 3-D, too much dialogue) plus ist is not seen as a hit in the US..

While that is a pretty good break down, you are forgetting to add in the marketing and distribution cost into the 100 million dollar investment (print ads alone for covenant are reported to be in the 20-25 million dollar range).  In the end, the investment is more along the lines of 200 million.  if you want to absolutely low ball it, you can go with 150ish but I think that's pretty unrealistic in this case.

Also, this part isn't true any more

QuoteThe movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

Generally speaking it is a flat 50-55% now for studios after theatres started going under by insanely front loaded films.  There are some securities worked out where theatres, not studios, are protected from absolute bombs (they get a higher % of the first x amount of money which flattens out to 50% pretty quickly).

QuoteSo we are looking at 60- 70M return on 100M investment so far.  It might break even, even make a small profit, although China is unlikely to give a significant boost, as the %age returns are low and the film doesn't tick the right boxes with the Chinese audience (no 3-D, too much dialogue) plus ist is not seen as a hit in the US.

China is going to be rough...   studios only see about 33% of China's box office and even less after expenses (distribution over there plus sub titles and or voice actors, currency exchanges and taxes etc., etc.) and I have seen estimates in the range of only really seeing 10-15%.

Re-running the numbers, and lowballing the marketing side:

Cost 150M

Return 30M domestic on 60M
            30M International on 100M

Potential: Japan returned 21M on Prom, so lowside 15M with 5M for the studio
DVD/Streaming say 15M for the studio

Total return ex China  80 million. So China has to gross at least 210M to break even, and that's based on lowballing marketing and distribution costs, and % return on Chinese gross. . Ain't gonna happen...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on May 31, 2017, 09:11:08 PM
I had a thought recently. I have noticed that almost every YouTube video review/discussion for this movie is negative. People really do wait to see how YouTube reacts to certain things now.

I am going to guess that is the reason the movie performed so poorly on it's second week.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on May 31, 2017, 09:23:27 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 31, 2017, 09:11:08 PM
I had a thought recently. I have noticed that almost every YouTube video review/discussion for this movie is negative. People really do wait to see how YouTube reacts to certain things now.

I am going to guess that is the reason the movie performed so poorly on it's second week.

That doesn't surprise me. I avoid watching them. They all seem to be about creating a platform and notoriety for the individual rather than about the actual films. Can't take them seriously really.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on May 31, 2017, 09:30:58 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on May 31, 2017, 09:23:27 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 31, 2017, 09:11:08 PM
I had a thought recently. I have noticed that almost every YouTube video review/discussion for this movie is negative. People really do wait to see how YouTube reacts to certain things now.

I am going to guess that is the reason the movie performed so poorly on it's second week.

That doesn't surprise me. I avoid watching them. They all seem to be about creating a platform and notoriety for the individual rather than about the actual films. Can't take them seriously really.

I watched a few but but yes you're right. Provocative tiles like 'It sucks' 'Why I hate..., 'Fail etc. It's all just click bait. They sit back and watch the fireworks and get off on the number of hits their channel gets. Best avoided.

The better ones that have some analysis - good, bad or neutral are still worth a watch, but wading through the utter shite to get there isn't easy.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 10:17:04 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 31, 2017, 09:11:08 PM
I had a thought recently. I have noticed that almost every YouTube video review/discussion for this movie is negative. People really do wait to see how YouTube reacts to certain things now.

I am going to guess that is the reason the movie performed so poorly on it's second week.

Other movies that have those succeed.  It had a plummeting drop off because people either had zero desire to see it again or weren't that interested int he first place.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on May 31, 2017, 10:38:45 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on May 31, 2017, 09:11:08 PM
I had a thought recently. I have noticed that almost every YouTube video review/discussion for this movie is negative. People really do wait to see how YouTube reacts to certain things now.

I am going to guess that is the reason the movie performed so poorly on it's second week.

It's a shame how so many people are influenced by grotesque neckbeards in their space marine outfits on youtube.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kerrod33 on May 31, 2017, 10:44:20 PM
Quote from: 900SL on May 31, 2017, 03:21:36 PM
As I understand it, and I quote here:

'An American motion picture studio typically gets back somewhere about 40% to 50% of the domestic box office gross a motion picture makes at the theater. A distribution fee, usually 10% to 12%, is paid to the company that distributes the film (doing much of the advertising and preparation and shipment of the copies of the film).

The movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

Foreign distribution and foreign movie theaters keep more of the box office gross for themselves (often to cover the costs of transporting a motion picture overseas and promoting it there as well). American studios tend to get back something about 30% of box office money earned outside of the United States and Canad'

Based on this assessment:

Current domestic gross:  60M so the Studio may get 30-40M from that, not much more as we are beyond the first two weeks.
Overseas:  100M, the studio gets about 30M based on the above

Domestic video/streaming sales: May make 30M gross, 15M net for the studio..

So we are looking at 60- 70M return on 100M investment so far.  It might break even, even make a small profit, although China is unlikely to give a significant boost, as the %age returns are low and the film doesn't tick the right boxes with the Chinese audience (no 3-D, too much dialogue) plus ist is not seen as a hit in the US..

Ok, now I can understand. Thanks for actually explaining  :)

When I asked how do people figure it is a flop when from the numbers it looked as if it was already in profit after earning $150mil+, all they would pretty much say 'cos reasons' or 'marketing'
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Noah on Jun 01, 2017, 12:09:46 AM
Fox spent 70M or even less for Deadpool (marketing costs). It's very unlikely they've spent 100M for A:C.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 01, 2017, 01:47:20 AM
Quote from: Noah on Jun 01, 2017, 12:09:46 AM
Fox spent 70M or even less for Deadpool (marketing costs). It's very unlikely they've spent 100M for A:C.

They spent 120 million on it. No idea where you got 70.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 01, 2017, 04:00:31 AM
Tonight is the second to last night Covenant will be playing in my town. Going to see it for the first time in 20 min. Kind of nervous I won't like it. I was a little too invested in Prometheus 2, folks...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on Jun 01, 2017, 05:08:31 AM
It was already pulled out here in all theaters.  :(
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: YutaniDitch on Jun 01, 2017, 10:37:37 AM
Quote from: 900SL on May 31, 2017, 03:21:36 PM
As I understand it, and I quote here:

'An American motion picture studio typically gets back somewhere about 40% to 50% of the domestic box office gross a motion picture makes at the theater. A distribution fee, usually 10% to 12%, is paid to the company that distributes the film (doing much of the advertising and preparation and shipment of the copies of the film).

The movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

Foreign distribution and foreign movie theaters keep more of the box office gross for themselves (often to cover the costs of transporting a motion picture overseas and promoting it there as well). American studios tend to get back something about 30% of box office money earned outside of the United States and Canad'

Based on this assessment:

Current domestic gross:  60M so the Studio may get 30-40M from that, not much more as we are beyond the first two weeks.
Overseas:  100M, the studio gets about 30M based on the above

Domestic video/streaming sales: May make 30M gross, 15M net for the studio..

So we are looking at 60- 70M return on 100M investment so far.  It might break even, even make a small profit, although China is unlikely to give a significant boost, as the %age returns are low and the film doesn't tick the right boxes with the Chinese audience (no 3-D, too much dialogue) plus ist is not seen as a hit in the US..

Where did you get that quote...? 😉👍🏻
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on Jun 01, 2017, 11:52:15 AM
Quote from: YutaniDitch on Jun 01, 2017, 10:37:37 AM
Where did you get that quote...? 😉👍🏻

https://www.quora.com/How-does-the-revenue-from-a-movie-get-split-among-actors-directors-and-everyone-else
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 01, 2017, 02:39:06 PM
Quote from: 900SL on Jun 01, 2017, 11:52:15 AM
Quote from: YutaniDitch on Jun 01, 2017, 10:37:37 AM
Where did you get that quote...? 😉👍🏻

https://www.quora.com/How-does-the-revenue-from-a-movie-get-split-among-actors-directors-and-everyone-else

There are some odd anachronistic info in there

QuoteThe movie theaters also get a significant cut, and take an increasing amount of the box office returns the longer a film is in theaters, based on the workings of the deals they have signed with the distribution company. For the first two weeks, most of the money goes to the studio; from week 3 on, increasingly more of the money goes to the movie theater.

This has largely been flattened out so I am not quite sure what they are referring to.  It used to be a pretty steep scale but that led to a lot of theatres going bankrupt as every studio simply blitzed ad campaigns for huge opening weekends and then stopped caring what happened after.  The theatres worked out a new contract that generally is a flat 50ish % across the life of the film...   they are even slightly protected by getting a higher percentage of the first X million dollar to buffer them against bombs.  They have much less financial ability to endure through repeated bombs when compared to a studio.

I do like that they discuss residuals though because so many people here seem to think that is magical Hollywood accounting and doesn't count.  it absolutely does and the studio is absolutely contractually obligated to pay them.  It is absolutely an expense that is not part of the production budget.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 01, 2017, 08:17:43 PM
QuoteAlien: Covenant grossed $954K on Wednesday.  13-Day total stands at $62.483M.

https://twitter.com/BORReport/status/870362671043944448
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BonesawT101 on Jun 01, 2017, 11:08:33 PM
Thats its US total aye?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: lv_226 on Jun 02, 2017, 02:59:39 AM
Quote from: FallenDarkAngel on Jun 01, 2017, 05:08:31 AM
It was already pulled out here in all theaters.  :(
Still going strong here!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jun 02, 2017, 05:34:22 AM
I just saw the film, today, but the theater was dead as a graveyard. Loved the movie, but, aside from myself, my brothers and my mother, only two other people were in the room.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on Jun 02, 2017, 06:01:42 AM
Quote from: lv_226 on Jun 02, 2017, 02:59:39 AM
Quote from: FallenDarkAngel on Jun 01, 2017, 05:08:31 AM
It was already pulled out here in all theaters.  :(
Still going strong here!
Good to know that!

I'm currently here in the Philippines, and I was appalled that all the cinemas here pulled out AC so early (considering the fact that AC is doing better than King Arthur that flopped here, but still being shown). So disappointed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 02, 2017, 07:48:14 AM
Quote from: BonesawT101 on Jun 01, 2017, 11:08:33 PM
Thats its US total aye?

Yeah, that's right.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: banecat on Jun 02, 2017, 09:47:26 AM
i remember in my showing, at 730 on the opening friday night, there was only about 30 people in there. i don't particularly get why it hasn't done better, the reviews aren't that bad. does anyone else fear that the box office performance is leading us to a reboot of the series?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 02, 2017, 10:19:04 AM
As long as the original movie's making money for Fox there will not be a remake.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: lv_226 on Jun 02, 2017, 09:55:49 PM
Quote from: banecat on Jun 02, 2017, 09:47:26 AM
i remember in my showing, at 730 on the opening friday night, there was only about 30 people in there. i don't particularly get why it hasn't done better, the reviews aren't that bad. does anyone else fear that the box office performance is leading us to a reboot of the series?
I wouldn't quite claim that yet. I think that overall the industry is seeing some issues with getting more butts in seats.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 03, 2017, 12:25:55 AM
It does seem to be industry-wide, right now - unless you are in the Disney/Marvel/Lucasfilm/Pixar empire.

Covenant lost 1,112 screens this week. I saw it on the second to last day my small town theater was showing it. It only lasted 13 days at our small-town movie theater before going away. Before the show, we chatted with the manager, who is a friend of ours. The manager said that the season has been slow overall, but he blamed the quality of movies. Beauty and the Beast cleaned up because of great word of mouth. I know one person who liked Covenant - a lot - but everyone else was mixed to negative. The manager wasn't even planning on projecting the movie until we showed up, because the auditorium was empty.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on Jun 03, 2017, 12:37:42 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 03, 2017, 12:25:55 AM
It does seem to be industry-wide, right now - unless you are in the Disney/Marvel/Lucasfilm/Pixar empire.

Covenant lost 1,112 screens this week. I saw it on the second to last day my small town theater was showing it. The manager said that the season has been slow overall, but he blamed the quality of movies. Beauty and the Beast cleaned up because of great word of mouth.

Beauty and the Beast - now there's a film with some ropey CGI.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 03, 2017, 03:28:30 AM
Apparently ropey CGI didn't prevent people from recommending that movie to their friends. Alien fans seem to have a fetish for the practical beast from the earlier films, almost to the exclusion of considering any other approach as legitimate.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 03, 2017, 05:52:01 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 03, 2017, 03:28:30 AM
Apparently ropey CGI didn't prevent people from recommending that movie to their friends. Alien fans seem to have a fetish for the practical beast from the earlier films, almost to the exclusion of considering any other approach as legitimate.

Stupid fanboys always behave like that. No offense.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on Jun 03, 2017, 06:47:19 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 03, 2017, 03:28:30 AM
Apparently ropey CGI didn't prevent people from recommending that movie to their friends. Alien fans seem to have a fetish for the practical beast from the earlier films, almost to the exclusion of considering any other approach as legitimate.

You have it all figured out eh? Must be bliss. :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jun 03, 2017, 01:28:42 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 01:39:20 PM

I think there was confusion over the phrasing when someone said 'a horror action movie'.  They meant why would you want a horror action movie to be like 2001, not that they thought 2001 was a horror action movie.

This is pretty non box office related though I guess.

The fact that the Alien films are horror-action means they cannot be like 2001, which is not horror-action. But the producers thought that they could mix the two, which is why the "ancient astronaut" lore and weighty dialogue (together with all sorts of literary references and purty scenery) were added. And I think that affected box office performance.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 03, 2017, 04:57:50 PM
Quote20th Century Fox's Alien: Covenant took another tumble yesterday, earning just $1.115 million (-63%) for a $64.334m 15-day total. We can expect a $3.9m (-63%) third weekend for a $67.119m 17-day cume. An $80m domestic total may be a pipe dream, but overseas is where the story will be told and it will open in China on the 16th of June. Granted, June will be busy as heck in China, with Wonder Woman this weekend, The Mummy next weekend and Transformers: The Last Knight on the 23rd.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/03/friday-box-office-pirates-5-plunges-73-baywatch-and-alien-fall-hard/#68e15e7f3cf2
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 03, 2017, 06:46:09 PM
Isn't Warner Bros distributing Covenant overseas? Does that effect Fox's take?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 11:52:45 AM
covenant is currently sitting at 165 mil on ''box office mojo worldwide 2017''. .thats where i usually go to check. .it at least moves up like a million each day. .but i notice the us total going up each day but the worldwide is stuck on 101 mil for almost a week now. ..  i am hoping they still need to update the global and it will give covenant some boost. . One can only hope!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 04, 2017, 12:11:02 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 11:52:45 AM
covenant is currently sitting at 165 mil on ''box office mojo worldwide 2017''. .thats where i usually go to check. .it at least moves up like a million each day. .but i notice the us total going up each day but the worldwide is stuck on 101 mil for almost a week now. ..  i am hoping they still need to update the global and it will give covenant some boost. . One can only hope!

Yeah, I noticed the same about 101 million worldwide. Update is needed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on Jun 04, 2017, 01:15:42 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 04, 2017, 12:11:02 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 11:52:45 AM
covenant is currently sitting at 165 mil on ''box office mojo worldwide 2017''. .thats where i usually go to check. .it at least moves up like a million each day. .but i notice the us total going up each day but the worldwide is stuck on 101 mil for almost a week now. ..  i am hoping they still need to update the global and it will give covenant some boost. . One can only hope!

Yeah, I noticed the same about 101 million worldwide. Update is needed.

They will update it after the weekend.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 04, 2017, 01:19:56 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jun 03, 2017, 01:28:42 PM
Quote from: Robopadna on May 31, 2017, 01:39:20 PM

I think there was confusion over the phrasing when someone said 'a horror action movie'.  They meant why would you want a horror action movie to be like 2001, not that they thought 2001 was a horror action movie.

This is pretty non box office related though I guess.

The fact that the Alien films are horror-action means they cannot be like 2001, which is not horror-action. But the producers thought that they could mix the two, which is why the "ancient astronaut" lore and weighty dialogue (together with all sorts of literary references and purty scenery) were added. And I think that affected box office performance.

In the end what hurt box office is the Alien.  Prometheus was a franchise mostly free of that association and profited for it.  Covenant is the example of what happen when you take a successful film with sequel possibility and listen to a vocal minority of fans.  Few people in North America wanted another Alien film.  Box office totals reflect that.  Word of mouth boiled down to "Oh another Alien flick" and indifference.

Maybe Prometheus 2 would also have crashed and burned.  Maybe it is the market or whatever other factors you wanna bring into it.  Personally, I think they made a not so great film about a creature people are tired of seeing.

Just for fun I looked up other played out Creature feature characters.  Alien: Covenant with a bigger star and a better director isn't doing much better than either the Nightmare on Elm Street or Friday the 13th remakes domestically while costing a huge amount more.

This is just domestic comparisons.  Alien is doing way better overseas without question. 

Nightmare on Elm Street 2010:  $63,075,011/35m budget
Friday the 13th 2009: $65,002,019/19m budget
Alien Covenant:  $64,334,484/97m budget

Note:  Those numbers are not including inflation, which brings Ft13 to over 74m and Nightmare to 71m in 2017 dollars.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 02:20:13 PM
i was just thinking about how badly that Life movie performed at thaeters as well. .it was basicly dead on arrival despite having ok reviews on RT.  audiences gave it a terrible c-. .judging from that i guess audiences are not that keen on horror sci fi anymore. .to be honest i was already weary of covenants performance at that stage. .it seemed to me like a bad omen. .at least covenant is not considered quite as big a flop in comparison. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 04, 2017, 02:26:41 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 02:20:13 PM
i was just thinking about how badly that Life movie performed at thaeters as well. .it was basicly dead on arrival despite having ok reviews on RT.  audiences gave it a terrible c-. .judging from that i guess audiences are not that keen on horror sci fi anymore. .to be honest i was already weary of covenants performance at that stage. .it seemed to me like a bad omen. .at least covenant is not considered quite as big a flop in comparison. .

Haven't seen Life yet. 58 million budget and only 93 million gross. Flop. People prefer superheroes movies now days.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 04, 2017, 02:43:56 PM
Quote"Game over, man, game over." ALIEN: COVENANT lost over 1,100+ theaters in its 3rd week, falling -62% w/ just $4M, $67M total.

https://twitter.com/ERCboxoffice/status/871375343650717697
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 02:48:55 PM
. .thanks for rubbing some coarse salt into my wounds hicks. .lol
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 04, 2017, 03:09:10 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 02:20:13 PM
i was just thinking about how badly that Life movie performed at thaeters as well. .it was basicly dead on arrival despite having ok reviews on RT.  audiences gave it a terrible c-. .judging from that i guess audiences are not that keen on horror sci fi anymore. .to be honest i was already weary of covenants performance at that stage. .it seemed to me like a bad omen. .at least covenant is not considered quite as big a flop in comparison. .

Did they even promote Life?  I've never even heard of it till this moment.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 03:25:25 PM
. .they did do a an expensive trailer at the superbowl and several other trailers on youtube. .some interviews as well. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 04, 2017, 03:26:59 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 03:25:25 PM
. .they did do a an expensive trailer at the superbowl and several other trailers on youtube. .some interviews as well. .

I had no idea.  (That said, I'm not in the USA so the Superbowl is far less important in day to day life).  I saw nothing about it on any of the other horror forums I'm on. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jun 04, 2017, 03:37:38 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 04, 2017, 01:19:56 PM

In the end what hurt box office is the Alien.  Prometheus was a franchise mostly free of that association and profited for it.  Covenant is the example of what happen when you take a successful film with sequel possibility and listen to a vocal minority of fans.  Few people in North America wanted another Alien film.  Box office totals reflect that.  Word of mouth boiled down to "Oh another Alien flick" and indifference.

Maybe Prometheus 2 would also have crashed and burned.  Maybe it is the market or whatever other factors you wanna bring into it.  Personally, I think they made a not so great film about a creature people are tired of seeing.

Just for fun I looked up other played out Creature feature characters.  Alien: Covenant with a bigger star and a better director isn't doing much better than either the Nightmare on Elm Street or Friday the 13th remakes domestically while costing a huge amount more.

This is just domestic comparisons.  Alien is doing way better overseas without question. 

Nightmare on Elm Street 2010:  $63,075,011/35m budget
Friday the 13th 2009: $65,002,019/19m budget
Alien Covenant:  $64,334,484/97m budget

Note:  Those numbers are not including inflation, which brings Ft13 to over 74m and Nightmare to 71m in 2017 dollars.

I get this feeling that Prometheus earned because viewers were curious about the prequel, and after that they judged the film as 6-7 out of 10. The main complaint was that even with the wonderful visuals it still did poorly because it tried to be profound but could not due to problems with the dialogue and the story.

Producers did not solve those problems and instead added elements from the first two movies of the franchise because those were what made them successful. But viewers were expecting something like Prometheus, so they didn't bother to watch it. The result was poor box office results and the rating still 6-7 out of 10.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on Jun 04, 2017, 03:43:48 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 04, 2017, 03:26:59 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 04, 2017, 03:25:25 PM
. .they did do a an expensive trailer at the superbowl and several other trailers on youtube. .some interviews as well. .

I had no idea.  (That said, I'm not in the USA so the Superbowl is far less important in day to day life).  I saw nothing about it on any of the other horror forums I'm on.

I saw Life at the cinema. A good film which owes a lot to ALIEN.

Sadly super hero movies seem to be the thing now - not sure why they've become so fashionable when they were the kiss of death for years. I've tried to watch a few when they've arrived on TV but find them unengaging. I expect their stranglehold will wane with time. R rated horror that has aspirations to engage with a mature audience isn't really finding one at the level it used to.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 04, 2017, 04:01:31 PM
Attempts to blame Prometheus are futile and sad. It got better reviews because it was intriguing. Reviews stated so. They rated Covenant lower because it was formulaic. Reviews stated so. Prometheus saved the franchise, actually. Covenant is doing the opposite.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 04, 2017, 05:42:32 PM
Foreign gross updated: $106,615,130 as of 6/4/17

Domestic:      $67,219,484        38.7%
+ Foreign:      $106,615,130      61.3%
= Worldwide: $173,834,614
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: RandomNumber on Jun 04, 2017, 06:58:38 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.

Agreed.

Interestingly, Katherine Waterston says the hairstyle was her idea, and that she begged Ridley Scott to let her do her hair that way:

http://io9.gizmodo.com/katherine-waterston-stole-her-alien-covenant-hairstyle-1790422610
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on Jun 04, 2017, 07:04:50 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 04, 2017, 04:01:31 PM
Attempts to blame Prometheus are futile and sad. It gt better reviews because it was intriguing. Reviews stated so. They rated Covenant lower because it was formulaic. Reviews stated so. Prometheus saved the franchise, actually. Covenant is doing the opposite.

Nope guys, the opposite. Prometheus was wrong, so wrong. Alien is "right". Covenant had too much Prometheus blood, and that's why it's failing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 04, 2017, 07:12:10 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.

Actually, same here. She looked nasty and it kind of turned me off. I wish Daniels' hair was longer. And actually Katherine Waterston in this role in general was kind of bad. Her face is too weird. Enough of these unique Sigourneys and Noomis. Just give me a straight classical beauty.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on Jun 04, 2017, 07:18:49 PM
Wow.

Her hairstyle is the reason this movie underperformed? I've heard dumb takes before, but this has to take the cake.

As for Prometheus being to blame; promotion for Covenant didn't reference it at all. It's very possible, perhaps likely, that general audiences weren't even aware they were related.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bananasalesperson on Jun 04, 2017, 09:18:23 PM
People aren't tired of horror sci fi. They're tired of bad film making. Prometheus was drastically, wildly, flawed in script and storytelling. And alien covenant was merely 'less flawed', but also does some storytelling acrobatics to make it a continuation of prometheus.

Ridley Scott went full Lucas on us.

Interest in horror/scifi is just fine, perhaps even a bit hungry for something good.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on Jun 04, 2017, 11:43:47 PM
Quote from: bananasalesperson on Jun 04, 2017, 09:18:23 PM

Ridley Scott went full Lucas on us.


Really? That unfounded bullshit again?

Isn't that the Youtube level? Can't we expect more inspired critique here?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on Jun 05, 2017, 12:11:31 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 04, 2017, 07:12:10 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.

Actually, same here. She looked nasty and it kind of turned me off. I wish Daniels' hair was longer. And actually Katherine Waterston in this role in general was kind of bad. Her face is too weird. Enough of these unique Sigourneys and Noomis. Just give me a straight classical beauty.

Covenant would be at 1 Billion $$$ or more Box Office if Danny McBride and Waterson had switched hair cuts.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on Jun 05, 2017, 12:29:16 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on Jun 05, 2017, 12:11:31 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 04, 2017, 07:12:10 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.

Actually, same here. She looked nasty and it kind of turned me off. I wish Daniels' hair was longer. And actually Katherine Waterston in this role in general was kind of bad. Her face is too weird. Enough of these unique Sigourneys and Noomis. Just give me a straight classical beauty.

Covenant would be at 1 Billion $$$ or more Box Office if Danny McBride and Waterson had switched hair cuts.

2 Bil if she were naked the whole time!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 05, 2017, 12:49:36 AM
Quote from: bananasalesperson on Jun 04, 2017, 09:18:23 PM
Interest in horror/scifi is just fine, perhaps even a bit hungry for something good.
I would like to see some numbers that support your claim. The most successful sci-fi horror movie of the last ten years was Prometheus... by a margin of hundreds of millions of dollars (unless you count Jurassic World as horror, which I don't). Before Prometheus, you have to go all the way back to I Am Legend, Spielberg's War of the Worlds, and Shyamalan's Signs before you find high-grossing sci-fi horror. Do you consider those quality sci-fi horror films? How about the Resident Evil movies, which are next on the list?

No, audience interest in sci-fi horror is moderate at best. The movies I mentioned show the upper limit of what they can gross with today's audiences. Sci-fi horror is more limited than just sci-fi. Sci-fi movies are doing huge business. Serious ones, that is, like Arrival or The Martian. Prometheus played up the sci-fi angle to great success; when people discuss that movie positively, they discuss the ideas, not the scares. Covenant doesn't have enough to offer in a crowded market that included recent hits like The Martian, Ex Machina, Fury Road, or Arrival. It lacked a compelling conceptual hook to be a good sci-fi draw, and it lacked original horror elements to be effectively scary. That and franchise fatigue: each Alien film made less than the prior one, and Covenant fits that pattern. Prometheus broke the pattern by breaking with the franchise and the subgenre. Imo, at least.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Predaker on Jun 05, 2017, 01:50:45 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on Jun 04, 2017, 07:18:49 PM
Wow.

Her hairstyle is the reason this movie underperformed? I've heard dumb takes before, but this has to take the cake.

That's not what I said. Sometimes a little reading comprehension goes a long way.

And don't underestimate the shallowness of some folk!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AlienFanIL17 on Jun 05, 2017, 02:35:50 AM
Just saw it again today.  I liked it even more than before.  I still put my ranking as Aliens, Alien, and then Covenant.  I still don't like the pacing of the third act, it still seems rushed.  I really hope we get a director's cut on blu-ray.  15-20 more minutes, with the majority of that added in the third act, would really elevate this film I feel.  The third act needs a little more tension, a little more cat and mouse with the beast. 

It seems like there were a good amount of people who didn't like Prometheus. but eventually they liked it.  I'm not saying everyone who dislikes Covenant will end up liking it.  However, I think Covenant is a movie that people will like the more they watch it.  Just my opinion.

Also, I thought of something while watching it today about no breathing masks or protection for when they landed.  Once they determine to check out the new planet, we are told the trip will take 2 weeks.  The repairs on the ship only need 48 hours.  I would say it's implied that all the tests to make sure the new destination is safe for exploration would have been carried out in the 12 days after the repairs have been made.  Again, just my opinion.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Spidey3121 on Jun 05, 2017, 02:59:21 AM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 05, 2017, 01:50:45 AM
Quote from: Spidey3121 on Jun 04, 2017, 07:18:49 PM
Wow.

Her hairstyle is the reason this movie underperformed? I've heard dumb takes before, but this has to take the cake.

That's not what I said. Sometimes a little reading comprehension goes a long way.

And don't underestimate the shallowness of some folk!

You said it negatively affected ticket sales. What other way is there to take this? And then 2 other members agreed. I certainly do not underestimate the shallowness of some, but I can't imagine her hair style is keeping the masses away.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Predaker on Jun 05, 2017, 03:12:58 AM
There are a number of reasons Covenant is underperforming. Daniels hairstyle isn't high up on that list.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 05, 2017, 05:15:11 AM
I actually might be going crazy but I do think it impacted the box office a bit.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 05, 2017, 05:46:24 AM
sorry but i never found her hair to be the least bit distracting. .i would agree that she is perhaps not the prettiest actress out their. .she's certainly no theron. .but she is still what i would regard as attractive..  .whatever she lacked in beauty i thought she made up for in her acting ability. .not oscar material. .but definately more than adequate.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: XenoVC on Jun 05, 2017, 05:59:56 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 05, 2017, 05:15:11 AM
I actually might be going crazy but I do think it impacted the box office a bit.

I thought the notion of this was funny, but this movie has done more business than Alien 3 with a bald Sigourney Weaver everywhere you can see.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 05, 2017, 07:51:35 AM
Her hair made the movie perform poorly? That has to be one of the daftest things I've read.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 05, 2017, 08:23:27 AM
The current numbers are a week behind internationally, so it'll be interesting to see much some of the larger markets bring in (UK, Australia, South Korea, Germany, Russia).  Based on the drops from previous weeks, I can't imagine it'll make a great deal more.

China will make a bit, and Japan doesn't get a release till September.

I think it'll get past $200m, which will see it into the top 20 for the year, but there's probably about a dozen other films yet to be released that will wind up ahead of it.

Watching it last night I was struck by the fact that back when Alien and Aliens came out, there were a bunch of movies that mimicked them.  How many space horror movies are there now?  We had Life a few months back that didn't really do much.  Before that?  Apollo 18?  And both those films are tied to present day(ish) NASA stuff and not futuristic.  Maybe there's just not an appetite for this anymore to a mass audience.

Another thing I noticed in the trailers for Annabelle Creation and IT was this jump/cut frame sped up screaming in your face kind of scares.  And they're both in mundane settings.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 05, 2017, 11:06:44 AM
. .yeah i just don't think that jump cut screaming in your face shit would work in an alien movie. .it works best with ghost movies. .i did not really enjoy that bit in the it trailer either. .it looks like a very lazy effect. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 05, 2017, 12:39:15 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 05, 2017, 08:23:27 AM
The current numbers are a week behind internationally, so it'll be interesting to see much some of the larger markets bring in (UK, Australia, South Korea, Germany, Russia).  Based on the drops from previous weeks, I can't imagine it'll make a great deal more.

You are right that its run is pretty much done internationally with the exception of China/Japan.

Quote from: SM on Jun 05, 2017, 08:23:27 AMI think it'll get past $200m, which will see it into the top 20 for the year, but there's probably about a dozen other films yet to be released that will wind up ahead of it.

If we look at last year, making 200 million WW would put it at 44 for the year.  I think it will actually approach about 300 WW but that would probably be top 25-30.

Overall this is going to be a bad flop, especially in the context of the expectations from Fox that they had fixed all the problems with Prometheus.  They wanted a tent pole franchise and I think Alien is proving that it isn't that.

I really hope Scott gets his final movie and I think we will see soon.  Fox can let him have it, even with this poor box office return, they can go in another direction (reboot or brand new story, which I think is the least likely) or they can put it on ice for a while.  I really hope they don't do that last but instead realize the audience isn't really there to treat this as a massive money maker and instead rethink and reshape their expectations.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 05, 2017, 12:46:18 PM
Maybe Blu Ray sales will pick up slack.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 05, 2017, 12:50:14 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on Jun 05, 2017, 12:46:18 PM
Maybe Blu Ray sales will pick up slack.

There will be costs associated with those (not insignificant ones) but dvd (standard and blu ray) plus red box/online buys will supplement the box office take.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 05, 2017, 02:22:42 PM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 04, 2017, 11:43:47 PM
Quote from: bananasalesperson on Jun 04, 2017, 09:18:23 PM

Ridley Scott went full Lucas on us.


Really? That unfounded bullshit again?

Isn't that the Youtube level? Can't we expect more inspired critique here?

There are elements of truth in it as he made the universe feel really small.  David creating the Xeno (currently according to ridley he is the creator and I accept this might change) is the Alien equal of Anakin creating C-3PO as a child.  Making a sci-fi franchise smaller is never a good thing. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ryan741 on Jun 05, 2017, 02:59:21 PM
I thought she was attractive.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 05, 2017, 03:05:07 PM
Quote from: Ryan741 on Jun 05, 2017, 02:59:21 PM
I thought she was attractive.

?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: lv_226 on Jun 05, 2017, 04:10:06 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.
What am I reading?

You do open up this discussion, potentially, to something that I see plagues the Alien series as a whole—the need for Ripley clones. This may contribute to people looking at Waterston and saying: "Oh no, not another "strong-resilient-woman-Ripley" archetype/character (which would be nullified given the success of Wonder Woman). However, for the purposes of this series it has becomes such a self-referential trope that I personally was glad to see the emphasis shift on David/Walter for the majority of Covenant' run-time.If anything challenges this series, it is the presence of self-referential tropes. I also think, and this may be a wider criticism needing its own thread,  but I don't believe the fans truly want something new/don't know what they want. NickisSmart, I believe, has provided some sound argumentation for this, and I believe that it is our own expectations, at the end of the day, that defeat the franchise.

If the formula worked, the series wouldn't have gotten stale. But, because Scott and Co. came and attempted to reinvigorate the series (by expanding the scope with Prometheus and changing the focus from human to non-human characters as principal protagonists), he took a creative risk that paid off for some and not for others. 

I, for one, am thankful that the series wasn't relegated to pure isolationist environments—this had been done to death. I really enjoyed some of the exterior shots of the Alien in Covenant, namely the shot of it rising in front of the Cathedral. That proves the beast is not cooked, but can still be used in new ways. Sorry, I started rambling here.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BigDaddyJohn on Jun 05, 2017, 04:11:53 PM
I think it's clearly disappointing, not a huge catastrophy with the worldwide results, but disappointing yes
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 05, 2017, 04:49:04 PM
Quote from: BigDaddyJohn on Jun 05, 2017, 04:11:53 PM
I think it's clearly disappointing, not a huge catastrophy with the worldwide results, but disappointing yes

And that is where it will probably land..   a bad result and roughly breaking even when everything is accounted for.  Extremely disappointing from the studio's point of view but not a studio crippler.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Predaker on Jun 05, 2017, 05:34:21 PM
Quote from: lv_226 on Jun 05, 2017, 04:10:06 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.
What am I reading?

You do open up this discussion, potentially, to something that I see plagues the Alien series as a whole—the need for Ripley clones. This may contribute to people looking at Waterston and saying: "Oh no, not another "strong-resilient-woman-Ripley" archetype/character (which would be nullified given the success of Wonder Woman). However, for the purposes of this series it has becomes such a self-referential trope that I personally was glad to see the emphasis shift on David/Walter for the majority of Covenant' run-time.If anything challenges this series, it is the presence of self-referential tropes. I also think, and this may be a wider criticism needing its own thread,  but I don't believe the fans truly want something new/don't know what they want. NickisSmart, I believe, has provided some sound argumentation for this, and I believe that it is our own expectations, at the end of the day, that defeat the franchise.

If the formula worked, the series wouldn't have gotten stale. But, because Scott and Co. came and attempted to reinvigorate the series (by expanding the scope with Prometheus and changing the focus from human to non-human characters as principal protagonists), he took a creative risk that paid off for some and not for others. 

I, for one, am thankful that the series wasn't relegated to pure isolationist environments—this had been done to death. I really enjoyed some of the exterior shots of the Alien in Covenant, namely the shot of it rising in front of the Cathedral. That proves the beast is not cooked, but can still be used in new ways. Sorry, I started rambling here.

That was said partly in jest, however there is some truth to it. It's not that people would see the poster and say to themselves, "I'm not seeing a movie with that ugly haircut!" but a contributing factor to what draws (or doesn't) audiences to gravitate towards seeing a film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: lv_226 on Jun 05, 2017, 06:20:00 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 05, 2017, 05:34:21 PM
Quote from: lv_226 on Jun 05, 2017, 04:10:06 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 04, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
I think Daniels haircut negatively affected ticket sales.
What am I reading?

You do open up this discussion, potentially, to something that I see plagues the Alien series as a whole—the need for Ripley clones. This may contribute to people looking at Waterston and saying: "Oh no, not another "strong-resilient-woman-Ripley" archetype/character (which would be nullified given the success of Wonder Woman). However, for the purposes of this series it has becomes such a self-referential trope that I personally was glad to see the emphasis shift on David/Walter for the majority of Covenant' run-time.If anything challenges this series, it is the presence of self-referential tropes. I also think, and this may be a wider criticism needing its own thread,  but I don't believe the fans truly want something new/don't know what they want. NickisSmart, I believe, has provided some sound argumentation for this, and I believe that it is our own expectations, at the end of the day, that defeat the franchise.

If the formula worked, the series wouldn't have gotten stale. But, because Scott and Co. came and attempted to reinvigorate the series (by expanding the scope with Prometheus and changing the focus from human to non-human characters as principal protagonists), he took a creative risk that paid off for some and not for others. 

I, for one, am thankful that the series wasn't relegated to pure isolationist environments—this had been done to death. I really enjoyed some of the exterior shots of the Alien in Covenant, namely the shot of it rising in front of the Cathedral. That proves the beast is not cooked, but can still be used in new ways. Sorry, I started rambling here.

That was said partly in jest, however there is some truth to it. It's not that people would see the poster and say to themselves, "I'm not seeing a movie with that ugly haircut!" but a contributing factor to what draws (or doesn't) audiences to gravitate towards seeing a film.

I think I see what you are getting at. I would use Wonder Woman as an example here: if she were unattractive—I think it is safe to assume that Gal Gadot is an attractive woman for a good amount of average moviegoers—I doubt she would have even been cast. Similarily, part of what I enjoyed about Noomi Rapace was that she doesn not look like any of the actresses in her current generation. She is very unique, has something of a Gothic sensibility to her, a foreign mystique if you will, and having seen her in Dragon Tattoo... I can see why Ridley wanted to include her in Prometheus. A very weird anecdote was when I had seen the first Dragon Tattoo film before Prometheus had ever been announced I wondered, "Man, I would really like to see this chick in an Alien film".
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Jun 05, 2017, 06:46:31 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 05, 2017, 02:22:42 PM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 04, 2017, 11:43:47 PM
Quote from: bananasalesperson on Jun 04, 2017, 09:18:23 PM

Ridley Scott went full Lucas on us.


Really? That unfounded bullshit again?

Isn't that the Youtube level? Can't we expect more inspired critique here?

There are elements of truth in it as he made the universe feel really small.  David creating the Xeno (currently according to ridley he is the creator and I accept this might change) is the Alien equal of Anakin creating C-3PO as a child.  Making a sci-fi franchise smaller is never a good thing.

Lucas and Scott are two completely different types of filmmakers, and just arbitrarily putting both in the same league is simply disingenuous. Covenant is shot, filmed, designed, and told in a completely different way than the Star Wars prequels, so please stop unless you acknowledge that you're a troll.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: XenoVC on Jun 05, 2017, 07:12:06 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 05, 2017, 02:22:42 PM
Quote from: Gash on Jun 04, 2017, 11:43:47 PM
Quote from: bananasalesperson on Jun 04, 2017, 09:18:23 PM

Ridley Scott went full Lucas on us.


Really? That unfounded bullshit again?

Isn't that the Youtube level? Can't we expect more inspired critique here?

There are elements of truth in it as he made the universe feel really small.  David creating the Xeno (currently according to ridley he is the creator and I accept this might change) is the Alien equal of Anakin creating C-3PO as a child.  Making a sci-fi franchise smaller is never a good thing.

C-3PO isn't the focus of the Star Wars films. They aren't dealing with him, or other Protocol droids as an antagonist.

If the Covenant has a bunch of Cats in stasis, and one of them is Jonesy's mom, then you'd have something there.

Quote from: Denton Smalls on Jun 05, 2017, 12:46:18 PM
Maybe Blu Ray sales will pick up slack.

They gave Requiem a major lift basically just a few short years before ITunes and Amazon took way off.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Seed-and-Weed on Jun 06, 2017, 03:09:20 AM
Quote from: SM on Jun 05, 2017, 08:23:27 AM
The current numbers are a week behind internationally, so it'll be interesting to see much some of the larger markets bring in (UK, Australia, South Korea, Germany, Russia).  Based on the drops from previous weeks, I can't imagine it'll make a great deal more.

China will make a bit, and Japan doesn't get a release till September.

I think it'll get past $200m, which will see it into the top 20 for the year, but there's probably about a dozen other films yet to be released that will wind up ahead of it.

Watching it last night I was struck by the fact that back when Alien and Aliens came out, there were a bunch of movies that mimicked them.  How many space horror movies are there now?  We had Life a few months back that didn't really do much.  Before that?  Apollo 18?  And both those films are tied to present day(ish) NASA stuff and not futuristic.  Maybe there's just not an appetite for this anymore to a mass audience.

Another thing I noticed in the trailers for Annabelle Creation and IT was this jump/cut frame sped up screaming in your face kind of scares.  And they're both in mundane settings.


Well, jump scares always work. Everyone know it's coming, but it's simply reflexive. Some emotional responses are just easier to provoke than others.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 06, 2017, 05:52:38 AM
They work up to a point.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Deadmeat on Jun 06, 2017, 03:59:46 PM
Welp. China was a dud.

See you guys in 10 years, I guess..? :D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 06, 2017, 04:32:41 PM
Quote from: Deadmeat on Jun 06, 2017, 03:59:46 PM
Welp. China was a dud.

See you guys in 10 years, I guess..? :D

What do you mean? It doesn't come out in China until 6/16.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Deadmeat on Jun 06, 2017, 04:34:48 PM
Will be, then. There will be no aliens in that cut so :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 06, 2017, 04:41:04 PM
Quote from: Deadmeat on Jun 06, 2017, 04:34:48 PM
Will be, then. There will be no aliens in that cut so :laugh:

?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 06, 2017, 04:42:55 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on Jun 06, 2017, 04:41:04 PM
Quote from: Deadmeat on Jun 06, 2017, 04:34:48 PM
Will be, then. There will be no aliens in that cut so :laugh:

?

True. No Alien in Chinese cut.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 06, 2017, 05:43:17 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 06, 2017, 04:42:55 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on Jun 06, 2017, 04:41:04 PM
Quote from: Deadmeat on Jun 06, 2017, 04:34:48 PM
Will be, then. There will be no aliens in that cut so :laugh:

?

True. No Alien in Chinese cut.

I still think we are not understanding something. There is no way you can cut that out and have the movie be anywhere near comprehensible.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: TeamXeno on Jun 06, 2017, 07:00:18 PM
Just crunching numbers
Box office worlwide: $174,080,096
Production budget: $97,000,000

So production is in the green by: $77,080,096

However marketing costs are probably about: $100,000,000

Which leaves us at: -$22,919,904

BUT Licensing royalties for merchandise (toys, comics, books, clothes, etc) probably accounts for: $50,000,000

Which would give us a profit of: $27,080,096

(By the way these numbers are rough estimates based around articles on movie marketing and merchandising royalties.)


Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 06, 2017, 07:09:16 PM
Quote from: TeamXeno on Jun 06, 2017, 07:00:18 PM
Just crunching numbers
Box office worlwide: $174,080,096
Production budget: $97,000,000

So production is in the green by: $77,080,096

However marketing costs are probably about: $100,000,000

Which leaves us at: -$22,919,904

BUT Licensing royalties for merchandise (toys, comics, books, clothes, etc) probably accounts for: $50,000,000

Which would give us a profit of: $27,080,096

(By the way these numbers are rough estimates based around articles on movie marketing and merchandising royalties.)

I'm no expert in the licensing and merch category but I have to believe Licensing and merch are no where near 50 million.  If you have some links to even rough estimates I'd love to read them.  Regardless of what they actually are I believe you are estimating alien merch and licensing as a total franchise, not individual covenant licensing and merch. That isn't counted because covenant isn't bringing it in.

It's sort of auxiliary Money streams that do benefit from having the alien name out in the theatre but aren't directly tied to covenant.

Also your numbers are wrong. The studio does not get that revenue from the box office.

So far they have gotten roughly

33 domestic
41 international

74 total against a rough 150-200 million dollar expenditure.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 06, 2017, 07:11:52 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 06, 2017, 04:42:55 PM
Quote from: Denton Smalls on Jun 06, 2017, 04:41:04 PM
Quote from: Deadmeat on Jun 06, 2017, 04:34:48 PM
Will be, then. There will be no aliens in that cut so :laugh:

?

True. No Alien in Chinese cut.

Wow. Makes you wonder why they even decided to distribute it at all.

I'm not sure the best editor in the world can spin that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jun 06, 2017, 08:31:31 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 06, 2017, 04:42:55 PM

True. No Alien in Chinese cut.

Is that a joke?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: TeamXeno on Jun 06, 2017, 08:40:20 PM
Robopanda ah yes I forgot the cut that theatres take. As for licensing 50 mil is probably more of year long estimate. The only actual figure I've found on licensing is Star Wars made $700,000,000 in fiscal year 2015 off of merchandising royalties.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM
Quote from: NickisSmart on Jun 06, 2017, 08:31:31 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 06, 2017, 04:42:55 PM

True. No Alien in Chinese cut.

Is that a joke?

Doesn't seem so. http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=57857.0

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

Quote"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

QuoteWhile Disney/Marvel's "Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2" is up over its first entry, that's the exception. Most long-term franchises have shown dropoffs. "Alien: Covenant" is the 12th big studio franchise sequel since Christmas, and preview-watching moviegoers are well aware how many still await them in coming weeks.

"Alien: Covenant" came soon after the two biggest franchises so far in 2017, "The Fate of the Furious" and "Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2," and right before the latest "Pirates" incarnation. That may have made it more vulnerable to customers deciding it was less essential than the ones preceding it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 06, 2017, 09:55:56 PM
Maybe it should have stuck with the August release date. We'll never know.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on Jun 07, 2017, 02:57:54 AM
The movie has no hope in China now. We can hope every adult in Japan sees the movie 20 times and we can maybe make production costs back. Have faith  :-\
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on Jun 07, 2017, 03:16:56 AM
Quote from: cucuchu on Jun 07, 2017, 02:57:54 AM
The movie has no hope in China now.

Depends if they're used to such things. Or if this (apparent) Fox edit simply put the emphasis elsewhere than the alien.

Weird as it appears it's hard to know as yet.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 07, 2017, 03:21:49 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

Quote"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

I disagree with the indiewire article summary.
- "Covenant" will not reach $300 million worldwide.
- If it did, it would do better than break even because that is more than 3 times its production budget.
- As for the other franchise movies, it's not about total box office but box office compared with the budget; besides the clear failure of AVP 2/R; "AVP" and "Ressurection" BO also didn't make 3 X their production budgets.

"Alien 3" barely did better than 3 X its production budget and Fox kept the franchise going with one mediocre performing film after another.
The only clear BO hit since "Alien 3" has been "Prometheus".

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 07, 2017, 05:28:25 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 07, 2017, 03:21:49 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

Quote"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

I disagree with the indiewire article summary.
- "Covenant" will not reach $300 million worldwide.
- If it did, it would do better than break even because that is more than 3 times its production budget.
- As for the other franchise movies, it's not about total box office but box office compared with the budget; besides the clear failure of AVP 2/R; "AVP" and "Ressurection" BO also didn't make 3 X their production budgets.

"Alien 3" barely did better than 3 X its production budget and Fox kept the franchise going with one mediocre performing film after another.
The only clear BO hit since "Alien 3" has been "Prometheus".

;)

And for a long time Prometheus wasn't considered such a hit...which by the way had always puzzled me.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 07, 2017, 12:20:09 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 07, 2017, 03:21:49 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

Quote"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

I disagree with the indiewire article summary.
- "Covenant" will not reach $300 million worldwide.
- If it did, it would do better than break even because that is more than 3 times its production budget.

Not sure what you are disagreeing with.  They think it WILL reach 300 WW.

They acknowledge that 300 is not enough (it isn't by a long shot).

Quote
- As for the other franchise movies, it's not about total box office but box office compared with the budget; besides the clear failure of AVP 2/R; "AVP" and "Ressurection" BO also didn't make 3 X their production budgets.

Deals with theaters were different back then regarding percentage splits.  Still AR was a box office failure.  Back then the cost of making the prints alone had to have been close to 4-5 million extra dollars.

Quote"Alien 3" barely did better than 3 X its production budget and Fox kept the franchise going with one mediocre performing film after another.
The only clear BO hit since "Alien 3" has been "Prometheus".

Fox keeps trying to value the property as a tentpole franchise instead of treating it like a niche film enjoyed considerably by a certain group. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 07, 2017, 03:22:21 PM
It was well on its way to a tentpole franchise post-Aliens. Remember that the first two movies were in the top 10 grossing films of their years.

The problem is the budgets are big but the scripts are absolutely terrible! Heck, even when the budget is low(AvPR) the script is terrible! They keep treating it as tentpole because honestly, it has the potential. I can't blame them.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prof. a on Jun 07, 2017, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 07, 2017, 03:21:49 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

Quote"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

I disagree with the indiewire article summary.
- "Covenant" will not reach $300 million worldwide.
- If it did, it would do better than break even because that is more than 3 times its production budget.
- As for the other franchise movies, it's not about total box office but box office compared with the budget; besides the clear failure of AVP 2/R; "AVP" and "Ressurection" BO also didn't make 3 X their production budgets.

"Alien 3" barely did better than 3 X its production budget and Fox kept the franchise going with one mediocre performing film after another.
The only clear BO hit since "Alien 3" has been "Prometheus".

;)

It's impossible to tell but a film doesn't need to triple its production budget to make a profit. So, on that metric, the article is not proven.

Let's look at some examples:

Elysium
Worldwide gross: 286 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 115 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 18 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491)

According to the IndieWire article, Elysium would've needed 345 million in worldwide gross to make profit. But, it made profit with slightly more than double its production budget

Monuments Men
Worldwide gross: 155 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 70 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 10 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491 (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491))

This film made about double its production budget and still made profit.

It really does differ from situation to situation. However, if a film needed triple its production budget, it would mean that barely any of the Alien films after the third one made any profit. Do you really think Fox would've made five more Alien films if that were the case?

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on Jun 08, 2017, 08:31:35 AM
AC had a massive PR budget. It was wall to wall, TV shows, internet, mainstream media. Domestic TV ads alone were in the region of $25M. I think they knew they had a problem, and tried to hype their way out of a hole.

If you work on a cost of 150M including PR and overheads, you need more than 300M to break even, even working on 50% return across the board. . We've been through the revenue breakdown before..

Why do you keep trying to spin this one way?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 08, 2017, 04:05:47 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

There is no way in hell Covenant is gonna pull $125m from Japan and China.  I'd be absolutely shocked if it hit $100m.  I suspect $50-75m to be a realistic number bringing the total worldwide to 250m.

So if there is another one, expect a huge budget cut.  One so big I've begun to joke that they might not be able to afford Fassbender.  Think typical "R" rated sort of budgets.  50-55m.  With that kinda cut don't expect Ridley in the directors chair either (he will continue to produce i suspect).




Quote from: Prof. a on Jun 07, 2017, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 07, 2017, 03:21:49 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

Quote"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

I disagree with the indiewire article summary.
- "Covenant" will not reach $300 million worldwide.
- If it did, it would do better than break even because that is more than 3 times its production budget.
- As for the other franchise movies, it's not about total box office but box office compared with the budget; besides the clear failure of AVP 2/R; "AVP" and "Ressurection" BO also didn't make 3 X their production budgets.

"Alien 3" barely did better than 3 X its production budget and Fox kept the franchise going with one mediocre performing film after another.
The only clear BO hit since "Alien 3" has been "Prometheus".

;)

It's impossible to tell but a film doesn't need to triple its production budget to make a profit. So, on that metric, the article is not proven.

Let's look at some examples:

Elysium
Worldwide gross: 286 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 115 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 18 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491)

According to the IndieWire article, Elysium would've needed 345 million in worldwide gross to make profit. But, it made profit with slightly more than double its production budget

Monuments Men
Worldwide gross: 155 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 70 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 10 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491 (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491))

This film made about double its production budget and still made profit.

It really does differ from situation to situation. However, if a film needed triple its production budget, it would mean that barely any of the Alien films after the third one made any profit. Do you really think Fox would've made five more Alien films if that were the case?



Associated costs going up (think about the additional need for advertising alone, more TV channels, the internet and social media, high prices for big spot commercials, etc) since Alien 3.  Theatres recently have demanded more take of the box office since either of those movie were release because they discovered they have the leveraging power that without theatres there would be no place to show the films themselves (there was a lot of nasty in-fighting between studios and theatre chains in the 00's.  Attack of the Clones is a f**king great example as Lucas took 100% of the first week sales.  That will never happen again.)

Prometheus made money.  How much it made is up for debate but at the end of the day it made something.  This film got funded off that films success.  If there is a next film the budget will be based on this films failure to connect with an audience or they will head in a massively different direction (PG-13).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 08, 2017, 07:14:56 PM
Profit or no, this movie is is still the second lowest grosser in the franchise, right above the most despised sequel perhaps on genre history (AvP:R), but cost twice as much to produce and market. I don't see Covenant being considered a flop, but there is no way this can be spun as an acceptable gross. For a franchise with 1-6 sequels planned, this was disastrous.  As an experiment in trying to be more commercial, it also failed. The Alien brand has declined with every film. Only Prometheus reversed that trend. All across the board, Prometheus did better, sometimes massively so. Profit or no, this movie still underperformed all the way up to the limit of how badly it could have failed before being considered a flop. Ridley's biggest flop will always be 1492: Conquest of Paradise. But Covenant might be Scott's biggest disappointment. They were clearly hoping for a sizeable profit and sequels in order to conclude their story. I doubt Fox will have any profit from this movie in their hands by the time Scott was hoping to film Covenant 2. The best we can hope for is a cheap Ridley Scott sequel to finish the trilogy, but even that might be too much to hope for. I think any future Alien movies will be pure genre product, focusing on lots of action and horror and spending less on talent.

The real question is, once these current heads of Fox are excused, will we get a proper Prometheus 2? I think they need to distance to themselves from the Alien brand and give us Visionary Ridley, not Hired Gun Ridley. Show us a visionary sequel and all is forgiven. If The Martian proved anything, it's that a sufficiently engaging human story does not require action scenes and gore. Audiences would have seen Paradise without the recasting and revamping and reintroduction of the beast. Your story has to be everything. Covenant dropped the ball on story in a gigantic way, and it introduced a new lead who really contributed nothing to the story besides being a Ripley stand in. The third and final movie should contain all of the story left to tell - no more withholding for sequels! Give us two hours of compelling story and keep the money you would have spent on action and movie stars. Sci-fi fans are sustained by visionary images and a story that takes us to uncharted territory with mindbending obstacles, but you have to care about your characters. Killing Shaw and sidelining the new female lead shows contempt for character. Action is something you include of you have an addition to it (Cameron, Bay, Blomkamp) off studio requires it. Let Ridley off that chain. He can command audience attention with pure vision. But they also have to stop frakking up any potential to develop strong human characters. Covenant was a disaster as a story and was almost a disaster commercially. The next movie needs to have an abundance of artistic integrity and no more Alien tropes.

Adapt and evolve or perish.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 08, 2017, 08:19:49 PM
Yeah, I love Alien, Aliens and Prometheus in equal measure, the but alien tropes were used to cynical effect in Covenant. They were treated lovingly, sparingly(thus more powerfully), and in a novel way in Prometheus.

I say bring back Lindelof, bring in another big star alongside Fassbender, and wrap it up. No more cute ambiguity.

Was it just me or was the story in Covenant... yikes, um, NON-EXISTENT. They land the ship, get off the ship, die, David delivers exposition we should have been treated to visually not through dialogue, they get back on the ship, die, THE END.

If Shaw was played by THERON like originally intended I don't think we'd be in as big a mess. She was still a big star pre-Covenant, while Rapace didn't gain in popularity, but Fassbender did. That's why they didn't care about chucking her, in addition to not being able to figure a story out for her. They would've fit her in as the lead someway had it been Theron.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 08, 2017, 08:21:01 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 08, 2017, 07:14:56 PM
Profit or no, this movie is is still the second lowest grosser in the franchise, right above the most despised sequel perhaps on genre history (AvP:R), but cost twice as much to produce and market. I don't see Covenant being considered a flop, but there is no way this can be spun as an acceptable gross. For a franchise with 1-6 sequels planned, this was disastrous.  As an experiment in trying to be more commercial, it also failed. The Alien brand has declined with every film. Only Prometheus reversed that trend. All across the board, Prometheus did better, sometimes massively so. Profit or no, this movie still underperformed all the way up to the limit of how badly it could have failed before being considered a flop. Ridley's biggest flop will always be 1492: Conquest of Paradise. But Covenant might be Scott's biggest disappointment. They were clearly hoping for a sizeable profit and sequels in order to conclude their story. I doubt Fox will have any profit from this movie in their hands by the time Scott was hoping to film Covenant 2. The best we can hope for is a cheap Ridley Scott sequel to finish the trilogy, but even that might be too much to hope for. I think any future Alien movies will be pure genre product, focusing on lots of action and horror and spending less on talent.

The real question is, once these current heads of Fox are excused, will we get a proper Prometheus 2? I think they need to distance to themselves from the Alien brand and give us Visionary Ridley, not Hired Gun Ridley. Show us a visionary sequel and all is forgiven. If The Martian proved anything, it's that a sufficiently engaging human story does not require action scenes and gore. Audiences would have seen Paradise without the recasting and revamping and reintroduction of the beast. Your story has to be everything. Covenant dropped the ball on story in a gigantic way, and it introduced a new lead who really contributed nothing to the story besides being a Ripley stand in. The third and final movie should contain all of the story left to tell - no more withholding for sequels! Give us two hours of compelling story and keep the money you would have spent on action and movie stars. Sci-fi fans are sustained by visionary images and a story that takes us to uncharted territory with mindbending obstacles, but you have to care about your characters. Killing Shaw and sidelining the new female lead shows contempt for character. Action is something you include of you have an addition to it (Cameron, Bay, Blomkamp) off studio requires it. Let Ridley off that chain. He can command audience attention with pure vision. But they also have to stop frakking up any potential to develop strong human characters. Covenant was a disaster as a story and was almost a disaster commercially. The next movie needs to have an abundance of artistic integrity and no more Alien tropes.

Adapt and evolve or perish.

I agree 100%.

BUT that sounds like a DREAM.

The realistic future sounds VERY BAD:

1.- Sir Ridley Scott left the Directors chair by his own decision.

2.- A CHEAPER Director(His Son Luke Scott).

3.- Maybe Michael Fassbender DOESN'T return.

4.- SMALL Budget like 50-55 Millions.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 08, 2017, 08:29:32 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 08, 2017, 04:05:47 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

There is no way in hell Covenant is gonna pull $125m from Japan and China.  I'd be absolutely shocked if it hit $100m.  I suspect $50-75m to be a realistic number bringing the total worldwide to 250m.

So if there is another one, expect a huge budget cut.  One so big I've begun to joke that they might not be able to afford Fassbender.  Think typical "R" rated sort of budgets.  50-55m.  With that kinda cut don't expect Ridley in the directors chair either (he will continue to produce i suspect).




Quote from: Prof. a on Jun 07, 2017, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 07, 2017, 03:21:49 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 06, 2017, 08:47:33 PM

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/06/alien-covenant-box-office-flop-series-1201837669/

Quote"Alien: Covenant" will be one of the franchise's lowest-grossing entries, second only to 2007's "Aliens Vs. Predator – Requiem," which made $52 million domestic in adjusted numbers. Three weeks in, "Alien: Covenant" is at $67 million domestic against a $97 million budget; after Japan and China open, expect it to hit about $300 million worldwide, which means theatrical won't be enough for it to break even.

I disagree with the indiewire article summary.
- "Covenant" will not reach $300 million worldwide.
- If it did, it would do better than break even because that is more than 3 times its production budget.
- As for the other franchise movies, it's not about total box office but box office compared with the budget; besides the clear failure of AVP 2/R; "AVP" and "Ressurection" BO also didn't make 3 X their production budgets.

"Alien 3" barely did better than 3 X its production budget and Fox kept the franchise going with one mediocre performing film after another.
The only clear BO hit since "Alien 3" has been "Prometheus".

;)

It's impossible to tell but a film doesn't need to triple its production budget to make a profit. So, on that metric, the article is not proven.

Let's look at some examples:

Elysium
Worldwide gross: 286 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 115 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 18 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491)

According to the IndieWire article, Elysium would've needed 345 million in worldwide gross to make profit. But, it made profit with slightly more than double its production budget

Monuments Men
Worldwide gross: 155 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 70 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 10 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491 (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491))

This film made about double its production budget and still made profit.

It really does differ from situation to situation. However, if a film needed triple its production budget, it would mean that barely any of the Alien films after the third one made any profit. Do you really think Fox would've made five more Alien films if that were the case?



Associated costs going up (think about the additional need for advertising alone, more TV channels, the internet and social media, high prices for big spot commercials, etc) since Alien 3.  Theatres recently have demanded more take of the box office since either of those movie were release because they discovered they have the leveraging power that without theatres there would be no place to show the films themselves (there was a lot of nasty in-fighting between studios and theatre chains in the 00's.  Attack of the Clones is a f**king great example as Lucas took 100% of the first week sales.  That will never happen again.)

Prometheus made money.  How much it made is up for debate but at the end of the day it made something.  This film got funded off that films success.  If there is a next film the budget will be based on this films failure to connect with an audience or they will head in a massively different direction (PG-13).

It's speculation.

I never said it's information.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on Jun 08, 2017, 09:58:11 PM
Give it time. In a few years, someone will reboot the series and find a way to close this story and bridge to the first (or perhaps will just make a sequel film that ignores the prequel arc entirely). I can't see Fox giving Ridley cart blanche to finish what he started since this isn't doing big business and I anticipate a different filmmaker picking up the gauntlet down the road. Unless, of course, it really rakes it in from sales and rentals and they let Ridley go one more round-- but that seems unlikely right?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BonesawT101 on Jun 08, 2017, 10:35:04 PM
He'll probably get his third film albeit with a much smaller budget.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 09, 2017, 08:03:34 AM
According to boxofficemojo.com Covenant did very well in Asia as for R-rated movie.

Hong Kong: 3,360,017   
Indonesia: 1,865,891
Malaysia: 1,596,825   
Singapore: 1,008,013
South Korea: 9,571,227
Taiwan: 2,317,536
Thailand: 1,101,257

But looking at Europe's biggest markets with comparison to Prometheus it's total disaster:

France: 8,683,517 / Prometheus 15,842,943
Germany: 4,652,610 / Prometheus 14,049,633
Spain: 3,865,007 / Prometheus 13,144,422
UK: 15,881,032 / Prometheus 39,899,425   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 09, 2017, 08:28:03 AM
"This movie [Prometheus] has two children: One of these children grows up to be Alien, but the other child is going to grow up, and God knows what happens to them. And that's what the sequel to Prometheus would be."

If only they stuck to that plan...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 09, 2017, 08:42:20 AM
http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/movies/alien/49933/alien-covenant-where-its-box-office-leaves-the-series

QuoteIf Fox plump for the latter option, then they still have another option open to them: the long-mooted Alien 5, or at least a movie that continues the Alien narrative from Alien: Resurrection onwards rather than prior to the events of the 1979 original. Ridley Scott may be reluctant to let other directors play around with the series he brought about with Alien, but with the film industry being as reliant on financial success as it is, the veteran filmmaker could yet find himself pushed aside.

Even accepting the reality that Alien: Covenant hasn't soared at the box office, the franchise as a whole still has a valuable market surrounding it - books, videogames, comics and other merchandise. We'd be surprised if Fox didn't want to keep the film series going in some form, though the results of the past few weeks may leave the studio wondering whether the franchise needs a new direction, a fresh pair of eyes - and maybe a splash of new blood.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on Jun 09, 2017, 12:49:27 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 09, 2017, 08:42:20 AM
http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/movies/alien/49933/alien-covenant-where-its-box-office-leaves-the-series

QuoteIf Fox plump for the latter option, then they still have another option open to them: the long-mooted Alien 5, or at least a movie that continues the Alien narrative from Alien: Resurrection onwards rather than prior to the events of the 1979 original. Ridley Scott may be reluctant to let other directors play around with the series he brought about with Alien, but with the film industry being as reliant on financial success as it is, the veteran filmmaker could yet find himself pushed aside.

Even accepting the reality that Alien: Covenant hasn't soared at the box office, the franchise as a whole still has a valuable market surrounding it - books, videogames, comics and other merchandise. We'd be surprised if Fox didn't want to keep the film series going in some form, though the results of the past few weeks may leave the studio wondering whether the franchise needs a new direction, a fresh pair of eyes - and maybe a splash of new blood.

Pretty much agree with their assessment. If you base the future of the franchise solely on the box office performance of Covenant, things seem quite grim. But the value of the IP is what gives me hope that Fox will still put some proper investment into the franchise and continue one way or another with more films. There are over 10 relatively new directors that I can name right off that I think could bring something exciting to the franchise.

For right now though the big questions are: Will Ridley Scott get to finish his prequel series with one more film and how soon? If the answer to that question is yes, then it seems likely that it would need to be happen sooner rather than later due to his age. If they stick to his plan of shooting next year then we should be hearing confirmation of the movie being given the go-ahead from the studio later this year.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 09, 2017, 03:31:06 PM
At this point I'd like for Ridley to get a chance to finish his prequel trilogy, but no more after that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: LastSurvivor92 on Jun 10, 2017, 01:34:54 PM
Yeah, Ridley just do one more and be done. I don't think we need more than 3 prequel films. His idea of having like 4 to 6 is kind of ridiculous in my opinion. Ridley really needs to start thinking about who will helm these films after him. One big thing he needs to understand is that it's not "His" franchise. You could basically say that for James Cameron, David Fincher, hell even Jean-Pierre Jeunet.

Anyone else ready for a new director/fresh vision after Ridley's 3rd film??
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 426Buddy on Jun 10, 2017, 01:51:28 PM
I definitly think Riddles prequels should be a trilogy. I enjoyed AC but i think one more and done is the way to go.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on Jun 10, 2017, 04:26:19 PM
Quote from: Chronicle on Jun 10, 2017, 01:34:54 PM
Yeah, Ridley just do one more and be done. I don't think we need more than 3 prequel films. His idea of having like 4 to 6 is kind of ridiculous in my opinion. Ridley really needs to start thinking about who will helm these films after him. One big thing he needs to understand is that it's not "His" franchise. You could basically say that for James Cameron, David Fincher, hell even Jean-Pierre Jeunet.

Anyone else ready for a new director/fresh vision after Ridley's 3rd film??

Yeah, he's lucky if he gets one more film. I think he and Fox execs will have a hard conversation about this, he'll get even less of a budget for the final one, and they will bring in a half dozen more screenwriters to retool whatever script they have right now to make it lead right into Alien. I have a sense they will actually use quite a lot of Spaihts' original Alien: Engineers script to accomplish that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 10, 2017, 04:43:50 PM
If that Spaihts guy was so good, and you guys keep referencing him all the time, why didn't they utilize his works more?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 10, 2017, 04:56:25 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 10, 2017, 04:43:50 PM
If that Spaihts guy was so good, and you guys keep referencing him all the time, why didn't they utilize his works more?

Good point. Plus, Collider asked Lindelof about the direction after Covenant instead of Spaihts, and that's even with Lindelof not being involved with the project. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on Jun 10, 2017, 05:51:24 PM
Quote from: shawsbaby on Jun 10, 2017, 04:26:19 PM


Yeah, he's lucky if he gets one more film. I think he and Fox execs will have a hard conversation about this, he'll get even less of a budget for the final one, and they will bring in a half dozen more screenwriters to retool whatever script they have right now to make it lead right into Alien. I have a sense they will actually use quite a lot of Spaihts' original Alien: Engineers script to accomplish that.

I'd like to know the backstory. Who made the changes?

I'm pretty certain Ridley was hogtied by the studio into grafting in the Alien bollocks. It's a typical dumbass production move. 'More Aliens!'
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 10, 2017, 06:01:15 PM
Quote from: 900SL on Jun 10, 2017, 05:51:24 PM
Quote from: shawsbaby on Jun 10, 2017, 04:26:19 PM


Yeah, he's lucky if he gets one more film. I think he and Fox execs will have a hard conversation about this, he'll get even less of a budget for the final one, and they will bring in a half dozen more screenwriters to retool whatever script they have right now to make it lead right into Alien. I have a sense they will actually use quite a lot of Spaihts' original Alien: Engineers script to accomplish that.

I'd like to know the backstory. Who made the changes?

I'm pretty certain Ridley was hogtied by the studio into grafting in the Alien bollocks. It's a typical dumbass production move. 'More Aliens!'

Perhaps, Scott went through an Alien3 type of treatment by Fox.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 10, 2017, 06:13:32 PM
QuoteFox's Alien: Covenant earned another $475,000 yesterday (-59%) on just 1,814 screens for a likely $1.6m (-61%) fourth weekend and $70.7m 24-day total. It's doing okay overseas ($176m thus far) and it has China on tap for next weekend, but this is still a big disappointment for all involved. In terms of domestic tickets sold, it's the second-worst of the series behind Alien vs. Predator: Requiem.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/10/friday-box-office-baywatch-drops-50-alien-continues-to-crash/#63d44a671280
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 10, 2017, 08:29:15 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 10, 2017, 06:13:32 PM
QuoteFox's Alien: Covenant earned another $475,000 yesterday (-59%) on just 1,814 screens for a likely $1.6m (-61%) fourth weekend and $70.7m 24-day total. It's doing okay overseas ($176m thus far) and it has China on tap for next weekend, but this is still a big disappointment for all involved. In terms of domestic tickets sold, it's the second-worst of the series behind Alien vs. Predator: Requiem.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/10/friday-box-office-baywatch-drops-50-alien-continues-to-crash/#63d44a671280
The $176m figure they give for overseas is actually the world wide total, including domestic, according to Box Office Mojo. The actual overseas number as of yesterday was $107m. Domestic looks like it will top out nearly $20 million short of the production budget, which cannot be a good thing by any metric.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: acrediblesource on Jun 11, 2017, 03:12:37 PM
If his idea of Alien movies now are showing less of a forbodding world and more of a complex structure of androids, genetic variations of our creature, and willy nilly baby girls romping about trying to shoot things, then count me out.
Aliens universe now merging with Star Wars.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on Jun 11, 2017, 05:32:39 PM
After this weekend, it's at $71.2 million domestic, $107.5 international, so around $178.7 total. Hopefully China gives it a nice boost.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 05:53:11 PM
I don't think its possible for the Chinese market to make up for the money they lost domestically. This movie might stay in the red forever. It won't make enough money to shift its overall ranking in the franchise, either. I'm surprised nobody has called it a flop, given that it will end up with roughly half of Prometheus's gross and Fox will almost certainly lose millions. Some people consider Prometheus a bomb. What does that make Covenant? Clearly people are being nice about this result when its actually rather disastrous.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: shawsbaby on Jun 11, 2017, 06:36:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 05:53:11 PM
I don't think its possible for the Chinese market to make up for the money they lost domestically. This movie might stay in the red forever. It won't make enough money to shift its overall ranking in the franchise, either. I'm surprised nobody has called it a flop, given that it will end up with roughly half of Prometheus's gross and Fox will almost certainly lose millions. Some people consider Prometheus a bomb. What does that make Covenant? Clearly people are being nice about this result when its actually rather disastrous.

True. In the press, it's being described as low performing but no one has cited it as a "flop" for whatever reason. Then again, "Alien 3" underperformed and they still greenlighted "Resurrection" a few years later, so perhaps there's enough residual franchise money and strength that Fox is okay with another round and hoping for better results?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 10:02:45 PM
Quote from: shawsbaby on Jun 11, 2017, 06:36:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 05:53:11 PM
I don't think its possible for the Chinese market to make up for the money they lost domestically. This movie might stay in the red forever. It won't make enough money to shift its overall ranking in the franchise, either. I'm surprised nobody has called it a flop, given that it will end up with roughly half of Prometheus's gross and Fox will almost certainly lose millions. Some people consider Prometheus a bomb. What does that make Covenant? Clearly people are being nice about this result when its actually rather disastrous.

True. In the press, it's being described as low performing but no one has cited it as a "flop" for whatever reason. Then again, "Alien 3" underperformed and they still greenlighted "Resurrection" a few years later, so perhaps there's enough residual franchise money and strength that Fox is okay with another round and hoping for better results?
I doubt the franchise is totally dead, but when faced with a clear downward trend, making 6 more in the near future is suicidal. Even making one moreIt's a franchise that needs to have a drought between episodes, because demand isn't very high but the bar for creativity is. Marvel can crank out movies because its fan-base is used to serialized storytelling (they don't want it to end) and the writers have been experimenting with the story possibilities for decades. The makers of the Alien movies are still figuring out what makes these movies tick, and until they do, they can't make reliable new ones.

I say finish up the trilogy with a strong connection to Prometheus, while leaving Alien mostly alone. Don't try to explain the Space Jockey as a recent event. Wrap up Prometheus and then mothball the franchise for 5+ years while mulling over the perfect comeback story. They are better off associating future movies with Prometheus, anyway, because it did twice as well financially and got slightly better scores.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 11, 2017, 10:07:30 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 10:02:45 PM

I say finish up the trilogy with a strong connection to Prometheus, while leaving Alien mostly alone. Don't try to explain the Space Jockey as a recent event. Wrap up Prometheus and then mothball the franchise for 5+ years while mulling over the perfect comeback story. They are better off associating future movies with Prometheus, anyway, because it did twice as well financially and got slightly better scores.

Agreed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Jun 11, 2017, 10:29:58 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 05:53:11 PM
I don't think its possible for the Chinese market to make up for the money they lost domestically. This movie might stay in the red forever. It won't make enough money to shift its overall ranking in the franchise, either. I'm surprised nobody has called it a flop, given that it will end up with roughly half of Prometheus's gross and Fox will almost certainly lose millions. Some people consider Prometheus a bomb. What does that make Covenant? Clearly people are being nice about this result when its actually rather disastrous.

Almost everything you post is false. China and Japan's markets have yet to come in. Prometheus made Fox a boatload of money; this idea of yours that it cost Fox millions in losses is hilarious.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 11, 2017, 11:31:46 PM
Quote from: shawsbaby on Jun 11, 2017, 06:36:10 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 05:53:11 PM
I don't think its possible for the Chinese market to make up for the money they lost domestically. This movie might stay in the red forever. It won't make enough money to shift its overall ranking in the franchise, either. I'm surprised nobody has called it a flop, given that it will end up with roughly half of Prometheus's gross and Fox will almost certainly lose millions. Some people consider Prometheus a bomb. What does that make Covenant? Clearly people are being nice about this result when its actually rather disastrous.

True. In the press, it's being described as low performing but no one has cited it as a "flop" for whatever reason. Then again, "Alien 3" underperformed and they still greenlighted "Resurrection" a few years later, so perhaps there's enough residual franchise money and strength that Fox is okay with another round and hoping for better results?

What will decide if "Covenant" just underperforms (like the Alien/AVP movies since "Alien 3") or is a flop, will be the box office from China and Japan. 

Keep in mind that there are only 3 movies in the Alien/AVP franchise that are clear hits; which have made more than 3 times their production budget.
"Alien", "Aliens" and "Prometheus".

- However, so far no movie in the franchise has made less than double its production budget; a sign of being a flop.
"Ghost in the Shell" and "King Arthur: Legend of the Sword" recently flopped because they did not make double their production budgets.

We'll see about "Covenant".

;)

PS.
I paid better attention to the sources for box office and budget and it turns out that;
- "Aiien 3" and "AVP-R" (due to its very low budget) also had box office over 3X their production budgets.
That explains the go ahead for "Resurrection".
With "Requiem", it was a cheap film that paid for its expenses but considering the viewer response (4.7/10 on IMDb) and its 12% Rotten Tomatoes score, it wasn't going to continue the franchise. 
- Anyway, here is a better listing of the numbers. (Getting the columns straight was tough.) :)

Alien / AVP box office ratios

         box office  / budget = ratio
               (in millions)

Alien         104      11        9.45
Aliens       131      18.5      7.08
Alien 3      159      50        3.18
Alien 4      161      75        2.15
AVP          172      60         2.87
AVP-R       128      40         3.2
Prometh.   403      130       3.2
Covenant   ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 12:50:25 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Jun 11, 2017, 10:29:58 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 11, 2017, 05:53:11 PM
I don't think its possible for the Chinese market to make up for the money they lost domestically. This movie might stay in the red forever. It won't make enough money to shift its overall ranking in the franchise, either. I'm surprised nobody has called it a flop, given that it will end up with roughly half of Prometheus's gross and Fox will almost certainly lose millions. Some people consider Prometheus a bomb. What does that make Covenant? Clearly people are being nice about this result when its actually rather disastrous.

Almost everything you post is false. China and Japan's markets have yet to come in. Prometheus made Fox a boatload of money; this idea of yours that it cost Fox millions in losses is hilarious.
Prometheus was a hit, perhaps even a big one, I agree. It's Covenant that might lose money. The conventional wisdom is that a movie needs to make at least double its budget to break even. In this case, that would be about $194m, and Covenant isn't even close to that number, and it's almost impossible for it to make that money during the rest of its theatrical run. When all is said and done, I expect Fox to post a small loss.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on Jun 12, 2017, 01:19:30 AM
i don't think movie do very well on china.

Alien scene get cut a lot and No 3d
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 01:53:14 AM
Quote from: gantarat on Jun 12, 2017, 01:19:30 AM
i don't think movie do very well on china.

Alien scene get cut a lot and No 3d
Variety says: "Chinese regulators have long found graphic sex, extreme violence, politics, religion, superstition and horror to be taboo subjects. Chinese film makers are slowly grappling with the horror genre and trying to push the boundaries, but the results are mostly mild compared with some western movies."

So:
-No 3D
-Horror
-Extreme violence
-Sex/nudity
-Religion

Some of these things resulted to cuts in the film, and the marketplace in China right now is apparently pretty crowded with big imports. Also, I'm pretty sure Prometheus is the only Alien movie to ever get a theatrical release in China, meaning that being more "Alien" and less "Prometheus" might actually hurt it. They like sci-fi but not horror, and they liked Prometheus but haven't seen Alien. All of this is working against Covenant.

We will know in a week.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 12, 2017, 05:48:24 AM
covenant is sitting at around 178 now globally. .it needs another 16 mil to hit double. .between china and japan i am sure it will get to at least 200, wich still won't mean that it actually made a profit. .cause it needs to make some extra to cover marketing. .but it wont go down as one of those full out flops of 2017. .like for instance Life, King Arthur, Ghost in the shell, The space between us, a Cure for wellness, Power Rangers, Baywatch, Chips. .theirs plenty more. .mone of those made double their budget. .some are even struggling to make back their budget once. .covenant is underperforming and a box office dissapointment. .but not a full out bomb like those i mentioned above. .


not to mention that nearly all those movies was a critical flops as well. .at least covenant got a decent critical responce. .the china cut's been butchered so i don't have high hopes and by the time it hits japan it will likely already be out on dvd, so no major numbers in either countries is what i am expecting. .but i really hope i am wrong and think it deserved a much better B0. .i am just so worried we might not get a sequel. .wich would leave my little fanboy hearth wripped and torn to shreads!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 12, 2017, 08:10:15 AM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 12, 2017, 05:48:24 AM
i am just so worried we might not get a sequel.

That is very possible since "Covenant" (in terms of box office compared with the budget) is going to do about as well as "Resurrection" did.
And we know how A4 worked out in terms of sequels.

Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 12, 2017, 05:48:24 AM
.wich would leave my little fanboy hearth wripped and torn to shreads!

I liked "Covenant" a lot.
But in a way my fanboy heart would welcome a rest from what Ridley is saying about David and the xenomorph.
Maybe it's a good thing that "Covenant" might be the last Alien movie made by Scott. (And overall I'm a Ridley Scott fan.)
- If Scott was done with Alien, I hope that would give the Fox studio a chance to fit the old canon with "Covenant" and reestablish the continuity of the franchise which is in the novelization.   

Maybe it's time for an AVP film?

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 12, 2017, 08:33:18 AM
@BB15. .yeah i know the likelyhood of a sequel is looking slimmer now after the poor BO, but i kinda enjoyed prom and covvie a hell of a lot and i did not mind david and were it was going either. .i wanted scott to finish what he started with at least one more prequel. .even if scott only acted as producer, but oh well. .now everything is in jeapordy and this might mean the end of the franchise.

Suppose another avp is the  next best thing. .hopefully that would be the worst case scenario.


Current Box Office Update
US - 71.2
Overseas - 110.4
= Global - 181.6
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: newagescamartist on Jun 12, 2017, 06:26:40 PM
If we get another AVP I hope it's a straight up reboot. While I enjoyed both AVPs for what they were, they seemed more like straight up Predator movies that happened to have xenomorphs in them. And they were cheesy of course. I'd love a very serious, well acted, frightening movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 12, 2017, 06:58:06 PM
. .i felt the same. .and the pradator does not have the same screen presence as the xeno. .not in a million years. .love those guys but i always rooted for the xeno's. .it did not help that the charaters in both avp films where so underwhelming. .i wanted every human character to f**king die in the worst possible way. .lol. .and the father and son getting chest bursted while on a hunting trip. .that was one of my favorite moments. .especially the son. .so glad the bambi killing little c**t did not get spared. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 08:48:32 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 01:53:14 AM
So:
-No 3D
-Horror
-Extreme violence
-Sex/nudity
-Religion

Unbelievable. What are they watching there? Cartoons?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 12, 2017, 09:33:19 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 08:48:32 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 01:53:14 AM
So:
-No 3D
-Horror
-Extreme violence
-Sex/nudity
-Religion

Unbelievable. What are they watching there? Cartoons?

Every theater shows the movie Pleasantville 24/7 lol.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 09:40:31 PM
Foreign gross $110,379,620 as of  6/11/17

Worldwide $181,618,411   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 09:42:40 PM
It's definitely getting somewhere.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 09:48:43 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 09:42:40 PM
It's definitely getting somewhere.

It will stop here. Nothing will change till Chinese and Japanese releases. China is an enigma. It might be between 20 to 50 millions or maybe even more. Hard to say. Japan probably 15-20. Covenant will reach 220+.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 10:09:23 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 09:48:43 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 09:42:40 PM
It's definitely getting somewhere.

It will stop here. Nothing will change till Chinese and Japanese releases. China is an enigma. It might be between 20 to 50 millions or maybe even more. Hard to say. Japan probably 15-20. Covenant will reach 220+.
One publication sad the Covenant needs up to $450m to break even. I wonder what the minimum it needs is.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jun 12, 2017, 11:02:36 PM
Another BO bomb for the Fassbender show. Hackwood was unusually lenient with this one but now its time to say byebye big budget career --
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Jun 12, 2017, 11:37:48 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jun 12, 2017, 11:02:36 PM
Another BO bomb for the Fassbender show. Hackwood was unusually lenient with this one but now its time to say byebye big budget career --

What an interesting post. You should be proud of yourself.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jun 12, 2017, 11:54:35 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 10:09:23 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 09:48:43 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 09:42:40 PM
It's definitely getting somewhere.

It will stop here. Nothing will change till Chinese and Japanese releases. China is an enigma. It might be between 20 to 50 millions or maybe even more. Hard to say. Japan probably 15-20. Covenant will reach 220+.
One publication sad the Covenant needs up to $450m to break even. I wonder what the minimum it needs is.

How could that be when Prometheus made less, yet cost more, and we still got a sequel.

IMO the movie is a success.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jun 13, 2017, 12:23:44 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Jun 12, 2017, 11:37:48 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jun 12, 2017, 11:02:36 PM
Another BO bomb for the Fassbender show. Hackwood was unusually lenient with this one but now its time to say byebye big budget career --

What an interesting post. You should be proud of yourself.

Thanks. Welcome to the internet!

Does anybody know why the viral spots for Covenant are extra listed as short movies on imdb? Does that maybe implicate that marketing for AC might have been a bit more expensive than for Prometheus in this area? I mean Prometheus had viral marketing too but no 'Last supper' etc.

edit: ah actually the Weyland TED is listed.. but for example the David viral is not. :confused: Is there a system for these things?
edit2: nevermind, its listed too///


Still ACs viral campaign looked a bit more ambitious to me. Weylands TED is some one man green screen video short, Prometheus' David spot doesnt even have a director listed etc.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 13, 2017, 01:28:34 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jun 12, 2017, 11:54:35 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 10:09:23 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 09:48:43 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 09:42:40 PM
It's definitely getting somewhere.

It will stop here. Nothing will change till Chinese and Japanese releases. China is an enigma. It might be between 20 to 50 millions or maybe even more. Hard to say. Japan probably 15-20. Covenant will reach 220+.
One publication sad the Covenant needs up to $450m to break even. I wonder what the minimum it needs is.

How could that be when Prometheus made less, yet cost more, and we still got a sequel.

IMO the movie is a success.
That's a good point, but the publication I was citing said "as much as $450m", or something like that, which means there must be a low end, a number that the movie could make "as little as" and break even. The budget plus prints and ads multiplied by two is probably closer to $300m. Covenant will still probably fall tens of millions short of that figure, I imagine.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 13, 2017, 02:26:50 AM
The $450m break even number sounds ridiculously high.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 13, 2017, 03:25:42 AM
It's probably closer to $291-330mm, if we 3x multiply the reported $97mm or $110mm budget.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 13, 2017, 03:39:25 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 13, 2017, 03:25:42 AM
It's probably closer to $291-330mm, if we 3x multiply the reported $97mm or $110mm budget.
The cost of prints and advertising need to be included, as well. Prints still cost something and there was plenty of advertising. Maybe it's somewhere in the $300-400m range.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Stolen on Jun 13, 2017, 05:50:51 AM
No way.
$ 250M would be enough to make it a success!

The Fox wouldn't lose money with this BO:
-> 75M$ Domestic
-> 120M$ Foreign
-> 40M$ China

You don't have to take into account the promo budget, this one is refunded by the extras (domestic and foreign home Entertainment, domestic vod, domestic pay tv, domestic network tv, foreign pay tv) 
Home Entertainment +/- 100M$
Pay TV (Vod+Network) +/- 150M$
And the Alien franchise is a huge business, so a significant merchandise revenue. And relaunch all sales of previous episodes!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jun 13, 2017, 07:45:24 AM
Quote from: SM on Jun 13, 2017, 02:26:50 AM
The $450m break even number sounds ridiculously high.

I am inclined to agree.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 13, 2017, 08:29:16 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 10:09:23 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 12, 2017, 09:48:43 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 09:42:40 PM
It's definitely getting somewhere.

It will stop here. Nothing will change till Chinese and Japanese releases. China is an enigma. It might be between 20 to 50 millions or maybe even more. Hard to say. Japan probably 15-20. Covenant will reach 220+.
One publication sad the Covenant needs up to $450m to break even. I wonder what the minimum it needs is.

Elijah; it's hard for me to believe that a movie has to make 4.5 times its production budget to break even.
If this was true, then most big budget Hollywood films should be money losers where some might earn a little profit years later after video/streaming.
- Using the 4.5 times its production budget formula just to break even, the first two new Star Trek movies were flops. Why would Paramount make a sequel to "Star Trek" (2009) if it lost hundreds of millions of dollars?
- Same with "Prometheus". Why would Fox do a sequel if that was a money loser?
- Look at Disney / Marvel. Using this 4.5 production budget formula; the first two Iron Man movies were flops.

** Yet the studios keep making sequels to movies which have box office about 3 times the production budget.
- What is going on with these 4.5 times production budget estimates?
Imo one thing has to do with notorious Hollywood accounting.
- Basically the studios set up shell companies to produce a movie and this company takes a loss while the studio gets the money.
Then the studio company can claim a loss to pay lower fees, But in reality the studio is making money. 

- From Wikipedia about Hollywood accounting;

QuoteExpenditures can be inflated to reduce or eliminate the reported profit of the project, thereby reducing the amount which the corporation must pay in royalties or other profit-sharing agreements, as these are based on the net profit...

A WB receipt was leaked online, showing that the hugely successful movie Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix ended up with a $167 million loss on paper.[22] This is especially unusual, given that, without inflation adjustment, the Harry Potter film series is the second highest-grossing film series of all time...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

* Imo one measure of box office success of a movie is whether the studio makes an immediate sequel.
"Star Trek" (2009) was a hit which led to "Star Trek Into Darkness". That was a hit which led to "Star Trek Beyond".
But "Star Trek Beyond" was clearly a flop because it did not make 2 x its production budget in theaters.
- Same with "Iron Man". It was a hit which led to "Iron Man 2" which also was a hit.

* Successful films in theaters (which get sequels) keep coming back to movies which have box office about 3+ times the production budget.
- This is the problem with "Covenant". It will probably crawl above 2x its production budget but it needed to be over $300 million to be a clear box office winner.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 13, 2017, 10:54:19 AM
in 2016 their was this word they invented. .sequelitis. .like a disease that are attached to sequels. .i kept reading articles about new releases and i am a little facinated by the numbers. .a good example of a movie that suffered from that was ninja turtles: out of the shadows. .first movie was aparently not great, but it was a reboot and everyone wanted to go watch it. .few were impressed, but it was a box office success. .then came the sequel. .it got a better critical reception and was a way better movie in every regard. .yet audiences was so put of by the first movie that they never bothered to watch the sequel. .  It did not even double it's budget and their is no current plans for a sequel. .i think covenant might have a slight case of sequalites. .not everyone loved prom like i did or most people on here did. .it might have effected covenants BO performance. .just a theory?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 13, 2017, 11:07:34 AM
The economics of franchise pictures are more complex than that (and no movie needs to earn 4 times its budget to break even).

You have to take into account the boost they provide to the brand: Rentals of older movies in the franchise, merchandising sales and deals, etc. The original Alien is still a huge seller because the franchise is kept alive and relevant by newer movies, for example.

Covenant is definitely a huge disappointment, ending up with just over half the gross of Prometheus, but don't be so quick to write the franchise off. There will be huge re-adjustments for sure, though. Expect to hear more later in the year.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 13, 2017, 04:16:29 PM
To be fair...Prometheus did not have nearly as much competition...Covenant was dropped into a sea of other major releases...plus covenant had a significantly bigger age restriction,...where as Prometheus was sold as a sci-fi...covenant was more of a horror flick...add to that no 3D and how lately it seems that only either Superhero or Disney and Dreamworks animations count...if Prom was released now in this current climate it would not have made 402 mil...no way...we must also bear in mind that maybe the new generation of audiences are not even familiar with the original movies...let alone care about them..sad state of affairs...us fans might be a dying breed....i hope not..
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Jun 13, 2017, 05:07:28 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 10:09:23 PM
One publication said that Covenant needs up to $450m to break even. I wonder what the minimum it needs is.

Which publication is this?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 900SL on Jun 13, 2017, 05:59:59 PM
I would have thought $320M would be getting close to breaking even. Working on a 50% o/all return to the Studio on a production marketing & distribution cost of $160M
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 13, 2017, 07:06:37 PM
320 mil...is still a very distant number...lets hope it gets their....that number will almost certainly ensure a sequel..
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 13, 2017, 07:13:12 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jun 13, 2017, 05:07:28 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 12, 2017, 10:09:23 PM
One publication said that Covenant needs up to $450m to break even. I wonder what the minimum it needs is.

Which publication is this?
https://www.moviefone.com/2017/05/22/alien-covenant-box-office-disappointment/ (https://www.moviefone.com/2017/05/22/alien-covenant-box-office-disappointment/)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: ripley161 on Jun 13, 2017, 07:19:24 PM
I am going to be so Dissapointed if we don't get a sequel !
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 13, 2017, 07:42:37 PM
Quote from: ripley161 on Jun 13, 2017, 07:19:24 PM
I am going to be so Dissapointed if we don't get a sequel !
dude you have no idea,not getting a sequel to this will drive me nuts...dreams and nightmares made prometheus come alive...hm,m...hello covenant:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 13, 2017, 11:08:47 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Jun 13, 2017, 05:50:51 AM
No way.
$ 250M would be enough to make it a success!

The Fox wouldn't lose money with this BO:
-> 75M$ Domestic
-> 120M$ Foreign
-> 40M$ China

You don't have to take into account the promo budget, this one is refunded by the extras (domestic and foreign home Entertainment, domestic vod, domestic pay tv, domestic network tv, foreign pay tv) 
Home Entertainment +/- 100M$
Pay TV (Vod+Network) +/- 150M$
And the Alien franchise is a huge business, so a significant merchandise revenue. And relaunch all sales of previous episodes!

Ok this is entirely wrong.

I feel like people are retreading the same incorrect information time and time again. Those numbers you are putting down are absolutely wild guesses that don't have much basis in the reality of covenant.

Alien merchandise in absolutely not a big deal in terms of revenue. Hardly any franchise merchandise is outside of children's movies Star Wars and comics.  Aliens isn't even a blip on the merchandise radar. It's a hard r series it virtually can't have a merch presence.

It does have ways to make money. But it won't be profitable from the box office. Probably a ways off considering it's absolute flop in the domestic market.

Overall it may pull even. But fox isn't investing hundreds of millions to just about pull even (and lose money when discussing inflation).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 13, 2017, 11:45:54 PM
The basic formula used to be budget X 3 for a sequel to be considered.  I don't know how true it was then or now, but $300m would be the target for Covenant.

The $450m figure doesn't have any data to back it up, and there's a tonne of different factors involved - particularly if you consider major parts of the marketing - Last Supper, The Crossing, etc - would have been shot during principal photography and wouldn't have required additional marketing budget to produce.  And that's before you involve Hollywood accounting.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Stolen on Jun 14, 2017, 05:53:12 AM
@robopadna
You're right, Covenant is a domestic and overall failure because it's half the amount of Prometheus! But with a budget of $100M, and if it works properly in China and Japan ($ 30M and $ 10M) Fox won't lose money. Still big dissapointing, but not a flop.

We must stop thinking that the promotional budget is refunded at the box office, it is absolutely false. The promo budget is always based on how much the movie will return in sales outside the BO, which are huge enough for blockbuster.

Broadcast TV rights (domestic and foreign) are generally very juicy for studios, between $100M and $200M for a blockbuster. And we can't neglect the home entertainment, the franchise Alien has always had an added value in this sector.

And the merchandising for the Alien franchise is obviously less important than others like Star Wars or Marvel.
Yet the license sells very well, and the adult public always responds commercially to new products.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 14, 2017, 05:59:21 AM
How well does it sell?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 14, 2017, 07:28:05 AM
I'm always curious about those figures but don't think it's ever really talked about. I'd love to know how well the novels and the Audibles do. Seems to sell well enough to warrant more being made on a pretty regular basis.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SiL on Jun 14, 2017, 07:34:45 AM
The only time I think they ever gave any indication of how well merchandise went was Dark Horse's first AvP, which was the best-selling independent comic of all time when it was released.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 14, 2017, 07:38:57 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 14, 2017, 07:34:45 AM
The only time I think they ever gave any indication of how well merchandise went was Dark Horse's first AvP, which was the best-selling independent comic of all time when it was released.
Whoa! Suddenly, the existence of the AvP movies makes some sense to me.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 14, 2017, 07:42:59 AM
Quote from: SiL on Jun 14, 2017, 07:34:45 AM
The only time I think they ever gave any indication of how well merchandise went was Dark Horse's first AvP, which was the best-selling independent comic of all time when it was released.

I think they still report comic sales.

Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 14, 2017, 07:38:57 AM
Whoa! Suddenly, the existence of the AvP movies makes some sense to me.

There was a good decade or so between the two events though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SiL on Jun 14, 2017, 08:42:09 AM
To be fair that was only because the Alien camp killed Briggs' version of it in the mid 90s to do A:R. Interest was there, but rights weren't.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 14, 2017, 10:03:04 AM
Briggs' version would be too expensive. That's what killed it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SiL on Jun 14, 2017, 10:10:16 AM
Could've been brought down with rewrites. Hill and Giler didn't want the crossover to happen and wouldn't relinquish the rights. John Davis said he spent years trying to get the rights in order.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 14, 2017, 10:46:19 AM
There was also talk of there being big fights over the money. Briggs' did do a rewrite but that second draft has never surfaced. I think he said he'd gotten rid of some of the action pieces.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jun 14, 2017, 12:02:21 PM
Quote from: Prof. a on Jun 07, 2017, 08:16:43 PM

It's impossible to tell but a film doesn't need to triple its production budget to make a profit. So, on that metric, the article is not proven.

Let's look at some examples:

Elysium
Worldwide gross: 286 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 115 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 18 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491)

According to the IndieWire article, Elysium would've needed 345 million in worldwide gross to make profit. But, it made profit with slightly more than double its production budget

Monuments Men
Worldwide gross: 155 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Reported production budget: 70 million (boxofficemojo.com)
Profit: 10 million (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491 (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/sony-hack-reveals-top-secret-754491))

This film made about double its production budget and still made profit.

It really does differ from situation to situation. However, if a film needed triple its production budget, it would mean that barely any of the Alien films after the third one made any profit. Do you really think Fox would've made five more Alien films if that were the case?

If funds involved investors who want good returns, then the profits might have to be much larger. Otherwise, they might not invest in future films in the franchise.



Some interesting points are raised here:

"Steven Spielberg and George Lucas predict film industry 'implosion'"

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2013/jun/13/steven-spielberg-george-lucas-film-industry

That is, studios are in competition with each other, needing tent-pole flicks to cover low earnings and even losses for other movies, requiring high profits to cover investors' demands for better returns, and thus relying more on marketing, lots of special effects, and simple story lines to attract international audiences.

This is probably why expectations were very high for this movie, and why even small profits or a lengthy period through merchandising to earn more might lead to delays, if not cancellation, of future films.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: JohnnyChimpo on Jun 14, 2017, 12:58:21 PM
Without derailing the thread too much - but its kinda come up in conversation now anyway - does anyone know how well stuff like NECA figures sell?

I'd love to see a breakdown on which figures sell the best, i.e.; Which movie has the best selling figures, from each individual movie which is the best selling figure etc. I'd be interested to know how the numbers stack up in terms of Alien v Aliens v Alien 3 v Resurrection v Prometheus etc. And then driving down deeper into the numbers, how many people buy an Alien Queen v a figure of Hudson or Bishop or whatever. Finally, it would be interesting to see the best selling Ripley figure (seen as she was ever present in the original movies).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jun 14, 2017, 02:40:50 PM
^I am sure they all sell pretty well as they keep making the things.

As for early 90s AvP movie, I heard that the AVP Capcom arcade game was supposedly based on the movie, as it was intended to come out around the same time.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jun 15, 2017, 01:38:37 PM
Quote from: Stolen on Jun 14, 2017, 05:53:12 AM
@robopadna
You're right, Covenant is a domestic and overall failure because it's half the amount of Prometheus! But with a budget of $100M, and if it works properly in China and Japan ($ 30M and $ 10M) Fox won't lose money. Still big dissapointing, but not a flop.

We must stop thinking that the promotional budget is refunded at the box office, it is absolutely false. The promo budget is always based on how much the movie will return in sales outside the BO, which are huge enough for blockbuster.

If we are talking about the box office then focus on the box office.  The costs are the same.  The promotional budget has nothing to do with the sales outside of the box office.  It is spent before that ever happens (there are other costs like participations, residuals and production costs for digital and physical sales)

QuoteBroadcast TV rights (domestic and foreign) are generally very juicy for studios, between $100M and $200M for a blockbuster. And we can't neglect the home entertainment, the franchise Alien has always had an added value in this sector.

That is absolutely not the case in covenant.  In no terms is this movie a blockbuster.  Suicide Squad pulled in 150 million between foreign and domestic tv rights and then another 130 or so in rentals (there are costs associated with thoseas well, but not terribly high ones)

That movie was a giant blockbuster (something like 800 ww?). This movie will not even come close to that level of interest or sales.  These numbers are not known (rental/buys can't be known yet) but I expect them to largely be in line with other comps.

QuoteAnd the merchandising for the Alien franchise is obviously less important than others like Star Wars or Marvel.
Yet the license sells very well, and the adult public always responds commercially to new products.

Some recent analysis basically shows if you aren't an animated kid film, comic book based movie, or star wars...  your merchandise does nothing in terms of profit.  Sure, Alien will generate more merch money than a movie without any merchandise (moonlight, for example), but it is insignificant.

Again, we are talking box office and this movie will not break even through that avenue.  It's absolute flop in the domestic market virtually ensures that.  Now there are other avenues a movie can make money, like you said, and other costs associated with them.  It will probably break even through those avenues.

Overall Fox does not make movies and invest all that money to essentially break even.  They want to actually turn a profit.  They do love this franchise though and keep over valuing it relation to how audiences actually perceive it.

My guess is that if it even comes close to break even, they will let Ridley finish out the prequel trilogy.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 16, 2017, 03:32:26 PM
QuoteALIEN: COVENANT debuted on Friday in 1st place with est. ¥76M/¥72M ($11.2M/$10.6M) including/without ticketing fees. @AlienAnthology

https://twitter.com/ChinaBoxOffice/status/875729425773600770
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 16, 2017, 03:39:21 PM
. .thats alreasy more or less the amount it needed to double it's budget. .so horay. .i am just confused with the 4 different figures. .are those different currency's or various estimates?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Jun 16, 2017, 03:40:47 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 16, 2017, 03:32:26 PM
QuoteALIEN: COVENANT debuted on Friday in 1st place with est. ¥76M/¥72M ($11.2M/$10.6M) including/without ticketing fees. @AlienAnthology

https://twitter.com/ChinaBoxOffice/status/875729425773600770

Shit. That's f**king decent!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jun 16, 2017, 03:52:49 PM
does anyone know if this a good opening in china or not?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on Jun 16, 2017, 03:55:30 PM
Yeah, is this good? I've got no idea, I don't really know how this stuff works.  :D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jun 16, 2017, 03:57:18 PM
Quote from: Evanus on Jun 16, 2017, 03:55:30 PM
Yeah, is this good? I've got no idea, I don't really know how this stuff works.  :D

??? Me neither, where is Robopadna when you need him!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 16, 2017, 04:01:19 PM
the mummy was number one last weekend and it overtook that movie. .so i would say it's done decently so far. .tho this might just be curiosity on it's first day and it might fall heavily tommorrow. .considering the cuts. .but it made something today and i am so happy it did!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Jun 16, 2017, 04:02:35 PM
Yes, it is a good opening day and it is on track for a $30million weekend there.

Apparently word-of-mouth is really poor so the $10million firday is better than expected.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jun 16, 2017, 04:05:23 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jun 16, 2017, 04:02:35 PM
Yes, it is a good opening day and it is on track for a $30million weekend there.

Apparently word-of-mouth is really poor so the $10million firday is better than expected.

That's encouraging then. 30 mil would be a great start
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 16, 2017, 04:34:28 PM
i hope if this weekend does well it will have some legs in  china. .so glad it is of to a good start. .i thouight with the cuts it would be lucky if it made 10 mil tops over it's entire run. .now lets hope it's . BIG IN JAPAN!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Jun 16, 2017, 04:36:31 PM
It's quite good. Might even do similar numbers as Prometheus. The only problem with China box office money is that the studio actually gets very little of it. It's not a 50/50 split.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 16, 2017, 04:45:50 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jun 16, 2017, 04:36:31 PM
It's quite good. Might even do similar numbers as Prometheus. The only problem with China box office money is that the studio actually gets very little of it. It's not a 50/50 split.
. .i know it's like 25 to 30 percent or something like that. .but it saved pacific rim wich has now gotten a sequel in the works. .i would never understand why that movie performed so badly in the states. . I thought it was ten times better than those transformer movies and the beasts was so cool. .same with kong skull island. .considering the cost it underperformed. .but still i thought it was spectacular. .loved the soundtrack as well!. .and it was way better than jurassic world. .in every regard. .yet according to the box office. .it was'nt. .wtf is up with audiences these days?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 16, 2017, 06:02:58 PM
$10 milllion in one day. Great news? No. It's bloody great news.

@juxtapose

I love Parific Rim. Great movie. It's too bad it didn't do well at box office. Transformers franchise is full of ...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 16, 2017, 06:06:26 PM
Hollywood is currently renogotiating its deal with China, in order to get more money, so establishing a foothold there is a huge win.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 16, 2017, 06:17:34 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jun 16, 2017, 04:36:31 PM
It's quite good. Might even do similar numbers as Prometheus. The only problem with China box office money is that the studio actually gets very little of it. It's not a 50/50 split.

It's much better that Prometheus in his first week.

Date(Weeks)                   Gross(M)   Total Gross
12-09-17 - 12-09-23 (3)   $4.9        $34.0
12-09-10 - 12-09-16 (2)   $9.3        $29.0
12-09-03 - 12-09-09 (1)   $15.3      $19.7
12-08-27 - 12-09-02 (0)   $4.4         $4.4
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 16, 2017, 06:19:42 PM
The chinese market is bigger now than it was back in 2012. Covenant will end up with $50-60 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 16, 2017, 06:24:13 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Jun 16, 2017, 06:19:42 PM
The chinese market is bigger now than it was back in 2012. Covenant will end up with $50-60 million.

I hope. It's got a good start but Prometheus was 3D and it wasn't butchered by censorship as Covenant. Besides Transformers will slaughter all next week.



QuoteAnd here we are, yet again, with a somewhat disappointing genre offering hoping against hope that China will pull them out of the fire. Ridley Scott's Alien: Covenant opened with a pretty decent $11.2 million yesterday, including online ticketing fees and including $750,000 from midnight previews. The 20th Century Fox release, which cost a fiscally reasonable $97m (Prometheus cost $130m in 2012), sputtered out pretty quickly in North America, earning $36m over its debut weekend and just $72m as it enters its fifth weekend with a likely under-$1m Fri-Sun frame. That's lower than what the original Alien made ($78m) way back in 1979.

The picture has done a little better overseas, with (including yesterday's China launch) $122 million thus far for a current $194m worldwide total not including whatever it made overseas between Monday and Thursday. So, yeah, it's probably over $200m worldwide and may be at around $215-$220m by Sunday. It won't come anywhere near the $405m earned by Prometheus five years ago. An over/under $250m worldwide cume for an R-rated horror movie is nothing to snark at, even if Fox was arguably hoping for something better. This is a longer conversation for another day, but I still maintain that Prometheus: Covenant (or just Covenant) would have been a better sell.

Alien is a franchise that has been around but hasn't been a huge deal since Aliens in 1986. Sure, it's still the biggest horror franchise of all time with $1.454 billion worldwide over eight movies (yes, counting the Alien vs. Predator films), but this isn't a great result and I imagine some hard questions will be asked about where the franchise goes next, or if it goes anywhere at all. I say this a lot, but it is entirely okay to allow one of these old-school franchises to die a natural death just because the time has come. But I digress.

We're probably looking at a $30 million opening weekend in China. There aren't a ton of options for Chinese horror fans, which partially explains why Resident Evil: The Final Chapter and The Mummy relatively broke out. But the film is heavily edited, with much of the violence/gore removed, and audiences aren't thrilled about that. At this juncture, a $60m total would be a gift, especially with Transformers: The Last Knight set to make $60m in its first minute in China (slight exaggeration) next week. Alien: Covenant is not a flop, but it's not really a hit either.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/16/china-box-office-alien-covenant-nabs-11m-friday-tom-cruises-the-mummy-drops-85/#2ed92842764d
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 16, 2017, 06:38:26 PM
. .from what i heard. .prom was even more butchered. .the scenes suffering the most was the medpod scene. .the end scene with the engineer versus the ovegrown facehugger, the fifield monster attack..the milburn and fifield misadventure with the spacecobra/hammerpede. .etc.
. .that was what one chinese memeber said on these board a while back. .before the 19th of may. .but i can't remember in which thread. .?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 16, 2017, 06:39:25 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 16, 2017, 06:24:13 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Jun 16, 2017, 06:19:42 PM
The chinese market is bigger now than it was back in 2012. Covenant will end up with $50-60 million.

I hope. It's got a good start but Prometheus was 3D and it wasn't butchered by censorship as Covenant. Besides Transformers will slaughter all next week.



QuoteAnd here we are, yet again, with a somewhat disappointing genre offering hoping against hope that China will pull them out of the fire. Ridley Scott's Alien: Covenant opened with a pretty decent $11.2 million yesterday, including online ticketing fees and including $750,000 from midnight previews. The 20th Century Fox release, which cost a fiscally reasonable $97m (Prometheus cost $130m in 2012), sputtered out pretty quickly in North America, earning $36m over its debut weekend and just $72m as it enters its fifth weekend with a likely under-$1m Fri-Sun frame. That's lower than what the original Alien made ($78m) way back in 1979.

The picture has done a little better overseas, with (including yesterday's China launch) $122 million thus far for a current $194m worldwide total not including whatever it made overseas between Monday and Thursday. So, yeah, it's probably over $200m worldwide and may be at around $215-$220m by Sunday. It won't come anywhere near the $405m earned by Prometheus five years ago. An over/under $250m worldwide cume for an R-rated horror movie is nothing to snark at, even if Fox was arguably hoping for something better. This is a longer conversation for another day, but I still maintain that Prometheus: Covenant (or just Covenant) would have been a better sell.

Alien is a franchise that has been around but hasn't been a huge deal since Aliens in 1986. Sure, it's still the biggest horror franchise of all time with $1.454 billion worldwide over eight movies (yes, counting the Alien vs. Predator films), but this isn't a great result and I imagine some hard questions will be asked about where the franchise goes next, or if it goes anywhere at all. I say this a lot, but it is entirely okay to allow one of these old-school franchises to die a natural death just because the time has come. But I digress.

We're probably looking at a $30 million opening weekend in China. There aren't a ton of options for Chinese horror fans, which partially explains why Resident Evil: The Final Chapter and The Mummy relatively broke out. But the film is heavily edited, with much of the violence/gore removed, and audiences aren't thrilled about that. At this juncture, a $60m total would be a gift, especially with Transformers: The Last Knight set to make $60m in its first minute in China (slight exaggeration) next week. Alien: Covenant is not a flop, but it's not really a hit either.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/16/china-box-office-alien-covenant-nabs-11m-friday-tom-cruises-the-mummy-drops-85/#2ed92842764d

Well then, I guess we're stuck with what's effectively a "Shrodinger's-edition" origin story. Perhaps for the best. The debate will continue and the franchise still maintains (somewhat of) a semblance of the original's genre-defining mysteriousness...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 16, 2017, 06:41:45 PM
It still might do $40-50. Maybe even $60. Fingers crossed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Denton Smalls on Jun 16, 2017, 08:25:53 PM
It would be ironic if the version of the latest Alien movie that makes the most money is the version where it's not an Alien movie.  :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ulm on Jun 17, 2017, 05:57:35 PM
I guess the Chinese don't mind Katherine Waterston's hairstyle?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 18, 2017, 12:04:49 PM
https://twitter.com/Boxofficindia/status/876392469558067200

Apparently it earned 9.73 M in its second day, that's almost 21 M already, which by the way is half of what Nostromo cost Weyland-Yutani in unadjusted dollars.

Prometheus earned 4.4 M in its opening week.

We're talking about 60 M easily.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 18, 2017, 12:48:05 PM
. .this is great news. .!. .go covenant!. .that also means that word of mouth must be generally ok!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 18, 2017, 03:27:36 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 18, 2017, 12:04:49 PM
https://twitter.com/Boxofficindia/status/876392469558067200

Apparently it earned 9.73 M in its second day, that's almost 21 M already, which by the way is half of what Nostromo cost Weyland-Yutani in unadjusted dollars.

Prometheus earned 4.4 M in its opening week.

We're talking about 60 M easily.

60 M? No way, Transformers will kill every single movie next week.


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCmHa0CXkAAzrw1.jpg:large)

4.6M on Sunday.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 18, 2017, 04:25:16 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 18, 2017, 03:27:36 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 18, 2017, 12:04:49 PM
https://twitter.com/Boxofficindia/status/876392469558067200

Apparently it earned 9.73 M in its second day, that's almost 21 M already, which by the way is half of what Nostromo cost Weyland-Yutani in unadjusted dollars.

Prometheus earned 4.4 M in its opening week.

We're talking about 60 M easily.

60 M? No way, Transformers will kill every single movie next week.


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCmHa0CXkAAzrw1.jpg:large)

4.6M on Sunday.
I know it will kill. But it ain't out till the 23th. Prometheus earned 34 M in the end...why can't Covvie earn 60 M?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Feeds On Minds on Jun 18, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Ugh..I was hoping Covenant would kill any chance of old Scott making more of these.. 
Still got my fingers crossed he's not allowed to do any further damage to the series.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 18, 2017, 05:07:20 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 18, 2017, 03:27:36 PM

60 M? No way, Transformers will kill every single movie next week.


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCmHa0CXkAAzrw1.jpg:large)

4.6M on Sunday.

Went up to 7.08 Million for Sunday. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 426Buddy on Jun 18, 2017, 05:19:36 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on Jun 18, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Ugh..I was hoping Covenant would kill any chance of old Scott making more of these.. 
Still got my fingers crossed he's not allowed to do any further damage to the series.

After Alien: Resurrection and the AvP films, there really isn't any more damage that could be done imo. I don't mind this new direction, i'de be happy if Scott was allowed to do one more.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 18, 2017, 05:34:39 PM
Quote from: 426Buddy on Jun 18, 2017, 05:19:36 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on Jun 18, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Ugh..I was hoping Covenant would kill any chance of old Scott making more of these.. 
Still got my fingers crossed he's not allowed to do any further damage to the series.

After Alien: Resurrection and the AvP films, there really isn't any more damage that could be done imo. I don't mind this new direction, i'de be happy if Scott was allowed to do one more.

Agreed. Let Riddles finish his trilogy,
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 18, 2017, 05:51:07 PM
I could do without more of Ridley's prequels but I'd hate to spoil Fox from doing any more Alien films at all.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 18, 2017, 06:00:04 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on Jun 18, 2017, 04:28:52 PM
Ugh..I was hoping Covenant would kill any chance of old Scott making more of these.. 
Still got my fingers crossed he's not allowed to do any further damage to the series.
Something better happened, imo:

It made enough that to series could continue under Scott.

But it also underperformed, and when Fox reads the reviews and comments, they will get the answer to the question of whether Prometheus would have been more successful as a direct Alien prequel. In other words, they overvalued the Alien brand and undervalued Prometheus. Fans seem to be slowly realizing this, also. Imagine if the bombing of Blade Runner was attributed to a lack of xenos and Scott made an immediate follow-up without Deckard but crawling with aliens? You can't recreated a past success. No Star Wars film has outperformed A New Hope. Most franchises trend downwards. And Scott has made four sci-fi movies that were great without being sequels to established franchises. Fox should stop recreating and start creating.

They will rethink the Alien prequel idea, again, which I think is good. Scott, Rothman, and Lindelof were vindicated in their belief that audiences want something fresh. Next time, they should listen to Scott more and hire a screenwriter with a fresh take, like Spaihts and Lindelof had. If (or, imo, when) that movie does better than Covenant, then they have definitive proof that fresh takes reinvigorate franchises and painting by the numbers slowly milks them dry.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 18, 2017, 06:17:55 PM
Scott will probably hand over the reigns to someone new and stay on board as a producer.
He'll soon be 80, has a full slate and a big enough ego to not be very content with the lukewarm reception of Covenant. Not to mention that Fox will most definitely demand a lower budget. I guess around $75 million or so.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 18, 2017, 06:19:54 PM
That won't happen. Ridley has more energy than any do us and will see this as a challenge to make an even better movie. He doesn't back down. Why do you guys always say that! You're here aren't you? We're all superfans. Everyone here should know that Ridley isn't like that by now.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 18, 2017, 07:10:45 PM
if fox allows scott to make another prequel he will. .his like a dog with a bone. .he won't let go that easily. .he loved making prom and covenant and i for one loved watching them. .


sitting now at 215.0 mil worldwide. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: newagescamartist on Jun 18, 2017, 07:59:02 PM
Prometheus and Covenant also got pretty decent reviews too so it's not like everyone universally hates those two movies. I think it's easier to get caught up in the negativity when discussing this stuff with hardcore fans. I bet Fox lowers the budget, and Scott will make one more.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on Jun 18, 2017, 10:13:15 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 18, 2017, 03:27:36 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 18, 2017, 12:04:49 PM
https://twitter.com/Boxofficindia/status/876392469558067200

Apparently it earned 9.73 M in its second day, that's almost 21 M already, which by the way is half of what Nostromo cost Weyland-Yutani in unadjusted dollars.

Prometheus earned 4.4 M in its opening week.

We're talking about 60 M easily.

60 M? No way, Transformers will kill every single movie next week.


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCmHa0CXkAAzrw1.jpg:large)

4.6M on Sunday.

China Watch Doraemon ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 18, 2017, 10:13:28 PM
Quote from: newagescamartist on Jun 18, 2017, 07:59:02 PM
Prometheus and Covenant also got pretty decent reviews too so it's not like everyone universally hates those two movies. I think it's easier to get caught up in the negativity when discussing this stuff with hardcore fans. I bet Fox lowers the budget, and Scott will make one more.
Good point about the reviews. Fox might chalk up the middling performance of the movie to an overall poor summer, lots of competition, and franchise fatigue. They can try again, hopefully with a fresher approach more akin to Prometheus. Lots of the reviews indicated that Covenant should have been more ambitious with the story rather than retreading familiar ground.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 01:08:22 AM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Jun 18, 2017, 06:17:55 PM
Scott will probably hand over the reigns to someone new and stay on board as a producer.
He'll soon be 80, has a full slate and a big enough ego to not be very content with the lukewarm reception of Covenant. Not to mention that Fox will most definitely demand a lower budget. I guess around $75 million or so.

All interesting questions about whether there will be another prequel, if so who will direct and what will be the budget?
Kane's guesses fit the projections about final box office.

* What is known is that "Covenant" BO is now at about $215 million worldwide.
- From that I can speculate that it will end up in the $225 to $230 million range.
That would be underperforming but OK. Taking the ratio of box office divided by production budget; "Covenant" will probably do a little better than "Resurrection" and a little worse than "AVP".

- If there is another Alien movie, imo it would get something like the budget for "Life", in the $58 million range.
Such a budget could push out Ridley Scott from directing it.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on Jun 19, 2017, 01:12:39 AM
How much Studios get money/share from $215 million ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 19, 2017, 01:14:26 AM
Forbes is basically confirming A:C is screwed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Aquarius8 on Jun 19, 2017, 01:41:17 AM
After topping the China Box Office "Covenant" becomes the 2nd Highest Grossing film in the Alien Franchise Globally.  Ridley Scott's "Alien Prequel Series" has crossed 600 Million at the Global Box Office and about 200 Million at the Domestic Box Office:

Prometheus
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $126,477,084      31.4%
+ Foreign:    $276,877,385      68.6%
= Worldwide:    $403,354,469   

A:Covenant
Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $72,660,985      33.8%
+ Foreign:    $142,300,000      66.2%
= Worldwide:    $214,960,985   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 19, 2017, 02:52:46 AM
Sorry guys, no more Alien films for a few years. (https://www.forbes.com/sites/robcain/2017/06/18/alien-covenant-falls-flat-in-china-day-2/)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anthony on Jun 19, 2017, 03:53:31 AM
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 19, 2017, 04:20:21 AM
Hahaha, good one.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jun 19, 2017, 05:39:31 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 19, 2017, 02:52:46 AM
Sorry guys, no more Alien films for a few years. (https://www.forbes.com/sites/robcain/2017/06/18/alien-covenant-falls-flat-in-china-day-2/)

Just the writer's opinion. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 19, 2017, 06:20:39 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jun 19, 2017, 05:39:31 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 19, 2017, 02:52:46 AM
Sorry guys, no more Alien films for a few years. (https://www.forbes.com/sites/robcain/2017/06/18/alien-covenant-falls-flat-in-china-day-2/)

Just the writer's opinion.

Yup. Like... an apology isn't needed aha. :D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 19, 2017, 07:30:18 AM
it still has monday to thursday to make some extra bucks in china. .it might be as much as another 10 to 15 mil. With the arival of Transformers next weekend every movie currently on the chinese circuit  will nosedive of a cliff. .so next weekend i think another 5 mil sounds about right for covenant and then by the end of it's run i am guessing about 25 mil added to the 215 it's already make. .then japan in september another 20 mil. .so 260 final global sounds like my best guess. .obviously i hope it does more. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 07:41:45 AM
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/china-box-office-alien-covenant-scares-up-30m-debut-1014609

Just under $30 million over the weekend over all. Honestly, that's more than I was expecting.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 19, 2017, 08:43:05 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 07:41:45 AM
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/china-box-office-alien-covenant-scares-up-30m-debut-1014609

Just under $30 million over the weekend over all. Honestly, that's more than I was expecting.
Same, and Prometheus made $34 million there in total.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 08:54:48 AM
Do we know where that figure was reported for Prometheus?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 09:11:38 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 08:54:48 AM
Do we know where that figure was reported for Prometheus?

http://english.entgroup.cn/602960/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 09:18:26 AM
You're a gent. Thank you, Ingwar.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 09:20:54 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 09:18:26 AM
You're a gent. Thank you, Ingwar.

I don't know how legit it is but it's all we got. Besides, since you're in good relations with Fox you might ask them :)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 09:26:30 AM
I don't want you all to misjudge my communication with them. I'm not privy to financial information or their super secrets plans or anything like that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 09:28:27 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Jun 19, 2017, 09:26:30 AM
I don't want you all to misjudge my communication with them. I'm not privy to financial information or their super secrets plans or anything like that.

Hicks, I was kidding ;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 04:21:17 PM
Quote from: gantarat on Jun 19, 2017, 01:12:39 AM
How much Studios get money/share from $215 million ?

Roughly overall, 1/2 of the box office goes to the studio.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 05:04:39 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 04:21:17 PM
Quote from: gantarat on Jun 19, 2017, 01:12:39 AM
How much Studios get money/share from $215 million ?

Roughly overall, 1/2 of the box office goes to the studio.

;)

Domestically yes, but not from the foreign markets. It's more complex that 50/50 share.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 06:53:13 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 05:04:39 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 04:21:17 PM
Quote from: gantarat on Jun 19, 2017, 01:12:39 AM
How much Studios get money/share from $215 million ?

Roughly overall, 1/2 of the box office goes to the studio.

;)

Domestically yes, but not from the foreign markets. It's more complex that 50/50 share.

I wrote "Roughly overall". I wanted to give a short answer and imo about 50% was an OK brief description.

But as you point out box office can be complicated.
So, for you I'll be more clear with a long answer.

- It's true that the studio's share of box office varies by country where the film is being shown. 

QuoteThe percentage of revenues that the exhibitor takes in depends on the individual contract for that film — which in turn depends on how much muscle the distributor has, according to Stone...

generally, how much of the domestic box office revenue goes to the studios?...
if a film only makes $10 million at the box office, the distributor will get only 45 percent of that money. But if a film makes $300 million at the box office, then the distributor gets up to 60 percent of that money...

According to the book The Hollywood Economist by Edward Jay Epstein, studios take in about 40 percent of the revenue from overseas release
http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable

- So in the end, these calculations are rough guesses.
It is possible for a studio to take in from 45% to 60% of US box office and 40% of overseas box office (which is also a guess since box office varies by country).
I don't know the specific percentages for each movie because those are secret but I'll first use a 50/40 US/overseas spit and then a possible best case for the studio of a 60/40 US/overseas split as described in the io9 article.

* 50/40 US/overseas split;
- Using that, for a film like "Star Trek (2009)" which had 2/3 of its box office in the US, that would mean about 47% goes to the studio.
With "Star Trek Into Darkness" which has about a 50/50 US/overseas box office split, about 45% would go to the studio.
For "Prometheus" where overseas box office was 68.6%, then about 43% went to the studio.
And with the "Covenant" numbers so far, where 66.2% of box office is coming from overseas, again about 43% would go to the studio.

* 60/40 US/overseas split;
- Again, for "Star Trek (2009)" which had 2/3 of its box office in the US, that would mean about 54% goes to the studio.
"Star Trek Into Darkness" and its about 50/50 US/overseas box office split, about 50% would go to the studio.
"Prometheus" where overseas box office was 68.6%, then about 46% went to the studio.
finally with the "Covenant" numbers so far, where 66.2% of box office is coming from overseas, about 47% would go to the studio.

- The actual US/overseas split I can only guess would be somewhere in this range of outcomes. 

* Considering that gantarat asked a simple question, I think that the short answer of a studio keeping about 1/2 of the overall box office was a fair reply.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 07:35:00 PM
Thanks mate. Do you know anything about Chinese market? I'm curious because it's gonna be Covenant's second, after US, biggest market.


QuoteFor the record, Alien: Covenant is not going to be some kind of megaflop. Kudos to Fox and friends for spending just $97 million on the Alien prequel/Prometheus sequel compared to the $130m spent on Prometheus. But the film is a huge domestic disappointment. It will earn around $75m in North America from a $36.16m debut weekend. It will make less in raw dollars than the original Alien ($79m back in 1979) and will be the smallest domestic grosser in terms of tickets sold outside of Alien vs. Predator: Requiem ($42m in 2007). But it has done better overseas, with $142m outside of North America, including a $29m debut in China. It currently has $215m worldwide.

Like X-Men: Apocalypse, it earned less in North America than the very old original film yet will be one of the bigger entries worldwide. And like that 2016 offering, it will leave its respective Fox-distributed/Michael Fassbender-starring franchise at a crossroad. That big China debut is impressive, especially when you consider that the film was allegedly hacked to bits by censors who removed most of the violence, gore, creature scenes and a kiss between two male characters. But word-of-mouth isn't great and with Transformers: The Last Knight set to make $45 zillion in China starting on Friday (slight exaggeration), Alien: Covenant should consider $60m a gift. It's an okay showing, but it won't be enough to make the film into a big hit.

It's relatively finished in most of the world, save for Cambodia in August and Japan (where Prometheus made $21 million back in 2012) way down the line in September.  So, barring a fluke, we're probably looking at a $240-$260 million worldwide total. That's not bad for an R-rated horror movie, but it's not the sort of thing that inspires confidence in whatever might come next, especially when contrasted with Prometheus's $405m worldwide take. So here's the question that's been on my mind since the film opened (in North America) one month ago today: Would the picture have performed better had it been sold as a Prometheus sequel instead of an Alien prequel? After all, Prometheus is the movie that made $400m+ worldwide, while Alien is the franchise that hasn't had a breakout hit (aside from the somewhat unique Alien vs. Predator) since 1986.

If we argue that part of Prometheus's appeal was its existence as an original, big-budget, star-filled (Charlize Theron and Idris Elba were added-value elements), R-rated sci-fi horror spectacular when such a thing was something of an event, then we should note that the would-be connections that Prometheus shared with the Alien series may have been incidental to the film's worldwide appeal. And, as such, the choice to more explicitly tie the next chapter not to Prometheus but to Alien may have been a fatal mistake. Yes, Alien: Covenant is more Prometheus 2 than Alien 0.75, but the marketing, from the title to the poster art to the trailers, sold the picture as another stroll down the Alien road. Maybe Prometheus: Covenant (or just Covenant) would have been a better sell than a film sold not as a continuation of a five-year-old hit but as a prequel/riff on a long-running franchise that peaked 30 years ago.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/19/alien-covenant-is-the-x-men-apocalypse-of-the-alien-series/#e309cae4d17b
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nightcrawler on Jun 19, 2017, 07:53:46 PM
Wonder how much money Covenant would have more made if it has been released in 3d?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Jun 19, 2017, 08:22:20 PM
Scot medlezon makes a fair few points the old cockerel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 19, 2017, 08:40:19 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 07:35:00 PM
QuoteSo here's the question that's been on my mind since the film opened (in North America) one month ago today: Would the picture have performed better had it been sold as a Prometheus sequel instead of an Alien prequel? After all, Prometheus is the movie that made $400m+ worldwide, while Alien is the franchise that hasn't had a breakout hit (aside from the somewhat unique Alien vs. Predator) since 1986.

If we argue that part of Prometheus's appeal was its existence as an original, big-budget, star-filled (Charlize Theron and Idris Elba were added-value elements), R-rated sci-fi horror spectacular when such a thing was something of an event, then we should note that the would-be connections that Prometheus shared with the Alien series may have been incidental to the film's worldwide appeal. And, as such, the choice to more explicitly tie the next chapter not to Prometheus but to Alien may have been a fatal mistake. Yes, Alien: Covenant is more Prometheus 2 than Alien 0.75, but the marketing, from the title to the poster art to the trailers, sold the picture as another stroll down the Alien road. Maybe Prometheus: Covenant (or just Covenant) would have been a better sell than a film sold not as a continuation of a five-year-old hit but as a prequel/riff on a long-running franchise that peaked 30 years ago.
[/b]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/19/alien-covenant-is-the-x-men-apocalypse-of-the-alien-series/#e309cae4d17b

He's right. Selling this as an Alien film than what it actually is, 'Prometheus 2' doomed the film. They should had kept the original title of Paradise or Paradise Lost. 

In addition, in trying to sell it as an Alien film, besides David 8, Fox went ahead and cut most of the connective bits from Prometheus i.e. the engineers and Dr Shaw.

Crossing my fingers that Fox is taking notice of this and if its still possible to course correct for the final film - try at best to close the Dr. Shaw's narrative via flashbacks and explore the engineers.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jango1201 on Jun 19, 2017, 09:02:07 PM
I noticed Japan gets it in a couple of months. Are films subject to censorship there as well?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jun 19, 2017, 09:13:33 PM
Quote from: Jango1201 on Jun 19, 2017, 09:02:07 PM
I noticed Japan gets it in a couple of months. Are films subject to censorship there as well?

I very much doubt it, most of the Japanese films I've seen are sick as hell.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 19, 2017, 10:06:37 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Jun 19, 2017, 09:13:33 PM
Quote from: Jango1201 on Jun 19, 2017, 09:02:07 PM
I noticed Japan gets it in a couple of months. Are films subject to censorship there as well?

I very much doubt it, most of the Japanese films I've seen are sick as hell.

I love Tetsuo for example.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jun 19, 2017, 10:22:51 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 19, 2017, 10:06:37 PM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Jun 19, 2017, 09:13:33 PM
Quote from: Jango1201 on Jun 19, 2017, 09:02:07 PM
I noticed Japan gets it in a couple of months. Are films subject to censorship there as well?

I very much doubt it, most of the Japanese films I've seen are sick as hell.

I love Tetsuo for example.

That's was one of the films I was thinking of (and it is good) along with Ichi the killer and visitor Q, which I didn't enjoy. All these films are far more messed up than anything in Covenant, it's tame in comparison.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 11:22:51 PM
Quote from: 0321recon on Jun 19, 2017, 08:40:19 PM
Crossing my fingers that Fox is taking notice of this and if its still possible to course correct for the final film - try at best to close the Dr. Shaw's narrative via flashbacks and explore the engineers.

I hope they won't correct anything.  Otherwise it will make things even worse. They should have done it in Covenant. It's too late now. Just leave it as it is.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 20, 2017, 01:23:19 AM
This is a great article:

'Alien: Covenant' Is The 'X-Men: Apocalypse' Of The 'Alien' Series (https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/19/alien-covenant-is-the-x-men-apocalypse-of-the-alien-series/#7a86e8674d17)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 20, 2017, 02:39:10 AM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 11:22:51 PM
Quote from: 0321recon on Jun 19, 2017, 08:40:19 PM
Crossing my fingers that Fox is taking notice of this and if its still possible to course correct for the final film - try at best to close the Dr. Shaw's narrative via flashbacks and explore the engineers.

I hope they won't correct anything.  Otherwise it will make things even worse. They should have done it in Covenant. It's too late now. Just leave it as it is.

Good point.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 20, 2017, 03:06:54 AM
Quote from: 0321recon on Jun 20, 2017, 02:39:10 AM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 11:22:51 PM
Quote from: 0321recon on Jun 19, 2017, 08:40:19 PM
Crossing my fingers that Fox is taking notice of this and if its still possible to course correct for the final film - try at best to close the Dr. Shaw's narrative via flashbacks and explore the engineers.

I hope they won't correct anything.  Otherwise it will make things even worse. They should have done it in Covenant. It's too late now. Just leave it as it is.

Good point.
If Damon Lindelof is correct (and I hope he is) then Covenant was just a detour on the way to where Prometheus 2 was going. It would be kind if they kept the new characters and tried to have strong continuity with Covenant, but had them encounter a world that we expected from Prometheus 2. Perhaps I am reading too much into the movie's tagline: The path to paradise begins in hell. It makes it seem like the planet in Covenant was Hell (which looked like Paradise), and the next movie will showcase Paradise (which will look like Hell).

That would be acceptable to me. I didn't love Covenant, but if the next movie delivers on the premise of Prometheus without using the lead character, I can live with it, and it would be worth the (admittedly tough) compromise if the Alien fans are also satisfied.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Jun 20, 2017, 03:45:38 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 20, 2017, 01:23:19 AM
This is a great article:

'Alien: Covenant' Is The 'X-Men: Apocalypse' Of The 'Alien' Series (https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/19/alien-covenant-is-the-x-men-apocalypse-of-the-alien-series/#7a86e8674d17)

This article is bullshit because he doesn't think having Covenant competing with Guardians of the Galaxy, Pirates of the Caribbean, and Wonder Woman had an effect on its BO performance. He really thinks it's because it wasn't marketed as a Prometheus sequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 20, 2017, 03:48:11 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 20, 2017, 03:06:54 AM

If Damon Lindelof is correct (and I hope he is) then Covenant was just a detour on the way to where Prometheus 2 was going. It would be kind if they kept the new characters and tried to have strong continuity with Covenant, but had them encounter a world that we expected from Prometheus 2. Perhaps I am reading too much into the movie's tagline: The path to paradise begins in hell. It makes it seem like the planet in Covenant was Hell (which looked like Paradise), and the next movie will showcase Paradise (which will look like Hell).

That would be acceptable to me. I didn't love Covenant, but if the next movie delivers on the premise of Prometheus without using the lead character, I can live with it, and it would be worth the (admittedly tough) compromise if the Alien fans are also satisfied.

I agree with you. I'm hoping Lindelof is right. I hope with this experience Fox and Scott Free dot their i's and cross their t's in a careful fashion to deliver the final film to appease both Alien and Prometheus fanbase.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 20, 2017, 05:03:21 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Jun 20, 2017, 03:45:38 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 20, 2017, 01:23:19 AM
This is a great article:

'Alien: Covenant' Is The 'X-Men: Apocalypse' Of The 'Alien' Series (https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/19/alien-covenant-is-the-x-men-apocalypse-of-the-alien-series/#7a86e8674d17)

This article is bullshit because he doesn't think having Covenant competing with Guardians of the Galaxy, Pirates of the Caribbean, and Wonder Woman had an effect on its BO performance. He really thinks it's because it wasn't marketed as a Prometheus sequel.

Your opinion is noted.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 20, 2017, 07:53:22 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Jun 20, 2017, 03:45:38 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 20, 2017, 01:23:19 AM
This is a great article:

'Alien: Covenant' Is The 'X-Men: Apocalypse' Of The 'Alien' Series (https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2017/06/19/alien-covenant-is-the-x-men-apocalypse-of-the-alien-series/#7a86e8674d17)

This article is bullshit because he doesn't think having Covenant competing with Guardians of the Galaxy, Pirates of the Caribbean, and Wonder Woman had an effect on its BO performance. He really thinks it's because it wasn't marketed as a Prometheus sequel.

It was a bit of everything. It's never one thing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 20, 2017, 07:50:18 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 11:22:51 PM
Quote from: 0321recon on Jun 19, 2017, 08:40:19 PM
Crossing my fingers that Fox is taking notice of this and if its still possible to course correct for the final film - try at best to close the Dr. Shaw's narrative via flashbacks and explore the engineers.

I hope they won't correct anything.  Otherwise it will make things even worse. They should have done it in Covenant. It's too late now. Just leave it as it is.

When thinking about the next Alien prequel, there are many things affecting box office as already mentioned.
One problem I'd add is the deep split among the Alien franchise fans. So, there is no correct story that will please every group of franchise enthusiasts.
* Examples from well known YouTube channels about "Covenant";
- Angry Joe hated the parts about "Prometheus" and loved the parts with the xenomorph.
- Jay Bauman of Red Letter Media loved the parts from "Prometheus" and hated the parts with the xenomorph.

Bottom line; "Covenant" underperformed. In terms of the ratio of box office divided by production budget, it's done a bit better than "Resurrection" and not as well as AVP.
To me it's premature to talk about the next Alien movie.
With the weak performance of "Covenant" it's not certain what Fox will do with the next Alien film.
My guess is that the studio will go for a very cheap production budget and Ridley may not be the director. Who knows?

- If "X-Men Apocalypse" is used as a comparison, the sequel for that, "Dark Phoenix", will have a director change. Bryan Singer is stepping aside and Simon Kinberg will direct.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: axiomatic on Jun 20, 2017, 08:21:57 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 11:22:51 PM
Quote from: 0321recon on Jun 19, 2017, 08:40:19 PM
Crossing my fingers that Fox is taking notice of this and if its still possible to course correct for the final film - try at best to close the Dr. Shaw's narrative via flashbacks and explore the engineers.

I hope they won't correct anything.  Otherwise it will make things even worse. They should have done it in Covenant. It's too late now. Just leave it as it is.

Studios take the heat when movies are bad but rarely the credit when they put in valuable input.
Let's not forget Scott almost got fired for trying to kill Ripley. The original would have been a total downer and half as successful if he did.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jimbobasaurus on Jun 20, 2017, 09:14:42 PM
Heya, new here, but just got this in my inbox this morning, great Asian styled drawing accompanying the article too!

http://chinafilminsider.com/alien-flatlnes/ (http://chinafilminsider.com/alien-flatlnes/)

Regards

Jimbob
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 20, 2017, 09:31:12 PM
f**king China. Everything has gone against Covenant so far. A negative popular narrative developed prior to the movie getting released in many places, convincing many people not to watch it, and then the lukewarm summer for movies in general while it had to compete with Wonder Woman and Guardians of the Galaxy. Cutting off the gore and creatures, some of the most important aspects of the film.. just why? What is wrong with the Chinese government? Just keep it R-rated for f**k's sake. My sympathies go to the Chinese viewers. I once bought a German version of Command and Conquer Generals, where all the people had been turned into androids in order not to offend Muslims, so I know what disappoint and anger in the face of shitty censoring feels like.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 20, 2017, 10:57:31 PM
Quote from: Jimbobasaurus on Jun 20, 2017, 09:14:42 PM
Heya, new here, but just got this in my inbox this morning, great Asian styled drawing accompanying the article too!

http://chinafilminsider.com/alien-flatlnes/ (http://chinafilminsider.com/alien-flatlnes/)

Regards

Jimbob
In short, Covenant made over half of its projected Chinese total in its opening weekend there. It will struggle to reach $55m.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 21, 2017, 12:55:11 AM
QuoteAlien: Covenant (异形·契约) enjoyed a first place debut with RMB 185 million* ($27.2 million)...

Alien will struggle to hit the 2x opening weekend multiplier that has become the recent standard for Hollywood releases in the territory.
http://chinafilminsider.com/alien-flatlnes/

The expectation now is about $50 million from China.
This is not bad news imo.
- "Life" which is part of the same sci-if/horror genre, made slightly less than $20 million in China. "Covenant" already beat that.
- "Covenant" is doing about 1/3 of the box office of "The Martian" in some markets like South Korea (which is near China).
(In S. Korea "The Martian" got ~ $32 million BO while "Covenant" got $9.5 million.)

With China "The Martian" got almost $95 million. 1/3 of that is about $32 million.
"Covenant" will get about $20 million more in the $50 million range.

With Japan's BO, "Covenant" could reach $250 million.
This is good news for those hoping for some kind of new Alien movie in the near future.

;)

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 21, 2017, 01:05:02 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 21, 2017, 12:55:11 AM
QuoteAlien: Covenant (异形·契约) enjoyed a first place debut with RMB 185 million* ($27.2 million)...

Alien will struggle to hit the 2x opening weekend multiplier that has become the recent standard for Hollywood releases in the territory.
http://chinafilminsider.com/alien-flatlnes/

The expectation now is about $50 million from China.
This is not bad news imo.
- "Life" which is part of the same sci-if/horror genre, made slightly less than $20 million in China. "Covenant" already beat that.
- "Covenant" is doing about 1/3 of the box office of "The Martian" in some markets like South Korea (which is near China).
("The Martian" got ~ $32 million BO while "Covenant" got $9.5 million there.)

With China "The Martian" got almost $95 million. 1/3 of that is about $32 million.
"Covenant" will get about $20 million more in the $50 million range.

With Japan's BO, "Covenant" could reach $250 million.
This is good news for those hoping for some kind of new Alien movie in the near future.

;)

I agree.

Ridley Scott was very savvy. He made COVENANT with only 97 Million.

Tom Cruise did his MUMMY with 275 Million. Stupid.

THE MUMMY is a huge flop.

COVENANT could get a sequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on Jun 21, 2017, 02:49:29 AM
I hope they don't go cheap with the next film. If you give it a decent budget similar to Covenant, you have a chance at course correcting the franchise if the right ideas are at play and execution is well-done. If you just go too cheap then the franchise gets pushed further into irrelevance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: AlienFanIL17 on Jun 21, 2017, 02:51:04 AM
It's easy for me to say this, since it's Fox's money and not mine, lol.

If the budget gets reduced a little bit more, I think we could get a sequel to Covenant in a couple of years.  A reduced budget could have the benefit of bringing in the smaller sets and increased tension that was present in the original Alien.  Maybe the budget would be able handle one big set piece, or one big CGI sequence. 

I really think the future of Alien is in Alien 5 or whatever the next sequel to Resurrection will be.  An Alien 5 would allow the franchise to move away from everything we have seen about the Alien so far, and start to show some new creative insights into the creature.  They can't keep making Alien movies without evolving the beast's capabilities, and just showing us the same things over and over again. 

I actually think that future Alien movies can incorporate those Prometheus concepts of creation and the Engineers.  I seem to remember Sigourney saying something to the effect of wanting to go to where the Alien came from to finish off Ripley's story.  The Alien home planet could be another Engineer planet where a black goo accident went horribly wrong.  As much as I want to get a Covenant sequel that ties into the first Alien, exciting new features and concepts can only come with an Alien 5 sequel and beyond.  That's just my opinion.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 02:56:14 AM
Scott won't do cheap.  But he won't go overboard on throwing money around, either.

No course correction is necessary, either.  These movies are on a path they're meant to be on.  I'm looking forward to the next installment of this series. 

You can bet the next movie will be a large scale confrontation... thousands of Aliens, Engineers and USCM into the mix.  That's not course correction - that's where it's headed.

Scott said it's going to be Epic.  I doubt it will all be contained in just one more movie. 

We've effectively only just witnessed half (at best) of a much bigger, Grander vision. 

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 03:53:13 AM
Sad to hear they're not getting the full film. Censorship is (in and of itself) a vile thing. I don't personally think Scott's steering this towards some large-scale intergalactic showdown. Unless the series gets handed to another director, such as Cameron or N.B., I don't see the Colonial Marines appearing on film in a significant way anytime soon, if ever again. This is, after all, a cash business. And unless it's got marvel or Disney attached to it, the love of the fan base only counts so much. A hard lesson was learned from King Arthur this year, and the reduced intake for covenant over Prometheus won't exactly help either. Perhaps it's time to get off this road of trying to keep everything intrinsically linked together. Maybe the only common link needed is the creature itself. They're ancient, and they're out there, everywhere. Plenty of different stories to be told. You don't need the company or Ripley to always be involved. Maybe reference other future films with wreckage and bones, but keep the blood fresh and release the kraken.

Or just have Jack Sparrow in an ironman suit swinging wonder woman's sword at a mummified Barbosa in the Mechanical Batsuit from D.O.J. while onboard a Juggernaut that's hurtling towards the sun and being chased by the guardians. And have tom cruise running, it doesn't matter where.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 21, 2017, 04:00:42 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 02:56:14 AM
Scott won't do cheap.  But he won't go overboard on throwing money around, either.

No course correction is necessary, either.  These movies are on a path they're meant to be on.  I'm looking forward to the next installment of this series. 

You can bet the next movie will be a large scale confrontation... thousands of Aliens, Engineers and USCM into the mix.  That's not course correction - that's where it's headed.

Scott said it's going to be Epic.  I doubt it will all be contained in just one more movie. 

We've effectively only just witnessed half (at best) of a much bigger, Grander vision. 

-Windebieste.

I agree. Seeing the recent video were he talks about the direction of the series, he's going to need every cent to bring that vision into reality. I'm pumped for this since its going to be grand space epic though I fear with Covenant's lackluster performance, Fox might screw around with the story. I'm hoping that Fox at least gives him the same budget from Covenant for this film, and let Riddles do this film, even if its the final in the series.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 21, 2017, 04:10:07 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 02:56:14 AM
Scott won't do cheap.  But he won't go overboard on throwing money around, either.

No course correction is necessary, either.  These movies are on a path they're meant to be on.  I'm looking forward to the next installment of this series. 

You can bet the next movie will be a large scale confrontation... thousands of Aliens, Engineers and USCM into the mix.  That's not course correction - that's where it's headed.

Scott said it's going to be Epic.  I doubt it will all be contained in just one more movie. 

We've effectively only just witnessed half (at best) of a much bigger, Grander vision. 

-Windebieste.

Probably the same budget: 97 Million USD.

COVENANT underperformed but Ridley Scott is powerful especially at FOX.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prof. a on Jun 21, 2017, 04:11:39 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 06:53:13 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 05:04:39 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 04:21:17 PM
Quote from: gantarat on Jun 19, 2017, 01:12:39 AM
How much Studios get money/share from $215 million ?

Roughly overall, 1/2 of the box office goes to the studio.

;)

Domestically yes, but not from the foreign markets. It's more complex that 50/50 share.

I wrote "Roughly overall". I wanted to give a short answer and imo about 50% was an OK brief description.

But as you point out box office can be complicated.
So, for you I'll be more clear with a long answer.

- It's true that the studio's share of box office varies by country where the film is being shown. 

QuoteThe percentage of revenues that the exhibitor takes in depends on the individual contract for that film — which in turn depends on how much muscle the distributor has, according to Stone...

generally, how much of the domestic box office revenue goes to the studios?...
if a film only makes $10 million at the box office, the distributor will get only 45 percent of that money. But if a film makes $300 million at the box office, then the distributor gets up to 60 percent of that money...

According to the book The Hollywood Economist by Edward Jay Epstein, studios take in about 40 percent of the revenue from overseas release
http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable

- So in the end, these calculations are rough guesses.
It is possible for a studio to take in from 45% to 60% of US box office and 40% of overseas box office (which is also a guess since box office varies by country).
I don't know the specific percentages for each movie because those are secret but I'll first use a 50/40 US/overseas spit and then a possible best case for the studio of a 60/40 US/overseas split as described in the io9 article.

* 50/40 US/overseas split;
- Using that, for a film like "Star Trek (2009)" which had 2/3 of its box office in the US, that would mean about 47% goes to the studio.
With "Star Trek Into Darkness" which has about a 50/50 US/overseas box office split, about 45% would go to the studio.
For "Prometheus" where overseas box office was 68.6%, then about 43% went to the studio.
And with the "Covenant" numbers so far, where 66.2% of box office is coming from overseas, again about 43% would go to the studio.

* 60/40 US/overseas split;
- Again, for "Star Trek (2009)" which had 2/3 of its box office in the US, that would mean about 54% goes to the studio.
"Star Trek Into Darkness" and its about 50/50 US/overseas box office split, about 50% would go to the studio.
"Prometheus" where overseas box office was 68.6%, then about 46% went to the studio.
finally with the "Covenant" numbers so far, where 66.2% of box office is coming from overseas, about 47% would go to the studio.

- The actual US/overseas split I can only guess would be somewhere in this range of outcomes. 

* Considering that gantarat asked a simple question, I think that the short answer of a studio keeping about 1/2 of the overall box office was a fair reply.

;)

Excellent post @bb-15. Thanks very much for that article - it basically confirms the gist of what I've been saying.

Quote: " So how do you know if the box-office gods have smiled enough on your favorite movie that studios are likely to greenlight similar films?
The short answer is, it depends on a number of factors, but a rule of thumb seems to be that the film needs to make twice its production budget globally."
(source: http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable (http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable))


This article also highlights and debunks the claims that all splits between theaters and studios are the same. They are not  - as the article mentions.

As for Covenant's Chinese success, the only caveat is that the split heavily favors the Chinese. American firms generally recoup only about 25% of the gross.

However, with the worldwide total over 200 million, Covenant has doubled its production budget.

Here's another interesting article about The Mummy.  http://deadline.com/2017/06/the-mummy-tom-cruise-box-office-bomb-loss-1202114482/ (http://deadline.com/2017/06/the-mummy-tom-cruise-box-office-bomb-loss-1202114482/)

I will say that the article's main premise is that The Mummy will lose money. Keep in mind that the projections are based off of anonymous insider sources and estimates. So, you have to take some of that reporting with a dose of skepticism.

But it says this: "Our non-Universal finance sources tells us that cash break-even occurs at $450M. "

So, on a budget of about 200 million, The Mummy needs 2.25 times the production budget to break even.


The reality is the American Box Office is becoming more and more irrelevant as globalization and film industry economics takes its toll.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 21, 2017, 04:22:33 AM
Quote from: Prof. a on Jun 21, 2017, 04:11:39 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 06:53:13 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 19, 2017, 05:04:39 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 19, 2017, 04:21:17 PM
Quote from: gantarat on Jun 19, 2017, 01:12:39 AM
How much Studios get money/share from $215 million ?

Roughly overall, 1/2 of the box office goes to the studio.

;)

Domestically yes, but not from the foreign markets. It's more complex that 50/50 share.

I wrote "Roughly overall". I wanted to give a short answer and imo about 50% was an OK brief description.

But as you point out box office can be complicated.
So, for you I'll be more clear with a long answer.

- It's true that the studio's share of box office varies by country where the film is being shown. 

QuoteThe percentage of revenues that the exhibitor takes in depends on the individual contract for that film — which in turn depends on how much muscle the distributor has, according to Stone...

generally, how much of the domestic box office revenue goes to the studios?...
if a film only makes $10 million at the box office, the distributor will get only 45 percent of that money. But if a film makes $300 million at the box office, then the distributor gets up to 60 percent of that money...

According to the book The Hollywood Economist by Edward Jay Epstein, studios take in about 40 percent of the revenue from overseas release
http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable

- So in the end, these calculations are rough guesses.
It is possible for a studio to take in from 45% to 60% of US box office and 40% of overseas box office (which is also a guess since box office varies by country).
I don't know the specific percentages for each movie because those are secret but I'll first use a 50/40 US/overseas spit and then a possible best case for the studio of a 60/40 US/overseas split as described in the io9 article.

* 50/40 US/overseas split;
- Using that, for a film like "Star Trek (2009)" which had 2/3 of its box office in the US, that would mean about 47% goes to the studio.
With "Star Trek Into Darkness" which has about a 50/50 US/overseas box office split, about 45% would go to the studio.
For "Prometheus" where overseas box office was 68.6%, then about 43% went to the studio.
And with the "Covenant" numbers so far, where 66.2% of box office is coming from overseas, again about 43% would go to the studio.

* 60/40 US/overseas split;
- Again, for "Star Trek (2009)" which had 2/3 of its box office in the US, that would mean about 54% goes to the studio.
"Star Trek Into Darkness" and its about 50/50 US/overseas box office split, about 50% would go to the studio.
"Prometheus" where overseas box office was 68.6%, then about 46% went to the studio.
finally with the "Covenant" numbers so far, where 66.2% of box office is coming from overseas, about 47% would go to the studio.

- The actual US/overseas split I can only guess would be somewhere in this range of outcomes. 

* Considering that gantarat asked a simple question, I think that the short answer of a studio keeping about 1/2 of the overall box office was a fair reply.

;)

Excellent post @bb-15. Thanks very much for that article - it basically confirms the gist of what I've been saying.

Quote: " So how do you know if the box-office gods have smiled enough on your favorite movie that studios are likely to greenlight similar films?
The short answer is, it depends on a number of factors, but a rule of thumb seems to be that the film needs to make twice its production budget globally."
(source: http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable (http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable))


This article also highlights and debunks the claims that all splits between theaters and studios are the same. They are not  - as the article mentions.

As for Covenant's Chinese success, the only caveat is that the split heavily favors the Chinese. American firms generally recoup only about 25% of the gross.

However, with the worldwide total over 200 million, Covenant has doubled its production budget.

Here's another interesting article about The Mummy.  http://deadline.com/2017/06/the-mummy-tom-cruise-box-office-bomb-loss-1202114482/ (http://deadline.com/2017/06/the-mummy-tom-cruise-box-office-bomb-loss-1202114482/)

I will say that the article's main premise is that The Mummy will lose money. Keep in mind that the projections are based off of anonymous insider sources and estimates. So, you have to take some of that reporting with a dose of skepticism.

But it says this: "Our non-Universal finance sources tells us that cash break-even occurs at $450M. "

So, on a budget of about 200 million, The Mummy needs 2.25 times the production budget to break even.


The reality is the American Box Office is becoming more and more irrelevant as globalization and film industry economics takes its toll.

Thanks.

2.25

97 Million multiply 2.25 equals 218.25 Million

COVENANT could made MORE than 218.25 Million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 04:37:22 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 03:53:13 AM
Sad to hear they're not getting the full film. Censorship is (in and of itself) a vile thing. I don't personally think Scott's steering this towards some large-scale intergalactic showdown. Unless the series gets handed to another director, such as Cameron or N.B., I don't see the Colonial Marines appearing on film in a significant way anytime soon, if ever again. This is, after all, a cash business. And unless it's got marvel or Disney attached to it, the love of the fan base only counts so much. A hard lesson was learned from King Arthur this year, and the reduced intake for covenant over Prometheus won't exactly help either. Perhaps it's time to get off this road of trying to keep everything intrinsically linked together. Maybe the only common link needed is the creature itself. They're ancient, and they're out there, everywhere. Plenty of different stories to be told. You don't need the company or Ripley to always be involved. Maybe reference other future films with wreckage and bones, but keep the blood fresh and release the kraken.

Or just have Jack Sparrow in an ironman suit swinging wonder woman's sword at a mummified Barbosa in the Mechanical Batsuit from D.O.J. while onboard a Juggernaut that's hurtling towards the sun and being chased by the guardians. And have tom cruise running, it doesn't matter where.


How about Scott's intention to make Haldeman's 'Forever War' into a movie?  He's been wanting to make a 'large scale intergalacitic showdown.' for years  You better believe it.  That's exactly where this is heading.

As for Disney touching this property lol.  If you think the Chinese censors removing content was bad enough, then can you imagine what the Disney cut of any 'ALIEN' movie would be like? 

Say goodbye to any violence, sexual references, androids kissing...  Say goodbye to anything remotely suggestive - fachuggers would be gone, no phallic Aliens allowed... at all.  It would be worse than Chinese censorship version because no one will get to see the movie the way it was intended because like you say, Disney is a business and Disney will only tackle safe bets for lowest common denominator audiences.  They make kids shows and 'ALIEN' is not a safe bet or child friendly.   

f**k Disney.  Never, ever let them near anything of any real value unless you want to entertain children and family friendly audiences with mediocre content.  f**k that. 

"I say we should nuke Disney and their PG13 friendly market from orbit.  It's the only way to be sure."

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 21, 2017, 04:39:29 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 04:37:22 AM

"I say we should nuke Disney and their PG13 friendly market from orbit.  It's the only way to be sure."

-Windebieste.

Nice!  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 21, 2017, 05:07:45 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 04:37:22 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 03:53:13 AM
Sad to hear they're not getting the full film. Censorship is (in and of itself) a vile thing. I don't personally think Scott's steering this towards some large-scale intergalactic showdown. Unless the series gets handed to another director, such as Cameron or N.B., I don't see the Colonial Marines appearing on film in a significant way anytime soon, if ever again. This is, after all, a cash business. And unless it's got marvel or Disney attached to it, the love of the fan base only counts so much. A hard lesson was learned from King Arthur this year, and the reduced intake for covenant over Prometheus won't exactly help either. Perhaps it's time to get off this road of trying to keep everything intrinsically linked together. Maybe the only common link needed is the creature itself. They're ancient, and they're out there, everywhere. Plenty of different stories to be told. You don't need the company or Ripley to always be involved. Maybe reference other future films with wreckage and bones, but keep the blood fresh and release the kraken.

Or just have Jack Sparrow in an ironman suit swinging wonder woman's sword at a mummified Barbosa in the Mechanical Batsuit from D.O.J. while onboard a Juggernaut that's hurtling towards the sun and being chased by the guardians. And have tom cruise running, it doesn't matter where.


How about Scott's intention to make Haldeman's 'Forever War' into a movie?  He's been wanting to make a 'large scale intergalacitic showdown.' for years  You better believe it.  That's exactly where this is heading.

As for Disney touching this property lol.  If you think the Chinese censors removing content was bad enough, then can you imagine what the Disney cut of any 'ALIEN' movie would be like? 

Say goodbye to any violence, sexual references, androids kissing...  Say goodbye to anything remotely suggestive - fachuggers would be gone, no phallic Aliens allowed... at all.  It would be worse than Chinese censorship version because no one will get to see the movie the way it was intended because like you say, Disney is a business and Disney will only tackle safe bets for lowest common denominator audiences.  They make kids shows and 'ALIEN' is not a safe bet or child friendly.   

f**k Disney.  Never, ever let them near anything of any real value unless you want to entertain children and family friendly audiences with mediocre content.  f**k that. 

"I say we should nuke Disney and their PG13 friendly market from orbit.  It's the only way to be sure."

-Windebieste.

I agree 100%.

Disney is Killing Star Wars.

Today, Disney fired Lord & Miller from the Han Solo movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 05:46:42 AM
It's been a long day at work, and perhaps I wasn't as specific as I intended. My point was that Marvel and Disney films make up a large portion of the highest grossing films each year, and therefore, studios are more comfortable investing in large scale pictures such as Pirates or Guardians because of an almost gauranteed high return. In no way was I suggesting that Disney make an Alien film. I personally am ready to see the Marvel Universe end so that we can get some creative and financial room for fresh ideas. I would much rather see A Cure For Wellness instead of Thor 7 and Finding Nemo's Great Grandson.


As for the "scale" of the next film, I simply have doubts that Ridley will be able to make anything of epic proportions happen, most likely due to hesitance from the studio. Unless Cameron comes onboard and turns it into avatar with Aliens, I don't see the studio shelling out more than Covenant's budget again. But claustrophobia and Aliens kinda go well together. So a smaller budget isn't necessarily a bad thing.

The last portion of my post, was of course, sarcasm as usual. But I still stand by that walking dead/breaking bad/aliens crossover.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 21, 2017, 05:54:00 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 21, 2017, 05:07:45 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 04:37:22 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 03:53:13 AM
Sad to hear they're not getting the full film. Censorship is (in and of itself) a vile thing. I don't personally think Scott's steering this towards some large-scale intergalactic showdown. Unless the series gets handed to another director, such as Cameron or N.B., I don't see the Colonial Marines appearing on film in a significant way anytime soon, if ever again. This is, after all, a cash business. And unless it's got marvel or Disney attached to it, the love of the fan base only counts so much. A hard lesson was learned from King Arthur this year, and the reduced intake for covenant over Prometheus won't exactly help either. Perhaps it's time to get off this road of trying to keep everything intrinsically linked together. Maybe the only common link needed is the creature itself. They're ancient, and they're out there, everywhere. Plenty of different stories to be told. You don't need the company or Ripley to always be involved. Maybe reference other future films with wreckage and bones, but keep the blood fresh and release the kraken.

Or just have Jack Sparrow in an ironman suit swinging wonder woman's sword at a mummified Barbosa in the Mechanical Batsuit from D.O.J. while onboard a Juggernaut that's hurtling towards the sun and being chased by the guardians. And have tom cruise running, it doesn't matter where.


How about Scott's intention to make Haldeman's 'Forever War' into a movie?  He's been wanting to make a 'large scale intergalacitic showdown.' for years  You better believe it.  That's exactly where this is heading.

As for Disney touching this property lol.  If you think the Chinese censors removing content was bad enough, then can you imagine what the Disney cut of any 'ALIEN' movie would be like? 

Say goodbye to any violence, sexual references, androids kissing...  Say goodbye to anything remotely suggestive - fachuggers would be gone, no phallic Aliens allowed... at all.  It would be worse than Chinese censorship version because no one will get to see the movie the way it was intended because like you say, Disney is a business and Disney will only tackle safe bets for lowest common denominator audiences.  They make kids shows and 'ALIEN' is not a safe bet or child friendly.   

f**k Disney.  Never, ever let them near anything of any real value unless you want to entertain children and family friendly audiences with mediocre content.  f**k that. 

"I say we should nuke Disney and their PG13 friendly market from orbit.  It's the only way to be sure."

-Windebieste.

I agree 100%.

Disney is Killing Star Wars.

Today, Disney fired Lord & Miller from the Han Solo movie.

Two movies, $3b box office, glowing reviews.

lol "killing".

All ships, prepare to jump to hyperbole...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 06:09:39 AM
But seriously, if anyone could outrun a xenomorph, God knows it would be Tom Cruise.  ;D
Even though ya'll misread my original post, it does make for interesting thought. What would disney's version of an Alien film be about? Would Nicolas Cage be involved? Would acid blood affect the hulk? What if wey-yu bought up a company called 'cyberdine'. Would SGT. Candy lead a platoon of Colonial Marines? Perhaps a con-air style fight between Candy and Cage for and ending sequence. We later discover after the credits that Candy is really a terminator, and Cage is john travolta. Boy Howdy, it's terrifying stuff.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 21, 2017, 06:57:34 AM
46 year old Pete Postlethwaite outran a xenomorph.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 21, 2017, 07:32:08 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 04:37:22 AM
How about Scott's intention to make Haldeman's 'Forever War' into a movie?  He's been wanting to make a 'large scale intergalacitic showdown.' for years  You better believe it.  That's exactly where this is heading.

The action isn't really the point of Forever War, though. It's the stuff in between. And from the way Scott talked about the Alien sequels in the recent Empire interview (whether he was right or wrong), he really seemed to dislike the action route that some of the sequels took. I don't think he'd be any rush to really go there himself.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 08:49:21 AM
"46 year old Pete Postlethwaite outran a xenomorph"

I'm talking open ground. I could see Tom pulling it off in a movie, maybe a field scene. The guy's always running and he's got speed. I think poor ol' Pete was being toyed with.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jun 21, 2017, 09:19:17 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 08:49:21 AM
"46 year old Pete Postlethwaite outran a xenomorph"

I'm talking open ground. I could see Tom pulling it off in a movie, maybe a field scene. The guy's always running and he's got speed. I think poor ol' Pete was being toyed with.

"the guys always running" lol. This is very true.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 844064612978 on Jun 21, 2017, 10:51:30 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 21, 2017, 05:54:00 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 21, 2017, 05:07:45 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 04:37:22 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 03:53:13 AM
Sad to hear they're not getting the full film. Censorship is (in and of itself) a vile thing. I don't personally think Scott's steering this towards some large-scale intergalactic showdown. Unless the series gets handed to another director, such as Cameron or N.B., I don't see the Colonial Marines appearing on film in a significant way anytime soon, if ever again. This is, after all, a cash business. And unless it's got marvel or Disney attached to it, the love of the fan base only counts so much. A hard lesson was learned from King Arthur this year, and the reduced intake for covenant over Prometheus won't exactly help either. Perhaps it's time to get off this road of trying to keep everything intrinsically linked together. Maybe the only common link needed is the creature itself. They're ancient, and they're out there, everywhere. Plenty of different stories to be told. You don't need the company or Ripley to always be involved. Maybe reference other future films with wreckage and bones, but keep the blood fresh and release the kraken.

Or just have Jack Sparrow in an ironman suit swinging wonder woman's sword at a mummified Barbosa in the Mechanical Batsuit from D.O.J. while onboard a Juggernaut that's hurtling towards the sun and being chased by the guardians. And have tom cruise running, it doesn't matter where.


How about Scott's intention to make Haldeman's 'Forever War' into a movie?  He's been wanting to make a 'large scale intergalacitic showdown.' for years  You better believe it.  That's exactly where this is heading.

As for Disney touching this property lol.  If you think the Chinese censors removing content was bad enough, then can you imagine what the Disney cut of any 'ALIEN' movie would be like? 

Say goodbye to any violence, sexual references, androids kissing...  Say goodbye to anything remotely suggestive - fachuggers would be gone, no phallic Aliens allowed... at all.  It would be worse than Chinese censorship version because no one will get to see the movie the way it was intended because like you say, Disney is a business and Disney will only tackle safe bets for lowest common denominator audiences.  They make kids shows and 'ALIEN' is not a safe bet or child friendly.   

f**k Disney.  Never, ever let them near anything of any real value unless you want to entertain children and family friendly audiences with mediocre content.  f**k that. 

"I say we should nuke Disney and their PG13 friendly market from orbit.  It's the only way to be sure."

-Windebieste.

I agree 100%.

Disney is Killing Star Wars.

Today, Disney fired Lord & Miller from the Han Solo movie.

Two movies, $3b box office, glowing reviews.

lol "killing".

All ships, prepare to jump to hyperbole...

It's pretty obvious he means that they are killing the story. Of course they are making loads of money off the brand.

As for the "glowing" reviews, I can't speak on behalf of others but I enjoyed The Force Awakens and Rogue One yet still believe they are an abomination to the original stories. Anyway, that's another conversation.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 12:56:07 AM
But if the reviews and box office are that substantial - pretty obvious they're not killing off anything; people are enjoying it enough to watch it in droves.  If the Last Jedi tanks, then maybe he'd have a point...

Quote from: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 08:49:21 AM
"46 year old Pete Postlethwaite outran a xenomorph"

I'm talking open ground. I could see Tom pulling it off in a movie, maybe a field scene. The guy's always running and he's got speed. I think poor ol' Pete was being toyed with.

In slow-mo.  ;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on Jun 22, 2017, 03:47:27 AM
Oh you got to have that John Woo slow-mo action. It's just the way you do it.


I'd still like to re-iterate I meant that a studio may not shell out funds to make large scale pictures (in general) just because there's a dedicated fanbase. Unless it is a type of film that is bound to reap a decent profit, such as Disney or Marvel movies often do, studios may not get too heavily invested. It's a cash business, a "butt-in-seat" business, and given the choice between Philosophical Space Horror or Beauty and the Jurassic Pirates, I doubt they'll increase the budget for the next Alien film just because Ridley and fans want something epic. I could almost hear the purse strings tightening when Arthur nose dived, and covenant isn't exactly setting benchmarks. I think the budget may stay the same going forward.


The thought of Disney making an Alien movie? Makes my skin crawl just thinking about it. But keep your eyes peeled people, you might spot a xeno skull over some off-world bar in the next star wars film, or the collector's place in Guardians 3. "shudders"
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mr. Xenomorph on Jun 22, 2017, 04:12:25 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Jun 22, 2017, 03:47:27 AM
The thought of Disney making an Alien movie? Makes my skin crawl just thinking about it.

In space, no one can get you ice cream...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 04:55:46 AM
I dunno. The Black Hole had some freaky bits in it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 22, 2017, 08:20:39 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 04:55:46 AM
I dunno. The Black Hole had some freaky bits in it.

The Black Hole was made in the 1980s.

30 YEARS AGO. DiFFERENT Disney. DIFFERENT World.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 22, 2017, 09:07:22 PM
41 millions in China so far.

http://english.entgroup.cn/boxoffice/cn/daily/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 22, 2017, 09:11:05 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 21, 2017, 06:57:34 AM
46 year old Pete Postlethwaite outran a xenomorph.

Xeno was playing, it would have snapped him in half in a split second if it wanted to like Jude.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 22, 2017, 10:54:00 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 22, 2017, 09:07:22 PM
41 millions in China so far.

http://english.entgroup.cn/boxoffice/cn/daily/

Looking good.
Box Office Mojo has total box office at $220 million so far.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=main&id=alienparadiselost.htm

Plus China isn't done and the release in Japan is still coming.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 11:01:56 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 22, 2017, 08:20:39 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 04:55:46 AM
I dunno. The Black Hole had some freaky bits in it.

The Black Hole was made in the 1980s.

30 YEARS AGO. DiFFERENT Disney. DIFFERENT World.

You DON'T SAY?

Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 22, 2017, 09:11:05 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 21, 2017, 06:57:34 AM
46 year old Pete Postlethwaite outran a xenomorph.

Xeno was playing, it would have snapped him in half in a split second if it wanted to like Jude.

Jude outran it too.  And Kevin.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 22, 2017, 11:25:36 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 11:01:56 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 22, 2017, 08:20:39 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 04:55:46 AM
I dunno. The Black Hole had some freaky bits in it.

The Black Hole was made in the 1980s.

30 YEARS AGO. DiFFERENT Disney. DIFFERENT World.

You DON'T SAY?

Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 22, 2017, 09:11:05 PM
Quote from: SM on Jun 21, 2017, 06:57:34 AM
46 year old Pete Postlethwaite outran a xenomorph.

Xeno was playing, it would have snapped him in half in a split second if it wanted to like Jude.

Jude outran it too.  And Kevin.

The fact is Disney changed.

You fight about nothing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 22, 2017, 11:28:30 PM
I thought the joke was really, REALLY OBVIOUS.

Clearly not.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 23, 2017, 11:56:03 AM
i might have mentioned this before in another thread. .but it's been awhile and i don't think i eloborated much. .anyway a fair comparison in regards to another fox franchise. .Percy Jackson first movie cost 95 mil and earned 226 worldwide, very close to what covenant is currently at and Percy got a sequel made, in 2013 it was made at a cost of 90 mil and earned 200 mil at the box office. .bringing the franchise to a screeching halt. .so i think their is hope for a covenant sequel based on those numbers. . ?


. .so if covenant can just make it to about 240. .then i think a sequel is more than justifiable. . .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 23, 2017, 12:38:20 PM
Of course there's hope. Alien is one of Fox's most valuable commodities.
As long as the movies remain in circulation and licensing deals continue to bring in cash, they will not let it die.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on Jun 23, 2017, 02:18:11 PM
Well,Percy Jackson it's movies base from novel, people can go find the book and read them if sequel movie didn't get made.

but Covenant it's prequel movie that lead to original movie and story in the movie not connect to original yet (end with cliffhanger)

i don't think fox would let prequel story end like this (unless they do sequel in comic or novel)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 23, 2017, 04:14:50 PM
Also keep in mind that Alien probably sells a lot more merch than Percy Jackson.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 23, 2017, 05:39:36 PM
Whatever helps you guys sleep at night.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 23, 2017, 06:06:33 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 23, 2017, 11:56:03 AM
i might have mentioned this before in another thread. .but it's been awhile and i don't think i eloborated much. .anyway a fair comparison in regards to another fox franchise. .Percy Jackson first movie cost 95 mil and earned 226 worldwide, very close to what covenant is currently at and Percy got a sequel made, in 2013 it was made at a cost of 90 mil and earned 200 mil at the box office. .bringing the franchise to a screeching halt. .so i think their is hope for a covenant sequel based on those numbers. . ?


. .so if covenant can just make it to about 240. .then i think a sequel is more than justifiable. . .

I think your prediction from those production budget / box office numbers makes sense.
Eventually imo Fox will give the approval for another Alien prequel movie.
But the new film will have a lower budget than "Covenant".

The new movie will complete an Alien prequel trilogy which I expect Fox will package as a set with special edition versions.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 23, 2017, 07:34:50 PM
i am sick of hoping. .i just wanne know already. .!. .i think the odds are good for a sequel. .but oh well if fox does'nt wanne make another then so be it. .it looks like percy is getting a tv series. .not that i care. .but in the event of no sequel. .then a tv series would be the next best thing. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Predaker on Jun 23, 2017, 09:02:29 PM
I really don't think the lackluster BO performance of Covenant will stop FOX dead in their tracks on a sequel. With Ridley Scott at the helm and a decent pitch, they'll keep on truckin'.

However, at this point we don't really need any more prequels. There isn't a whole lot to offer up other than rehashing the themes already present in Prometheus/Covenant, cementing David as the progenitor beyond any "reasonable doubt," and some cute action sequences that shoehorn this new series directly into ALIEN (S.O. 937 and all.)

At least we would presumably get a modern take on the original Giger design in all its biomechanical glory. I'm always game for a new Alien film that will at least be entertaining.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jun 23, 2017, 11:13:34 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 23, 2017, 09:02:29 PM
At least we would presumably get a modern take on the original Giger design in all its biomechanical glory. I'm always game for a new Alien film that will at least be entertaining.

People clamor for him and want more Giger. The guy is dead. I liked him in Alien, the work he did, but I also like Mobius, Scott, Cobb, O'Bannon and everyone else who worked on that movie. It's not just Giger. His design for the alien was great, but it was made in stages, and didn't Shusset come up with the look for the facehugger? Yeah, it's a pretty suit, and the Jockey was based off a painting of Giger's, and the ship was something Scott and Giger worked on, together.

It'd be nice if he had more opportunities before he passed to work more in film, but the fact of the matter is is he was a private European artist who had a chance to work on a handful of films, but mainly didn't work in film. He was an artist before he was a filmmaker. The fact that he got chosen to work on Alien at all was a miracle (you can thank Scott for that one). I'll take what I get from Scott and company at this stage because frankly that's what we're going to get.


The guy's dead. I don't want more of him, because, well, again, dead as a door nail.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on Jun 24, 2017, 12:17:02 AM
I want more Giger.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Huggs on Jun 24, 2017, 03:42:30 AM
Seeing a true Giger-world on film would be amazing, but it'll likely never happen outside of the videogame arena. I'd love it if it turned out that the Giger-world played "Hell" to Covenant's "Paradise", and it was from this biomechanical hell that the xenomorph actually originated. But again, having panic stricken scientists or marines run into a large biomechanical womb only to be surrounded by walls full of black death might not have an easy time getting the green light.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 06:23:41 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on Jun 23, 2017, 11:13:34 PM
... I also like Mobius, Scott, Cobb, O'Bannon and everyone else who worked on that movie. It's not just Giger. His design for the alien was great, but it was made in stages, and didn't Shusset come up with the look for the facehugger? Yeah, it's a pretty suit, and the Jockey was based off a painting of Giger's, and the ship was something Scott and Giger worked on, together...

That's the core idea, the designs in the Alien franchise were a team effort.
I agree with your list of all these contributors.
- I'd just like to add a recent name who has had an influence on the prequel designs, Jon Spaihts.
Spaihts in his scripts came up with the classic Greek/Roman sculpture look of the Engineers. And that opened up the design range of the Engineer's buildings / art to include classic ancient earth motifs (giant head sculptures/statues, Renaissance style ceiling painting).   

- The Alien film design language is a mixture of the efforts of many creative people.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 24, 2017, 07:01:37 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jun 21, 2017, 04:37:22 AM
Quote from: Huggs on Jun 21, 2017, 03:53:13 AM
Sad to hear they're not getting the full film. Censorship is (in and of itself) a vile thing. I don't personally think Scott's steering this towards some large-scale intergalactic showdown. Unless the series gets handed to another director, such as Cameron or N.B., I don't see the Colonial Marines appearing on film in a significant way anytime soon, if ever again. This is, after all, a cash business. And unless it's got marvel or Disney attached to it, the love of the fan base only counts so much. A hard lesson was learned from King Arthur this year, and the reduced intake for covenant over Prometheus won't exactly help either. Perhaps it's time to get off this road of trying to keep everything intrinsically linked together. Maybe the only common link needed is the creature itself. They're ancient, and they're out there, everywhere. Plenty of different stories to be told. You don't need the company or Ripley to always be involved. Maybe reference other future films with wreckage and bones, but keep the blood fresh and release the kraken.

Or just have Jack Sparrow in an ironman suit swinging wonder woman's sword at a mummified Barbosa in the Mechanical Batsuit from D.O.J. while onboard a Juggernaut that's hurtling towards the sun and being chased by the guardians. And have tom cruise running, it doesn't matter where.


How about Scott's intention to make Haldeman's 'Forever War' into a movie?  He's been wanting to make a 'large scale intergalacitic showdown.' for years  You better believe it.  That's exactly where this is heading.

As for Disney touching this property lol.  If you think the Chinese censors removing content was bad enough, then can you imagine what the Disney cut of any 'ALIEN' movie would be like? 

Say goodbye to any violence, sexual references, androids kissing...  Say goodbye to anything remotely suggestive - fachuggers would be gone, no phallic Aliens allowed... at all.  It would be worse than Chinese censorship version because no one will get to see the movie the way it was intended because like you say, Disney is a business and Disney will only tackle safe bets for lowest common denominator audiences.  They make kids shows and 'ALIEN' is not a safe bet or child friendly.   

f**k Disney.  Never, ever let them near anything of any real value unless you want to entertain children and family friendly audiences with mediocre content.  f**k that. 

"I say we should nuke Disney and their PG13 friendly market from orbit.  It's the only way to be sure."

-Windebieste.

Right?! It seems like the Alien series is in legitimate danger from getting snatched up by Disney! YUCK! I hate how popular their stupid critically acclaimed content is.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 24, 2017, 07:03:39 AM
 :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 24, 2017, 08:22:32 AM
Quote from: NickisSmart on Jun 23, 2017, 11:13:34 PM
Quote from: Predaker on Jun 23, 2017, 09:02:29 PM
At least we would presumably get a modern take on the original Giger design in all its biomechanical glory. I'm always game for a new Alien film that will at least be entertaining.

People clamor for him and want more Giger. The guy is dead. I liked him in Alien, the work he did, but I also like Mobius, Scott, Cobb, O'Bannon and everyone else who worked on that movie. It's not just Giger. His design for the alien was great, but it was made in stages, and didn't Shusset come up with the look for the facehugger? Yeah, it's a pretty suit, and the Jockey was based off a painting of Giger's, and the ship was something Scott and Giger worked on, together.

It'd be nice if he had more opportunities before he passed to work more in film, but the fact of the matter is is he was a private European artist who had a chance to work on a handful of films, but mainly didn't work in film. He was an artist before he was a filmmaker. The fact that he got chosen to work on Alien at all was a miracle (you can thank Scott for that one). I'll take what I get from Scott and company at this stage because frankly that's what we're going to get.


The guy's dead. I don't want more of him, because, well, again, dead as a door nail.

Don't forget Carlo Rambaldi who created hydraulics for the Alien's head.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jun 24, 2017, 04:33:07 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 24, 2017, 08:22:32 AM
Don't forget Carlo Rambaldi who created hydraulics for the Alien's head.

Ah, true. Yeah, I remember he didn't quite want all the detail with the monster's mouth and jaw but Ridley insisted so Carlo just gave him what he wanted.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 07:56:47 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 24, 2017, 07:01:37 AM
Right?! It seems like the Alien series is in legitimate danger from getting snatched up by Disney!

Not that I can see.
The Alien franchise is owned by Fox and I can find no news where Fox is going to sell the franchise to Disney.

The only connection between Disney and the Alien franchise is with a ride at Walt Disney World (in Florida) called "The Great Movie Ride".
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Movie_Ride

Disney acquired the licensing rights to "Alien" for a ride. And that's the limit of Disney's control of the franchise.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 24, 2017, 08:55:57 PM
Woooooooosh.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 426Buddy on Jun 24, 2017, 11:05:02 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 07:56:47 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 24, 2017, 07:01:37 AM
Right?! It seems like the Alien series is in legitimate danger from getting snatched up by Disney!

Not that I can see.
The Alien franchise is owned by Fox and I can find no news where Fox is going to sell the franchise to Disney.

The only connection between Disney and the Alien franchise is with a ride at Walt Disney World (in Florida) called "The Great Movie Ride".
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Movie_Ride

Disney acquired the licensing rights to "Alien" for a ride. And that's the limit of Disney's control of the franchise.

;)

That was a fun ride, i got the chance to go there when i was 9. I hope they have updated it though because it was pretty basic.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 06:23:41 AM

- I'd just like to add a recent name who has had an influence on the prequel designs, Jon Spaihts.
Spaihts in his scripts came up with the classic Greek/Roman sculpture look of the Engineers. And that opened up the design range of the Engineer's buildings / art to include classic ancient earth motifs (giant head sculptures/statues, Renaissance style ceiling painting).   


Or did Ridley suggest all those idea and Spaiht just worked them into the script?   

I give Spaihts zero credit.  "Engineers" was a f**king awful script.  his other films have all been terrible.  passengers was a f**king nightmare.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jun 25, 2017, 03:39:41 AM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 23, 2017, 11:56:03 AM
i might have mentioned this before in another thread. .but it's been awhile and i don't think i eloborated much. .anyway a fair comparison in regards to another fox franchise. .Percy Jackson first movie cost 95 mil and earned 226 worldwide, very close to what covenant is currently at and Percy got a sequel made, in 2013 it was made at a cost of 90 mil and earned 200 mil at the box office. .bringing the franchise to a screeching halt. .so i think their is hope for a covenant sequel based on those numbers. . ?


. .so if covenant can just make it to about 240. .then i think a sequel is more than justifiable. . .

With Percy it looks like they get double their budget back.  Alien is different, though, the profit ratio needs to be 3 to 1,  based on how the previous films performed.  So Covenant needs to make another 60 mil or so (from 220 mil).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jun 25, 2017, 05:38:17 AM
Why is it different? Why 3 to 1?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jun 25, 2017, 05:55:08 AM
Because since Alien 3 every Alien film (except Resurrection) made 3x their budget back.  Alien and Aliens were big earners and the franchise will never reach those heights again (?).

Now with Resurrection, we know that led to a 7 year hiatus and a reboot with the AVP films.  As of right now, Covenant is at Resurrection numbers which isn't good.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 25, 2017, 06:20:21 AM
ooooh f**k. .it better be big in japan then. .but also bear in mind weavers age?. .she was always keen on another, but far as i remember she would only return if they provided her with a decent script that did not take place on earth. .end of resurrection made it look like they were heading straight here. .plus ridley and cameron had plans for alien 5 and decided to let it go the moment fox greenlit the offensive low budget crap known as avp. .which imo saved the predators from obscurity and did nothing but nearly ruin the alien franchise. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 25, 2017, 06:26:59 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jun 25, 2017, 05:55:08 AM
Because since Alien 3 every Alien film (except Resurrection) made 3x their budget back.  Alien and Aliens were big earners and the franchise will never reach those heights again (?).

Now with Resurrection, we know that led to a 7 year hiatus and a reboot with the AVP films.  As of right now, Covenant is at Resurrection numbers which isn't good.

Soft reboot and retcon incoming (2024 probably).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 25, 2017, 09:58:02 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jun 25, 2017, 03:39:41 AM

With Percy it looks like they get double their budget back.  Alien is different, though, the profit ratio needs to be 3 to 1,  based on how the previous films performed.  So Covenant needs to make another 60 mil or so (from 220 mil).

The performance of previous movies in a franchise have nothing to do with how much money the most recent installment has to make in order to be profitable. the only thing determining that is return of investment. If the new movie ends up bringing in more money than it cost to make, it's by default profitable.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 25, 2017, 10:30:30 AM
Yeah.  What's this 2 to 1, 3 to 1 deal?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 25, 2017, 11:10:29 AM
It's nonsense. There's a general rule that a movie has to earn twice its production budget in order to enter the realm of profitability.
However, we lack a lot of information: We don't know the marketing budget, presales to foreign territories, licensing fees, projections for TV rights and home video sales, or the added value to the franchise as a whole by Covenant.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: remember on Jun 25, 2017, 11:52:42 AM
Remember if your comparing this to resurrection's entire box office and using inflation, don't forget to inflate the budget, which would be around 147 million dollars, not including marketing, perhaps not the best comparison. The home market seems more vibrant these days too, people buying laser disc and VHS possible wasn't much profit back then, plus resurrection is a terrible movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 25, 2017, 11:58:33 AM
I suspect the marketing campaign was on the expensive side, but merch and blu-ray sales are probably going to cover for that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jun 25, 2017, 01:17:59 PM
Resurrection only made twice it's budget, that's why it was rebooted.

If you look at it from an accounting perspective, Alien made 10X it's budget, Aliens made 7X it's budget.  Then Alien 3 makes only 3X it's budget.  Diminishing returns had set in by this point.  But AVP, AVPR and Prometheus all made back 3X their budget.  So, if you were an investor, you'd expect to make 3 dollars for every 1 dollar spent.

Merchandising is a whole different deal.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 25, 2017, 05:33:07 PM
Box office as of June 25:

Domestic:         $73,328,461
Foreign:          $154,198,291

Worldwide:      $227,526,752   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 25, 2017, 07:04:05 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 25, 2017, 05:33:07 PM
Box office as of June 25:

Domestic:         $73,328,461
Foreign:          $154,198,291

Worldwide:      $227,526,752

I see those numbers are from Box Office mojo, however if you check for China it hasn't been update since 6/18/17 since it has it at 29 million.

However if you check China's box office as of Today

http://english.entgroup.cn/boxoffice/cn/daily/

its 41 million.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 25, 2017, 07:20:05 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 06:23:41 AM
- I'd just like to add a recent name who has had an influence on the prequel designs, Jon Spaihts.
Spaihts in his scripts came up with the classic Greek/Roman sculpture look of the Engineers. And that opened up the design range of the Engineer's buildings / art to include classic ancient earth motifs (giant head sculptures/statues, Renaissance style ceiling painting).   

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
"Engineers" was a f**king awful script.  his other films have all been terrible.  passengers was a f**king nightmare.

It's fine if you believe that Spaihts is a bad writer.
But a "bad" writer can come up with a new idea.

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Or did Ridley suggest all those idea and Spaiht just worked them into the script?   

I give Spaihts zero credit...

I can't find evidence that Ridley came up with the original idea of the Engineer's look and their classic earth style architecture as seen in "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
But Spaihts claims that he thought of the Engineers as looking human and that they helped develop ancient architecture on earth. 

QuoteGiven the age of the wreck as it's characterized in the first Alien movie, my first thought was that these ancient giants must have been the von Daniken‑style aliens who some believe helped to shape ancient civilizations, and raise our early monuments, and, perhaps, even to shape the development of the species itself.
I imagined them as the Engineers who fomented sentient life on earth and then schooled that life into their own image, both cognitively and physically. I suppose the closing idea was that that elephantine alien face of the space jockey was merely a mask. Underneath it, to our astonishment, it would be revealed that they looked like us. Or, perhaps more accurately, that we looked like them.
https://gointothestory.blcklst.com/interview-part-1-jon-spaihts-5cf713ab14c4

* Spaihts claims that he came up with these ideas.
And I can't find anything where Ridley contradicts that.

* Going back to the design style of the Alien prequels which includes; the shrine/head room, the Engineer city, with their ancient earth designs.
And the Engineers looking human, (as they made humanity in their own image).
This design language seems to come from Spaihts' scripts/proposals. 

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 25, 2017, 08:40:21 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 25, 2017, 07:20:05 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 06:23:41 AM
- I'd just like to add a recent name who has had an influence on the prequel designs, Jon Spaihts.
Spaihts in his scripts came up with the classic Greek/Roman sculpture look of the Engineers. And that opened up the design range of the Engineer's buildings / art to include classic ancient earth motifs (giant head sculptures/statues, Renaissance style ceiling painting).   

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
"Engineers" was a f**king awful script.  his other films have all been terrible.  passengers was a f**king nightmare.

It's fine if you believe that Spaihts is a bad writer.
But a "bad" writer can come up with a new idea.

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Or did Ridley suggest all those idea and Spaiht just worked them into the script?   

I give Spaihts zero credit...

I can't find evidence that Ridley came up with the original idea of the Engineer's look and their classic earth style architecture as seen in "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
But Spaihts claims that he thought of the Engineers as looking human and that they helped develop ancient architecture on earth. 

QuoteGiven the age of the wreck as it's characterized in the first Alien movie, my first thought was that these ancient giants must have been the von Daniken‑style aliens who some believe helped to shape ancient civilizations, and raise our early monuments, and, perhaps, even to shape the development of the species itself.
I imagined them as the Engineers who fomented sentient life on earth and then schooled that life into their own image, both cognitively and physically. I suppose the closing idea was that that elephantine alien face of the space jockey was merely a mask. Underneath it, to our astonishment, it would be revealed that they looked like us. Or, perhaps more accurately, that we looked like them.
https://gointothestory.blcklst.com/interview-part-1-jon-spaihts-5cf713ab14c4

* Spaihts claims that he came up with these ideas.
And I can't find anything where Ridley contradicts that.

* Going back to the design style of the Alien prequels which includes; the shrine/head room, the Engineer city, with their ancient earth designs.
And the Engineers looking human, (as they made humanity in their own image).
This design language seems to come from Spaihts' scripts/proposals. 

;)

Ridley Scott said in interviews that he believes that Aliens like the Enginners created us. It's his theory but he believes in them.

Ridley Scott doesn't believe in Gods. He believes in All Powerful Aliens. So, I suppose PROMETHEUS were created around his beliefs/ideas.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 26, 2017, 04:56:02 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 25, 2017, 08:40:21 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 25, 2017, 07:20:05 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 06:23:41 AM
- I'd just like to add a recent name who has had an influence on the prequel designs, Jon Spaihts.
Spaihts in his scripts came up with the classic Greek/Roman sculpture look of the Engineers. And that opened up the design range of the Engineer's buildings / art to include classic ancient earth motifs (giant head sculptures/statues, Renaissance style ceiling painting).   

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
"Engineers" was a f**king awful script.  his other films have all been terrible.  passengers was a f**king nightmare.

It's fine if you believe that Spaihts is a bad writer.
But a "bad" writer can come up with a new idea.

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Or did Ridley suggest all those idea and Spaiht just worked them into the script?   

I give Spaihts zero credit...

I can't find evidence that Ridley came up with the original idea of the Engineer's look and their classic earth style architecture as seen in "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
But Spaihts claims that he thought of the Engineers as looking human and that they helped develop ancient architecture on earth. 

QuoteGiven the age of the wreck as it's characterized in the first Alien movie, my first thought was that these ancient giants must have been the von Daniken‑style aliens who some believe helped to shape ancient civilizations, and raise our early monuments, and, perhaps, even to shape the development of the species itself.
I imagined them as the Engineers who fomented sentient life on earth and then schooled that life into their own image, both cognitively and physically. I suppose the closing idea was that that elephantine alien face of the space jockey was merely a mask. Underneath it, to our astonishment, it would be revealed that they looked like us. Or, perhaps more accurately, that we looked like them.
https://gointothestory.blcklst.com/interview-part-1-jon-spaihts-5cf713ab14c4

* Spaihts claims that he came up with these ideas.
And I can't find anything where Ridley contradicts that.

* Going back to the design style of the Alien prequels which includes; the shrine/head room, the Engineer city, with their ancient earth designs.
And the Engineers looking human, (as they made humanity in their own image).
This design language seems to come from Spaihts' scripts/proposals. 

;)

Ridley Scott said in interviews that he believes that Aliens like the Enginners created us. It's his theory but he believes in them.

Ridley Scott doesn't believe in Gods. He believes in All Powerful Aliens. So, I suppose PROMETHEUS were created around his beliefs/ideas.

Imo it is a matter of when ideas were proposed and who came up with those ideas at what time.
- The earliest press interviews by Ridley about "Prometheus" come from a few months before the film was released. These interviews were in early 2012 or late 2011.
- But Spaihts made his pitch to Fox and Scott in 2009. That would be when Spaihts originated the ideas about the Engineers which were new to the franchise and then he began writing his scripts.
- I cannot find an interview/commentary by Scott before 2009 where he states that the Space Jockey was an Engineer who looked human and that these Engineers helped create life on earth, humanity and ancient earth culture.

Also, notice what Spaihts says in the interview quote that I posted.
"my first thought"

Jon Spaihts has taken ownership of these ideas and I can't find where Ridley contradicts this claim by Spaihts.
 
;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 05:04:38 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 26, 2017, 04:56:02 AM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 25, 2017, 08:40:21 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 25, 2017, 07:20:05 PM
Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 24, 2017, 06:23:41 AM
- I'd just like to add a recent name who has had an influence on the prequel designs, Jon Spaihts.
Spaihts in his scripts came up with the classic Greek/Roman sculpture look of the Engineers. And that opened up the design range of the Engineer's buildings / art to include classic ancient earth motifs (giant head sculptures/statues, Renaissance style ceiling painting).   

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
"Engineers" was a f**king awful script.  his other films have all been terrible.  passengers was a f**king nightmare.

It's fine if you believe that Spaihts is a bad writer.
But a "bad" writer can come up with a new idea.

Quote from: fiveways on Jun 25, 2017, 02:42:13 AM
Or did Ridley suggest all those idea and Spaiht just worked them into the script?   

I give Spaihts zero credit...

I can't find evidence that Ridley came up with the original idea of the Engineer's look and their classic earth style architecture as seen in "Prometheus" and "Covenant".
But Spaihts claims that he thought of the Engineers as looking human and that they helped develop ancient architecture on earth. 

QuoteGiven the age of the wreck as it's characterized in the first Alien movie, my first thought was that these ancient giants must have been the von Daniken‑style aliens who some believe helped to shape ancient civilizations, and raise our early monuments, and, perhaps, even to shape the development of the species itself.
I imagined them as the Engineers who fomented sentient life on earth and then schooled that life into their own image, both cognitively and physically. I suppose the closing idea was that that elephantine alien face of the space jockey was merely a mask. Underneath it, to our astonishment, it would be revealed that they looked like us. Or, perhaps more accurately, that we looked like them.
https://gointothestory.blcklst.com/interview-part-1-jon-spaihts-5cf713ab14c4

* Spaihts claims that he came up with these ideas.
And I can't find anything where Ridley contradicts that.

* Going back to the design style of the Alien prequels which includes; the shrine/head room, the Engineer city, with their ancient earth designs.
And the Engineers looking human, (as they made humanity in their own image).
This design language seems to come from Spaihts' scripts/proposals. 

;)

Ridley Scott said in interviews that he believes that Aliens like the Enginners created us. It's his theory but he believes in them.

Ridley Scott doesn't believe in Gods. He believes in All Powerful Aliens. So, I suppose PROMETHEUS were created around his beliefs/ideas.

Imo it is a matter of when ideas were proposed and who came up with those ideas at what time.
- The earliest press interviews by Ridley about "Prometheus" come from a few months before the film was released. These interviews were in early 2012 or late 2011.
- But Spaihts made his pitch to Fox and Scott in 2009. That would be when Spaihts originated the ideas about the Engineers which were new to the franchise and then he began writing his scripts.
- I cannot find an interview/commentary by Scott before 2009 where he states that the Space Jockey was an Engineer who looked human and that these Engineers helped create life on earth, humanity and ancient earth culture.
 
;)

I remembered an old interview where Ridley Scott talked about Von Danniken and his theories.

Ridley Scott was interested in Von Danniken and his theories since a long, very long time ago.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on Jun 26, 2017, 05:14:55 AM
I hate to say I told you so but it did tell the so called experts about 40 pages back this film is not a flop until the fat lady sings (Chinese box office).
It's time to call it, the film is not a flop. It's not a hit and I had any money to invest in a sequel I wouldn't do it. If I was an investor with Fox I would say put my money into the Cartel film Ridley has planned but don't put it into another Alien film as it's ever decreasing returns based on the last two films.
Besides as a Ridley Scott fan I want to see him do something original for him. I want to see Cartel channeling Tony Scott. Ridley told NZ Stuff h has 10 films left in him (http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/film/92454786/Alien-Covenant-Milford-Sounds-big-moment-in-the-Hollywood-spotlight) and I would rather he go out in a blaze of glory making something that can live up to Gladiator or Kingdom Of Heaven Directors Cut than an even lower budget Alien film

Page 39 of thread:
"It can't be called a flop until all the receipts are in. Resident Evil The Final Chapter was deemed a flop but then opened to 90+ million weekend in China going on to make 160 million there. That's now the biggest film of the series and so big they are doing an immediate reboot.

I don't for one second preditct AC will do that in China but then I never would have said RE TFC would make 90 mil opening.

You never know, so it's a little early to pronounce it as a flop. Wait until it's hit the full set of markets then call it a flop"
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 26, 2017, 05:59:47 AM
. .if Vin Diesel could finance the last Riddick movie for 38 mil. .then i think Ridley can do a sequel to covenant for 70 - 80 mil. .keep it on the covenant and kill david in the opening scene. .or do whatever it takes. .i just want that darn sequel. .i guess 250 is still in reach with japan coming up. .it will probably make at least another 5 - 10 mil before the end of it's china run. .prom made over 20 mil in japan. .so me i still hope. .lol


. .i don'r care if he does the cartel. .whatever. .their some other movie his doing as well. .as long as we get a sequel. .and if he only acts as producer. .then so be it. .better than no sequel at all. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: dkwookie on Jun 26, 2017, 08:07:51 AM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 26, 2017, 05:59:47 AM
. .if Vin Diesel could finance the last Riddick movie for 38 mil. .then i think Ridley can do a sequel to covenant for 70 - 80 mil. .keep it on the covenant and kill david in the opening scene. .or do whatever it takes. .i just want that darn sequel. .i guess 250 is still in reach with japan coming up. .it will probably make at least another 5 - 10 mil before the end of it's china run. .prom made over 20 mil in japan. .so me i still hope. .lol


. .i don'r care if he does the cartel. .whatever. .their some other movie his doing as well. .as long as we get a sequel. .and if he only acts as producer. .then so be it. .better than no sequel at all. .

I think 250 is where it's going to end up, which given the budget is not bad. If I were Ridley I would produce the next one with a smaller budget and an up and coming horror director. Maybe the guy who made Lights Out. Just get it back to the horror roots again with an A list B movie
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 26, 2017, 10:14:35 AM
The problem with A-list stars is that they so darn expensive. .i like Fassbender but at the same time he might be a bit pricey. .waterston and mcbride can't be that expensive. .the later usually only apear in fairly low budget comedy fair and waterstan is'nt that well known yet. .but they might end up as alien incubators. .so in that case. .get a fresh faced newbie actress a try. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 06:00:46 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on Jun 26, 2017, 05:14:55 AM
I hate to say I told you so but it did tell the so called experts about 40 pages back this film is not a flop until the fat lady sings (Chinese box office).
It's time to call it, the film is not a flop. It's not a hit and I had any money to invest in a sequel I wouldn't do it. If I was an investor with Fox I would say put my money into the Cartel film Ridley has planned but don't put it into another Alien film as it's ever decreasing returns based on the last two films.
Besides as a Ridley Scott fan I want to see him do something original for him. I want to see Cartel channeling Tony Scott. Ridley told NZ Stuff h has 10 films left in him (http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/film/92454786/Alien-Covenant-Milford-Sounds-big-moment-in-the-Hollywood-spotlight) and I would rather he go out in a blaze of glory making something that can live up to Gladiator or Kingdom Of Heaven Directors Cut than an even lower budget Alien film

Page 39 of thread:
"It can't be called a flop until all the receipts are in. Resident Evil The Final Chapter was deemed a flop but then opened to 90+ million weekend in China going on to make 160 million there. That's now the biggest film of the series and so big they are doing an immediate reboot.

I don't for one second preditct AC will do that in China but then I never would have said RE TFC would make 90 mil opening.

You never know, so it's a little early to pronounce it as a flop. Wait until it's hit the full set of markets then call it a flop"

I agree 100%.

Actually, I'm more excited for 3 other Ridley Scott options: BATTLE OF BRITAIN, WRAITHS OF THE BROKEN LAND and THE CARTEL.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on Jun 26, 2017, 06:02:02 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 26, 2017, 10:14:35 AM
The problem with A-list stars is that they so darn expensive. .i like Fassbender but at the same time he might be a bit pricey. .waterston and mcbride can't be that expensive. .the later usually only apear in fairly low budget comedy fair and waterstan is'nt that well known yet. .but they might end up as alien incubators. .so in that case. .get a fresh faced newbie actress a try. .
Actually, I read somewhere that Fassbender doesn't ask that much for his roles.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jun 26, 2017, 06:16:07 PM
Fassbender is acclaimed but not A-list. He can't open a movie. Theron is A-list and was added to Prometheus to make it more appealing to mainstream audiences.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 26, 2017, 06:46:42 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 05:04:38 AM
I remembered an old interview where Ridley Scott talked about Von Danniken and his theories.

Ridley Scott was interested in Von Danniken and his theories since a long, very long time ago.

I did a Google search for Von Daniken and his theories Ridley Scott.

The earliest link I could find with this search was a Hollywood Reporter article from June 28, 2011 about a "Prometheus" press event at CineEurope.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/ridley-scott-michael-fassbender-noomi-206321

From the article;

QuoteThe British director said the film's storyline, and script ... was partially inspired by the writings of legendary Swiss sci-fi writer Eric van Daniken.

But 2011 is after 2009.
In 2009 Spaihts made his pitch for the "Alien" prequel.

Spaihts has said as I've posted;

Quotemy first thought was that these ancient giants must have been the von Daniken‑style aliens who some believe helped to shape ancient civilizations, and raise our early monuments, and, perhaps, even to shape the development of the species itself.
https://gointothestory.blcklst.com/interview-part-1-jon-spaihts-5cf713ab14c4

Again, Spaihts made his pitch to Fox and Scott in 2009.
Spaihts' first idea was to tie the Space Jockey with Von Daniken's concepts.

Spaihts has claimed that he came up with connecting these ideas from Von Daniken and the Engineers.
Ridley AFAIK has not contracted that.

* Back to the design language of "Prometheus". It includes human looking space aliens and classic architecture / motifs from ancient times.
The origin of putting those design concepts into "Prometheus" it seems comes from the ideas/scripts from Spaihts.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 07:22:20 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 26, 2017, 06:46:42 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 05:04:38 AM
I remembered an old interview where Ridley Scott talked about Von Danniken and his theories.

Ridley Scott was interested in Von Danniken and his theories since a long, very long time ago.

I did a Google search for Von Daniken and his theories Ridley Scott.

The earliest link I could find with this search was a Hollywood Reporter article from June 28, 2011 about a "Prometheus" press event at CineEurope.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/ridley-scott-michael-fassbender-noomi-206321

From the article;

QuoteThe British director said the film's storyline, and script ... was partially inspired by the writings of legendary Swiss sci-fi writer Eric van Daniken.

But 2011 is after 2009.
In 2009 Spaihts made his pitch for the "Alien" prequel.

Spaihts has said as I've posted;

Quotemy first thought was that these ancient giants must have been the von Daniken‑style aliens who some believe helped to shape ancient civilizations, and raise our early monuments, and, perhaps, even to shape the development of the species itself.
https://gointothestory.blcklst.com/interview-part-1-jon-spaihts-5cf713ab14c4

Again, Spaihts made his pitch to Fox and Scott in 2009.
Spaihts' first idea was to tie the Space Jockey with Von Daniken's concepts.

Spaihts has claimed that he came up with connecting these ideas from Von Daniken and the Engineers.
Ridley AFAIK has not contracted that.

* Back to the design language of "Prometheus". It includes human looking space aliens and classic architecture / motifs from ancient times.
The origin of putting those design concepts into "Prometheus" it seems comes from the ideas/scripts from Spaihts.

;)

You could be right.

Because Ridley Scott wasn't interested in PROMETHEUS at the beginning. Carl Rinsch was the first Director. FOX fired him. FOX only wanted Ridley Scott.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 26, 2017, 08:50:23 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 07:22:20 PM
Carl Rinsch was the first Director. FOX fired him. FOX only wanted Ridley Scott.
and now I only want Scott, too
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 26, 2017, 09:29:55 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 26, 2017, 08:50:23 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 07:22:20 PM
Carl Rinsch was the first Director. FOX fired him. FOX only wanted Ridley Scott.
and now I only want Scott, too
Same. Can't imagine any other director finishing this. The only other director I would trust with the Alien franchise in general is David Cronenberg to be honest.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jun 26, 2017, 10:00:14 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jun 26, 2017, 08:50:23 PM
Quote from: PierreVW on Jun 26, 2017, 07:22:20 PM
Carl Rinsch was the first Director. FOX fired him. FOX only wanted Ridley Scott.
and now I only want Scott, too

Agreed. The die is cast. Alien felt sort of self-contained, and Cameron was extending or building on something that was "done," more or less. I think Covenant isn't finished, and Ridley needs to be allowed to finish the tale he wants to tell.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: chrisandy on Jun 26, 2017, 10:31:13 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on Jun 26, 2017, 05:14:55 AM
I hate to say I told you so but it did tell the so called experts about 40 pages back this film is not a flop until the fat lady sings (Chinese box office).
It's time to call it, the film is not a flop. It's not a hit and I had any money to invest in a sequel I wouldn't do it. If I was an investor with Fox I would say put my money into the Cartel film Ridley has planned but don't put it into another Alien film as it's ever decreasing returns based on the last two films.
Besides as a Ridley Scott fan I want to see him do something original for him. I want to see Cartel channeling Tony Scott. Ridley told NZ Stuff h has 10 films left in him (http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/film/92454786/Alien-Covenant-Milford-Sounds-big-moment-in-the-Hollywood-spotlight) and I would rather he go out in a blaze of glory making something that can live up to Gladiator or Kingdom Of Heaven Directors Cut than an even lower budget Alien film

Page 39 of thread:
"It can't be called a flop until all the receipts are in. Resident Evil The Final Chapter was deemed a flop but then opened to 90+ million weekend in China going on to make 160 million there. That's now the biggest film of the series and so big they are doing an immediate reboot.

I don't for one second preditct AC will do that in China but then I never would have said RE TFC would make 90 mil opening.

You never know, so it's a little early to pronounce it as a flop. Wait until it's hit the full set of markets then call it a flop"

As with most other folks on here, missing the point.

Average revenue split for domestic B.O. is 50% theaters, 50% studio. China is a lot more opaque - closer to 25% for the studio. So even if it made $30 million (and it had a sharp drop too), not all of that is going to the studio.

Also worth considering - P&A spend. It's likely Fox spent the budget, or close to the budget, of A:C on marketing. So production and advertising cost put together equals about.. $200 million.

In other words, the film would need to make $400 million to break even.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 26, 2017, 11:05:10 PM
Quote from: chrisandy on Jun 26, 2017, 10:31:13 PM
Quote from: Dkwookie on Jun 26, 2017, 05:14:55 AM
I hate to say I told you so but it did tell the so called experts about 40 pages back this film is not a flop until the fat lady sings (Chinese box office).
It's time to call it, the film is not a flop. It's not a hit and I had any money to invest in a sequel I wouldn't do it. If I was an investor with Fox I would say put my money into the Cartel film Ridley has planned but don't put it into another Alien film as it's ever decreasing returns based on the last two films.
Besides as a Ridley Scott fan I want to see him do something original for him. I want to see Cartel channeling Tony Scott. Ridley told NZ Stuff h has 10 films left in him (http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/film/92454786/Alien-Covenant-Milford-Sounds-big-moment-in-the-Hollywood-spotlight) and I would rather he go out in a blaze of glory making something that can live up to Gladiator or Kingdom Of Heaven Directors Cut than an even lower budget Alien film

Page 39 of thread:
"It can't be called a flop until all the receipts are in. Resident Evil The Final Chapter was deemed a flop but then opened to 90+ million weekend in China going on to make 160 million there. That's now the biggest film of the series and so big they are doing an immediate reboot.

I don't for one second preditct AC will do that in China but then I never would have said RE TFC would make 90 mil opening.

You never know, so it's a little early to pronounce it as a flop. Wait until it's hit the full set of markets then call it a flop"

As with most other folks on here, missing the point.

Average revenue split for domestic B.O. is 50% theaters, 50% studio. China is a lot more opaque - closer to 25% for the studio. So even if it made $30 million (and it had a sharp drop too), not all of that is going to the studio.

Also worth considering - P&A spend. It's likely Fox spent the budget, or close to the budget, of A:C on marketing. So production and advertising cost put together equals about.. $200 million.

In other words, the film would need to make $400 million to break even.
That would mean Prometheus wouldn't have been a box office success. Surely it has to be less. I'd say around 300 million maybe.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jun 27, 2017, 02:41:51 AM
It has to make another 50 mil at least to get a sequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 11:58:25 AM
if a movie can double it's production budget then it's not considered a flop. .because marketing cost can be covered by tv licencing, merchandice, dvd/bluray sales etc. Prom had a reportrd marketing cost of 50mil. .so i don't see why they would double the marketing cost on covenant. .so it's likely not made aprofit yet but it is definately going to get their sooner or later. .unfortunately breaking even and making a few mil does not guarantee a sequel. .fox will have to decide if they are willing to take the risk and all we can do in the meanwhile is hope and pray. .
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 27, 2017, 12:03:24 PM
I tend to think the promo costs weren't that huge on this.  Last Supper, The Crossing and the video messages would've likely all been shot as part of principal photography in Sydney where they were getting a nice old tax break on the Australian tax payer (roads, schools, hospitals and Alien films - suits me).  These were pretty substantial promotional pieces that wouldn't have required extra marketing dollars.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Jun 27, 2017, 12:08:22 PM
I know Prometheus made over $400 million, but that's sort of absurdly high for an R-rated horror movie.  It seems unrealistic for Fox to bank on this movie making even $300 million, let alone matching the $400 mil success of Prometheus, doesn't it?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 12:24:59 PM
Sci-Fi Horror is a tough sell. .Prom had a softer R, so it was a little easier to sell, a lot of people don't like horror, audiences tend to give them a lower rating. .not uncommon for a horror movie to get a C+ or B-

the riddick movies were all done on a relatively small budget. .except for cronicles wich bombed quite badly. .the last one only made litte more than double it's small 38 mil budget and considering that resident evil made about 80 percent of it's 312 gross from china alone. .how profitable was it really ?. .if the studio only gets back 25 percent of that. .?. .still it's getting a reboot. .have to google what the budget on that one was?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Jun 27, 2017, 03:45:00 PM
Quote from: necrotard on Jun 27, 2017, 12:08:22 PM
I know Prometheus made over $400 million, but that's sort of absurdly high for an R-rated horror movie.  It seems unrealistic for Fox to bank on this movie making even $300 million, let alone matching the $400 mil success of Prometheus, doesn't it?

Life didn't even break $100million worldwide and even had an A-List cast to boot.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Jun 27, 2017, 03:50:48 PM
I was glancing at the Paranormal Activity movies on BoxOfficeMojo.  Those are always regarded as massive successes, yet most of those only grossed around $100 million.  They're just considered successful because they're practically made with a single cheap camera and some fishing line.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 04:13:28 PM
Ok guys , what is the latest figures? ........Do we get a sequel or not?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 04:34:18 PM
Quote from: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 04:13:28 PM
Ok guys , what is the latest figures? ........Do we get a sequel or not?


well i hate that it so in a grey area right now. .i meaning if it hits anything between 240-260. .it's still in that grey area. .neither a hit or a miss. .will we get a sequal. .maybe . .maybe not. .so now the waiting game starts. .it would have almost been easier to except a complete spectacular flop. .but i always wanted it to succeed and i thought it was super entertaining. .love covenant. .personally i thought it was up the with the first 2 originals. . But according to so many of these so called fan boys it was a complete f**king incoherent mess with awfull effects and stupid plot devices and bad characters and bad acting and bad space ships and bad bad bad. .oh my god?. .f**k all those people i loved it and i will gladly lap up any and every drop that this franchise got coming. .actually enjoying prom and covenant more than alien and aliens at this point!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 27, 2017, 05:03:10 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 04:34:18 PM
Quote from: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 04:13:28 PM
Ok guys , what is the latest figures? ........Do we get a sequel or not?


well i hate that it so in a grey area right now. .i meaning if it hits anything between 240-260. .it's still in that grey area. .neither a hit or a miss. .will we get a sequal. .maybe . .maybe not. .so now the waiting game starts. .it would have almost been easier to except a complete spectacular flop. .but i always wanted it to succeed and i thought it was super entertaining. .love covenant. .personally i thought it was up the with the first 2 originals. . But according to so many of these so called fan boys it was a complete f**king incoherent mess with awfull effects and stupid plot devices and bad characters and bad acting and bad space ships and bad bad bad. .oh my god?. .f**k all those people i loved it and i will gladly lap up any and every drop that this franchise got coming. .actually enjoying prom and covenant more than alien and aliens at this point!

I agree 100%.

ALIEN: COVENANT is very entertaining to me too. I love those 3: PROMETHEUS, ALIEN: COVENANT and ALIEN.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 27, 2017, 05:14:08 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jun 27, 2017, 03:45:00 PM
Quote from: necrotard on Jun 27, 2017, 12:08:22 PM
I know Prometheus made over $400 million, but that's sort of absurdly high for an R-rated horror movie.  It seems unrealistic for Fox to bank on this movie making even $300 million, let alone matching the $400 mil success of Prometheus, doesn't it?

Life didn't even break $100million worldwide and even had an A-List cast to boot.
But then again very average Elysium, which only had good visual aesthetic and special effects but a pedestrian story earned more than Covenant, probably on strength of Matt Damon alone.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 05:44:23 PM
Thats why,  if there will be sequel we need a main male character..........and my vote goes to Tom Hardy an absolute badass.
Will effect the box office 100 %.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 05:44:54 PM
to answer salt and fries. .the reason that movie earned so much was because of the huge expectation after district 9 and the inclution of Jodie Foster. .it was a very meh movie overall. .and i am from SA and i was rooting for it. .having stayed in Johannesburg for 16 years and soon going back. .but nah it was a boring mess and so was chappie. .i actually slightly preferred the latter. .but not even weaver could quite save it. .including '' die antwoord'' a very urban rap weird f**ked up local band to the mix. .i dunno. ..i don't hate them. .but i just did not quite get why they were even allowed on the set. .lol
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jun 27, 2017, 06:13:38 PM
Quote from: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 05:44:23 PM
Thats why,  if there will be sequel we need a main male character..........and my vote goes to Tom Hardy an absolute badass.
Will effect the box office 100 %.

And Leonardo Di Caprio. He actually was considered for the role of David before, and he with Ridley Scott had a good history of doing films together. I think the combined star power of Di Caprio, Hardy and Fassbender could do wonders, especially if Scott wants to go with the flow and finish with a bang.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 27, 2017, 06:51:30 PM
Yeah, you can't just offer the alien. You've got to offer a bunch of things.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 27, 2017, 06:59:42 PM
 So, alien covenant now has Japan as its final release country. Prometheus took in about 22 million back 2012, meaning if it pulls in around the same now it will breach 250 million worldwide. At those numbers, I can't see why fox does not greenlight a sequel, probably  with a similar or just slightly less budget then covenant.

Hopefully, ridley Scott will pull out all the necessary tricks and stops to make a better sequel to covenant.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 27, 2017, 07:00:13 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 04:34:18 PM
Quote from: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 04:13:28 PM
Ok guys , what is the latest figures? ........Do we get a sequel or not?


well i hate that it so in a grey area right now. .i meaning if it hits anything between 240-260. .it's still in that grey area. .neither a hit or a miss. .will we get a sequal. .maybe . .maybe not. .so now the waiting game starts...

That's pretty much my view of it.
Worldwide box office is now;    $227,814,263   
It should go above $240 million after Japan. How much? Who knows.

As for a sequel, Fox needs to make some profit on "Covenant" and that will take time with streaming/disk sale money.
Imo there will be another Alien prequel/sequel, someday.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 07:00:28 PM
Jesus. . . ?! with those actors onboard it.s not gonna be cheap. .what the new installment will need. .if it ever gets realilezd . .then in my always extremely humble opinion  . ..life contiinues. .like or hate it. . if at least waterston survives. .i grew a little fond of her character. .more so than rapace in prom, but actually noomi dd great with what she was given. .she never felt like female rambo. .ripley did that part already..
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 27, 2017, 07:08:07 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 07:00:28 PM
Jesus. . . ?! with those actors onboard it.s not gonna be cheap. .what the new installment will need. .if it ever gets realilezd . .then in my always extremely humble opinion  . ..life contiinues. .like or hate it. . if at least waterston survives. .i grew a little fond of her character. .more so than rapace in prom, but actually noomi dd great with what she was given. .she never felt like female rambo. .ripley did that part already..

Shaw was great. Never understood the hate from fans. She felt original. More than Waterson.

Covenant will definitely breach 250 after its Japan launch. On a 97 million dollar budget, 250 isn't bad.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: lv_226 on Jun 27, 2017, 08:06:41 PM
I can't blame anyone for making prognostications about this sort of thing, but I feel that rumors concerning the demise of the Alien franchise under Ridley Scott's direction are greatly exaggerated.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 27, 2017, 10:27:02 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jun 27, 2017, 07:00:13 PM
Quote from: juxtapose on Jun 27, 2017, 04:34:18 PM
Quote from: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 04:13:28 PM
Ok guys , what is the latest figures? ........Do we get a sequel or not?


well i hate that it so in a grey area right now. .i meaning if it hits anything between 240-260. .it's still in that grey area. .neither a hit or a miss. .will we get a sequal. .maybe . .maybe not. .so now the waiting game starts...

That's pretty much my view of it.
Worldwide box office is now;    $227,814,263   
It should go above $240 million after Japan. How much? Who knows.

As for a sequel, Fox needs to make some profit on "Covenant" and that will take time with streaming/disk sale money.
Imo there will be another Alien prequel/sequel, someday.

;)

Box office Mojo either is lagging it or not checking since it hasn't updated China's box office amount since 6/18.  If you check China's own box office numbers it's hovering around $42 million while on Mojo it's just 29 million. I could see the film at least reaching $260 after finishing its theatrical run in Japan.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 27, 2017, 11:00:13 PM
According to BOMJ, Prometheus took in roughly 3.1 times its budget.

Covenant is at 2.34, still with a Japan release. I would argue that would push it to the 2.5-2.75 arena.

Not nearly as bad when you look at it like that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 28, 2017, 01:16:48 AM
Quote from: palerider on Jun 27, 2017, 05:44:23 PM
Thats why,  if there will be sequel we need a main male character..........and my vote goes to Tom Hardy an absolute badass.
Will effect the box office 100 %.

I agree. I want:

Tom Hardy and His Colonial Marines VERSUS Michael Fassbender and his Aliens!.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mr. Xenomorph on Jun 28, 2017, 04:25:21 AM
Honestly, I think someone like Hugh Jackman would be more of a possibility for the next one than Hardy. He has a good relationship with Fox because he's been under contract with them for years with Wolvie, Logan did big numbers and he's a household name like Hardy is.

They definitely need star power for the next one though. Alien was big, but Aliens was produced post-Ghostbusters, so Sigourney was huge at that point.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: newagescamartist on Jun 28, 2017, 08:18:22 AM
Marines? I hope you guys aren't talking about Covenant's sequel because there is almost zero percent chance of that happening. If you want to talk about fan service, inserting wise cracking tough guy marines and the queen back into the series is the definition of fan service.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Feeds On Minds on Jun 28, 2017, 11:55:49 AM
Why would any of those well known actors jump aboard the sinking ship that is the Alien franchise? lol
Keep dreaming that dream.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: lv_226 on Jun 28, 2017, 01:41:54 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 27, 2017, 11:00:13 PM
According to BOMJ, Prometheus took in roughly 3.1 times its budget.

Covenant is at 2.34, still with a Japan release. I would argue that would push it to the 2.5-2.75 arena.

Not nearly as bad when you look at it like that.

This.

A little perspective is always a refreshing thing. There is so much negativity in this thread.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: juxtapose on Jun 28, 2017, 01:51:39 PM
i agree 100 percent!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Jun 28, 2017, 04:35:37 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on Jun 28, 2017, 11:55:49 AM
Why would any of those well known actors jump aboard the sinking ship that is the Alien franchise? lol
Keep dreaming that dream.

I've never known a sinking ship to stay afloat as long as nearly 40 years.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 28, 2017, 05:59:07 PM
13 days in China and it's $43.47 million so far. It's very unlikely it will reach 50 but it's still better than Prometheus (34 in total).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 28, 2017, 06:05:45 PM
Quote from: SuicideDoors on Jun 28, 2017, 04:35:37 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on Jun 28, 2017, 11:55:49 AM
Why would any of those well known actors jump aboard the sinking ship that is the Alien franchise? lol
Keep dreaming that dream.

I've never known a sinking ship to stay afloat as long as nearly 40 years.

It'd be more than just an Alien entry. It's a Ridley Scott movie lol. Anyone would work with him.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 28, 2017, 09:09:52 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jun 28, 2017, 05:59:07 PM
13 days in China and it's $43.47 million so far. It's very unlikely it will reach 50 but it's still better than Prometheus (34 in total).

Better than I expected at the low end. My guess was 40-60 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 28, 2017, 09:51:43 PM
Quote from: Feeds On Minds on Jun 28, 2017, 11:55:49 AM
Why would any of those well known actors jump aboard the sinking ship that is the Alien franchise? lol
Keep dreaming that dream.

Because Ridley Scott. Ridley Scott worked with A-List stars like Leonardo DiCaprio, Matt Damon, Christian Bale, Michael Fassbender, Russell Crowe, etc....
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 28, 2017, 10:17:42 PM
Alien movies don't need A-list stars. Fassbender is enough. Besides, look at actors in Alien. They were known to the public but weren't superstars, not mentioning Weaver who was totally new in the business.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 29, 2017, 02:36:48 AM
Lol. If we want A list stars, let us want. Alien just might need a bona fide star the next movie to bolster box office. So don't be so agonized.

If you want to watch an Alien movie with no stars just watch most of the other Alien movies. The only star-stars at the time of their respective entries are arguably only Winona and Charlize, and Fassbender but only with Covenant. And Franco barely counts but obviously an A-lister.

On the tier below A list I'd say, Elba, McBride and Pearce would be there.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 29, 2017, 04:10:07 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 29, 2017, 02:36:48 AM
Lol. If we want A list stars, let us want. Alien just might need a bona fide star the next movie to bolster box office. So don't be so agonized.

If you want to watch an Alien movie with no stars just watch most of the other Alien movies. The only star-stars at the time of their respective entries are arguably only Winona and Charlize, and Fassbender but only with Covenant. And Franco barely counts but obviously an A-lister.

On the tier below A list I'd say, Elba, McBride and Pearce would be there.

Dutton! Best part of Alien 3.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on Jun 29, 2017, 04:12:37 AM

I'd like to see Denzel Washington headline the next film. He was great in American Gangster.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 29, 2017, 04:28:55 AM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 29, 2017, 04:10:07 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 29, 2017, 02:36:48 AM
Lol. If we want A list stars, let us want. Alien just might need a bona fide star the next movie to bolster box office. So don't be so agonized.

If you want to watch an Alien movie with no stars just watch most of the other Alien movies. The only star-stars at the time of their respective entries are arguably only Winona and Charlize, and Fassbender but only with Covenant. And Franco barely counts but obviously an A-lister.

On the tier below A list I'd say, Elba, McBride and Pearce would be there.

Dutton! Best part of Alien 3.

Never been an A-lister.


Quote from: echobbase79 on Jun 29, 2017, 04:12:37 AM

I'd like to see Denzel Washington headline the next film. He was great in American Gangster.

He'd be great squaring off against Fassbender.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Jun 29, 2017, 05:10:00 AM
Cast someone who draws crowds in China...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 29, 2017, 11:20:16 AM
Quote from: necrotard on Jun 29, 2017, 05:10:00 AM
Cast someone who draws crowds in China...

Milla Jovovich it is!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 29, 2017, 12:10:28 PM
Jackie Chan ;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jun 29, 2017, 12:33:49 PM
 ;) Donnie Yen.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jun 29, 2017, 01:09:01 PM
I'd say Chow Yun Fat but he was almost in Alien:R.  Good thing he dodged that bullet.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jun 29, 2017, 05:56:11 PM
Quote from: newagescamartist on Jun 28, 2017, 08:18:22 AM
Marines? I hope you guys aren't talking about Covenant's sequel because there is almost zero percent chance of that happening.

My guess is that the assumption here is that the sequel to "Covenant" will be filmed next year and that Ridley Scott would be the director.
With "Covenant" under performing at the box office, there is no guarantee of that.
The sequel could be delayed for years and eventually be done without Ridley.

Quote from: newagescamartist on Jun 28, 2017, 08:18:22 AM
If you want to talk about fan service, inserting wise cracking tough guy marines and the queen back into the series is the definition of fan service.

The second half of "Covenant" (which centered on the xenomorph) is a clear example of movie fan service.
The xenomorph was in the film because some fans asked for it to be brought back.
From a Ridley Scott interview about "Covenant";

Quote Ridley Scott: "Prometheus" was very successful... some of the notes if you look on social media; 'good film' but they missed him (the xenomorph) and the evolution, chestbursters, facehuggers, all that stuff... In the process of planning "Covenant" we're going to have to re-introduce him.
(from a YouTube video titled "Spoiler Alert!: Ridley Scott's secret plans for the future of the Alien franchise" at 3 minutes and 6 seconds)

* Prior to this with the development of "Prometheus" Scott had vowed not to use the xenomorph again.

Quote(Cinemablend:) Here's what he had to say when asked directly if we would again see the xenomorph in the film:
(Ridley Scott:) No. Absolutely not. They squeezed it dry. He (the xenomorph) did very well. (He laughs) He survived, he's now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!
http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Ridley-Scott-Says-Xenomorph-Absolutely-Prometheus-28428.html

But Ridley did go "back there". Why? Again, fan service.
- As for the sequel to "Covenant' and fan service, what was done in the past (bringing back something from the Alien franchise), could happen again.

;)

PS. "Covenant" box office update from Box Office Mojo; Worldwide:    $228,570,372   
And that includes China's box office at $41 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 29, 2017, 06:08:54 PM
It's 43.98 million in China according to http://english.entgroup.cn/boxoffice/cn/daily/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 29, 2017, 07:05:14 PM
Quote from: echobbase79 on Jun 29, 2017, 04:12:37 AM

I'd like to see Denzel Washington headline the next film. He was great in American Gangster.

I prefer Matt Damon.

Matt Damon and His Colonial Marines VERSUS Michael Fassbender and His Aliens!.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Jun 29, 2017, 08:57:13 PM
Matt Damon is playing space pirate, Captain Blonde Beard in next Alien movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mr. Xenomorph on Jun 29, 2017, 09:05:26 PM
If they could actually get Damon, that would be huge. Jason Bourne did very well last year while Ninja Turtles and Independence Day tanked.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jun 29, 2017, 09:46:09 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jun 29, 2017, 08:57:13 PM
Matt Damon is playing space pirate, Captain Blonde Beard in next Alien movie.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages4.static-bluray.com%2Freviews%2F12989_16_large.jpg&hash=273441508e2ca040be3e3a3390616494729e8fe6)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Jun 29, 2017, 10:01:15 PM
 :laugh:

Pirates + Matt Damon = Big Business at the Box Office.

Quote from: Mr. Xenomorph on Jun 29, 2017, 09:05:26 PM
If they could actually get Damon, that would be huge. Jason Bourne did very well last year while Ninja Turtles and Independence Day tanked.

I think Damon would jump at the opportunity to work with Ridley again.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jun 29, 2017, 10:22:57 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jun 29, 2017, 10:01:15 PM
:laugh:

Pirates + Matt Damon = Big Business at the Box Office.

Quote from: Mr. Xenomorph on Jun 29, 2017, 09:05:26 PM
If they could actually get Damon, that would be huge. Jason Bourne did very well last year while Ninja Turtles and Independence Day tanked.

I think Damon would jump at the opportunity to work with Ridley again.

I agree. Actually, THE MARTIAN is the biggest box office hit of both careers: Matt Damon and Ridley Scott.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 29, 2017, 10:38:10 PM
I thought they learned with Prometheus that they had to sweeten the pot with a name e.g. Charlize.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 29, 2017, 10:52:40 PM
They should've showed more of Katherine Waterston's belly.
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.dailymail.co.uk%2Fi%2Fpix%2F2016%2F11%2F15%2F18%2F3A693C6500000578-0-Magic_moment_Katherine_Waterston_displayed_her_tiny_midriff_in_a-m-2_1479236165864.jpg&hash=287a7e2083ef6abb53827625eff2b327c7d507a5)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 30, 2017, 12:06:17 AM
What did they waste money on?  Covenant was made for less than Prometheus, Exodus or The Martian.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on Jun 30, 2017, 12:20:56 AM
Yeah, 97 million or something like that isn't even that much for a film like Covenant. I'd say they used the money very effectively, even if the film is flawed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 30, 2017, 03:54:45 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Idiot alert


Quote from: tleilaxu on Jun 29, 2017, 10:52:40 PM
They should've showed more of Katherine Waterston's belly.
(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.dailymail.co.uk%2Fi%2Fpix%2F2016%2F11%2F15%2F18%2F3A693C6500000578-0-Magic_moment_Katherine_Waterston_displayed_her_tiny_midriff_in_a-m-2_1479236165864.jpg&hash=287a7e2083ef6abb53827625eff2b327c7d507a5)

I would chow down on her cryo box for light years.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: D. Compton Ambrose on Jun 30, 2017, 04:33:16 AM
edit
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nostromo on Jun 30, 2017, 06:23:33 AM
All I know is the movie has been out for a month...and all that's worth talking about from it is someone's cryo box.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jun 30, 2017, 06:41:14 AM
If you're actually sorry - don't post drivel in the first place.

You can knock the film without being a tool.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jun 30, 2017, 08:07:14 AM
Quote from: Nostromo on Jun 30, 2017, 06:23:33 AM
All I know is the movie has been out for a month...and all that's worth talking about from it is someone's cryo box. Can't even remember her name. What a sh!t alien movie lol. If you like this movie you have an iq of 10 sorry.

You can dislike a film without insulting people who do. Don't let me see it happen again or I'll be forced to remove your ability to post at all.

I don't like being forced to act like a school teacher.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 07:25:10 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 30, 2017, 03:54:45 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Idiot alert


Not an idiot. If you look a the old box office prediction thread, about ninety percent of the forum expected this movie to perform significantly better than it did. This is a poor showing, worse than even the lowest predictions. This is one of Fox's biggest franchises, and they probably lost money on it. They crashed one of their flagship franchises into the ground. For a post-Prometheus, post-Martian, Scott-directed Alien movie to perform worse than AvP is an embarrassment for everyone involved. They can spin it all they want, but the industry will look on this as a failure and I'm sure the stockholders will question the wisdom of making more of these. Calling people an idiot won't make Covenant a better, more successful movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 30, 2017, 07:59:44 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 07:25:10 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 30, 2017, 03:54:45 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Idiot alert


Not an idiot. If you look a the old box office prediction thread, about ninety percent of the forum expected this movie to perform significantly better than it did. This is a poor showing, worse than even the lowest predictions. This is one of Fox's biggest franchises, and they probably lost money on it. They crashed one of their flagship franchises into the ground. For a post-Prometheus, post-Martian, Scott-directed Alien movie to perform worse than AvP is an embarrassment for everyone involved. They can spin it all they want, but the industry will look on this as a failure and I'm sure the stockholders will question the wisdom of making more of these. Calling people an idiot won't make Covenant a better, more successful movie.
It didn't perform worse than AvP in total gross, but it did perform badly. Even when I sat down in the theater, at the earliest possible showing in my country, and saw that the theater was perhaps only 70% full, I just had the feeling it wouldn't do too well.
Even barring the negative social media campaigns and leaked spoilers, it just doesn't seem there was much hype for another Alien movie.
Hope they keep all of this in mind for the next one. Just removing the "Alien" in Alien: Awakening might make a huge difference for nowadays twitter bots.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 30, 2017, 08:01:38 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 07:25:10 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 30, 2017, 03:54:45 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Idiot alert


Not an idiot. If you look a the old box office prediction thread, about ninety percent of the forum expected this movie to perform significantly better than it did. This is a poor showing, worse than even the lowest predictions. This is one of Fox's biggest franchises, and they probably lost money on it. They crashed one of their flagship franchises into the ground. For a post-Prometheus, post-Martian, Scott-directed Alien movie to perform worse than AvP is an embarrassment for everyone involved. They can spin it all they want, but the industry will look on this as a failure and I'm sure the stockholders will question the wisdom of making more of these. Calling people an idiot won't make Covenant a better, more successful movie.

The sobering truth.

Heck I expected this movie to make nearly triple of its running cume.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 08:41:50 PM
Quote from: tleilaxu on Jun 30, 2017, 07:59:44 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 07:25:10 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 30, 2017, 03:54:45 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Idiot alert


Not an idiot. If you look a the old box office prediction thread, about ninety percent of the forum expected this movie to perform significantly better than it did. This is a poor showing, worse than even the lowest predictions. This is one of Fox's biggest franchises, and they probably lost money on it. They crashed one of their flagship franchises into the ground. For a post-Prometheus, post-Martian, Scott-directed Alien movie to perform worse than AvP is an embarrassment for everyone involved. They can spin it all they want, but the industry will look on this as a failure and I'm sure the stockholders will question the wisdom of making more of these. Calling people an idiot won't make Covenant a better, more successful movie.
It didn't perform worse than AvP in total gross, but it did perform badly. Even when I sat down in the theater, at the earliest possible showing in my country, and saw that the theater was perhaps only 70% full, I just had the feeling it wouldn't do too well.
Even barring the negative social media campaigns and leaked spoilers, it just doesn't seem there was much hype for another Alien movie.
Hope they keep all of this in mind for the next one. Just removing the "Alien" in Alien: Awakening might make a huge difference for nowadays twitter bots.
That's true, it did make more money than AvP. But AvP had a bigger opening weekend and made back almost triple its budget. Covenant will not be able to do that.

At least one pundit believes the Alien label was a liability. I think they should have made a straight Prometheus sequel called Covenant, kept Shaw, and pushed the sci-fi angle. Original sci-fi is huge right now, and Scott is the king of original sci-fi. Trying to make Alien into Star Wars was always going to end in disappointment. There is no universe where Covenant made Star Wars money. They missed their chance to create a new, vital franchise by reboarding a ship they've known was sinking for 25 years. Sci-fi has to continually push boundaries or it doesn't work. Same with horror. Looking back at how audiences, and even James Cameron, reacted to the first teaser, the public could tell immediately that Covenant wasn't going to break any new ground and had retreated from the high-concept approach of Prometheus. Nobody finds a total lack of confidence appealing. To have a successful movie like Prometheus receive such a safe sequel is retreating after victory. It's so cowardly it's kind of pitiful.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Jun 30, 2017, 08:54:40 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 08:41:50 PM
That's true, it did make more money than AvP. But AvP had a bigger opening weekend and made back almost triple its budget. Covenant will not be able to do that.

At least one pundit believes the Alien label was a liability. I think they should have made a straight Prometheus sequel called Covenant, kept Shaw, and pushed the sci-fi angle. Original sci-fi is huge right now, and Scott is the king of original sci-fi. Trying to make Alien into Star Wars was always going to end in disappointment. There is no universe where Covenant made Star Wars money. They missed their chance to create a new, vital franchise by reboarding a ship they've known was sinking for 25 years. Sci-fi has to continually push boundaries or it doesn't work. Same with horror. Looking back at how audiences, and even James Cameron, reacted to the first teaser, the public could tell immediately that Covenant wasn't going to break any new ground and had retreated from the high-concept approach of Prometheus. Nobody finds a total lack of confidence appealing. To have a successful movie like Prometheus receive such a safe sequel is retreating after victory. It's so cowardly it's kind of pitiful.

Not sure how "safe" I'd consider the Shaw elements to be, but I see what you're saying.

As much as it pains me to say, I do think a large part of Prometheus's success was that people didn't even know it was an Alien film.  They thought it was a new, original thing.  (This can be hard for us AVP dorks to even fathom.)  I imagine there are a lot of people who don't even know Covenant was a sequel to Prometheus.

Maybe if the next film features engineers, the trailer can showcase them and normies will get that it's a sequel to Prometheus and go see it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jun 30, 2017, 09:12:18 PM
It's too late. The toothpaste has been let out of the tube. The time to showcase engineers was with Covenant.

Now you'll really f**king confuse the normies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: echobbase79 on Jun 30, 2017, 09:32:09 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 29, 2017, 04:28:55 AM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 29, 2017, 04:10:07 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jun 29, 2017, 02:36:48 AM
Lol. If we want A list stars, let us want. Alien just might need a bona fide star the next movie to bolster box office. So don't be so agonized.

If you want to watch an Alien movie with no stars just watch most of the other Alien movies. The only star-stars at the time of their respective entries are arguably only Winona and Charlize, and Fassbender but only with Covenant. And Franco barely counts but obviously an A-lister.

On the tier below A list I'd say, Elba, McBride and Pearce would be there.

Dutton! Best part of Alien 3.

Never been an A-lister.


Quote from: echobbase79 on Jun 29, 2017, 04:12:37 AM

I'd like to see Denzel Washington headline the next film. He was great in American Gangster.

He'd be great squaring off against Fassbender.

Agreed. Have they worked together in a movie before?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jun 30, 2017, 10:10:52 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 08:41:50 PM
Quote from: tleilaxu on Jun 30, 2017, 07:59:44 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 07:25:10 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 30, 2017, 03:54:45 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Idiot alert


Not an idiot. If you look a the old box office prediction thread, about ninety percent of the forum expected this movie to perform significantly better than it did. This is a poor showing, worse than even the lowest predictions. This is one of Fox's biggest franchises, and they probably lost money on it. They crashed one of their flagship franchises into the ground. For a post-Prometheus, post-Martian, Scott-directed Alien movie to perform worse than AvP is an embarrassment for everyone involved. They can spin it all they want, but the industry will look on this as a failure and I'm sure the stockholders will question the wisdom of making more of these. Calling people an idiot won't make Covenant a better, more successful movie.
It didn't perform worse than AvP in total gross, but it did perform badly. Even when I sat down in the theater, at the earliest possible showing in my country, and saw that the theater was perhaps only 70% full, I just had the feeling it wouldn't do too well.
Even barring the negative social media campaigns and leaked spoilers, it just doesn't seem there was much hype for another Alien movie.
Hope they keep all of this in mind for the next one. Just removing the "Alien" in Alien: Awakening might make a huge difference for nowadays twitter bots.
That's true, it did make more money than AvP. But AvP had a bigger opening weekend and made back almost triple its budget. Covenant will not be able to do that.

At least one pundit believes the Alien label was a liability. I think they should have made a straight Prometheus sequel called Covenant, kept Shaw, and pushed the sci-fi angle. Original sci-fi is huge right now, and Scott is the king of original sci-fi. Trying to make Alien into Star Wars was always going to end in disappointment. There is no universe where Covenant made Star Wars money. They missed their chance to create a new, vital franchise by reboarding a ship they've known was sinking for 25 years. Sci-fi has to continually push boundaries or it doesn't work. Same with horror. Looking back at how audiences, and even James Cameron, reacted to the first teaser, the public could tell immediately that Covenant wasn't going to break any new ground and had retreated from the high-concept approach of Prometheus. Nobody finds a total lack of confidence appealing. To have a successful movie like Prometheus receive such a safe sequel is retreating after victory. It's so cowardly it's kind of pitiful.
The thing is, to a large extent did make an original sci-fi movie. It had new creatures, it gave a backstory for the old creature and gave a new spin on its development, it had an overarching theme of  creation, it had allegories and artistic references. The third act is mainly where we re-tread old waters, but even then, if you accept it as a build-up for the triumphant final it feels much more coherent and fitting.
However, normies are not going to pick up on this, at least not unless you tell them. The marketing campaign ended up being very misguided, focusing on the action and horror aspects instead of what the movie was actually about.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nostromo on Jun 30, 2017, 10:53:59 PM
If I'm too offensive can just delete me. Please don't lol.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jul 01, 2017, 12:59:46 AM
Quote from: tleilaxu on Jun 30, 2017, 10:10:52 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 08:41:50 PM
Quote from: tleilaxu on Jun 30, 2017, 07:59:44 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 07:25:10 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jun 30, 2017, 03:54:45 AM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Idiot alert


Not an idiot. If you look a the old box office prediction thread, about ninety percent of the forum expected this movie to perform significantly better than it did. This is a poor showing, worse than even the lowest predictions. This is one of Fox's biggest franchises, and they probably lost money on it. They crashed one of their flagship franchises into the ground. For a post-Prometheus, post-Martian, Scott-directed Alien movie to perform worse than AvP is an embarrassment for everyone involved. They can spin it all they want, but the industry will look on this as a failure and I'm sure the stockholders will question the wisdom of making more of these. Calling people an idiot won't make Covenant a better, more successful movie.
It didn't perform worse than AvP in total gross, but it did perform badly. Even when I sat down in the theater, at the earliest possible showing in my country, and saw that the theater was perhaps only 70% full, I just had the feeling it wouldn't do too well.
Even barring the negative social media campaigns and leaked spoilers, it just doesn't seem there was much hype for another Alien movie.
Hope they keep all of this in mind for the next one. Just removing the "Alien" in Alien: Awakening might make a huge difference for nowadays twitter bots.
That's true, it did make more money than AvP. But AvP had a bigger opening weekend and made back almost triple its budget. Covenant will not be able to do that.

At least one pundit believes the Alien label was a liability. I think they should have made a straight Prometheus sequel called Covenant, kept Shaw, and pushed the sci-fi angle. Original sci-fi is huge right now, and Scott is the king of original sci-fi. Trying to make Alien into Star Wars was always going to end in disappointment. There is no universe where Covenant made Star Wars money. They missed their chance to create a new, vital franchise by reboarding a ship they've known was sinking for 25 years. Sci-fi has to continually push boundaries or it doesn't work. Same with horror. Looking back at how audiences, and even James Cameron, reacted to the first teaser, the public could tell immediately that Covenant wasn't going to break any new ground and had retreated from the high-concept approach of Prometheus. Nobody finds a total lack of confidence appealing. To have a successful movie like Prometheus receive such a safe sequel is retreating after victory. It's so cowardly it's kind of pitiful.
The thing is, to a large extent did make an original sci-fi movie. It had new creatures, it gave a backstory for the old creature and gave a new spin on its development, it had an overarching theme of  creation, it had allegories and artistic references. The third act is mainly where we re-tread old waters, but even then, if you accept it as a build-up for the triumphant final it feels much more coherent and fitting.
However, normies are not going to pick up on this, at least not unless you tell them. The marketing campaign ended up being very misguided, focusing on the action and horror aspects instead of what the movie was actually about.
I'm talking about a "high-concept hook". Prometheus had "the search for our beginning could lead to our end." The Martian was about a stranded astronaut who uses science to survive for years on a desolate planet while Earth unites to rescue him. Those are strong hooks. Covenant lacked that. It was the same structure as Alien (distress call, exploration, infection, retreat, and a fight to the death) with no new hook. The advertising had no hook upon which to hang their campaign. It wasn't like The Matrix, Ghostbuster, or even Avatar, which all had hooks. Alien: Covenant was "the path to paradise begins in hell." That's a pretty good tagline given what they had to work with, but it wasn't a strong story hook. Science fiction is concept-driven and this one did not introduce any concepts that weren't already present in the prior films. They marketed it as a familiar formula, not as a novel one. Horror movies also need a hook, because similar scares over and over again will lose their effect. Horror fans need the unknown in order to feel the dread. Good sci-fi movies are really hard to make for this reason. It needs to be pretty fresh in order to break out. Prometheus has a very healthy following because there are lots of ideas to unpack, and it had a tremendously promising setup for an even more ambitious sequel. From a glance at the trailer, it's clear that they abandoned the setup in favor of rehashing the structure and basic elements of the older, declining Alien franchise. I think that's what did this movie in. Sci-fi fans knew at a glance that this wasn't going to match Scott's prior four science fiction masterpieces in terms of vision or freshness, and horror fans knew the scares were going to be rehashed. The marketing also wasn't very good, overall. The shower scene in the first teaser was one of the most ridiculed moments of the year.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 01, 2017, 01:33:19 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jun 30, 2017, 07:25:10 PM
... If you look a the old box office prediction thread, about ninety percent of the forum expected this movie to perform significantly better than it did. This is a poor showing, worse than even the lowest predictions. This is one of Fox's biggest franchises, and they probably lost money on it. They crashed one of their flagship franchises into the ground. For a post-Prometheus, post-Martian, Scott-directed Alien movie to perform worse than AvP is an embarrassment for everyone involved. They can spin it all they want, but the industry will look on this as a failure and I'm sure the stockholders will question the wisdom of making more of these. Calling people an idiot won't make Covenant a better, more successful movie.

Elijah; I'm more positive about the situation than you are.
I think that "Covenant" will make a profit after streaming and disk sales.
Also, it is possible that Fox will approve of a sequel a few years from now.

As for the story not having a strong science fiction hook, you are right that a lot of the second half of "Covenant" is a retread of "Alien".
But I can't blame the studio that much. The Alien franchise fanbase is very divided right now. Fox wanted to please all the viewer factions which in hindsight seems to be an impossible task. Some fans wanted a return of the xenomorph and a monster hunt. Naturally Fox and Ridley responded to that.

The last Star Trek movie faced a similar problem, a divided fanbase and an underperforming film.
- Sometimes a franchise needs a rest.
"Aliens" came out 7 years after "Alien" with new filmmakers.
The same kind of thing could happen with a "Covenant" sequel.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 426Buddy on Jul 01, 2017, 01:37:22 AM
Quote from: Nostromo on Jun 30, 2017, 10:53:59 PM
If I'm too offensive can just delete me. Please don't lol.

Please do.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: gantarat on Jul 01, 2017, 06:50:46 AM
How about Samuel L. Jackson for next movie ?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jul 01, 2017, 02:43:45 PM
How about Idris Elba as the engineer emperor  :o
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 01, 2017, 05:14:57 PM
Quote from: LCpl. D. Grant on Jun 30, 2017, 12:03:57 AM
Covenant wasted so much money and as I predicted performed mediocrely at best. What a horrible showing. (Not withstanding all of the scenes cut from in China).

Wasted SO much money...yet was made for like, 30 mill less than Prometheus.

Don't inbox me again, loser.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: darkvegett0 on Jul 02, 2017, 01:31:46 PM
I'm also surprised how awful A:C did,but after watching it...it was a terrible movie. And IMHO if it had prom 2 name it would have done worse. scott can't do this on his own he's going to need a better crew to help him....its a freaking train wreck watching these movies...


Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on Jul 02, 2017, 04:04:01 PM
Quote from: darkvegett0 on Jul 02, 2017, 01:31:46 PM
I'm also surprised how awful A:C did,but after watching it...it was a terrible movie. And IMHO if it had prom 2 name it would have done worse. scott can't do this on his own he's going to need a better crew to help him....its a freaking train wreck watching these movies...
You're entitled to your own opinion, but let's not exaggerate here. The film is problematic in a lot of ways, sure, but definitely not terrible.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jul 02, 2017, 08:40:05 PM
http://variety.com/2017/film/box-office/marvel-dc-dark-universe-movie-franchise-scorecard-1202478716/#networktype-1/page-1
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Jul 02, 2017, 09:29:25 PM
From that article:
"After four decades and seven films..."

Good job, author.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jul 02, 2017, 09:55:59 PM
Quote from: Evanus on Jul 02, 2017, 04:04:01 PM
Quote from: darkvegett0 on Jul 02, 2017, 01:31:46 PM
I'm also surprised how awful A:C did,but after watching it...it was a terrible movie. And IMHO if it had prom 2 name it would have done worse. scott can't do this on his own he's going to need a better crew to help him....its a freaking train wreck watching these movies...
You're entitled to your own opinion, but let's not exaggerate here. The film is problematic in a lot of ways, sure, but definitely not terrible.

some of us think it was just terrible and pointless.  I hated every moment of it.  Even Ridley Scott's direction couldn't make up for how much I disliked the film.  I put in on the same level as Alien:R. 

A blanket response to a pile of people suggesting additional A-list actors.  The next movie is probably going to get a budget reduction.  Ridley Scott makes 10m a film.  Fassbender has a big paycheck as well.  You will be lucky to get those 2 in the if it takes the sort of budget cut I think it is gonna take.  Yeah Scott could take a massive pay cut, he could not direct and just take his producers check (which is a separate paycheck).  I've joked they could write out Fassbender to save money there but it would piss off too many people (I'm personally not interested in David's story at all so I'd be ok with it).  But yeah, they isn't going to be 2 a-list actors facing off against each other in the next film.  Scott's grand War of the Worlds idea is going to be way scaled back. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jul 02, 2017, 09:59:04 PM
45 millions in China, worldwide 231 so far. Only Japan left so it's very likely that Covenant will reach 250 in total.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 03, 2017, 03:40:15 AM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jul 02, 2017, 09:59:04 PM
45 millions in China, worldwide 231 so far. Only Japan left so it's very likely that Covenant will reach 250 in total.

Prometheus took in 20 million there. AC brat Prometheus in China so a repeat in Japan is likely.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 03, 2017, 04:00:06 AM
Japan will at least pull $20m at the box office.  At the very least.  'ALIEN' stuff is crazy popular in Japan.  After closing its world wide run, 'ALIEN Covenant will have taken in around $260m. 

Not bad, for a prequel.  :P

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jul 03, 2017, 05:11:12 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jul 03, 2017, 04:00:06 AM
Japan will at least pull $20m at the box office.  At the very least.  'ALIEN' stuff is crazy popular in Japan.  After closing its world wide run, 'ALIEN Covenant will have taken in around $260m. 

Not bad, for a prequel.  :P

-Windebieste.

I have an English friend who lives in Japan. He's a big Alien fan and a film critic. I feel sorry for him that he has to wait for so long...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jul 03, 2017, 11:46:56 AM
Listing all the profit to cost ratio of the movies:

Alien - budget 11 mil gross 104 mil - 9:1
Aliens - budget 18 mil gross 131 mil - 7:1
Alien3 - budget 50 mil gross 159 mil - 3:1
Alien Resurrection - budget 75 mil gross 161 mil - 2.15:1
AVP - budget 60 mil gross 172 mil - 2.87:1
AVPR - budget 40 mil gross 128 - 3:1
Prometheus - budget 130 gross 403 - 3:1
Alien Covenant - budget 97 mil gross 231 - 2.4:1

So at the moment it is sitting between Alien Resurrection and AVP. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: YutaniDitch on Jul 05, 2017, 05:12:03 PM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jul 03, 2017, 11:46:56 AM
Listing all the profit to cost ratio of the movies:

Alien - budget 11 mil gross 104 mil - 9:1
Aliens - budget 18 mil gross 131 mil - 7:1
Alien3 - budget 50 mil gross 159 mil - 3:1
Alien Resurrection - budget 75 mil gross 161 mil - 2.15:1
AVP - budget 60 mil gross 172 mil - 2.87:1
AVPR - budget 40 mil gross 128 - 3:1
Prometheus - budget 130 gross 403 - 3:1
Alien Covenant - budget 97 mil gross 231 - 2.4:1

So at the moment it is sitting between Alien Resurrection and AVP.

Again, the PRODUCTION budget is just a tiny fraction of the overall budget of a movie, which includes marketing costs, copies' costs, theater owners' percentages, etc... The domestic BO is where they get the most returns and AC is failing miserably in the US, well below the production budget, much less the OVERALL one...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 11, 2017, 12:07:27 AM
The one good thing is, with the budget going down Fassbender will play all characters in the next installment.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jul 11, 2017, 01:34:52 AM
Quote from: YutaniDitch on Jul 05, 2017, 05:12:03 PM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jul 03, 2017, 11:46:56 AM
Listing all the profit to cost ratio of the movies:

Alien - budget 11 mil gross 104 mil - 9:1
Aliens - budget 18 mil gross 131 mil - 7:1
Alien3 - budget 50 mil gross 159 mil - 3:1
Alien Resurrection - budget 75 mil gross 161 mil - 2.15:1
AVP - budget 60 mil gross 172 mil - 2.87:1
AVPR - budget 40 mil gross 128 - 3:1
Prometheus - budget 130 gross 403 - 3:1
Alien Covenant - budget 97 mil gross 231 - 2.4:1

So at the moment it is sitting between Alien Resurrection and AVP.

Again, the PRODUCTION budget is just a tiny fraction of the overall budget of a movie, which includes marketing costs, copies' costs, theater owners' percentages, etc... The domestic BO is where they get the most returns and AC is failing miserably in the US, well below the production budget, much less the OVERALL one...

Box office is not everything as well.  These movies have a long life with merchandising.  The original Alien is still making money.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 11, 2017, 01:35:58 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 11, 2017, 12:07:27 AM
The one good thing is, with the budget going down Fassbender will play all characters in the next installment.

Kinda like this?

(https://vhistory.files.wordpress.com/2015/08/the-rimmer-song.jpg)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 11, 2017, 02:28:48 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 11, 2017, 01:35:58 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 11, 2017, 12:07:27 AM
The one good thing is, with the budget going down Fassbender will play all characters in the next installment.

Kinda like this?

(https://vhistory.files.wordpress.com/2015/08/the-rimmer-song.jpg)

I have not the slightest idea what that is and im not sure thats a bad thing.  :D


(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi0.wp.com%2Fwww.eigaland.com%2Fwordpress%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2015%2F05%2F4b06ba0db572e664afddd8540266f9c0.jpeg%3Ffit%3D600%252C600&hash=d0fa4aff2651947d6202a7a85414204b52e45474)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jul 11, 2017, 02:45:26 AM
You don't know Red Dwarf?  Geek credentials revoked.  :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 11, 2017, 03:14:53 AM
Ok i just blindly ordered the first 8 seasons box set. Satisfied?


On topic: Byebye A:C Blue Ray  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jul 11, 2017, 09:25:45 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jul 11, 2017, 01:34:52 AM
Box office is not everything as well.  These movies have a long life with merchandising.  The original Alien is still making money.

The catch is that the studio needs to pay for operating costs right away, cover any losses from other films, provide returns to investors right away, profit right away to expand its business and gain an advantage as it competes with other studios, and present something potentially lucrative in order to gain funding for future projects.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jul 11, 2017, 10:44:11 AM
Studios are like casinos. They always win. Studio doesn't make one movie per yer. They make dozens. One movie flops, another succeeds.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 11, 2017, 08:23:58 PM
Quote from: Scorpio on Jul 11, 2017, 01:34:52 AMBox office is not everything as well.  These movies have a long life with merchandising.  The original Alien is still making money.

Yes. And besides merchandising there's $millions from disk sales, streaming, and fees from TV cable broadcasts.

Back to box office, "Covenant" will make more money in Japan. I hope the box office will end up at about 2.5 times its production budget.
It that happens, it's not great but it isn't bad.

Other films that did about 2.5 times the production budget at the box office?
"Batsman Begins"
"Star Trek (2009)"

Both those films got sequels. They were not flops.
If Japan's box office is about $20 million, there is still hope imo that "Covenant" will get a low budget sequel.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 11, 2017, 08:34:15 PM
Those other films are no sequels though, those are origin storys. So its more like A:C vs The Dark Knight Returns massacre --

Then again we got a third Star Trek, so ...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jul 12, 2017, 07:13:48 AM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jul 11, 2017, 10:44:11 AM
Studios are like casinos. They always win. Studio doesn't make one movie per yer. They make dozens. One movie flops, another succeeds.

If one flops and another succeeds, then the studio might not do well in the end. It requires a healthy profit margin in order to expand operations and compete with other studios, while investors want better returns.



Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 11, 2017, 08:23:58 PM

Yes. And besides merchandising there's $millions from disk sales, streaming, and fees from TV cable broadcasts.

Back to box office, "Covenant" will make more money in Japan. I hope the box office will end up at about 2.5 times its production budget.
It that happens, it's not great but it isn't bad.

Other films that did about 2.5 times the production budget at the box office?
"Batsman Begins"
"Star Trek (2009)"

Both those films got sequels. They were not flops.
If Japan's box office is about $20 million, there is still hope imo that "Covenant" will get a low budget sequel.

;)

The catch is that studios need most revenues right away to cover operating costs and investors' returns. Given that, if they find better projects, then they may choose to shelve those that are riskier, or as you put it resort to lower budgets.

About the two examples, I'm guessing that they represent more attractive franchises compared to Alien.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 12, 2017, 08:55:02 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 12, 2017, 07:13:48 AM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jul 11, 2017, 10:44:11 AM
Studios are like casinos. They always win. Studio doesn't make one movie per yer. They make dozens. One movie flops, another succeeds.

If one flops and another succeeds, then the studio might not do well in the end. It requires a healthy profit margin in order to expand operations and compete with other studios, while investors want better returns.



Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 11, 2017, 08:23:58 PM

Yes. And besides merchandising there's $millions from disk sales, streaming, and fees from TV cable broadcasts.

Back to box office, "Covenant" will make more money in Japan. I hope the box office will end up at about 2.5 times its production budget.
It that happens, it's not great but it isn't bad.

Other films that did about 2.5 times the production budget at the box office?
"Batsman Begins"
"Star Trek (2009)"

Both those films got sequels. They were not flops.
If Japan's box office is about $20 million, there is still hope imo that "Covenant" will get a low budget sequel.

;)

The catch is that studios need most revenues right away to cover operating costs and investors' returns. Given that, if they find better projects, then they may choose to shelve those that are riskier, or as you put it resort to lower budgets.

About the two examples, I'm guessing that they represent more attractive franchises compared to Alien.

I'm not an executive in a film studio.
The way I approach this is; I don't pretend to try to fully understand Hollywood accounting or how studio economics works.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

* What I can do is look at box office performance with movies in a science fiction film franchise like Star Trek. I can see their production budgets and their worldwide box office and what films got sequels.
That lets me understand about how much money a Star Trek film (or even an Alien movie) needs to make (compared with its production budget), in order to get a sequel.

- "Star Trek: Insurrection" was a slight flop. Production Budget: $58 million. Double that = $116 million. But the film's box office = $112,587,658.
Still "Insurrection" got a sequel.

- The sequel, "Star Trek:Nemesis" flopped hard. What I'd call a bomb. Production Budget: $60 million. Worldwide box office: $67,312,826.
Barely above 1 x production budget. Imo it lost $millions and that ended Star Trek movies for 7 years.

* Back to "Covenant". It could get up to about 2.5 its production budget from Japan's box office.
Both "Star Trek (2009)" and "Star Trek Into Darkness" made box office that was about 2.5 times their production budgets.
Those Star Trek movies got sequels.
- "AVP" had a Production Budget: of $60 million (Box Office Mojo) to $70 million (Google). Box office: $172,544,654. Using the Google budget = box office about 2.5 x the production budget. (The Box Office Mojo budget = box office 2.86 x the production budget.) And "AVP" got a sequel.

- Conclusion based on this information?
If "Covenant" makes about 2.5 times its production budget (after its Japan release), it could get a sequel.

* As for comparing a Star Trek film with an Alien movie; in several ways "Prometheus" was similar to a sci-if adventure Star Trek film.
There can be an overlap between the two franchises in terms of overall style imo.
For instance "Star Trek First Contact" had horror elements in a sci-if adventure (like "Prometheus"). And "First Contact" made about 3 x its production budget. 

;) 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 12, 2017, 09:09:57 PM
First Contact was more akin to Aliens.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 12, 2017, 09:12:41 PM
Quote from: SM on Jul 12, 2017, 09:09:57 PM
First Contact was more akin to Aliens.

OK. Still that shows a style overlap between the Star Trek / Alien movie franchises.
All I'm saying is that there are similarities between these two studio properties and that the chances for a sequel can be compared between them.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: nanison on Jul 12, 2017, 09:22:39 PM
I think a sequel is gonna come but there will be lots of rewriting and meddling from the bosses and especially a smaller budget but that last part could be a blessing, as creative juices flow better when less money is involved.

Personally I'm not waiting for it but I'm a fanboy so i'll get excited anyway.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jul 12, 2017, 10:27:54 PM
I won't f**king tolerate that. Give me a 200 million $ movie with plenty of embryos and angry Engineers or I will f**king riot.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 12, 2017, 11:58:55 PM
I don't think one man shouting in the street constitutes a riot.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 13, 2017, 12:06:52 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 12, 2017, 11:58:55 PM
I don't think one man shouting in the street constitutes a riot.


Debatable


(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimage.nongnghiep.vn%2FHandler%2Fupload%2FArticle%2Fvietvv%2F2017%2F7%2F5%2Ftong-thong-trump-1_ww220.jpg&hash=e334db298e42aa5301a41c8bea1ab552db21e4ec)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jul 13, 2017, 12:21:16 AM
Doesn't matter who's rioting, one man shouting isn't a riot.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 13, 2017, 12:21:52 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 13, 2017, 12:06:52 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 12, 2017, 11:58:55 PM
I don't think one man shouting in the street constitutes a riot.


Debatable


http://image.nongnghiep.vn/Handler/upload/Article/vietvv/2017/7/5/tong-thong-trump-1_ww220.jpg

;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: nanison on Jul 13, 2017, 12:44:54 AM
one man shouting is a loony,a thousand men shouting is power
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jul 13, 2017, 01:43:33 AM
A thousand men shouting is power.  Powerful loonies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jul 13, 2017, 03:36:29 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 12, 2017, 08:55:02 PM

I'm not an executive in a film studio.
The way I approach this is; I don't pretend to try to fully understand Hollywood accounting or how studio economics works.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

* What I can do is look at box office performance with movies in a science fiction film franchise like Star Trek. I can see their production budgets and their worldwide box office and what films got sequels.
That lets me understand about how much money a Star Trek film (or even an Alien movie) needs to make (compared with its production budget), in order to get a sequel.

- "Star Trek: Insurrection" was a slight flop. Production Budget: $58 million. Double that = $116 million. But the film's box office = $112,587,658.
Still "Insurrection" got a sequel.

- The sequel, "Star Trek:Nemesis" flopped hard. What I'd call a bomb. Production Budget: $60 million. Worldwide box office: $67,312,826.
Barely above 1 x production budget. Imo it lost $millions and that ended Star Trek movies for 7 years.

* Back to "Covenant". It could get up to about 2.5 its production budget from Japan's box office.
Both "Star Trek (2009)" and "Star Trek Into Darkness" made box office that was about 2.5 times their production budgets.
Those Star Trek movies got sequels.
- "AVP" had a Production Budget: of $60 million (Box Office Mojo) to $70 million (Google). Box office: $172,544,654. Using the Google budget = box office about 2.5 x the production budget. (The Box Office Mojo budget = box office 2.86 x the production budget.) And "AVP" got a sequel.

- Conclusion based on this information?
If "Covenant" makes about 2.5 times its production budget (after its Japan release), it could get a sequel.

* As for comparing a Star Trek film with an Alien movie; in several ways "Prometheus" was similar to a sci-if adventure Star Trek film.
There can be an overlap between the two franchises in terms of overall style imo.
For instance "Star Trek First Contact" had horror elements in a sci-if adventure (like "Prometheus"). And "First Contact" made about 3 x its production budget. 

;)

I'm not sure, but I think distributors get around a third of box office receipts, and in several cases probably half.

In general, then, one can consider doubling the cost (because of marketing), and then cutting revenues by a third to a half (because they go to distributors), then adding ten percent for the profit margin. In a worst-case scenario:

Production cost: $100m
Marketing cost: $100m
Total cost: $200m

Box office receipts should be $300m to $400m (because $100m to $200m will go to distributors) plus 10 pct profit margin (around $20 million).

Other factors may be considered in decision-making, such as domestic sales, whether or not there are other franchises or projects that may make more money, and so on.

Finally, I think one reason why the Star Trek franchise keeps going is that its revenues do not rely solely on box office receipts but multiple movies and TV shows.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 13, 2017, 08:28:25 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 13, 2017, 03:36:29 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 12, 2017, 08:55:02 PM

I'm not an executive in a film studio.
The way I approach this is; I don't pretend to try to fully understand Hollywood accounting or how studio economics works.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

* What I can do is look at box office performance with movies in a science fiction film franchise like Star Trek. I can see their production budgets and their worldwide box office and what films got sequels.
That lets me understand about how much money a Star Trek film (or even an Alien movie) needs to make (compared with its production budget), in order to get a sequel.

- "Star Trek: Insurrection" was a slight flop. Production Budget: $58 million. Double that = $116 million. But the film's box office = $112,587,658.
Still "Insurrection" got a sequel.

- The sequel, "Star Trek:Nemesis" flopped hard. What I'd call a bomb. Production Budget: $60 million. Worldwide box office: $67,312,826.
Barely above 1 x production budget. Imo it lost $millions and that ended Star Trek movies for 7 years.

* Back to "Covenant". It could get up to about 2.5 its production budget from Japan's box office.
Both "Star Trek (2009)" and "Star Trek Into Darkness" made box office that was about 2.5 times their production budgets.
Those Star Trek movies got sequels.
- "AVP" had a Production Budget: of $60 million (Box Office Mojo) to $70 million (Google). Box office: $172,544,654. Using the Google budget = box office about 2.5 x the production budget. (The Box Office Mojo budget = box office 2.86 x the production budget.) And "AVP" got a sequel.

- Conclusion based on this information?
If "Covenant" makes about 2.5 times its production budget (after its Japan release), it could get a sequel.

* As for comparing a Star Trek film with an Alien movie; in several ways "Prometheus" was similar to a sci-if adventure Star Trek film.
There can be an overlap between the two franchises in terms of overall style imo.
For instance "Star Trek First Contact" had horror elements in a sci-if adventure (like "Prometheus"). And "First Contact" made about 3 x its production budget. 

;)

I'm not sure, but I think distributors get around a third of box office receipts, and in several cases probably half.

In general, then, one can consider doubling the cost (because of marketing), and then cutting revenues by a third to a half (because they go to distributors), then adding ten percent for the profit margin. In a worst-case scenario:

Production cost: $100m
Marketing cost: $100m
Total cost: $200m

Box office receipts should be $300m to $400m (because $100m to $200m will go to distributors) plus 10 pct profit margin (around $20 million).

Other factors may be considered in decision-making, such as domestic sales, whether or not there are other franchises or projects that may make more money, and so on.

Finally, I think one reason why the Star Trek franchise keeps going is that its revenues do not rely solely on box office receipts but multiple movies and TV shows.

My disagreements with this argument;

1. The claim that box office needs 4 x the production budget to be get a sequel is just a theory.   
* We can test the theory of when studios approve sequels by looking at the numbers and seeing when sequels are approved. (From the numbers.com website)
http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/franchise/X-Men#tab=summary
- May 26, 2006   X-Men: The Last Stand, production budget:   $210,000,000, worldwide box office:   $459,359,555, ratio box office/budget = 2.19
Sequel approved.
- May 1, 2009   X-Men Origins: Wolverine, production budget:   $150,000,000, worldwide box office:   $374,825,760, ratio box office/budget = 2.49
Sequel approved.
- Jun 3, 2011   X-Men: First Class, production budget:   $160,000,000   worldwide box office:   $355,408,30   ratio box office/budget = 2.22
Sequel approved.

So, that's two franchises (Star Trek & X-Men) where sequels were approved with box office being about 2.5 x the production budget or even less.   
I could find more examples.

2. A movie makes money from more than just theater box office. There are disk sales (DVD/Blu-ray), streaming, cable broadcast fees, and with science fiction there are merchandising fees from toys and comics.

** Back to "Covenant"; a sequel could happen if its box office gets to 2.5 the production budget. Why? Because there are multiple movies which got sequels (like Batman Begins, Star Trek, X-Men) where that kind of performance got a sequel.

3. The Alien franchise is considered to be one of the top science fiction movie/TV franchises of all time.
http://screenrant.com/greatest-science-fiction-franchises-ever/

The challenge for the Fox studio is to figure out how to release an Alien franchise movie which can get better box office.
Whether the studio goes with a film more like "Prometheus" or "Aliens", there is the potential to make money and because of that, the Alien franchise is not dead. 

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jul 13, 2017, 09:33:53 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 13, 2017, 08:28:25 PM

Whether the studio goes with a film more like "Prometheus" or "Aliens", there is the potential to make money and because of that, the Alien franchise is not dead. 

;)

Seeing the performance of Covenant, they might go into the 'Prometheus' route.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 14, 2017, 12:18:26 AM
The end of 'Covenant' strongly hints at what's to come.  Scott has already noted that the Engineers will be returning to find their planet decimated, along with several other factions.  His 'war of the worlds' statement has surfaced more than once, now.  We have already had the first hints at what is to follow.

In this regard, the next movie (and possibly the one after that) will be a major melting pot of all things 'ALIEN' and 'PROMETHEUS'.

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jul 14, 2017, 02:25:39 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 13, 2017, 08:28:25 PM

My disagreements with this argument;

1. The claim that box office needs 4 x the production budget to be get a sequel is just a theory.   
* We can test the theory of when studios approve sequels by looking at the numbers and seeing when sequels are approved. (From the numbers.com website)
http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/franchise/X-Men#tab=summary
- May 26, 2006   X-Men: The Last Stand, production budget:   $210,000,000, worldwide box office:   $459,359,555, ratio box office/budget = 2.19
Sequel approved.
- May 1, 2009   X-Men Origins: Wolverine, production budget:   $150,000,000, worldwide box office:   $374,825,760, ratio box office/budget = 2.49
Sequel approved.
- Jun 3, 2011   X-Men: First Class, production budget:   $160,000,000   worldwide box office:   $355,408,30   ratio box office/budget = 2.22
Sequel approved.

So, that's two franchises (Star Trek & X-Men) where sequels were approved with box office being about 2.5 x the production budget or even less.   
I could find more examples.

2. A movie makes money from more than just theater box office. There are disk sales (DVD/Blu-ray), streaming, cable broadcast fees, and with science fiction there are merchandising fees from toys and comics.

** Back to "Covenant"; a sequel could happen if its box office gets to 2.5 the production budget. Why? Because there are multiple movies which got sequels (like Batman Begins, Star Trek, X-Men) where that kind of performance got a sequel.

3. The Alien franchise is considered to be one of the top science fiction movie/TV franchises of all time.
http://screenrant.com/greatest-science-fiction-franchises-ever/

The challenge for the Fox studio is to figure out how to release an Alien franchise movie which can get better box office.
Whether the studio goes with a film more like "Prometheus" or "Aliens", there is the potential to make money and because of that, the Alien franchise is not dead. 

;)

The point isn't that a sequel requires revenues at up to four times the budget. It's that a movie requires revenues at that level in order to profit. For a sequel to be approved, many other factors will be involved, including earnings from other movies produced by the studio, whether or not producers think that they will do better next time, whether or not investors will bite, what other projects are ready to be funded and that might earn more, etc.

Movies do earn from merchandising, but production and marketing involve annual operating costs that need to be paid. Also, studios need to profit to show investors that their businesses are healthy and can afford to expand operations the following year, which is important given the fact that they are competing with each other. It also doesn't help that they are trying to outdo each other with tent-pole flicks each year at expensive ticket prices, and larger budgets needed to make films look expensive and spectacular. That means movies have to earn as fast as possible.

The Alien franchise is one of the best, but that's not shown in the two recent releases. And those two movies were considered only after almost two decades after Alien: Resurrection and after figuring out whether they should make sequels (or something else) or prequels. Meanwhile, the studio tried experimenting by combining aliens and predators.



Quote from: windebieste on Jul 14, 2017, 12:18:26 AM
The end of 'Covenant' strongly hints at what's to come.  Scott has already noted that the Engineers will be returning to find their planet decimated, along with several other factions.  His 'war of the worlds' statement has surfaced more than once, now.  We have already had the first hints at what is to follow.

In this regard, the next movie (and possibly the one after that) will be a major melting pot of all things 'ALIEN' and 'PROMETHEUS'.

-Windebieste.

Reminds me of the present film, which tries to combine aspects of the first two movies plus continue the prequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jul 14, 2017, 02:47:08 AM
Box office has not been strong for Alien films since 1992.  Best they can hope for is making back 3x the budget.  And these movies are not cheap to make, like other series.  They went cheap for AVPR and it is the lowest grossing of the franchise.

2.4 is a good result, considering it hasn't opened in Japan and Cambodia yet, that could go to 2.6 or 2.7 times the budget.

Alien is still the top-grossing horror franchise - https://www.forbes.com/sites/simonthompson/2016/10/27/the-13-highest-grossing-horror-film-franchises-of-all-time-at-the-u-s-box-office/#535ce32f68d1
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Jul 14, 2017, 03:19:00 AM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 14, 2017, 02:25:39 AM
The Alien franchise is one of the best, but that's not shown in the two recent releases.

Prometheus is the highest grossing Alien film, bud. A Fox executive recently said Covenant will make the studio a profit even though it underperformed. Can you do some more basic google searches before you post stuff like this, please?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jul 14, 2017, 04:54:35 AM
I guess the marketing cost wasn't as big as we expected then.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jul 14, 2017, 10:43:05 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Jul 14, 2017, 03:19:00 AM
Prometheus is the highest grossing Alien film, bud. A Fox executive recently said Covenant will make the studio a profit even though it underperformed. Can you do some more basic google searches before you post stuff like this, please?

But if you consider its budget and marketing cost then it's not. In relation between box office and budget/marketing highest grossing Alien movies are Alien and Aliens.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SiL on Jul 14, 2017, 10:59:13 AM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jul 14, 2017, 10:43:05 AM
But if you consider its budget and marketing cost then it's not. In relation between box office and budget/marketing highest grossing Alien movies are Alien and Aliens.
Gross doesn't take into account costs so yes, it is the highest grossing movie.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jul 14, 2017, 11:53:52 AM
Did Fox hope that Covenant would match or surpass Prometheus' box office numbers? You bet they did.
Was Covenant a flop? Absolutely not.
It was a disappointment and I'm sure the execs are really trying to figure why it didn't match their expectations. But I'm pretty sure it will make them a tidy, little profit and it will definitely not kill one of Fox's signature franchises.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jul 14, 2017, 12:20:41 PM
Quote from: SiL on Jul 14, 2017, 10:59:13 AM
Quote from: Ingwar on Jul 14, 2017, 10:43:05 AM
But if you consider its budget and marketing cost then it's not. In relation between box office and budget/marketing highest grossing Alien movies are Alien and Aliens.
Gross doesn't take into account costs so yes, it is the highest grossing movie.

But it should be taken it into an account. Otherwise box office it's just an illusion. Budget and marketing costs should be considered. Prometheus didn't earn 403 millions. It sold tickets for 403 millions ... minus budget and marketing and so on.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on Jul 14, 2017, 12:52:24 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Jul 14, 2017, 11:53:52 AM
Did Fox hope that Covenant would match or surpass Prometheus' box office numbers? You bet they did.
Was Covenant a flop? Absolutely not.
It was a disappointment and I'm sure the execs are really trying to figure why it didn't match their expectations. But I'm pretty sure it will make them a tidy, little profit and it will definitely not kill one of Fox's signature franchises.

What I find weird is why release it in the summer. This could have made some serious money with a Halloween release no?

Were they really this confident?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 14, 2017, 12:54:35 PM
Personally, I feel this was the biggest mistake Fox made and I could never figure out this myself.  Why rush it?  Why not just wait until October as planned originally?  As you say, that's the ideal time to release it.

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jul 14, 2017, 01:21:15 PM
They liked the movie and felt confident. Also, a movie's release date is part of a jigsaw puzzle. We don't have all the data.
Personally, I believe they should've stuck to August 4th.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: cucuchu on Jul 14, 2017, 06:08:48 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Jul 14, 2017, 11:53:52 AM
Did Fox hope that Covenant would match or surpass Prometheus' box office numbers? You bet they did.
Was Covenant a flop? Absolutely not.
It was a disappointment and I'm sure the execs are really trying to figure why it didn't match their expectations. But I'm pretty sure it will make them a tidy, little profit and it will definitely not kill one of Fox's signature franchises.

Didn't a Fox rep recently say Covenant hit all the marks they were shooting for but reception has been tepid at best so another movie is uncertain? That is certainly damning to hear before the BluRay/Digital even releases.

I don't think we are to expect another one, and most certainly not one helmed by Scott. These films require an at least somewhat decent budget and there is no longer an audience left to profit off that budget.  I love the franchise and enjoyed Covenant but I accept the franchise is dead. Maybe one day someone can fill that Sci Fi horror niche again, but it will not be another Alien film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 14, 2017, 06:37:54 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 14, 2017, 02:25:39 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 13, 2017, 08:28:25 PM

My disagreements with this argument;

1. The claim that box office needs 4 x the production budget to be get a sequel is just a theory.   
* We can test the theory of when studios approve sequels by looking at the numbers and seeing when sequels are approved. (From the numbers.com website)
http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/franchise/X-Men#tab=summary
- May 26, 2006   X-Men: The Last Stand, production budget:   $210,000,000, worldwide box office:   $459,359,555, ratio box office/budget = 2.19
Sequel approved.
- May 1, 2009   X-Men Origins: Wolverine, production budget:   $150,000,000, worldwide box office:   $374,825,760, ratio box office/budget = 2.49
Sequel approved.
- Jun 3, 2011   X-Men: First Class, production budget:   $160,000,000   worldwide box office:   $355,408,30   ratio box office/budget = 2.22
Sequel approved.

So, that's two franchises (Star Trek & X-Men) where sequels were approved with box office being about 2.5 x the production budget or even less.   
I could find more examples.

2. A movie makes money from more than just theater box office. There are disk sales (DVD/Blu-ray), streaming, cable broadcast fees, and with science fiction there are merchandising fees from toys and comics.

** Back to "Covenant"; a sequel could happen if its box office gets to 2.5 the production budget. Why? Because there are multiple movies which got sequels (like Batman Begins, Star Trek, X-Men) where that kind of performance got a sequel.

3. The Alien franchise is considered to be one of the top science fiction movie/TV franchises of all time.
http://screenrant.com/greatest-science-fiction-franchises-ever/

The challenge for the Fox studio is to figure out how to release an Alien franchise movie which can get better box office.
Whether the studio goes with a film more like "Prometheus" or "Aliens", there is the potential to make money and because of that, the Alien franchise is not dead. 

;)

The point isn't that a sequel requires revenues at up to four times the budget.

My point is that you and I are not studio executives.
Another of my points is that all we can know if our theories about sequels are correct is by what past box office/budget performance can lead to a sequel.

* Besides, several Star Trek and X-Men movies (and Batman Begins) getting sequels approved with box office ~2.5 x (or below) the production budget, there are other moves where this happened.
- From the-numbers.com
- Jan 20, 2006   Underworld: Evolution, production budget:   $45,000,000, worldwide box office:    $113,417,762,   ratio box office/budget = 2.5
Sequel approved. 
- Jan 23, 2009   Underworld 3: Rise of the Lycans, production budget:   $35,000,000, worldwide box office:   $89,102,315, ratio box office/budget = 2.5
Sequel approved.
- Jan 20, 2012   Underworld: Awakening, production budget:   $70,000,000, worldwide box office:   $160,379,930, ratio box office/budget = 2.3
Sequel approved.

- A straight comedy movie, Analyze This, Production Budget: $80 million, Worldwide box office:    $176,885,658, ratio box office/budget = 2.2   (from Box Office Mojo)
Sequel approved.        

- I've already mentioned "AVP". It's box office was above 2.5 x the production budget but it's below 3x at around 2.87. 
Sequel approved.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 14, 2017, 02:25:39 AMThe Alien franchise is one of the best, but that's not shown in the two recent releases.

We all are entitled to our personal taste about any film.
- But our personal taste should not be part of this discussion. (Individual personal taste does not = professional critic rankings or large viewer polls.)
The personal taste of a few individuals has nothing to do with the fact that several movies exist which got sequels that had box office which was about 2.5 x their production budgets.   

- As for the box office for "Prometheus", it was 3.1 x its production budget. And it got a sequel. Many films get sequels when their box office is 3 x the production budget.
And comparing "Prometheus" box office with some other Alien franchise films?

- Alien3 - production budget $50 million, world wide box office, $159 million, ratio box office/budget = 3.18
Sequel approved and "Prometheus" did about the same with its box office / budget performance.
- Alien Resurrection - production budget $75 million, world wide box office, $161 million,  ratio box office/budget = 2.15
Sequel not approved.
But both "Prometheus" and "Covenant" have outperformed Resurrection.

* Bottom line; again, going by the publicly known facts about film history, box office and production budgets, if the box office for "Covenant" gets to 2.5 x its production budget, it could get a sequel.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: irn on Jul 14, 2017, 07:20:14 PM
It was not a summer movie at all. It should have come out on the original release date post-summer and pre-Starwarsmas.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jul 14, 2017, 07:56:51 PM
Lol wut. All kinds a movies come out durin' the summer.

PEOPLE WEREN'T AS HUNGRY FOR THIS MOVIE AS THEY WERE FOR PROMETHEUS. THE END
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jul 14, 2017, 08:38:52 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jul 14, 2017, 07:56:51 PM
Lol wut. All kinds a movies come out durin' the summer.

PEOPLE WEREN'T AS HUNGRY FOR THIS MOVIE AS THEY WERE FOR PROMETHEUS. THE END

I disagree.

Prometheus looked bigger. Summer is only for the biggest movies like Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jul 14, 2017, 08:48:34 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jul 14, 2017, 07:56:51 PM
Lol wut. All kinds a movies come out durin' the summer.

PEOPLE WEREN'T AS HUNGRY FOR THIS MOVIE AS THEY WERE FOR PROMETHEUS. THE END
I feel like eating and I mean food!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Jul 14, 2017, 03:19:00 AM

Prometheus is the highest grossing Alien film, bud. A Fox executive recently said Covenant will make the studio a profit even though it underperformed. Can you do some more basic google searches before you post stuff like this, please?

As explained earlier, you have to cut gross revenues by a third to a half because that goes to distributors, then add marketing cost (sometimes, almost the same as production cost). Then add a percentage for the studio's (and investors'?) profit margin, and assume that merchandising will not be able to cover production, marketing, and distribution right away. There are some details here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

and more shared by others in the rest of this thread.

For example, for a worst-case scenario:

production cost: $100 million
marketing cost: $100 million
profit margin (10 pct): $20 million

revenues (50 percent goes to distributors): $420 million ($220 million to the studio to cover both costs plus profit; the other $200 million to distributors)

This explains why some argue that a movie must earn three to four times its production cost.

Because studios may have more projects, then any weak performance in a movie can be covered by others, which means there is always a chance that a franchise may continue. It's also possible that new ideas may be given which might attract investors. On the other hand, if other projects look more promising, then producers may choose to shelve franchises temporarily or lower budgets. In several cases, they may even lower budgets to ensure that they profit or even receive more profits.

Finally, there is the issue of increasing budgets, more competition, higher ticket prices, and greater risks:

"Steven Spielberg and George Lucas predict film industry 'implosion'"

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2013/jun/13/steven-spielberg-george-lucas-film-industry

That is, at some point successive failures in blockbusters (e.g., high grosses that are barely able to cover soaring costs) may mean a drastic change in what studios release and the way franchises are developed.




Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 14, 2017, 06:37:54 PM
My point is that you and I are not studio executives.
Another of my points is that all we can know if our theories about sequels are correct is by what past box office/budget performance can lead to a sequel.

* Besides, several Star Trek and X-Men movies (and Batman Begins) getting sequels approved with box office ~2.5 x (or below) the production budget, there are other moves where this happened.
- From the-numbers.com
- Jan 20, 2006   Underworld: Evolution, production budget:   $45,000,000, worldwide box office:    $113,417,762,   ratio box office/budget = 2.5
Sequel approved. 
- Jan 23, 2009   Underworld 3: Rise of the Lycans, production budget:   $35,000,000, worldwide box office:   $89,102,315, ratio box office/budget = 2.5
Sequel approved.
- Jan 20, 2012   Underworld: Awakening, production budget:   $70,000,000, worldwide box office:   $160,379,930, ratio box office/budget = 2.3
Sequel approved.

- A straight comedy movie, Analyze This, Production Budget: $80 million, Worldwide box office:    $176,885,658, ratio box office/budget = 2.2   (from Box Office Mojo)
Sequel approved.        

- I've already mentioned "AVP". It's box office was above 2.5 x the production budget but it's below 3x at around 2.87. 
Sequel approved.

But as I explained to you earlier, I was not making any theories about sequels. Rather, I explained how studios profit.

For the examples you gave above, you need to include marketing cost (usually, almost the same amount as the production budget) and then deduct 30 to 50 percent of box office receipts (because they go to distributors).

Given that, there are many reasons why sequels are approved even if studios did not earn as much. Read my previous post for details.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 14, 2017, 02:25:39 AM

We all are entitled to our personal taste about any film.
- But our personal taste should not be part of this discussion. (Individual personal taste does not = professional critic rankings or large viewer polls.)
The personal taste of a few individuals has nothing to do with the fact that several movies exist which got sequels that had box office which was about 2.5 x their production budgets.   

- As for the box office for "Prometheus", it was 3.1 x its production budget. And it got a sequel. Many films get sequels when their box office is 3 x the production budget.
And comparing "Prometheus" box office with some other Alien franchise films?

- Alien3 - production budget $50 million, world wide box office, $159 million, ratio box office/budget = 3.18
Sequel approved and "Prometheus" did about the same with its box office / budget performance.
- Alien Resurrection - production budget $75 million, world wide box office, $161 million,  ratio box office/budget = 2.15
Sequel not approved.
But both "Prometheus" and "Covenant" have outperformed Resurrection.

* Bottom line; again, going by the publicly known facts about film history, box office and production budgets, if the box office for "Covenant" gets to 2.5 x its production budget, it could get a sequel.

;)

To recap, you need to add a marketing cost to the production budget to get the total cost of the studio, then decrease the box office receipts by 30 to 50 percent because those are used to pay distributors. That means revenues will have to be three to four times the production cost.

To find out why sequels are approved, you need to look at the other revenue streams of the studio. That means other projects might be covering weak ones.



Here's another article to consider:

"How is a cinema's box office income distributed?"

https://stephenfollows.com/how-a-cinemas-box-office-income-is-distributed/





Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 15, 2017, 08:30:29 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMBut as I explained to you earlier, I was not making any theories about sequels.

Earlier, you speculated about why a studio would choose to release a sequel to a film which had box office which was about 2.5 times its production budget. 

From me;

Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 11, 2017, 08:23:58 PMOther films that did about 2.5 times the production budget at the box office?
"Batsman Begins"
"Star Trek (2009)"

Both those films got sequels. They were not flops.
If Japan's box office is about $20 million, there is still hope imo that "Covenant" will get a low budget sequel.

Your reply with emphasis by me.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 12, 2017, 07:13:48 AMThe catch is that studios need most revenues right away to cover operating costs and investors' returns. Given that, if they find better projects, then they may choose to shelve those that are riskier, or as you put it resort to lower budgets.

About the two examples, I'm guessing that they represent more attractive franchises compared to Alien.

What is being discussed here to me is the decision by the studio to release a sequel (or not to release one).
I have found several films which got sequels that performed at the box office (compared to the production budget) at about the same level to where "Covenant" should end up after its Japan release.
- I have taken the known public financial information which could be part of the studio's decision.

In terms of testing a film theory about what a studio "may choose" to decide about a sequel release, I think that's the best I can do.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMRather, I explained how studios profit.

You gave expense / income calculations. I already knew about that.
Still presenting a thought experiment/film theory about studio finances doesn't bring much clarity imo to when studios will approve of sequels.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMFor the examples you gave above, you need to include marketing cost...

Not really.
1. Marketing costs / total film expenses are very hard to find and are almost always unknown to the public.
2. If I did have the total movie expenses, I could give a more accurate measure (using formulas) of whether a film lost money or made money.
http://www.deadline.com/2013/01/movie-profits-december-snl-kagan/ (http://www.deadline.com/2013/01/movie-profits-december-snl-kagan/)

* But even if I had the total film expense information (and almost always, none of us have it), that still doesn't give an answer to the question of when a studio may approve a sequel for a particular movie or not.
- I don't work for the company where those decisions are made.
- What I have looked for is the cut off area, using numbers available to the public, of when studios may approve a sequel.
It seems again to be when box office is about 2.5 x the production budget.
- Here's another example (from the-numbers.com);

2015   The Divergent Series: Insurgent; production budget:   $110,000,000, worldwide box office:   $295,279,072, ratio box office/budget = 2.68
Sequel approved.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMGiven that, there are many reasons why sequels are approved even if studios did not earn as much. Read my previous post for details.

I understand. Those are your theories about why sequels are approved or are not approved.
Again, it's our privilege to bring up film theories/thought experiments.
- What I have done is to find the cut off area between box office and production budgets to determine the zone of where roughly there is a chance for a sequel to be approved.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMTo find out why sequels are approved, you need to look at the other revenue streams of the studio.

- That information is not available.
* To recap what is not available to the public;
1. Total film expenses.
2. All revenue streams for a studio.
3. The effects of arcane Hollywood Accounting which tries to hide film profits.
4. Studio executive discussions about sequel decisions. 

* What is known?
- Box office numbers and production budgets.
- Therefore a ratio between those two numbers can be figured out to find about where studios are approving sequels based on that.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMHere's another article to consider:

"How is a cinema's box office income distributed?"

https://stephenfollows.com/how-a-cinemas-box-office-income-is-distributed/

Thanks for the link.
I have read several articles about that topic including one by the author you posted, Stephen Fellows.

https://stephenfollows.com/how-movies-make-money-hollywood-blockbusters/

- Here are a couple more articles about studio finances;

http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 16, 2017, 05:42:33 PM
Again the films you found are origin storys. Studios know quite well that origin storys are underperforming from time time and they get a sequel anyway because implied money. (For example compare: the first Nolan Batman and its sequels, the first Captain America and its sequels, X-Men: First Class and its first sequel etc.)

A:C is not an origin story and its BO already dropped compared to Prometheus, which contains the origin story in this case. They already trimmed down the production cost (unlike they did with the Batman sequel, where it went up instead; Ridley sure is working economically but in my eyes it already shows that FOX has lost a significant amount of trust in Ridley pulling this franchise off financially).

If you dont take into account these factors, which are obviously "available" also, your theory is worth ****.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jul 16, 2017, 08:40:50 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 13, 2017, 08:28:25 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 13, 2017, 03:36:29 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 12, 2017, 08:55:02 PM

I'm not an executive in a film studio.
The way I approach this is; I don't pretend to try to fully understand Hollywood accounting or how studio economics works.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

* What I can do is look at box office performance with movies in a science fiction film franchise like Star Trek. I can see their production budgets and their worldwide box office and what films got sequels.
That lets me understand about how much money a Star Trek film (or even an Alien movie) needs to make (compared with its production budget), in order to get a sequel.

- "Star Trek: Insurrection" was a slight flop. Production Budget: $58 million. Double that = $116 million. But the film's box office = $112,587,658.
Still "Insurrection" got a sequel.

- The sequel, "Star Trek:Nemesis" flopped hard. What I'd call a bomb. Production Budget: $60 million. Worldwide box office: $67,312,826.
Barely above 1 x production budget. Imo it lost $millions and that ended Star Trek movies for 7 years.

* Back to "Covenant". It could get up to about 2.5 its production budget from Japan's box office.
Both "Star Trek (2009)" and "Star Trek Into Darkness" made box office that was about 2.5 times their production budgets.
Those Star Trek movies got sequels.
- "AVP" had a Production Budget: of $60 million (Box Office Mojo) to $70 million (Google). Box office: $172,544,654. Using the Google budget = box office about 2.5 x the production budget. (The Box Office Mojo budget = box office 2.86 x the production budget.) And "AVP" got a sequel.

- Conclusion based on this information?
If "Covenant" makes about 2.5 times its production budget (after its Japan release), it could get a sequel.

* As for comparing a Star Trek film with an Alien movie; in several ways "Prometheus" was similar to a sci-if adventure Star Trek film.
There can be an overlap between the two franchises in terms of overall style imo.
For instance "Star Trek First Contact" had horror elements in a sci-if adventure (like "Prometheus"). And "First Contact" made about 3 x its production budget. 

;)

I'm not sure, but I think distributors get around a third of box office receipts, and in several cases probably half.

In general, then, one can consider doubling the cost (because of marketing), and then cutting revenues by a third to a half (because they go to distributors), then adding ten percent for the profit margin. In a worst-case scenario:

Production cost: $100m
Marketing cost: $100m
Total cost: $200m

Box office receipts should be $300m to $400m (because $100m to $200m will go to distributors) plus 10 pct profit margin (around $20 million).

Other factors may be considered in decision-making, such as domestic sales, whether or not there are other franchises or projects that may make more money, and so on.

Finally, I think one reason why the Star Trek franchise keeps going is that its revenues do not rely solely on box office receipts but multiple movies and TV shows.

My disagreements with this argument;

1. The claim that box office needs 4 x the production budget to be get a sequel is just a theory.   
* We can test the theory of when studios approve sequels by looking at the numbers and seeing when sequels are approved. (From the numbers.com website)
http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/franchise/X-Men#tab=summary
- May 26, 2006   X-Men: The Last Stand, production budget:   $210,000,000, worldwide box office:   $459,359,555, ratio box office/budget = 2.19
Sequel approved.
- May 1, 2009   X-Men Origins: Wolverine, production budget:   $150,000,000, worldwide box office:   $374,825,760, ratio box office/budget = 2.49
Sequel approved.
- Jun 3, 2011   X-Men: First Class, production budget:   $160,000,000   worldwide box office:   $355,408,30   ratio box office/budget = 2.22
Sequel approved.

So, that's two franchises (Star Trek & X-Men) where sequels were approved with box office being about 2.5 x the production budget or even less.   
I could find more examples.

2. A movie makes money from more than just theater box office. There are disk sales (DVD/Blu-ray), streaming, cable broadcast fees, and with science fiction there are merchandising fees from toys and comics.

** Back to "Covenant"; a sequel could happen if its box office gets to 2.5 the production budget. Why? Because there are multiple movies which got sequels (like Batman Begins, Star Trek, X-Men) where that kind of performance got a sequel.

3. The Alien franchise is considered to be one of the top science fiction movie/TV franchises of all time.
http://screenrant.com/greatest-science-fiction-franchises-ever/

The challenge for the Fox studio is to figure out how to release an Alien franchise movie which can get better box office.
Whether the studio goes with a film more like "Prometheus" or "Aliens", there is the potential to make money and because of that, the Alien franchise is not dead. 

;)

X-Men is unique s Fox has to make an X-men related movie every 7 years (I've also read 5 in the case of X-men) or the right revert BACK to marvel/disney.  this is why there is constantly talks of a new fantastic four movie (same sort of contact) because fox doesn't want to give those character back without some sort of financial reward. 

This is also why there is continuously X-men films on the go. 


regardless of when it was released the movie was doomed to under-perform.  Bad word of mouth killed it.  This would have happened in August, October (also October isn't a great time to release films in general as attendance always falls after the summer months), or whenever.

Changing the release date doesn't magically make the movie better.  It doesn't change peoples opinions on it.  It doesn't make people suggest it to friends.  It just postpones it's under-performance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 16, 2017, 08:48:44 PM
QuoteA:C is not an origin story

Except for the origin of the Alien in the title.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 16, 2017, 09:22:24 PM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2017, 08:48:44 PM
QuoteA:C is not an origin story

Except for the origin of the Alien in the title.

I dont know, are you kinda implying here that youd categorize A:C as an origin because of the Alien? I admit that would kill my argument, but i hardly see it with the Alien essentially being the black goo more or less and the Fassbender all over the place...

Im sure though Fox may have tried to make this appear as some kind of reboot, but i think they failed, i think everyone sees this as a Prometheus sequel with a weird disruption of the usual title continuation... Would be news for me if these two films werent heavily associated with each other in public perception, for good and worse --

I remember the rumours about Fox wanting to take out the bombing sequence. Maybe the whole problem with their reboot plan was actually Ridley himself. Wouldnt surprise me. It may have been sort of a trade off situation for them: they wanted to keep Ridley, cause Alien is Ridley, at least thats their marketing line, but wanted to reboot Prometheus/any Alien story badly at the same time.... they compromised and produced A:C.  ::) *inbeforemrmiyagiquote

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jul 17, 2017, 01:01:01 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 16, 2017, 09:22:24 PM
Quote from: SM on Jul 16, 2017, 08:48:44 PM
QuoteA:C is not an origin story

Except for the origin of the Alien in the title.

I dont know, are you kinda implying here that youd categorize A:C as an origin because of the Alien? I admit that would kill my argument, but i hardly see it with the Alien essentially being the black goo more or less and the Fassbender all over the place...

Im sure though Fox may have tried to make this appear as some kind of reboot, but i think they failed, i think everyone sees this as a Prometheus sequel with a weird disruption of the usual title continuation... Would be news for me if these two films werent heavily associated with each other in public perception, for good and worse --

I remember the rumours about Fox wanting to take out the bombing sequence. Maybe the whole problem with their reboot plan was actually Ridley himself. Wouldnt surprise me. It may have been sort of a trade off situation for them: they wanted to keep Ridley, cause Alien is Ridley, at least thats their marketing line, but wanted to reboot Prometheus/any Alien story badly at the same time.... they compromised and produced A:C.  ::) *inbeforemrmiyagiquote
I think a reboot would have simply been called "Alien". The ": Covenant" part implies sequel more than reboot, imho.

Whether or not the movie is profitable may never be known and may not even be relevant. Did you ever read about how some of the Harry Potter movies were not profitable according to the studio's books? It's a typical way to prevent them from having to share profits: claim there weren't any.

To me, the real issue is that the grosses for each Alien film continue to decline. Even good reviews didn't change that for Covenant. Prometheus was the only movie in the franchise that made more than its predecessors. It's worth pondering why.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 17, 2017, 01:09:36 AM
QuoteI dont know, are you kinda implying here that youd categorize A:C as an origin because of the Alien?

It tells us the origin of the Alien, so it would be, by definition, an origin story.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 01:21:18 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 17, 2017, 01:09:36 AM
QuoteI dont know, are you kinda implying here that youd categorize A:C as an origin because of the Alien?

It tells us the origin of the Alien, so it would be, by definition, an origin story.


A:C contains the origin story of the Alien, that doesnt make A:C as a whole into an origin story.

You think The Dark Knight Rises is an origin story because it tells us where Bane is coming from? Ja? So who is this old guy flying around in a Bat costume and why doesnt he just shoot criminals with a rocket launcher, cause he obviously can afford it?

(Even for the Alien alone A:C is lacking a severe amount of information. Who is this robot? Whats his beef with bald folks? What is this black substance? etc.)

QuoteDid you ever read about how some of the Harry Potter movies were not profitable according to the studio's books?

I didnt know. Shows how much of a black blox Hollywood productions really are. Everyone of us on the outside is talking more or less out of their *** and everyone on the inside wont talk at all.

A totally outside thought by myself: I think Fox at the moment doesnt really know what to do with the franchise, like at all, but they will leave no stone unturned (even Ridley), when it comes to figure out how to make more money with this problem child.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 17, 2017, 01:38:37 AM
QuoteA:C contains the origin story of the Alien, that doesnt make A:C as a whole into an origin story.

Depends if define 'origin' story in terms of super hero films.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 01:49:39 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 17, 2017, 01:38:37 AM
QuoteA:C contains the origin story of the Alien, that doesnt make A:C as a whole into an origin story.

Depends if define 'origin' story in terms of super hero films.

Ja if you solely focus on the cat, a man holding a cat is a cat. But in my book its a man holding a cat.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 17, 2017, 01:54:34 AM
That cat's something I can't explain.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 01:58:24 AM
There is no cat.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 17, 2017, 02:49:53 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 17, 2017, 01:54:34 AM
That cat's something I can't explain.



-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 17, 2017, 06:36:20 AM
It's not box office related, but AC is #1 for sci-fi sales on Amazon.

Also, thank the ENGINEERS (jk), for the sole fact there will be multiple cover designs. The main one is God awful, but the Best Buy exclusive one is very nice indeed. It's a steel book cover with the baby alien that Oram gave us. Much better design than the main one put out.

Also, Japan is a pretty big movie market. Beauty and the Beast took in a crushing 109 mill. Now, I am not saying AC will close close to that, but 20-40 million isn't out of the question, which puts it at 254-274 total. That, is a solid total. Not a flop.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 17, 2017, 10:37:00 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 17, 2017, 06:36:20 AMIt's not box office related, but AC is #1 for sci-fi sales on Amazon.

That's good news for those who want a sequel to "Covenant". The more disk/streaming sales the higher the total income will be for the film.
I'll be getting "Covenant" on Blu-ray.

Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 17, 2017, 06:36:20 AMAlso, Japan is a pretty big movie market... I am ... saying AC ... 20-40 million isn't out of the question, which puts it at 254-274 total. That, is a solid total. Not a flop.

Agreed.
* And box office which is about 2.6 x the production budget (or even below that) has gotten a sequel for several movies in the past.
- I've found over 20 movies where that happened for diffferent genres, budgets and several kinds of stories.
Here's the list;

- 2004 Resident Evil: Apocalypse, Production Budget: $50,000,000, world box office: $125,168,734, ratio box office/budget = 2.5

- 2002 Red Dragon (Hannibal Lecter), Production Budget: $78,000,000, world box office: $206,455,420, ratio box office/budget = 2.6
 
- 2008 The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian, Production Budget: $225,000,000, world box office: $417,341,288, ratio box office/budget = 1.9

- 2009 Night at the Museum: Battle of the Smithsonian, Production Budget: $150,000,000, world box office: $402,231,063, ratio box office/budget = 2.68

- 2002 The Santa Clause 2, Production Budget: $65,000,000, world box office: $172,825,854, ratio box office/budget = 2.65
 
- 2002 Halloween: Resurrection, Production Budget: $15,000,000, world box office: $37,659,652, ratio box office/budget = 2.47

- 2009 I Can Do Bad All By Myself, Production Budget: $19,000,000, world box office: $51,733,921, ratio box office/budget = 2.68
- 2011 Madea's Big Happy Family, Production Budget: $25,000,000, world box office: $53,345,287, ratio box office/budget = 2.12
- 2013 Tyler Perry's A Madea Christmas, Production Budget: $25,000,000, world box office: $52,543,354, ratio box office/budget = 2.1

- 1998 "Star Trek: Insurrection", Production Budget: $58 million. World box office = $112,587,658. ratio box office/budget = 1.93

- 2009 Star Trek, Production Budget: $150 million, World box office: $385,680,446. ratio box office/budget = 2.57
- 2013 Star Trek Into Darkness, Production Budget: $190 million, World box office: 467,381,469. ratio box office/budget = 2.46

- 1999 Analyze This, Production Budget: $80 million, World box office: $176,885,658, ratio box office/budget = 2.2           

- 2006 X-Men: The Last Stand, production budget: $210,000,000, world box office:   $459,359,555, ratio box office/budget = 2.19
- 2009 X-Men Origins: Wolverine, production budget: $150,000,000, world box office: $374,825,760, ratio box office/budget = 2.49
- 2011 X-Men: First Class, production budget: $160,000,000 world box office $355,408,305, ratio box office/budget = 2.22   

- 2005 Batman Begins, Production Budget: $150 million, world box office: $374,218,241. ratio box office/budget = 2.49

- 2006 Underworld: Evolution, production budget: $45,000,000, world box office:   $113,417,762,   ratio box office/budget = 2.5
- 2009 Underworld 3: Rise of the Lycans, production budget: $35,000,000, world box office: $89,102,315, ratio box office/budget = 2.5
- 2012 Underworld: Awakening, production budget: $70,000,000, world box office: $160,379,930, ratio box office/budget = 2.3

- 2015 The Divergent Series: Insurgent; production budget: $110,000,000, world box office: $295,279,072, ratio box office/budget = 2.68

- As for the Alien/AVP franchise "AVP" is not far from the box office/budget numbers of "Covenant".
- "AVP" Production Budget: $60 million. World Box office: $172,544,654. ratio box office/budget = 2.86
"AVP" got a sequel.

- And for the origin story topic; "Covenant" has a reboot of the origin of the Alien/xenomorph. It's also trying to begin a new timeline which leads to "Alien" and then goes beyond that.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 10:45:28 PM
If Covenant has a reboot of the origin of the Alien then SW Episode I sure has a reboot of the origin of Anakin Skywalker.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 17, 2017, 10:54:49 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 10:45:28 PM
If Covenant has a reboot of the origin of the Alien then SW Episode I sure has a reboot of the origin of Anakin Skywalker.

FYI; the xenomorph is in "Covenant" along with David's claim that he created it.
In addition in interviews Ridley has said that David created the xenomorph and the Engineers didn't do that.
A:C in several ways is a change from what was canon in "Alien".

As for "The Phantom Menace", it is just adding to the SW timeline and isn't drastically changing it.
Notice the difference between that and "Covenant".

;)

Edit; to take out a mistaken mention of Luke Skywalker.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 10:59:52 PM
Oh ja? So tell me, who created the Alien in Alien (1979) and how that was altered by Covenant.

FYI; Luke Skywalker ≠ Anakin Skywalker.

FYI; Anakin Skywalker is Darth Vader (LOL sorry!).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 17, 2017, 11:21:11 PM
As for my mentioning Luke Skywalker, that was a mistake of reading and typing my comment too quickly. 
I've edited my previous post to correct that.

Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 10:59:52 PM
Oh ja? So tell me, who created the Alien in Alien (1979) and how that was altered by Covenant.

How old were the xenomorph eggs in the derelict in "Alien"?
Previous "Alien" canon confirmed by Ridley at the time, was that the Space Jockey was fossilized.
It takes thousands of years for something to become a fossil.
So, the SJ is thousands of years old but the derelict ship seems undisturbed and so the eggs in that ship were also thousands of years old.
The xenomorphs being ancient weapons was confirmed by Scott in the "Alien" DVD commentary.

In an interview before "Prometheus" Ridley again supported this "Alien" canon. Ridley said the derelict ship left the base at LV-223 and crashed on LV-426. The date when the base on LV-223 was operational was up until about 2,000 years ago. Ridley said the derelict ship left the base on LV-223 a few hundred years before the disaster at the base.
Again, the eggs on that ship would be over 2000 years old.

* "Covenant" and Ridley's explanation of it states that xenomorph eggs did not exist before David.
David only exists in the future. And David created the first xenomorph eggs. Therefore the xenomorph eggs in the derelict were either created by David or were descendants of the creatures created by David.

"Covenant" changes several things in previous "Alien" canon.
1. While Ridley said in the "Alien" DVD commentary that xenomorphs were weapons used by the Space Jockeys in ancient wars.
This is no longer canon.
2. Even though Ridley said that the Space Jockey was fossilized. This can no longer be true since the filmmakers say that the SJ was killed by a xenomorph chestburster and those did not exist until David who is from the future.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 11:30:27 PM
Ja, have fun watching the Alien prequels leading directly into Alien (1979) and Ridley explaining it to you on the BD commentary.


(https://lecinemaavecungranda.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/jedighosts-rotj.png?w=330&h=142)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 17, 2017, 11:35:01 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 11:30:27 PM
Ja, have fun watching the Alien prequels leading directly into Alien (1979) and Ridley explaining it to you on the BD commentary.


https://lecinemaavecungranda.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/jedighosts-rotj.png?w=330&h=142

Will do.
I've also listened to a lot of commentaries by Lucas (and read interviews by him) including about why he put Hayden in the ghost moment in ROTJ.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 11:42:25 PM
Yes and im sure you didnt wonder why a guy is looking like this in one moment and totally different in the next.

Just like you wont wonder when a Jockey is said to be fossilized in one moment, and then all of a sudden isnt any longer in the next. In this case they dont even need to alter the picture. Maybe they will beep Dallas though?  ;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 18, 2017, 12:12:54 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 17, 2017, 11:42:25 PM
Yes and im sure you didnt wonder why a guy is looking like this in one moment and totally different in the next.

Just like you wont wonder when a Jockey is said to be fossilized in one moment, and then all of a sudden isnt any longer in the next. In this case they dont even need to alter the picture. Maybe they will beep Dallas though?  ;D

With Star Wars it's a change of actor in the last ghost scene. Irritating but I can easily ignore it and I don't worry that the original version of the original SW trilogy is obsolete.
With Rogue One there is more retconning with Vader in his spa and so on but it's tolerable and not a complete change.
Still not a reboot.

* With the ideas in "Covenant" the derelict crashed only a few years before the Nostromo showed up as I explained.
- And just as important, there is no Alien Queen with David's creating of the xenomorphs.
Ridley had played with the idea of xenomorph eggs being created out of some parasite goop with the "Alien: Director's Cut" .
If Scott has David create the derelict eggs with no Queen, then this undermines the Queen idea in "Aliens", "Alien 3" and "Resurrection".
Ridley seems to be going for a new no Queen franchise timeline and that's a reboot imo.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 18, 2017, 12:15:30 AM
It also takes something to be buried for it to become 'fossilised'.  So no.  It's not a fossil.  Mummified and preserved in a dry environment after it died, yes.  More likely.   Such a process can occur naturally in just a few weeks under the right conditions.

Besides, Scott is in a position to change his mind should he wish to.  If anyone has a right to renegotiate on what was said on old DVD commentaries, its the Director.   

There's no evidence that says how old the Space Jockey actually is.  It could be 10 years old.  Or it could 10,000 years old.  We'll find out in an upcoming movie.  Dallas says it's 'fossilised' sure, but he obviously knows f**k all about the process and is making a best guess due to lack of information on his part.   Once again, his job is to fly the Nostromo - not evaluate extra terrestrial archeological finds.  That's outside his area of expertise - flying and landing M Class freighters.

The jury is still out on this issue as far as I am concerned.   We'll need to wait and see what the next installment has to offer on this topic. 

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 18, 2017, 12:25:57 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jul 18, 2017, 12:15:30 AMBesides, Scott is in a position to change his mind should he wish to.  If anyone has a right to renegotiate on what was said on old DVD commentaries, its the Director.

I am not saying that Ridley and the studio don't have the right to change canon. They can.
All I'm saying is that is what is happening with "Covenant" as explained by Ridley and if it plays out with a sequel(s).

"Covenant" is an origin story and if it plays out as Ridley has described it, it will be a reboot of the franchise.   

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 18, 2017, 12:39:18 AM
They may leave it all unclear in the end. I doubt we have more than one film ahead considering the performance of AC and i also doubt this film will come that close to Alien (1979) timewise.

I dont think Scott (as a director or producer) wants to further mess with one of the few films the public considers to be truly great and therefore he will just leave things ambiguous and get out of this mess while he still can without losing whats left of his reputation completely (like Lucas kinda did, thanks to these internetkids). Ridley isnt Lucas though, i doubt he will go fullforce Prequel like Episode III (with David crashing the derelict and whatnot). I have still faith that he wont, then again hes already talking about Ripleys Mum...

In a few years it will be FOXs problem to deal with whats left of the public interest in the Alien franchise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jul 18, 2017, 01:55:57 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 15, 2017, 08:30:29 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMBut as I explained to you earlier, I was not making any theories about sequels.

Earlier, you speculated about why a studio would choose to release a sequel to a film which had box office which was about 2.5 times its production budget. 

From me;

Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 11, 2017, 08:23:58 PMOther films that did about 2.5 times the production budget at the box office?
"Batsman Begins"
"Star Trek (2009)"

Both those films got sequels. They were not flops.
If Japan's box office is about $20 million, there is still hope imo that "Covenant" will get a low budget sequel.

Your reply with emphasis by me.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 12, 2017, 07:13:48 AMThe catch is that studios need most revenues right away to cover operating costs and investors' returns. Given that, if they find better projects, then they may choose to shelve those that are riskier, or as you put it resort to lower budgets.

About the two examples, I'm guessing that they represent more attractive franchises compared to Alien.

What is being discussed here to me is the decision by the studio to release a sequel (or not to release one).
I have found several films which got sequels that performed at the box office (compared to the production budget) at about the same level to where "Covenant" should end up after its Japan release.
- I have taken the known public financial information which could be part of the studio's decision.

In terms of testing a film theory about what a studio "may choose" to decide about a sequel release, I think that's the best I can do.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMRather, I explained how studios profit.

You gave expense / income calculations. I already knew about that.
Still presenting a thought experiment/film theory about studio finances doesn't bring much clarity imo to when studios will approve of sequels.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMFor the examples you gave above, you need to include marketing cost...

Not really.
1. Marketing costs / total film expenses are very hard to find and are almost always unknown to the public.
2. If I did have the total movie expenses, I could give a more accurate measure (using formulas) of whether a film lost money or made money.
http://www.deadline.com/2013/01/movie-profits-december-snl-kagan/ (http://www.deadline.com/2013/01/movie-profits-december-snl-kagan/)

* But even if I had the total film expense information (and almost always, none of us have it), that still doesn't give an answer to the question of when a studio may approve a sequel for a particular movie or not.
- I don't work for the company where those decisions are made.
- What I have looked for is the cut off area, using numbers available to the public, of when studios may approve a sequel.
It seems again to be when box office is about 2.5 x the production budget.
- Here's another example (from the-numbers.com);

2015   The Divergent Series: Insurgent; production budget:   $110,000,000, worldwide box office:   $295,279,072, ratio box office/budget = 2.68
Sequel approved.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMGiven that, there are many reasons why sequels are approved even if studios did not earn as much. Read my previous post for details.

I understand. Those are your theories about why sequels are approved or are not approved.
Again, it's our privilege to bring up film theories/thought experiments.
- What I have done is to find the cut off area between box office and production budgets to determine the zone of where roughly there is a chance for a sequel to be approved.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMTo find out why sequels are approved, you need to look at the other revenue streams of the studio.

- That information is not available.
* To recap what is not available to the public;
1. Total film expenses.
2. All revenue streams for a studio.
3. The effects of arcane Hollywood Accounting which tries to hide film profits.
4. Studio executive discussions about sequel decisions. 

* What is known?
- Box office numbers and production budgets.
- Therefore a ratio between those two numbers can be figured out to find about where studios are approving sequels based on that.

Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 15, 2017, 03:00:36 AMHere's another article to consider:

"How is a cinema's box office income distributed?"

https://stephenfollows.com/how-a-cinemas-box-office-income-is-distributed/

Thanks for the link.
I have read several articles about that topic including one by the author you posted, Stephen Fellows.

https://stephenfollows.com/how-movies-make-money-hollywood-blockbusters/

- Here are a couple more articles about studio finances;

http://io9.gizmodo.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

;)

I don't think studios make decisions based on production budget and box office receipts, i.e., following the articles at the end of your post. Rather, they make decisions based on the ff. plus other factors:

total cost = production budget + marketing cost

box office share = box office receipts - distributors' cut - taxes

profits = investors' share + producers' share

studio profits = revenues from different projects (box office share) + other revenues - total cost of projects - other costs - other taxes






Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 17, 2017, 10:37:00 PM
Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 17, 2017, 06:36:20 AMIt's not box office related, but AC is #1 for sci-fi sales on Amazon.

That's good news for those who want a sequel to "Covenant". The more disk/streaming sales the higher the total income will be for the film.
I'll be getting "Covenant" on Blu-ray.

Quote from: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 17, 2017, 06:36:20 AMAlso, Japan is a pretty big movie market... I am ... saying AC ... 20-40 million isn't out of the question, which puts it at 254-274 total. That, is a solid total. Not a flop.

Agreed.
* And box office which is about 2.6 x the production budget (or even below that) has gotten a sequel for several movies in the past.
- I've found over 20 movies where that happened for diffferent genres, budgets and several kinds of stories.
Here's the list;

- 2004 Resident Evil: Apocalypse, Production Budget: $50,000,000, world box office: $125,168,734, ratio box office/budget = 2.5

- 2002 Red Dragon (Hannibal Lecter), Production Budget: $78,000,000, world box office: $206,455,420, ratio box office/budget = 2.6

- 2008 The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian, Production Budget: $225,000,000, world box office: $417,341,288, ratio box office/budget = 1.9

- 2009 Night at the Museum: Battle of the Smithsonian, Production Budget: $150,000,000, world box office: $402,231,063, ratio box office/budget = 2.68

- 2002 The Santa Clause 2, Production Budget: $65,000,000, world box office: $172,825,854, ratio box office/budget = 2.65

- 2002 Halloween: Resurrection, Production Budget: $15,000,000, world box office: $37,659,652, ratio box office/budget = 2.47

- 2009 I Can Do Bad All By Myself, Production Budget: $19,000,000, world box office: $51,733,921, ratio box office/budget = 2.68
- 2011 Madea's Big Happy Family, Production Budget: $25,000,000, world box office: $53,345,287, ratio box office/budget = 2.12
- 2013 Tyler Perry's A Madea Christmas, Production Budget: $25,000,000, world box office: $52,543,354, ratio box office/budget = 2.1

- 1998 "Star Trek: Insurrection", Production Budget: $58 million. World box office = $112,587,658. ratio box office/budget = 1.93

- 2009 Star Trek, Production Budget: $150 million, World box office: $385,680,446. ratio box office/budget = 2.57
- 2013 Star Trek Into Darkness, Production Budget: $190 million, World box office: 467,381,469. ratio box office/budget = 2.46

- 1999 Analyze This, Production Budget: $80 million, World box office: $176,885,658, ratio box office/budget = 2.2           

- 2006 X-Men: The Last Stand, production budget: $210,000,000, world box office:   $459,359,555, ratio box office/budget = 2.19
- 2009 X-Men Origins: Wolverine, production budget: $150,000,000, world box office: $374,825,760, ratio box office/budget = 2.49
- 2011 X-Men: First Class, production budget: $160,000,000 world box office $355,408,305, ratio box office/budget = 2.22   

- 2005 Batman Begins, Production Budget: $150 million, world box office: $374,218,241. ratio box office/budget = 2.49

- 2006 Underworld: Evolution, production budget: $45,000,000, world box office:   $113,417,762,   ratio box office/budget = 2.5
- 2009 Underworld 3: Rise of the Lycans, production budget: $35,000,000, world box office: $89,102,315, ratio box office/budget = 2.5
- 2012 Underworld: Awakening, production budget: $70,000,000, world box office: $160,379,930, ratio box office/budget = 2.3

- 2015 The Divergent Series: Insurgent; production budget: $110,000,000, world box office: $295,279,072, ratio box office/budget = 2.68

- As for the Alien/AVP franchise "AVP" is not far from the box office/budget numbers of "Covenant".
- "AVP" Production Budget: $60 million. World Box office: $172,544,654. ratio box office/budget = 2.86
"AVP" got a sequel.

- And for the origin story topic; "Covenant" has a reboot of the origin of the Alien/xenomorph. It's also trying to begin a new timeline which leads to "Alien" and then goes beyond that.

;)

As explained earlier, you have to include marketing cost and then deduct distributors' cut from the box office revenues.

Ultimately, you have to figure out what returns investors and producers got from the film, and what they think they'll get from merchandising. I think that's what determines whether or not a project is funded.


Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jul 18, 2017, 04:33:04 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jul 18, 2017, 12:15:30 AM
There's no evidence that says how old the Space Jockey actually is.  It could be 10 years old.  Or it could 10,000 years old.  We'll find out in an upcoming movie.  Dallas says it's 'fossilised' sure, but he obviously knows f**k all about the process and is making a best guess due to lack of information on his part.   Once again, his job is to fly the Nostromo - not evaluate extra terrestrial archeological finds.  That's outside his area of expertise - flying and landing M Class freighters.


Damn, where's Fifield when you need him? That man loved rocks!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 18, 2017, 04:44:53 AM
*sigh* He loved 'em so much, when he lands on an alien planet made of the stuff, he doesn't even pick one up...

"Rocks...  I love.  Rocks."  Then again, he was only aboard the ship for the money. 

It's the occasional moments of Stupid that just bring 'PROMETHEUS' down; much lower than what it should be.

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jul 18, 2017, 05:08:09 AM
Yeah. The writing of those two scientists in particular really brought the film down. Despite being a biologist, Milburn did pretty much no biology, unless getting himself killed by a penis snake counts.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jul 18, 2017, 07:29:59 AM
Given their phallic nature, isn't the word "penis-snake" kind of redundant? :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jul 18, 2017, 01:06:45 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Jul 18, 2017, 01:55:57 AM


As explained earlier, you have to include marketing cost and then deduct distributors' cut from the box office revenues.

Ultimately, you have to figure out what returns investors and producers got from the film, and what they think they'll get from merchandising. I think that's what determines whether or not a project is funded.

They would have already made their money back just by selling the rights.  Big franchise movies almost never lose money.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 18, 2017, 05:55:51 PM
Quote from: windebieste on Jul 18, 2017, 04:44:53 AM
*sigh* He loved 'em so much, when he lands on an alien planet made of the stuff, he doesn't even pick one up...

"Rocks...  I love.  Rocks."  Then again, he was only aboard the ship for the money. 

It's the occasional moments of Stupid that just bring 'PROMETHEUS' down; much lower than what it should be.

-Windebieste.
Quote from: tleilaxu on Jul 18, 2017, 05:08:09 AM
Yeah. The writing of those two scientists in particular really brought the film down. Despite being a biologist, Milburn did pretty much no biology, unless getting himself killed by a penis snake counts.

- I guess it's now time to point out things about the characters in "Prometheus".
* This is an off topic discussion for this thread. This should be on the "Prometheus" board but here we are.

1. Vickers hired the two scientists. She said she did the hiring in the crew presentation and since everyone else seemed to be regulars/or chosen by Weyland, Fifield and Milburn were the new comers and they would have been hired by Vickers.
2. Vickers thought no advanced aliens would be found on LV-223. She thought Shaw's / Holloway's hypothesis about the Engineers was nonsense.
So it turns out that Vickers hired two scientists who thought like she did; who also believed that the Engineer hypothesis was nonsense.
3. In the briefing Milburn and Fifield did what Vickers expected, they told Shaw / Holloway that their Engineer hypothesis was literally BS.
The biologist and geologist rejected the idea of guided evolution by space aliens. (They believed in pure Darwinian evolution.)
Those two scientists expected they would not find advanced space aliens on LV-223 and it turns out they weren't interested in finding them.
4. Fifield does some geology in "Prometheus"; such as by analyzing the structure of the dome/pyramid and by using the PUPS to map the structure of the tunnels.
But as explained in the dialogue, Fifield had no interest in the body of the advanced space alien Engineer. He wanted nothing to do with that.
5. Milburn's work as a biologist was cut from the theatrical version. In a deleted scene he finds a worm in a tunnel and is very excited by this.
His speciality was with less advanced creatures like worms or snakes.
But he had no interest in giant advanced space aliens.

* Considering this context; the behavior by the two scientists makes sense imo and does not bring "Prometheus" down.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Jul 18, 2017, 08:26:05 PM
There's a misconception that Weyland hired the best and brightest scientists. No respectable scientist would abandon everything and go away for 5+ years without even knowing where he's going or what he's supposed to study.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Jul 18, 2017, 10:08:39 PM
I know people hate "dumb" characters, but humans are pretty stupid. We make bad choices, just like the characters in Prometheus and Covenant did.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 18, 2017, 10:19:44 PM
I'll grant that.  On the other hand, there were instances - particularly in 'PROMETHEUS' - where characters failed to demonstrate any training within the field of their profession.  Fifield and Milburn being the most pronounced examples.

Aside from these issues, the movie has a ton of value.

'ALIEN: Covenant' suffers from the same problem but to a much lesser degree.

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 18, 2017, 10:37:34 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Jul 18, 2017, 08:26:05 PM
There's a misconception that Weyland hired the best and brightest scientists. No respectable scientist would abandon everything and go away for 5+ years without even knowing where he's going or what he's supposed to study.

You better dont watch this show:

(https://img.webme.com/pic/s/startrekmarpla/tripulacionpuente.jpg)


Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 18, 2017, 10:52:27 PM
 :D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jul 19, 2017, 12:53:35 AM
They have sex with green women, on that show. Wise, unwise? Not sure, but Kirk does it anyway. To boldly go where no man has gone before...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jul 19, 2017, 08:32:38 AM
Cannot blame him ;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Jul 19, 2017, 11:38:03 AM
Quote from: windebieste on Jul 18, 2017, 10:19:44 PM
I'll grant that.  On the other hand, there were instances - particularly in 'PROMETHEUS' - where characters failed to demonstrate any training within the field of their profession.  Fifield and Milburn being the most pronounced examples.

Funny thing is they were the other way round in Lindelof's script that's out there. So we didn't have the biologist touching the hammerpede.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on Jul 19, 2017, 12:27:03 PM
Quote1. Vickers hired the two scientists. She said she did the hiring in the crew presentation and since everyone else seemed to be regulars/or chosen by Weyland, Fifield and Milburn were the new comers and they would have been hired by Vickers.

Ok... so thats an excuse?

Quote2. Vickers thought no advanced aliens would be found on LV-223. She thought Shaw's / Holloway's hypothesis about the Engineers was nonsense. So it turns out that Vickers hired two scientists who thought like she did; who also believed that the Engineer hypothesis was nonsense.

Then the movie should explain the viewer that she hired a bunch of idiots.

Quote3. In the briefing Milburn and Fifield did what Vickers expected, they told Shaw / Holloway that their Engineer hypothesis was literally BS. The biologist and geologist rejected the idea of guided evolution by space aliens. (They believed in pure Darwinian evolution.)
Those two scientists expected they would not find advanced space aliens on LV-223 and it turns out they weren't interested in finding them.

Again the movie is too vague on their interests or their relation with Vickers. It would have been better if they had some sort of hidden agenda with vickers or something.

Quote4. Fifield does some geology in "Prometheus"; such as by analyzing the structure of the dome/pyramid and by using the PUPS to map the structure of the tunnels.
But as explained in the dialogue, Fifield had no interest in the body of the advanced space alien Engineer. He wanted nothing to do with that.

:P That dialogue is bat-sht crazy... Specially the way he brought it, and shows how horrid those 2 characters are written.

Quote5. Milburn's work as a biologist was cut from the theatrical version. In a deleted scene he finds a worm in a tunnel and is very excited by this.
His speciality was with less advanced creatures like worms or snakes.
But he had no interest in giant advanced space aliens.

Deleted scene's do not count, since only fanboys seen these

Quote* Considering this context; the behavior by the two scientists makes sense imo and does not bring "Prometheus" down.

No. And it does. People should not need a fcking manual trying to watch Prometheus.  :P Srry...

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jul 19, 2017, 03:08:54 PM
The Milburn complaints are so tired. AAAAAUUUUUUUOOWWWHHN.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 04:02:29 PM
They really are tired complaints. Hating a movie because of one character who is onscreen less than ten percent of the time? Blaming a script you haven't read? These are nitpicks at best. At least the biologist had a motivation to be interested in an extraterrestrial organism. Kane had no such excuse, and the entire Alien series resulted from Kane's decisions. Milburn doesn't even impact the plot. Either condemn all the Alien movies, or realize that criticizing Milburn and Fifield (and Lindelof) is the wrong battle to fight.

Prometheus's problems, imho, come from the editing. It moved very quickly, too quickly for some to accept the premise or the decisions made by the characters, and left a lot of material on the cutting room floor that would have helped the characters and the story work better. They are contorted to structure to focus on a single protagonist, Shaw, when the ensemble approach better served the complex plotline, imo. E sequel then kills of that protagonist and makes the antagonist the central character, making the reediting of Prometheus pointless. Even that is a bit of a nitpick. Overall Prometheus was excellent.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jul 19, 2017, 04:08:27 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 04:02:29 PM
The really are tired complaints. Hating a movie because of one character who is onscreen less than ten percent of the time? Blaming a script you haven't read? These are nitpicks at best. At least the biologist had a motivation to be interested in an extraterrestrial organism. Kane had no such excuse, and the entire Alien series resulted from Kane's decisions. Milburn doesn't even impact the plot. Either condemn all the Alien movies, or realize that criticizing Milburn and Fifield (and Lindelof) is the wrong battle to fight.

Prometheus's problems, imho, come from the editing. It moved very quickly, too quickly for some to accept the premise or the decisions made by the characters, and left a lot of material on the cutting room floor that would have helped the characters and the story work better. They are contorted to structure to focus on a single protagonist, Shaw, when the ensemble approach better served the complex plotline, imo. E sequel then kills of that protagonist and makes the antagonist the central character, making the reediting of Prometheus pointless. Even that is a bit of a nitpick. Overall Prometheus was excellent.

It's not just those two though. Most of the characters are badly written IMO. Janek, Holloway and Shaw are just as bad.

The editing doesn't help but the characters were just as big an issue.

I still like the film overall though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Holloway isn't badly written. The drinking scene at the billiard table is the most carefully written scene in the entire film. That relationship is the most developed in the story. There were scenes written, and some filmed, that make almost all of the characters well-rounded. He just isn't likeable and the actor was a weak link in an otherwise world-class ensemble of actors. Restore Janek's monologue and he comes into focus as one of the best characters in the series. Shaw is a much more nuanced character in his first film that Ripley was after just Alien. There is a double standard at work, here. Shaw was not given four movies to develop. If she had, she might have had an amazing arc.

All of the Alien movies have characters who exist solely to make poor choices. All of them have characters who are arrogant and will be proven wrong before the end. Shaw had more of a true character arc in one movie than Ripley had in three or four. Being motherly reduced her to a female stereotype and wanting to die isn't a character arc. Sue doesn't evolve, she goes through ups and downs. She didn't fundamentally change like Shaw chose to.

People focus too much on whether characters make mistakes to judge intelligence. In the other Alien movies, wrong equals stupid or evil. That is not a legitimate reason to rank Prometheus below the others.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jul 19, 2017, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Holloway isn't badly written. The drinking scene at the billiard table is the most carefully written scene in the entire film. That relationship is the most developed in the story. There were scenes written, and some filmed, that make almost all of the characters well-rounded. He just isn't likeable and the actor was a weak link in an otherwise world-class ensemble of actors. Restore Janek's monologue and he comes into focus as one of the best characters in the series. Shaw is a much more nuanced character in his first film that Ripley was after just Alien. There is a double standard at work, here. Shaw was not given four movies to develop. If she had, she might have had an amazing arc.

All of the Alien movies have characters who exist solely to make poor choices. All of them have characters who are arrogant and will be proven wrong before the end. Shaw had more of a true character arc in one movie than Ripley had in three or four. Being motherly reduced her to a female stereotype and wanting to die isn't a character arc. Sue doesn't evolve, she goes through ups and downs. She didn't fundamentally change like Shaw chose to.

People focus too much on whether characters make mistakes to judge intelligence. In the other Alien movies, wrong equals stupid or evil. That is not a legitimate reason to rank Prometheus below the others.

I'm not talking about poor decisions though, I can accept them. It's about them behaving in a manner that doesn't sit right with the character.

I agree the billiard table scene is a highlight of the film but the flaw for me is how we arrived at this scene. After being on the planet for only 5 mins and only scratching the surface of discovery this guy chucks his toys out the pram and hits the bottle like a sulky 5yr old. That's poor writing for me.

Janek at one point spots another life form on the monitor and then when it disappears basically just says sleep tight boys I'm off to bed! I mean, really? His disregard for the lost crew members well being is quite astonishing and unrealistic.

I'm not even gonna start on Shaw because we don't have enough hours in the day.

I agree the film has some great actors but the characters are so badly written they don't feel real and that's a problem IMO
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jul 19, 2017, 06:12:40 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Holloway isn't badly written. The drinking scene at the billiard table is the most carefully written scene in the entire film. That relationship is the most developed in the story. There were scenes written, and some filmed, that make almost all of the characters well-rounded. He just isn't likeable and the actor was a weak link in an otherwise world-class ensemble of actors. Restore Janek's monologue and he comes into focus as one of the best characters in the series. Shaw is a much more nuanced character in his first film that Ripley was after just Alien. There is a double standard at work, here. Shaw was not given four movies to develop. If she had, she might have had an amazing arc.

All of the Alien movies have characters who exist solely to make poor choices. All of them have characters who are arrogant and will be proven wrong before the end. Shaw had more of a true character arc in one movie than Ripley had in three or four. Being motherly reduced her to a female stereotype and wanting to die isn't a character arc. Sue doesn't evolve, she goes through ups and downs. She didn't fundamentally change like Shaw chose to.

People focus too much on whether characters make mistakes to judge intelligence. In the other Alien movies, wrong equals stupid or evil. That is not a legitimate reason to rank Prometheus below the others.

Thank you. No one is above making a stupid decision, not even scientists in uncharted territory.

And the billiard table scene might be my favorite scene in the Alien franchise. "We made you cuz we could." Perfection!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 19, 2017, 07:15:01 PM
Continuing the off topic (for this thread) discussion.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 19, 2017, 12:27:03 PMOk... so thats an excuse?

Vickers hiring the two scientists is an explanation.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 19, 2017, 12:27:03 PMThen the movie should explain the viewer that she hired a bunch of idiots.

"Prometheus" does have dialogue which explains Vicker's view of the mission.
- Vickers thought Shaw's / Holloway's hypothesis about the Engineers was nonsense.
- So it turns out that Vickers hired two scientists who thought like she did; who also believed that the Engineer hypothesis was nonsense as shown in the crew briefing scene.

- As for characters in an Alien franchise movie making dumb mistakes, this is part of every Alien film because;
1. A character who does something wrong is a standard horrror movie trope.
2. Why are there characters who misjudge the situation / risks in movies with horror/killers? Because mistakes are often essential to the later deaths of people happening in the story.
It's a basic idea in these kinds of stories.
- And such wrong behavior can spill over to science fiction such as with "Jurassic Park' where 'experts' make one bad move after another.

- As for the plausibility of the behavior of Milburn and Fifield? In our world snake experts can get killed by snakes and airline pilots can get lost because they are distracted. 

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 19, 2017, 12:27:03 PMAgain the movie is too vague on their interests or their relation with Vickers. It would have been better if they had some sort of hidden agenda with vickers or something.

I understand the dislike for the more vague style of the story.
Ridley Scott can do this with his science fiction as he did with "Blade Runner". (Scott sometimes likes to make his SF stories vague so viewers can argue about it,)
Accepting that vague style or not is a personal taste thing.
- Some viewers want the entire story to be crystal clear.
- Others are bored with multiple explanations and want the plot to be more vague.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 19, 2017, 12:27:03 PM:P That dialogue is bat-sht crazy... Specially the way he brought it, and shows how horrid those 2 characters are written.

In a movie some people can act 'crazy' including scientists.
- One idea from the beginning of science fiction is the mad scientist. In SF 'mad' is = to 'bat-sht' crazy.
- In the Alien franchise; with "Alien", the science officer, Ash, does crazy, reckless things (like Kane eating with the crew) which sabotages the secret orders to get the creature to earth.
- With "Alien Ressurection" the scientists do an extremely risky experiment with the xenomorphs which sets them loose and a scientist while trapped by the Queen, tells Ripley bizarre, wacky things.
- Science characters can act this way in SF.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 19, 2017, 12:27:03 PMDeleted scene's do not count, since only fanboys seen these

AVPgalaxy is an enthusiast site where some people go over draft scripts in detail, post multiple photos of each film's production and can review every deleted scene (and all other Blu-ray extras).
- So, while you are not interested in that extra stuff, which is fine, there are lots of people here, like me, who are interested.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 19, 2017, 12:27:03 PMNo. And it does. People should not need a fcking manual trying to watch Prometheus.  :P Srry...

* It all depends on the personal taste of the viewer.
I also understand that many people dislike "Prometheus" and that's fine with me.
- But on an Alien / Predator fan site like this, with includes the Alien franchise movies, you will find a few people who like "Prometheus" a lot.

Anyway, there is no absolutely correct personal taste.
I'm most willing to agree to disagree and move on.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jul 19, 2017, 07:39:01 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 04:02:29 PM
They really are tired complaints. Hating a movie because of one character who is onscreen less than ten percent of the time? Blaming a script you haven't read? These are nitpicks at best. At least the biologist had a motivation to be interested in an extraterrestrial organism. Kane had no such excuse, and the entire Alien series resulted from Kane's decisions. Milburn doesn't even impact the plot. Either condemn all the Alien movies, or realize that criticizing Milburn and Fifield (and Lindelof) is the wrong battle to fight.

Prometheus's problems, imho, come from the editing. It moved very quickly, too quickly for some to accept the premise or the decisions made by the characters, and left a lot of material on the cutting room floor that would have helped the characters and the story work better. They are contorted to structure to focus on a single protagonist, Shaw, when the ensemble approach better served the complex plotline, imo. E sequel then kills of that protagonist and makes the antagonist the central character, making the reediting of Prometheus pointless. Even that is a bit of a nitpick. Overall Prometheus was excellent.
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Holloway isn't badly written. The drinking scene at the billiard table is the most carefully written scene in the entire film. That relationship is the most developed in the story. There were scenes written, and some filmed, that make almost all of the characters well-rounded. He just isn't likeable and the actor was a weak link in an otherwise world-class ensemble of actors. Restore Janek's monologue and he comes into focus as one of the best characters in the series. Shaw is a much more nuanced character in his first film that Ripley was after just Alien. There is a double standard at work, here. Shaw was not given four movies to develop. If she had, she might have had an amazing arc.

All of the Alien movies have characters who exist solely to make poor choices. All of them have characters who are arrogant and will be proven wrong before the end. Shaw had more of a true character arc in one movie than Ripley had in three or four. Being motherly reduced her to a female stereotype and wanting to die isn't a character arc. Sue doesn't evolve, she goes through ups and downs. She didn't fundamentally change like Shaw chose to.

People focus too much on whether characters make mistakes to judge intelligence. In the other Alien movies, wrong equals stupid or evil. That is not a legitimate reason to rank Prometheus below the others.

My God, what two superbly written posts. I'm in awe and I really agree with you. Actually Holloway is a character who is drawn a lot better than Kane despite John Hurt being a world-class actor by the way.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jul 19, 2017, 09:54:33 PM
Yeah, Kane was just a slasher victim. We know way more about Holloway. All I remember from Kane is getting facehugged and his brilliant death performance. The rest is just banter and spacesuits.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 19, 2017, 11:29:36 PM
It's more than that, but because he doesn't blather on it's easily missed.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jul 20, 2017, 01:48:13 AM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Jul 19, 2017, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Holloway isn't badly written. The drinking scene at the billiard table is the most carefully written scene in the entire film. That relationship is the most developed in the story. There were scenes written, and some filmed, that make almost all of the characters well-rounded. He just isn't likeable and the actor was a weak link in an otherwise world-class ensemble of actors. Restore Janek's monologue and he comes into focus as one of the best characters in the series. Shaw is a much more nuanced character in his first film that Ripley was after just Alien. There is a double standard at work, here. Shaw was not given four movies to develop. If she had, she might have had an amazing arc.

All of the Alien movies have characters who exist solely to make poor choices. All of them have characters who are arrogant and will be proven wrong before the end. Shaw had more of a true character arc in one movie than Ripley had in three or four. Being motherly reduced her to a female stereotype and wanting to die isn't a character arc. Sue doesn't evolve, she goes through ups and downs. She didn't fundamentally change like Shaw chose to.

People focus too much on whether characters make mistakes to judge intelligence. In the other Alien movies, wrong equals stupid or evil. That is not a legitimate reason to rank Prometheus below the others.

I'm not talking about poor decisions though, I can accept them. It's about them behaving in a manner that doesn't sit right with the character.

I agree the billiard table scene is a highlight of the film but the flaw for me is how we arrived at this scene. After being on the planet for only 5 mins and only scratching the surface of discovery this guy chucks his toys out the pram and hits the bottle like a sulky 5yr old. That's poor writing for me.

Janek at one point spots another life form on the monitor and then when it disappears basically just says sleep tight boys I'm off to bed! I mean, really? His disregard for the lost crew members well being is quite astonishing and unrealistic.

I'm not even gonna start on Shaw because we don't have enough hours in the day.

I agree the film has some great actors but the characters are so badly written they don't feel real and that's a problem IMO
Yeah I agree with most of this. I even thought Janek was part of a Weyland-Yutani conspiracy at some point when watching it for the first time, because it was hard to make SENSE of what was going on.
I didn't really have any problems with Shaw though, it was mostly, like, everybody else.
One of the scenes that keep grating me is when Janek's two co-pilots decide to kamikaze with him. First of all, it seems weird that give a futuristic space-ship they couldn't just use the ship's AI to crash it into the Juggernaut, but I can accept that there has to be a sacrifice, I can look over it, but why on earth are his two co-pilots just willy-nilly giving up their lives for no reason? That part still annoys me so much everytime I watch Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 20, 2017, 01:52:45 AM
Janek alerted his crew to the lifeform reading which he believed was a glitch.  Don't see a problem.

Not having anyone monitoring the ground crew for the whole night was a bit dumb though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 20, 2017, 02:55:55 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 19, 2017, 11:29:36 PM
It's more than that, but because he doesn't blather on it's easily missed.

Ja this essentially. Alien uses a way more nuanced and subtle method when it comes to characterization. Its so much harder to find (pure) stereotypes for the Nostromo crew members, though its not completely impossibe obviously.

Prometheus almost feels COMICesque in this department. It might not be undeliberated though, due to the different kind of audience these blockbusters of today are simply designed to appeal to.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jul 20, 2017, 06:39:50 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 20, 2017, 01:52:45 AM
Janek alerted his crew to the lifeform reading which he believed was a glitch.  Don't see a problem.

Not having anyone monitoring the ground crew for the whole night was a bit dumb though.

I know he says it's a glitch but that's just an assumption on his part, he's just so blasé about it all when they are in an alien environment they know little about and have already seen some weird shit. like you say, he just buggers off and stops monitoring them. It's not so much dumb as just not fitting the character of Janek.

The most frustrating thing about Prometheus is it's almost great. Just a few little tweaks would fix almost every issue in the film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 20, 2017, 06:56:22 AM
It's a sporadic reading a kilometre away from the Millburn and Fifield.  I don't think it's a big deal for people who aren't aware they're in a horror film.

And I'm not sure it doesn't really fit the character.  He did take off and ram the Juggeraut without warning the other security guys on board.  ;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jul 20, 2017, 07:47:08 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 20, 2017, 06:56:22 AM
It's a sporadic reading a kilometre away from the Millburn and Fifield.  I don't think it's a big deal for people who aren't aware they're in a horror film.

And I'm not sure it doesn't really fit the character.  He did take off and ram the Juggeraut without warning the other security guys on board.  ;)

Yeah there is that, and Vickers was a bit of a distraction for him and I cant blame him for that really.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 20, 2017, 06:56:22 AM
It's a sporadic reading a kilometre away from the Millburn and Fifield.  I don't think it's a big deal for people who aren't aware they're in a horror film.

And I'm not sure it doesn't really fit the character.  He did take off and ram the Juggeraut without warning the other security guys on board.  ;)

Poor fellas prob thought they were going home... They were so wrong... :P

Quote1. A character who does something wrong is a standard horrror movie trope.

Sure... But making it convincing that the person is making a mistake is a different kind of art. Both scientist, actors and script were not imo.

QuoteIn a movie some people can act 'crazy' including scientists.

There was no indication that Fifield was getting nervous or afraid. It comes over like he suddenly rages and flips for no reason. Correction...there is a reason. Bad script   ;D (or cut wrong)

QuoteAVPgalaxy is an enthusiast site where some people go over draft scripts in detail

Not the point, the point was from a viewers perspective. Unbiased. I know you love the deleted scene stuff, but without that information a viewer shrugs and thinks "wtf...don't touch the fcking worm...you are a scientist!". Hence why so many people online bitch about it. Viewers simply reacted negative to those parts of the movie for a reason.

And I am interested in the extra stuff, but I should not have to see those to get an explanation why Milburn is acting like a twat in his field.

Quote* It all depends on the personal taste of the viewer.
I also understand that many people dislike "Prometheus" and that's fine with me.
- But on an Alien / Predator fan site like this, with includes the Alien franchise movies, you will find a few people who like "Prometheus" a lot.

You like what you like, but like SM and Sil point out too often.... movies make mistakes. You can try to defend those with commentary tracks or deleted scenes, but in the end the unbiased viewers judgement is clear. The two sientist are poorly written, movie is cut bad or the acting is unconvincing.

Ill say it again. I love Alien 3, but I also realise you can't defend certain parts of that movie... Fincher didn't even have a script with bad characters during shooting haha, that realisation came afterwards lol.

So I learned to nod, and simply say...you are correct SM.  ;) (and he is...most of the time :P) I still love the movie, like you love Prometheus. And thats great, cous in the end it's all about entertainment no?



Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 20, 2017, 09:54:38 AM
Yep.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jul 20, 2017, 02:58:28 PM
For me the problem with Fifield was that he got lost in a cave he mapped out himself...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Jul 20, 2017, 03:05:46 PM
Quote from: Salt The Fries on Jul 20, 2017, 02:58:28 PM
For me the problem with Fifield was that he got lost in a cave he mapped out himself...

He just released his pups. That's all. He hasn't seen scanning process because he wasn't inside Prometheus.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jul 20, 2017, 03:06:51 PM
And like that Weyland makeup OMG am I right folks??
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jul 20, 2017, 03:16:19 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Jul 20, 2017, 02:55:55 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 19, 2017, 11:29:36 PM
It's more than that, but because he doesn't blather on it's easily missed.

this essentially. Alien uses a way more nuanced and subtle method when it comes to characterization. Its so much harder to find (pure) stereotypes for the Nostromo crew members, though its not completely impossibe obviously.



(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FnZTeSde.jpg&hash=99ace109528710e706fd2691483785d5f975bbe7)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jul 20, 2017, 03:18:20 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jul 20, 2017, 03:06:51 PM
And like that Weyland makeup OMG am I right folks??

Huh?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 21, 2017, 02:24:16 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 19, 2017, 07:15:01 PM1. A character who does something wrong is a standard horrror movie trope.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMSure... But making it convincing that the person is making a mistake is a different kind of art. Both scientist, actors and script were not imo.

In your opinion something in "Prometheus" was not convincing. Fine.
We just have different opinions.   

Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 19, 2017, 07:15:01 PMIn a movie some people can act 'crazy' including scientists.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMThere was no indication that Fifield was getting nervous or afraid. It comes over like he suddenly rages and flips for no reason. Correction...there is a reason. Bad script   ;D (or cut wrong)

Fifield was breathing heavy when he first entered the tunnels. Imo that was a sign that he was nervous.
And it was already established in the film that Fifield was rude and has an anger management problem. Add stress to that and he had a tantrum.
The only time Fifield was relaxed was when he was stoned.

- As for what you think is "bad", we all are entitled to our personal taste.

Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 19, 2017, 07:15:01 PMAVPgalaxy is an enthusiast site where some people go over draft scripts in detail

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMNot the point, the point was from a viewers perspective. Unbiased.

- There is no such thing as an unbiased personal reaction about a film.
Each person comes to a movie with their knowledge / experiences which leads to their personal taste which is a bias. 

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMI know you love the deleted scene stuff, but without that information a viewer shrugs and thinks "wtf...don't touch the fcking worm...you are a scientist!". Hence why so many people online bitch about it.

- I did not need the deleted scenes to understand the argument that Milburn's specialty was with more primitive life forms. That was figured out on IMDb long before the Blu-ray came out.
- There are many people who "bitch" about lots of movies such as; "2001" and "Blade Runner".
Name your favorite film; maybe it's "The Godfather". On IMDb that has thousands of 1/10 votes. Every movie gets 1/10 votes.
- As a result, all films cannot appeal to everyone because that is impossible. For instance making all films appeal to young teenagers is not an answer.
- A movie can be made for enthusiast audiences who want to explore a film in depth.
Ridley decided to go that direction.
Some people like that. Others don't.

You didn't like that? Fine.
We can agree to disagree.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMMilburn is acting like a twat in his field.

Not imo.
- Milburn was examining and maybe trying to capture an alien snake.
- In our world scientists examine and capture the most dangerous snakes in the world.
Who put the wild animals in the zoos around the world? They had to be captured.

Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 19, 2017, 07:15:01 PM* It all depends on the personal taste of the viewer.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMYou like what you like, but like SM and Sil point out too often.... movies make mistakes.

That's their opinion.
I have pointed out what I believe are mistakes either in films/scripts or with certain comments by the filmmakers.
And others have argued against my criticisms.
No one has infallible personal taste.

* And film criticism to me is not a popularity contest.
A movie rating is personal to each person.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMIll say it again. I love Alien 3, but I also realise you can't defend certain parts of that movie...

I can criticize any film.
And I can find what I think are flaws in a movie including with "Prometheus". In fact I have a "Prometheus" flaws list which I'll post if you are interested.
I just disagree about what are commonly brought up as flaws about the two scientists.

Quote from: Hemi on Jul 20, 2017, 08:41:41 AMAnd thats great, cous in the end it's all about entertainment no?

Of course. There was this person on IMDb who loved "Manos Hands of Fate" and who gave it a 10/10.
Any well known movie on IMDb can get 10/10 ratings or 1/10 scores.
Personal taste is everyone's privilege.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jul 21, 2017, 05:48:29 AM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Jul 19, 2017, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Holloway isn't badly written. The drinking scene at the billiard table is the most carefully written scene in the entire film. That relationship is the most developed in the story. There were scenes written, and some filmed, that make almost all of the characters well-rounded. He just isn't likeable and the actor was a weak link in an otherwise world-class ensemble of actors. Restore Janek's monologue and he comes into focus as one of the best characters in the series. Shaw is a much more nuanced character in his first film that Ripley was after just Alien. There is a double standard at work, here. Shaw was not given four movies to develop. If she had, she might have had an amazing arc.

All of the Alien movies have characters who exist solely to make poor choices. All of them have characters who are arrogant and will be proven wrong before the end. Shaw had more of a true character arc in one movie than Ripley had in three or four. Being motherly reduced her to a female stereotype and wanting to die isn't a character arc. Sue doesn't evolve, she goes through ups and downs. She didn't fundamentally change like Shaw chose to.

People focus too much on whether characters make mistakes to judge intelligence. In the other Alien movies, wrong equals stupid or evil. That is not a legitimate reason to rank Prometheus below the others.

I'm not talking about poor decisions though, I can accept them. It's about them behaving in a manner that doesn't sit right with the character.

I agree the billiard table scene is a highlight of the film but the flaw for me is how we arrived at this scene. After being on the planet for only 5 mins and only scratching the surface of discovery this guy chucks his toys out the pram and hits the bottle like a sulky 5yr old. That's poor writing for me.

Janek at one point spots another life form on the monitor and then when it disappears basically just says sleep tight boys I'm off to bed! I mean, really? His disregard for the lost crew members well being is quite astonishing and unrealistic.

I'm not even gonna start on Shaw because we don't have enough hours in the day.

I agree the film has some great actors but the characters are so badly written they don't feel real and that's a problem IMO
I don't understand how things happening quickly equals bad writing. There are explanations for all of the behaviors for all of the characters. Holloway became a little temperamental after his line about having discovered another tomb. They may have scratched the surface archaeologically, but Holloway explicitly states that he wanted to meet his living makers. It was immediately obvious that the planet was not inhabited any longer. He started drinking after returning to the ship, which made his feelings more difficult to hide. That's what alcohol does. This happened immediately because his dreams were dashed in an instant.

Janek is unsure if he actually detected a life form, and he is powerless to do anything about it, anyway. Even a captain needs to sleep.

Prometheus has many characters and a lot of ground it covers in under two hours. That's why I cite editing as the reason the movie has trouble pleasing everyone. But of you watch the movie closely, it is very knowledgeable of psychology and provides motivations for all of the characters' behaviors. To me, of is the best Alien movie for realistic psychology, particularly when it comes to motivation. But many people dislike the characters or disagree with their decisions, which is not a legitimate basis to criticise the writing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Jul 21, 2017, 06:00:44 AM
Geologist goes to another planet - fails to pick up a single rock.  Really?  Why not..?

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 21, 2017, 06:26:38 AM
QuoteJanek is unsure if he actually detected a life form, and he is powerless to do anything about it, anyway. Even a captain needs to sleep.

He wasn't sleeping.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on Jul 21, 2017, 07:07:12 AM
Quote from: SM on Jul 21, 2017, 06:26:38 AM
QuoteJanek is unsure if he actually detected a life form, and he is powerless to do anything about it, anyway. Even a captain needs to sleep.

He wasn't sleeping.



Write that up as just another one of those "things". :P He really doesn't care about any of the crew lol.

"They are lost. Fck em! Imma gonna blow up this ship anyway with most of you guys on it! Come here Vickers!"

Janek is a real ahole...

Quote from: bb-15 on Jul 21, 2017, 02:24:16 AM

-snip-


You and I differ too much on this subject. So i'm going to stop this whole "It's my opinion" debate right here, if you don't mind.
Cous this can go on forever.  :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jul 21, 2017, 09:35:07 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 21, 2017, 05:48:29 AM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Jul 19, 2017, 05:22:29 PM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 19, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Holloway isn't badly written. The drinking scene at the billiard table is the most carefully written scene in the entire film. That relationship is the most developed in the story. There were scenes written, and some filmed, that make almost all of the characters well-rounded. He just isn't likeable and the actor was a weak link in an otherwise world-class ensemble of actors. Restore Janek's monologue and he comes into focus as one of the best characters in the series. Shaw is a much more nuanced character in his first film that Ripley was after just Alien. There is a double standard at work, here. Shaw was not given four movies to develop. If she had, she might have had an amazing arc.

All of the Alien movies have characters who exist solely to make poor choices. All of them have characters who are arrogant and will be proven wrong before the end. Shaw had more of a true character arc in one movie than Ripley had in three or four. Being motherly reduced her to a female stereotype and wanting to die isn't a character arc. Sue doesn't evolve, she goes through ups and downs. She didn't fundamentally change like Shaw chose to.

People focus too much on whether characters make mistakes to judge intelligence. In the other Alien movies, wrong equals stupid or evil. That is not a legitimate reason to rank Prometheus below the others.

I'm not talking about poor decisions though, I can accept them. It's about them behaving in a manner that doesn't sit right with the character.

I agree the billiard table scene is a highlight of the film but the flaw for me is how we arrived at this scene. After being on the planet for only 5 mins and only scratching the surface of discovery this guy chucks his toys out the pram and hits the bottle like a sulky 5yr old. That's poor writing for me.

Janek at one point spots another life form on the monitor and then when it disappears basically just says sleep tight boys I'm off to bed! I mean, really? His disregard for the lost crew members well being is quite astonishing and unrealistic.

I'm not even gonna start on Shaw because we don't have enough hours in the day.

I agree the film has some great actors but the characters are so badly written they don't feel real and that's a problem IMO
I don't understand how things happening quickly equals bad writing. There are explanations for all of the behaviors for all of the characters. Holloway became a little temperamental after his line about having discovered another tomb. They may have scratched the surface archaeologically, but Holloway explicitly states that he wanted to meet his living makers. It was immediately obvious that the planet was not inhabited any longer. He started drinking after returning to the ship, which made his feelings more difficult to hide. That's what alcohol does. This happened immediately because his dreams were dashed in an instant.

Janek is unsure if he actually detected a life form, and he is powerless to do anything about it, anyway. Even a captain needs to sleep.

Prometheus has many characters and a lot of ground it covers in under two hours. That's why I cite editing as the reason the movie has trouble pleasing everyone. But of you watch the movie closely, it is very knowledgeable of psychology and provides motivations for all of the characters' behaviors. To me, of is the best Alien movie for realistic psychology, particularly when it comes to motivation. But many people dislike the characters or disagree with their decisions, which is not a legitimate basis to criticise the writing.

Thank you for the advice but I have watched the movie dozens of times and very closely I can assure you. The behavior of characters were a problem for me the first time I saw it and they still remain. When I went to see Prometheus for the first time I was totally hyped for it and then as the film unfolded I found myself continually questioning character moments, taking me out of the movie. Yes you can make excuses for behavior and fill in the gaps but they are still just excuses and this isn't down to subtlety either.

I don't believe the characters have realistic psychology or motivations, they are just thinly drawn plot devices. I am fully aware you can call the characters in Alien plot devices too, and you would be correct, but they all feel like real humans to me and the purpose of the film is very different. None of the characters in Prometheus are carefully drawn apart from David and to a lesser extent Weyland (which is why they are the only ones remaining in Covenant)

I still love the film because its strengths outway its weaknesses for me but I'm not going to deny they exist. The billiard scene is brilliant as are several other sequences, Michael Fassbender is outstanding, its visually stunning and parts of the soundtrack are great but you cant just wave away these criticisms because they didn't bother you. They bothered me and many others and unfortunately undermine a film that was very nearly a true great of the genre.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hemi on Jul 21, 2017, 10:48:01 AM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Jul 21, 2017, 09:35:07 AM

I still love the film because its strengths outway its weaknesses for me but I'm not going to deny they exist. The billiard scene is brilliant as are several other sequences, Michael Fassbender is outstanding, its visually stunning and parts of the soundtrack are great but you cant just wave away these criticisms because they didn't bother you. They bothered me and many others and unfortunately undermine a film that was very nearly a true great of the genre.

I agree... but they will still wave them away m8...or find some weird convoluted explanation why the scene does work. Kinda like the movie itself lol.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Jul 21, 2017, 11:16:00 AM
Quote from: Hemi on Jul 21, 2017, 10:48:01 AM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Jul 21, 2017, 09:35:07 AM

I still love the film because its strengths outway its weaknesses for me but I'm not going to deny they exist. The billiard scene is brilliant as are several other sequences, Michael Fassbender is outstanding, its visually stunning and parts of the soundtrack are great but you cant just wave away these criticisms because they didn't bother you. They bothered me and many others and unfortunately undermine a film that was very nearly a true great of the genre.

I agree... but they will still wave them away m8...or find some weird convoluted explanation why the scene does work. Kinda like the movie itself lol.

Yep, you're right, i'm engaging in a pointless exercise and totally in the wrong thread for it to boot!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Look into my eye on Jul 21, 2017, 03:42:31 PM
https://moviesfilmsandflix.com/2017/07/20/mff-special-figuring-out-how-the-geologist-got-lost-in-prometheus/

Found this in Reddit today, thought it might be appropriate here.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 21, 2017, 06:02:43 PM
Quote from: windebieste on Jul 21, 2017, 06:00:44 AM
Geologist goes to another planet - fails to pick up a single rock.  Really?  Why not..?

-Windebieste.

A definition of geology;

Quote1 The science which deals with the physical structure and substance of the earth, their history, and the processes which act on them.
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/geology

Once he left the ship in the beginning of the mission Fifield did his job as a geologist when he;
1. Used instruments to show that the dome/pyramid's structure was hollow.
2. When Fifield used the PUPS to determine the structure of the tunnels.

* Also, Fifield was not on earth. He would be doing what's called 'planetary geology'. With space exploration a geologist does not even need to be on another planet to do geology.

QuotePlanetary geology includes such topics as determining the internal structure of the terrestrial planets, and also looks at planetary volcanism and surface processes such as impact craters, fluvial and aeolian processes. The structures of the giant planets and their moons are also examined, as is the make-up of the minor bodies of the Solar System, such as asteroids, the Kuiper Belt, and comets.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planetary_geology

- Since Fifield was traveling in space, this seemed to be the kind of geology which he did, which involves figuring out the structure of things on other planets/moons.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Jul 21, 2017, 06:57:01 PM
Could someone please explain to me what Fifield and Millburn's got to do with Covenant's box office situation?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 21, 2017, 11:11:10 PM
Isn't it their fault?  Isn't everything?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: FallenDarkAngel on Jul 22, 2017, 03:34:52 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jul 21, 2017, 06:57:01 PM
Could someone please explain to me what Fifield and Millburn's got to do with Covenant's box office situation?

Exactly.  :D They should've created a separate thread for that.  :laugh: ::)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Jul 22, 2017, 03:35:40 PM
Quote from: SM on Jul 21, 2017, 11:11:10 PM
Isn't it their fault?  Isn't everything?

But I thought Katherine Waterston's hairstyle was responsible for the disappointing box office?  ???
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Robopadna on Jul 22, 2017, 04:44:07 PM
Apparently Fox is reassessing the franchise as a whole due to the poor box office performance.  I'm somewhat surprised but we might actually not get a sequel.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jul 22, 2017, 05:05:18 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jul 21, 2017, 06:57:01 PM
Could someone please explain to me what Fifield and Millburn's got to do with Covenant's box office situation?
All discussions of Prometheus seem to end up as debates of the movie's merits, and the Milburn-Fifield thing is the main iisues detractors hang onto. I'm as tired of it as anyone else, but I feel the need to point out that, minority opinion notwithstanding, Prometheus 2 would have done better than Covenant. Prometheus was very successful if you tune out the people who think minor characters are fatal flaws and the fresh premise is what this franchise needed to thrive. Those chances were dashed my Prometheus haters who harped on all of the wrong issues. They need to get over this double standard and support original science fiction movies if they want to see more successful ones.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Jul 22, 2017, 09:14:15 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jul 21, 2017, 06:57:01 PM
Could someone please explain to me what Fifield and Millburn's got to do with Covenant's box office situation?

I wrote in my first reply about this that it was off topic but since it came up, I had my own view of it.
The topic started with Replies #1380, #1381 and my Reply #1384 in this thread.

* I'd gladly talk about "Covenant" worldwide box office which is now at $232,312,741 (box office mojo)
The film needs Japan's release to get to ~$250 million which would be good news for a possible sequel imo.

Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jul 22, 2017, 03:35:40 PMBut I thought Katherine Waterston's hairstyle was responsible for the disappointing box office?  ???

Ha ha...

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: nanison on Jul 22, 2017, 11:08:22 PM
Quote from: FallenDarkAngel on Jul 22, 2017, 03:34:52 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jul 21, 2017, 06:57:01 PM
Could someone please explain to me what Fifield and Millburn's got to do with Covenant's box office situation?

Exactly.  :D They should've created a separate thread for that.  :laugh: ::)

They made her look so ordinary which is some doing as she is actually super hot. If you don't believe me watch inherent vice
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 23, 2017, 02:26:53 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Jul 22, 2017, 03:35:40 PM
Quote from: SM on Jul 21, 2017, 11:11:10 PM
Isn't it their fault?  Isn't everything?

But I thought Katherine Waterston's hairstyle was responsible for the disappointing box office?  ???

Millburn's hobbies included hair styling.  Had he not died on LV-223, he could've applied for the Covenant mission and given Daniels long hair like a proper girly should have.

Bottom line - everything is Fifield and Millburn's fault.  Evah.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jul 23, 2017, 02:51:18 AM
Actually short hair is objectively better on girls.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Jul 23, 2017, 03:35:06 AM
More likely an attempt to copy Ripley's character and appearance rather than style preferences, and that in turn connected to the idea that copying from previous films would lead to box office success.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 23, 2017, 03:39:27 AM
Quote from: tleilaxu on Jul 23, 2017, 02:51:18 AM
Actually short hair is objectively better on girls.

:laugh:

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PierreVW on Jul 23, 2017, 06:02:55 PM
Quote from: tleilaxu on Jul 23, 2017, 02:51:18 AM
Actually short hair is objectively better on girls.

I disagree but some women look great with short hair. For example: Emma Watson.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: fiveways on Jul 24, 2017, 05:40:30 PM
Short hair works on some women, long hair works on some women.  This movie works for some people, this movie doesn't work for some people.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Jul 24, 2017, 05:42:27 PM
Jesus what did this thread devolve into.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on Jul 24, 2017, 07:30:07 PM
Yeah.. Hair? Seriously? What the hell does it even matter? Some women have short hair, so what. Looks fine to me.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Jul 24, 2017, 09:26:57 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Jul 24, 2017, 05:42:27 PM
Jesus what did this thread devolve into.

I think it's time to shut down this thread.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Jul 24, 2017, 09:42:15 PM
I personally like to see what a thread may evolve into, as long as it doesn't become full of trash-talking. I don't think there's a need to shut down, also because further news of the box office situation will still tick in.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jul 24, 2017, 11:01:14 PM
^

But seriously. What is this?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 25, 2017, 02:12:42 AM
Its kinda settled anyway. I mean plus what 20m from japan and thats it. ~250m, neither fish nor fowl, id say.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Jul 25, 2017, 04:41:10 AM
A pretty decent result for an R rated horror film.  If it had a lower budget, it would be a success.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 25, 2017, 04:42:40 AM
If it had a lower budget it'd be a different film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 25, 2017, 07:16:27 PM
If it had created a larger profit it would have been more successful.

Discuss!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 25, 2017, 11:36:18 PM
If my uncle was a woman he'd be my aunt.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on Jul 26, 2017, 12:02:33 AM
If my granny had wheels she'd be a wheelbarrow.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Jul 26, 2017, 12:06:03 AM
If a Xenomorph had a vagina for a head instead of a penis, it would be a Predator.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Jul 26, 2017, 01:29:59 AM
You depraved people!!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Gash on Jul 26, 2017, 01:32:49 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Jul 26, 2017, 12:06:03 AM
If a Xenomorph had a vagina for a head instead of a penis, it would be a Predator.

Good job they don't exist in the same universe.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anthony on Jul 26, 2017, 05:34:16 PM
Hey remember when we talked about box office on this thread?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Salt The Fries on Jul 26, 2017, 06:14:44 PM
Quote from: Anthony on Jul 26, 2017, 05:34:16 PM
Hey remember when we talked about box office on this thread?

What glorious times, those were.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Jul 26, 2017, 07:14:47 PM
Quote from: Anthony on Jul 26, 2017, 05:34:16 PM
Hey remember when we talked about box office on this thread?

I'm sure Japan will course correct this thread in September.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: NickisSmart on Jul 26, 2017, 08:13:02 PM
$150 million-take, in Japan.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: nanison on Jul 26, 2017, 09:30:37 PM
Let's not go off topic guys. Let's talk about Tennessee's hair. I think it looked like a hat.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Jul 26, 2017, 09:53:30 PM
 :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Protozoid on Jul 27, 2017, 12:34:41 AM
Quote from: Anthony on Jul 26, 2017, 05:34:16 PM
Hey remember when we talked about box office on this thread?
There is plenty of analysis yet to go.

For example, I just noticed that Alien: Covenant is Scott's lowest-grossing science fiction movie at the domestic box office.

Adjusted for inflation, Blade Runner made $83,397,000 domestically, and was considered a flop. (The good news is, that didn't stop Blade Runner from becoming a classic down the road.)

And speaking of Japan: Covenant also made less than Black Rain (Domestic Total Adj. Gross: $103,482,400).
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anthony on Jul 27, 2017, 04:17:16 AM
Quote from: Protozoid on Jul 27, 2017, 12:34:41 AM
Quote from: Anthony on Jul 26, 2017, 05:34:16 PM
Hey remember when we talked about box office on this thread?
There is plenty of analysis yet to go.


I know, but when the thread has devolved into conversations about Daniels' hair, I think maaaaaaybeee we've gone a bit of topic.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Aug 10, 2017, 07:30:19 AM
QuoteOn the film front, it was a mixed bag. Fox had a hit with DreamWorks Animation's "Boss Baby," but "Alien: Covenant" stumbled, leading to questions about the horror franchise's viability, and the Amy Schumer comedy "Snatched" was a box office disappointment. The lack of a major hit caused the division to have a quarterly segment OIBDA loss of $22 million, a $186 million decrease from the $164 million contribution it reported in the same period a year ago. Fox's film division was also weighed down by weaker home entertainment sales. In the year-ago quarter, "Deadpool" hit store shelves, making comparisons difficult.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/21st-century-fox-earnings-beat-expectations-revenues-miss-1202521215/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Aug 10, 2017, 10:57:33 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Aug 10, 2017, 07:30:19 AM
QuoteOn the film front, it was a mixed bag. Fox had a hit with DreamWorks Animation's "Boss Baby," but "Alien: Covenant" stumbled, leading to questions about the horror franchise's viability, and the Amy Schumer comedy "Snatched" was a box office disappointment. The lack of a major hit caused the division to have a quarterly segment OIBDA loss of $22 million, a $186 million decrease from the $164 million contribution it reported in the same period a year ago. Fox's film division was also weighed down by weaker home entertainment sales. In the year-ago quarter, "Deadpool" hit store shelves, making comparisons difficult.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/21st-century-fox-earnings-beat-expectations-revenues-miss-1202521215/
Well at least Covenant did a lot better than Vagina Joke: The Movie...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Aug 11, 2017, 07:23:11 PM
That is not a good "at least" at all. Most "at leasts" are not good.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Aug 11, 2017, 10:57:38 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Aug 11, 2017, 07:23:11 PM
That is not a good "at least" at all. Most "at leasts" are not good.
Well you wouldn't want to learn that Snatched beat Covenant at the box office, would you? :P
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Aug 12, 2017, 12:04:08 AM
I would not care.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Aug 12, 2017, 01:26:54 AM
K.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Aug 13, 2017, 04:31:28 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Aug 10, 2017, 07:30:19 AM
QuoteOn the film front, it was a mixed bag. Fox had a hit with DreamWorks Animation's "Boss Baby," but "Alien: Covenant" stumbled, leading to questions about the horror franchise's viability, and the Amy Schumer comedy "Snatched" was a box office disappointment. The lack of a major hit caused the division to have a quarterly segment OIBDA loss of $22 million, a $186 million decrease from the $164 million contribution it reported in the same period a year ago. Fox's film division was also weighed down by weaker home entertainment sales. In the year-ago quarter, "Deadpool" hit store shelves, making comparisons difficult.

http://variety.com/2017/film/news/21st-century-fox-earnings-beat-expectations-revenues-miss-1202521215/

Surprised there is no mention of Apes in there, that's unquestionably been a bigger disappointment for Fox. Shame cause I thought Apes was a 9/10 and Covenant maybe a 6/7 outta 10; nowhere near as lacklustre as their figures suggest.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on Aug 13, 2017, 06:01:35 PM
I think audiences are getting a bit bored with episodic films, regardless of their relative merits/flaws. In my humble opinion, the best films (sans perhaps The Empire Strikes Back and The Godfather Part 2) are self contained and standalone (even films like Terminator 2 or Aliens). It's no surprise that audiences are bored with Alien and Ape films etc.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Aug 14, 2017, 08:23:05 AM
It's a review for the second quarter of the year.  War for the Planet of the Apes came out in July.  They'll complain about that one next quarter.

But if such a widely acclaimed movie like that makes similarly lackluster numbers, I think it's more proof that studios shouldn't be releasing anything but major superhero movies during superhero season.

Covenant should have stayed in October.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Richman678 on Aug 15, 2017, 06:41:02 PM
Is there a way to track Blu Ray sales?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Aug 15, 2017, 09:59:02 PM
Quote from: Richman678 on Aug 15, 2017, 06:41:02 PM
Is there a way to track Blu Ray sales?

This is the only site I know of.  Doesn't look like any blu-ray sale data is posted yet.

http://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Alien-Covenant#tab=summary (http://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Alien-Covenant#tab=summary)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Aug 16, 2017, 02:25:51 PM
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/top.php

According to Blu-ray.com the normal Blu-ray is #1, the 4K is #4.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mister Skeezler on Aug 17, 2017, 12:11:56 PM
I bought it and watched it last night.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: lv_226 on Aug 21, 2017, 02:01:29 PM
Just a mild curiosity, I didn't think that creating a new thread specifically for this was appropriate. Why is the Japanese Covenant release in September? In this era of downloading and streaming (whether legal or not) it blows my mind that Fox would think that releasing the film after the home video was available pretty much in most major markets would be a good idea.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Aug 21, 2017, 04:17:48 PM
Almost every Hollywood movie is released later in Japan.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Aug 21, 2017, 04:43:29 PM
I'm sure box office takes a hit when Japanese fans can download a 1080 blu-ray rip a month sooner.

But I don't know if Hollywood even cares that much.  Our movies don't make a ton over there anyway.  The most any movie can expect there seems to be about $20 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Aug 21, 2017, 05:19:02 PM
Quote from: necrotard on Aug 21, 2017, 04:43:29 PM
I'm sure box office takes a hit when Japanese fans can download a 1080 blu-ray rip a month sooner.

But I don't know if Hollywood even cares that much.  Our movies don't make a ton over there anyway.  The most any movie can expect there seems to be about $20 million.

All true.
But if "Covenant" earned $20 million in Japan, it would be a solid boost to its overall box office (divided by production budget).
So, I'm still rooting for decent numbers from Japan just so the Fox studio will be encouraged to release another Alien movie in the next 5 years.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hamster1066 on Aug 23, 2017, 04:59:45 PM
It's a shame a film like this doesn't do better. I wonder if the limited runtime that a cinema film has compared to a HBO series means that such films are struggling to find a balance that sells the story as well as it could? Transitional times perhaps?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Aug 26, 2017, 05:13:08 PM
http://m.homemediamagazine.com/research/alien-covenant-debuts-no-1-disc-sales-charts-40667

NUMBER UNO
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Aug 27, 2017, 05:06:24 AM
Related:

"Yes, Summer Box Office Was Bad — and Here's 6 Reasons Why the Worst is Yet to Come"

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/08/summer-box-office-bad-foreign-audience-transformers-despicable-me-1201868845/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 15, 2017, 10:12:47 AM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/intl/japan/

Here's the link so we keep an eye out for Japan's BO results over the weekend.


http://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Alien-Covenant#tab=international

Apparently, internationally, Covenant did best in China. $45 million.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 16, 2017, 07:18:18 AM
http://www.homemediamagazine.com/top-sellers/top-20-selling-blu-ray-discs-week-ended-090917

Some Blu-ray chart stuff.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Hamster1066 on Sep 16, 2017, 08:51:04 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Sep 15, 2017, 10:12:47 AM
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/intl/japan/

Here's the link so we keep an eye out for Japan's BO results over the weekend.


http://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Alien-Covenant#tab=international

Apparently, internationally, Covenant did best in China. $45 million.

Will China's blu-rays also be heavily edited. Will a percentage of those 45 million want to see what they missed. Or will the black market thrive off the back of those edits?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Daszkowski on Sep 17, 2017, 10:26:30 PM
"Alien: Covenant" opened to $2,6M in Japan.

"Prometheus" did $3.6M after first weekend.

Source: http://deadline.com/2017/09/war-for-the-planet-of-the-apes-china-opening-it-movie-spider-man-homecoming-mother-international-box-office-1202171328/


Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Sep 18, 2017, 06:51:29 AM
Quote from: Daszkowski on Sep 17, 2017, 10:26:30 PM
"Alien: Covenant" opened to $2,6M in Japan.

"Prometheus" did $3.6M after first weekend.

Source: http://deadline.com/2017/09/war-for-the-planet-of-the-apes-china-opening-it-movie-spider-man-homecoming-mother-international-box-office-1202171328/

From this news I'll do some math to get some estimates of the overall box office results for A:C and what that means for its performance.

* Japan first weekend; "Prometheus" $3.6M from deadline.com (Box Office Mojo has that opening weekend at $3.8M.)
"Alien: Covenant" $2.6M
- 2.6 divided by 3.6 gives what percentage A:C's opening was compared with "Prometheus".
Answer; 72% using the deadline.com number
(2.6 divided by 3.8 = 68% using the Box Office Mojo "Prometheus" number)

- "Prometheus" total box office in Japan; $21,816,409 which I'll round down to $21 million. (I'm being conservative with these estimates.)
X 72% = about $15 million estimate for A:C in Japan using the deadline.com numbers
(X 68% = about $14 million estimate for A:C in Japan using the Box Office Mojo number)

* Total estimated box office for "Alien Covenant".
Currently  "Alien Covenant" box office is at $236 million but that may include the new Japan box office.
Google has the A:C box office at $233.1 million which is probably what it is without the numbers from Japan.

$233.1 million + the estimated $15 million or $14 million gets A:C into the $248 / $247 million range.
$248 / $247 million box office would be 2.56 / 2.55 times the production budget ($97 million).
2.5 time the production budget is $242.5 million.

* It looks like A:C box office will get to 2.5 times its production budget ($242.5 million).
- Many movies that have box office at around 2.5 times their production budget have historically been considered decent performers (getting sequels for instance).

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Sep 18, 2017, 07:21:02 AM
That's actually a better result than Batman Begins.  Doesn't mean we'll get a sequel, though.  The world could end tomorrow for all we know.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Sep 18, 2017, 07:44:08 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Sep 18, 2017, 07:21:02 AM
That's actually a better result than Batman Begins.  Doesn't mean we'll get a sequel, though.  The world could end tomorrow for all we know.

Yes. I think for Fox, they like an Alien movie to get about 3 X the production budget before approving a sequel.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Sep 18, 2017, 07:47:58 AM
Not sure comparing it to a 12 year old film is much of a comparison.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Sep 18, 2017, 08:14:02 AM
The combined takings for 'PROMETHEUS' and 'ALIEN: Covenant' exceed $600m.  There's no guarantee, but a third movie could possibly break the $1b mark.

Honestly, why would Fox not take that risk and release a third one? They have everything to gain and nothing to lose, even if a third movie just breaks even.

It's a safe bet Fox will approve of another 'ALIEN' movie in the current cycle, even if it just wraps it all up. 

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Deadmeat on Sep 18, 2017, 08:21:35 AM
Sounds promising. Honestly, I see more reasons for Fox to finish the run, rather than cutting it short. Like Windebieste said - they honestly have nothing to lose. Even if the next movie flops, it won't flop so badly it won't break even. That's my opinion, though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PRI. HUDSON on Sep 18, 2017, 10:28:09 AM
Not bad. Let's see how it goes from here.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Whiskeybrewer on Sep 18, 2017, 11:34:30 AM
Okay this isn't bad at all. Maybe they will do a third one in this prequel trilogy. Hopefully Ridley wraps it up as I think that's what I needs before its decided what happens next
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Sep 18, 2017, 11:40:30 AM
The Alien franchise is a blue chip investment.  The returns are not always high, but they always return a profit.  There is very little risk to the investor.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Justice Lord on Sep 18, 2017, 11:46:38 AM
I really hope it gets to 250 million.  Fox could easily market the 3rd movie as final in prequel trilogy & picking a better release date this time. Fox has nothing to lose here.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: zoidy on Sep 18, 2017, 03:18:59 PM
Picked it up on blu today in UK, looking forward to seeing it again.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: ESPILFIRE on Sep 18, 2017, 04:24:38 PM
I bought BR+4K on friday. I hope FOX approve sequel and we can close the trilogy... but I would like a better film than Prometheus and Covenant too. Ridley can do it, he only need a good script, answer the questions and stay focused on it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Whos_Nick on Sep 18, 2017, 04:51:38 PM
The film ending up around 240-250 million worldwide probably doesn't change much when you look at the domestic total. It underperformed heavily stateside which is the number studios care about most, unless it does huge numbers overseas.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Sep 18, 2017, 04:57:16 PM
Quote from: windebieste on Sep 18, 2017, 08:14:02 AM
Honestly, why would Fox not take that risk and release a third one?

Because, diminishing returns.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 18, 2017, 05:22:17 PM
Quote from: windebieste on Sep 18, 2017, 08:14:02 AM
The combined takings for 'PROMETHEUS' and 'ALIEN: Covenant' exceed $600m.  There's no guarantee, but a third movie could possibly break the $1b mark.

Honestly, why would Fox not take that risk and release a third one? They have everything to gain and nothing to lose, even if a third movie just breaks even.

It's a safe bet Fox will approve of another 'ALIEN' movie in the current cycle, even if it just wraps it all up. 

-Windebieste.

This isn't how things work.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: XENOMORPHOSIS on Sep 18, 2017, 05:51:13 PM
Got my DVD today. Unsure if the financial decline of Covenant compared to Prometheus may discourage Fox from making the 3rd Prequel film.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SuicideDoors on Sep 18, 2017, 07:19:39 PM
Quote from: Whos_Nick on Sep 18, 2017, 04:51:38 PM
The film ending up around 240-250 million worldwide probably doesn't change much when you look at the domestic total. It underperformed heavily stateside which is the number studios care about most, unless it does huge numbers overseas.

Yeah that's the thing that sucks. Tbh I always felt Prometheus was a tad disappointing with its $125mill return against a $130mill budget (domestic) - because the hype was huge and it was during 3D's heyday. Of course it did tremendously well overseas. I mean 275mill for an R-rated sci-if is unprecedented.

Sci-fi horror just seems to get such a lukewarm reception stateside. Life wasn't great but I felt it deserved better numbers than it got.

Still, when all is said and done, Alien: Covenant is still the 2nd biggest global taker in the Alien franchise. I hope that counts for something when they decide what path the next film will follow.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Bluray on Sep 18, 2017, 08:18:19 PM
Prometheus - $130 million
Covenant - $97 million (25% decrease)
Awakening - $73 (25% decrease)

I would gladly accept $70'ish million budgeted sequel. Bring back the practical suits too with limited to no cgi. Same, if not larger scope than Covenant could be achieved if we removed the money hogging cgi xenos.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Sep 18, 2017, 09:57:11 PM
Quote from: Bluray on Sep 18, 2017, 08:18:19 PM
Prometheus - $130 million
Covenant - $97 million (25% decrease)
Awakening - $73 (25% decrease)

I would gladly accept $70'ish million budgeted sequel. Bring back the practical suits too with limited to no cgi. Same, if not larger scope than Covenant could be achieved if we removed the money hogging cgi xenos.

That's the route Fox should go for.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 18, 2017, 10:17:49 PM
If we're going to talk about downwards trends, let's talk about how if the next one is to follow suit, Covenant's sequel will only gross about $60 million worldwide.

Pack it up fellow fans, we're in for another dry spell.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Sep 18, 2017, 11:34:46 PM
Quote from: Bluray on Sep 18, 2017, 08:18:19 PM
Prometheus - $130 million
Covenant - $97 million (25% decrease)
Awakening - $73 (25% decrease)

Prometheus was shot in 3D which added 10 mil to the budget.

Also, Covenant was shot in Australia where they got millions in government grants.

Prometheus made more partly because 3D tickets are more expensive.

It's not always a simple "it made less money so it failed".

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 18, 2017, 11:37:28 PM
Not always, but in this case it did fail.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Bluray on Sep 19, 2017, 04:43:00 AM
I feel very late with these comments, (I mean who needs the millionth post about their thoughts on Covenant?), but I really want Sir Ridley to finish off this series and give us one more go in the Alien'verse.

I will preface by saying that I did not like Prometheus and was initially mixed on Covenant, but have grown to appreciate it a lot more especially as it was featured in a youtube CinemaWins video last week, which basically noted how major plotholes perceived by the casual filmgoer were in fact explained within the film's narrative. How well one accepts those explanations may be the ultimate deciding factor on whether you enjoyed the film or not, but I won't go into that debate.

What I do want to mention is how much I enjoy the world and atmosphere in every single one of Ridley's alien films. There's an immense attention to detail and sensibility that you don't get in modern blockbusters. When I think of Ridley Scott's style or approach, I imagine him in the league of Martin Scorcese. Not in terms of film output, but in terms of encyclopedic knowledge of filmmaking and the visual medium. And this vast knowledge is what gives us that unique sensibility that we just don't get in cookie cutter modern blockbusters. Ridley Scott is the last of the Greats. He just went for something different and it wasn't everyone's cup of tea.

I think of Covenant as being in the same vein as an 80's Carpenter film. It didn't do very well because audiences weren't expecting it, didn't get it or don't care for it. And at the moment, it'll be known as the "Fassbender robot" movie. But in time, when the dust settles, tastes change and when looked at as a whole, everyone will appreciate what it does differently and presents differently in the Alien'verse.

Other than that, I don't think of budget as a limiting factor for any possible Covenant sequel. If anything, I'd be pleased to see Ridley challenged with a lower budget and be forced to be very precise with executing a script that would allow him to wrap up expressing all the themes and ideas he had started in Prometheus.

At the moment I'm really looking forward to his next - All the Money in the World - and hopefully we get the Covenant sequel within the next couple of years.


Ridley is a remarkable film maker, but his films tell too much story, it took awhile before Covenant kicked into gear, Perhaps a different writer and director is needed, only though where would you go ? you differently don't want The Brothers Strause , how fox approved that Avp 2 script is beyond everyone.

Perhaps Prometheus sabotaged its own momentum with its dumb founded illogical moments that caused most viewers to have negative remarks in the first place, maybe Covenant didn't stand a chance ? I would say if predator preforms under expectations too, fox will put these two franchise's away for a decent decade.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: darkvegett0 on Sep 19, 2017, 08:35:20 PM
Hopefully fox ends these awful prequels...... Reboot the franchise and increase the budget and never again let ridly control anything in the alien universe please....
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Evanus on Sep 19, 2017, 10:05:27 PM
Quote from: darkvegett0 on Sep 19, 2017, 08:35:20 PM
Hopefully fox ends these awful prequels...... Reboot the franchise and increase the budget and never again let ridly control anything in the alien universe please....
Well then thank god you're not in charge at Fox.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: PsyKore on Sep 19, 2017, 11:08:28 PM
Quote from: darkvegett0 on Sep 19, 2017, 08:35:20 PM
Hopefully fox ends these awful prequels...... Reboot the franchise and increase the budget and never again let ridly control anything in the alien universe please....

If you're confident a reboot with a big budget would turn out good, then it's a safe gamble.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on Sep 20, 2017, 06:51:12 AM
Anybody who thinks that a reboot guarantees both a good and financially successful film needs to wake up and smell the coffee. Good/financially succesful reboots are not mutually exclusive, but they often tend to be hugely inferior products, even if they make the money.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Sep 20, 2017, 08:33:47 AM
You say "Reboot", I hear "more of the same! More of the same!"
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Sep 20, 2017, 08:41:51 AM
must haz ripley and newt and hixk back.  must haz pluse rifols. must haz blokmap direct and sigoney weever direct it.  must haz reboot reboot and more reboot.

only way to maek a aliens movie (coz its the aliens series and not the alien series) is ignore everthing after james 'i am god' cameron and maek it with dropshits and us colonic marines.  thats all ever fan wants is be a trufan liek me and wish i could go back in time to 1986 and maek james cameron to do moar aliens movie in a trufan and proper way.

only a aliens trufan knows what a alioens movie should be.  lol.

-not windebieste.

ps.  i am a trufan.  not like those cvoenant hippies. lol.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 20, 2017, 09:27:22 AM
There's really no need for this level of childish post, Winde.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Nukiemorph on Sep 20, 2017, 10:55:42 AM
People are crying reboot and I'm not sure how many of them want a full-on remake or a soft reboot.  In my opinion, there's a major difference.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 20, 2017, 11:02:11 AM
There is. I'd prefer a soft reboot as in set in some other corner of the galaxy, within the existing continuity but a new set of characters and story. Obviously, Prometheus and Covenant were also that but I'd like to start again and avoid those particular plots.

I don't want a remake of Alien. Never. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Sep 20, 2017, 11:06:42 AM
I'd be interested to see what it'd look like.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 20, 2017, 11:15:31 AM
A reboot or remake?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Sep 20, 2017, 11:22:41 AM
Remake.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Sep 20, 2017, 11:26:51 AM
 :o Heathen! Any people stick out in the mind for the job?

I do think we'll get one eventually. I think it's bound to happen.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Sep 20, 2017, 11:39:08 AM
Nah, no one in mind.  Someone with a death wish most likely.  It'd be like trying to remake Jaws and they haven't done that yet either.

I think the problem is the two key sequences of Kane getting facehugged and the chestburster have been done over in the sequels, that they no longer pack a punch.  They've tried to rework the chestburster each time to do something different, but I think the Neomorph probably the only one that's been approaching the original for shock value and brutality.  Wren's head burster was a good try but a little comical in execution.

You can't rely on those two scenes again.  You can't rely on the evil secret robot.  The Alien will likely fail because it'll be either too much like the original, or too little.  It's quite the recipe for disaster, but there's always that tiny chance it'll surprise.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Sep 20, 2017, 01:08:54 PM
I don't think I could cope with a remake. The very thought makes me break out in a cold sweat.

I'm not sure they would ever do it though and if they did it would still be a long, long way off. Like SM points out it has iconic scenes that you cant replicate successfully.

Alien, like Jaws, are true classics and I cant think of any other examples of a film regarded in this way being remade?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 20, 2017, 02:35:11 PM
Alien will never be remade. Even after Covenant's failure.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Sep 20, 2017, 02:39:58 PM
The 1979 Alien will not be remade because it still makes money for Fox.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Bluray on Sep 20, 2017, 03:02:11 PM
It seems like I'm in the minority here for Ridley to finish off his trilogy.

In anycase, no need for remake when there's still time for 4k release and eventually when the next successive home theater standard rolls around, a definitive 8k release matching the 35mm resolution.

That and Aliens in 3d. Because you know Cameron is just waiting on the sidelines  to cash in on that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 20, 2017, 03:21:30 PM
Not to mention the universe is so rich, it would be weird to scale it down to a lean chase movie. How suffocating.

Unless they don't plan on doing a chase movie. In which case, just make a sequel or a prequel or a spinoff.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Deadmeat on Sep 20, 2017, 05:20:18 PM
Scott's free. We're getting "Awakening" after all:

http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/fox-trust-ridley-scott-break-new-ground-with-alien-covenant-sequel

Not sure if this has been posted already or not. Couldn't find anything on this forum, at least.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Sep 20, 2017, 05:40:58 PM
Quote from: Deadmeat on Sep 20, 2017, 05:20:18 PM
Scott's free. We're getting "Awakening" after all:

http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/fox-trust-ridley-scott-break-new-ground-with-alien-covenant-sequel

Not sure if this has been posted already or not. Couldn't find anything on this forum, at least.

It's been discussed here...http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=58873.45

Though, I do hope Fox let Scott take the reigns for the final film and salvage whatever is left of the story he wanted with the engineers.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 20, 2017, 06:46:13 PM
Ridley is impulsive. Just let him be a producer now.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Sep 21, 2017, 08:15:25 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Sep 18, 2017, 06:51:29 AM
Quote from: Daszkowski on Sep 17, 2017, 10:26:30 PM
"Alien: Covenant" opened to $2,6M in Japan.

"Prometheus" did $3.6M after first weekend.

Source: http://deadline.com/2017/09/war-for-the-planet-of-the-apes-china-opening-it-movie-spider-man-homecoming-mother-international-box-office-1202171328/

From this news I'll do some math to get some estimates of the overall box office results for A:C and what that means for its performance.

* Japan first weekend; "Prometheus" $3.6M from deadline.com (Box Office Mojo has that opening weekend at $3.8M.)
"Alien: Covenant" $2.6M
- 2.6 divided by 3.6 gives what percentage A:C's opening was compared with "Prometheus".
Answer; 72% using the deadline.com number
(2.6 divided by 3.8 = 68% using the Box Office Mojo "Prometheus" number)

- "Prometheus" total box office in Japan; $21,816,409 which I'll round down to $21 million. (I'm being conservative with these estimates.)
X 72% = about $15 million estimate for A:C in Japan using the deadline.com numbers
(X 68% = about $14 million estimate for A:C in Japan using the Box Office Mojo number)

* Total estimated box office for "Alien Covenant".
Currently  "Alien Covenant" box office is at $236 million but that may include the new Japan box office.
Google has the A:C box office at $233.1 million which is probably what it is without the numbers from Japan.

$233.1 million + the estimated $15 million or $14 million gets A:C into the $248 / $247 million range.
$248 / $247 million box office would be 2.56 / 2.55 times the production budget ($97 million).
2.5 time the production budget is $242.5 million.

* It looks like A:C box office will get to 2.5 times its production budget ($242.5 million).
- Many movies that have box office at around 2.5 times their production budget have historically been considered decent performers (getting sequels for instance).

;)

You have to add the marketing cost to the production budget, and it's roughly equivalent to the latter. So the total cost might be $200 million.

After that, deduct around 30 percent from the box office because that goes to distribution. That means the studio earned around $175 million.

From there, if there's a net profit, remove 35 percent for taxes. Then get what remains and divide it evenly between investors and the studio.

Assume that both wanted a 10-percent return on their investment, or around $10 million apiece.

Given these, we can only hope that they do well with merchandising, but they usually want the returns right away in order to finance other projects.



Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Sep 21, 2017, 08:24:22 PM
Quote from: SM on Sep 20, 2017, 11:39:08 AM
Nah, no one in mind.  Someone with a death wish most likely.  It'd be like trying to remake Jaws and they haven't done that yet either.

I think the problem is the two key sequences of Kane getting facehugged and the chestburster have been done over in the sequels, that they no longer pack a punch.  They've tried to rework the chestburster each time to do something different, but I think the Neomorph probably the only one that's been approaching the original for shock value and brutality.  Wren's head burster was a good try but a little comical in execution.

You can't rely on those two scenes again.  You can't rely on the evil secret robot.  The Alien will likely fail because it'll be either too much like the original, or too little.  It's quite the recipe for disaster, but there's always that tiny chance it'll surprise.

* Ridley Scott (in comments/interviews) was well aware of this problem of the Alien franchise tropes losing their horror punch. In "Prometheus" he tried to go in a different direction but while that film was a box office success, the hate for "Prometheus" by some was very loud and persistent.
- As I've written before, the Alien fan base is deeply split and Scott was caught in the middle of that. 

* But your topic imo touches on a greater issue; that in general science fiction horror films are no longer very scary.
- Every alien / genetically engineered movie creature has been done so much that this entire SF horror genre has lost its impact.
- A second problem with SF horror is that it requires explanation sequences, which with much of today's mass audience, gets in the way of the horror.

* The horror genre (for instance "IT" / "Annabelle: Creation" / "Get Out" / "Paranormal Activity") now focuses on villains who are deranged humans, ghosts or small toys/dolls often with loud jump scares. 
- These kinds of horror movies are cheap which SF cannot compete with in terms of cost.
And cheap horror films can make hundreds of millions of dollars.
- Also, SF horror is not only more expensive but if its story is serious science fiction, it will be more complicated which is turning off much of today's audience.

* The studio / Ridley turned to the most persistent / often emotional fans who had campaigned to bring back the xenomorph hunt, a standard Alien franchise trope.
- Unfortunately, following the advice of emotional SF fans is often a recipe for lower performance. This happened with "Star Trek: Beyond". "Beyond" made McCoy the 3rd main character demanded by some fans. That movie was a flop in terms of box office / production budget.
- Emotional fans cannot help in guiding a SF franchise towards financial success imo. 

* What can the studio do?
- Science fiction which has horror can go in the direction of adventure.
Rampaging monsters / dinosaurs in an adventure are continuing as a genre with tiny bits of SF which have no importance to the story.
- But in the Alien franchise, it's important to realize that action is difficult in terms of bringing in good box office.
Only Cameron was very successful doing this money wise in the franchise with "Aliens". David Fincher, Jean-Pierre Jeunet (with help from Joss Whedon) and Ridley (with "Covenant") put in some adventure/chase sequences but they could not in terms of box office match what Cameron did. 
- The closest thing to Cameron's "Aliens" (a bug battle adventure) imo was "Starship Troopers" and that flopped at the box office.
- Conclusion? Imo doing some kind of reboot/repeat of "Aliens" is in no way a guarantee of box office success.

* Some clamor for finding a new director.
- Blomkamp? His career is stalled and with comparing box office/production budget; "Elysium" barely did better than "Covenant" and "Chappie" did worse.
- Cameron? He's busy.
- Abrams? Lots of the emotional fans don't like him.

- Imo Fox sees the challenges with continuing the Alien franchise;
And it seems that instead of risking putting another director in charge, the studio is leaning towards letting Ridley do another one;
As noted in this linked article already posted in this thread.
http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/fox-trust-ridley-scott-break-new-ground-with-alien-covenant-sequel

We'll see.   

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on Sep 22, 2017, 10:15:17 PM
It's really all about the story... story and strong characters. If there's a great story/characters, there can be a great Alien film. The first Alien film didn't really have a strong original story, the characters were fairly cliche... however, it had a concept (and production design) that was highly original/unique. Rebooting the franchise, whilst I'm sure would be popular to some degree, certainly won't guarantee a good film, nor continued success.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Sep 25, 2017, 12:45:21 PM
Alien was not cliche back in 1979.
There hadn't been any space monster movies for two decades and the fact that it was a crew of truck drivers and not scientists, and that the captain bites the dust and the survivor is the woman who kept her cool was very fresh.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on Sep 25, 2017, 07:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Sep 25, 2017, 12:45:21 PM
Alien was not cliche back in 1979.
There hadn't been any space monster movies for two decades and the fact that it was a crew of truck drivers and not scientists, and that the captain bites the dust and the survivor is the woman who kept her cool was very fresh.
I didn't state Alien, as a film, was cliche. I stated that the characters and story were. It's a haunted house story where most of the characters adhere to the broad brush strokes of 'standard' character traits depicted in numerous films before 1979. Horror films of the mid/late 70's were already establishing 'female leads' e.g Halloween, Carrie, Texas Chainsaw (and Alien was certainly part of that) etc. It was the production design, the body horror elements, and Scott's filmmaking that elevate Alien above and beyond the standard thriller. The point is that the filmmakers need to invest time in creating a great story/great characters to move the franchise forward; as simply remaking/rebooting the original film/films simply won't be good enough.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Sep 27, 2017, 01:17:30 AM
Update on "Alien Covenant" box office.

QuoteAlien: Covenant pulled in another $830,000 from Japan, raising the international tally to $164.6m.
https://www.screendaily.com/box-office/kingsman-the-golden-circle-takes-international-box-office-crown/5122613.article

Box Office Mojo updated its foreign box office to about that level.
Total worldwide box office for A:C right now is; $238,826,860.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=alienparadiselost.htm

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Sep 27, 2017, 01:26:02 AM
Really crappy return in Japan.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 27, 2017, 01:35:47 AM
People really did not want this movie, and did not like this movie. Yikes.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: windebieste on Sep 27, 2017, 02:45:04 AM
Of course it has a crappy return in Japan.  Anyone wanting to see the movie would already have imported the BluRay.

Apparently, BluRay/DVD sales were very good for the movie.  Do you suppose there's a correlation between the 2?

It should have been released in Japan months ago.   Then the return would have been different. 

-Windebieste.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Sep 27, 2017, 04:52:06 PM
Quote from: windebieste on Sep 27, 2017, 02:45:04 AM
Of course it has a crappy return in Japan.  Anyone wanting to see the movie would already have imported the BluRay.

Apparently, BluRay/DVD sales were very good for the movie.  Do you suppose there's a correlation between the 2?

It should have been released in Japan months ago.   Then the return would have been different. 

-Windebieste.

Less than 10% of Japanese citizens understand or speak English. Less than 1% can speak it fluently.

All your base are belong to us.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Jonesy1974 on Sep 28, 2017, 11:32:47 AM
Really disappointed in the Japan BO, I honestly thought it would make more than that.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Sep 28, 2017, 10:10:56 PM
240 millions worldwide is embarrassing. It has made so far 272 ... domestically. And it's a movie made for 35 millions without any A-list Hollywood stars.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Sep 29, 2017, 03:16:55 AM
Budget doesn't matter and A-listers aren't draws on their own.

People just want good content.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Sep 29, 2017, 05:10:41 AM
Maybe the Japanese just arent in the mood for a film where some shit is dropped on a city and wipes out the entire population.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Sep 29, 2017, 06:44:21 AM
Quote from: Jonesy1974 on Sep 28, 2017, 11:32:47 AM
Really disappointed in the Japan BO, I honestly thought it would make more than that.

I'm not disappointed considering the situation.
"Alien Covenant" is on streaming. It is on Blu-ray.
It is easily available for those who have computers for streaming/shopping and the Japanese own computers.
- Only the most devoted Alien fans are going to pay to see it in a theater when it's so widely available.

* What A:C needs for its total box office is to get $4 million more in Japan and it will reach $242.5 million worldwide.
And that would put box office at 2.5 x its production budget which is reaching a decent milestone. 

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Sep 29, 2017, 09:59:17 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Sep 29, 2017, 03:16:55 AM
Budget doesn't matter and A-listers aren't draws on their own.

People just want good content.

Exactly. People do want good content. However if you spent 100 millions + marketing cost + hire A-listed Hollywood star with A-listed director and well-known franchise movie flops then it's embarassing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Sep 29, 2017, 02:54:18 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Sep 29, 2017, 06:44:21 AM
Alien Covenant" is on streaming. It is on Blu-ray.
It is easily available for those who have computers for streaming/shopping and the Japanese own computers.
- Only the most devoted Alien fans are going to pay to see it in a theater when it's so widely available.

Yes, but most Japanese don't speak or even understand English. Even less understand Spanish, German, French etc. So their only option is to wait for the Japanese theatrical release which is in their own language. Fox isn't stupid you know.

QuoteWhat A:C needs for its total box office is to get $4 million more in Japan and it will reach $242.5 million worldwide.
And that would put box office at 2.5 x its production budget which is reaching a decent milestone. 

Which is still below expectations no matter how you try and spin it. Fox already said the box office was "disappointing".
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Sep 29, 2017, 07:14:16 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Sep 29, 2017, 02:54:18 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Sep 29, 2017, 06:44:21 AM
Alien Covenant" is on streaming. It is on Blu-ray.
It is easily available for those who have computers for streaming/shopping and the Japanese own computers.
- Only the most devoted Alien fans are going to pay to see it in a theater when it's so widely available.

Yes, but most Japanese don't speak or even understand English. Even less understand Spanish, German, French etc. So their only option is to wait for the Japanese theatrical release which is in their own language.

1. Movie piracy can increase when a release of a legal film / TV series to a certain country is delayed. Japan's release dates are often later compared with Europe / US.
And piracy is easier when Blu-ray copies are available which can be ripped.
I'm not going to provide links because that could be seen as encouraging piracy which I do not condone.
- However, it is a fact that torrent copies of Alien Covenant exist and that Japanese subtitles are available for that.
- I believe that there are people in Japan who decided not to wait for A:C and they saw available pirated copies as an option and they knew the way to get Japanese subtitles for A:C torrents.

2. Legitimate copies of "Alien Covenant" are for sale in Japan right now.
https://www.amazon.co.jp/Alien-Covenant-Blu-ray-Import/dp/B071YLX9D7/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1506670235&sr=8-2&keywords=alien+covenant

A percent of the population does understand English and those could be lost ticket sales.
Also, I assume that enterprising people from Japan could rip the Blu-ray and then add Japanese subtitles.

Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Sep 29, 2017, 02:54:18 PMFox isn't stupid you know.

I never said that about Fox or anyone else. I try my hardest to not use insulting language like that on web forums.

Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Sep 29, 2017, 02:54:18 PM
QuoteWhat A:C needs for its total box office is to get $4 million more in Japan and it will reach $242.5 million worldwide.
And that would put box office at 2.5 x its production budget which is reaching a decent milestone. 

Which is still below expectations no matter how you try and spin it.

It is your privilege to label what I've written as "spin".
I don't see it that way. I believe that I am presenting facts which are relevant to the topic of this thread; 'Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance".

* Since the 1990s science fiction horror has never been in the top level, blockbuster territory.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-grossing_films

- And Alien / AVP movies since "Aliens" have at best been mediocre with box office performance.

* Here are links about the long term box office performance of the science fiction/horror genre and the Alien franchise.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/genres/chart/?id=scifihorror.htm
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/franchises/chart/?id=alien.htm

- The Alien franchise even at its peak (A1 & A2) was never at the level of Star Wars. Even "Star Trek: The Motion Picture" beats any Alien movie in terms of box office.
http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/franchise/Star-Trek#tab=summary

Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Sep 29, 2017, 02:54:18 PMFox already said the box office was "disappointing".

* Fox has said that A:C financially was a disappointment.
A studio is usually hoping to make as much money as the previous film in a franchise.
- When that doesn't happen, such as with A:C, the studio will often be disappointed.

* But the box office for "Alien Covenant" could have been worse.
Decent science fiction movies which had horror, "Sunshine" and "Life", were flops.
And so they didn't get sequels.

* Recently Fox is saying that they believe that Ridley could do another Alien franchise movie.
http://www.alien-covenant.com/news/fox-trust-ridley-scott-break-new-ground-with-alien-covenant-sequel

Why? One reason is because the box office for A:C is going to be about 2.5 x its production budget.
And why is that ratio of box office to production budget important?
Because several films with a box office / production budget ratio of about 2.5 x have gotten sequels.
(And if anyone here requests a list of such movies, I can post that.)

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Sep 29, 2017, 07:42:47 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Sep 29, 2017, 07:14:16 PM
Decent science fiction movies which had horror, "Sunshine" and "Life" were flops.
And so they didn't get sequels.

Hey there bb-15, good to see you again. sfmzone of the old imdb days, here. What did you think of "Life" 2017?

I found the alien's physiology an intriguing concept. Each cell functioning simultaneously as a muscle cell, nerve cell,  and photoreceptive cell. Or as Miranda put it, all muscle, all brain, all eye. I'm not claiming it's original. I'm just saying it's the first I've been exposed to that concept in cinema/literature.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Sep 29, 2017, 09:46:30 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Sep 29, 2017, 07:14:16 PM
A percent of the population does understand English and those could be lost ticket sales.

Yeah, less than 10%.

QuoteHowever, it is a fact that torrent copies of Alien Covenant exist and that Japanese subtitles are available for that.
I believe that there are people in Japan who decided not to wait for A:C and they saw available pirated copies as an option and they knew the way to get Japanese subtitles for A:C torrents.

I'm sure the vast majority of potential viewers would rather wait for the official and professionally dubbed version rather than downloading illegal rips with iffy do-it-yourself subtitles.

QuoteRecently Fox is saying that they believe that Ridley could do another Alien franchise movie. Why? One reason is because the box office for A:C is going to be about 2.5 x its production budget.
And why is that ratio of box office to production budget important?
Because several films with a box office / production budget ratio of about 2.5 x have gotten sequels.
(And if anyone here requests a list of such movies, I can post that.)

Yeah but it doesn't look like they're interested in making a sequel to Covenant.

"It was a disappointment, but I trust Ridley [Scott] and Emma [Watts] to know the right story when they find it.
-Stacey Snider Fox CEO"

Seeing as Covenant's sequel was already written long before Snider made that comment it seems obvious they're not keen on going with it anymore. At least in it's current form.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Sep 30, 2017, 01:25:46 AM
Doesn't mean anything.  They changed Prometheus from an Alien Prequel and Covenant was supposed to be Paradise Lost and more of a direct sequel to Prometheus.

Just means they are changing the script.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Darth Vile on Oct 01, 2017, 07:09:34 AM
Box office globally is on the decline. Alien Covenant has suffered because of this trend... Too much competition, not just in terms of competing films, but event TV, which is influencing viewers to watch drama from the comfort of their own arm chair. There's little the Alien franchise can do at this point to break that trend, other than produce a film that is universally popular and becomes an 'event' film, but obviously if it were that easy everyone would be doing it. No doubt the execs probably believe the only way of doing that is with a reboot. Saying that, this is also about presence in the market place, and if Scott wants to make another one, I'm sure he'll e afforded that opportunity.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Oct 01, 2017, 07:27:00 AM
There are many movies that failed at the box office this year and Alien Covenant is not one of them.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Oct 01, 2017, 07:37:18 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Sep 29, 2017, 07:42:47 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Sep 29, 2017, 07:14:16 PM
Decent science fiction movies which had horror, "Sunshine" and "Life" were flops.
And so they didn't get sequels.

Hey there bb-15, good to see you again. sfmzone of the old imdb days, here.

Hi SFMzone! (Biomechanoid) Good to hear from you.

Quote from: Biomechanoid on Sep 29, 2017, 07:42:47 PMWhat did you think of "Life" 2017?

I found the alien's physiology an intriguing concept. Each cell functioning simultaneously as a muscle cell, nerve cell,  and photoreceptive cell. Or as Miranda put it, all muscle, all brain, all eye. I'm not claiming it's original. I'm just saying it's the first I've been exposed to that concept in cinema/literature.

Agreed that the alien in "Life" was interesting with each cell acting in some ways as a complete organism.
A variation of this idea, of an alien being composed of multiple independent organisms, was mentioned in "The Thing" (1982) by MacReady before he did his blood test.

In addition; I figure you've seen the classic "The Thing From Another World". In that movie the aliens first grow as small plants. Baby Calvin (the alien in "Life") reminded me of this.
Then in "Life" there is the mouth rape trope and fast growth (from "Alien").

* Overall imo "Life" is worth watching though I prefer "Alien Covenant" much more.
As you can see I'm still in the role of a defender of the Alien franchise as I was on IMDb. And so it continues... LOL!

;)

PS. And back to the topic of the thread. "Covenant" has made enough money, compared with its production budget, that Fox is leaning towards making another Alien movie with Ridley at the helm. I'm hopeful since as you know I enjoy the franchise quite a bit.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 01, 2017, 06:27:42 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Oct 01, 2017, 07:37:18 AM
Agreed that the alien in "Life" was interesting with each cell acting in some ways as a complete organism.
A variation of this idea, of an alien being composed of multiple independent organisms, was mentioned in "The Thing" (1982) by MacReady before he did his blood test.

Agree that we can pick a few traits similar to The Thing and Alien, perhaps then maybe it was the presentation and tension of the creature's threat that affected my perception. I mean, hard to find a review on Life that doesn't mention Alien. The Thing film or novella don't really describe the individual, but thinking it further, seems logical the alien cell of The Thing would need multiple functions like muscle and nerve. Anyway, this is off topic from the thread......so....

Quote from: bb-15 on Oct 01, 2017, 07:37:18 AM
And back to the topic of the thread. "Covenant" has made enough money, compared with its production budget, that Fox is leaning towards making another Alien movie with Ridley at the helm. I'm hopeful since as you know I enjoy the franchise quite a bit.

I still reference IMDB quite a bit and saw recently a top summer movie list, which Covenant was in the top ten, I think it was at 7. The breakdown of percentages, net profits, etc......we really don't know for sure. Popular numbers have been bounced around among us fantasy studio executives, such as the studio receives 40-50% of gross return, is the most popular. But we really don't know. No studio is required to comply with the percentages we fans came up with. 

Both Life and Covenant I have already done replays. If I'm voluntarily doing a replay of a film, it must have made some sort of impact on me.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Oct 03, 2017, 01:25:49 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Oct 01, 2017, 06:27:42 PM
Quote from: bb-15 on Oct 01, 2017, 07:37:18 AM
And back to the topic of the thread. "Covenant" has made enough money, compared with its production budget, that Fox is leaning towards making another Alien movie with Ridley at the helm. I'm hopeful since as you know I enjoy the franchise quite a bit.

I still reference IMDB quite a bit and saw recently a top summer movie list, which Covenant was in the top ten, I think it was at 7. The breakdown of percentages, net profits, etc......we really don't know for sure. Popular numbers have been bounced around among us fantasy studio executives, such as the studio receives 40-50% of gross return, is the most popular. But we really don't know. No studio is required to comply with the percentages we fans came up with. 

Both Life and Covenant I have already done replays. If I'm voluntarily doing a replay of a film, it must have made some sort of impact on me.

- "Life" had its good / interesting moments. I encourage everyone here to see it.
Sadly its box office didn't do well which continues the trend where sci-if / horror is often neglected.
Look at "The Thing" from 1982. I think it's brilliant but it flopped at the box office.

- With "Covenant", I'm doing my part. :D Besides seeing it in a theater twice I own a copy on Blu-ray/streaming.
For my personal taste it was very enjoyable.

* As for studio finances, I agree that Hollywood accounting is a mysterious subject with some strange results.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

* I can only guess at what Fox cares about with the box office performance of an Alien movie.
- My current speculation is that studios are hoping that a film will have box office at least 2x the production budget to avoid a flop.
If the box office gets to 2.5 x the production budget, then that's in the range where a sequel is possible.

* Current box office for "Covenant" has reached $240 million.
Worldwide:    $240,085,541   
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=main&id=alienparadiselost.htm

- Japan is doing well enough. I'm hopeful that the final box office will be at least in the $243 million range (~2.5 x the production budget).

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Daszkowski on Oct 07, 2017, 04:58:06 PM
US Top 20 Selling Blu-ray Discs for the Week Ended 09/30/17

12 (9) Alien: Covenant - 7 weeks on chart

Chart Run: 1-2-4-5-7-9-12

Source: http://www.homemediamagazine.com/category/hmm/news/research
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Oct 08, 2017, 02:30:19 AM
Ridley Scott flat out says Alien: Covenant made enough money for Fox to greenlight a sequel on the recent empire podcast.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Oct 08, 2017, 11:46:06 PM
Ha! Fox will be pleased to hear that!  :D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Oct 09, 2017, 12:11:39 AM
Not the Blomkamp fanboys, though.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Oct 09, 2017, 04:24:27 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Oct 09, 2017, 12:11:39 AM
Not the Blomkamp fanboys, though.

;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Oct 09, 2017, 08:53:30 AM
I'm a little hesitant about that (and not a Blomkamp fanboy  ::) ), just not keen on the direction these prequels are going.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Oct 09, 2017, 10:34:20 AM
Ridley's just posturing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Oct 09, 2017, 03:14:02 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 08, 2017, 11:46:06 PM
Ha! Fox will be pleased to hear that!  :D

It will certainly be news to them!  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Oct 09, 2017, 10:28:24 PM
Quote from: Alionic on Oct 08, 2017, 02:30:19 AM
Ridley Scott flat out says Alien: Covenant made enough money for Fox to greenlight a sequel on the recent empire podcast.

I hope Ridley is right about a sequel. "Covenant" is still making money in Japan, from disk sales and streaming.

Current worldwide box office is;  $240,739,641.
And that is very close to 2.5 times its production budget (of $97 million).

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=main&id=alienparadiselost.htm

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Oct 10, 2017, 06:50:58 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Oct 09, 2017, 03:14:02 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 08, 2017, 11:46:06 PM
Ha! Fox will be pleased to hear that!  :D

It will certainly be news to them!  :laugh:

Fox CEO Stacey Snider said there will be a sequel to Covenant a few weeks ago.

Quote from: Scorpio on Oct 09, 2017, 12:11:39 AM
Not the Blomkamp fanboys, though.

I'm willing to bet he'll get to make his fanboy film after Scott wraps up the prequels. Just watch.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Oct 10, 2017, 04:04:24 PM
Quote from: Alionic on Oct 10, 2017, 06:50:58 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Oct 09, 2017, 03:14:02 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 08, 2017, 11:46:06 PM
Ha! Fox will be pleased to hear that!  :D

It will certainly be news to them!  :laugh:

Fox CEO Stacey Snider said there will be a sequel to Covenant a few weeks ago.

lolnope. Since the story for Covenant II was already written, she's obviously not too keen on it. Any new Alien films (whether Scott is involved or not) will likely try and distance themselves from Covenant even more than Covenant tried to distance itself from Prometheus.

"It was a disappointment, but I trust Ridley [Scott] and Emma [Watts] to know the right story when they find it.
-Stacey Snider Fox CEO"

The Search for Plot continues...
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Oct 10, 2017, 07:13:19 PM
People who are responsible for this franchise have no clue what are they doing. Seriously :) First they made Prometheus as kind of sequel to Alien but without Aliens which was fine with me by the way (lack of Xenomorphs is the last problem of this movie). They introduces new characters and we were ready for voyage with Shaw and David to meet Engineers.Then studio changed their minds and served us sequel to Prometheus with Alien in the title and the name of the ship. That title doesn't mean anything to the movie itself. Why Covenant? Why not! They also put there some Xenomorphs by force because .... there weren't in Prometheus. Plus there were Engineers. A new ingredient of the franchise and ... let's wipe them out. Now we gonna have (if it's gonna happen) sequel to Covenant that will focus on AI (like it didn't focus on David before) rather than Aliens. Are they gonna remove Alien from he title again? I'm not surprised that Covenant made much less money that its predecessor.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prez on Oct 10, 2017, 11:03:39 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Oct 10, 2017, 07:13:19 PM
People who are responsible for this franchise have no clue what are they doing. Seriously :) First they made Prometheus as kind of sequel to Alien but without Aliens which was fine with me by the way (lack of Xenomorphs is the last problem of this movie). They introduces new characters and we were ready for voyage with Shaw and David to meet Engineers.Then studio changed their minds and served us sequel to Prometheus with Alien in the title and the name of the ship. That title doesn't mean anything to the movie itself. Why Covenant? Why not! They also put there some Xenomorphs by force because .... there weren't in Prometheus. Plus there were Engineers. A new ingredient of the franchise and ... let's wipe them out. Now we gonna have (if it's gonna happen) sequel to Covenant that will focus on AI (like it didn't focus on David before) rather than Aliens. Are they gonna remove Alien from he title again? I'm not surprised that Covenant made much less money that its predecessor.

Hammer. Nail. Head.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Oct 11, 2017, 07:15:12 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Oct 10, 2017, 04:04:24 PM
Quote from: Alionic on Oct 10, 2017, 06:50:58 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Oct 09, 2017, 03:14:02 PM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 08, 2017, 11:46:06 PM
Ha! Fox will be pleased to hear that!  :D

It will certainly be news to them!  :laugh:

Fox CEO Stacey Snider said there will be a sequel to Covenant a few weeks ago.

lolnope. Since the story for Covenant II was already written, she's obviously not too keen on it. Any new Alien films (whether Scott is involved or not) will likely try and distance themselves from Covenant even more than Covenant tried to distance itself from Prometheus.

"It was a disappointment, but I trust Ridley [Scott] and Emma [Watts] to know the right story when they find it.
-Stacey Snider Fox CEO"

The Search for Plot continues...

Thanks for confirming my post about Stacey Snider greenlighting a sequel, I guess?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Oct 11, 2017, 10:58:36 AM
That's not a greenlight or a guarantee, though. It just means Fox is open to a sequel and seems to indicate that whatever story we heard that Scott had worked up previously isn't the right one yet. They're still looking for it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Oct 11, 2017, 03:46:21 PM
exactamundo
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Local Trouble on Oct 11, 2017, 03:56:47 PM
Does this mean no new Alien movie that focuses on rogue AIs?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯 on Oct 11, 2017, 09:59:55 PM
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 11, 2017, 03:56:47 PM
Does this mean no new Alien movie that focuses on rogue AIs?

They'll likely go on to Plan B :

Ripley's mom and Colonial Marines with lots of pulse rifles.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Oct 11, 2017, 10:15:59 PM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Oct 11, 2017, 09:59:55 PM
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 11, 2017, 03:56:47 PM
Does this mean no new Alien movie that focuses on rogue AIs?

They'll likely go on to Plan B :

Ripley's mom and Colonial Marines with lots of pulse rifles.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Scorpio on Oct 12, 2017, 04:09:29 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Oct 10, 2017, 06:50:58 AM


I'm willing to bet he'll get to make his fanboy film after Scott wraps up the prequels. Just watch.

I don't care because after the prequels the series is done.  There is nothing more logically you can do but fan service and reboots.  Oh sure, you could do hundreds of different things, but most of those won't make money.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Oct 12, 2017, 06:06:10 AM
Quote from: The Eighth Passenger on Oct 11, 2017, 09:59:55 PM
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 11, 2017, 03:56:47 PM
Does this mean no new Alien movie that focuses on rogue AIs?

They'll likely go on to Plan B :

Ripley's mom and Colonial Marines with lots of pulse rifles.

I'm waiting for plasma rifles a'la Fallout.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Oct 12, 2017, 07:51:41 AM
Phased plasma pulse rifles.

Frwap. Fry half a city with one of those puppies.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prez on Oct 12, 2017, 11:58:07 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Oct 12, 2017, 07:51:41 AM
Phased plasma pulse rifles.

Frwap. Fry half a city with one of those puppies.

Sea of Sorrows plasma rifles anyone?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Oct 13, 2017, 01:31:32 AM
Quote from: Scorpio on Oct 12, 2017, 04:09:29 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Oct 10, 2017, 06:50:58 AM


I'm willing to bet he'll get to make his fanboy film after Scott wraps up the prequels. Just watch.

I don't care because after the prequels the series is done.  There is nothing more logically you can do but fan service and reboots.  Oh sure, you could do hundreds of different things, but most of those won't make money.

I think there is plenty that can be done in the Alien franchise with the Engineers+black goo creatures+out of control androids+the nasty Weyland company.
New movies can have broader science fiction stories (like Star Trek).

Can money be made in the future with an Alien / Engineer universe?
It's possible. The budget just needs to be kept down as Ridley did with "Covenant" (which has allowed the box office to reach about 2.5 times the production budget).

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Oct 13, 2017, 11:44:10 AM
Blade Runner 2049 opened to a lukewarm $32,7 million, despite glowing reviews.
Do you still hold the opinion that Covenant, which got pretty decent reviews, failed to crack $100 million because it was "bad" and not because adult sci-fi is unfortunately not a hot commodity in today's infantile cinematic environment?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Oct 13, 2017, 01:27:40 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Oct 13, 2017, 11:44:10 AM
Blade Runner 2049 opened to a lukewarm $32,7 million, despite glowing reviews.
Do you still hold the opinion that Covenant, which got pretty decent reviews, failed to crack $100 million because it was "bad" and not because adult sci-fi is unfortunately not a hot commodity in today's infantile cinematic environment?

After Blade Runner, it's a good possibility that hard Science Fiction is sadly going out, and Covenant was the precursor for things to come.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Oct 14, 2017, 10:00:56 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Oct 13, 2017, 11:44:10 AM
Blade Runner 2049 opened to a lukewarm $32,7 million, despite glowing reviews.
Do you still hold the opinion that Covenant, which got pretty decent reviews, failed to crack $100 million because it was "bad" and not because adult sci-fi is unfortunately not a hot commodity in today's infantile cinematic environment?

It's unfortunate how modern audiences just want their endless comic book movies and Star Wars retreads.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Anthony on Oct 15, 2017, 01:12:37 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Oct 14, 2017, 10:00:56 PM
Quote from: Kane's other son on Oct 13, 2017, 11:44:10 AM
Blade Runner 2049 opened to a lukewarm $32,7 million, despite glowing reviews.
Do you still hold the opinion that Covenant, which got pretty decent reviews, failed to crack $100 million because it was "bad" and not because adult sci-fi is unfortunately not a hot commodity in today's infantile cinematic environment?

It's unfortunate how modern audiences just want their endless comic book movies and Star Wars retreads.

Have you considered that maybe Blade Runner (which bombed when originally released) and Alien aren't as popular as Star Wars or comic book films?

Nah screw that! It's much easier to just insult the general audience and bring up completely unrelated films.

Mind you, I really liked Blade Runner 2049, but it was never going to be a huge hit.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Oct 15, 2017, 01:57:14 AM
Yep.  It's becoming increasingly obvious that if they want to make good money from stuff like Alien or Blade Runner they need to dial down the budgets and/ or the ratings.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: 0321recon on Oct 15, 2017, 04:11:31 PM
Quote from: SM on Oct 15, 2017, 01:57:14 AM
Yep.  It's becoming increasingly obvious that if they want to make good money from stuff like Alien or Blade Runner they need to dial down the budgets and/ or the ratings.

Good point. I can see Fox pushing Scott either take the rating or budget hit for them to green-light Awakening. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: skhellter on Oct 15, 2017, 04:30:14 PM
3rd film will definitely have a smaller budget.
And that's fine, tbh.

Prometheus kinda felt like it was wasting some of its
budget in unmemorable scenes like the sandstorm
or the scrapped cgi-Mutant-Fifield


Keep it focused, keep it claustrophobic, plz.
But also keep it R-Rated, plz.

plz?
plz.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Oct 15, 2017, 05:40:14 PM
Likely the problem with these movies is that their budgets are too high. And they're high because large amounts of credit are available for investment, which means given competition studios have to make very expensive movies. In order to earn from them, they have to spend large amounts on marketing, spend heavily on special effects and/or A-list actors, and come up with stories that will appeal across many cultures while hitting the PG sweet spot. That's why many of these movies (not all) look alike, and why studios have to resort to remakes, reboots, prequels and sequels, etc.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 15, 2017, 11:46:23 PM
I've read where studios conduct market research on audience trends - what genres are hot and not, during any given period. For example, sci-fi was riding high from 78 to 81. By 1982, their research showed audience desire for sci-fi had dropped by a whopping 70%  (source: John Carpenter interview discussing The Thing's box office failure). Unfortunate timing for Blade Runner and The Thing. ET scored big, but it's dominate family oriented theme carried it to blockbuster profit.

I haven't seen more recent research results, but I would be curious if it shows a sine wave-like pattern for sci-fi over the years since 82. Even without seeing the research, the pattern seems to indicate this is the pattern. Sci-fi was on a high in the early nineties with Terminator 2, Jurassic Park, Total Recall, Twelve Monkeys, Back/Future trilogy continues, Star Trek films, etc.

If there is any substance to this theory, perhaps we are currently riding the bottom end of the sine wave pattern on audience trend regarding sci-fi.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 12:23:02 AM
According to this theory films like Jurassic Park/T2/Back-Future wouldve grossed significantly less if at the start of the 90s there wouldve been some kind of negative audience interest going on in terms of scifi? I highly doubt that.

I have a counter theory, totally pulled from my own a**: I think scifi movies are then heavily successful if their are linked to some kind of jump in the technological department.

This would apply to the 77-81 era as well as to the start of the 90s and to this otherwise more or less mediocre film:


(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b0/Avatar-Teaser-Poster.jpg)


This might even be true for something like 'Inception', though its hard to seperate this film from the Nolan-factor.

But i surely never heard anyone say: "You nedd to see Prometheus duuuuude, cause i never saw anything like it before!"

And the original Blade Runner just looked like Star Wars directed by R. Scott. It even had that Han dude--
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 16, 2017, 12:35:01 AM
Despite your less than favorable view of the original Blade Runner, both The Thing and Blade Runner place highly in many All time lists. So yes, this sine wave pattern does raise the question would Blade Runner and The Thing have performed better at the box office if it had not hit a 70% decline in audience desire for SF. I mean, how can anyone simply dismiss a 70% decline as a factor in analyzing a given film's box office performance.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 12:47:08 AM
Lol and here i thought that Han bit would definitely give away the irony.... oh well.

Well well i guess audience' interest was magically back up again for the first Terminator? Did it then stay up till the 90s or...?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Oct 16, 2017, 01:03:02 AM
Twenty movies finished ahead of Terminator in 1984 in terms of box office and only 2 were strictly science fiction.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 16, 2017, 01:04:55 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 12:47:08 AM
Well well i guess audience' interest was magically back up again for the first Terminator? Did it then stay up till the 90s or...?

Well well I'm not sure I would call it "magically back up again" in 84, Terminator wasn't even in the top 20 domestic gross in box office in 84.


Doah! SM, you beat me by one minute!  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 01:10:24 AM
I still fail to see any sort of pattern. What about Trek 2&3&4?

And again, does this low hold till the the early 90s or what, cause i sure didnt heard Cameron complain bout the BO performance of Aliens.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 16, 2017, 01:17:48 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 01:10:24 AM
I still fail to see any sort of pattern.

Well, son, here's a tip: self discovery is a reward worthy of pursuit. Start here http://www.boxofficemojo.com/yearly/ , look at the top 20 of each year, count how many were sci-fi of each year, and decide for yourself if there is pattern.

That tip, my gift to you, no thanks is necessary. . . .  ;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 01:23:26 AM
QuoteWhat about Trek 2&3&4?

And again, does this low hold till the the early 90s or what, cause i sure didnt heard Cameron complain bout the BO performance of Aliens.


And another one: no significant drop in BO performance from ROTJ to ESB. Unlike the significant drop from ESB compared to ANHs performance.


good game; no rematch ;D


Heres another one for your theory:

In the same year 'Avatar' is skyrocketing the BO a critically acclaimed movie like JJs first Trek is struggling to reach the 400mio mark. MONTHLY SWINGS PROB

Now let me ask you, was yesterday a good day for releasing sci fi movie? What about tomorrow... You could save Hollywood millions--

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 16, 2017, 01:43:47 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 01:10:24 AM
And again, does this low hold till the the early 90s or what, cause i sure didnt heard Cameron complain bout the BO performance of Aliens.

I get it. You want me to do the counting for you, don't you. Nope, I have faith in your skill at basic arithmetic.

Aliens? Go to that link I provided for your benefit, look at the the top 20 in 1986......no, better yet.....look at the TOP 50 and count how many were sci-fi. I counted the total.  I have full confidence you will deliver here the total out of 50 in 1986 that were sci-fi. The spotlight is on you.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 02:00:27 AM
The spotlight is clearly on you, pal (Trek, ROTJ etc etc  :laugh:). FYI one year doesnt make a pattern!

QuoteHeres another one for your theory:

In the same year 'Avatar' is skyrocketing the BO a critically acclaimed movie like JJs first Trek is struggling to reach the 400mio mark. MONTHLY SWINGS PROB

Oh ja and as you said:

Quoteperhaps we are currently riding the bottom end of the sine wave pattern on audience trend regarding sci-fi.


I know right? TFA and RO nearly bankrupted Disney thats why they refrain from going all space and starships with their other franchises...

I give up, the daily swing pattern argument i can not beat.  :D


So was yesterday a good day for scifi? Or no... or so-so?

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 16, 2017, 02:41:02 AM
Quote from: kwisatz
The spotlight is clearly on you, pal
So......you couldn't deliver. You can't count how many films in the 1986 Top 50 are sci-fi. How disappointing. I really had high hopes you had a solid grasp on basic arithmetic.

Quote from: kwisatz
(Trek, ROTJ etc etc  :laugh:).
What about Trek? It was in the top ten in 2009.
What about ROTJ? It was the only SF in the top 20 in 1983.
No offense, but I think you're struggling with keeping up with the conversation.

Quote from: kwisatz
FYI one year doesnt make a pattern!
The only one suggesting a pattern is based on only one year, is you.

Quote from: kwisatz
In the same year 'Avatar' is skyrocketing the BO a critically acclaimed movie like JJs first Trek is struggling to reach the 400mio mark. MONTHLY SWINGS PROB

Oh ja and as you said:
I don't even understand your point here. Trek 09 would be considered a box office success and launched two sequels. If you're going to compare it to the box office king, then that would include every other movie made since time began, that should be considered as "struggling" according to your strange logic.


Quote from: kwisatz
I know right? TFA and RO nearly bankrupted Disney thats why they refrain from going all space and starships with their other franchises...

I give up, the daily swing pattern argument i can not beat.  :D


So was yesterday a good day for scifi? Or no... or so-so?

The only one suggesting and clinging onto a "daily" pattern, is you. . . . . ;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 03:16:28 AM
Too tired for a lenghty answer but i just wanted point out that you think

QuoteSci-fi was on a high in the early nineties

and

Quoteperhaps we are currently riding the bottom end of the sine wave pattern on audience trend regarding sci-fi.


Now all i want you to do, is go to some BO site and check out the highest grossing film of all time worldwide, the second highest grossing film of all time worldwide and the 4th highest grossing film of all time worldwide. Then check out their release dates! Genre too!

Then come back here and present a new whack theory.  :D

Keep it up and have a good night!!!!!!!!!!1111111111------

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Highland on Oct 16, 2017, 05:30:55 AM
I guess a simple question I would have is - Why would there be a pattern?

Also Sci Fi is like a genre inside a genre. It's most likely going to rule out kids, which rules out mums and dads. Unless you get something like Avatar....which is for kids.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 16, 2017, 05:37:14 AM
Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 03:16:28 AM
Now all i want you to do, is go to some BO site and check out the highest grossing film of all time worldwide, the second highest grossing film of all time worldwide and the 4th highest grossing film of all time worldwide. Then check out their release dates! Genre too!

So.....I answered your questions. Yet you still fail to answer my question on Aliens.......a film that you brought up to make some kind of point. Instead of delivering, you bring up irrelevant deflections and run. Well.......you certainly showed me! . . . . ;)


Quote from: kwisatz on Oct 16, 2017, 03:16:28 AM
but i just wanted point out that you think Sci-fi was on a high in the early nineties

Then come back here and present a new whack theory.

I see. Whack theory, huh. .......

Penn State University research: "However, it is clear from the results presented here that, since the early 1990s, there has been an upwards trend in the number of fantasy/science fiction films..... From the breakdown by decade in Table 1, we see that the proportion of Genre trends at the US box office, 1991 to 2010 fantasy/science fiction films in the top 25 films has increased from 51% to 64% and with an increase from 26% to 50% for top 10 films; and in 2005 alone, fantasy/science fiction films occupied six of the top 7 rankings by total gross. "

Ooh...."upwards trend".....there's that nasty pattern talk again ..... ;)

Penn State continues: "This paper has presented an empirical analysis of genre trends at the US box office in the two decades since 1991. Overall, analysis of box office data indicates that the range of genres for the highest grossing films at the US box office has become narrower over the past twenty years. A limited range of special effects-based films from the action/adventure and fantasy/science fiction genres have come to dominate the US box office at the expense of character- and narrative-driven films (crime/thriller and drama films) that were previously identified as the most popular. "
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.393.8852&rep=rep1&type=pdf.

Well, well, well, that statement is just oozing with audience trend patterns for SF ..... :laugh:

Fools! All Penn State University had to do was email kwisatz and you could have told them they wasted their time doing all that research since analyzing audience trends by genre is a "whack theory," according to you. I'm sure they would have held your word as credible because you said so in a movie forum........... ;)



Meanwhile, still waiting on your answer on Aliens.........tick tock says the croc.  :P





Quote from: Highland on Oct 16, 2017, 05:30:55 AM
I guess a simple question I would have is - Why would there be a pattern?
I have no answer "why" there is a pattern, but there is a pattern. For example, if you reference the Penn State link above they show SF in the decade 1991 to 2000 with 35 top 25 box office films, which increased to 56 top 25 box office films in the decade 2001 to 2010.

And this is not a case of all genres likely increased. That same chart shows the genres Comedy, Drama, and Crime/Thriller actually decreased during those two decades. A pattern is a pattern no matter how much someone wants to desperately dismiss it as a "whack theory."  ;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Oct 19, 2017, 08:47:55 PM
In following box office from Japan and worldwide, it looks like "Alien Covenant" will end up at about $241 million.
The delay in the theatrical release in Japan took its toll imo.
"Covenant" has been available on disk and downloads since mid August.

Blu rays for sale in Hong Kong / Taiwan had both English and "traditional Chinese" (I assume Mandarin) subtitles which gave a legal outlet for Japanese customers (who could read those languages) to get the film since mid August. 
http://www.yesasia.com/us/alien-covenant-2017-blu-ray-steelbook-taiwan-version/1061453135-0-0-0-en/info.html

And available pirated downloaded copies of the movie (with Japanese subtitles) also lead to a lower performance.

* Still "Covent" ends up with a box office of 2.48 times its production budget.
Considering that, we will see what Fox decides to do with the Alien franchise.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 22, 2017, 12:58:55 AM
Quote from: bb-15 on Oct 19, 2017, 08:47:55 PM
* Still "Covent" ends up with a box office of 2.48 times its production budget.
Considering that, we will see what Fox decides to do with the Alien franchise.

No example comes to mind at the moment, but I think studios have approved a continuation of a given film universe for less profit than that, sometime in the past. That could be bad recollection on my part without researching it. I would also speculate profits from the home market - discs, streaming, are taken in consideration in their decision making.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Oct 22, 2017, 05:40:08 PM
The other point to consider is that for-profit businesses do not operate on making sure earnings are good enough. Rather, they seek to maximize profits, especially given competition. Given that, it's not enough for a movie to simply make 2.5 times more its production cost.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 23, 2017, 02:44:49 AM
Quote from: monkeylove on Oct 22, 2017, 05:40:08 PM
The other point to consider is that for-profit businesses do not operate on making sure earnings are good enough. Rather, they seek to maximize profits, especially given competition. Given that, it's not enough for a movie to simply make 2.5 times more its production cost.

Not being in the profession, I really don't follow that train of thought.

If I was a studio executive in a conference room and a co-worker brings forth a project where their market research showed there's high probability they will collect a one million-plus net profit return, I would endorse the suggestion. But wait, another co-worker interrupts, "yes, we may gain a one million-plus net profit return, but I just found out that Acme Studios approved a project that will likely garner them a two million-plus net profit return."

Are you suggesting that executives would reject a project that would result in a one million-plus net profit return simply on the reason they discovered another studio may gain a higher net profit return? I don't follow, please explain.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Oct 23, 2017, 02:53:45 AM
All businesses are "for-profit."

It's really not that difficult. If your movie makes $400 million, and you make a sequel that makes $170 million less, you're going to rethink your game plan. I mean especially since the sequel was meant to be a crowd pleaser, bringing back everyone's favorite alien.

So the whole 2.5x fascination is strange. That's a bad multiple compared to the predecessor. Ok on its own I guess. But disappointing per Fox. This IS a franchise, and how this one does will affect their future Alien decisions. That's really just it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Oct 23, 2017, 12:34:19 PM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Oct 23, 2017, 02:44:49 AM

Not being in the profession, I really don't follow that train of thought.

If I was a studio executive in a conference room and a co-worker brings forth a project where their market research showed there's high probability they will collect a one million-plus net profit return, I would endorse the suggestion. But wait, another co-worker interrupts, "yes, we may gain a one million-plus net profit return, but I just found out that Acme Studios approved a project that will likely garner them a two million-plus net profit return."

Are you suggesting that executives would reject a project that would result in a one million-plus net profit return simply on the reason they discovered another studio may gain a higher net profit return? I don't follow, please explain.

Executives will reject or set aside a project if they believe that they can make more money from another. Of course, that assumes that the studio has more than one project to consider.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Daszkowski on Oct 23, 2017, 04:13:07 PM
UK Official Blu-Ray Chart Top 100

Alien: Covenant Chart Run: 1-2-2-5-8

Source: http://www.officialcharts.com/charts/blu-ray-chart/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 23, 2017, 09:52:00 PM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Oct 23, 2017, 02:53:45 AM
All businesses are "for-profit." It's really not that difficult. If your movie makes $400 million, and you make a sequel that makes $170 million less, you're going to rethink your game plan.

Quote from: monkeylove on Oct 23, 2017, 12:34:19 PM
Executives will reject or set aside a project if they believe that they can make more money from another. Of course, that assumes that the studio has more than one project to consider.

Unless you two are in the studio executive profession, I assume you are speculating as I am.

I worked for a major pharmaceutical headquarters prior to early retirement and I was a part of the IT team on several drug marketing projects. Over the years I was involved in maybe close to a dozen monster huge projects involving multi-million dollar gains. Those mega-projects were the stars of the show.

But....I was also involved in hundreds of minor projects. Small profit gain projects, but in reality, their accumulative return as a whole, was the bulk of the corporation's annual income. From mini-projects that required less than a week of work, to mid-size projects requiring more time....and various levels of minor projects in between.

Other corporations I worked for were also geared with the same platform. Never did I see corporate management turn their nose up to a project that would potentially result in small gain, unless all their teams were already locked in other projects.

Just like cinema, there's no guaranteed return, there were risks.  I can't imagine studio corporations being the exception to how most other corporations operate in regards to collecting revenue. Nor can I imagine studio corporations are built as a singular team project. Like most corporations, I would imagine there are multiple teams working on various projects (feature films, straight-to-video, tv series, commercials, etc.).

My point to all this is I find it unlikely they are solely deciding for or against a given film project on the size of their estimated profit return. It was really the small projects in the corporations I worked for that kept the paychecks coming.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Oct 24, 2017, 07:09:27 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Oct 23, 2017, 09:52:00 PM

Unless you two are in the studio executive profession, I assume you are speculating as I am.

I worked for a major pharmaceutical headquarters prior to early retirement and I was a part of the IT team on several drug marketing projects. Over the years I was involved in maybe close to a dozen monster huge projects involving multi-million dollar gains. Those mega-projects were the stars of the show.

But....I was also involved in hundreds of minor projects. Small profit gain projects, but in reality, their accumulative return as a whole, was the bulk of the corporation's annual income. From mini-projects that required less than a week of work, to mid-size projects requiring more time....and various levels of minor projects in between.

Other corporations I worked for were also geared with the same platform. Never did I see corporate management turn their nose up to a project that would potentially result in small gain, unless all their teams were already locked in other projects.

Just like cinema, there's no guaranteed return, there were risks.  I can't imagine studio corporations being the exception to how most other corporations operate in regards to collecting revenue. Nor can I imagine studio corporations are built as a singular team project. Like most corporations, I would imagine there are multiple teams working on various projects (feature films, straight-to-video, tv series, commercials, etc.).

My point to all this is I find it unlikely they are solely deciding for or against a given film project on the size of their estimated profit return. It was really the small projects in the corporations I worked for that kept the paychecks coming.

The Alien franchise is not a minor project.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 24, 2017, 01:09:39 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Oct 24, 2017, 07:09:27 AM
The Alien franchise is not a minor project.

Collectively? I would agree. But some of the films of the franchise did not warrant blockbuster budget. Compared to many of today's big budget films in the range of 250 million, the Alien franchise has continued with films that fall well under that watermark. 

From what I'm understanding what you are saying, you think studios approve projects as, "either this project OR that project near the same time frame." The point I'm making is they may "approve this project AND that project in the same time frame, regardless if one project is a major project and the other a minor project...or near same level budget.

The fact that Fox released Alien Covenant within one month of releasing War for the Planet of the Apes, the latter costing over 50 million dollars more to produce, should be your clue studios approve multiple projects in the same time frame. This recent history should show you this is more than just an axiom that they approved both projects in the same time frame, with Covenant getting the lesser budget. 
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Kane's other son on Oct 24, 2017, 02:44:09 PM
Covenant was R-rated and skewed towards adults. It would never get a tent-pole budget because there was never a chance to make tent-pole money. Even if it was a huge hit, it would make Mad Max money, not Marvel money ("It" was a fluke and that's why its budget was a very modest $35 million).

Having said that, there's no formula for green-lighting a sequel. No magic benchmark (2.5x budget, 3x budget, etc). It's more complex than that. Especially on established franchises, in which every new installment is judged according to the value it brings to the franchise as a whole.

Covenant (probably) broke even or made a little profit. We have no idea how it affected sales of older entries in the franchise, merchandising deals, etc. It certainly didn't poison the well since it was well-received by critics and people generally liked it (but didn't go crazy about it).

Fox will (should?) definitely try to shake things up, moving forward, but they are not going to let a franchise that's grossed close to $2 billion, die.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: BishopShouldGo on Oct 24, 2017, 03:55:53 PM
That reads like someone trying to convince themselves that Covenant wasn't a huge commercial disappointment.

I don't like it either, but it disappointed. Studios don't greenlight movies based on their ability to help bump sales of the older movies. Especially expensive ones.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Oct 25, 2017, 03:00:29 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Oct 24, 2017, 03:55:53 PM
That reads like someone trying to convince themselves that Covenant wasn't a huge commercial disappointment.

I don't like it either, but it disappointed. Studios don't greenlight movies based on their ability to help bump sales of the older movies. Especially expensive ones.

The CEO of Fox greenlit a sequel with Scott directing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Oct 25, 2017, 03:21:16 AM
QuoteThat reads like someone trying to convince themselves that Covenant wasn't a huge commercial disappointment.

"Huge" is churching things up a tad.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: skhellter on Oct 25, 2017, 03:55:54 AM
Yeah.

Covenant did better than Blade Runner 2049. ;D
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Paranoid Android on Oct 25, 2017, 08:46:35 AM
Covenant was expected to do better than Blade Runner 2049. It's the sixth film in an iconic, well established and profitable franchise. 2049 is the sequel nobody asked for to a 35 year old flop. If Covenant would've done worse than Blade Runner 2049, it would've been embarrassing.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prez on Oct 25, 2017, 10:21:59 AM
Reality is both underperformed for various reasons.

Of the two though I (strongly) suspect Blade Runner 2049 will have substantial more longevity and respect in the minds of fans, critics and the general sci-fi community.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Ingwar on Oct 25, 2017, 10:38:17 PM
Quote from: Prez on Oct 25, 2017, 10:21:59 AM
Of the two though I (strongly) suspect Blade Runner 2049 will have substantial more longevity and respect in the minds of fans, critics and the general sci-fi community.

Without doubt. It's masterfully made movie. It grows on me and even despite the fact that I've got some issues with it I still cannot stop thinking about it. BR 2049 it's addictive piece of art.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Prez on Oct 25, 2017, 11:00:04 PM
Quote from: Ingwar on Oct 25, 2017, 10:38:17 PM
Quote from: Prez on Oct 25, 2017, 10:21:59 AM
Of the two though I (strongly) suspect Blade Runner 2049 will have substantial more longevity and respect in the minds of fans, critics and the general sci-fi community.

Without doubt. It's masterfully made movie. It grows on me and even despite the fact that I've got some issues with it I still cannot stop thinking about it. BR 2049 it's addictive piece of art.

For me it's the best film I've seen in a decade.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Oct 26, 2017, 08:03:17 AM
Quote from: Alionic on Oct 25, 2017, 03:00:29 AM
Quote from: BishopShouldGo on Oct 24, 2017, 03:55:53 PM
That reads like someone trying to convince themselves that Covenant wasn't a huge commercial disappointment.

I don't like it either, but it disappointed. Studios don't greenlight movies based on their ability to help bump sales of the older movies. Especially expensive ones.

The CEO of Fox greenlit a sequel with Scott directing.

I wouldn't go as far as to say it's been greenlit but what she said definitely indicated they're open to more if Scott can find a direction that Fox is happy with.

Quote from: SM on Oct 25, 2017, 03:21:16 AM
QuoteThat reads like someone trying to convince themselves that Covenant wasn't a huge commercial disappointment.

"Huge" is churching things up a tad.

(https://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F4.bp.blogspot.com%2F-TahRr7ackxY%2FUU38wPEpacI%2FAAAAAAAALGA%2Fa8DAVIQYLD0%2Fs1600%2Findeed.gif&hash=93aa093348d96b4146df97a5eee0b88a109d3324)

Scott and some Fox executives have already said it was a money earner for them. It under-performed. There's no denying that but to call it a huge commercial disappointment is hyperbole.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Oct 26, 2017, 08:55:58 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Oct 24, 2017, 01:09:39 PM

Collectively? I would agree. But some of the films of the franchise did not warrant blockbuster budget. Compared to many of today's big budget films in the range of 250 million, the Alien franchise has continued with films that fall well under that watermark. 

From what I'm understanding what you are saying, you think studios approve projects as, "either this project OR that project near the same time frame." The point I'm making is they may "approve this project AND that project in the same time frame, regardless if one project is a major project and the other a minor project...or near same level budget.

The fact that Fox released Alien Covenant within one month of releasing War for the Planet of the Apes, the latter costing over 50 million dollars more to produce, should be your clue studios approve multiple projects in the same time frame. This recent history should show you this is more than just an axiom that they approved both projects in the same time frame, with Covenant getting the lesser budget.

Why do you use $250 million as a cutoff to define whether or not a project is major? Movies like Deadpool had much smaller budgets but they are not seen as minor.

Of course a studio will choose between one project or another if it does not have enough funds or resources to proceed with both or if funds for the first can be used to support other projects in the pipeline that it believes it can earn more.

Ultimately, your point that as long as a movie breaks even then any sequels or prequels will proceed, is questionable because that's not how for-profit businesses work.



Quote from: Kane's other son on Oct 24, 2017, 02:44:09 PM
Covenant was R-rated and skewed towards adults. It would never get a tent-pole budget because there was never a chance to make tent-pole money. Even if it was a huge hit, it would make Mad Max money, not Marvel money ("It" was a fluke and that's why its budget was a very modest $35 million).

Having said that, there's no formula for green-lighting a sequel. No magic benchmark (2.5x budget, 3x budget, etc). It's more complex than that. Especially on established franchises, in which every new installment is judged according to the value it brings to the franchise as a whole.

Covenant (probably) broke even or made a little profit. We have no idea how it affected sales of older entries in the franchise, merchandising deals, etc. It certainly didn't poison the well since it was well-received by critics and people generally liked it (but didn't go crazy about it).

Fox will (should?) definitely try to shake things up, moving forward, but they are not going to let a franchise that's grossed close to $2 billion, die.

It will not let a franchise die only if it knows that future films will make a significant profit. Otherwise, why continue with something that will only break even or make a small profit each time?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 28, 2017, 08:07:55 AM
Quote from: monkeylove on Oct 26, 2017, 08:55:58 AM
Of course a studio will choose between one project or another if it does not have enough funds or resources to proceed with both or if funds for the first can be used to support other projects in the pipeline that it believes it can earn more.
Understood, but as I provided for you the Alien Covenant/War for the Planet of the Apes example, that was not the case in this instance, now was it?


Quote from: monkeylove on Oct 26, 2017, 08:55:58 AM
Ultimately, your point that as long as a movie breaks even then any sequels or prequels will proceed, is questionable because that's not how for-profit businesses work.
Well now you're just putting words in my mouth so you can venture off on an irrelevant counterpoint. You say my point was as long as a movie "breaks even?"......... The only one interjecting the term "break even," is you.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: tleilaxu on Oct 28, 2017, 07:37:37 PM
I'm still surprised that Blade Runner 2049 is underperforming. I thought it was a well established classic, but apparently it isn't outside the internet.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Oct 30, 2017, 02:46:14 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Oct 28, 2017, 08:07:55 AM
Understood, but as I provided for you the Alien Covenant/War for the Planet of the Apes example, that was not the case in this instance, now was it?

As I explained earlier, if there is another project that may earn more, then a studio can choose to focus on that and shelve the one that will make less, but that in turn is based on many other factors, such as availability of funding. In this case, it proceeded with both projects, likely hoping for a worst-case scenario where gains from one tent pole will make up for the other. Other options may involve continuing a franchise with lower budgets, trying something like a TV series, etc.

In any event, the belief that studios will continue making projects for a franchise as long as they break even is questionable.

Quote
Well now you're just putting words in my mouth so you can venture off on an irrelevant counterpoint. You say my point was as long as a movie "breaks even?"......... The only one interjecting the term "break even," is you.

Sorry, I was referring to the original point of this discussion, which was raised by another forum member:

http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=57436.msg2254624#msg2254624

Quote* Still "Covent" ends up with a box office of 2.48 times its production budget.
Considering that, we will see what Fox decides to do with the Alien franchise.

Notice that BishopShouldGo also gave a response that is similar to mine.

For me, the implication of the statement is that as long as a movie makes around 2.5 its production budget, then a franchise may continue.

As we explained earlier, these businesses are for-profit, and in competition with each other, they want to maximize profits, and more so if investors are involved.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 31, 2017, 01:16:36 AM
Quote from: monkeylove on Oct 30, 2017, 02:46:14 AM
Sorry, I was referring to the original point of this discussion, which was raised by another forum member:

Apology accepted and false accusation forgiven.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Oct 31, 2017, 02:50:30 PM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Oct 31, 2017, 01:16:36 AM
Apology accepted and false accusation forgiven.

But that was the main point of the discussion. To recap, the implication is that as long as the studio breaks even, then it will continue the franchise. Two of us argued that FWIW that's not how a for-profit business operates. Rather, it may postpone making a sequel if there is another project that will be more profitable, or may continue a sequel if it has assurances that the next movie will make more. Whatever it does, it will do so to maximize profits.

For some reason, you found our arguments perplexing, and came up with the following arguments:

1. That it will shelve a project if it finds out that a rival company has something better.

Actually, that's not what we argued. Rather, it may work on another project first if that will guarantee more profits.

2. A studio may work on several minor project and may continue them even if they provide a small gain, as the cumulative gains may make up the annual income of the studio.

I don't think Covenant is a minor project.

I also forgot to add that I don't understand this point: if a company has, say, 100 such projects and has a profit margin of only 1 percent for each one, then its profit margin is still 1 percent, right? Shouldn't it consider projects that can earn more, especially if it has investors who are expecting better returns, not to mention rivals who can do better?

3. Studios may work on more than one project.

If it does so, it's because it has a good reason, and very likely connected to maximizing profitability. In this case, it assumes that a sequel to Covenant will not simply break even or provide a small gain. Or that one tent pole will provide funds to support another in case the latter is expected to gain slowly.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Oct 31, 2017, 04:52:20 PM
Quote from: monkeylove on Oct 31, 2017, 02:50:30 PM
For some reason, you found our arguments perplexing, and came up with the following arguments:
Once again you make a false assumption of me. On the contrary, I find your argument borderline jejune. You're tainting your graceful apology, just let it go.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Nov 01, 2017, 02:42:08 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Oct 31, 2017, 04:52:20 PM
Once again you make a false assumption of me. On the contrary, I find your argument borderline jejune. You're tainting your graceful apology, just let it go.

But the assumption made for this discussion isn't only about breaking even but also making a small profit, and your reasons refer to that. In fact, that's clearly seen in the second reason you gave, i.e., it can work on numerous, low-earning minor projects and still make an accumulative gain for its annual income (which is illogical because percentage-wise the accumulated profit is still low).

I won't discuss the first reason because it is obviously illogical, but the third also supports our arguments. If a studio continues developing for two franchises, it will do so only because it expects to earn more from both in the long run or because it has no other projects to consider. Otherwise, it will earn only a small profit with an accumulative gain or one will keep pulling down the other.

Finally, one more point to consider: the profit is usually shared between the studio and investors, and the former usually competes with other studios over the latter. And investors want the best return on their investments, which is one reason why studios want to maximize profits. Given that, breaking even or making small gains won't be good enough.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 01, 2017, 03:54:51 AM
He's like the energizer bunny!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Nov 02, 2017, 03:09:45 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Nov 01, 2017, 03:54:51 AM
He's like the energizer bunny!

Powered by reason!
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 02, 2017, 11:26:18 PM
Powered by, all right, but "reason" wasn't the word I had in mind. . . .  ;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Nov 03, 2017, 09:08:50 AM
Play nicely, gentlemen.  :)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Nov 03, 2017, 01:42:06 PM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Nov 02, 2017, 11:26:18 PM
Powered by, all right, but "reason" wasn't the word I had in mind. . . .  ;)

Once you can counter my arguments, then you make such assumptions.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Nov 04, 2017, 12:21:21 AM
Quote from: skhellter on Oct 25, 2017, 03:55:54 AM
Yeah.

Covenant did better than Blade Runner 2049. ;D

Quote from: Paranoid Android on Oct 25, 2017, 08:46:35 AM
Covenant was expected to do better than Blade Runner 2049. It's the sixth film in an iconic, well established and profitable franchise.

* It was uncertain how "Covenant" was going to do with evidence pointing for both success and lack of it.

* Prior to "Prometheus"; the last Alien movie was "Resurrection". (I'm not counting the AVP movies.)
That had a production budget of $75 million and box office of $161,376,068 or box office that is 2.15 times its production budget.
- The performance of "Resurrection" while decent (probably making a little money after several years), it did not do that well enough to get a direct sequel.    
- As a result Fox waited 15 years before releasing the soft reboot/prequel, "Prometheus".
* "Prometheus" did well in terms of box office (3x production budget) but it showed a deep split among the audience, especially with the fans of the franchise.
It was certainly possible that "Covenant" would only do OK; a little better than "Resurrection" and that's what happened.

Quote from: Paranoid Android on Oct 25, 2017, 08:46:35 AM2049 is the sequel nobody asked for to a 35 year old flop.

Some people may not have asked for a "Blade Runner" sequel but studios decide if films are made and not because of the opinions of random movie goers.
- And once Fox decided to do "BR 2049" many people (such as on IMDb forums, including fans of Denis Villeneuve) were very much looking forward to seeing it.
(PS. I got the studio(s) wrong. The "BR 2049" production companies were: Warner Bros. · Columbia Pictures · Alcon Entertainment.)
- And "Blade Runner 2049" was certainly anticipated by many film journalists / bloggers. Here's a bit of that.

QuoteIt is unmistakably a Denis Villeneuve film, inviting us to tumble, tense with anticipation, into his doomy clutches.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/10/16/blade-runner-2049-the-mysteries-deepen

Quote'Blade Runner 2049' Tests Our Anticipation Levels With A Second Trailer
http://uproxx.com/hitfix/blade-runner-2049-trailer-2/

QuoteAfter months of anticipation and years in the making, the first reactions to Denis Villeneuve's Blade Runner 2049 are here.
https://io9.gizmodo.com/the-first-reactions-to-blade-runner-2049-are-incredibly-1818807529

Quote"Blade Runner 2049" topped the box office over the weekend, but after months of buzz and anticipation, the sci-fi sequel...
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/blade-runner-2049-tops-box-office-but-falls-short-of-expectations/ 

Quote from: Paranoid Android on Oct 25, 2017, 08:46:35 AMIf Covenant would've done worse than Blade Runner 2049, it would've been embarrassing.

My view is that;
- It was obvious that the Fox studio anticipated that "BR 2049" would be a bigger box office draw than "Covenant".
Why? Because Fox approved $150 million for the production of "BR 2049" and only $97 million for the production of "Covenant'.
- And why would Fox risk $53 million more on "BR 2049" compared with "Covenant"?
Because Fox expected that "BR 2049" would make much more money than "Covenant".
(PS. Again, I got the studio(s) wrong. The "BR 2049" production companies were: Warner Bros. · Columbia Pictures · Alcon Entertainment.)

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Nov 04, 2017, 12:29:26 AM
Fox spent $150m on Blade Runner?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Nov 04, 2017, 12:37:00 AM
Quote from: SM on Nov 04, 2017, 12:29:26 AM
Fox spent $150m on Blade Runner?

Yes SM;
Though, just to be clear this is not about 1982 "Blade Runner", I wrote; "Fox approved $150 million for the production of "BR 2049"
(PS. I got the studio(s) wrong. The "BR 2049" production companies were: Warner Bros. · Columbia Pictures · Alcon Entertainment.)

Here are the numbers from Box Office Mojo for "Blade Runner 2049".

QuoteProduction Budget: $150 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic:    $83,221,130      37.0%
+ Foreign:    $141,595,153      63.0%
= Worldwide:    $224,816,283
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?page=main&id=bladerunnersequel.htm

It seemed that Fox was hoping that "BR 2049" would make about $450 million (3x production budget).

;)   
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Nov 04, 2017, 01:22:56 AM
Fox spent $150m on Blade Runner 2049?

Not WB and Sony?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 04, 2017, 11:07:23 AM
Looks like Ridley may soon be leaving the franchise behind again (thankfully): https://movieweb.com/alien-franchise-over-ridley-scott/
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Whiskeybrewer on Nov 04, 2017, 12:38:27 PM
Quote from: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 04, 2017, 11:07:23 AM
Looks like Ridley may soon be leaving the franchise behind again (thankfully): https://movieweb.com/alien-franchise-over-ridley-scott/

He keeps flip flopping. jesus christ
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 04, 2017, 01:11:24 PM
I know. That's the main problem. He's got no guts. He can't make up his mind and stick to it.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Mister Skeezler on Nov 04, 2017, 02:04:09 PM
I like many of the parts of the whole David story arc, but I just don't think I want to be left with yet another story that focuses solely on AI. It's starting to feel tired.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 04, 2017, 03:21:09 PM
Quote from: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 04, 2017, 01:11:24 PM
I know. That's the main problem. He's got no guts. He can't make up his mind and stick to it.
Do you think he should retire from directing and finish out his career as producer only?
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 04, 2017, 03:41:04 PM
Probably. I loved Alien, Legend and Blade Runner. Wasn't a fan of Gladiator. Robin Hood was awful. Kingdom of Heaven was even worse. The Martian was okay, but basically Castaway in Space, so it's a very particular kind of film you'll either love or hate. I didn't like Castaway, so...

Maybe he's had his day. It's not just him. I wasn't a fan of Avatar, which also felt self-indulgent and far less original/creative than its director thought it was (Fern Gully in Space, anyone?). I also wasn't keen on Spielberg's recent stuff. I think the Hollywood machine is being held back by this tenacious crop of old men who aren't letting in new talent (take Alien 5, for instance).

To be fair, it's possibly the same in the business world in general (my mother's generation seems to be hogging all the top jobs with the best pay, and few of them want to budge). Originally, the Alien movies were a springboard for new talent. What are the chances of a first time director getting his or her hands on a new Alien movie now? Practically zero.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 04, 2017, 04:14:45 PM
I agree, I too think he should retire from directing, but I think the skills are still there for him to continue as producer.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: bb-15 on Nov 04, 2017, 05:00:49 PM
Quote from: SM on Nov 04, 2017, 01:22:56 AM
Fox spent $150m on Blade Runner 2049?

Not WB and Sony?

Oops! Sorry my mistake;

The "BR 2049" production companies were: Warner Bros. · Columbia Pictures · Alcon Entertainment.

I'll add a couple of PSs to my above posts!

------------------------

Quote from: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 04, 2017, 03:41:04 PMMaybe he's had his day. It's not just him. I wasn't a fan of Avatar, which also felt self-indulgent and far less original/creative than its director thought it was (Fern Gully in Space, anyone?). I also wasn't keen on Spielberg's recent stuff. I think the Hollywood machine is being held back by this tenacious crop of old men who aren't letting new talent (take Alien 5, for instance).
Originally, the Alien movies were a springboard for new talent. What are the chances of a first time director getting his or her hands on a new Alien movie now? Practically zero.

The problem for Hollywood and big budget serious science fiction films is that not very many directors can do it and make a profit.
That is why Hollywood is looking for the few directors who have a proven track record with serious science fiction movies.
There is huge pressure because studios don't like to lose money.
As a result, many directors (some big names) either stay away from those projects and often why new directors aren't given the job.
- Take David Fincher. "Alien 3" was a horrible experience for him and since its release he wants nothing to do with the franchise or the genre. With newer directors the studio will often interfere and some directors don't want to deal with that.
- Serious science fiction movies are expensive making it hard to make a profit compared with a low budget indie film.
So, serious science fiction movies often flop.
- This is why imo Tarantino hasn't done serious science fiction.

Back to "BR 2049", it looks like it will be a flop.
- Other famous serious SF movie flops?
"Sunshine", "Children of Men", "Star Trek: Nemesis", "Cloud Atlas", "Life" and so on.
   
Or serious science fiction which had so so box office performance.
"Edge of Tomorrow" with box office at only 2x its production budget.
Same level of performance with "Chappie".

* Cameron, Spielberg, Nolan, Abrams and Scott all have had serious science fiction films that made money.
It makes sense that when the studios are considering funding a serious science fiction movie that those directors with a proven track record would be considered. 

----------------------

Quote from: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 04, 2017, 11:07:23 AM
Looks like Ridley may soon be leaving the franchise behind again (thankfully): https://movieweb.com/alien-franchise-over-ridley-scott/

Imo, that's not what Ridley said. If he does a sequel to "Covenant", it would be in the Alien franchise.
- It just would not have the Xenomorph (or very little of it).
Why? The fanbase is split. One group of fans did not want the Xenomorph back (see Jay Bauman, in the Red Letter Media review).
Instead this part of the fanbase wanted another film more like "Prometheus" (with Engineers and very little about Xenomorphs).
- I know that a lot of fans hate "Prometheus" (I've argued with a lot of them over the years, LOL) but again, the fanbase is split.

Anyway, we'll see what the studio decides.

;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Nov 05, 2017, 04:29:12 AM
Get better writers, and keep the budget low.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 05, 2017, 07:22:48 AM
Quote from: monkeylove on Nov 03, 2017, 01:42:06 PM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Nov 02, 2017, 11:26:18 PM
Powered by, all right, but "reason" wasn't the word I had in mind. . . .  ;)

Once you can counter my arguments, then you make such assumptions.

There's nothing for me to counter. You already admitted error and apologized you can't even keep up with the conversation between you and I. I made no such mention regarding studios breaking even. But now somehow you have convinced yourself in your mind I'm disagreeing with that. You're arguing with yourself now.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: adambeyoncelowe on Nov 05, 2017, 11:19:36 AM
I disagree that SF always has to cost a lot. Sometimes it does. Sometimes it doesn't. But the creative industries in general are about risk. Many movies, books and so on, lose money. It's worse in publishing, but only about 51% of films make money (https://stephenfollows.com/hollywood-movies-make-a-profit/).

The problem is that Hollywood is increasingly unwilling to take risks. That's why we see endless sequels, more and more superhero movies, and a glut of same-ness on-screen. In theory this should mean an Alien film would be a good decision--but the last few outings haven't been the cash-cows studios wanted and studio vacillation means loads of money is wasted (look at Alien 3 and how much they wasted before they even started filming).

Also, you simply can't discount the fact that Ridley isn't producing his best work any more. The script for Prometheus was awful, and the script for Covenant felt like two films squashed together. Why didn't he realise this at any point? It makes me question his judgement. The visuals were still good but he's apparently got no sense for story, which is concerning for a director.

Fresh blood might be what we need. But then again, what the studio wants and what the audience wants are two entirely different things. Maybe it's that that's the biggest problem? Until we're on the same side again, we might continue to get naff Alien films.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: SM on Nov 05, 2017, 08:06:07 PM
They took a risk with the first film before sequels followed.  Hollywood aren't "increasingly" making sequels - they've been doing it for decades.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Nov 06, 2017, 03:03:48 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Nov 05, 2017, 07:22:48 AM
There's nothing for me to counter. You already admitted error and apologized you can't even keep up with the conversation between you and I. I made no such mention regarding studios breaking even. But now somehow you have convinced yourself in your mind I'm disagreeing with that. You're arguing with yourself now.  :laugh:

I never admitted error, and my apology is a figure of speech. You did not refer to breaking even, but there is no difference between that and a minimal gain, which is your argument.

Companies don't shelve projects because the competition has something better. Minimal gain across many minor projects still leads to a minimal gain for the company because profitability is measured using a percentage. And just because a company will work on projects that earn less in parallel with those that earn more doesn't mean it will accept minimal gains overall in the long run.

Ultimately, as we explained earlier, for-profit businesses work to maximize profits, and the reasons are obvious: they are competing with other companies and want to gain market share by expanding operations (among others), and their investors want the best returns on their investment. None of these can happen given the perception that their main goal is simply to attain a profit, no matter how small it is.




Quote from: SM on Nov 05, 2017, 08:06:07 PM
They took a risk with the first film before sequels followed.  Hollywood aren't "increasingly" making sequels - they've been doing it for decades.

Exactly, and even that is connected to the points that we've been raising. Sequels, prequels, reboots, remakes, spinoffs, etc., for established franchises generally have faster development time. Hollywood hasn't been engaged in such simply because it wants to make fans happy, or break even, or even make a small profit. Large amounts of money are up for investment and studios are competing with each other several times a year, which is why they have to spend large amounts to peddle tent poles on a global scale, with smaller projects released during dump months. Obviously, the goal is to maximize profits.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 06, 2017, 03:30:23 AM
Quote from: monkeylove on Nov 06, 2017, 03:03:48 AM
I never admitted error.....
Yes you did. You don't have to say the words when evidence in your posts...... ;D

Quote from: monkeylove on Nov 06, 2017, 03:03:48 AM
my apology is a figure of speech.
I think the logic in your arguments are impressive.

(Btw, when I say impressive, it's just a figure of speech. It's real meaning is not the praise you might think it is.........;) )

Hint: Your posted apology is EVIDENCE you were admitting ERROR.......Catching on yet?

Quote from: monkeylove on Nov 06, 2017, 03:03:48 AM
You did not refer to breaking even, but there is no difference between that and a minimal gain, which is your argument.
LOL! He just can't stop putting words in my mouth. Not only did I not mention breaking even, you are in ERROR I made any mention about "minimal gain."

(I think I will just sit back and watch monkeylove argue with monkeylove until he blows himself out.  :P)

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Nov 07, 2017, 01:32:38 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Nov 06, 2017, 03:30:23 AM
Yes you did. You don't have to say the words when evidence in your posts...... ;D

It's a figure of speech. Also, why do you keep ignoring my point that a minimal gain is just as bad as breaking even?

Quote
I think the logic in your arguments are impressive.


(Btw, when I say impressive, it's just a figure of speech. It's real meaning is not the praise you might think it is.........;) )

Hint: Your posted apology is EVIDENCE you were admitting ERROR.......Catching on yet?


Oh, the irony.  ::)

Quote
LOL! He just can't stop putting words in my mouth. Not only did I not mention breaking even, you are in ERROR I made any mention about "minimal gain."

(I think I will just sit back and watch monkeylove argue with monkeylove until he blows himself out.  :P)

You finally get to address at least one of my counter-arguments.

Here's what you wrote in

http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=57436.msg2255180#msg2255180

QuoteBut....I was also involved in hundreds of minor projects. Small profit gain projects, but in reality, their accumulative return as a whole, was the bulk of the corporation's annual income. From mini-projects that required less than a week of work, to mid-size projects requiring more time....and various levels of minor projects in between.

That's what I mean by "minimal gain," but let's use your term.

The problem with this argument is that profitability is measured by a percentage, which means it doesn't matter if there are hundreds of small profit gain projects, the sum is still a small profit gain.

Given that, if a studio makes, say, a 1-percent profit margin on average for all of its projects (major and minor), then it makes only a 1-percent profit margin as a whole. If half of the funding for these projects came from investors who were promised, say, a 7-percent return, what happens now?

And don't forget the corporate tax.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 07, 2017, 02:44:38 AM
I see.

So.....how about an update. Who's winning the argument between monkeylove and.......monkeylove?

You?.......or....You?  :laugh:
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Alionic on Nov 07, 2017, 05:04:21 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Nov 07, 2017, 02:44:38 AM
I see.

So.....how about an update. Who's winning the argument between monkeylove and.......monkeylove?

You?.......or....You?  :laugh:

It takes two to tango, kiddo.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 07, 2017, 12:01:10 PM
Quote from: Alionic on Nov 07, 2017, 05:04:21 AM
It takes two to tango, kiddo.

If you're not going to bother reading the conversation and see where he's making up crap just so he can argue with himself, then you stick your nose in here and dish out a lame irrelevant quote, it's your own fault you now have crap on your shoes, junior. . . . . ;)
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Nov 07, 2017, 12:48:36 PM
Gentlemen...this isn't a playground.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 07, 2017, 12:51:22 PM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Nov 07, 2017, 12:48:36 PM
Gentlemen...this isn't a playground.

Well, now in all fairness, you can see earlier I advised him to just let it go.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Corporal Hicks on Nov 07, 2017, 01:49:20 PM
If he wants to argue with himself, let him. There's no need to respond to him.
Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: monkeylove on Nov 08, 2017, 06:57:34 AM
Quote from: Biomechanoid on Nov 07, 2017, 12:51:22 PM

Well, now in all fairness, you can see earlier I advised him to just let it go.

Let go of what? How many times does this have to be explained to you? There is no difference between Alien: Covenant breaking even and make a small gain because the arguments used to counter the claim that Fox Studios is happy enough to break even is the SAME as those to counter the claim that Fox Studios is happy enough to earn a bit.

Given that, I didn't apologize or admit that I made a mistake in what I've said. If any, I've countered every point you raised. But you keep responding, first by claiming that I apologized (which I didn't), that you didn't mean to argue that the studio is happy enough to make a small gain (which you did, and based on wrong reasoning), and now that I'm simply arguing with myself, which even one member countered for me. Not only have you FAILED to address any of my points, you are now attacking others.

That's it: adding you to my ignore list.

Title: Re: Alien: Covenant Box Office Performance
Post by: Biomechanoid on Nov 08, 2017, 07:25:51 AM
Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Nov 07, 2017, 01:49:20 PM
If he wants to argue with himself, let him.

Good point. He's still rehashing his arguments no one is disputing but himself.

Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Nov 07, 2017, 01:49:20 PM
There's no need to respond to him.

I know first hand moderating forums can be a dark road of nightmares at times, so I will honor your request. Good luck in dealing with trolls in the future.