Pietro Scalia Talks Editing Alien: Covenant

[Corporal Hicks]

That'd be the one, Eighth.

[𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱𝔥 𝔓𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔯]

Very close call then, matter of hours. I remember you being very flabbergasted at why it wasn't released.

[newagescamartist]

Sorry, Pietro, but your editing ruined another Ridley movie. He's a damn butcher. He needs to stop trying to fix stories in the editing room. He did the same to Prometheus, thinking that the structure needed fixing when it didn't. Having flawless pacing and a balanced structure is secondary to tracking the story in the way that allows the audience the deepest experience.

Well I'm sorry to tell you, that regardless of who is editing the film, it had to be just under 2 hours per Fox's Contractual Order. It was in contract to be under 2 hours. Besides it sounds to me like he fought to have more themes kept in the story. It's a hard job given the restrictions and restraints of director , studio and all of the above. If you have problems with either film he is not to blame.

THIS!!! THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS.

It's like NO ONE understands that ^^^^^THIS^^^^^^ is the reason the movie is the way it is. Stop bickering and wasting your time. You aren't understanding that this is an industry issue. Its about runtime. Almost everything that wasn't good in this AND Prometheus were because of a contractual obligation to limit the length of the film. All of this bickering and finger pointing - its just because an R-RATED 100mil$ film cannot be 2.5 hours long and risk not making its money back. The editor was just doing his job. If anything the problem is that they need to write a 1.5 hour script so Ridley and his editors can keep the pace fleshed out.

Also there is nothing Scalia's interview that says there are 12 additional minutes of SHAW footage specifically. He says more stuff that bridges the gap, totaling 12 minutes. This includes what is already IN the film and the Prologue. You are assuming that means more scenes with Shaw. It doesn't. It may be slightly extended Prologue or etc but we also know that the opening Prologue with David was initially longer, for instance.
So a longer Prologue, possibly a slightly longer version of The Crossing, and the scene with David bombing the Engineers all included in that 12 minutes. He didn't say "12 additional minutes of Shaw and David on Paradise doing a bunch of stuff youve never seen." At best, there may be an additional scene or a viral that never got released.

I'm still waiting to see verification of this, but either way it's not logical and mostly nonsense. The new Transformers was much longer and was considered an event film. It failed to deliver the strong box office that was expected, but no one is blaming the run time. If what you're saying is true then Fox has no idea what they're doing ( debatable, for sure ). Usually if a movie is going to be so big that a theatre is selling out multiple showings they just get a few more screens lol.

[Highland]

I'm sitting on the fence. I think it does seem quite logical that they would cut it in under 2 hours. One thing that bothers me is that Scott says he doesn't listen or read reviews yet Covenant is clearly an about face in reaction to Prometheus. That itself doesn't make sense since Prometheus made a lot of money and also got good reviews (better if we are being picky).

I don't think it's an unrealistic claim to think that someone demanded the movie be cut short. Particularly given that the scenes that are missing are not just sweeping shots of mountains or useless dialog, the scenes in question sound like important plot points. I would again agree that there is something "fishy" with the complete removal of Shaw from almost all live scenes and would not be surprised if just using an image of her dead body was somehow contractually benificial. I don't buy the storyline guff unless they wanted to completely cut all connections with Prom.

Transformers is going to make a zillion dollars no matter what just purely because there is big stuff making big explosions.

[SM]

Fox sought to address audience and critical feedback from Prometheus.  Ridley was obviously on board with it, otherwise he would've left and done something else.

[BishopShouldGo]

I'm sitting on the fence. I think it does seem quite logical that they would cut it in under 2 hours. One thing that bothers me is that Scott says he doesn't listen or read reviews yet Covenant is clearly an about face in reaction to Prometheus. That itself doesn't make sense since Prometheus made a lot of money and also got good reviews (better if we are being picky).

I don't think it's an unrealistic claim to think that someone demanded the movie be cut short. Particularly given that the scenes that are missing are not just sweeping shots of mountains or useless dialog, the scenes in question sound like important plot points. I would again agree that there is something "fishy" with the complete removal of Shaw from almost all live scenes and would not be surprised if just using an image of her dead body was somehow contractually benificial. I don't buy the storyline guff unless they wanted to completely cut all connections with Prom.

Transformers is going to make a zillion dollars no matter what just purely because there is big stuff making big explosions.

Lol yeah but what everyone is trying to get at is that it's all conjecture unless someone can provide concrete proof.

[Nostromo]

Absolutely not? What was so good about that part? Who hired this moron?

Congrats on the worst editing job ever performed.

This.

[CainsSon]

Sorry, Pietro, but your editing ruined another Ridley movie. He's a damn butcher. He needs to stop trying to fix stories in the editing room. He did the same to Prometheus, thinking that the structure needed fixing when it didn't. Having flawless pacing and a balanced structure is secondary to tracking the story in the way that allows the audience the deepest experience.

Well I'm sorry to tell you, that regardless of who is editing the film, it had to be just under 2 hours per Fox's Contractual Order. It was in contract to be under 2 hours. Besides it sounds to me like he fought to have more themes kept in the story. It's a hard job given the restrictions and restraints of director , studio and all of the above. If you have problems with either film he is not to blame.

THIS!!! THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS.

It's like NO ONE understands that ^^^^^THIS^^^^^^ is the reason the movie is the way it is. Stop bickering and wasting your time. You aren't understanding that this is an industry issue. Its about runtime. Almost everything that wasn't good in this AND Prometheus were because of a contractual obligation to limit the length of the film. All of this bickering and finger pointing - its just because an R-RATED 100mil$ film cannot be 2.5 hours long and risk not making its money back. The editor was just doing his job. If anything the problem is that they need to write a 1.5 hour script so Ridley and his editors can keep the pace fleshed out.

Also there is nothing Scalia's interview that says there are 12 additional minutes of SHAW footage specifically. He says more stuff that bridges the gap, totaling 12 minutes. This includes what is already IN the film and the Prologue. You are assuming that means more scenes with Shaw. It doesn't. It may be slightly extended Prologue or etc but we also know that the opening Prologue with David was initially longer, for instance.
So a longer Prologue, possibly a slightly longer version of The Crossing, and the scene with David bombing the Engineers all included in that 12 minutes. He didn't say "12 additional minutes of Shaw and David on Paradise doing a bunch of stuff youve never seen." At best, there may be an additional scene or a viral that never got released.

I'm still waiting to see verification of this, but either way it's not logical and mostly nonsense. The new Transformers was much longer and was considered an event film. It failed to deliver the strong box office that was expected, but no one is blaming the run time. If what you're saying is true then Fox has no idea what they're doing ( debatable, for sure ). Usually if a movie is going to be so big that a theatre is selling out multiple showings they just get a few more screens lol.

You dont have to wait for verification. It was the same story with Prometheus. R-Rated films at a 100million + is completely unheard of. There simply is NO OTHER FRANCHISE that produces 100million dollar+ R-Rated films. TRANSFORMERS is marketable to 7 year olds. Its Rated PG-13, and anyone can see it without supervision. Its a false comparison. TRANSFORMERS is not at the same degree of risk of not making its money back. An R-Rated film thats as long as TRANSFORMERS, would play in less theaters, and has far less showtimes per day. This is why the ALIEN FILM is 2 hours and is contracted to be 2 hours. Because FOX wont take that risk and the turnout for this is verification of their rightness. If Alien:Covenant would have been 2.5 hours it would result in one entire less showtime every 8 hours. That's 2 less showtimes per day, per theatre, as per most multiplexes, and it results in much less profit for the theatre and the studio. If each showtime in a theatre amounted to 20 million dollars, thats the difference between 80million a day and 60 million per day, Thats a substantial risk to take over adding 20 minutes of additional footage to keep fans happy. TRANSFORMERS on the other hand, with its PG13 rating will automatically open in far more theaters. In fact TRANSFORMERS opened in 4,132 theatres in the US this week. Alien Covenant opened in 3,761. Thats because of its R rating, which doesnt fill seats. If it had been 2.5 hours long, it would have been detrimental to FOX's bottom line.
Waiting for confirmation of this is silly. This is a film industry fact. R-rated films at this budget do not exist and never have. This is legitimately the ONLY franchise of its caliber at a consistent R Rating.
Do I think this HURT the film? ABSOLUTELY. Do I think FOX should have taken the risk? You bet I do. Will they? Unlikely. They will just try and make the next film for cheaper.
Fans need to take this stuff into consideration and understand why they arent getting what they wish they'd were. The real solution is to write 1.5 hour scripts that allow Scott an additional half hour to be more exacting with pace.

[SM]

Who says it's a fact?

[Highland]

Fox sought to address audience and critical feedback from Prometheus.  Ridley was obviously on board with it, otherwise he would've left and done something else.

Sure, but why? Its like the studio just doubled down the chips and lost more the second time. I'd say the general feeling not just in the boards is that half the people didn't really like Covenant either and wanted Prometheus to follow on. So now you've got some weird situation where you've just managed to still only please 50% of the audience. Many of the things that Prometheus was slated for are still present in Covenant.

I think that's reflected in the sharp drop off at the box office. Prometheus did really well, it got generally positive reviews.

[SM]

Why?  To get better returns I suppose since a lot of people were disappointed that there wasn't an actual Alien in Prometheus.

It may be that they thought 'Prometheus did well, but people really wanted Alien.  So we don't completely abandon Prometheus, but we include things to satisfy the Alien crowd'.

They kinda pleased both judging on the overall reaction, but did please either enough.

[CainsSon]

Who says it's a fact?

It is an industry fact that R-Rated films are not produced at 100 million + budgets because their audience and ability to fill seats is limited and this is the only franchise that has ever been able to pull that off. It is also an industry fact that films longer than 2 hours are frowned upon by Hollywood because they make less money / have less ability to make money because they have less showtimes per day. Aliens, the only exception in this franchise, is the exception proving the rule. It wasnt made cheaply, and it rode the coattails of the smash hit that was ALIEN at a time when Low Budget R Rated films actually had a theatrical release. This is simply unheard of today and we should be singing praise to Alien Covenant and Prometheus for even existing with an R-Rating and making money.  Alien is the most successful horror franchise of all time.

[Highland]

Why?  To get better returns I suppose since a lot of people were disappointed that there wasn't an actual Alien in Prometheus.

It may be that they thought 'Prometheus did well, but people really wanted Alien.  So we don't completely abandon Prometheus, but we include things to satisfy the Alien crowd'.

They kinda pleased both judging on the overall reaction, but did please either enough.

I'm not sure there ever was an Alien crowd when it comes to Prometheus. I think the general feeling at the time was more "whats all this about then?" Rather than where's the Alien.

Something tells me Blade runner is going to smash it at the box office and it's not because it'll have cool action sequences and quick pacing. For me they have not identified the group that watch these movies correctly. Covenant is like you say a sort of hybrid smart movie trying to be a popcorn flick at the same time but really doesn't achieve either.

[tleilaxu]

Who says it's a fact?

It is an industry fact that R-Rated films are not produced at 100 million + budgets because their audience and ability to fill seats is limited and this is the only franchise that has ever been able to pull that off. It is also an industry fact that films longer than 2 hours are frowned upon by Hollywood because they make less money / have less ability to make money because they have less showtimes per day. Aliens, the only exception in this franchise, is the exception proving the rule. It wasnt made cheaply, and it rode the coattails of the smash hit that was ALIEN at a time when Low Budget R Rated films actually had a theatrical release. This is simply unheard of today and we should be singing praise to Alien Covenant and Prometheus for even existing with an R-Rating and making money.  Alien is the most successful horror franchise of all time.

What about Logan?
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=wolverine2017.htm
I'll grant you that it's a different situation because of the capeshit association, but still.

[SM]

Or Fury Road?  Or The Revenant?

I'm not sure there ever was an Alien crowd when it comes to Prometheus. I think the general feeling at the time was more "whats all this about then?" Rather than where's the Alien.

There were a lot of people who assumed an Alien prequel was going to have Aliens in it, despite a lot of pre-release stuff saying it wasn't a strict Alien prequel.

I dunno about Blade Runner.  I think it looks sweet and hope it kills, but I'm not sure it's going do big business.