Jean-Pierre Jeunet: Joss Whedon Movies Are for 'Morons' and 'American Geeks'
Jeunet directed "Alien: Resurrection" from a script by Whedon, who previously called the movie "unwatchable."
QuoteJean-Pierre Jeunet is having the final word in his long-running feud with Joss Whedon.
After Whedon criticized Jeunet's directorship for the 1997 film "Alien: Resurrection," which Whedon wrote the script for, Jeunet slammed Whedon's work as being only "for morons," which, according to Jeunet, is most of the MCU fandom. Whedon previously said that "Alien: Resurrection" did everything "wrong" when it came to casting, scoring, and more, deeming it "almost unwatchable" (per Joss Whedon's biography).
"I know Joss Whedon said some bad things about me," Oscar nominee Jeunet recently told The Independent. "I don't care. I know if Joss Whedon had made the film himself, it probably would have been a big success. He's very good at making films for American geeks, something for morons."
The "Amélie" director continued, "Because he's very good at making Marvel films. I hate this kind of movie. It's so silly, so stupid."
"Alien: Resurrection" grossed $161 million worldwide against a budget of $70 million, with Jeunet suffering poor reviews at the time for his American studio debut. (He has not made a movie in Hollywood since.)
Whedon said in a past interview that, with "Alien: Resurrection," "They said the lines... mostly... but they said them all wrong. And they cast it wrong. And they designed it wrong. And they scored it wrong. They did everything wrong that they could possibly do. It wasn't so much that they'd changed the script – it's that they just executed it in such a ghastly fashion as to render it almost unwatchable."
Whedon directed the first two "Avengers" films in the MCU, 2012's "Avengers Assemble" and 2015's "Avengers: Age of Ultron." Whedon also took over "Justice League" after Zack Snyder stepped down. Since then, Whedon has faced toxic workplace allegations from "Justice League" stars Gal Gadot and Ray Fisher, as well as former "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" actresses.
The quality of Marvel movies has also been a debate in recent years, with auteurs like Martin Scorsese and Francis Ford Coppola calling the MCU akin to "theme parks" on the big screen. "Alien" director Ridley Scott said superhero films are "boring as shit" and shared his take on what "superhero movies" really are.
https://www.indiewire.com/2022/10/jean-pierre-jeunet-joss-whedon-movies-morons-1234777134/
They're both right.
QuoteJeunet slammed Whedon's work as being only "for morons," which, according to Jeunet, is most of the MCU fandom.
(https://i.giphy.com/media/UTFiHeDL8cOSA/giphy.webp)
Dang, Jeunet over here starting beef with fans now. Childish.
It's funny because the script is the only bad part of the movie.
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Oct 28, 2022, 09:21:12 PMIt's funny because the script is the only bad part of the movie.
Yep, this.
Eat my f**k! >:(
No thx
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Oct 28, 2022, 09:21:12 PMIt's funny because the script is the only bad part of the movie.
And the Dutch angle zooms.
They shoulda got Terry Gilliam to direct. Or Sam Raimi.
Why do you hate me.
Quote from: SiL on Oct 29, 2022, 12:57:17 AMQuote from: [cancerblack] on Oct 28, 2022, 09:21:12 PMIt's funny because the script is the only bad part of the movie.
And the Dutch angle zooms.
Those don't bother me at all, but your mileage obviously varies.
Quote from: SiL on Oct 29, 2022, 03:30:07 AMWhy do you hate me.
Because you're letting ralfy win. >:(
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 29, 2022, 01:10:52 AMThey shoulda got Terry Gilliam to direct. Or Sam Raimi.
I still maintain that if they took the 'Alien3' "wooden planet" script, changed it up so it's not an official capital-A Alien movie and just had a different (new) monster, and let Gilliam direct it, it'd be a hell of a movie.
Quote from: Xenomrph on Oct 29, 2022, 07:47:35 AMQuote from: Local Trouble on Oct 29, 2022, 01:10:52 AMThey shoulda got Terry Gilliam to direct. Or Sam Raimi.
I still maintain that if they took the 'Alien3' "wooden planet" script, changed it up so it's not an official capital-A Alien movie and just had a different (new) monster, and let Gilliam direct it, it'd be a hell of a movie.
This right here!
(https://s4.gifyu.com/images/im-watching-you-watching-youf068b8b30b0e75d3.gif)
Quote from: Nightmare Asylum on Oct 28, 2022, 07:31:47 PM"I hate this kind of movie. It's so silly, so stupid."
Is it wrong of me that I imagine this being said in the thickest and most stereotypical of French accents?
Not at all.
"The casting was all wrong!"
Joss, most of the worst stuff in that movie came from Ripley, so just keep on talkin'. :D
Lol, but it has some "marvelisms" from Jeunet himself.
The last point from the quote is important, i.e., from Scorsese, Coppola, and Scott. It's not just in superhero movies but many Hollywood movies: cardboard cutout characters, lack of character development leading to unsympathetic protagonists, a heavy reliance on spectacle instead of a buildup leading to that, and recently a strong emphasis on forcing woke agendas.
Some of these problems have shown up in some of the recent movies in the Alien and Predator franchises, and it's possible that even if directors and writers try to avoid these issues they show up because producers force changes to stories.
Quote from: ralfy on Nov 20, 2022, 01:56:04 AMThe last point from the quote is important, i.e., from Scorsese, Coppola, and Scott. It's not just in superhero movies but many Hollywood movies: cardboard cutout characters, lack of character development leading to unsympathetic protagonists, a heavy reliance on spectacle instead of a buildup leading to that, and recently a strong emphasis on forcing woke agendas.
But don't you really like Prometheus and Covenant?
More wokeisms yes pls
And when you ask people what they mean by "wokism" it basically boils down to "casting people who aren't straight white dudes"
Juanet is right, Whedon is a hack. I hated him before it was cool.
Quote from: SiL on Nov 20, 2022, 10:02:53 AMAnd when you ask petite what they mean by "wokism" it basically boils down to "casting people who aren't straight white dudes"
inb4 Danny Glover or Carl Weathers gets posted.
No see they were ok because there's absolutely no political messaging in those films. None.
Yes, that's the argument that's always made when they're brought up in the context of Prey being woke, so I inb4'd the inevitable post.
To be fair, something like Paper Girls delivered like 5 "woke" points in an awkward manner, almost 4th wall breaking. There wasn't anything really subtle about it. It's a matter of show don't tell for a lot of people that have that complaint. Not every criticism comes from a place of hate.
I don't care if a movie has a woke agenda. Show me, don't tell me.
Paper Girls ended up being pretty good and had some good character development, amidst some narrative chaos lol.
And yes, there are some sad people that complain about castings because they don't like a certain race, but there is another side of the coin where dislike or criticism of a movie or show is lumped into racism/misogyny (The Last Jedi is a good example). There is some idiotic toxicity on both sides. And then there is the 99% in between those two ends of the discussion. It's not all black and white.
Yeah, although I don't use the right websites to have been called a chud for thinking the Star Wars movies are dogshit, while I've had to hear ad nauseam about how Prey is the woke agenda at work. I know which of those two extremes gets up in my grill more often and it's not the rabid left, as silly as they can get.
Quote from: Local Trouble on Nov 20, 2022, 02:08:45 AMQuote from: ralfy on Nov 20, 2022, 01:56:04 AMThe last point from the quote is important, i.e., from Scorsese, Coppola, and Scott. It's not just in superhero movies but many Hollywood movies: cardboard cutout characters, lack of character development leading to unsympathetic protagonists, a heavy reliance on spectacle instead of a buildup leading to that, and recently a strong emphasis on forcing woke agendas.
But don't you really like Prometheus and Covenant?
I didn't like them because for the first there are problems with writing such that one can't sympathize with the protagonists. The problem with the second is that it rehashes the first and second movies, with the protagonist even looking like Ripley, and with attempts to create the same blue-collar atmosphere, e.g., instead of Dallas, Tennessee, with cowboy hats and early '70s pop songs.
I think what they should have done was retain the grimy atmosphere of the first movies, then figure out how to incorporate the "origin" elements. The second would have probably required a lot of development time, with much of it spent on writing and rewriting.
Whedon can do well as long as he doesn't receive pressure from producers who focus more on audience sweet spots or political agendas. Maybe one can consider his earlier works, like
Firefly, or go back to the older
Alien and
Predator movies and see what made them notable: well-developed characters, blue-collar backgrounds (space truckers, grunts, expendable spec ops soldiers, overwhelmed cops), a careful buildup, vulnerabilities of protagonists emphasized in order to avoid Mary or Gary Sue scenarios, amoral corporate antagonists (with some giving arguments related to amorality and pragmatic ethics), etc.
Why can't these guys just laugh it off? The film turned out a bit shit, who cares? There's arguably been worse shit put out since.
Quote from: PsyKore on Nov 21, 2022, 07:51:33 AMWhy can't these guys just laugh it off? The film turned out a bit shit, who cares? There's arguably been worse shit put out since.
I have no idea, although I actually quite like the end result, probably because I like Jeunet flicks in general. I think Whedon is the genuinely salty one while frenchie is just dismissive and a tad bit snarky, which fits with what I know of both of them tbh.
Quote"I know Joss Whedon said some bad things about me," Oscar nominee Jeunet recently told The Independent. "I don't care. I know if Joss Whedon had made the film himself, it probably would have been a big success. He's very good at making films for American geeks, something for morons."
The "Amélie" director continued, "Because he's very good at making Marvel films. I hate this kind of movie. It's so silly, so stupid."
My estimation of Jean-Pierre Jeunet has just increased exponentially.
Based JPJ.
JPJ was the best part of Alien resurrection. love his camera work and color palette.
Alien resurrection is perhaps the worst alien movie, but it is not a bad movie.
And honestly, I think Prometheus is way worse.
Quote from: bobby brown on Dec 14, 2022, 03:28:53 PMAnd honestly, I think Prometheus is way worse.
Resurrection is better because it excels at what it was trying to achieve—and that's the problem.
Prometheus is worse because it fails at what it was trying to achieve—and that's a bigger problem.
Quote from: [cancerblack] on Nov 20, 2022, 10:25:56 AMQuote from: SiL on Nov 20, 2022, 10:02:53 AMAnd when you ask petite what they mean by "wokism" it basically boils down to "casting people who aren't straight white dudes"
inb4 Danny Glover or Carl Weathers gets posted.
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/3b1JW7LxfsAKs/giphy.gif)
Quote from: Local Trouble on Oct 28, 2022, 07:35:15 PMThey're both right.
THIS.
It's like neither party had ever seen an Alien movie before.