Missing the Point - AvPGalaxy Podcast #35

Started by Corporal Hicks, Apr 20, 2016, 05:33:49 PM

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Missing the Point - AvPGalaxy Podcast #35 (Read 9,085 times)

DarkXeno

Prometheus just kinda expanded upon the universe. I didn't like it as much. The idea was cool, but the idea wasn't fleshed out enough for me to like the movie.
Too many plot holes.

Corporal Hicks

Quote from: Primordial on Apr 24, 2016, 06:18:49 PM
Making the Space Jockey relatable to us, making him a giant humanoid, is missing the point, yes. I mean, even if they took the same route of it (SJ) being a suit, but with an unseen, bizarre lifeform inside, it would easily have our approval. As stated by David Levy in 'The Furious Gods', people working on 'Prometheus' not liking the Engineer as the SJ at first and then finally liking him is more of a diplomatic answer (well, that's what I like to think!)
I prefer the SJ fused with the chair but how can this concept make its way in the movie, also knowing that Ridley has a penchant for pratical effects ?

I prefer the old Lovecraftian sense behind the Space Jockey. Though I don't mind the Ancient Astronaut angle. I never have minded those panspermia angles. I don't think it needed to be related to humanity in such a straight forward way though as it loses that sense of wonder a bit, I think.

QuoteI often think that 'Prometheus' started extremely well with the giant saucer giving a sense a great intensity and 'alienness', especially when it verticalised, it was kind of a implicit promise that says ''hang on to your seat, we will do the rest'' but it was put on hold from that point...

That being said, it is funny how I can find many weak points to this movie but still I do appreciate it very much.

There's a lot in Prometheus I do really enjoy. But I just find the entire experience, especially the narrative, to be quite frustrating.

Quote from: SiL on Apr 25, 2016, 12:02:56 AM
We did try to avoid throwing shit on any one person -- or even the movies themselves -- because of how much of a collaborative effort the thing is. I think we even mention when talking about Prometheus that we aren't saying any one person f**ked up, just that the final product had a lot of serious issues.

I actually find it hard to outright dislike Prometheus, too. Lots of faults, but still a good ride.

We certainly did. We made a point of it, I believe.

Valaquen

Loved the discussion, guys.

XenoHunter99

Another good listen. I like SiL's passion.  :D

Primordial

Quote from: Perfect-Organism on Apr 24, 2016, 07:43:13 PM
Same here.  I damn well enjoy this film.  I understand it's shortcomings, and because I enjoy it so much, I find myself making excuses for it, and rationalizations.  Hopefully the next installment will justify some of that.

We should continue to act this way, as long as we don't become some blind advocates who deny the undeniable.  :)

Quote from: Corporal Hicks on Apr 25, 2016, 08:46:24 AM
Quote from: SiL on Apr 25, 2016, 12:02:56 AM
We did try to avoid throwing shit on any one person -- or even the movies themselves -- because of how much of a collaborative effort the thing is. I think we even mention when talking about Prometheus that we aren't saying any one person f**ked up, just that the final product had a lot of serious issues.

I actually find it hard to outright dislike Prometheus, too. Lots of faults, but still a good ride.

We certainly did. We made a point of it, I believe.

Yes, totally, especially given the fact that you guys mentionned it several times. I should have clarified that this wasn't specific about the podcast, sorry for that. I probably developped an allergy to the internet's Lindelof bashing :D. You know, I came out of the cinema so enchanted after the first viewing and so eager to see other people's reaction on forums, that the repetition of nasty comments about him brought me down a couple of times. I can get oversensitive to injustice. He has so many interesting things to say in interviews.

Spooky799kil

I think AVP should only stay in other media. Every way I look at it just seems like a failure when you apply the premise to film. Though I only fan of AVP through the AVP games, generally AVP has only been successful in outside media with Video games, comics, novels, and fans. And thats where it should be.

oduodu

Sorry if I put someone on the spot but its the first time anywhere I actually heard anyone say that Lindelof actually was trying to be not overly "Lost" in his approach but Scott told him he should. That's a very important bit of info!

Its just that you get a better sense of how the actual creative process was driven to be and by whom and makes more easier to understand what might happen in a sequel. Especially if the same happens in the sequel. It was also Ridley who instructed Max to de Giger the designs. Its simply for me a case of forming a better understanding. As Sil pointed out a lot of the star wars prequels being criticized was due to Lucas having too much power and so also Ridley.

Thanks for pointing that out as it makes me understand much better where and how to look at it all.

Yes alien could exist without the mystery of the Space Jockey but I maintain that it wouldn't have had the staying power that it had. Even if it was only a backdrop to the main story.

It is my contention that Prometheus was trying to be over mysterious simply because that was what people were talking about all these years . Val wrote at some point that alien's staying power was due the SJ mystery. Perhaps that was what Scott intended to do by introducing many new mysteries but answering what the space jockey was but finding replacement mysteries that would keep people talking for many years. Too many mysteries perhaps and not expanded on. I mean the plot for me was definitely established in the movie itself  about one woman who desired to know why she was created and what our purpose was. People have more need of purpose in spite of all the technology that now exists. In Contact the character played by Matthew McConaughey asks/says the same thing. But does philosophical questions like this have a place in the alien franchise? Was that necessary? Wasn't that just a way of making it about us (the human race)?

As for miss marketing the movie I feel that was simply to get bums on seats and it worked.

PRJ_since1990

I listened to this pod today at work. It was nice to hear from another long time forum member like SiL. I know the cast is usually Corporal, Ridgetop & Xenomorphine + Guest so it's great to hear a mix of different people like HuDaFuk, Omegamorph and others.

While I did like SiL's take on breaking down the films to their core structures to analyze, I couldn't help but wonder if you [SiL] enjoy movies or if you can't help but get sidetracked thinking about all the aspects of film making mid-movie? Also, let Ridgetop finish his sentences! Sheesh lol

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