Alien 5 won't be titled Alien 5, won't tread on Prometheus 2

[BringbackJonesy!]

As far as why the assymetrical-shaped 'juggernaut' craft seen in PROMETHEUS is essentially the same design (give or take a few details) as the long-derelict one seen in a different place in ALIEN (and ALIENS)...it could be that the version seen in PROMETHEUS was made around the *same* era to begin with (along with the other similar ships presumably underneath the other mounds too).

In fact, ALL the technology that the PROMETHEUS crew find on LV-223 could be roughly as old as the 'juggernaut' seen in ALIEN for all we know...considering we *don't know* how long that surviving 'Engineer' was kept functioning in 'stasis'.  Judging by the many dessicated 'Engineer' bodies/'suits' that Millburn and Fifield come across, the whole complex is very, very old indeed - perhaps as old as the ALIEN 'derelict'.  The fact that everything is still functioning is unsurprising...considering the supposedly technologically-advanced nature of the otherworldly 'Engineers' and the unknown, weirdly-exotic materials and designs they have come up with - remember, the 'warning' signal that the crew of ALIEN came across was still working fine after however many years the 'derelict' had been there.  In addition, even the 'eggs' stored inside the hold of the 'derelict' still had a working layer of 'protection' over them, when Kane went to investigate.

(In fact, while it's still possible to just 'imagine' that the 'Space Jockey' seen in ALIEN was indeed the skeleton of a giant, 'snorkel-faced' alien creature of some sort, completely *separate* from the 'Engineer' race...if I had to compromise due to Ridley's 're-imagining' of Giger's original design, I guess I like the possibility that one of the 'Engineers' from the PROMETHEUS movie had managed to flee from the unknown 'outbreak' in one of the 'juggernauts' at the time, but was 'infected' beforehand...and consequently crashed on the planetoid seen in ALIEN soon after! )

However, even if the ships in ALIEN and PROMETHEUS were made in *different* eras to each other, I still like to think that the main reason that there are only minimal design changes to the 'U' shape of the 'juggernauts'...is the fact that the overall design was so successful to begin with, and that there was no need for the 'Engineers' to change things drastically whatsoever.  And given that the 'juggernauts' seem to be made of such exotic materials, these things were likely capable of lasting and working for many, many years - probably thousands, and perhaps millions...

Still, before PROMETHEUS came out, I recall imagining that it would perhaps be quite neat to see some other kind of 'Space Jockey' craft too, especially if there was some kind of 'fleet' shot in space of them all (which there wasn't, as it turned out )   For instance, I'd even imagined what a possible 'Mothership' might have looked like - a gigantic, non-spikey, 'Giger'-esque 'sea-urchin' shape which allowed for a group of 'Space Jockey' ships to emerge from an opening underneath.  Oh, and by the way, I'd also imagined these 'U'-shaped ships to spin around in a slow, boomerang-like way as they flew forwards... 

There's actually a bit of PROMETHEUS concept art which seems to show an alternative 'Engineer' ship design here -  http://www.avpgalaxy.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/192815_326268787470185_1113144400_o.jpg

However, it pales beside the strangeness of Giger's orginal assymetrical design, and only makes me wish that we'd seen another Giger-designed ship for the start of the movie, compared to the relatively standard-looking 'ufo' we ended up with.

[razeak]

I say don't explain anything about the ships differences. It's pretty easy to assume they are different designs, classes or what not. Not every rivet has to be explained. Why would they be the same any ways? Look at the ships on our Navy. There are tons of different designs.

[NetworkATTH]

Isn't that implied anyway? I always took it that the derelict was a much more ancient craft than the juggernaut, partially it's design and partially that it's carrying eggs, rather than a distillation of the eggs. Also of course the fact that it's implied to have rested on the planetoid for untold millennia rather than a couple of thousand years

Not necessarily true. Now, I'm no anthropologist, or geologist, biologist, or paleontologist. With Prometheus we're given that everything they make is biomechanical and etched from rock. Now we're given from here, the assumption everything works in the same biological logic that the craft from Alien has, it's biomechanical, still, in different states of preservation. But, the Pilot's chair in the Derelict is more decomposed and heavily bloated, the halls rotting to show the bones and skeletal structure. I just assume, that it was from 2000 years ago and not earlier, because the facilities are so close together, really. Aside from that, even though it's said it's fossilized, combined with the heavy environmental conditions of LV-426, the biological material making up the craft, with nothing to feed on, turned on itself (maybe in a natural mechanism to erase the craft from existence), and everything went in a state of decomposition, rapid mummification (I don't know how), and semi-fossilization. It's not entirely "fossil", it resembles more a mammoth found in ice than a fossil. It's bloated and white, but there are still shades of yellow, pink, and red on it.

While perhaps not carrying the urns, maybe it was carrying eggs? A strain of something. We don't exactly know they didn't do that, who knows, maybe the eggs themselves were once urns, urns that accidentally activated. I just don't think that it's entirely likely it's that old considering the distance from LV-426 and LV-223. Sure, they could have avoided it do to the distress beacon, like "Let's not go there, just avoid it', but I don't find it likely. The facility on LV-223 was, I'm assuming, strictly for Earth in whatever capacity, it wasn't for anything else as-far-as-we-know, if it was and existed for longer than humans, longer than 500,000 years, then you would have to explain how the rock hasn't eroded, been heavily weathered. So, in that scenario, the derelict lands first before the facility on LV-223 is established. It would be pretty unwise to build a facility near a containment breach.

Given everything, I find it more likely that the derelict was one of the craft that evacuated LV-223, but didn't make it. Why there are eggs instead of urns, I don't know.

[irn]

The Derelict certainly looks quite ancient, but if it's thousands of years older than what we saw in Prometheus, why does it look exactly the same?  You'd think that Engineer flight technology would have gotten better in that time.

To be fair they shouldn't know how old the ship(s) in Prometheus were because they used carbon dating to measure the age of something that's not even from or on Earth it for some reason. Basically a complete waste of time.

I'd put money on Ridley's chat with Blomkamp being that he wants to continue with his destruction of the myterious Space Jockey mythology by continuing its abuse with more 'ancient astronaut' Engineers shennanigans. Chances are our Niell wasn't too fond of it and wanted to go back to how it was perceived in original Alien films.

[OmegaZilla]

That's the impression I got too, irn. Only time will tell.

[zuzuki]

The Derelict certainly looks quite ancient, but if it's thousands of years older than what we saw in Prometheus, why does it look exactly the same?

Scott said that they are ''brother'' ships separated in design by aprox 200 years. This can be interpreted that they are either 2 different classes of ships used in parallel by the engineers, or the Juggernaut is a more advanced, newer version of the Derelict.

You'd think that Engineer flight technology would have gotten better in that time.

Don't attribute the human way of doing things to an alien species. Just because it's newer doesn't mean it must look differently. If they are weird enough to have a croissant shaped ship instead of a aerodynamic lookin one, they are perfectly capable of doing other weird things by our standards

They served the same purpose in Spaihts script, though.

I'm not denying that. But you're trying to us it as evidence for Spaihts script being inferior, when the end film did EXACTLY THE SAME THING.

Pot - kettle.

There are more reasons than that why Spaihts script was draft-like. Which is what it was. It was a draft. It could have been sanded down one way or another into a better film, it had great visuals.

Yes we don't know if that was number 1 or number 8 of the drafts he wrote.

It was the final draft. And it had a suited engineer shooting energy blasts from his hands, some pretty jumbled acts and an ending that didn't connect with Alien at all. Beyond some cool concepts and some fresh ideas the script was amateur hour

It will be a retcon, I reckon. I'm saying it's unlikely we'll see anything other than some sort of retcon/alternate sequel to Aliens. Judging by Neill's comments, this isn't going to be a continuation of Alien Resurrection and without that the retcon direction (as much as I wish it wasn't) is the only real direction he has to go.

He could have continued after Aliens in the timeline, or Alien3 and put whatever tone or direction he wanted in the film. But he he ignores this cause he wants Ripley and Hicks in the movie at all costs. Is it an alien movie or ''THE ADVENTURES OF RIPLEY AND HICKS PART 2?''. Cause it seems he's more of a fan of the concept of Ripley kicking xeno ass than being a fan of the series and it's theme and has zero respect for the continuity and integrity of the franchise. Judging by the artwork the man just wants to see Aliens2

[NetworkATTH]

The Derelict certainly looks quite ancient, but if it's thousands of years older than what we saw in Prometheus, why does it look exactly the same?

Scott said that they are ''brother'' ships separated in design by aprox 200 years. This can be interpreted that they are either 2 different classes of ships used in parallel by the engineers, or the Juggernaut is a more advanced, newer version of the Derelict.

You'd think that Engineer flight technology would have gotten better in that time.

Don't attribute the human way of doing things to an alien species. Just because it's newer doesn't mean it must look differently. If they are weird enough to have a croissant shaped ship instead of a aerodynamic lookin one, they are perfectly capable of doing other weird things by our standards

They served the same purpose in Spaihts script, though.

I'm not denying that. But you're trying to us it as evidence for Spaihts script being inferior, when the end film did EXACTLY THE SAME THING.

Pot - kettle.

There are more reasons than that why Spaihts script was draft-like. Which is what it was. It was a draft. It could have been sanded down one way or another into a better film, it had great visuals.

Yes we don't know if that was number 1 or number 8 of the drafts he wrote.

It was the final draft. And it had a suited engineer shooting energy blasts from his hands, some pretty jumbled acts and an ending that didn't connect with Alien at all. Beyond some cool concepts and some fresh ideas the script was amateur hour

It will be a retcon, I reckon. I'm saying it's unlikely we'll see anything other than some sort of retcon/alternate sequel to Aliens. Judging by Neill's comments, this isn't going to be a continuation of Alien Resurrection and without that the retcon direction (as much as I wish it wasn't) is the only real direction he has to go.

He could have continued after Aliens in the timeline, or Alien3 and put whatever tone or direction he wanted in the film. But he he ignores this cause he wants Ripley and Hicks in the movie at all costs. Is it an alien movie or ''THE ADVENTURES OF RIPLEY AND HICKS PART 2?''. Cause it seems he's more of a fan of the concept of Ripley kicking xeno ass than being a fan of the series and it's theme and has zero respect for the continuity and integrity of the franchise. Judging by the artwork the man just wants to see Aliens2

That's not neccisarily fair, because in any other time you would agree Fox had no care for the continuinty when they shoved production of Alien 3 and rushed it, taking time because of creative differences, and even hating Eric Red's contribution (For good reason). But it was over and done. Then they decided taking that ending away, so any thematic relevance Alien 3 had, and made Alien Resurrection. Witha  campy high paced, big budget, popcorn flick.

Both of those films did not involve Scott whatsoever, this one does.

There's more nuance to this, than you admit.

[zuzuki]

Whatever problems Alien3 and AR had, they respected the continuity. AR could have retconed Alien 3 too, since that one was so plagued with production problems and was disowned by Fincher. But they made it work. They used a shitty cloning plot, but they made it fit into the series. Alien 5 won't have that, not because something horrible happened with the way the xeno was portrayed or some other core subject, but because the fanboy wants his Ripley back, together with Hicks.

And as much as i loved Hicks, i don't find him that necessary to be honest. He was a secondary character, playing secomd fiddle to Ripley in the second partof the movie for a short while before he got himself hurt and decomisioned, making him useless for the 3rd act of the movie. So why does a character like that need to be brought back? Pure nostalgia and fanboy love. Reminds me of the love a useless character like Bobba Fett gets,and obsession over Darth Maul.

Just imagine, a movie set in the Aliens timeframe like NB wants to make, with millitary action and big set pieces. But instead of using grandma, he brings new characters into the fold, that we can follow even in potential sequels. The company, found another xeno source, or our new protagonists find out about the engineer homeworld and what happened on lv223 and decide to end the problem once and for all, just like they wanted to do in the past. Thus tying the movie with what happened in Prometheus too( these are just personal examples, doesn't mean they have to follow this path). And this could all happen without erasing A3 and AR from continuity. So many options, but none of them can be used and nothing fresh and new can be brought to the table because people are fixated on Ripley, a character that had a complete arc with a heroic death.

It's the same reason the new Terminator movie will be mediocre. They had to come up with some f**ked up plot, recycling emblematic moments in the franchise just so it can have Arnold back in, kicking ass in the 80's. Let's push things forward, not allow them to get stale

[windebieste]

This ^  All of this you say is what is needed.  All of it.  100%. 

-Windebieste.

[OmegaZilla]

I bet that if Ridley Scott were at the helm of this, 50% of the current haters of the project would have no problem with the direction it is taking.

[HuDaFuK]

I bet that if Ridley Scott were at the helm of this, 50% of the current haters of the project would have no problem with the direction it is taking.

Not in my case. Scott hasn't made a really great film in years and Prometheus was a mess.

[predxeno]

I bet that if Ridley Scott were at the helm of this, 50% of the current haters of the project would have no problem with the direction it is taking.

Lol, that is SO quoted for truth, Prometheus is proof.

[Bio Mech Hunter]

Maybe before we saw Prometheus. Not now.

[predxeno]

People still worship Ridley now even after Prometheus. When it comes to canon, it has never been about using fair, unbiased standards and it has always been about some shallow popularity contest, and apparently Riddles is still at the top.

[Mr. Clemens]

People still worship Ridley now even after Prometheus. When it comes to canon, it has never been about using fair, unbiased standards and it has always been about some shallow popularity contest, and apparently Riddles is still at the top.

And why not? He made the best film.

That said, what little we know of A5 sounds kinda dodgy no matter who's at the helm.